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DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods

 
nightrunner
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02/04/2013 04:24 AM
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DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Half of all doomsday preppers will die of botulism or related food poisoning because of wrong canning methods and therefore sample food regularly.
Don'tBeAfraid

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02/04/2013 04:30 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Where is your evidence of that? There were only 1000 cases of botulism in 7 billion people. Yes, 90% of the cases in the USA were from home canning, but the actual number of cases was miniscule. Saying half of preppers is an absurd claim. There are only 110 cases each year in the USA on average.


[link to www.cdc.gov]
"Home-canned vegetables are the most common cause of botulism outbreaks in the United States. From 1996 to 2008, there were 116 outbreaks of foodborne botulism reported to CDC. Of the 48 outbreaks that were caused by home-prepared foods, 18 outbreaks, or 38%, were from home-canned vegetables."

[link to www.wedlinydomowe.com]
"Statistics

Experts estimate that up to 90% of U.S. food-borne botulism cases can be traced to eating contaminated home-preserved food. Between 1975-1992, 543 people fell victim to food-borne botulism in the United States and Puerto Rico. In the early 1900s, 71% of botulism victims died, but with early diagnosis and advanced treatment, the fatality rate had dropped to 7.5 % by 1984 and fewer than 2% by 1993.

In the United States, an average of 110 cases of botulism are reported every year. Approximately 25% are food borne, 72% are infant botulism, and the rest are wound botulism. Outbreaks of food borne botulism involving two or more persons are the most frequent, and are usually caused by eating contaminated home-canned foods. The number of cases of foodborne and infant botulism has changed little in recent years, but wound botulism has increased because of the wide spread use of drugs.

Worldwide, there are about 1000 cases of botulism each year. The probability of death is high if not treated immediately. Botulinum toxin has no odor or taste, so the wisest course of action is to discard any suspicious food. In most cases botulism occurs by eating contaminated foods in improperly home - canned meats or preserved foods. Always discard bulbing or rancid food. A dented can can develop an air leak to allow bacteria to grow. All home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before serving to eliminate any botulism spores. Home canning should follow strict hygienic recommendations to reduce risks. Food that has been improperly preserved or stored can harbor botulinum toxin-producing clostridia. Pressure canners should be used for all low-acid foods. In addition, home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before eating. Botulism spores can only be killed by the high temperatures produced by a pressure canner. The toxin (that is produced in anaerobic conditions) can only be destroyed when boiled. All smoked meats and sausages when smoked at low temperatures should contain of nitrates/nitrites."

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 02/04/2013 04:32 AM
nightrunner (OP)

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02/04/2013 04:36 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Where is your evidence of that? There were only 1000 cases of botulism in 7 billion people. Yes, 90% of the cases in the USA were from home canning, but the actual number of cases was miniscule. Saying half of preppers is an absurd claim. There are only 110 cases each year in the USA on average.


[link to www.cdc.gov]
"Home-canned vegetables are the most common cause of botulism outbreaks in the United States. From 1996 to 2008, there were 116 outbreaks of foodborne botulism reported to CDC. Of the 48 outbreaks that were caused by home-prepared foods, 18 outbreaks, or 38%, were from home-canned vegetables."

[link to www.wedlinydomowe.com]
"Statistics

Experts estimate that up to 90% of U.S. food-borne botulism cases can be traced to eating contaminated home-preserved food. Between 1975-1992, 543 people fell victim to food-borne botulism in the United States and Puerto Rico. In the early 1900s, 71% of botulism victims died, but with early diagnosis and advanced treatment, the fatality rate had dropped to 7.5 % by 1984 and fewer than 2% by 1993.

In the United States, an average of 110 cases of botulism are reported every year. Approximately 25% are food borne, 72% are infant botulism, and the rest are wound botulism. Outbreaks of food borne botulism involving two or more persons are the most frequent, and are usually caused by eating contaminated home-canned foods. The number of cases of foodborne and infant botulism has changed little in recent years, but wound botulism has increased because of the wide spread use of drugs.

Worldwide, there are about 1000 cases of botulism each year. The probability of death is high if not treated immediately. Botulinum toxin has no odor or taste, so the wisest course of action is to discard any suspicious food. In most cases botulism occurs by eating contaminated foods in improperly home - canned meats or preserved foods. Always discard bulbing or rancid food. A dented can can develop an air leak to allow bacteria to grow. All home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before serving to eliminate any botulism spores. Home canning should follow strict hygienic recommendations to reduce risks. Food that has been improperly preserved or stored can harbor botulinum toxin-producing clostridia. Pressure canners should be used for all low-acid foods. In addition, home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before eating. Botulism spores can only be killed by the high temperatures produced by a pressure canner. The toxin (that is produced in anaerobic conditions) can only be destroyed when boiled. All smoked meats and sausages when smoked at low temperatures should contain of nitrates/nitrites."
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Doomsday time there wont be much treatment left for serious foodpoisings,just a thought...
Don'tBeAfraid

User ID: 33440387
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02/04/2013 04:46 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Where is your evidence of that? There were only 1000 cases of botulism in 7 billion people. Yes, 90% of the cases in the USA were from home canning, but the actual number of cases was miniscule. Saying half of preppers is an absurd claim. There are only 110 cases each year in the USA on average.


[link to www.cdc.gov]
"Home-canned vegetables are the most common cause of botulism outbreaks in the United States. From 1996 to 2008, there were 116 outbreaks of foodborne botulism reported to CDC. Of the 48 outbreaks that were caused by home-prepared foods, 18 outbreaks, or 38%, were from home-canned vegetables."

[link to www.wedlinydomowe.com]
"Statistics

Experts estimate that up to 90% of U.S. food-borne botulism cases can be traced to eating contaminated home-preserved food. Between 1975-1992, 543 people fell victim to food-borne botulism in the United States and Puerto Rico. In the early 1900s, 71% of botulism victims died, but with early diagnosis and advanced treatment, the fatality rate had dropped to 7.5 % by 1984 and fewer than 2% by 1993.

In the United States, an average of 110 cases of botulism are reported every year. Approximately 25% are food borne, 72% are infant botulism, and the rest are wound botulism. Outbreaks of food borne botulism involving two or more persons are the most frequent, and are usually caused by eating contaminated home-canned foods. The number of cases of foodborne and infant botulism has changed little in recent years, but wound botulism has increased because of the wide spread use of drugs.

Worldwide, there are about 1000 cases of botulism each year. The probability of death is high if not treated immediately. Botulinum toxin has no odor or taste, so the wisest course of action is to discard any suspicious food. In most cases botulism occurs by eating contaminated foods in improperly home - canned meats or preserved foods. Always discard bulbing or rancid food. A dented can can develop an air leak to allow bacteria to grow. All home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before serving to eliminate any botulism spores. Home canning should follow strict hygienic recommendations to reduce risks. Food that has been improperly preserved or stored can harbor botulinum toxin-producing clostridia. Pressure canners should be used for all low-acid foods. In addition, home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before eating. Botulism spores can only be killed by the high temperatures produced by a pressure canner. The toxin (that is produced in anaerobic conditions) can only be destroyed when boiled. All smoked meats and sausages when smoked at low temperatures should contain of nitrates/nitrites."
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Doomsday time there wont be much treatment left for serious foodpoisings,just a thought...
 Quoting: nightrunner


First off, you're posting information which is FALSE. You don't address that. If you were a honest person, you'd admit that you exaggerated a medical condition which likely you don't understand, nor have any idea about legitimate biostatistics.

Second, in a true collapse, something I've been posting about for over a year in complex ways, the vast majority will die because they can't grow enough food, gather it from wild edibles, or have the skills.

Third, the major issues is not food-bourne illness resulting in gasteroenteritis, it's dehydration in three days.

Fourth, the majority of preservation post-collapse will be dehydration, not canning.

Fifth, most people who are preppers have pressure canning which they can do quite well as proven by the statistics above.

Sixth, most people will eat most of the food as it is harvested and will be lucky to put back enough for preservation. This makes canning very low of a concern.

I'm not sure of your intentions, but you're not putting out truthful information.
Apocalypse Troll
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02/04/2013 04:50 AM

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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Solution is high pressure canning.

[link to www.canningpantry.com]
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02/04/2013 04:53 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
canning doom
Don'tBeAfraid

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02/04/2013 04:56 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Solution is high pressure canning.

[link to www.canningpantry.com]
 Quoting: Apocalypse Troll


Precisely. ^ Spoken like a prepper.

Post-collapse, in the interim period, people will run out of canning lids. You can purchase reusable ones, but they cost more. They're a good investment.

People in primitive condition in the absence of power can all the time and do it safely by high pressure canning.

The only kind of canning done with a water bath has to do with making things with high acid content. See:
[link to pubs.ext.vt.edu]
"Boiling water bath canning involves packing jars with food, completely covering the jars with water, heating the water to boiling (212 degrees Fahrenheit (F), 100 degrees Celsius (C)), and processing for 5 to 85 minutes, depending on the food product, style of pack, and jar size. Boiling removes the oxygen remaining in the jar, which helps to form a tight seal between the lid and the rim. The heat used for this method of canning is sufficient to kill vegetative bacterial cells found in the food.

Only high-acid food with a pH of 4.6 or less can be processed using the boiling water bath method. This is because high-acid foods prevent the growth of spores of the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which can’t be killed by boiling. Foods with a pH more than 4.6 allow the spores to grow. If spores of C. botulinum are allowed to grow, toxin will form, and consumption of C. botulinum toxin is deadly. Symptoms from the consumption of this toxin develop within six hours to 10 days and include double and blurred vision, drooping eyelids, slurred speech, difficulty swallowing, and muscle weakness. Paralysis of breathing muscles can cause a person to stop breathing and die unless mechanical ventilation is provided. Individuals with any of these symptoms should seek immediate medical assistance."

Post-collapse, when many people have died, then tribes will send out salvage crews to acquire canning lids of both kinds to continue to preserve food. At some point, there won't be any, but there's a high chance that the Hordes that hit the stores looking for food items won't have decimated the canning lids and jars.

Because these supplies post-collapse will run out, then dehydrating food will become the norm. That means coming up with methods like vacuum sealing, accelerating drying, solar drying, chemical treatment, etc will be necessary.

See my 1st link in my signature to see ways to do all that.
nightrunner (OP)

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02/04/2013 05:01 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Where is your evidence of that? There were only 1000 cases of botulism in 7 billion people. Yes, 90% of the cases in the USA were from home canning, but the actual number of cases was miniscule. Saying half of preppers is an absurd claim. There are only 110 cases each year in the USA on average.


[link to www.cdc.gov]
"Home-canned vegetables are the most common cause of botulism outbreaks in the United States. From 1996 to 2008, there were 116 outbreaks of foodborne botulism reported to CDC. Of the 48 outbreaks that were caused by home-prepared foods, 18 outbreaks, or 38%, were from home-canned vegetables."

[link to www.wedlinydomowe.com]
"Statistics

Experts estimate that up to 90% of U.S. food-borne botulism cases can be traced to eating contaminated home-preserved food. Between 1975-1992, 543 people fell victim to food-borne botulism in the United States and Puerto Rico. In the early 1900s, 71% of botulism victims died, but with early diagnosis and advanced treatment, the fatality rate had dropped to 7.5 % by 1984 and fewer than 2% by 1993.

In the United States, an average of 110 cases of botulism are reported every year. Approximately 25% are food borne, 72% are infant botulism, and the rest are wound botulism. Outbreaks of food borne botulism involving two or more persons are the most frequent, and are usually caused by eating contaminated home-canned foods. The number of cases of foodborne and infant botulism has changed little in recent years, but wound botulism has increased because of the wide spread use of drugs.

Worldwide, there are about 1000 cases of botulism each year. The probability of death is high if not treated immediately. Botulinum toxin has no odor or taste, so the wisest course of action is to discard any suspicious food. In most cases botulism occurs by eating contaminated foods in improperly home - canned meats or preserved foods. Always discard bulbing or rancid food. A dented can can develop an air leak to allow bacteria to grow. All home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before serving to eliminate any botulism spores. Home canning should follow strict hygienic recommendations to reduce risks. Food that has been improperly preserved or stored can harbor botulinum toxin-producing clostridia. Pressure canners should be used for all low-acid foods. In addition, home-canned foods should be boiled for 20 minutes before eating. Botulism spores can only be killed by the high temperatures produced by a pressure canner. The toxin (that is produced in anaerobic conditions) can only be destroyed when boiled. All smoked meats and sausages when smoked at low temperatures should contain of nitrates/nitrites."
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Doomsday time there wont be much treatment left for serious foodpoisings,just a thought...
 Quoting: nightrunner


First off, you're posting information which is FALSE. You don't address that. If you were a honest person, you'd admit that you exaggerated a medical condition which likely you don't understand, nor have any idea about legitimate biostatistics.

Second, in a true collapse, something I've been posting about for over a year in complex ways, the vast majority will die because they can't grow enough food, gather it from wild edibles, or have the skills.

Third, the major issues is not food-bourne illness resulting in gasteroenteritis, it's dehydration in three days.

Fourth, the majority of preservation post-collapse will be dehydration, not canning.

Fifth, most people who are preppers have pressure canning which they can do quite well as proven by the statistics above.

Sixth, most people will eat most of the food as it is harvested and will be lucky to put back enough for preservation. This makes canning very low of a concern.

I'm not sure of your intentions, but you're not putting out truthful information.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


well either way most of mankind is doomed in a big enough collapse of any kind as Most of humans are spoiled with modern technology,i wont keep canned food for years to risky,rather rotate supplies its easier to boil water then than food...
Mr information
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02/04/2013 05:29 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Half of all doomsday preppers will die of botulism or related food poisoning because of wrong canning methods and therefore sample food regularly.
 Quoting: nightrunner


Oh really i ate just a few days ago my out of date canned fish which according to the date put on the cans was overdue by at least 2 years.

And it was still intact and pretty heatlthy to eat...

But i would go much than two years over the limit.

Anyway i was amazed to see that canned fish could still be eatable after being there in my room for 3 - 4 years.

Same thing with the honey. It remained eatable and frankly became even better as the yellow color turned into dark red.
Perhaps it oxidized i don't know but surprisingly i loved the taste of that old honey.

The only thing i didn't dare to touch was the canned tomato which became poisonous i think as the canned literally strated to crack whith time and molds started to appear.

So hear is my advice NO CANNED VEGATABLES under any circomstances!!!!

No chocolate either. The chocolate was barely eatable after laying there for 4 years this was a surprise for me i thought the chocolate would be in better shape than the canned fish but no it perished more quickly.

So in my opninion honey is the best thing to hord take it or leave it.

At least you don't have to worry it it will degrade over time.

But remember vegetables will become poisonous!
So don't hord canned vegetables same thing goes for chocolate!

Go for the honey! Oh yes sweet honey!

ohyeah
Don'tBeAfraid

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United States
02/04/2013 05:47 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Half of all doomsday preppers will die of botulism or related food poisoning because of wrong canning methods and therefore sample food regularly.
 Quoting: nightrunner


Oh really i ate just a few days ago my out of date canned fish which according to the date put on the cans was overdue by at least 2 years.

And it was still intact and pretty heatlthy to eat...

But i would go much than two years over the limit.

Anyway i was amazed to see that canned fish could still be eatable after being there in my room for 3 - 4 years.

Same thing with the honey. It remained eatable and frankly became even better as the yellow color turned into dark red.
Perhaps it oxidized i don't know but surprisingly i loved the taste of that old honey.


The only thing i didn't dare to touch was the canned tomato which became poisonous i think as the canned literally strated to crack whith time and molds started to appear.

So hear is my advice NO CANNED VEGATABLES under any circomstances!!!!

No chocolate either. The chocolate was barely eatable after laying there for 4 years this was a surprise for me i thought the chocolate would be in better shape than the canned fish but no it perished more quickly.

So in my opninion honey is the best thing to hord take it or leave it.

At least you don't have to worry it it will degrade over time.

But remember vegetables will become poisonous!
So don't hord canned vegetables same thing goes for chocolate!

Go for the honey! Oh yes sweet honey!

ohyeah
 Quoting: Mr information 1337378


While botulism cases are very low, botulism spores are NOT killed in honey. As a result, young toddlers and infants should NEVER be given honey. It's fine for everyone else.
[link to www.mayoclinic.com]
" Infant botulism is a rare but serious gastrointestinal condition caused by exposure to Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores. Bacteria from the spores can grow and multiply in a baby's intestines, producing a dangerous toxin.

To protect your baby from infant botulism:
Don't offer your baby honey. Wild honey is a potential source of Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores."

For everyone else, honey crystalizes as it gives up moisture. You can do that on purpose to create a sugar-like substance, or you can simply add some water to thin it out and mix it up. Because sugar is hard to produce for a prepper, then while preppers will grow beets for this purpose, harvest corn syrup from standing stalks, or grow sorghum, most preppers will thin their honey more than normal to stretch it out.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 02/04/2013 05:49 AM
nightrunner (OP)

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02/04/2013 06:02 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Half of all doomsday preppers will die of botulism or related food poisoning because of wrong canning methods and therefore sample food regularly.
 Quoting: nightrunner


Oh really i ate just a few days ago my out of date canned fish which according to the date put on the cans was overdue by at least 2 years.

And it was still intact and pretty heatlthy to eat...

But i would go much than two years over the limit.

Anyway i was amazed to see that canned fish could still be eatable after being there in my room for 3 - 4 years.

Same thing with the honey. It remained eatable and frankly became even better as the yellow color turned into dark red.
Perhaps it oxidized i don't know but surprisingly i loved the taste of that old honey.


The only thing i didn't dare to touch was the canned tomato which became poisonous i think as the canned literally strated to crack whith time and molds started to appear.

So hear is my advice NO CANNED VEGATABLES under any circomstances!!!!

No chocolate either. The chocolate was barely eatable after laying there for 4 years this was a surprise for me i thought the chocolate would be in better shape than the canned fish but no it perished more quickly.

So in my opninion honey is the best thing to hord take it or leave it.

At least you don't have to worry it it will degrade over time.

But remember vegetables will become poisonous!
So don't hord canned vegetables same thing goes for chocolate!

Go for the honey! Oh yes sweet honey!

ohyeah
 Quoting: Mr information 1337378


While botulism cases are very low, botulism spores are NOT killed in honey. As a result, young toddlers and infants should NEVER be given honey. It's fine for everyone else.
[link to www.mayoclinic.com]
" Infant botulism is a rare but serious gastrointestinal condition caused by exposure to Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores. Bacteria from the spores can grow and multiply in a baby's intestines, producing a dangerous toxin.

To protect your baby from infant botulism:
Don't offer your baby honey. Wild honey is a potential source of Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores."

For everyone else, honey crystalizes as it gives up moisture. You can do that on purpose to create a sugar-like substance, or you can simply add some water to thin it out and mix it up. Because sugar is hard to produce for a prepper, then while preppers will grow beets for this purpose, harvest corn syrup from standing stalks, or grow sorghum, most preppers will thin their honey more than normal to stretch it out.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So the best solution cooked ur canned again before eatingbanana2
Don'tBeAfraid

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02/04/2013 06:07 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Half of all doomsday preppers will die of botulism or related food poisoning because of wrong canning methods and therefore sample food regularly.
 Quoting: nightrunner


Oh really i ate just a few days ago my out of date canned fish which according to the date put on the cans was overdue by at least 2 years.

And it was still intact and pretty heatlthy to eat...

But i would go much than two years over the limit.

Anyway i was amazed to see that canned fish could still be eatable after being there in my room for 3 - 4 years.

Same thing with the honey. It remained eatable and frankly became even better as the yellow color turned into dark red.
Perhaps it oxidized i don't know but surprisingly i loved the taste of that old honey.


The only thing i didn't dare to touch was the canned tomato which became poisonous i think as the canned literally strated to crack whith time and molds started to appear.

So hear is my advice NO CANNED VEGATABLES under any circomstances!!!!

No chocolate either. The chocolate was barely eatable after laying there for 4 years this was a surprise for me i thought the chocolate would be in better shape than the canned fish but no it perished more quickly.

So in my opninion honey is the best thing to hord take it or leave it.

At least you don't have to worry it it will degrade over time.

But remember vegetables will become poisonous!
So don't hord canned vegetables same thing goes for chocolate!

Go for the honey! Oh yes sweet honey!

ohyeah
 Quoting: Mr information 1337378


While botulism cases are very low, botulism spores are NOT killed in honey. As a result, young toddlers and infants should NEVER be given honey. It's fine for everyone else.
[link to www.mayoclinic.com]
" Infant botulism is a rare but serious gastrointestinal condition caused by exposure to Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores. Bacteria from the spores can grow and multiply in a baby's intestines, producing a dangerous toxin.

To protect your baby from infant botulism:
Don't offer your baby honey. Wild honey is a potential source of Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores."

For everyone else, honey crystalizes as it gives up moisture. You can do that on purpose to create a sugar-like substance, or you can simply add some water to thin it out and mix it up. Because sugar is hard to produce for a prepper, then while preppers will grow beets for this purpose, harvest corn syrup from standing stalks, or grow sorghum, most preppers will thin their honey more than normal to stretch it out.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So the best solution cooked ur canned again before eatingbanana2
 Quoting: nightrunner

Are you just hopeless obtuse or what? Here's my free advice. Go read about canning. Go learn some first aid. Spend more time learning to prep. Write on the chalkboard, "I will do more research before creating a nonsensical topic of little worth and wasting the time of seasoned preppers and putting out disinformation." Write that at least 1000 times before posting again.

A swelled can of botulism contaminated food should NEVER be eaten. Not ever.

I don't know many preppers who eat their food cold. They heat it up usually, so your post is dumb.

I have no idea what your goal was here, but as a prepper of about 30 years, you're really doing a disservice to the GLP community.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 02/04/2013 06:10 AM
nightrunner (OP)

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02/04/2013 06:12 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
...


Oh really i ate just a few days ago my out of date canned fish which according to the date put on the cans was overdue by at least 2 years.

And it was still intact and pretty heatlthy to eat...

But i would go much than two years over the limit.

Anyway i was amazed to see that canned fish could still be eatable after being there in my room for 3 - 4 years.

Same thing with the honey. It remained eatable and frankly became even better as the yellow color turned into dark red.
Perhaps it oxidized i don't know but surprisingly i loved the taste of that old honey.


The only thing i didn't dare to touch was the canned tomato which became poisonous i think as the canned literally strated to crack whith time and molds started to appear.

So hear is my advice NO CANNED VEGATABLES under any circomstances!!!!

No chocolate either. The chocolate was barely eatable after laying there for 4 years this was a surprise for me i thought the chocolate would be in better shape than the canned fish but no it perished more quickly.

So in my opninion honey is the best thing to hord take it or leave it.

At least you don't have to worry it it will degrade over time.

But remember vegetables will become poisonous!
So don't hord canned vegetables same thing goes for chocolate!

Go for the honey! Oh yes sweet honey!

ohyeah
 Quoting: Mr information 1337378


While botulism cases are very low, botulism spores are NOT killed in honey. As a result, young toddlers and infants should NEVER be given honey. It's fine for everyone else.
[link to www.mayoclinic.com]
" Infant botulism is a rare but serious gastrointestinal condition caused by exposure to Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores. Bacteria from the spores can grow and multiply in a baby's intestines, producing a dangerous toxin.

To protect your baby from infant botulism:
Don't offer your baby honey. Wild honey is a potential source of Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores."

For everyone else, honey crystalizes as it gives up moisture. You can do that on purpose to create a sugar-like substance, or you can simply add some water to thin it out and mix it up. Because sugar is hard to produce for a prepper, then while preppers will grow beets for this purpose, harvest corn syrup from standing stalks, or grow sorghum, most preppers will thin their honey more than normal to stretch it out.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So the best solution cooked ur canned again before eatingbanana2
 Quoting: nightrunner

Are you just hopeless obtuse or what? Here's my free advice. Go read about canning. Go learn some first aid. Spend more time learning to prep. Write on the chalkboard, "I will do more research before creating a nonsensical topic of little worth and wasting the time of seasoned preppers and putting out disinformation." Write that at least 1000 times before posting again.

A swelled can of botulism contaminated food should NEVER be eaten. Not ever.

I don't know many preppers who eat their food cold. They heat it up usually, so your post is dumb.

I have no idea what your goal was here, but as a prepper of about 30 years, you're really doing a disservice to the GLP community.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


such a pity glass cant swell dickhead.
Don'tBeAfraid

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02/04/2013 06:19 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
...


While botulism cases are very low, botulism spores are NOT killed in honey. As a result, young toddlers and infants should NEVER be given honey. It's fine for everyone else.
[link to www.mayoclinic.com]
" Infant botulism is a rare but serious gastrointestinal condition caused by exposure to Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores. Bacteria from the spores can grow and multiply in a baby's intestines, producing a dangerous toxin.

To protect your baby from infant botulism:
Don't offer your baby honey. Wild honey is a potential source of Clostridium botulinum (C. botulinum) spores."

For everyone else, honey crystalizes as it gives up moisture. You can do that on purpose to create a sugar-like substance, or you can simply add some water to thin it out and mix it up. Because sugar is hard to produce for a prepper, then while preppers will grow beets for this purpose, harvest corn syrup from standing stalks, or grow sorghum, most preppers will thin their honey more than normal to stretch it out.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So the best solution cooked ur canned again before eatingbanana2
 Quoting: nightrunner

Are you just hopeless obtuse or what? Here's my free advice. Go read about canning. Go learn some first aid. Spend more time learning to prep. Write on the chalkboard, "I will do more research before creating a nonsensical topic of little worth and wasting the time of seasoned preppers and putting out disinformation." Write that at least 1000 times before posting again.

A swelled can of botulism contaminated food should NEVER be eaten. Not ever.

I don't know many preppers who eat their food cold. They heat it up usually, so your post is dumb.

I have no idea what your goal was here, but as a prepper of about 30 years, you're really doing a disservice to the GLP community.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


such a pity glass cant swell dickhead.
 Quoting: nightrunner

Well, moron, food is not all canned in glass, but if you were a real prepper, you'd know that. Real preppers actually go to a cannery and can their food as well as using the waterbath method for high acid food and high pressure cooker method for others.
shill
Don'tBeAfraid

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02/04/2013 06:22 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Because the OP is spreading disinformation, I recommend that this topic be deleted. We have very fine topics on canning methods as well as many topics describing canning and other pertinent prepping methods.

The last thing we need is disinformation by a less than adequately knowledgable person at best, or a shill at worst.
nightrunner (OP)

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02/04/2013 06:46 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Because the OP is spreading disinformation, I recommend that this topic be deleted. We have very fine topics on canning methods as well as many topics describing canning and other pertinent prepping methods.

The last thing we need is disinformation by a less than adequately knowledgable person at best, or a shill at worst.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


i am ex spes forces and have survived where u wont survive,delete urself mr inadequate.
Don'tBeAfraid

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02/04/2013 06:47 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Because the OP is spreading disinformation, I recommend that this topic be deleted. We have very fine topics on canning methods as well as many topics describing canning and other pertinent prepping methods.

The last thing we need is disinformation by a less than adequately knowledgable person at best, or a shill at worst.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


i am ex spes forces and have survived where u wont survive,delete urself mr inadequate.
 Quoting: nightrunner

All of that may be so, but that doesn't mean you're not a moron and speading bad disinformation.

Wake up.
Anonymous Coward
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02/04/2013 07:57 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
FYI:

[link to pickyourown.org]
Anonymous Coward
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02/04/2013 08:33 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Half of all doomsday preppers will die of botulism or related food poisoning because of wrong canning methods and therefore sample food regularly.
 Quoting: nightrunner


preppers will still have a better chance of survival regardless of this info...the future belongs to those that are prepared...if/when tshtf preppers will be the only ppl around so why do you bother giving this info as soon imho we will see who survives and who doesnt.
Lady Jane SmithModerator
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02/04/2013 08:38 AM

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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
People in my family have been canning for generations, including me.

Nobody have even gotten sick, let alone died.

My Grandmother taught me to carefully inspect every jar for bubbles & any questionable appearance/smell. If so, the contents are discarded and the jar sterilized in boiling water before a regular washing & storage.

I think any death that occur will be more due to ignorance of process & procedure than canning.
Life is karma and karma always reflects both past and present circumstance. Our time here is short, so choose carefully and behave well, for all of your tomorrows are presently being decided.

"Don't die on a small cross..." Saddletramp's Mom

"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."
-- William Shakespeare, born April 23, 1564.

Killer Bunny mockingjay
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02/04/2013 08:45 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
[link to en.wikipedia.org]
[link to www.fsis.usda.gov]
Lady Jane SmithModerator
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02/04/2013 08:46 AM

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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Solution is high pressure canning.

[link to www.canningpantry.com]
 Quoting: Apocalypse Troll


Precisely. ^ Spoken like a prepper.

Post-collapse, in the interim period, people will run out of canning lids. You can purchase reusable ones, but they cost more. They're a good investment.

People in primitive condition in the absence of power can all the time and do it safely by high pressure canning.

The only kind of canning done with a water bath has to do with making things with high acid content. See:
[link to pubs.ext.vt.edu]
"Boiling water bath canning involves packing jars with food, completely covering the jars with water, heating the water to boiling (212 degrees Fahrenheit (F), 100 degrees Celsius (C)), and processing for 5 to 85 minutes, depending on the food product, style of pack, and jar size. Boiling removes the oxygen remaining in the jar, which helps to form a tight seal between the lid and the rim. The heat used for this method of canning is sufficient to kill vegetative bacterial cells found in the food.

Only high-acid food with a pH of 4.6 or less can be processed using the boiling water bath method. This is because high-acid foods prevent the growth of spores of the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which can’t be killed by boiling. Foods with a pH more than 4.6 allow the spores to grow. If spores of C. botulinum are allowed to grow, toxin will form, and consumption of C. botulinum toxin is deadly. Symptoms from the consumption of this toxin develop within six hours to 10 days and include double and blurred vision, drooping eyelids, slurred speech, difficulty swallowing, and muscle weakness. Paralysis of breathing muscles can cause a person to stop breathing and die unless mechanical ventilation is provided. Individuals with any of these symptoms should seek immediate medical assistance."

Post-collapse, when many people have died, then tribes will send out salvage crews to acquire canning lids of both kinds to continue to preserve food. At some point, there won't be any, but there's a high chance that the Hordes that hit the stores looking for food items won't have decimated the canning lids and jars.

Because these supplies post-collapse will run out, then dehydrating food will become the norm. That means coming up with methods like vacuum sealing, accelerating drying, solar drying, chemical treatment, etc will be necessary.

See my 1st link in my signature to see ways to do all that.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Reusable canning lids. Less expensive in the long run. Here is an article:

[link to www.rural-revolution.com]
Life is karma and karma always reflects both past and present circumstance. Our time here is short, so choose carefully and behave well, for all of your tomorrows are presently being decided.

"Don't die on a small cross..." Saddletramp's Mom

"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."
-- William Shakespeare, born April 23, 1564.

Killer Bunny mockingjay
Lady Jane SmithModerator
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02/04/2013 08:50 AM

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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Because the OP is spreading disinformation, I recommend that this topic be deleted. We have very fine topics on canning methods as well as many topics describing canning and other pertinent prepping methods.

The last thing we need is disinformation by a less than adequately knowledgable person at best, or a shill at worst.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


I will leave it as there is some good info & your posts direct people to you comprehensive survival thread.

May be an opportunity for others to find you.

hf
Life is karma and karma always reflects both past and present circumstance. Our time here is short, so choose carefully and behave well, for all of your tomorrows are presently being decided.

"Don't die on a small cross..." Saddletramp's Mom

"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."
-- William Shakespeare, born April 23, 1564.

Killer Bunny mockingjay
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02/04/2013 09:04 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Fact; 100% of preppers will die.
samanthasunflower

User ID: 29507233
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02/04/2013 09:07 AM

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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Solution is high pressure canning.

[link to www.canningpantry.com]
 Quoting: Apocalypse Troll


Precisely. ^ Spoken like a prepper.

Post-collapse, in the interim period, people will run out of canning lids. You can purchase reusable ones, but they cost more. They're a good investment.

People in primitive condition in the absence of power can all the time and do it safely by high pressure canning.

The only kind of canning done with a water bath has to do with making things with high acid content. See:
[link to pubs.ext.vt.edu]
"Boiling water bath canning involves packing jars with food, completely covering the jars with water, heating the water to boiling (212 degrees Fahrenheit (F), 100 degrees Celsius (C)), and processing for 5 to 85 minutes, depending on the food product, style of pack, and jar size. Boiling removes the oxygen remaining in the jar, which helps to form a tight seal between the lid and the rim. The heat used for this method of canning is sufficient to kill vegetative bacterial cells found in the food.

Only high-acid food with a pH of 4.6 or less can be processed using the boiling water bath method. This is because high-acid foods prevent the growth of spores of the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which can’t be killed by boiling. Foods with a pH more than 4.6 allow the spores to grow. If spores of C. botulinum are allowed to grow, toxin will form, and consumption of C. botulinum toxin is deadly. Symptoms from the consumption of this toxin develop within six hours to 10 days and include double and blurred vision, drooping eyelids, slurred speech, difficulty swallowing, and muscle weakness. Paralysis of breathing muscles can cause a person to stop breathing and die unless mechanical ventilation is provided. Individuals with any of these symptoms should seek immediate medical assistance."

Post-collapse, when many people have died, then tribes will send out salvage crews to acquire canning lids of both kinds to continue to preserve food. At some point, there won't be any, but there's a high chance that the Hordes that hit the stores looking for food items won't have decimated the canning lids and jars.

Because these supplies post-collapse will run out, then dehydrating food will become the norm. That means coming up with methods like vacuum sealing, accelerating drying, solar drying, chemical treatment, etc will be necessary.

See my 1st link in my signature to see ways to do all that.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Reusable canning lids. Less expensive in the long run. Here is an article:

[link to www.rural-revolution.com]
 Quoting: Lady Jane Smith

[link to www.reusablecanninglids.com]

Just go straight to the company that sells them. They are also starting to sell at some stores such as Bi-Mart.

I have these, they work great. Although I have to be on family members to not throw them away or abuse them once they come off the jars.
Anonymous Coward
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02/04/2013 09:08 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
JUST SO YOU KNOW, BOTULISM TOXIN CAN BE DESTROYED WITH HIGH TEMPS. SO IF IN DOUBT COOK THE SHIT OUTTA YOUR FOOD BEFORE YOU EAT IT. LOOK IT UP.
Anonymous Coward
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02/04/2013 09:10 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
JUST SO YOU KNOW, BOTULISM TOXIN CAN BE DESTROYED WITH HIGH TEMPS. SO IF IN DOUBT COOK THE SHIT OUTTA YOUR FOOD BEFORE YOU EAT IT. LOOK IT UP.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31656952


Yea, because all preppers can cook EVERY SINGLE can of food.

Hey, those canned peaches, throw them on the fire!
Anonymous Coward
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02/04/2013 09:14 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
bsflagbsflagbsflagbsflagbsflagbsflagbsflag
nightrunner (OP)

User ID: 33564975
02/04/2013 09:15 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
Solution is high pressure canning.

[link to www.canningpantry.com]
 Quoting: Apocalypse Troll


Precisely. ^ Spoken like a prepper.

Post-collapse, in the interim period, people will run out of canning lids. You can purchase reusable ones, but they cost more. They're a good investment.

People in primitive condition in the absence of power can all the time and do it safely by high pressure canning.

The only kind of canning done with a water bath has to do with making things with high acid content. See:
[link to pubs.ext.vt.edu]
"Boiling water bath canning involves packing jars with food, completely covering the jars with water, heating the water to boiling (212 degrees Fahrenheit (F), 100 degrees Celsius (C)), and processing for 5 to 85 minutes, depending on the food product, style of pack, and jar size. Boiling removes the oxygen remaining in the jar, which helps to form a tight seal between the lid and the rim. The heat used for this method of canning is sufficient to kill vegetative bacterial cells found in the food.

Only high-acid food with a pH of 4.6 or less can be processed using the boiling water bath method. This is because high-acid foods prevent the growth of spores of the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which can’t be killed by boiling. Foods with a pH more than 4.6 allow the spores to grow. If spores of C. botulinum are allowed to grow, toxin will form, and consumption of C. botulinum toxin is deadly. Symptoms from the consumption of this toxin develop within six hours to 10 days and include double and blurred vision, drooping eyelids, slurred speech, difficulty swallowing, and muscle weakness. Paralysis of breathing muscles can cause a person to stop breathing and die unless mechanical ventilation is provided. Individuals with any of these symptoms should seek immediate medical assistance."

Post-collapse, when many people have died, then tribes will send out salvage crews to acquire canning lids of both kinds to continue to preserve food. At some point, there won't be any, but there's a high chance that the Hordes that hit the stores looking for food items won't have decimated the canning lids and jars.

Because these supplies post-collapse will run out, then dehydrating food will become the norm. That means coming up with methods like vacuum sealing, accelerating drying, solar drying, chemical treatment, etc will be necessary.

See my 1st link in my signature to see ways to do all that.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Reusable canning lids. Less expensive in the long run. Here is an article:

[link to www.rural-revolution.com]
 Quoting: Lady Jane Smith

[link to www.reusablecanninglids.com]

Just go straight to the company that sells them. They are also starting to sell at some stores such as Bi-Mart.

I have these, they work great. Although I have to be on family members to not throw them away or abuse them once they come off the jars.
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


rather buy enough canned food,shelflife is a few jrs in anycase nowadays and replace 6months before exp date,give it to the needy then,thats what i do.total anarchy you have to fend for urself in any case after ur food is depleted.
Anonymous Coward
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02/04/2013 09:18 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
JUST SO YOU KNOW, BOTULISM TOXIN CAN BE DESTROYED WITH HIGH TEMPS. SO IF IN DOUBT COOK THE SHIT OUTTA YOUR FOOD BEFORE YOU EAT IT. LOOK IT UP.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31656952


Yea, because all preppers can cook EVERY SINGLE can of food.

Hey, those canned peaches, throw them on the fire!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1266452


yeah grilled peaches are delish. or be like a canuck and just roll over and die at the first sign of trouble
Anonymous Coward
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02/04/2013 09:19 AM
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Re: DOOMSDAY PREPPERS - half of preppers will die of wrong canning methods
JUST SO YOU KNOW, BOTULISM TOXIN CAN BE DESTROYED WITH HIGH TEMPS. SO IF IN DOUBT COOK THE SHIT OUTTA YOUR FOOD BEFORE YOU EAT IT. LOOK IT UP.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31656952


Yea, because all preppers can cook EVERY SINGLE can of food.

Hey, those canned peaches, throw them on the fire!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1266452


yeah grilled peaches are delish. or be like a canuck and just roll over and die at the first sign of trouble
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31656952


Here comes the hate!
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