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This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.

 
ayr phorce yuan
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02/12/2013 04:37 PM
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This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Back problems, joint problems?

This is a medical fix so I expect many of you to scream "run to the hills" but trust me here, it has been used for years in competition horses but has only recently been licensed for human treatment, although a miracle cure for most, as it is so new in human treatment many health professionals are unaware of it, and it is kept quiet (medicare/medicaid) as it's cheaper to recommend rest lol.

Lower back pain is my story, it rendered me practically useless, and I was a professional sportsman, thank goodness I was told about this, it gave me my life back.

Prolotherapy is a treatment where a sclerostin is injected into the supporting ligaments of the problematic area to strengthen connective tissue.

Ok, I am a layman when it comes to this stuff so let me try to explain it in simplistic terms.

The majority of most joint and lower back problems is a lack of stability of the joint, ie, that joint moving around too much thus bumping into things it shouldn't and wear and tear on that joint due to excessive movement.

This excessive movement is because the ligaments and tendons supporting these joints have become stretched and damaged.

The sclerostin injected into these tendons and ligaments repairs the tissues and creates healthy cells, here is the wiki stuff.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Ok, now the boring shit is done here is my experience, please don't fail to look into this if you have these issues, I will keep it simple.

I was a professional horseman, due to injuries over the years (I am only 34 btw) I was a little fucked, simple things like washing my feet in the shower and putting socks on was a major pain in the arse, every now and again my back would GO, in 2008 I was at the golf range and it went again, I was so pissed off (although watching a great deal of the election build up) as the NHS answer was give up work and make a lifestyle change lol, idiots.

Anyway, I went online and found a private consultant, my life changed that day.

Anyway here it is, as some of you know, I ride stunt horses for the filming industry, I went from being practically useless in 2008, then had treatment which was 1 day of treatment consisting of a few jabs for 4 weeks, that's one day a week for 4 weeks.

It cost about £1,200 sterling.

In 2009 I rode the stunt horses for Ridley's 'Robin Hood' then Spielbergs 'War Horse' then Scorsese's 'Hugo Caberet'....... 'Jack the Giant Slayer'......'47 Ronin'.....'Snow White and the Huntsman'.....'Great Expectations'.....'Parades End'..... And a few I forget.

My point is this, they do not want you to know this treatment is out there, and it is a miracle cure, they do not want you to know for many reasons, I won't go into that now, but I liken it to eugenics, a very good friend of mine mentioned this treatment to me, a friend many of you would like to see burning on a stake lol, the truth is, there is them and us, and I know many of you class me as 'them', but I just wanted to throw this out there as so many people suffer unnecessary pain and depression as a result.

Speak to your health professionals and demand prolotherapy.

Lol, of all the shit I have posted over the last 12 years or so, I think this may well be the most important lol.

If you have lower back or knee/shoulder problems then ffs trust me and demand. I am now a professional horseman again and about to hit the circuit once again lol!

Bump it, pin it, do what you will with it, but this is the SECOND most important thread I have ever posted!

Signing out, phew!
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02/12/2013 04:49 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Just one question...when you were filming Robin Hood...you didn't...




...you didn't have to wear the tights..? :spookd:
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ayr phorce yuan  (OP)

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02/12/2013 04:53 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Just one question...when you were filming Robin Hood...you didn't...




...you didn't have to wear the tights..? :spookd:
 Quoting: Shoot straight Johnny


Lol, no tights, flags, swords and layers upon layers of chain mail, which in the height of summer does bloody burn! Galloping around like lunatics in that situ is very painful! Lol
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ayr phorce yuan  (OP)

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02/12/2013 04:58 PM
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You know me well, just sayin........................
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02/12/2013 05:03 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
sounds interesting, I have just had a cortizone shot for plantar fasciitis , only to discover it is prolly Achilles tendonitis .

Would it help Achilles tendonitis ?
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02/12/2013 05:06 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Yeah, back pain can be serious. Really serious. I've been lucky in that respect except for one time about 15 years ago when I was pulling the dog off the couch....a big dog.

Back went 'click' and I was paralyzed. For about two weeks. From that moment I couldn't even move. It took me about 40 minutes to get the 6 feet back to the couch. And there I lay, motionless, for about two weeks. My daughter who was living with me at the time had to bring everything for me.


I'm very wary since then.
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stillhere

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02/12/2013 05:06 PM

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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Pinned for you, (everyone is glued to the Dorner thing)--they are capturing him live now-- [link to losangeles.cbslocal.com]

I have a question, as the devil is in the details. And I do believe you that this was a miracle for you, but looking at the link you provided the irritant solution can be many different things as listed below. Do you know which "irritant" was injected into your spine/back?

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Prolotherapy in clinical practice

"Prolotherapy involves the injection of an irritant solution into an area where connective tissue has been weakened or damaged through injury or strain.

Many solutions are used, including hyperosmolar dextrose (a sugar),

glycerine, lidocaine (a commonly used local anesthetic), phenol, or sodium morrhuate, a derivative of cod liver oil extract.

The injection is administered at joints or at tendons where they connect to bone.
Prolotherapy treatment sessions are generally given every two to six weeks for several months.

Many patients receive treatment at less frequent intervals until treatments are rarely required, if at all."
hf

Last Edited by stillhere on 02/12/2013 05:10 PM
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ayr phorce yuan  (OP)

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02/12/2013 05:07 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
sounds interesting, I have just had a cortizone shot for plantar fasciitis , only to discover it is prolly Achilles tendonitis .

Would it help Achilles tendonitis ?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34264205


Trust me mate, please enquire! Fucking right it will!
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ayr phorce yuan  (OP)

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02/12/2013 05:09 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Pinned for you,

I have a question, as the devil is in the details. And I do believe you that this was a miracle for you, but looking at the link you provided the irritant solution can be many different things as listed below. Do you know which "irritant" was injected into your spine/back?

Prolotherapy in clinical practice

"Prolotherapy involves the injection of an irritant solution into an area where connective tissue has been weakened or damaged through injury or strain.

Many solutions are used, including hyperosmolar dextrose (a sugar),

glycerine, lidocaine (a commonly used local anesthetic), phenol, or sodium morrhuate, a derivative of cod liver oil extract.

The injection is administered at joints or at tendons where they connect to bone.
Prolotherapy treatment sessions are generally given every two to six weeks for several months.

Many patients receive treatment at less frequent intervals until treatments are rarely required, if at all."
hf
 Quoting: stillhere


I will of course return the favor, this is an important issue! I will read your reply now!
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stillhere

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02/12/2013 05:14 PM

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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
They are saying there are too many green pins right now, (limit is 10), I will check again later, but really I thing more people will read once this Dorner thing resolves itself.
peace

Oh, I have no problem with the procedure. I only am concerned that the substance injected into you might work better than the other ones listed.

Someone might take your advice and have this done, but with one of the other substances and it might not work as well.
bump

Last Edited by stillhere on 02/12/2013 05:16 PM
"You can bend it and twist it... You can misuse and abuse it... But even God cannot change the Truth.”
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02/12/2013 05:16 PM
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I can only see 3 green pins damned
The chariots of God are tens of thousands, and thousands of thousands.
CrazyMama73

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02/12/2013 05:19 PM

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I found this very interesting. I know a few people who would be thrilled to find some kind of comfort from the pain they are experiencing and, so far, not finding anything that is helping.

5 stars and pin for you!
stillhere

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02/12/2013 05:24 PM

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handshurt: Does Cleveland Clinic use prolotherapy or done any trials testing its efficacy? Are there significant risks?

"Dr_Bjoern_Buehring: Hello handshurt. The Cleveland Clinic Arthritis Center does not provide this service. I briefly reviewed the evidence and found a Cochrane Review (high-quality reviews) from 2004 that stated the following: “There is conflicting evidence regarding the efficacy of prolotherapy injections in reducing pain and disability in patients with chronic low-back pain. Conclusions are confounded by clinical heterogeneity amongst studies and by the presence of co-interventions. There was no evidence that prolotherapy injections alone were more effective than control injections alone. However, in the presence of co-interventions, prolotherapy injections were more effective than control injections, more so when both injections and co-interventions were controlled concurrently.”

This was for back pain. There is not much evidence for joints. I agree more research is needed"

[link to my.clevelandclinic.org]

~~Not surprising the CC does not do this as it seems the medical community is "Big Business" and this would eliminate some of their more lucrative procedures.
"You can bend it and twist it... You can misuse and abuse it... But even God cannot change the Truth.”
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TDJ

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02/12/2013 05:26 PM
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i think this is basically what they did to my back for a couple years without much relief. It took surgery to "fix" it but it still isn;t right.

I had cortisone and lidocane injections that worked temporarily but in the end there just wasn't any disc left in my lumbar back. fusion brought the greatest relief but was a traumatic experience that took me out of life for 2.5 yrs trying to get someone to help me get right again.

Last Edited by Founders Fan on 02/12/2013 05:26 PM
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stillhere

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02/12/2013 05:26 PM

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The other pins were just taken down now, why are people being so impatient today?

The thread is green pinned now.
hf
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02/12/2013 05:27 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Pinned for you, (everyone is glued to the Dorner thing)--they are capturing him live now-- [link to losangeles.cbslocal.com]

I have a question, as the devil is in the details. And I do believe you that this was a miracle for you, but looking at the link you provided the irritant solution can be many different things as listed below. Do you know which "irritant" was injected into your spine/back?

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Prolotherapy in clinical practice

"Prolotherapy involves the injection of an irritant solution into an area where connective tissue has been weakened or damaged through injury or strain.

Many solutions are used, including hyperosmolar dextrose (a sugar),

glycerine, lidocaine (a commonly used local anesthetic), phenol, or sodium morrhuate, a derivative of cod liver oil extract.

The injection is administered at joints or at tendons where they connect to bone.
Prolotherapy treatment sessions are generally given every two to six weeks for several months.

Many patients receive treatment at less frequent intervals until treatments are rarely required, if at all."
hf
 Quoting: stillhere


Forgive me and please placate me, but I am unsure of your concern, is it in the ingredients of the procedure or a moral or ethical objective?
 Quoting: ayr phorce yuan


firstly i am really glad you found something that works for you
your back ligaments were weakened by the actvties you put it through though and if you are continuing to do so then i hope you aren't just relying on the sclerosant to strengthen / immobilise that part of your back
you still have a lot of flexible back that will take the strain

personally have no problem to use of sclerosants- they are used and have been used for some time but they are irritants- that's how they work - so , they come with side effects

i am cautious though as in america can't just about anyone be your primary care practitioner ? - so before injecting something into ones back i would want extended scope physio and MRI with ortho /spinal surgeon review - if they said it was the best way forward- i'd give it serious consideration

but you are a young man so take care of your back

there are other ways to promote natural ligamental strengthening - but maybe without the speed of resoltion you have had or the ability to return to such high impact stuff


so once again- great for you but y
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02/12/2013 05:34 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
You're OP was so long...sorry, but I didn't give a shit...
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Is this the cure for horse arthritis?

I know (of) a dude via a family member who is a vet...

he developed a cure for arthritis and joint pain... he discovered it by working on race horses here in Kentucky...

He went through the proper channels to begin human trials... it was safe for humans... it worked on humans...

but the FDA had it stuck in red tape limbo last I heard

sad
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You're OP was so long...sorry, but I didn't give a shit...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 16213727


Here this is pretty short and should keep your attention

[link to www.amishrakefight.org]
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02/12/2013 05:36 PM

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[link to www.orthohealing.com]

" Neural Prolotherapy."

Traditional Prolotherapy has focused on ligament-tendon healing, and has shown to be a powerful treatment modality.

With Neural Prolotherapy, however we shift our focus to the subcutaneous nerves as a source of pathology. These subcutaneous nerves in a pathologic state can lead to neurogenic inflammation and pain.

We introduce and explore the use of low dose dextrose Prolotherapy in the treatment of neurogenic inflammatory pain. Neural Prolotherapy is indeed a fantastic treatment option that has the potential to further our healing profession.


Neural Prolotherapy also called Neurofascial Prolotherapy (NPT) is one of the newest advances in Regenerative Orthopedic Medicine.

Neural Prolotherapy is not to be confused with traditional “German” Neural injection therapy.


Dr. Lyftogt noticed that these same nerves responded even better to a low dose dextrose injection. He will be expanding on this further in his upcoming book. Dr. Lyftogt discussed in his recent Neural Prolotherapy meeting that “Cutaneous nerves pass through many fascial layers on their way to the spine. When there is neurogenic swelling at the Fascial Penetration Zone, a Chronic Constriction Injury (CCI) occurs. The CCI points will inhibit flow of Nerve Growth Factor (NGF).8, 7 Proper flow of NGF is essential for nerve health and repair.”3

Dr. Lyftogt has studied the use of a wide range of dextrose, lidocaine, and procaine concentrations. At this point in time, he is using 5% dextrose in sterile water solution (1cc of dextrose 50 in 9cc sterile water).

No lidocaine is used.
NPT is given just under the skin close to subcutaneous nerves at weekly intervals.
"You can bend it and twist it... You can misuse and abuse it... But even God cannot change the Truth.”
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stillhere

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02/12/2013 05:42 PM

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Dr. Lyftogt’s early research focused on the treatment of Achilles tendons. He has treated over 300 Achilles tendons with a success rate of more than 90%.

Dr. Lyftogt has published six level 4 studies in the Australian Journal of Musculoskeletal Medicine since 2005. He has studied the shoulder, ankle, back, elbow, and hip. His 2 year follow up shows a 80-100% success rate.10, 11, 12

[link to www.orthohealing.com]
peace
"You can bend it and twist it... You can misuse and abuse it... But even God cannot change the Truth.”
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02/12/2013 05:44 PM
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See ciriax massage( sound like a test by an evil supervillain) same principle of prolotherapy much more safe(in skilled hands).
Anonymous Coward
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02/12/2013 06:13 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
I went through four rounds of Prolotherapy treatments over ten years ago, for torn spinal ligaments. I can vouch for the effectiveness of this treatment.
I was left with a bit of a bulge on my back where the injections did their work, but that is a small price to pay to be able to ride a bike and carry a backpack up a trail again.
If you are suffering from chronic back pain, I highly recommend looking into it. It's not effective for every type of injury, but for some it can be very effective.
Psycho7
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02/12/2013 06:19 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Seems to be a few options in Australia.

Thanks for the heads up.
simultaneous_final

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02/12/2013 06:32 PM
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A fucking HORSEMAN?!!

You break horses?

You're twice the man I'll ever be!
A subject observes itself observing itself observing itself observing itself observing itself observing itself observing itself observing itself ad infinitum.
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02/12/2013 06:33 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Is this the cure for horse arthritis?

I know (of) a dude via a family member who is a vet...

he developed a cure for arthritis and joint pain... he discovered it by working on race horses here in Kentucky...

He went through the proper channels to begin human trials... it was safe for humans... it worked on humans...

but the FDA had it stuck in red tape limbo last I heard

sad
 Quoting: Dr. Acula


Did it involve taking MSM?
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02/12/2013 06:37 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Dr. Lyftogt’s early research focused on the treatment of Achilles tendons. He has treated over 300 Achilles tendons with a success rate of more than 90%.

Dr. Lyftogt has published six level 4 studies in the Australian Journal of Musculoskeletal Medicine since 2005. He has studied the shoulder, ankle, back, elbow, and hip. His 2 year follow up shows a 80-100% success rate.10, 11, 12

[link to www.orthohealing.com]
peace
 Quoting: stillhere


Thank you for the link :-)
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
Is this the cure for horse arthritis?

I know (of) a dude via a family member who is a vet...

he developed a cure for arthritis and joint pain... he discovered it by working on race horses here in Kentucky...

He went through the proper channels to begin human trials... it was safe for humans... it worked on humans...

but the FDA had it stuck in red tape limbo last I heard

sad
 Quoting: Dr. Acula


Did it involve taking MSM?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32477660


you know i dont even know.

I barely remember the story told to me. far as i know the technical aspects werent discussed.

It came from my cousin... who doesnt lie or tell uncle stories...

but through his job he met the vet and after a few days of working with him... (my cousin is a mechanic)
Turns out they live in the same area and etc.
so the dude was venting to him about it.

something like that... my memory is getting shitty

lol

but i do know he developed a cure for joint pain and arthritis in humans and he discovered it after being a vet and working with horses.

That part i know 100% lol


EDIT:

oh i mentioned it cos i wondered if this was based on that dudes work... or someone who came up with a similar cure...

anyways the OP isnt full of shit... from what i heard horse doctors can help humans too lol

cheerS

Last Edited by Dr. Acula on 02/12/2013 06:42 PM
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Thanks, I know some folks who could benefit greatly from this info.
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There is even one in my hometown, so worth checking out.

Thanks.
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02/12/2013 07:48 PM
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Re: This thread WILL help a few of you, GLP gives to me so it's only right I give something back.
I went through four rounds of Prolotherapy treatments over ten years ago, for torn spinal ligaments. I can vouch for the effectiveness of this treatment.
I was left with a bit of a bulge on my back where the injections did their work, but that is a small price to pay to be able to ride a bike and carry a backpack up a trail again.
If you are suffering from chronic back pain, I highly recommend looking into it. It's not effective for every type of injury, but for some it can be very effective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27786776


That's great! Good for you. Nothing like good folks coming forward with their own personal experiences.





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