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I asked My Pastor ...

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 5943151
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02/16/2013 02:48 AM
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I asked My Pastor ...
He preached a sermon about the Evil of Drinking alcohol...


Later ...

I asked him this...

"If drinking alcohol is WRONG ... Why did Jesus turn "Water into Wine?" ... As His FIRST miracle, at the wedding celebration?".

---------------------

His answer ...

"Well ... The water then, was polluted and impure!".


My question, then ...

"Why didn't Jesus just turn the Water into "Pure" water?".

----------------------

His Blank stare ....

"Uh ... You'll have to ask God that question ... When you get to Heaven ....".

--------------------


That was the day that I lost confidence in Pastors and traditional "Churches".


------------------------


Does ANYONE here have an answer to this Question? :

If alcohol is wrong ... Why did Jesus turn Water into Wine?


Thoughts ? ...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/16/2013 02:51 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
Anyone?
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 02:52 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
drink alcohol arent wrong, it become wrong when you drink to much and you get drunk or you get addicted to alcohol
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 02:53 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
It isn't the alcohol drink that is wrong, it is getting drunk on the alcohol drink. You see if you get drunk you lose control of yourself and are open to bad thinks. That is what is wrong with it, it is get drunk.

Do not be drunken on wine, or anything that make you drunk or lose control over your own actions.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 02:53 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
I've actually read back in those times grape juice was called wine but then again I've read people in the bible being drunk on wine so not really sure.
MHz

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02/16/2013 02:56 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
It was at His mother's request for the men at the week long wedding and they had run out. If they plant vineyards they could drink the wine, strong drink was forbidden.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 02:59 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
I've actually read back in those times grape juice was called wine but then again I've read people in the bible being drunk on wine so not really sure.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 9787765


Both.

Also getting drunk is unclassy. Stay classy.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 02:59 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
The Master Jesus turning water into wine is the Transmutation Stage of Alchemy. Do some research on the topic, you'll certainly find peace.
MHz

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02/16/2013 02:59 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
I've actually read back in those times grape juice was called wine but then again I've read people in the bible being drunk on wine so not really sure.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 9787765

That was what Noah planted first, Lot was drunk when his daughters slept with him. A older son who became a` drunkard and a glutton could be put to death so there were clear limits.
ANHEDONIC

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02/16/2013 02:59 AM

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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
Sure, try interpretting the act of turning water into wine as a metaphor designed to communicate a higher message / conceptualization. I very much would doubt it was intended to be a literal account of a magic trick. : )

Think along the lines of refinement / transformation / etc.

"You will not be punished for your anger, you will be punished by your anger"
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:00 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
The bible says serve no man strong drink... that would be liquor. Not beer or wine... Wine dates all the way back to the days of Noah...

Hard Liquor got the name Spirits back in the days of old because when you drank it, It made you mean and angry! That's why they call liquor spirits, because you acted like demons when you got toasted.

Not the same for wine unless you drank a whole shit load of it... Also When Jesus drank wine, It was called New wine and was unleavened meaning basically grape juice.. It was a euphemism for being without sin... Jesus spilled his blood for our sins... His blood is represented by the New Wine, meaning without sin....
ANHEDONIC

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02/16/2013 03:01 AM

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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
The Master Jesus turning water into wine is the Transmutation Stage of Alchemy. Do some research on the topic, you'll certainly find peace.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17398523


Transmutation - that's the word I was looking for in my post.

charlie

Last Edited by ANHEDONIC on 02/16/2013 03:02 AM

"You will not be punished for your anger, you will be punished by your anger"
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:02 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
The bible says serve no man strong drink... that would be liquor. Not beer or wine... Wine dates all the way back to the days of Noah...

Hard Liquor got the name Spirits back in the days of old because when you drank it, It made you mean and angry! That's why they call liquor spirits, because you acted like demons when you got toasted.

Not the same for wine unless you drank a whole shit load of it... Also When Jesus drank wine, It was called New wine and was unleavened meaning basically grape juice.. It was a euphemism for being without sin... Jesus spilled his blood for our sins... His blood is represented by the New Wine, meaning without sin....
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34517938




Don't know if you can comprehend this... It is not in just one place in the bible you would have to study it out in the margins to understand.....


Just Remember New Wine meaning without sin=Christ
s Blood and forgiveness of our sins...
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:04 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
New Wine means it has not yet been leavened or turned to alcohol yet.
krosty

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02/16/2013 03:04 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
It's not like this is the only example of inconsistency in the Bible. rolleyes
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:05 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
As usual you people take things out of context....

The letter of the law killeth, but the spirit of the law giveth life!
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:08 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
It's not like this is the only example of inconsistency in the Bible. rolleyes
 Quoting: krosty


this is not an inconsistency, It is not for you to know! It is only for those with a good and honest heart... Those who realize that they are assholes, but realize they can be forgiven, for being that asshole if we repent...

The only sin that cannot be forgiven is those who blaspheme God's name and his word.
Children of the Atom

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02/16/2013 03:09 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
drink alcohol arent wrong, it become wrong when you drink to much and you get drunk or you get addicted to alcohol
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14197586


cool2
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:10 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
And if your pastor did not give you the answer as I did above about the new wine... He is a false prophet a wolf in sheep's clothing and you should run as far away from him as you can
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/16/2013 03:12 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
The Scripture says this:


John 2

King James Version (KJV)


2 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:

2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.

3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.

4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.

5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.

6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.

7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.

8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it.

9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,

10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.

11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.

---------------------------


Obviously ... It wasn't 'water' ....

It was a 'celebration' at a wedding feast ...

It was "Wine" ... A drink that made Men's hearts ... Merry.

NOT "Grape Juice".

Jesus was concerned at doing this 'miracle' ... But he honored his Mother's request ...

-----------------------

Tradition was that the 'bad wine' was served first ... Jesus gave them "New Wine" ... And that was noted and commented on...

It was WINE ...
krosty

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02/16/2013 03:23 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
It's not like this is the only example of inconsistency in the Bible. rolleyes
 Quoting: krosty


this is not an inconsistency, It is not for you to know! It is only for those with a good and honest heart... Those who realize that they are assholes, but realize they can be forgiven, for being that asshole if we repent...

The only sin that cannot be forgiven is those who blaspheme God's name and his word.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34517938


I know I'm an asshole as we all are. The bible says I can do whatever I want and it's all paid for even if I can figure out he exists before I die. John 3:16

I suppose there is a verse that contradicts with that?
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:24 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
The Scripture says this:


John 2

King James Version (KJV)


2 And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:

2 And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.

3 And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.

4 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.

5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.

6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.

7 Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.

8 And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it.

9 When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,

10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.

11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.

---------------------------


Obviously ... It wasn't 'water' ....

It was a 'celebration' at a wedding feast ...

It was "Wine" ... A drink that made Men's hearts ... Merry.

NOT "Grape Juice".

Jesus was concerned at doing this 'miracle' ... But he honored his Mother's request ...

-----------------------

Tradition was that the 'bad wine' was served first ... Jesus gave them "New Wine" ... And that was noted and commented on...

It was WINE ...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 5943151


You are missing it, Jesus was talking about the marriage of Christ to his bride, He was also setting up the parable of the representation of wine and the symbol of marriage between him and his bride! He was also foretelling of his own death and Resurrection. It is kinda complicated...

hus saith the Lord, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.

Thus saith the Lord, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.

Jesus's blood is the new wine meaning without sin!!

Get it... leaven=sin
Unleavened means without sin...
Christ's blood was without sin...
without leaven... Read the words he said after he broke the bread and ate and drank the new wine.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 5943151
United States
02/16/2013 03:24 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
Sure, try interpretting the act of turning water into wine as a metaphor designed to communicate a higher message / conceptualization. I very much would doubt it was intended to be a literal account of a magic trick. : )

Think along the lines of refinement / transformation / etc.

------------------------------------------------

Appreciate your thoughts ...

But, Obviously ... In the context of the recorded event ...

Plain water was turned into something OTHER than plain water.

It was recognized as "WINE" ... NOT grape juice ...

NOT highly-aged "WINE" ...

But "WINE" ... None the Less ...

It was "New WINE" ...

Intended to enhance the Party atmosphere ...

Alchohol WAS a part of this event.

Obviously!
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:26 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
He preached a sermon about the Evil of Drinking alcohol...


Later ...

I asked him this...

"If drinking alcohol is WRONG ... Why did Jesus turn "Water into Wine?" ... As His FIRST miracle, at the wedding celebration?".

---------------------

His answer ...

"Well ... The water then, was polluted and impure!".


My question, then ...

"Why didn't Jesus just turn the Water into "Pure" water?".

----------------------

His Blank stare ....

"Uh ... You'll have to ask God that question ... When you get to Heaven ....".

--------------------


That was the day that I lost confidence in Pastors and traditional "Churches".


------------------------


Does ANYONE here have an answer to this Question? :

If alcohol is wrong ... Why did Jesus turn Water into Wine?


Thoughts ? ...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 5943151


The answer to your question is the same answer to every question. Alcohol can provide you with an experience. Many people love it so much that they make that experience their life goal. Alcohol can be evil because it can be enjoyed and abused so easily. It takes little to no logic to see that the effects of too much drinking on someone are very negative. If you enjoy alcohol moderation is the key. Using it as a recreational activity and a pass time as most do...well that's the evil side of it all. First thing to go with alcohol is your judgment...
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:28 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
It's not like this is the only example of inconsistency in the Bible. rolleyes
 Quoting: krosty


this is not an inconsistency, It is not for you to know! It is only for those with a good and honest heart... Those who realize that they are assholes, but realize they can be forgiven, for being that asshole if we repent...

The only sin that cannot be forgiven is those who blaspheme God's name and his word.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34517938


I know I'm an asshole as we all are. The bible says I can do whatever I want and it's all paid for even if I can figure out he exists before I die. John 3:16

I suppose there is a verse that contradicts with that?
 Quoting: krosty


Wrong that is called treading on the blood of jesus christ!

Putting your sins under the blood of christ is totally different... You must first repent... that means stop sinning..

People are miss taught by their pastors that they can keep sinning... and that the law is non effect..

Read this

Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.

28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

29 Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:

30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:31 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
Meaning you still have to Obey God's laws.....Not what the churches are teaching!
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:32 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
But when you screw up, you are forgiven, if you repent of it and stop doing it...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/16/2013 03:34 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
I see your point...

And THAT would seem to reconcile Jesus' reluctance to turn the water into wine ... At HIS Mother's request ...

Mom had a history of attending such parties ... And, so, accepted the party, "Protocol"...

-----------------------

Jesus was trying to show that there was a "Better Way" ...

"Mom" (Mary) ... Was just as simple and plain as WE are ...

----------------------

Jesus complied ... With Reservations ...

----------------------

Just as YOU and I Might ... When we know that OUR Mom might be prone to drink a little too much wine...

----------------------

I see it, Now ...


Jesus was weening her away from Wine...
Judethz
Israel is Eternal

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United Kingdom
02/16/2013 03:40 AM

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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
drink alcohol arent wrong, it become wrong when you drink to much and you get drunk or you get addicted to alcohol
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14197586


9teen Thats basically true. Non of us are perfect but try and drink in moderation, and as others have said avoid strong drink.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 34517938
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02/16/2013 03:40 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
I see your point...

And THAT would seem to reconcile Jesus' reluctance to turn the water into wine ... At HIS Mother's request ...

Mom had a history of attending such parties ... And, so, accepted the party, "Protocol"...

-----------------------

Jesus was trying to show that there was a "Better Way" ...

"Mom" (Mary) ... Was just as simple and plain as WE are ...

----------------------

Jesus complied ... With Reservations ...

----------------------

Just as YOU and I Might ... When we know that OUR Mom might be prone to drink a little too much wine...

----------------------

I see it, Now ...


Jesus was weening her away from Wine...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 5943151


You are still missing the point, Jesus was a man, who could have sinned at any time... but he rebuked both Satan and Temptation to commit sin. His blood was pure... he did not sin... but God knows mans heart.. He said there is not One righteous man on the entire earth... We had evil thoughts from the time we were born...

He sent his son, to teach us we can rebuke sin, but if we screwed up that we could be forgiven through our faith in God or His son... Jesus Christ....
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2013 03:43 AM
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Re: I asked My Pastor ...
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

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