Obamacare Broke Already, And It's Just Beginning...

USA healthcare has been financial insanity for many years. Nothing new.

Workers, not capitalists, create all the material wealth in society, from raw materials that belong to the commons. As an employee is always paid less than they create for the employer, the employee is actually working at a loss. It is the employer who is stealing from the employee and from humanity. It isn't productivity that is the problem; rather, the inequitable productivity that benefits the capitalist at the expense of everyone else in society.

it looks like a giant insurance company will collapse. US with high debt and keep increasing its debt exponentially, printing more and more money, and now have obligation for healthcare.. officially done

Again

So what if the employer decides that there is no need for the employee? There will be NO wealth for the employee then!

What happens if the employer doesn't innovate? Then someone else will have to take over.

What happens if the employee doesn't take the inventor's place? There will be no advancement of humanity at all.

What happens if the employee DOES take the inventor's place? Then that person will be accused of the tripe the left like throwing at them.

What the leftists describe is a zero-sum game. If someone has a lot of wealth, then there is less for someone else. But wealth isn't just pieces of gold with limited availability. Wealth is all but infinite - limited only by the productive nature of the human mind.

Until leftists figure this out, they will whine about social justice and the like. And as long as those whine about social justice and the like, there will be theft and tyranny.

Last Edited by Gnosis 2020 on 02/16/2013 12:35 PM

Definitely the dentist! I dropped 30 grand on a dentist last year to make up for my lifetime of dental horror. Do it all in one year so the tax deduction is possible. I figure I can last the rest of my life without a real dentist if I absolutely have to. Plan for another country if necessary.

So you would rather be Dominated by an unelected political class of "Party Members" in a Communist system?!?!?

Or do you think that you, being the useful idiot you are, are going to be one of those "Party Members"?

Because I got news for you...the Useful Idiots are the first to go...

See Russia (30 Million Dead), see China (50 Million Dead)...

Besides, what we have right now is barely recognizable as "Capitalism"...all systems around the world are morphing into a system that more resembles the Chinese Communist/Fascism model...

And that system only promotes more of what we already have and worse...

Last Edited by Saddletramp on 02/16/2013 12:37 PM

I just want everyone to take notice of who is defending the Behemoth of Obamacare on this thread...Avowed Communists!!!

Ohhhh I see now, So we have been a shitty country for the last 220 years

Don't get me wrong, I'd much rather have a single payer plan like all the other western industrialized nations. Unfortunately, conservative ideology and the power of the insurance industry has made that impossible, for now anyway.

Yes, but there's still hope if we'll only abandon conservatism once and for all.

I don't see people who are employed by the government working for FREE. They're now making double what the private sector is getting, and most of them do nothing for it. Big welfare check with a job title attached.

So hey, rather than fix the holes in the system...lets give Communism a try...

Sorry, I'm not buying...

What a fucking shill! The bill originated in the senate(disqualified immediately) and went through coercive manipulative tactics to "pass" both houses. Everything was bogus, including hiding language in "by reference" clauses.

Obama was in on the fix, and all the insiders got paid off one way or another.

The "law" was upheld by the turncoat supremes under a truly bogus "tax" hypothesis. Of course it's a tax, but it's hidden as a 2000 dollar assessment against every policy, or person without insurance.

I won't be payin', just sayin'.

BTW, "promote the general welfare" doesn't mean to force one perspective of general welfare.

Freedom trumps any of this crap.

It boggles the mind that someone as monumentally ignorant(wilfully or otherwise) as you so clearly are can figure out how to turn on a computer, let alone how to navigate to this site & post a comment. Are you just a shitty little SHILL or just another brain dead Ohbumma-bot Lemming? Just out of curiosity....Which would you kiss first, his ring, feet or ass?

Freedom is not absolute. Freedom must be limited for the well-being of society. It's OK though, because the benefits of a well-functioning society greatly outweigh any perceived benefits of absolute freedom, if there actually were such a thing.

Communists have been gloming onto those four words for 60 years...of course they have to take them entirely out of context to use them, but hey...

Indigent care has been thus far absorbed by the industry. From tax write offs, charity cases, philanthropy to hospitals, everyone gets emergent health care. The question at this point is who has been paying for it.

The problem is that those who are indigent and don't have healthcare always present in the 11th hour and cost a lot more. If they actually had access to doctors/pa's/np's and adequate preventive care, we could avoid some of these costs.

The other issue is litigation and the price of defensive medicine. The studies say that tort reform won't affect but <5 percent of cost, but what they fail to realize is that a doctor that's trained in this legal environment is going to practice defensive medicine for most of his career. Those trained in a new legal environment won't be about "getting that mri so I don't miss that 1/1,000,000 neuroblastoma."

Those of you who live in this paradise where healthcare equal for everyone should be available to everyone just don't get it.

If you want healthcare to be cheaper, then make the training shorter 5 years like other countries, make more doctors - free education - so there's no debt, then pay doctors less, make nurses education free as well, pa education free, np education free, decrease the time for those as well. Pay hospitals less, get rid of some expensive regulations so hospitals can cut some corners.

Basically, make healthcare worse but it will be cheaper.

You get what you pay for. That's how life is.

:Bullshit33:

What a load of BS. You get that from Media Matters?

Exactly - this was the plan.

Cloward Piven.

Yes, the system can't be sustained as obama intends it to be. Care will be worse, but everyone will have it. The select few will still be able to pay for the real elite stuff that allows for the real expensive stuff like transplants.

You should move to a country that will address those problems for you. Then you will see how great American principles actually are and how stupid you are for believing your entitled to something just because you were born.

Or you could do what Obamacare is doing, making Healthcare both worse, and more expensive...

Now I don't need to move to a better country, thanks to President Obama.

My total basic annual living expenses are less than $2000 usd. That's nothing for me.
That means first of all that my life is care-free.

All Mexican citizens have basic but comprehensive medical, dental, and optical care, but the average Mexican worker is not required to pay income tax or fill out any forms.

Taxes come from businesses, and from import duties, not from workers.

If the social medicine seems too slow or inadequate, out of pocket medical and dental care is about 1/10th what it is in the US, for professional licensed care, or maybe less for care witchdoctors or traditional healers.

The only hitch is, is that it's buyer beware, because here you have the freedom to choose a professionally trained and licensed doctor, or a witchdoctor, if you choose.

It always seems to me that most people in the US are blind to the real foundation to the medical problem, and that is the pyramid power structure of the medical establishment that funnels 90% of the expenses to parasitic upper levels.

The Obamacare, is just another overlay of stupidity, a cloth thrown over the pyramid. The primary problem is the giant pyramid.

ALL this would be solved, simply by giving the people the freedom to choose any kind of medical care they want, regardless of effectiveness or competency. Some would choose better service, and some would choose worse.

This is the fundamental cornerstone that all these secondary problems are based on.

Last Edited by ehecatl on 02/16/2013 01:05 PM

If you think health care is expensive now, wait until its "free"

Yes, that bolded comment says it all. He's a piece of work.

Meanwhile, I expect nothing from this health care system. If you see me lying unconscious in the street, please, please, leave me there or if you are really kind, just load me in a cab and send me home. Please never send me to a medical institute under Obamacare where I can be stuffed in a corner for hours/days/weeks while they allocate their "limited resources according to priorities", butchered, irradiated, pilled to death, or euthanized. Even if it's (cough) "free".

LOL, I think the raw cost isn't going to change much, but who's paying for it definitely has. And those that are going to be be paying for it, can't afford it.

The system although not perfect now has been supported as I said by write offs, charity, etc. Now instead of the private system absorbing costs as they normally have and pricing accordingly (i.e. charging paying customers more akin to merchant charging more to make up for stealing), the government is going to pay for all the "stealing" than can occur/is ocurring. (lol)

Think before spouting off blanket statements. Perhaps you perceive a world of only mega-corporations and employees.

What about the self-employed that produce and sell goods?

What about factory machines? Would you argue that they don't create material wealth.

Right and us peons will get basically first aid. Things like cardiac stents will be for the likes of Bill Clinton but not the average Joe.


We'll all have our great big share of lousy healtcare delivered by nurses and physician's assistants and seldom if ever seeing a real physician.