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what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?

 
warrior poet

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02/21/2013 11:25 PM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I will share my NDE. First from what I can recollect I didn't have any of the conventional experiences. First, I don't have my medical records anymore. I was unable to discuss the details of the night for most of my life. After the shooting I went to see my surgeon on follow up care and he wanted me to know, "son, you were as close as anyone can ever be without being gone forever." My parents wanted to talk to me, "about that night..." likewise I was unable to discuss it with them. It wasn't until this past year when I sat down and wrote about my experience in an effort to write a suicide prevention book that I was forced to consider the events of that night when I buried the end of a muzzle 1 inch left of sternum in the middle of the woods and tugged the trigger.

I know before I pulled the trigger I prayed and I took a small King James Gideon's bible with me into the woods. It was approximately 4:45 to 5:00 PM in the evening. I lived 22 miles away from the hospital and the nearest rescue squad was 18 miles away. As I say I was alone in the woods. I know it would take 40 minutes of drive time to deliver me to the surgeon. I reason I went over 90 minutes post shooting.

What I remember: This reality and I hope we can be mature, but it felt like latex. The closer I moved towards the death the more this latex was stretched. The more "thin" that reality was separated from this one. Here healthy and full of this life, that reality is invisible. As the progression of the damage carried its way through me I became "aware" of "voices"... the "voices" (I called the voice "it" most of my life) "It" confronted me a period of time after the round went off. I belive it was an answer to my prayers. It asked me to, "name a reason to live" this is why I say, "Find one reason to live and hold fast to it if you are having a crisis of hope." For a blink of an eye or two, I felt what I believe where my children. One NDE symptom is a life flash forward. Death is outside of this realm of time. "It" gave me directions on how to get out of the woods. Further I remember my body and face "banging off the ground" When I woke up in the ICU I was unable to open my left eye. They told me, "It was due to you dragging your face off the ground in the woods (saw briars, stumps, rocks etc)" I don't remember fully making it out of the woods. It was a struggle to sit and breathe after the sucking chest wound. If I lay down on my side/back I felt like I was drowning. If I set up I used to much energy and that made me breathe faster causing more pain and misery. I cleared the wood line and "It" instructed me to call for help. It was all I could do to whisper let alone scream. Yet my screams carried. My younger brother was in the home a distance away and felt an urgency to come into the woods to work with firewood and thus found me.


When I reached the ER. I was in and out. I never had those, "I went to hell and suffered fire. Or, I went and hung out with Jesus," but I was at peace. I didn't want to die by suicide. My "spirit" was grieving I had done that to me. I wanted to live. I remember the chest tube insertion. That was hell. It's a long spear that the trauma surgeon shoves into the intercostals spaces between ribs. I saw my family walk into the trauma hallway. They were maybe 20 yards away. I remember, I turned my head and looked at them. They covered their face and walked away, grief stricken. I was upset they were gone. I wanted them to know I was fine and okay. I made eye contact with them but they never saw me look at them and make eye contact.

I have sensations of hands gripping my heart. I have a thoractomy scar covering half of my upper body and a bullet fragment remains near my spine. I shot myself on January 24th 1986. The space shuttle went down four days later on a Tuesday. I had been discharged from the ICU and on to a main floor. My head was foggy. I was struggling with ice chips that day. No one pulled a curtain and pulled up a stool to, "talk to me about my shooting..." Yet, as I watched the space shuttle blow out of the sky, I knew exactly where they were going. My thoughts, "They went further than me" going back to that veil. I believe I touched it while they went through it.

As I wrote my book, I listened to my "writer voice" and what my subconsicous mind had to say. I visited a psychiatrist for a year after the shooting. He wanted me to "free write" about what I saw in the woods. He wanted me to access what my subconscious mind knew but blocked from me. As I wrote last year I wrote a scene that touched my heart. It boils down to, "sitting almost on a hillside beneath an illuminating sun light with my feet stretched out. Not wanting to leave the warmth and joy of that place. Not wanting to go back to the cold and chaos. I was at home and wanted "them" to know I was okay and happy". I don't know if that sequence was relevant to an experience.

Sorry for the round about NDE experience but I feel it's important when ever I talk about mine to share it without embellishments. I wish I could remember mine like so many of these other folks that see loved ones and others.
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:28 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
...


my sweeping generalization is this. I'm just a person. I'm not an authority on anything . Therefore you can go read my posts and such and then you can tell me what you think. I know religion, I detoxed it. I understand spirituality as it is a lifestyle. I know toxins and how to detox them. Toxins will make you an idiot if you let them. Been there, done that. Just a little concerned that you try to hard to make yourself an authority on stuff that is a belief (by definition cannot be proven). Does not make it false, but you have to wonder, why are you really trying so hard?

if you can honestly answer that question to yourself using logic and reason and real root words and definitions, then you are on a good path. Otherwise you are leaning on your own understanding. Book of Proverbs can tell you how that one turns out
 Quoting: acegotflows


It's good to see you aren't so arrogant, as your previous posts.

I do respect that.

There was a lot of logic and reasoning in post, hence for example, why I specifically looked for veridical information. By doing this, we can logically rule out, that the person was not creating the experience from his subconscious, based on former beliefs.

About to look over your account.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


I see multiple threads you created, which one is it?

There doesn't appear to be indication, where you specifically mention your personal experience with Jesus, in the title.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


you're right. I never named Jesus because I couldn't. I didn't think about that before I sent you hunting. My bad on that one. here's a link just from today where I touched on it

Thread: Did Native Americans have access to the Bible?
 Quoting: acegotflows


The experience I see is this:

1- my amrosia experience in 2007 where I was consumed by the violet flame. It felt like warm electric silk and all loving and knowing. I also saw a bright gyroscope craft and beings that had animal masks with wings

2- my experience with seeing and being taken to a crystal pyramid with the beings that had the lines for faces

3- my life being saved on different occasions by nothing that could be logically explained



Let me state this, I can relate somewhat, I had also personally tried a psychedelic, and learned about the experiences of others.

I too looked into native american, and shamanic beliefs. For example I read every book by Carlos Castaneda, and many other shamanic books.

I understand your experience.

You were born into a Christian belief, but never really had a chance to explore other beliefs. To make up you own mind. For example, there's not only various new age, and shamanic beliefs, but there's also Buddhism, Hinduism, Advaita Vedanta, etc.

From what you stated, where I quoted you, the experiences aren't very detailed, so I can't really comment on it. Do you have more info?

All I can state, is be willing to look for all evidences, for all beliefs, both mainstreams, and the various belief systems.

This will take many years, and will be ongoing process.

If you don't you may prematurely form a conclusion, and no longer be open minded to other evidences, which shows that you're wrong.
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:30 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
Can't know until it happens but you were there for him and listened. Better than most would do.hf
 Quoting: Seeker of Truth


I would have given him the 2 cigs without conditions. maybe I would have taken time out to be with him and talk, depends.
krosty

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02/21/2013 11:31 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I would have told him that I know where to get heroin, they will give it to you at the hospital.
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:34 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
Did I see some one say there are no absolutes ??? Seriously? In a world full of absolutes why would it be any different beyond the grave? There is hot so hot it melts steel, cold so cold it goes beyond measure. No absolutes? Dark so dark you cannot see your hand in front of your face. Extended darkness, and isolation that causes madness. Light so bright it blinds the eyes. No absolutes? You have the cold moon, the hot sun. Water is wet. No absolutes? I'm tired of hearing this age old philosophical dribble. Of course there are absolutes. There is absolute truth. Absolute falsehood. Any one who says there is no eternity, no soul, no life after death is a fool. You cannot see it, so it's not there? Really? You have an eye TOOL, it taps into the "seeing" realm. No tool, no "seeing". Does that mean there's no such thing as color? To the blind maybe. The "man" said it good, you are all blind guides. If you don't know nothing, keep your mouth shut. The fool says, "there is no God" because he is a fool. It is becoming common knowledge in the science world, that in fact, life has come by intelligent design. Anything designed is set together by laws and principle. That is why we have LAWS AND PRINCIPLES where by we build, and we create, and we design. The cell resembles galaxies why? Because of the principle of the design. Order from the finite to infinity, therefore the after life- unseen- resembles that which is "seen" in this realm, because these things (in their kind) resemble themselves. That is why suicide is dangerous. You could be punished in a court of judgment in another realm and find you had no good excuse to do what you did. No one on this forum can say they Know for sure anything any differently.

From someone that knows the pain it causes, what it does to your family is criminal. It is the ultimate state of selfishness, it will destroy your parents and put a dark shadow over your children, and they will be tormented in their minds by it for the rest of their lives, until they get spiritual healing, if they don't follow your foot steps, first, which is more common than not.

So-

if you hate your life, then just act like your dead, that you have not life of your own, and commit yourself to a worthy cause. I promise you, you will find your life there. Ultimately, God is always the answer.
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:35 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
Did I see some one say there are no absolutes ??? Seriously? In a world full of absolutes why would it be any different beyond the grave? There is hot so hot it melts steel, cold so cold it goes beyond measure. No absolutes? Dark so dark you cannot see your hand in front of your face. Extended darkness, and isolation that causes madness. Light so bright it blinds the eyes. No absolutes? You have the cold moon, the hot sun. Water is wet. No absolutes? I'm tired of hearing this age old philosophical dribble. Of course there are absolutes. There is absolute truth. Absolute falsehood. Any one who says there is no eternity, no soul, no life after death is a fool. You cannot see it, so it's not there? Really? You have an eye TOOL, it taps into the "seeing" realm. No tool, no "seeing". Does that mean there's no such thing as color? To the blind maybe. The "man" said it good, you are all blind guides. If you don't know nothing, keep your mouth shut. The fool says, "there is no God" because he is a fool. It is becoming common knowledge in the science world, that in fact, life has come by intelligent design. Anything designed is set together by laws and principle. That is why we have LAWS AND PRINCIPLES where by we build, and we create, and we design. The cell resembles galaxies why? Because of the principle of the design. Order from the finite to infinity, therefore the after life- unseen- resembles that which is "seen" in this realm, because these things (in their kind) resemble themselves. That is why suicide is dangerous. You could be punished in a court of judgment in another realm and find you had no good excuse to do what you did. No one on this forum can say they Know for sure anything any differently.

From someone that knows the pain it causes, what it does to your family is criminal. It is the ultimate state of selfishness, it will destroy your parents and put a dark shadow over your children, and they will be tormented in their minds by it for the rest of their lives, until they get spiritual healing, if they don't follow your foot steps, first, which is more common than not.

So-

if you hate your life, then just act like your dead, that you have not life of your own, and commit yourself to a worthy cause. I promise you, you will find your life there. Ultimately, God is always the answer.
acegotflows

User ID: 28872932
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02/21/2013 11:35 PM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I will share my NDE. First from what I can recollect I didn't have any of the conventional experiences. First, I don't have my medical records anymore. I was unable to discuss the details of the night for most of my life. After the shooting I went to see my surgeon on follow up care and he wanted me to know, "son, you were as close as anyone can ever be without being gone forever." My parents wanted to talk to me, "about that night..." likewise I was unable to discuss it with them. It wasn't until this past year when I sat down and wrote about my experience in an effort to write a suicide prevention book that I was forced to consider the events of that night when I buried the end of a muzzle 1 inch left of sternum in the middle of the woods and tugged the trigger.

I know before I pulled the trigger I prayed and I took a small King James Gideon's bible with me into the woods. It was approximately 4:45 to 5:00 PM in the evening. I lived 22 miles away from the hospital and the nearest rescue squad was 18 miles away. As I say I was alone in the woods. I know it would take 40 minutes of drive time to deliver me to the surgeon. I reason I went over 90 minutes post shooting.

What I remember: This reality and I hope we can be mature, but it felt like latex. The closer I moved towards the death the more this latex was stretched. The more "thin" that reality was separated from this one. Here healthy and full of this life, that reality is invisible. As the progression of the damage carried its way through me I became "aware" of "voices"... the "voices" (I called the voice "it" most of my life) "It" confronted me a period of time after the round went off. I belive it was an answer to my prayers. It asked me to, "name a reason to live" this is why I say, "Find one reason to live and hold fast to it if you are having a crisis of hope." For a blink of an eye or two, I felt what I believe where my children. One NDE symptom is a life flash forward. Death is outside of this realm of time. "It" gave me directions on how to get out of the woods. Further I remember my body and face "banging off the ground" When I woke up in the ICU I was unable to open my left eye. They told me, "It was due to you dragging your face off the ground in the woods (saw briars, stumps, rocks etc)" I don't remember fully making it out of the woods. It was a struggle to sit and breathe after the sucking chest wound. If I lay down on my side/back I felt like I was drowning. If I set up I used to much energy and that made me breathe faster causing more pain and misery. I cleared the wood line and "It" instructed me to call for help. It was all I could do to whisper let alone scream. Yet my screams carried. My younger brother was in the home a distance away and felt an urgency to come into the woods to work with firewood and thus found me.


When I reached the ER. I was in and out. I never had those, "I went to hell and suffered fire. Or, I went and hung out with Jesus," but I was at peace. I didn't want to die by suicide. My "spirit" was grieving I had done that to me. I wanted to live. I remember the chest tube insertion. That was hell. It's a long spear that the trauma surgeon shoves into the intercostals spaces between ribs. I saw my family walk into the trauma hallway. They were maybe 20 yards away. I remember, I turned my head and looked at them. They covered their face and walked away, grief stricken. I was upset they were gone. I wanted them to know I was fine and okay. I made eye contact with them but they never saw me look at them and make eye contact.

I have sensations of hands gripping my heart. I have a thoractomy scar covering half of my upper body and a bullet fragment remains near my spine. I shot myself on January 24th 1986. The space shuttle went down four days later on a Tuesday. I had been discharged from the ICU and on to a main floor. My head was foggy. I was struggling with ice chips that day. No one pulled a curtain and pulled up a stool to, "talk to me about my shooting..." Yet, as I watched the space shuttle blow out of the sky, I knew exactly where they were going. My thoughts, "They went further than me" going back to that veil. I believe I touched it while they went through it.

As I wrote my book, I listened to my "writer voice" and what my subconsicous mind had to say. I visited a psychiatrist for a year after the shooting. He wanted me to "free write" about what I saw in the woods. He wanted me to access what my subconscious mind knew but blocked from me. As I wrote last year I wrote a scene that touched my heart. It boils down to, "sitting almost on a hillside beneath an illuminating sun light with my feet stretched out. Not wanting to leave the warmth and joy of that place. Not wanting to go back to the cold and chaos. I was at home and wanted "them" to know I was okay and happy". I don't know if that sequence was relevant to an experience.

Sorry for the round about NDE experience but I feel it's important when ever I talk about mine to share it without embellishments. I wish I could remember mine like so many of these other folks that see loved ones and others.
 Quoting: warrior poet


thank you for sharing. That touched my deeply as I can tell the anguish you felt just by your descriptions. I could never feel what you did, but you conveyed it in a way that made it real to me. I can only imagine what you must have felt and how the will to live overcame the desire to give it all away.

For me, my NDE experience was because of psychedelics. I literally died and eulogized myself (I can't really describe it) and felt my book of judgement be wiped clean as I took the steps to try and transmute my past by admitting my faults and shortcomings and being willing to LEAVE at that time. When you dabble in that stuff you don't always feel like you will come back, even if it's the case. I literally buried myself under a cover and just went to this place that was just me and my memories all knowing and all encompassing. I didn't have to feel anything it just was. and I TOLD ON MYSELF. I just stated telling. I admitted stuff I forgot I did. I admitted that I was not a good person a lot of times. And I realized IT IS NOT OUR FAULT. NONE OF IT IS OUR FAULT. The victim mindset takes blame for stuff that is not yours to take. We can't just repent (as that is just re-stuffing the issue) we have to logically explain it away and send it to "god". I wound up feeling whole like I was being walked WITH rather than being led. Now I don't fear, I'm not apprehensive about life, and I get exactly what I need by paying attention to things as they come.

I've had more experiences, but when I actually DIED to myself by CHOICE I started to live again. And more each day.

peace
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
acegotflows

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02/21/2013 11:41 PM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
...


It's good to see you aren't so arrogant, as your previous posts.

I do respect that.

There was a lot of logic and reasoning in post, hence for example, why I specifically looked for veridical information. By doing this, we can logically rule out, that the person was not creating the experience from his subconscious, based on former beliefs.

About to look over your account.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


I see multiple threads you created, which one is it?

There doesn't appear to be indication, where you specifically mention your personal experience with Jesus, in the title.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


you're right. I never named Jesus because I couldn't. I didn't think about that before I sent you hunting. My bad on that one. here's a link just from today where I touched on it

Thread: Did Native Americans have access to the Bible?
 Quoting: acegotflows


The experience I see is this:

1- my amrosia experience in 2007 where I was consumed by the violet flame. It felt like warm electric silk and all loving and knowing. I also saw a bright gyroscope craft and beings that had animal masks with wings

2- my experience with seeing and being taken to a crystal pyramid with the beings that had the lines for faces

3- my life being saved on different occasions by nothing that could be logically explained



Let me state this, I can relate somewhat, I had also personally tried a psychedelic, and learned about the experiences of others.

I too looked into native american, and shamanic beliefs. For example I read every book by Carlos Castaneda, and many other shamanic books.

I understand your experience.

You were born into a Christian belief, but never really had a chance to explore other beliefs. To make up you own mind. For example, there's not only various new age, and shamanic beliefs, but there's also Buddhism, Hinduism, Advaita Vedanta, etc.

From what you stated, where I quoted you, the experiences aren't very detailed, so I can't really comment on it. Do you have more info?

All I can state, is be willing to look for all evidences, for all beliefs, both mainstreams, and the various belief systems.

This will take many years, and will be ongoing process.

If you don't you may prematurely form a conclusion, and no longer be open minded to other evidences, which shows that you're wrong.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


I've gone into details in other threads, but I felt that those 3 bullets were kind of an indicator that I'm aware just as you are. I'm just taking it a day at a time as I'm just getting slammed with all these realizations since January. I didn't even have reference for most of this stuff until then as my mind was still in the fog of bad diet, blame and guilt for things that were not my fault to begin with. We lose our innocence at a young age and often struggle to get back to the child like curiosity of exploring our experiences. Nobody can tell you what and who you are besides you. Most of the time those things are trying to impress on you. It's not easy to wade thru that.
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:42 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I've been starting to feel that way lately. I have no friends, no girlfriend, I work alone at a mediocre job and I find little enjoyment in hobbies. I have such little happiness and love in my life lately I've started to lose the will to live. If things don't change soon I don't know how much longer I can go on. Without love and friendship, life is pointless. I simply exist.
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:44 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
First I would say "Are you feeling lucky? Huh PUNK?"

Then I would say "Go ahead - MAKE MY DAY"
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:44 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I had a NDE, astral traveled, went through the "torture" test before the afterlife (as explained in the "Book of the Dead")... and I saw Jesus,, didnt meet him, but saw him; talked to God, met and listened to my Guide; fought horrendous battles with my demon.

And lived...
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:45 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
...


I see multiple threads you created, which one is it?

There doesn't appear to be indication, where you specifically mention your personal experience with Jesus, in the title.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


you're right. I never named Jesus because I couldn't. I didn't think about that before I sent you hunting. My bad on that one. here's a link just from today where I touched on it

Thread: Did Native Americans have access to the Bible?
 Quoting: acegotflows


The experience I see is this:

1- my amrosia experience in 2007 where I was consumed by the violet flame. It felt like warm electric silk and all loving and knowing. I also saw a bright gyroscope craft and beings that had animal masks with wings

2- my experience with seeing and being taken to a crystal pyramid with the beings that had the lines for faces

3- my life being saved on different occasions by nothing that could be logically explained



Let me state this, I can relate somewhat, I had also personally tried a psychedelic, and learned about the experiences of others.

I too looked into native american, and shamanic beliefs. For example I read every book by Carlos Castaneda, and many other shamanic books.

I understand your experience.

You were born into a Christian belief, but never really had a chance to explore other beliefs. To make up you own mind. For example, there's not only various new age, and shamanic beliefs, but there's also Buddhism, Hinduism, Advaita Vedanta, etc.

From what you stated, where I quoted you, the experiences aren't very detailed, so I can't really comment on it. Do you have more info?

All I can state, is be willing to look for all evidences, for all beliefs, both mainstreams, and the various belief systems.

This will take many years, and will be ongoing process.

If you don't you may prematurely form a conclusion, and no longer be open minded to other evidences, which shows that you're wrong.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


I've gone into details in other threads, but I felt that those 3 bullets were kind of an indicator that I'm aware just as you are. I'm just taking it a day at a time as I'm just getting slammed with all these realizations since January. I didn't even have reference for most of this stuff until then as my mind was still in the fog of bad diet, blame and guilt for things that were not my fault to begin with. We lose our innocence at a young age and often struggle to get back to the child like curiosity of exploring our experiences. Nobody can tell you what and who you are besides you. Most of the time those things are trying to impress on you. It's not easy to wade thru that.
 Quoting: acegotflows

Thank you for sharing your experiences, but, let me be direct, from what I gather so far, you still need to continue searching.
acegotflows

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02/21/2013 11:55 PM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
Did I see some one say there are no absolutes ??? Seriously? In a world full of absolutes why would it be any different beyond the grave? There is hot so hot it melts steel, cold so cold it goes beyond measure. No absolutes? Dark so dark you cannot see your hand in front of your face. Extended darkness, and isolation that causes madness. Light so bright it blinds the eyes. No absolutes? You have the cold moon, the hot sun. Water is wet. No absolutes? I'm tired of hearing this age old philosophical dribble. Of course there are absolutes. There is absolute truth. Absolute falsehood. Any one who says there is no eternity, no soul, no life after death is a fool. You cannot see it, so it's not there? Really? You have an eye TOOL, it taps into the "seeing" realm. No tool, no "seeing". Does that mean there's no such thing as color? To the blind maybe. The "man" said it good, you are all blind guides. If you don't know nothing, keep your mouth shut. The fool says, "there is no God" because he is a fool. It is becoming common knowledge in the science world, that in fact, life has come by intelligent design. Anything designed is set together by laws and principle. That is why we have LAWS AND PRINCIPLES where by we build, and we create, and we design. The cell resembles galaxies why? Because of the principle of the design. Order from the finite to infinity, therefore the after life- unseen- resembles that which is "seen" in this realm, because these things (in their kind) resemble themselves. That is why suicide is dangerous. You could be punished in a court of judgment in another realm and find you had no good excuse to do what you did. No one on this forum can say they Know for sure anything any differently.

From someone that knows the pain it causes, what it does to your family is criminal. It is the ultimate state of selfishness, it will destroy your parents and put a dark shadow over your children, and they will be tormented in their minds by it for the rest of their lives, until they get spiritual healing, if they don't follow your foot steps, first, which is more common than not.

So-

if you hate your life, then just act like your dead, that you have not life of your own, and commit yourself to a worthy cause. I promise you, you will find your life there. Ultimately, God is always the answer.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 11261416


taking two sides of something to the extreme still is not an absolute. It just is an extreme. Energy is energy. you start to label it now it is not Just energy -it is energy with intent and that is directed energy. Apply that concept to religion and naming stuff. You are calling things into being every thought you think. Your intention builds up like a bank, some call it karma. it is really more like can you see what you ask for. Messages and messengers are in many forms and take time to get there. Energy "god" is instant. This is how one tends to miss the message because we trick ourselves. Absolutes are a deception. Not because they aren't true. But how can you prove it? There is always a higher authority until you can't run anymore. You just might not LIKE it when you get there. We run out of choices and free will in life at certain times. How we thought and what we did leading up to that point will more than likely determine the outcome before we actually have made a decision on it.

Does not mean that you cannot get up and start back over again, but it won't be easy if you have to UNLEARN bad habits and negative processes. But dealing in absolutes is assuming that YOU are an authority on stuff.

If you are found to be incorrect in them- it is not a nice realization.

I have had plenty of them from my ignorant ways. And I was BLESSED because I still am here. Many times that I was aware of I could have not been. I can only imagine the times that I had no clue how close I was.

Ditch the absolutes unless you are just that CONFIDENT in your assumptions.
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
acegotflows

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02/21/2013 11:55 PM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
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you're right. I never named Jesus because I couldn't. I didn't think about that before I sent you hunting. My bad on that one. here's a link just from today where I touched on it

Thread: Did Native Americans have access to the Bible?
 Quoting: acegotflows


The experience I see is this:

1- my amrosia experience in 2007 where I was consumed by the violet flame. It felt like warm electric silk and all loving and knowing. I also saw a bright gyroscope craft and beings that had animal masks with wings

2- my experience with seeing and being taken to a crystal pyramid with the beings that had the lines for faces

3- my life being saved on different occasions by nothing that could be logically explained



Let me state this, I can relate somewhat, I had also personally tried a psychedelic, and learned about the experiences of others.

I too looked into native american, and shamanic beliefs. For example I read every book by Carlos Castaneda, and many other shamanic books.

I understand your experience.

You were born into a Christian belief, but never really had a chance to explore other beliefs. To make up you own mind. For example, there's not only various new age, and shamanic beliefs, but there's also Buddhism, Hinduism, Advaita Vedanta, etc.

From what you stated, where I quoted you, the experiences aren't very detailed, so I can't really comment on it. Do you have more info?

All I can state, is be willing to look for all evidences, for all beliefs, both mainstreams, and the various belief systems.

This will take many years, and will be ongoing process.

If you don't you may prematurely form a conclusion, and no longer be open minded to other evidences, which shows that you're wrong.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


I've gone into details in other threads, but I felt that those 3 bullets were kind of an indicator that I'm aware just as you are. I'm just taking it a day at a time as I'm just getting slammed with all these realizations since January. I didn't even have reference for most of this stuff until then as my mind was still in the fog of bad diet, blame and guilt for things that were not my fault to begin with. We lose our innocence at a young age and often struggle to get back to the child like curiosity of exploring our experiences. Nobody can tell you what and who you are besides you. Most of the time those things are trying to impress on you. It's not easy to wade thru that.
 Quoting: acegotflows

Thank you for sharing your experiences, but, let me be direct, from what I gather so far, you still need to continue searching.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


as do you. That's not advice, it's reality
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:57 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
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The experience I see is this:

1- my amrosia experience in 2007 where I was consumed by the violet flame. It felt like warm electric silk and all loving and knowing. I also saw a bright gyroscope craft and beings that had animal masks with wings

2- my experience with seeing and being taken to a crystal pyramid with the beings that had the lines for faces

3- my life being saved on different occasions by nothing that could be logically explained



Let me state this, I can relate somewhat, I had also personally tried a psychedelic, and learned about the experiences of others.

I too looked into native american, and shamanic beliefs. For example I read every book by Carlos Castaneda, and many other shamanic books.

I understand your experience.

You were born into a Christian belief, but never really had a chance to explore other beliefs. To make up you own mind. For example, there's not only various new age, and shamanic beliefs, but there's also Buddhism, Hinduism, Advaita Vedanta, etc.

From what you stated, where I quoted you, the experiences aren't very detailed, so I can't really comment on it. Do you have more info?

All I can state, is be willing to look for all evidences, for all beliefs, both mainstreams, and the various belief systems.

This will take many years, and will be ongoing process.

If you don't you may prematurely form a conclusion, and no longer be open minded to other evidences, which shows that you're wrong.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


I've gone into details in other threads, but I felt that those 3 bullets were kind of an indicator that I'm aware just as you are. I'm just taking it a day at a time as I'm just getting slammed with all these realizations since January. I didn't even have reference for most of this stuff until then as my mind was still in the fog of bad diet, blame and guilt for things that were not my fault to begin with. We lose our innocence at a young age and often struggle to get back to the child like curiosity of exploring our experiences. Nobody can tell you what and who you are besides you. Most of the time those things are trying to impress on you. It's not easy to wade thru that.
 Quoting: acegotflows

Thank you for sharing your experiences, but, let me be direct, from what I gather so far, you still need to continue searching.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


as do you. That's not advice, it's reality
 Quoting: acegotflows


Well I presented cases, that you can't explain.

Also if you're aware as me, tell me this.

There's 2 groups of people, that have NDEs. Group one has an NDE, but aren't clinically death. The other group are clinically death, also experience an NDE.

How will their NDE experience be different?

If you're aware as me, you would know this.
Anonymous Coward
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02/21/2013 11:59 PM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
as aware as me...

just sayin.
Anonymous Coward
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02/22/2013 12:02 AM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
When I had my NDE I was very enthusiastic about telling people. But it was a put down when people challenged my experience as it challenged their concepts, ideas, beliefs... It's hard to spill your guts like that and have it thrown back in your face..
Anonymous Coward
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02/22/2013 12:04 AM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
When I had my NDE I was very enthusiastic about telling people. But it was a put down when people challenged my experience as it challenged their concepts, ideas, beliefs... It's hard to spill your guts like that and have it thrown back in your face..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34241302


It sounded really interesting, I would love to hear it in full, if you don't mind.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
When I had my NDE I was very enthusiastic about telling people. But it was a put down when people challenged my experience as it challenged their concepts, ideas, beliefs... It's hard to spill your guts like that and have it thrown back in your face..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34241302


It sounded really interesting, I would love to hear it in full, if you don't mind.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


I wrote 30 pages on it. In full would get me banned...
acegotflows

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02/22/2013 12:12 AM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
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I've gone into details in other threads, but I felt that those 3 bullets were kind of an indicator that I'm aware just as you are. I'm just taking it a day at a time as I'm just getting slammed with all these realizations since January. I didn't even have reference for most of this stuff until then as my mind was still in the fog of bad diet, blame and guilt for things that were not my fault to begin with. We lose our innocence at a young age and often struggle to get back to the child like curiosity of exploring our experiences. Nobody can tell you what and who you are besides you. Most of the time those things are trying to impress on you. It's not easy to wade thru that.
 Quoting: acegotflows

Thank you for sharing your experiences, but, let me be direct, from what I gather so far, you still need to continue searching.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


as do you. That's not advice, it's reality
 Quoting: acegotflows


Well I presented cases, that you can't explain.

Also if you're aware as me, tell me this.

There's 2 groups of people, that have NDEs. Group one has an NDE, but aren't clinically death. The other group are clinically death, also experience an NDE.

How will their NDE experience be different?

If you're aware as me, you would know this.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179

because I have been dead before. It was not fun. It actually was interesting because I technically shouldn't have noticed. I fell out of my bunk bed and landed smack on my head on the window seal when I was little. I don't remember much of anything but the hurt and then nothing. It was so sudden. I KNEW I was dead, but surprisingly enough just that quick I was back in my body and boom it was like nothing happened.

Did not meet a Jesus figure then

got saved by an oncoming car once. Hand came out of the sky and changed it in a direction that was impossible by the laws of physics.

Could not explain it didn't try to.

The first time I SAW and knew I had an experience much like the one EZEKIEL had in the Bible. That is when I started to be informed of the true nature of the "messengers"

From what I dealt with Jesus was an embodiment of certain things- not a person but just an avatar that is unique to each person but is familiar when you hear or feel it.

Jesus is an embodiment of principles that the mind and body chemistry form when in a certain energy frequency. Does not make it real or fake (those are all assumptions of the mind). It just is. You can't explain it or explain it away when you're there. I've been there. It was the best feeling I ever had. Since then I literally have been walking WITH rather than being led by. When you get to that point you can't do what you used to because body and mind reject it (like the dark can't even stay anymore). You become more loving and feeling. IT does not mean you become God like or perfect. Rather you realize your mortality and are better directed to whatever purposes you set for yourself and learn to use your natural and spiritual gifts.

And you can share about it and don't have to worry about SHADOWS and such as THAT IS THE MAIN TOOL OF THE DECEIVERS. You don't have to care what others think if you aren't lying and you aren't hiding.

THAT IS WHERE YOU CAN SEE THE MIMIC. Because the mimic does not know it's own material when questioned. It just thinks it does.

So once again you can tell me all that you feel you know. I'll tell you my experience and tell you keep searching for answers if you still feel that you need them. I don't anymore. It's not about answers for me.

it is something you cannot explain because we just don't have the capacity or the capability to express it. I've tried.

so if you would like to know more ... cool. If not.... cool

either way I'm just a person and am not special or any different than anybody
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Anonymous Coward
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I was working as a deckhand on a tugboat and fell between a deep sea boat and a barge. Crushed by two walls of steal.
Anonymous Coward
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02/22/2013 12:14 AM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
"hey, life is not for everyone."
acegotflows

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02/22/2013 12:16 AM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
When I had my NDE I was very enthusiastic about telling people. But it was a put down when people challenged my experience as it challenged their concepts, ideas, beliefs... It's hard to spill your guts like that and have it thrown back in your face..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34241302


I understand what you mean. My reply I just wrote speaks on that same concept of it being thrown in your face and challenging the beliefs of others
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Anonymous Coward
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02/22/2013 12:23 AM
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
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Thank you for sharing your experiences, but, let me be direct, from what I gather so far, you still need to continue searching.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


as do you. That's not advice, it's reality
 Quoting: acegotflows


Well I presented cases, that you can't explain.

Also if you're aware as me, tell me this.

There's 2 groups of people, that have NDEs. Group one has an NDE, but aren't clinically death. The other group are clinically death, also experience an NDE.

How will their NDE experience be different?

If you're aware as me, you would know this.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179

Jesus is an embodiment of principles that the mind and body chemistry form when in a certain energy frequency. Does not make it real or fake (those are all assumptions of the mind).
 Quoting: acegotflows


Again, as stated, I said a trap people fall into, is having a personal experience and then make sweeping generalizations.

You're essentially doing this.

Why?

An overwhelming majority of cases, are seeing the exact same key features of Jesus. Which shows, it's not merely an assumption of the mind.

Also thanks for sharing your experience. There was actually another case, in which a lady too describes a very similar experience regarding the large hand, coming to move her car, and preventing her from dying.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I was working as a deckhand on a tugboat and fell between a deep sea boat and a barge. Crushed by two walls of steal.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34241302


Can explain, what occurred during the actual NDE?
little deer

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
Re: Re : :what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
do you want to live?

Last Edited by boob on 02/22/2013 12:29 AM
you know
acegotflows

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02/22/2013 12:31 AM

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as do you. That's not advice, it's reality
 Quoting: acegotflows


Well I presented cases, that you can't explain.

Also if you're aware as me, tell me this.

There's 2 groups of people, that have NDEs. Group one has an NDE, but aren't clinically death. The other group are clinically death, also experience an NDE.

How will their NDE experience be different?

If you're aware as me, you would know this.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179

Jesus is an embodiment of principles that the mind and body chemistry form when in a certain energy frequency. Does not make it real or fake (those are all assumptions of the mind).
 Quoting: acegotflows


Again, as stated, I said a trap people fall into, is having a personal experience and then make sweeping generalizations.

You're essentially doing this.

Why?

An overwhelming majority of cases, are seeing the exact same key features of Jesus. Which shows, it's not merely an assumption of the mind.

Also thanks for sharing your experience. There was actually another case, in which a lady too describes a very similar experience regarding the large hand, coming to move her car, and preventing her from dying.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34812179


let me explain something to you about a programmed mind. You skipped DOES NOT MAKE IT REAL OR FAKE part along with assumptions of the mind. How can a simple mind understand ALL ENCOMPASSING? No way that it can. I make no bones about it. When something just is- you can't explain for or against.... NOTICE THAT I HAVE NOT.

you still look for validation. If you still need it, you're lost... not that you are not on the path... but you will never see what you chose to walk around. God is everything. period. You ignore the messages because you assume that there is still good vs bad. I cant tell just by your whole angle of trying to be validated in your assumptions. You read way too much into it.

that's why a mimic can't tell it's exposed. You need to put your mimic in check. You cannot make logical progressions. Something is preventing you from doing so. Whatever it is probably is a stronghold over you that gives you purpose in life because it wants to be given credence.

I don't know you. I don't do people. I do energy. Based on the words you do and the lack of being able to follow logical progression you need to go back to the drawing board. It's not a bad thing, you just need to refine your technique. You are not ask skilled as you think...

you're essentially barking up the wrong tree on this one. But I'll be happy to answer any questions you have regarding why I said what I have ...I have no shadows and no reason to hide or duck you....
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Anonymous Coward
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
there's a reason why they say never talk to strangers. Now you opened a neural path for a killer to walk amongst the living waiting to kill himself and perhaps others.
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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I was working as a deckhand on a tugboat and fell between a deep sea boat and a barge. Crushed by two walls of steal.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34241302


I was in ICU for 2 weeks. 3 weeks in the respiratory lung recovery. Morphine was my friend. Could have been all there was. But I know hallucingens, and this was altogether different. Plus I was told afterwards I was in and out of death, or at least the machines told them so...

Where I was, however, was in a different world,,,, then in a different dimension, then in a different time, far far away. And what I learned, the training, the practice, the trial and error, and the testing to gain strength, to overcome many debilities, to fight just so I could obtain in the end supernatural powers and begin a quest I still dont understand -- this over a 2 week period...
acegotflows

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02/22/2013 12:35 AM

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Re: what would you say to someone that wanted to kill themselves?
I was working as a deckhand on a tugboat and fell between a deep sea boat and a barge. Crushed by two walls of steal.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34241302


I was in ICU for 2 weeks. 3 weeks in the respiratory lung recovery. Morphine was my friend. Could have been all there was. But I know hallucingens, and this was altogether different. Plus I was told afterwards I was in and out of death, or at least the machines told them so...

Where I was, however, was in a different world,,,, then in a different dimension, then in a different time, far far away. And what I learned, the training, the practice, the trial and error, and the testing to gain strength, to overcome many debilities, to fight just so I could obtain in the end supernatural powers and begin a quest I still dont understand -- this over a 2 week period...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34241302


that resonates very strongly with me
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"

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