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Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...

 
Chauncey Gardener
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02/22/2013 02:27 PM
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Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
On 13 May 2000, Cardinal Sodano announced that the Third Secret would be released, during which he implied the secret was about the persecution of Christians in the 20th century that culminated in the failed assassination attempt on Pope John Paul II on 13 May 1981. <I>However, other theologians believe that the secret concerns an apostasy of cardinals, bishops and priests.</I> For instance, Cardinal Ciappi, personal theologian to Pope John Paul II, is quoted by sources as saying,

<b>"In the Third Secret it is foretold, among other things, that the great apostasy in the Church will begin at the top." </b>

In addition, on a syndicated radio broadcast, Fr. Malachi Martin stated that the Third Secret "doesn't make any sense unless we accept that there will be, or that there is in progress, a wholesale apostasy amongst clerics, and laity in the Catholic Church ...".
Chauncey Gardener (OP)
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
Moses foretells the end of days in Deuteronomy, describing a time of apostasy, in which people of Israel become "settled upon their lees". They do not keep the Laws of Moses and resort to idolatry.

[They] would corrupt themselves, and make a graven image; this was the sin that would most easily beset them. Did ever people hear the voice of God speaking out of the midst of the fire? As the seas turn black and feel like mud, and all will know the wrath and atonement of their sins? You shall utterly be destroyed, scattered among the nations, And your sin shall be made your punishment. There shall you serve gods, the work of men's hands, be compelled to serve them, whether you will or no, or, through your own sottishness and stupidity, you will find no better succours to apply yourselves in your captivity.
—Deuteronomy 4:26–28


[link to en.wikipedia.org]
Chauncey Gardener (OP)
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02/22/2013 02:42 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
The Message:
* A “diabolical disorientation” will permeate the Church.
* Multitudes of churchmen—religious, priests, bishops, cardinals—will fall away from the Catholic Faith.
* Multitudes of Catholic faithful will be lead into apostasy (and hell) because of blind obedience to false shepherds.

[link to fatima.ageofmary.com]
Chauncey Gardener (OP)
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02/22/2013 04:16 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
[link to www.tldm.org]

"My child, they converse of the secret that I gave at Fatima. It is a simple explanation. It could not be fully revealed because of the drastic nature of My message. How I warned and warned that satan would enter into the highest realms of the hierarchy in Rome. The Third Secret, My child, is that satan would enter into My Son's Church." - Our Lady of the Roses, May 13, 1978
Anonymous Coward
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02/23/2013 07:36 AM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
bump
Anonymous Coward
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02/23/2013 07:55 AM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
[link to www.tldm.org]

"My child, they converse of the secret that I gave at Fatima. It is a simple explanation. It could not be fully revealed because of the drastic nature of My message. How I warned and warned that satan would enter into the highest realms of the hierarchy in Rome. The Third Secret, My child, is that satan would enter into My Son's Church." - Our Lady of the Roses, May 13, 1978
 Quoting: Chauncey Gardener 34890086


with a pope who proactively harbors pedophiles and tries to seek immunity from prosecution from the state for his church's crimes that sounds about right.
Anonymous Coward
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02/25/2013 12:07 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
English Cardinal resignation accepted.

American Cardinal now being investigated.
Anonymous Coward
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02/25/2013 12:08 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
English Cardinal resignation accepted.

American Cardinal now being investigated.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35139665


which one?
wisc_natureboy

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02/25/2013 12:12 PM

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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
The Message:
* A “diabolical disorientation” will permeate the Church.
* Multitudes of churchmen—religious, priests, bishops, cardinals—will fall away from the Catholic Faith.
* Multitudes of Catholic faithful will be lead into apostasy (and hell) because of blind obedience to false shepherds.

[link to fatima.ageofmary.com]
 Quoting: Chauncey Gardener 34890086


When I was in Vatican City, I was amazing at all the wealth on display.
Huge gold statues everywhere, and just a kilometre away people were begging and starving.
Even at 22yo, I could see the hypocrisy.
.
-
.

We all breathe the same air.
.-.. --- ...- . / .- .-.. .-..
(love/all)
abeliever

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02/25/2013 12:13 PM

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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
OP - I was thinking this last night. The silence about the content of the 3rd secret makes so much sense now. It is because of what will be coming out about the church and offenses against children again. It makes sense why the church protected the information of the 3rd secret. It was to protect themselves. So infuriating and so sad.

Well, they have a lot of gold and dollars in the vatican.

Time to cash it all in and pay for all the criminal offenses against children as anyone charged with a crime has to do.

This is according to God's laws too!
CowboyEE

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02/25/2013 12:16 PM

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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
The Message:
* A “diabolical disorientation” will permeate the Church.
* Multitudes of churchmen—religious, priests, bishops, cardinals—will fall away from the Catholic Faith.
* Multitudes of Catholic faithful will be lead into apostasy (and hell) because of blind obedience to false shepherds.

[link to fatima.ageofmary.com]
 Quoting: Chauncey Gardener 34890086


When I was in Vatican City, I was amazing at all the wealth on display.
Huge gold statues everywhere, and just a kilometre away people were begging and starving.
Even at 22yo, I could see the hypocrisy.
 Quoting: wisc_natureboy


I agree, It was a gross display of immeasurable wealth.
Anonymous Coward
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02/25/2013 12:26 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
English Cardinal resignation accepted.

American Cardinal now being investigated.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35139665


which one?
 Quoting: Swinburnian


Just caught a blurb on the news at noon.
The American Cardinal is under investigation for not acting on abuse charges asap. I think he is from Cincinnati ?

I know we sent Bernard Law over to the Vatican for the same thing, IE whitewashing the investigation into pedo priests.

The English one is charged with being gay with other priests.
Anonymous Coward
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02/25/2013 12:31 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
Weird, as this is the same church that hosed the Templars back in the 1300's.

Just came to light that a document called the Parchment of Chinon was discovered in the Vatican Secret Archives by Barbara Frale and it was written not long after the Templars were accused of heresy, homosexuality, praying to the skull of Dagobert and a multitude of other Vatican offenses.

Signed by the Pope at the time and put away, not to be discovered for over 700 years. It absolved the Templars of all wrongdoing.

It was said that the King of France owed the Templars money and attrition was his way of getting out of debt.

Can you imagine what treasure lay within the Vatican and Malta ??
Anonymous Coward
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02/26/2013 07:49 AM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
Read the book "Vatican Diaries" by John Thavis.
Chris12138

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02/26/2013 08:05 AM

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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
pinthisshit
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
Looks like England will not have a vote in the conclave for the next pope because of the English cardinal's resignation.

I thought that cardinal was from Scotland ?
Anonymous Coward
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02/26/2013 08:26 AM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
Looks like England will not have a vote in the conclave for the next pope because of the English cardinal's resignation.

I thought that cardinal was from Scotland ?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35201320


he was
there are no english cardinals eligible to vote
PEER
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
The Message:
* A “diabolical disorientation” will permeate the Church.
* Multitudes of churchmen—religious, priests, bishops, cardinals—will fall away from the Catholic Faith.
* Multitudes of Catholic faithful will be lead into apostasy (and hell) because of blind obedience to false shepherds.

[link to fatima.ageofmary.com]
 Quoting: Chauncey Gardener 34890086


When I was in Vatican City, I was amazing at all the wealth on display.
Huge gold statues everywhere, and just a kilometre away people were begging and starving.
Even at 22yo, I could see the hypocrisy.
 Quoting: wisc_natureboy


I agree, It was a gross display of immeasurable wealth.
 Quoting: CowboyEE


That is Her property! If you let Government come for the Church's private property, then what happens once they're done with that? They will turn on the citizens. The Church is the Most Powerful force for good in this world. It does more charity then any other organization, but people don't even think of that. Let's not have a repeat of the 'enlightenment'...thanks
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
The Message:
* A “diabolical disorientation” will permeate the Church.
* Multitudes of churchmen—religious, priests, bishops, cardinals—will fall away from the Catholic Faith.
* Multitudes of Catholic faithful will be lead into apostasy (and hell) because of blind obedience to false shepherds.

[link to fatima.ageofmary.com]
 Quoting: Chauncey Gardener 34890086


Seems the 1st two parts of the message above are coming to fruition.

Any ideas on "the false shepherds" mentioned above ?

I would say any of those money grubbing tv preachers would be good candidates.
Anonymous Coward
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02/26/2013 09:21 AM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
They will bring God’s children under the rule of the little horn, who will sit in pompous splendour in the Seat of Peter
On February 18, 2013 @ 6:00 pm

Download article as PDF
My dearly beloved daughter, as the changes within My Church on earth intensify, so also will the voices of the false prophets rise, in unison, to endorse the abomination in My Church. As I reveal to you, the true end time prophet, the Truth – most of which is already known – lies will be spread to confuse all those who follow Me.

For every instruction I give to you, for the world, the exact opposite will be declared from the mouths of the false prophets. They will declare words of comfort to My followers who will find the Truth too awful to bear. Through their wicked lies they will bring God’s children under the rule of the little horn, who will sit in pompous splendour in the Seat of Peter.

When I told you of the great division in My Church, I did not tell you how this would happen. So hear Me now. Just as the priests during My time on earth rejected My Holy Word, so too will the priests just before My Second Coming reject Me. Not only will they reject My Word, given to you, My daughter, but they will accept the changes, which will be forced upon them. Their sacred gifts will be rendered impotent, as soon as, they accept the blasphemies and the new rules presented to them.

My faithful followers will also be divided in their loyalty to My Church on earth. All you must do is to follow My Teachings given to you in My Father’s Book. There is no need to run anywhere, as I Am present amongst you.

You know the Truth. It has been fed to you, as Christians. So when you see that God’s Commandments and My Teachings are being re-written, and My Holy Sacraments changed, then you must turn your backs. Do not allow lies to frighten you, rather be frightened for those who accept these new evil acts and laws, purported to be from Me and who fail to understand the Truth.

Your Jesus



[1]
Endnotes:
[Image]: [link to www.freetellafriend.com]
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
[link to www.fatima.org]

Enter Father Gruner

Father Nicholas Gruner has given voice to the growing movement for disclosure of "The Third Secret." Ordained in Avellino, Italy in 1976, Father Gruner received permission in 1978 to reside in Canada, his home country, where he has since been engaged in a worldwide Catholic apostolate devoted to promoting awareness of "the full Fatima Message". The apostolate has used print, radio and television media to petition for disclosure of the Third Secret, as well as the "consecration" of Russia to the Virgin Mary, which many Catholics believe has yet to be done. The media effort has included an open letter to the Pope in a major Italian newspaper, which caused a furor in the Roman press.

The "Great Apostasy"


Father Gruner has widely publicized the work of several Fatima experts who believe they have deduced what the Third Secret contains: a warning that the Catholic Church will undergo a catastrophic loss of faith and discipline beginning around 1960 - the "great apostasy" predicted in Scripture as a harbinger of the end times.

As evidence for this view, these experts point to unprecedented change and upheaval in the Catholic Church since the Second Vatican Council was convened in 1960: the abandonment of all traditional forms of worship in Latin, the collapse of traditional orders of priests and nuns, the exodus of Catholics from the Church, the precipitous drop in Mass attendance among those remaining, the drastic decline in priestly and religious vocations, the innumerable sexual scandals involving priests and even bishops, and the widespread refusal of nominal Catholics in the pews to adhere any longer to Papal teaching on contraception, divorce, abortion or any other matter on which they "disagree" with the Pope.

Father Gruner, too, is convinced that the Third Secret warns of precisely these events, and that this would explain its suppression: "Obviously, no Vatican official would be eager to reveal a warning from Heaven which says that the great apostasy in the Catholic Church is going to happen on his watch."
Anonymous Coward
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02/26/2013 12:21 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
The following are excerpts from the CNS online article. I think it speaks for itself. (Sorry I can't post the link, but it is easy to find.)

CNS

VATICAN LETTER May-7-2010 (990 words) Backgrounder. With photos posted May 5. xxxi

Fatima debate: Some say 'third secret' is still secret

By John Thavis
Catholic News Service

VATICAN CITY (CNS) -- Ten years after the Vatican divulged one of the church's best-kept secrets -- the third part of the message of Fatima -- a small band of skeptics and critics are still questioning the official explanation.

More than 100 of them gathered at a hotel not far from the Vatican in early May for a weeklong conference on such topics as "Fatima and the Global Economic Crisis," "The Present Need for the Consecration of Russia" and "Is There a Missing Text of the Third Secret?"

For those in attendance, the answer to that last question is a no-brainer.

"The evidence points to only one conclusion: that something has to be missing," said Christopher A. Ferrara, a U.S. attorney and Catholic commentator who spoke at the conference.

Ferrara pointed to what he described as a series of incongruities and inconsistencies in the Vatican's version. Among people truly familiar with the events at Fatima, he said, only a minority "cling steadfastly to the notion that an ambiguous vision of a bishop dressed in white outside a half-ruined city is all there is to the third secret."

That's the heart of the question for people in the "Fatima Challenge" movement. They argue that the third secret of Fatima was a prophecy so traumatic and dire that several popes decided not to make it known to the faithful, and yet the text published in 2000 contained little more than an allegory about the church's past struggles with 20th-century ideologies.

They say there's good reason to believe the third secret wasn't just about the church battling outside forces, but about Satan working in the church -- at the highest levels.

[SNIP]

Most recently, several of these "diehard Fatimists" -- as a Vatican official once described them -- have suggested that the priestly sex abuse crisis in the church is a clear sign of the crisis of faith and pastoral negligence prophesied, they say, by Mary at Fatima.

The conference took place a few days before Pope Benedict XVI's visit to Fatima, and organizers went out of their way to invite the pope and Vatican officials. None showed up. The pope's Vatican aides consider the "Fatimists" a fringe element that is best ignored.

[SNIP]

Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, the Vatican secretary of state, has said one of the reasons the third secret was made public in 2000 was that people were spreading "absurd theses" about catastrophic events or heresy at the top levels of the church.

[SNIP]

In 2007, Cardinal Bertone wrote his own book, "The Last Visionary of Fatima," which reiterated the official version of the Fatima messages and secrets and was based, he said, on long conversations with Carmelite Sister Lucia dos Santos, the last of the visionaries to die. In TV appearances, the cardinal strongly denied theories of a Vatican cover-up.

Pope Benedict was also personally involved in publishing the third secret. As Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, the Vatican's top doctrinal official, he presented the text of the secret to the press and wrote a lengthy commentary about it.

That news conference on June 26, 2000, is still memorable for Vatican journalists. The stage was set for disclosure of a text that for decades was thought to be too disturbing to reveal. But instead, Cardinal Ratzinger began by deflating expectations and announcing that there was nothing apocalyptic.

[SNIP]

Cardinal Ratzinger said that was how to understand the third secret's vision of a "bishop in white" who struggles up a hill amid corpses of slain martyrs, and then falls dead after being shot by soldiers.

That explanation still sticks in the craw of "Fatimists," who say it deliberately removes the vision's apocalyptic scenario and lulls the faithful into a false sense of security. The Vatican's version, they say, suggests these problems are behind the church, when in their view the worst is yet to come.

[SNIP]

The Fatima messages are not dogma, and the church does not impose belief or any single interpretation. That seems to ensure that the "Fatimists" will continue to broadcast their theories to whoever will listen.


[END ARTICLE EXCERPTS]

Now, remember that the above is from CATHOLIC NEWS SERVICE, but it seems to me that even the author of this article does not believe the official Vatican story regarding the third secret!
Anonymous Coward
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02/26/2013 12:51 PM
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
^ Good info on the CNS by ac above ^

bump
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
On 13 May 2000, Cardinal Sodano announced that the Third Secret would be released, during which he implied the secret was about the persecution of Christians in the 20th century that culminated in the failed assassination attempt on Pope John Paul II on 13 May 1981. <I>However, other theologians believe that the secret concerns an apostasy of cardinals, bishops and priests.</I> For instance, Cardinal Ciappi, personal theologian to Pope John Paul II, is quoted by sources as saying,

<b>"In the Third Secret it is foretold, among other things, that the great apostasy in the Church will begin at the top." </b>

In addition, on a syndicated radio broadcast, Fr. Malachi Martin stated that the Third Secret "doesn't make any sense unless we accept that there will be, or that there is in progress, a wholesale apostasy amongst clerics, and laity in the Catholic Church ...".
 Quoting: Chauncey Gardener 34890086


I think possibly the contents of the LaSallette message embodies what is essentially contained in Fatima's 3rd secret.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
On 13 May 2000, Cardinal Sodano announced that the Third Secret would be released, during which he implied the secret was about the persecution of Christians in the 20th century that culminated in the failed assassination attempt on Pope John Paul II on 13 May 1981. <I>However, other theologians believe that the secret concerns an apostasy of cardinals, bishops and priests.</I> For instance, Cardinal Ciappi, personal theologian to Pope John Paul II, is quoted by sources as saying,

<b>"In the Third Secret it is foretold, among other things, that the great apostasy in the Church will begin at the top." </b>

In addition, on a syndicated radio broadcast, Fr. Malachi Martin stated that the Third Secret "doesn't make any sense unless we accept that there will be, or that there is in progress, a wholesale apostasy amongst clerics, and laity in the Catholic Church ...".
 Quoting: Chauncey Gardener 34890086


I think possibly the contents of the LaSallette message embodies what is essentially contained in Fatima's 3rd secret.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28649819


What is the LaSallette message ?
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
[link to www.fatima.org]


APPARITION OF THE BLESSED VIRGIN ON THE MOUNTAIN OF LA SALETTE
September 19, 1846

Part I of III
Published by the Shepherdess of La Salette
with Imprimatur by the Bishop of Lecce.

Only the witness herself, Melanie, can, along with Maximin, give an account of the apparition. After giving it by word of mouth an incalculable number of times, she decided to write it all down in 1878. It was published at Lecce on the 15th of November 1879 — with the "Imprimatur" of Bishop Zola — and reprinted "ne varietur" at Lyons in 1904, a few months before Melanie's death. This slim booklet is now a rarity. The text is followed exactly here.

(Continued in link above)
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
I think the whole idea is to discredit the Catholic Church - it is the 'old skin' the old vehicle of control - they are going to get the plebs to attack it same as they are doing with the bankers and the 1% ers.

The shiny new snake is going to be Putin's Russia with himself as 'gods annointed Tzar' after the Pope flees rome and the Vatican merges with the revived Russian Orthodox Church.

These 'Marian apparitions' and proheciesare all part of the plan - greys, Archons or whatever in disguise!
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
the state "dissolves" the church "disolves". to "dissapear"

this is magic

a hat pull

the rabbit is the combination of the two

see also

"the divine invasion"
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
Cardinal Ciappi, personal theologian to Pope John Paul II, is quoted by sources as saying:

"In the Third Secret it is foretold, among other things, that the great apostasy in the Church will begin at the top."
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Apostasy & The 3rd Secret of Fatima - it starts at the top echelons...
The Pope wears Red Prada shoes.

When he goes emeritus, he is trading them in for handmade mexican made loafers.
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[link to www.fatima.org]

Rome will lose faith and become the seat of the Antichrist.

The demons of the air, together with the Antichrist, will perform great wonders on earth and in the atmosphere, and men will become more and more perverted. God will take care of His faithful servants and men of good will. The Gospel will be preached everywhere, and all peoples of all nations will get to know the truth.

I make an urgent appeal to the earth. I call on the true disciples of the living God who reigns in Heaven; I call on the true followers of Christ made man, the only true Saviour of men; I call on My children, the true faithful, those who have given themselves to Me so that I may lead them to My divine Son, those whom I carry in My arms, so to speak, those who have lived on My spirit. Finally, I call on the Apostles of the Last Days, the faithful disciples of Jesus Christ who have lived in scorn for the world and for themselves, in poverty and in humility, in scorn and in silence, in prayer and in mortification, in chastity and in union with God, in suffering and unknown to the world. It is time they came out and filled the world with light. Go and reveal yourselves to be My cherished children. I am at your side and within you, provided that your faith is the light which shines upon you in these unhappy days. May your zeal make you famished for the glory and the honor of Jesus Christ. Fight, children of light, you, the few who can see. For now is the time of all times, the end of all ends.

The Church will be in eclipse, the world will be in dismay. But now Enoch and Eli will come, filled with the Spirit of God. They will preach with the might of God, and men of good will will believe in God, and many souls will be comforted. They will make great steps forward through the power of the Holy Spirit and will condemn the devilish lapses of the Antichrist. Woe to the inhabitants of the earth! There will be bloody wars and famines, plagues and infectious diseases. It will rain with a fearful hail of animals. There will be thunderstorms which will shake cities, earthquakes which will swallow up countries. Voices will be heard in the air. Men will beat their heads against walls, call for their death, and on another side death will be their torment. Blood will flow on all sides. Who will be the victor if God does not shorten the length of the test? At the blood, the tears and prayers of the righteous, God will relent. Enoch and Eli will be put to death. Pagan Rome will disappear. The fire of Heaven will fall and consume three cities. All the universe will be struck with terror and many will let themselves be led astray because they have not worshipped the true Christ who lives among them. It is time; the sun is darkening; only faith will survive.

Now is the time; the abyss is opening. Here is the King of kings of darkness, here is the Beast with his subjects, calling himself the Savior of the world. He will rise proudly into the air to go to Heaven. He will be smothered by the breath of the Archangel Saint Michael. He will fall, and the earth, which will have been in a continuous series of evolutions for three days, will open up its fiery bowels; and he will have plunged for all eternity with all his followers into the everlasting chasms of hell. And then water and fire will purge the earth and consume all the works of men's pride and all will be renewed. God will be served and glorified."

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