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Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others

 
Lady Wolf

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03/01/2013 11:31 PM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
you r sweet christians, but being gay is not a sin through christ eyes, only saying this is a very grave abuse of christ message. i wouldnt say a grave sin, because its clear your hearts want to understand, but a grave misunderstanding and manipulation of the holy message, yes.

btw, i am gay. i ws born into an evangelical family, and for many many years the only thing i did is pray to god to set me free of it, many christians came to tell me i would go to hell.
 Quoting: anom 35335472


Being gay is a sin as outlined by Enoch, and many other scriptures.

vitium sodomiticum. Being gay is an abomination.
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


YOU'RE AN ABOMINATION. YOU HAVE HATE IN YOUR HEART. YOU LET SATAN IN AND HE HAS TAKEN OVER YOUR MIND AND FILLED YOU WITH FEAR AND HATE FOR THAT WHICH YOU ARE TOO IGNORANT TO UNDERSTAND.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13636777


Excuse me, but how is pointing out what the Bible says concerning sin hateful?
Real truth is self evident...
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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03/01/2013 11:39 PM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
you r sweet christians, but being gay is not a sin through christ eyes, only saying this is a very grave abuse of christ message. i wouldnt say a grave sin, because its clear your hearts want to understand, but a grave misunderstanding and manipulation of the holy message, yes.

btw, i am gay. i ws born into an evangelical family, and for many many years the only thing i did is pray to god to set me free of it, many christians came to tell me i would go to hell.
 Quoting: anom 35335472


Being gay is a sin as outlined by Enoch, and many other scriptures.

vitium sodomiticum. Being gay is an abomination.
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


YOU'RE AN ABOMINATION. YOU HAVE HATE IN YOUR HEART. YOU LET SATAN IN AND HE HAS TAKEN OVER YOUR MIND AND FILLED YOU WITH FEAR AND HATE FOR THAT WHICH YOU ARE TOO IGNORANT TO UNDERSTAND.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13636777


Excuse me, but how is pointing out what the Bible says concerning sin hateful?
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


I'm not sure some of them will ever admit it, Ladywolf. Sometimes pride will not allow us to admit when we're wrong, and when that happens, it's like talking to a brick wall. You can present them with an inordinate amount of evidence in both Testaments, logically and analytically explain your point, and they will still just say your a hater. What they fail to understand is the real hate is indifference and apathy. Admonition as you pointed out is the tough love that they all lack.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.

Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 12:32 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
And you're a wonderful friend to me as well.

Let's just focus on spreading His love with the world, and let the Holy Spirit do the growing, correcting and changing as need be in each person along the way. You're doing an awesome job, keep on going and remember the love above all else.

:jesus404:
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa


Thank you, Lisa - as usual, you are correct, and you have showed me the error of my ways. I am so defensive about people who distort the message that I don't see the power that the Holy Spirit has on us to make the determination for us. I keep trying to force or control something I have no business controlling, and I need to trust in Christ that He will guide those chosen to our Father's Kingdom. Thank you :-)


 Quoting: Rising Son


I'm sorry, I know this was addressed to Lisa, but I feel compelled to jump in here and give my two cents so please forgive me if I'm being rude.

OP, While only you and God knows what is in your heart and why you felt compelled to post this thread, as one who is reading this thread, I can't help but feel you were not wrong in posting this. "For how will they know unless we tell them?" "And the harvest is plentiful and requires many workers." These two scriptures immediately come to mind to explain what I am saying. All you have done with this thread is to inform people who come here about truth and what the Bible teaches and SAYS about the sin of homosexuality. You have had a loving and a matter of fact attitude about getting this oh so badly needed truth out and I for one applaud your willingness to do it! If your heart was pure in its intention to post this thread, and I feel that it was just based on your words and tone alone, than you have done nothing to be ashamed of or to feel bad about.

Lisa, you seem to be a very kind and loving Christian. While those are admirable traits for a Christian to have, only you know for certain your intentions of a loving rebuttal to OP's thread. However, I also feel it's important that love must not be confused or be at the behest of truth! You are absolutely right that God is the one to finish the work that He has started in us. That He and He alone is able to convict us or make us aware of the sin in our lives. But I must ask you this. How do you know for certain that God is not using the OP and this thread for that very thing? God uses people AS WELL AS other Christians all the time to insure His will is done. How do you know God is not using this very thread to reach out to those on GLP to convict them of their sin? You don't. So for you to tell the OP that God is the one to show us sin in our lives and not the OP, you are basically doing the same thing that you feel the OP is doing, because you don't know that God isn't using the OP for this work. Your response to him, while loving, was also a bit on the stifling side in terms of your attempt to stifle this message.

I hope my loving rebuke to you as a Christian sister is not seen as combative not unloving. But we all know that God works in mysterious ways! peace

Last Edited by Lady Wolf on 03/02/2013 02:24 AM
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Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 01:11 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
PS: if you would tell me your cried for 5 years to god as a child, i would think, oh my god, how did he survive, i would have tears in my eyes. nobody of you christians gave me one ounce of care until now. The prayers are more about what is right in your eyes, then what is right for me.
 Quoting: anom 35335472


I just want to say that I am very sorry for your struggle. A true Christian would have lovingly come along side you and helped you through this difficult time. If this had happened, perhaps you would have found the strength and the support you needed. (((hugs)))
Real truth is self evident...
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 01:23 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
btw, enoch received parables of above, just as your temple is abstract, but i remember you pick and choose what is abstract, temple yes, marriage no.
 Quoting: anom 35335472



Enoch wasn't given Parables, Enoch was brought into Heaven and shown the wonders. My brother I don't condemn you, but God is not a hypocrite as His son showed us. I am only saying this because I LOVE you. Judgment day comes sooner then you think my friend
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


PS: again fear is what you give me. My judgement i lived through life and will do until i will go there where god needs me.

enoch was parable, and if not proof me he even existed.
you can not. still you believe an old men more then you belief me. because jesus told it ? well i believe in what jesus said and the torah, why dont you ? because the torah is full or not, every "sin" equal in our eyes or no torah.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35335472


Enoch was not only real, he had a son named Methuselah. Remember him in the Bible? If Enoch wasn't real than neither was Methuselah. Also, both of these men were descendants of Seth.
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Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 01:37 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
I hope i will still get a response.

James writes that if we disobey one commandment, we are guilty of all (James 2:10).

but a christian gay (loving another) goes to hell and a christian drunkard (who hurts his children sometimes or perhaps because of it) goes to heaven ?

i still think it is very dogmatic and i hope to receive more answers.

the other thing, why would god give stones when a child ask bread ?
 Quoting: anom 35335472


Maybe this will help. He doesn't say WHEN He will give the "bread." Just that He will. It is always about His timing and not ours. Even when we are little children. Case in point, I suffered much abuse as a child. In every way shape and form. Far too much to go into here. Suffice it to say, God was with me THROUGH that abuse and eventually helped me out of it. But it was always on His timing and for His purpose and not my own. His will for me at that time in my life was for me to endure the abuse. But He never left me the whole time it was happening. Today, I am an extremely empathetic person, and I believe the extent of the abuse that I suffered all of those years ago gave me the ability to be compassionate and to learn empathy for the struggles of others.

Do you think it is possible that God allowed you that kind of pain in order for you to learn empathy of others who are also going through similar circumstances. Perhaps this thread and possible other signs He might be showing you is telling you that the lessons are over and now it's time to end your suffering and come to Him and ask Him and His Holy Spirit to help you out of this struggle. To take away the sinful desire that causes you to be this way? I don't know, because I am not God. It is only a suggestion on my part based on what happened to me.
Real truth is self evident...
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 01:45 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
...


ok now wait just a minute here. To love someone has nothing what so ever to do with disagreeing with them. And to forgive someone? To forgive means to pardon someone who is sorry for what they have done and who turns away from it and does not continue to do it and throw it in your face. I do not see how either of these two verbs have anything to do with the subject of this thread.

Just because I do not agree with what someone does. It does not mean I don't love that person. That's just it. Christians have been admonished, actually ORDERED by this very Jesus whom you toute had nothing against homosexuality, to preach the gospel to all the world. Those are our marching orders. Telling you something is a sin, IS love! It's not judgement. Any more than pulling you out of the way of an on-coming truck is judgement! I, the OP and others on here are simply telling you how GOD feels about what you're doing AND justifying in your own reprobate minds, is wrong. It is sin. If I were a thief and flaunting it in your face and showing you all of the goods I have robbed. Would you consider it judging me to tell me that what I was doing was wrong? Or against the law? Or would you expect me to see it as a friendly warning and admonishment to stop stealing things?

I think part of the problem is that people don't know the difference between loving admonition and judging. The two are very different things. I think it's time we learn the difference and stop calling an apple an orange.
 Quoting: Lady Wolf



stealing harms others; loving the person of one's choice harms no one, makes the world a brighter place. apples and oranges, ms. wolf.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 30462077


I'm afraid this is where we're in disagreement. This is not about loving someone in the sense that we ought to love everyone. The kind of love you speak of is against God's laws and his plan for human kind. It not only harms the one who does this, it harms the society who chooses to bury their heads in the sand and look the other way rather than calling this out for what it is. Grave sin in the eyes of God. I'm sorry if that sounds "intolerant" or "hateful" But the truth is rarely welcomed with open arms. Sadly it is usually shunned, ridiculed and received with hatred for the messenger. I'm not saying that you hate me, I'm simply speaking in general terms.
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


Truth is often seen as hate, I agree, and this has destroyed all the false churches. Nobody wants the truth, they just want to think that Love will get them in, WRONG.
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


And Jesus did tell us that we would be hated and persecuted for telling that truth just as he was. He was not wrong. But I will endure so long as He continues to give me the strength as well as the discernment to do so. Keep on keeping on my brother in Christ.
Real truth is self evident...
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 01:49 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
No one is saying GAY People are worse than any other person, that is not even the issue..

It is Homosexuality it is so contrary to why GOD created Mankind that the Abomination of Homosexuality is going to destroy the nation...

Does not mean that all GAY People are going to be destroyed but Homosexuality just like Abortion will be destroyed for good.

 Quoting: christian


bsflag Christianity is so fucking stupid.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17152779


How so? Please have the decency to be specific when you level such a charge against it.
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Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 01:59 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
...


if you take the law literal, take in attention that a gentile is not supposed to keep the sabbath in the way a jew does. the penalty is severe, if you put so much importance to the jewish religion.

i dont say this to scare you, i say this to make a point.

u can not use the law, and then abuse against it.
i dont say that because you have to think as me,
i say this because as long u see sin in gays,
more then in other non attacking sins,
u make them less then yourself. and this thinking is dangerous.
 Quoting: anom 35335472


And that is another lie of the church, they altered the true sabbath, I have two translations that prove Sunday sabbath is false. According to Gods laws you are sinning. Like I said I will pray for you, and I won't cast any stones or condemn you. I will let your actions do that.
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


---

you know the noahide laws ?
a non jew is not supposed to keep the sabbath, penalty is harsh, actually the torah prescribes many to deatch if it would be valid, there is no temple, so it is not valid in that way neither.

the point is, if the torah prescribes almost everyone to death, isnt it better to learn that the torah also gives life by teaching us that the absolute judgement is wrong,
and always deserves death.

as opposite we have christ and love, and it is love that says sin is relative, and how further away from love how more damage you evoke, and how further away fromt he great commandment of loving god, he is all, and one, all toegether, as much as you can.
 Quoting: anom 35335472


The noahide laws also say to cut the heads of off idolaters, such as Christians worshipping a false Messiah, Jesus Christ. The Noahide law will be enforced in our country very soon.
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


Can you please elaborate on this statement. Is this something you want to see happen, or something you believe will happen with the ushering in of the new world order? Thanks:)
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Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:03 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
With all of this being said, it is wrong to cast judgment on others if we ourselves are in need of judgment. However, it is also wrong to support and sponsor immorality while at the same time denigrating the traditional definition of marriage, as Jesus taught us. We all should love homosexuals as we love each other, and in that love, we should yearn to help them overcome their illness of the mind.
 Quoting: Rising Son


I think you are wrong, and i think you give the bible your own meaning, now if you read well, you will realize that what the bible condemns the most, as well as God and Christ, is VIOLENCE, not homosexuality

you cannot equate homosexuality to evil or mental impurity, they are separate, now whether a person is impure an engages in homosexuality would be a different case than a person who is pure and who engages in homosexuality, but the act itself must not be mixed with either good or evil

now, heterosexuality according to history can be far WORST than homosexuality if we are going to talk on those terms, in the past some angels came to our world, the sons of god, and they had sex with human females and guess what came out of that?, giants who controlled the earth in those days and enslaved us, so god had to flood the world and kill everyone to fix the mess they caused, so those angels would've done the right thing by being homosexual and avoiding heterosexual activity, to stop the earth from being flooded

now if you hate homosexuality that is your problem, in fact if you hate homosexuality you are far away from understanding Christ and tolerance, so i suggest you start by being tolerant and taken out the hate from your heart.
 Quoting: SuperPet225


This is not true. Jesus Christ Himself said, "I do not come to bring peace but to bring a sword and division, even to the point of one's own family." (paraphrased from memory) He even goes on to list different types of family relations, i.e. brother against brother, mother against daughter etc. He did NOT preach tolerance. This is a lie. He DID preach love and forgiveness but NEVER at the expense of truth!

Last Edited by Lady Wolf on 03/02/2013 02:04 AM
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Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:08 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
Calling sin SIN is NOT judging a person! Sin is sin, period. When we say murder is a SIN, we are not juding the person who murders, we are judging the ACT of murder! It's always been wrong to kill, always will be! It's always been wrong to be homosexual, always will be! Sin is always sin, and again that is NOT judging a person!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1580547


This!! ^^

clappa
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Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:09 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
Jesus Christ preached about abnormal sex, not homosexuality. God allows humans to pair as they wish, it is abominable sex that harms folks that is forbidden.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31769448


goofy thum
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35370252


Romans 1: 21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet."

WRONG!! Men WITH men or women WITH women is AGAINST the natural way God created us, it is a CHOICE to be gay and it is a SIN to be gay! If you notice the verses closely, God GIVES them up to vile affections because obviously they want their sin more than God! Open your bible and read it my friend!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1580547


And this!! ^^

clappa
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ParadigmShift
Christianity = The Great Lie

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03/02/2013 02:12 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
btw, enoch received parables of above, just as your temple is abstract, but i remember you pick and choose what is abstract, temple yes, marriage no.
 Quoting: anom 35335472



Enoch wasn't given Parables, Enoch was brought into Heaven and shown the wonders. My brother I don't condemn you, but God is not a hypocrite as His son showed us. I am only saying this because I LOVE you. Judgment day comes sooner then you think my friend
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


By you? I have been at a high level and there is no judgmental god. That is a fallacy written and made up by man. We judge ourselves and hold it in our spirit,until we forgive ourselves.

wow, you have judged your own mother? Be careful....you might be here next time around to learn a lesson.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32938997


You really should pick up a dictionary and look up what judge means, by telling someone they are siinning according to the word of God, that is not judging. And that false preaching of judging ourselves, ok.

Guess you have listened to Joel Osteen to much.
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith Yahweh, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their Elohim, and they shall be my people.
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:13 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
Calling sin SIN is NOT judging a person! Sin is sin, period. When we say murder is a SIN, we are not juding the person who murders, we are judging the ACT of murder! It's always been wrong to kill, always will be! It's always been wrong to be homosexual, always will be! Sin is always sin, and again that is NOT judging a person!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1580547


Sin literally means separation from god. If you read what Jesus actually said, he said that what man calls 'god' is Spirit. That spirit is within MAN. Knowing oneself is the salvation you speak of, however, Chrisitanity leads astray! Knowing oneself is the process of recovery from separation.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 29801624


Christianity is the Antichrist. Christ came to destroy religion. After he left, they created a church that went against Christ....hence the church is the antichrist. In Hebrew numerology Christianity and Antichrist are EQUIVALENTS. Jesus fits the m.o. of the Antichrist as well. He performed miracles, most of the world follows him, he received a fatal wound to the head(Christ was crucified at a place called Golgotha, which means 'place of the skull'.) "Come away from her(the church); lest ye be judged as her."
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 29801624


Stop saying such stupid stuff... seriously! although the antichrist is the Papacy and came out of Christianity, we were warned in scripture and bible prophecy that would be the case. The wound being healed and ALL the world wondering after the beast happened in 1929 when the Papacy once again began to rule in Rome. In 1798 it received it's deadly wound when the Pope was taken and later died in captivity and was dead until 1929 when it was healed through Mussolini. Anyone who knows history and the bible knows all about this stuff and especially knows the Papacy is the antichrist power of the bible.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1580547


You seem to know your prophecy. Question? What do you know or believe about the St. Malachy prophecy about the 112th. Black pope and what do you believe is happening right now with now former pope Ratzinger's resignation? Sorry for the thread drift OP, but I don't have the ability to send private messages.
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ParadigmShift
Christianity = The Great Lie

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03/02/2013 02:15 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
The bible has it all over, the book of romans probably being the most hardline in the new testament, equating homosexuality with bestiality.

Completely agree OP, but expect alot of hate for preaching the truth.
 Quoting: Tatsuya


Unfortunately, many people associate homosexuality(same sex) with nothing, but a sexual act. A partnership is much more than just sex. Allow these people to live their lives with dignity and respect, because after watching a documentary on same sex couples, I realized that many have a very spiritual life-long love for each other.

Get your minds out of the gutter.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32938997


It's sinful nothing more nothing less, it's not about love, or the relationship, it's about the LAW
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THE LAW OR YOU WOULDN'T BE ON THIS FORUM JUDGING LIKE THE LEADERS OF THE BIBLE. YOU KNOW NOTHING AND YOU KNOW NOTHING CONCERNING UNIVERSAL LAW. JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32938997


Again go pick up a dictionary and learn what the word judge means, I am letting people know the real truth, and the truth hurts, but sharing the truth is not judging.
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith Yahweh, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their Elohim, and they shall be my people.
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:23 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
...


Being gay is a sin as outlined by Enoch, and many other scriptures.

vitium sodomiticum. Being gay is an abomination.
 Quoting: ParadigmShift


YOU'RE AN ABOMINATION. YOU HAVE HATE IN YOUR HEART. YOU LET SATAN IN AND HE HAS TAKEN OVER YOUR MIND AND FILLED YOU WITH FEAR AND HATE FOR THAT WHICH YOU ARE TOO IGNORANT TO UNDERSTAND.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13636777


Excuse me, but how is pointing out what the Bible says concerning sin hateful?
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


I'm not sure some of them will ever admit it, Ladywolf. Sometimes pride will not allow us to admit when we're wrong, and when that happens, it's like talking to a brick wall. You can present them with an inordinate amount of evidence in both Testaments, logically and analytically explain your point, and they will still just say your a hater. What they fail to understand is the real hate is indifference and apathy. Admonition as you pointed out is the tough love that they all lack.
 Quoting: Rising Son


I suppose it is up to us then to know when our pearls of Biblical wisdom and teaching have been cast before swine? I just have a tough time knowing when that is...but I suppose I will get better with time. After all...I too am a work in progress. :)
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krosty

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03/02/2013 02:25 AM
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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
How did Mary get pregnant? What if it was a women angel?
ParadigmShift
Christianity = The Great Lie

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03/02/2013 02:26 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
...


YOU'RE AN ABOMINATION. YOU HAVE HATE IN YOUR HEART. YOU LET SATAN IN AND HE HAS TAKEN OVER YOUR MIND AND FILLED YOU WITH FEAR AND HATE FOR THAT WHICH YOU ARE TOO IGNORANT TO UNDERSTAND.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13636777


Excuse me, but how is pointing out what the Bible says concerning sin hateful?
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


I'm not sure some of them will ever admit it, Ladywolf. Sometimes pride will not allow us to admit when we're wrong, and when that happens, it's like talking to a brick wall. You can present them with an inordinate amount of evidence in both Testaments, logically and analytically explain your point, and they will still just say your a hater. What they fail to understand is the real hate is indifference and apathy. Admonition as you pointed out is the tough love that they all lack.
 Quoting: Rising Son


I suppose it is up to us then to know when our pearls of Biblical wisdom and teaching have been cast before swine? I just have a tough time knowing when that is...but I suppose I will get better with time. After all...I too am a work in progress. :)
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


I sent you message about St Malachi and Noahide Laws and gave good karma for defending the word.
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith Yahweh, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their Elohim, and they shall be my people.
Anonymous Coward
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03/02/2013 02:35 AM
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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
Homosexuality acceptance has brought society down and now the Church to it's knees in depravity....
 Quoting: christian


Nah, sheeple and their fairy tale religions has brought society down.
In the modern age we have zero common sense!

sheeplebah
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27241994


Alistar Crowley is happy you are an atheist. He has succeeded. You are the sheep now.
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:41 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
I hear often from gay rights activists that Jesus Christ never spoke out about homosexuality or that He never mentioned sexual orientation. This is to set the record straight, so that those with an agenda can stop claiming things they know nothing about.

This first passage is Jesus Christ speaking out against homosexuality. Notice that He differentiates between adultery and sexual immorality - this is important to note because the term 'homosexuality' was not common during His time obviously, so He used the term sexual immorality - separate from adultery - to encompass homosexuality and any other sexual wickedness that is immoral:

Mark 7:21-22

"For from within, out of men's hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly."

This next passage is Jesus' affirmation of the traditional definition of marriage between one man and one woman. He even goes as far as referencing the story of Creation in which God created male and female. Notice how He specifies a man and wife, not a man and his partner or a woman and her partner:

Matthew 19:4-5

"Haven't you read," He replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,' and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'?"

So, do not let anyone tell you that Jesus Christ never spoke out against homosexuality, and that He didn't support traditional marriage. Furthermore, it is not possible for you to be a gay Christian. That is the same thing as claiming to be a Christian thief - if you are unrepentant for your sin and you continue that sin in ignorance of Jesus' teachings, you are a walking contradiction.

With all of this being said, it is wrong to cast judgment on others if we ourselves are in need of judgment. However, it is also wrong to support and sponsor immorality while at the same time denigrating the traditional definition of marriage, as Jesus taught us. We all should love homosexuals as we love each other, and in that love, we should yearn to help them overcome their illness of the mind.
 Quoting: Rising Son


He without sin cast the first stone.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1708283


Jesus did not mean for this to become a free license to go ON sinning. I will quote the rest of that story that you failed to finish. After her accusers left, he asked the woman, "where are your accusers." And she answered, "There is no one my Lord." And he said to her, "Neither do I accuse you. NOW GO AND SIN NO MORE!!"

By this one sentence, Jesus, forgave her of her current sin, conveyed to her that it WAS a sin and admonished her to STOP sinning!
Real truth is self evident...
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:43 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
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I appreciate your respectful post and your kind words. I do not have a problem with homosexuals. What I DO have a problem with is that society has chosen to see this life style, birth defect, whatever you want to call it as something needing protection for calling it out for what it is. Abnormal. This is not personal. This is not about my being a bigot or being a "hater" or whatever the latest term is for anyone who disagrees with something. Let me ask you a question. Do you think your friend would accept a cure, if one were to be found and opt to have a normal life as a heterosexual? Do you think he enjoys being different? It's a serious question. I'd appreciate a serious response. From your previous response I feel that you'll be honest with me and willing to answer it.

From a Biblical view, men and women were created different for a reason. The marriage bed was created for a reason. The home was created with rules and guidelines to follow for a reason. Children were given a mother and father as role models for a reason. What makes man think that he can throw away the creator's blueprint for a well balanced life and basically go completely against God's plan? What arrogance! What complete and utter arrogance!
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


Just for the record, I don't think that most people who oppose homosexuality actually "hate" gays or are "bigoted," and I don't think that way about you. A small minority of people actually "hate" gays, and the people who support gay rights often tend to focus on this minority to make their case for why the other side should be rejected.

But to answer your question - if I had to guess, I would think this person ( I don't talk to him much, but I guess we could be considered "friends") probably wished he could have been straight for a very long period of his life, but now probably has accepted it. But, of course, it's hard to tell. He's not exactly Mr. Gay Pride parade or anything like that, so despite his occasional effeminate tendencies, I certainly wouldn't describe him as being flamboyantly gay. It's possible you could characterize that as an example of him still being inwardly ashamed of himself, even to this day. But then again, it's also possible he just doesn't define himself by his sexuality, and isn't very political about his sexual orientation.

It's an interesting question you pose all the same. However, I think for many gay people, a "cure" could never retroactively resolve the hardship they experienced earlier in life, and thus, would probably be thought of as ineffective and pointless. Now, for those young men smack dab in the middle of being bullied in school for being effeminate and weird... I'm sure many would jump at the chance to swallow a pill or inject a shot that makes them attracted to women.

As for the part about men and women in the Bible, sure - men and women alone are able to procreate, and not same sex couples... but not everyone needs to procreate, straight or gay. It may seem arrogant now to make such a seemingly drastic change to marriage, but there have been many changes to marriage over the last two millennia which have radically reshaped marriage. Hell, even two hundred years ago women were considered property of their husbands! I would say that providing women the same rights as men in marriage has more radically altered the concept of marriage than allowing, as some states currently do, same sex couples the ability to marry.

But although we might not have changed each other's minds, I'm glad we could at least exchange a dialogue about it instead of crass insults and accusations. I admit when I'm not talking to individual people I get carried away a little myself. Don't we all? Haha. But go easy on your gay brothers and sisters! They are people too, with all their good and bad qualities, just trying to get by like the rest of us.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 34900904


I too am enjoying a rational and civil discussion with you. It is discussions such as ours that make way for learning, changing and growing. And just to clarify that, I mean it for both of us. I certainly do not hold all the answers and my walk is not necessarily your walk. I do understand and respect that. You are absolutely right. I do not hate nor judge nor single out homosexual people. It is NOT my place. But when I walk into a room, or in this case a message board like this one and the topic is on the table, and opened up for discussion, I don't mind chiming in with my views and values on the topic.

That said. My point about a homosexual opting for a cure if it were to be found, is that I can't imagine anyone actually CHOOSING this life style / birth defect for themselves and all of the confusion, pain and controversy that must come with it. While I would agree there would be much water under the proverbial bridge for some, like you, I believe that many who feel trapped by it would jump at the chance to be normal. That might infuriate some reading this post, but it is just how I feel. Homosexuality is NOT spiritually normal. And it was not what God intended when he made man and woman.

Did you know that Adam named Eve "woman" because she was taken out of "man" when a baby is born, it comes from the womb. When Eve was created she was taken "out of" Adam, a man. Think..."womb-man" It's a very good picture of how God created us to be different as well as to completely balance each other in our unique differences.

Regardless of how you feel about homosexuality, God sees it as sin. But we have ALL sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. None of us can boast that we have not sinned. But that does not mean that we should "tolerate" sin in each other. Rather, as Christians we are admonished to call each other out in sin and to "come along side each other" and "help each other" to see the error of our ways so that we will be encouraged to not keep on sinning. That is all a TRUE Christian is doing when he or she tells you that homosexuality is a sin and goes against God's laws for man kind.

Moving on to what you said about marriage and procreation. Yes, it is true that marriage was created in order that children would be born into a Godly union. I'm speaking of Godly marriages where God is the head of that marriage and the marriage is a healthy one. That does not mean that those who choose not to marry are "off the hook" or so to speak with their own righteousness and following God's laws. The body IS the temple and is not to be defiled. You still must stand before God on judgement day and answer for ALL things you have done while IN the body! This is a very grave truth, but it IS the truth! I can't state that emphatically enough!

It comes down to this. Just because you do not believe in nor care about God's laws and His plan of salvation, does NOT mean you will not be standing before Him one day and explaining yourself and your actions to Him. He tells us in the Bible that He gives us the wonders of nature in all of it's fine tuned glory so that we are "without excuse" in knowing our creator.

Here's a question to ponder. Lets say you don't believe in God. Lets say that maybe you do but you're on the fence and still justifying your sins. Let me ask you a question. If you were with your partner in a sexual way, and Jesus chose that exact moment to make His appearance again. How would you feel? It's an important question to ask yourself, because how you answer that will speak volumes about what you truly feel about what you're doing. It is sort of "when the rubber meets the road" type of question. Now know this. He does see your sin, while it's happening, and He knows your thoughts. Are you ok with this? It's a rhetorical question, but it is one that should cause you to really stop and think about your choices in life.
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


Look, you preaching to some of us is the equivalent of a Muslim trying to convince you of their faith. I know your faith is bullshit.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 29801624


Noted and thanks for reading. Now be kind enough and articulate enough to explain why you believe it to be...in your words, "bullshit."
Real truth is self evident...
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:45 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
The bible was written by man and you do not know the Christ as i have.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32938997


Whatever you have to tell yourself to make it feel less guilty when you sin. The Law is the Law, no matter how you interpret it.
 Quoting: Rising Son


I have nothing to feel guilty about and I am heterosexual. Believe me, you have a lot to learn, because you have never touched upon a spiritual level.

Sorry, but you are at the bottom of the spiritual ladder.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32938997


You are who you associate with or who you befriend. If I excused the conduct of a murderer or a thief and justified why they hadn't sinned, I would be just as guilty as the sinner.

As far as spirituality, you make the mistake of assuming I somehow need your validation. My validation comes from within, and it was given to me by the Holy Spirit. There is no 'ranking' or 'ladder' in spirituality, you either get it, or you don't. Here's a hint - it usually starts with humility...
 Quoting: Rising Son


This!! ^^

headbang
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Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 02:49 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
Paradigmshift, Thank you for the pm's:) I would very much enjoy talking with you about prophecy, but I can not answer you as I'm not an elite member here. Please feel free to email me at: ldy_wolf@comcast.net as time permits. Thank you!!:)
Real truth is self evident...
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 03:34 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
Wow!! I don't know who but some very kind soul just upgraded my account. While I can't be certain, I have a feeling it was someone on this thread. You know who you are and I just wanted to say a BIG thank you for your kindness and the type of upgrade was extremely generous! I just don't know what to say! Accept wow and may God bless you!! hf
Real truth is self evident...
anom
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03/02/2013 05:46 AM
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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
With all of this being said, it is wrong to cast judgment on others if we ourselves are in need of judgment. However, it is also wrong to support and sponsor immorality while at the same time denigrating the traditional definition of marriage, as Jesus taught us. We all should love homosexuals as we love each other, and in that love, we should yearn to help them overcome their illness of the mind.
 Quoting: Rising Son


I think you are wrong, and i think you give the bible your own meaning, now if you read well, you will realize that what the bible condemns the most, as well as God and Christ, is VIOLENCE, not homosexuality

you cannot equate homosexuality to evil or mental impurity, they are separate, now whether a person is impure an engages in homosexuality would be a different case than a person who is pure and who engages in homosexuality, but the act itself must not be mixed with either good or evil

now, heterosexuality according to history can be far WORST than homosexuality if we are going to talk on those terms, in the past some angels came to our world, the sons of god, and they had sex with human females and guess what came out of that?, giants who controlled the earth in those days and enslaved us, so god had to flood the world and kill everyone to fix the mess they caused, so those angels would've done the right thing by being homosexual and avoiding heterosexual activity, to stop the earth from being flooded

now if you hate homosexuality that is your problem, in fact if you hate homosexuality you are far away from understanding Christ and tolerance, so i suggest you start by being tolerant and taken out the hate from your heart.
 Quoting: SuperPet225


This is not true. Jesus Christ Himself said, "I do not come to bring peace but to bring a sword and division, even to the point of one's own family." (paraphrased from memory) He even goes on to list different types of family relations, i.e. brother against brother, mother against daughter etc. He did NOT preach tolerance. This is a lie. He DID preach love and forgiveness but NEVER at the expense of truth!
 Quoting: Lady Wolf



this is a dangerous statement, it has been used to justify a lot of wars and suffeering even until the biggest holocausts.

jesus said, you will love your enemy, not destroy him.
and if you can not do anything else then defend yourself, do it in love.

even mother theresa divided people into a reaction, it doesnt mean she was evil. its an example, do not start about mother theresa now, its just an example, that even something that doesnt divide, can bring a divide.
Anonymous Coward
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03/02/2013 05:52 AM
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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
What is it that bothers people so much about homosexuality? Seriously. Penis into vagina vs. penis into butthole. Or penis into mouth. Or whatever. Who cares?

There are so many places to start. Jesus also says "judge not lest ye be judged." Jesus said "let he who is without sin cast the first stone."

You people forget the real tenets of the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Plus, here's the bottom line:

This is fucking AMERICA, bitches. If you don't like gay sex, then DON'T HAVE IT. But that HARDLY gives you the right to deny gay people the right to marry other gay people. If you don't like gay sex, go to fucking Saudi Arabia where they behead gay people and you'll fit right in. You people talk all this shit about the Muslims and the ironic part is, without a language barrier and an ocean separating the two cultures, you two would find you have A LOT in common with one another.

And just to drive the point home, the people who speak out against homosexuality the most are usually the ones who get caught in public restrooms having gay meth-fueled sex. Need I state the obvious?

Go fuck yourselves and your bigotry. Jesus would be crying if he heard how self-righteously judgmental you all are - and all in His name, no less.
Lady Wolf

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03/02/2013 06:14 AM

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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
With all of this being said, it is wrong to cast judgment on others if we ourselves are in need of judgment. However, it is also wrong to support and sponsor immorality while at the same time denigrating the traditional definition of marriage, as Jesus taught us. We all should love homosexuals as we love each other, and in that love, we should yearn to help them overcome their illness of the mind.
 Quoting: Rising Son


I think you are wrong, and i think you give the bible your own meaning, now if you read well, you will realize that what the bible condemns the most, as well as God and Christ, is VIOLENCE, not homosexuality

you cannot equate homosexuality to evil or mental impurity, they are separate, now whether a person is impure an engages in homosexuality would be a different case than a person who is pure and who engages in homosexuality, but the act itself must not be mixed with either good or evil

now, heterosexuality according to history can be far WORST than homosexuality if we are going to talk on those terms, in the past some angels came to our world, the sons of god, and they had sex with human females and guess what came out of that?, giants who controlled the earth in those days and enslaved us, so god had to flood the world and kill everyone to fix the mess they caused, so those angels would've done the right thing by being homosexual and avoiding heterosexual activity, to stop the earth from being flooded

now if you hate homosexuality that is your problem, in fact if you hate homosexuality you are far away from understanding Christ and tolerance, so i suggest you start by being tolerant and taken out the hate from your heart.
 Quoting: SuperPet225


This is not true. Jesus Christ Himself said, "I do not come to bring peace but to bring a sword and division, even to the point of one's own family." (paraphrased from memory) He even goes on to list different types of family relations, i.e. brother against brother, mother against daughter etc. He did NOT preach tolerance. This is a lie. He DID preach love and forgiveness but NEVER at the expense of truth!
 Quoting: Lady Wolf



this is a dangerous statement, it has been used to justify a lot of wars and suffeering even until the biggest holocausts.

jesus said, you will love your enemy, not destroy him.
and if you can not do anything else then defend yourself, do it in love.

even mother theresa divided people into a reaction, it doesnt mean she was evil. its an example, do not start about mother theresa now, its just an example, that even something that doesnt divide, can bring a divide.
 Quoting: anom 35421156


ok. Fair enough. Then what do you think Jesus meant by this statement?
Real truth is self evident...
onelastcloud

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03/02/2013 07:28 AM
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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
lady: this is anom, i logged in because i get banned to much as anonymous.

--

jesus meant that he brought us the message of the goal,
but that the way was one of pain...

this is why he brought the sword, even when he was love.

he knew the parables would be closed for many for many thousand of years to come...

make a difference, goal and way towards,

religion mostly starts from the goal and then sees sinners,
christ starts from the way and sees gains in everybody.
Anonymous Coward
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03/02/2013 07:36 AM
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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
And you're a wonderful friend to me as well.

Let's just focus on spreading His love with the world, and let the Holy Spirit do the growing, correcting and changing as need be in each person along the way. You're doing an awesome job, keep on going and remember the love above all else.

:jesus404:
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa


Thank you, Lisa - as usual, you are correct, and you have showed me the error of my ways. I am so defensive about people who distort the message that I don't see the power that the Holy Spirit has on us to make the determination for us. I keep trying to force or control something I have no business controlling, and I need to trust in Christ that He will guide those chosen to our Father's Kingdom. Thank you :-)


 Quoting: Rising Son


I'm sorry, I know this was addressed to Lisa, but I feel compelled to jump in here and give my two cents so please forgive me if I'm being rude.

OP, While only you and God knows what is in your heart and why you felt compelled to post this thread, as one who is reading this thread, I can't help but feel you were not wrong in posting this. "For how will they know unless we tell them?" "And the harvest is plentiful and requires many workers." These two scriptures immediately come to mind to explain what I am saying. All you have done with this thread is to inform people who come here about truth and what the Bible teaches and SAYS about the sin of homosexuality. You have had a loving and a matter of fact attitude about getting this oh so badly needed truth out and I for one applaud your willingness to do it! If your heart was pure in its intention to post this thread, and I feel that it was just based on your words and tone alone, than you have done nothing to be ashamed of or to feel bad about.

Lisa, you seem to be a very kind and loving Christian. While those are admirable traits for a Christian to have, only you know for certain your intentions of a loving rebuttal to OP's thread. However, I also feel it's important that love must not be confused or be at the behest of truth! You are absolutely right that God is the one to finish the work that He has started in us. That He and He alone is able to convict us or make us aware of the sin in our lives. But I must ask you this. How do you know for certain that God is not using the OP and this thread for that very thing? God uses people AS WELL AS other Christians all the time to insure His will is done. How do you know God is not using this very thread to reach out to those on GLP to convict them of their sin? You don't. So for you to tell the OP that God is the one to show us sin in our lives and not the OP, you are basically doing the same thing that you feel the OP is doing, because you don't know that God isn't using the OP for this work. Your response to him, while loving, was also a bit on the stifling side in terms of your attempt to stifle this message.

I hope my loving rebuke to you as a Christian sister is not seen as combative not unloving. But we all know that God works in mysterious ways! peace
 Quoting: Lady Wolf


Well, I could be wrong....but I'd be willing to bet that almost all homosexuals in this country are well aware that the christian church and the bible says that homosexuality is a sin. In fact, there is a thread about it just about every few weeks just here on GLP alone. I cringe when I see everyone one of them.

I don't cringe becasue it's not the truth, it is the truth. It is a sin, and you'll never hear me say otherwise. I cringe becasue they already know that and it only makes them feel more alienated by God and pushes them away farther, the majority of them. I know this to be a fact, not speculation...fact.

I know the intentions are good, I get that, and I understand it, and it's not my intentions to hurt my brothers and sisters here, but rather try to show them that maybe this isn't effective, that maybe there is a better way.

Listen, I'm a fat lady. I sure as heck know it. I don't need someone to walk up to me and tell me that I'm fat. I"m also a smoker, and I'm well aware that my cigarette smoke sinks and is unhealthy. I already know that too. If a group of people were to continue to point out my flaws, over and over again, even tho I already am aware of it, I would consider it ignorant and hostile and I would move as far away from those people as possible, as quickly as I could.

Now if someone were to tell me how much Jesus loves me, that He fashioned me with His own hands, and that He understands my pain and my inner most thoughts and feelings, and that He wants me to get to know Him on a personal level because He really cares about me, well maybe I'd listen to that.

Jesus will meet a person wherever they are in life. A person does not have to be perfect to come to Him and be saved. I put up a thread yesterday that demonstrates that and shows His love for all people and that He saves the most broken of all of us. It is after that the Holy Spirit will work on a person's heart to make changes as the Lord sees fit, each according to his own progress, circumstances and ability. This is the truth.

hf
Anonymous Coward
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03/02/2013 07:38 AM
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Re: Jesus Christ Preached Against Homosexuality, But He Also Said Not To Judge Others
I thought there were no gays around back then in Jesus' neighborhood, as it is today in Iran.

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