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When can the Police stop and frisk?

 
catsup
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03/30/2013 08:53 AM
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When can the Police stop and frisk?
As a Brit living in the States this question is about the law as it currently stands in the United States. I'd like to know what the most recent rulings are in these matters. If I could learn which actual court cases established the answers, that would be very helpful.

Under what circumstances can the police actually stop a person walking down the street?

Specifically, can they make a stop based on:

the fact that the person is in a high-crime area?

the fact that the person is walking in a dark area or trying to avoid being seen?

In any of the above circumstances, can the police insist on frisking the person?

If a person believes that he was stopped or frisked in a circumstance that's not allowed, what options does he have for redress?
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."

Hunter S. Thompson
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:08 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
They can't, without a warrant or your permission.
Sippy Longjohnson
User ID: 2683444
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03/30/2013 10:21 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
If the cop has a gun,and you don't....
it's kind of a no brainer isn't it?
catsup (OP)

User ID: 16726273
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03/30/2013 10:33 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
They can't, without a warrant or your permission.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 36687648


The cops stopped and frisked me last summer and I never gave them permission nor did they ask. But I didn't know the laws at the time actually I still don't understand them. Anyway I was walking back from the liquor store at night with a bottle of scotch and they parked and motioned me over. They asked for my name and asked me if I had anything illegal on me and I answered no, one of the officers patted me down and searched my pockets while the other was running my ID.
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."

Hunter S. Thompson
TwitcH

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03/30/2013 10:38 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Tell them you have done nothing wrong and you do not consent to a search.
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:40 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
They can whenever they want. How you deal with the fact that the don't have the right to without a warrant or your permission is entirely up to you.
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:43 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
The USA has about 88,000 jurisdictions, federal, state, and local. They each make up their own rules, regulations, ordinances and laws, and they each enforce them differently.

Many of the laws are unconstitutional and would be overturned by an honest court. Unfortunately, most judges were former prosecutors and have a vested interest in the system.

The Constitution and its Bill of Rights are technically the supreme law of the land, yet without infinite time and money, justice is rarely served. There's no right to search without probable cause, unless you give permission. If a cop asks you to turn out your pockets and you comply, they consider this permission. If you refuse, then you're escalating the situation. Talk to an attorney or civil liberties groups for better info. Sorry, the USA is not the country that it used to be.
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:44 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
In reality ... ANYTIME THEY WANT!

Forget "legalities". Police in the US have always done what they want to do first ... and if no one is serious hurt then no one calls them to task for it.

When I was growing up it was normal for police to "talk" to some of the neighborhood punks back in the alley sometimes. I guess the poor police would get a little tounge tied when they did that since it seemed that their big heavy flashlight did most of the talking.

Nobody cared much about the fact that the punks had somehow fallen down and injured themselves ... just after the talking ... and when a punk would complain about their broken arm or whatever it would seem that they would shortly thereafter be caught stealing or with a weapon and would be sent down the road to prison.

I ALWAYS respect the police ... and if they want to frisk me, well who am I to say no? They have the gun. They have the nightstick. They have the mace. They have the taser. They have the unregistered handgun hidden somewhere in the car that may just fall on the ground next to me. OH ... and they have THE BADGE, which means anything they say carriex about 10x the weight of what I would say, and if there are two of them it is about 100x the weight.

The reality of street life is that there is the "formal" legal system ... and the "informal" legal system. If one stops the "informal" legal system from doing most of the work shortly thereafter the "formal" legal system is overwhelmed and the streets are a very dangerous place for everyday middle class types.
Judethz
Israel is Eternal

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United Kingdom
03/30/2013 10:47 AM

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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Specifically, can they make a stop based on:

the fact that the person is in a high-crime area?

the fact that the person is walking in a dark area or trying to avoid being seen?

In any of the above circumstances, can the police insist on frisking the person?

 Quoting: catsup


9teen Having lived in the US as a dual citizen for over 30 years I'd say that...I sure hope so.

Actually your biggest worry is getting stopped when driving. Screw up and you could lose the fancy auto that cost you an arm and a leg. No opened alcoholic containers or dope in the passenger compartment in any circumstances. Be sure whoever is driving has no alcohol on their breath.

There are plenty of good You Tube videos on how to handle traffic stops, watch a few of them.
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:50 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
That's like asking, "When can a gang member rob and beat you?"

LE is, after all, the US' largest illegal gang...they break the law all day long in the name of "revenue generation" and will kill you if you resist.
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:53 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
they are not supposed to


but they fuckin do it anyway


for the most part they are above the law
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:53 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
They can't, without a warrant or your permission.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 36687648


Or probable cause and they had better be exact with it.

However without video they will plant evidence, beat you down, and charge you with assault.

Cops are never to be trusted. NEVER!
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:55 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Specifically, can they make a stop based on:

the fact that the person is in a high-crime area?

the fact that the person is walking in a dark area or trying to avoid being seen?

In any of the above circumstances, can the police insist on frisking the person?

 Quoting: catsup


:9teen: Having lived in the US as a dual citizen for over 30 years I'd say that...I sure hope so.

Actually your biggest worry is getting stopped when driving. Screw up and you could lose the fancy auto that cost you an arm and a leg. No opened alcoholic containers or dope in the passenger compartment in any circumstances. Be sure whoever is driving has no alcohol on their breath.

There are plenty of good You Tube videos on how to handle traffic stops, watch a few of them.
 Quoting: Judethz


What's with the cartoon chicks crossing their legs like they are holding back a piss?

It is LAME!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 33560264
United States
03/30/2013 10:58 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
As a Brit living in the States this question is about the law as it currently stands in the United States. I'd like to know what the most recent rulings are in these matters. If I could learn which actual court cases established the answers, that would be very helpful.

Under what circumstances can the police actually stop a person walking down the street?

Specifically, can they make a stop based on:

the fact that the person is in a high-crime area?

the fact that the person is walking in a dark area or trying to avoid being seen?

In any of the above circumstances, can the police insist on frisking the person?

If a person believes that he was stopped or frisked in a circumstance that's not allowed, what options does he have for redress?
 Quoting: catsup


Unfortunatly, under the Patriot Act, they can do as they damn well please.


Many claim you can ask "Am I being charged, Am I free to go" is all you need to ask/repeat. And worse case "I need a lawyer"..
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 10:59 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Specifically, can they make a stop based on:

the fact that the person is in a high-crime area?

the fact that the person is walking in a dark area or trying to avoid being seen?

In any of the above circumstances, can the police insist on frisking the person?

 Quoting: catsup


:9teen: Having lived in the US as a dual citizen for over 30 years I'd say that...I sure hope so.

Actually your biggest worry is getting stopped when driving. Screw up and you could lose the fancy auto that cost you an arm and a leg. No opened alcoholic containers or dope in the passenger compartment in any circumstances. Be sure whoever is driving has no alcohol on their breath.

There are plenty of good You Tube videos on how to handle traffic stops, watch a few of them.
 Quoting: Judethz


Good god stop with the lame anime picks to persuade thought.
catsup (OP)

User ID: 16726273
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03/30/2013 11:26 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Unfortunatly, under the Patriot Act, they can do as they damn well please.


Many claim you can ask "Am I being charged, Am I free to go" is all you need to ask/repeat. And worse case "I need a lawyer"..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 33560264


I will remember this! ^
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."

Hunter S. Thompson
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 37137206
United Kingdom
03/30/2013 11:28 AM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Any time they want.

You must remember that all cops carry throw-down guns, and baggies of drugs.

damned
catsup (OP)

User ID: 37146460
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03/30/2013 01:58 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Any time they want.

You must remember that all cops carry throw-down guns, and baggies of drugs.

damned
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 37137206


We need to start filming them with our cell phones or whatever when they stop us.
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."

Hunter S. Thompson
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 37137206
United Kingdom
03/30/2013 02:02 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Specifically, can they make a stop based on:

the fact that the person is in a high-crime area?

the fact that the person is walking in a dark area or trying to avoid being seen?

In any of the above circumstances, can the police insist on frisking the person?

 Quoting: catsup


:9teen: Having lived in the US as a dual citizen for over 30 years I'd say that...I sure hope so.

Actually your biggest worry is getting stopped when driving. Screw up and you could lose the fancy auto that cost you an arm and a leg. No opened alcoholic containers or dope in the passenger compartment in any circumstances. Be sure whoever is driving has no alcohol on their breath.

There are plenty of good You Tube videos on how to handle traffic stops, watch a few of them.
 Quoting: Judethz


Good god stop with the lame anime picks to persuade thought.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 33560264


"Jew Deathz" is a fat, greasy Jew, in his momma's basement in the gay capital of the world, Tel Aviv.

He has a perverted Japanese teen fetish.
Anonymous Coward
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United Kingdom
03/30/2013 02:03 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Any time they want.

You must remember that all cops carry throw-down guns, and baggies of drugs.

damned
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 37137206


We need to start filming them with our cell phones or whatever when they stop us.
 Quoting: catsup


Try that and they'll kill you.
catsup (OP)

User ID: 37146460
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03/30/2013 02:11 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
We need to start filming them with our cell phones or whatever when they stop us.
 Quoting: catsup


Try that and they'll kill you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 37137206


I doubt they would be that stupid... then again cops
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."

Hunter S. Thompson
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 02:41 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
According to Constitutional Law and court precedence, a Police Officer can stop and frisk (pat down) a person if he has "reasonable suspicion" to believe that the person has committed; is committing; or is about to commit a crime short of probable cause. This is called a "Terry Stop" based upon Terry vs Ohio.

A "frisk" is a pat down and was intended for the discovery of weapons for Officer safety reasons. This means that an Officer can not be digging into your pockets without your consent. However, if probable cause does exists, then this ruling does not apply. Under the rules of "Warrantless Searches" an Officer may search a person incidental to a lawful arrest. This falls in line with "Inevitable Discovery"
catsup (OP)

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03/30/2013 02:48 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
According to Constitutional Law and court precedence, a Police Officer can stop and frisk (pat down) a person if he has "reasonable suspicion" to believe that the person has committed; is committing; or is about to commit a crime short of probable cause. This is called a "Terry Stop" based upon Terry vs Ohio.

A "frisk" is a pat down and was intended for the discovery of weapons for Officer safety reasons. This means that an Officer can not be digging into your pockets without your consent. However, if probable cause does exists, then this ruling does not apply. Under the rules of "Warrantless Searches" an Officer may search a person incidental to a lawful arrest. This falls in line with "Inevitable Discovery"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14106953


This is interesting but how does an Officer of the law determine a person is about to commit a crime... When you actually take time to look around anything can look suspicious!
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."

Hunter S. Thompson
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2013 02:49 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
Except NYC, for another week or so, the officer must have a reason that can be articulated. They need not have "proof" of a crime but a reasonable suspicion of some criminal action(s). You might look like someone they are looking for or doing something that the officer can point to as being "suspicious" or unusual. Walking out of a known "crack house" might be enough, walking out of Starbucks? Nope. In any event don't waste your time arguing with the cop, if they want to arrest you they will, fighting cops is a "Born to Lose" action. If they are wrong beat them in court.
Judethz
Israel is Eternal

User ID: 20521597
United Kingdom
03/30/2013 09:13 PM

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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
"Jew Deathz" is a fat, greasy Jew,.............................

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 37137206


blinker Think of me when bad things happen to you, until such time as you repent.

Gen 12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30867238
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03/30/2013 09:41 PM
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Re: When can the Police stop and frisk?
According to Constitutional Law and court precedence, a Police Officer can stop and frisk (pat down) a person if he has "reasonable suspicion" to believe that the person has committed; is committing; or is about to commit a crime short of probable cause. This is called a "Terry Stop" based upon Terry vs Ohio.

A "frisk" is a pat down and was intended for the discovery of weapons for Officer safety reasons. This means that an Officer can not be digging into your pockets without your consent. However, if probable cause does exists, then this ruling does not apply. Under the rules of "Warrantless Searches" an Officer may search a person incidental to a lawful arrest. This falls in line with "Inevitable Discovery"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14106953


This is interesting but how does an Officer of the law determine a person is about to commit a crime... When you actually take time to look around anything can look suspicious!
 Quoting: catsup


Lol..he doesn't, it's usually just an excuse to harass you. Some people are just juvenile. A very effective way to combat that type of harassment would be for you to start disguising yourself. Change your clothes (and styles) often, and also vary times and routes of travel, and hang around areas with security cameras. He is basically abusing the terry vs ohio case.

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