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Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?

 
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 03:26 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
I would like to know...when did simply disagreeing with someone became "hate"?
 Quoting: Melrox


It never did.

There are plenty of people who disagree with homosexuality but who don't abuse their rights. In other words, real Christians would not engage in hateful behaviour and/or criminal acts against anybody.

We all know that there are also plenty of "Christians" who do exactly that. Even to simply hate people without physically hurting them is a bad thing, IMO.
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 03:28 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
My country has been in the news for wanting to kill homosexuals. The facts are:

1) A single Member of Parliament drafted a Private Member's Bill that called for all manner of things against homosexuals. It isn't a government position.

2) Most Ugandans could care less about this Bill or about who is homosexual since it doesn't affect their daily lives.

3) A certain group of homosexual organizations have taken it upon themselves to "educate" children here about the what, how and why of homosexuality. In response, certain Christian groups and parents have launched a counter campaign.

I'm hetero. I have a couple of homosexual friends. I don't really like to think about what they do and I'm not comfortable with tv series where men kiss men. Being a woman, I'm repelled by the idea that a woman will hit on me. So personally, I wouldn't tell my kids that homosexuality is an option.

Does that mean we should discriminate against them? Should we be bullying them? Are they morally bankrupt compared to heteros? I don't think so. Most rape, pedophelia and deviant non consensual sex is committed by heterosexuals. So if someone is gay or lesbian, it doesn't mean that they are automatically deviant. Judging by some people's hatred, you would think they have never met a gay man or lesbian. If you know any, you'd find that they are human beings like the rest of us. In fact, if you found your son is gay, you'd quickly discover that this is more complicated than simply labeling them deviant.

The only thing that points to homosexuality as being immoral is Religion. But it also states a number of things that are immoral but that we "allow" to happen. Adultery, fornication, lust, envy....you name it. Where do we get off "hating" homosexuals? How do we justify giving this "sin" more weight than the others? If the wages of sin...is death, then we are all doomed, homosexual or not. We are all sinners. How are we different from homosexuals?
 Quoting: Nefertiti


Big philosophical question.

I guess it is because women need to be loved, so they put pressure on their sons to be men, and despise gays, even though they will grow up full of homosexual attraction feelings.

But trying to conform to moms, therefore the manifested "straight" society, guys marry, and then start to molest their children because he really does not respect a woman who thinks like that (because she cant SEE reality), and from there everything goes down the river...
 Quoting: TruthMinion


What? I'm lost.
Anonymous Coward
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05/07/2013 03:33 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
I don't hate them at all. Co-suffering love wants to help them to cure themselves from unnatural same-sex attraction. Their lust for the same sex is no better or worse than that of a heterosexual's.
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 03:36 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Do you really believe GOD condoned - Infanticide, rape, murder, animal and human sacrifice, ethnic cleansing, war crimes, torture, stoning, slavery and other atrocities?:
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661

I'll address this, again, for the cheap seats...the rest of your garbage is just that

You don't define "atrocities" because you're not God, you're dust (Gen. 3:19)

Before Jesus Christ came, animal sacrifices were required by a Holy God to atone for sin

Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? (Rom. 9:20)

God who created all defines "atrocities," and can do as God sees fit with God's creation

Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? (Matt. 20:15)

Old Testament violence was the wrath of a Holy God against evil, whether perpetrated by Jews or heathen

Most of the items on your list are against the laws of God, except when God commands otherwise

God ordering the genocide of demon possessed witches who were molesting, sacrificing and eating children is God's call

God who created all knows how best to deal with a situation, not man

There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. (Prov. 14:12)

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. (Isa. 55:9)


And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. (Mark 12:30)

Once Jesus Christ gave himself as the atoning sacrifice for man's sins, a new covenant was established and man now has peace with God through Christ

For example, man now has the name of Jesus Christ by which to cast out demons, and the eradication of witches by stoning is no longer necessary

Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ (Rom. 5:1)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


You're kind of scary with all those Bible quotes that you are using to "threaten" a perceived dissenter. I've seen this before. Someone asks a question and the answer is provided by quoting Scripture. Why not also explain exactly how certain verses answer that question?
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 04:13 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
I just thought I'd try some lateral thinking to show how foolish people are who believe these horrid things about GOD.

Even though it will be hard let's just say I am correct.

Let's say the Bible isn't GOD's word.

Where do we stand.

I have done nothing except defend GOD. I have said that unGODLY acts mentioned in the Bible are NOT condoned by GOD.

What have you believers done in that same scenario.

You have claimed GOD "does condone" Infanticide, rape, murder, animal and human sacrifice, ethnic cleansing, war crimes, torture, stoning, slavery and other atrocities.

Who will be right with GOD?

It will be me.

Now let's say I am wrong and GOD did condone these unGODly acts.

What can I be accused of... Thinking GOD was better than GOD actually is... Oh how outrageous of me. I defended his love and omniscience against all comers.

What of you... You believed that GOD was a mass murdering scumbag. CONGRATULATIONS you will be correct.

BUT how will GOD judge me... A person who didn't trust all the evil things said about GOD that in the end were proven to be true. How can GOD judge me harshly for saying nice things about him? For defending him?

BUT most importantly - Why would I want to follow a GOD who is so evil? I wouldn't!

So you believe GOD said

1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.

Infanticide at it's most ruthlessness.

And you will be happy in killing the children.

Psalms 137:9 Happy (shall he be), that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

BUT let's examine the Passover. Do you celebrate the Passover in your Church?

Would it be wrong to celebrate the holocaust? Of course it would! It would be disgraceful!

BUT you see nothing wrong with celebrating the Passover?

In the passover the murder didn't stop with children. It was ALL the firstborn, both man and beast or was it?

Exodus 12:12 For I will pass through the land of Egypt this night, and will smite all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the gods of Egypt I will execute judgment: I am the Lord.

BUT wait the LORD got it wrong. The LORD didn't do what he said! Did he change his mind? Why were only the cattle punished amongst the animals? The LORD only killed the firstborn Egyptians and Cattle? Not all beasts? Did GOD repent and Moses forgot to tell us? What had the cattle done wrong?

And I bet you guys thought it was the "Angel of Death" and yet it wasn't. It was the LORD!

Exodus 12:29 And it came to pass, that at midnight the Lord smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh that sat on his throne unto the firstborn of the captive that was in the dungeon; and all the firstborn of cattle.

How could a loving GOD come up with such a terrible event?

Perhaps people should read the story in detail, noting how GOD allegedly kept hardening Pharaoah's heart, and how GOD allegedly killed all the innocents based on that heart hardening.

You really believe GOD did such things?

I know I am right and you are wrong... BUT GOD seems to have hardened your hearts and thickened your heads! 1rof1

Believing GOD would do such things, you truly are an insult to a loving, omniscient GOD!

SHAME ON YOU!

I can't wait for judgement day... I have only ever defended GOD! Are you about to come last?

tantrum

ohyeah
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661


I shudder when I hear the things attributed to God by some Christians. That He should continue to love us humans amazes me. He is the very meaning of the word patience. But it must hurt Him tremendously that we act the way we do, don't you think? People should try to figure out what God was doing when He commanded the deaths of whole nations since it seems out of character.

I'm reading or researching so many things at once that sometimes I take a break. On the question of why God may have insisted that Joshua obliterate enemy nations, the answer may lie with some form of gene contamination. Interesting. Now how come many Christians haven't heard of this? Still researching it.

Christians are duty bound to defend God. Unfortunately they do not realize that to do so means to study Scripture. To do so means to pray for understanding, knowledge and discernment while reading the Bible. Not to just make assumptions and paint Him out to be some crazy dictator.

Thanks, Amazed for searching. Keep it up!
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 09:55 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
...


Why do people always bring in these other crimes into the discussion. It has no bearing on the argument whatsoever.

The reason they are crimes, and rightly crimes, is simple. The other person or beast has no say over the act. They are criminal because it is a misuse of power. It is an abuse of power!

The fact that the homosexual adults are consenting negates that point totally.

So your real point is that you find it yucky... so do I... we are not homosexual.

But some homosexuals might find the heterosexual act yucky as well.

Should we be against it just because of Yuckiness?

The fact that you find the act disgusting really has nothing to do with it, especially as homosexuals could argue the same point! They might find what heterosexuals do disgusting. One I talked to expressed that to me.

I might even consider what you and your partner do disgusting. Should we shame you because of my thoughts about your yuckiness?

Come on people surely we can think deeper than this!

ohyeah
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661


Why won't you answer me? I refuted everything you said how come I don't get a response?

What guides your moral standard?

If not the dusty ol book of the bible then what?

I'm waiting anxiously
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27329410


I didn't watch the video... so that is why I may have failed to answer you properly.

You are correct that in some ways my knowledge of the Bible guides my moral compass.

I know Moses was a murderous evil man. I know that Paul oppressed women. I don't want to be like them so their horridness made me a better person.

I also learnt about Jesus, but why did they only teach me the lovely bits. I was indoctrinated like most people. I took the bribe... I love Easter Eggas and Christmas presents. Go figure I was a child.

It is a big question. I know hitting someone in the head with a brick is wrong, I didn't need to read it in the Bible. I know that owning a slave is wrong. GOD apparently doesn't but I do.

So it is probably a very good upbringing that guides it mostly. My parents taught me right from wrong. They were good people I am a good person, or try my best to be.

I hope that has cured your anxiety...

I eagerly await your trick question... 1rof1

lolsign
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661


You were A little all over the place in this response. Give me the passages please to which you are referring to, it sounds like you are reciting what someone told you once.

I'm not trying to trick you either, I. Want to get to the root of where your coming from. Because I don't understand.

Let me be more clear, do you think there is an objective morality? As in despite what you or I think there re moral truths like rape is wrong?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27329410


I am eager to see where your going with this. I believe in an objective morality if you mean morality that is true regardless of religious beliefs or others. Such stealing is bad, killing is bad, rape is bad, etc.

How would you relate this topic to objective morality? What are your thoughts?
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 10:13 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Christians dont hate homos! You cant believe everything you read on the internet.

There are many Christian homos out there. Do you think they hate themseleves???? NO!! of course not.

Dont believe the internet or mainstream media. They want to divide and conquer not unite humanity.


Peace and safety!
peace hiding
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1743891


"Peace-Peace then Comes Sudden Destruction"

to be a friend to the world is to be friends with Sin

God lovers the Sinner, But hates the Sin

Are sins Separate us from a God who can easily empower us to defeat all are Sin problems

Saying that one is a Christian Homosexual is a kin to saying that God doesn't have the power to fix your sexual perversions and twisted fetishes

or worst still saying that God gave you a female brain in a male body or male brain in a female body, that God Made you defective, That really seems like Blaming God For your own Problem

God did No such thing, people choose to openly rebel against themselves, their family's and the natural order of things (The Order which God Created in Eden)

God didn't make anyone Gay just the same as God didn't force anyone to become a Junkie or a Alcoholic, people choose to go through those doors themselves, via their own bad choices, the friends and their influences to them.

People should Google: "Gay bowel syndrome"

just encase people are stupid enough to think being a gay christian is all puppy-dogs, ferry-floss, rainbows and unicorns

Gotta wonder if the Sodomites at Sodom and Gomorrah also Highjacked God's Rainbow Sign for themselves, I bet they did
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39394559


Just wanted to point out that "defective" is relative. God did make some people defective. For example, kids born with autism, or a severe mental retardation. The reason I put defective in quotes is because I don't like to call such people that. One of my brothers has just such a condition and sometimes I wonder if it isn't a blessing in disguise. He's a genius at computers.
Anonymous Coward
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05/07/2013 10:22 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Do you really believe GOD condoned - Infanticide, rape, murder, animal and human sacrifice, ethnic cleansing, war crimes, torture, stoning, slavery and other atrocities?:
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661

I'll address this, again, for the cheap seats...the rest of your garbage is just that

You don't define "atrocities" because you're not God, you're dust (Gen. 3:19)

Before Jesus Christ came, animal sacrifices were required by a Holy God to atone for sin

Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? (Rom. 9:20)

God who created all defines "atrocities," and can do as God sees fit with God's creation

Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? (Matt. 20:15)

Old Testament violence was the wrath of a Holy God against evil, whether perpetrated by Jews or heathen

Most of the items on your list are against the laws of God, except when God commands otherwise

God ordering the genocide of demon possessed witches who were molesting, sacrificing and eating children is God's call

God who created all knows how best to deal with a situation, not man

There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. (Prov. 14:12)

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. (Isa. 55:9)


And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. (Mark 12:30)

Once Jesus Christ gave himself as the atoning sacrifice for man's sins, a new covenant was established and man now has peace with God through Christ

For example, man now has the name of Jesus Christ by which to cast out demons, and the eradication of witches by stoning is no longer necessary

Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ (Rom. 5:1)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


You're kind of scary with all those Bible quotes that you are using to "threaten" a perceived dissenter. I've seen this before. Someone asks a question and the answer is provided by quoting Scripture. Why not also explain exactly how certain verses answer that question?
 Quoting: Nefertiti

"those Bible quotes" are the living Word of God, the Lord Jesus Christ made flesh, your Creator who you'll be judged by (John 1:1, 14, 12:48)

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom (Prov. 9:10)

As a wicked denier of Jesus Christ, you are of your father the devil and there is no truth in you (1 John 2:22, John 8:44), as I supplemented all scripture given in italics (though none is needed, God's Word is pure (Prov. 30:5))
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 10:36 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
It pisses me off you scribe better English than 99% of Americans.
Maybe we should enroll our kids in Ugandan schools for a better education, Mate.
About male buggery, however, I'm well agnostic about that subject... except to reflect, I'm personally not into slurping shit off a cock. Lesbians, hot!
It's truthfully just the shitty cock that kills the whole thing for me.
I'm a bit of a germ-freak.
Nothing personal. No agenda.
 Quoting: T-Cain


Well, it depends on the school one goes to. I wouldn't advise just any odd one. LOL! Thanks for the compliment.

My soon-to-be ex-husband is homophobic. He would rather not know that a man is gay because according to him, he simply can't shake the mental picture. He, just like you, has no issues whatsoever with lesbians.

I think it is normal to react with disgust when you think about the acts in question. There is no doubt that a heterosexual will be disgusted by homosexual acts. It was surprising to me that my gay friends are disgusted by heterosexual acts too. In a way, I don't understand because instinctively hetero sex is what should be happening. I'm talking about me personally. And yet I get it because I have absolutely no control over my internal reaction to watching two men kissing. Honestly, I can't help how I feel. So I suppose they can't help how they feel either. Knowing that got me wondering about what we are asking of them.

I'm no different from them. It's just that I bat for the regular side. Everything about this couple is really good. They are honest, hard working, kind, fair and very entertaining. It was knowing them that got me questioning my former beliefs which were anti-gay to the extent of writing the person off as totally abnormal. But I also have one (only one) girlfriend who lacks any concept of fidelity. Frankly she pisses me off big time. That I simply don't get and yet Christians will say its bad but I don't see anyone bullying people like her.

Last Edited by Nefertiti on 05/07/2013 10:37 AM
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 10:58 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Do you really believe GOD condoned - Infanticide, rape, murder, animal and human sacrifice, ethnic cleansing, war crimes, torture, stoning, slavery and other atrocities?:
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661

I'll address this, again, for the cheap seats...the rest of your garbage is just that

You don't define "atrocities" because you're not God, you're dust (Gen. 3:19)

Before Jesus Christ came, animal sacrifices were required by a Holy God to atone for sin

Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? (Rom. 9:20)

God who created all defines "atrocities," and can do as God sees fit with God's creation

Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? (Matt. 20:15)

Old Testament violence was the wrath of a Holy God against evil, whether perpetrated by Jews or heathen

Most of the items on your list are against the laws of God, except when God commands otherwise

God ordering the genocide of demon possessed witches who were molesting, sacrificing and eating children is God's call

God who created all knows how best to deal with a situation, not man

There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. (Prov. 14:12)

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. (Isa. 55:9)


And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. (Mark 12:30)

Once Jesus Christ gave himself as the atoning sacrifice for man's sins, a new covenant was established and man now has peace with God through Christ

For example, man now has the name of Jesus Christ by which to cast out demons, and the eradication of witches by stoning is no longer necessary

Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ (Rom. 5:1)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


You're kind of scary with all those Bible quotes that you are using to "threaten" a perceived dissenter. I've seen this before. Someone asks a question and the answer is provided by quoting Scripture. Why not also explain exactly how certain verses answer that question?
 Quoting: Nefertiti

"those Bible quotes" are the living Word of God, the Lord Jesus Christ made flesh, your Creator who you'll be judged by (John 1:1, 14, 12:48)

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom (Prov. 9:10)

As a wicked denier of Jesus Christ, you are of your father the devil and there is no truth in you (1 John 2:22, John 8:44), as I supplemented all scripture given in italics (though none is needed, God's Word is pure (Prov. 30:5))
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


That's better. I can't imagine a Muslim responding to me in all quotes with no explanation. It would seem fundamentalist and we all know what those kinds of people do.

What if I told you that I have failed to find any scripture instructing people to create the Bible? God spoke to different people through his prophets and their words were written down. Jesus spent months teaching people the right thing to do and these became the Gospels. Paul wrote letters to specific people but didn't actually envisage those letters being compiled into a book. So to me, Jesus is the Living Word of God.

So let's start with 1 John 2:22:

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

I haven't denied that Jesus is the Christ. And so I'm not the Antichrist.

John 8:44

44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.


You do realize that Jesus was explaining to His audience who He was, right? They didn't understand that He was the Son of God and that the father He spoke of was God. Context is important. I simply don't see the context here. Help please.

Prov 9:10 is clear but again not applicable. I fear (respect, hold in awe) The Lord. I asked you before what exactly Jesus said about homosexuality. To ask is not a sign of stupidity or a sign of disrespect.

I could go on but I hope you get the point.
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 11:34 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Its not that we hate its more we are feeling bad because if they do not change they shall not inherit the kingdom of God. Hear this I want everyone possible to inherit the kingdom of God but it doesn't matter what I want its what each living soul wants. If they choose to be a homosexual they want not the kingdom of God. I hope and pray that my brothers and sisters who may be homosexual come back to the light of truth and learn the way of life from Jesus Christ. Thank you and I hope you understand and have a good day.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32230396


I do understand. That's why God sent his Son to earth. It was to save those who had gone astray. Thanks for responding.
Anonymous Coward
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05/07/2013 11:35 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
...

I'll address this, again, for the cheap seats...the rest of your garbage is just that

You don't define "atrocities" because you're not God, you're dust (Gen. 3:19)

Before Jesus Christ came, animal sacrifices were required by a Holy God to atone for sin

Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? (Rom. 9:20)

God who created all defines "atrocities," and can do as God sees fit with God's creation

Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? (Matt. 20:15)

Old Testament violence was the wrath of a Holy God against evil, whether perpetrated by Jews or heathen

Most of the items on your list are against the laws of God, except when God commands otherwise

God ordering the genocide of demon possessed witches who were molesting, sacrificing and eating children is God's call

God who created all knows how best to deal with a situation, not man

There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. (Prov. 14:12)

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. (Isa. 55:9)


And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. (Mark 12:30)

Once Jesus Christ gave himself as the atoning sacrifice for man's sins, a new covenant was established and man now has peace with God through Christ

For example, man now has the name of Jesus Christ by which to cast out demons, and the eradication of witches by stoning is no longer necessary

Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ (Rom. 5:1)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


You're kind of scary with all those Bible quotes that you are using to "threaten" a perceived dissenter. I've seen this before. Someone asks a question and the answer is provided by quoting Scripture. Why not also explain exactly how certain verses answer that question?
 Quoting: Nefertiti

"those Bible quotes" are the living Word of God, the Lord Jesus Christ made flesh, your Creator who you'll be judged by (John 1:1, 14, 12:48)

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom (Prov. 9:10)

As a wicked denier of Jesus Christ, you are of your father the devil and there is no truth in you (1 John 2:22, John 8:44), as I supplemented all scripture given in italics (though none is needed, God's Word is pure (Prov. 30:5))
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


That's better. I can't imagine a Muslim responding to me in all quotes with no explanation. It would seem fundamentalist and we all know what those kinds of people do.

What if I told you that I have failed to find any scripture instructing people to create the Bible? God spoke to different people through his prophets and their words were written down. Jesus spent months teaching people the right thing to do and these became the Gospels. Paul wrote letters to specific people but didn't actually envisage those letters being compiled into a book. So to me, Jesus is the Living Word of God.

So let's start with 1 John 2:22:

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

I haven't denied that Jesus is the Christ. And so I'm not the Antichrist.

John 8:44

44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.


You do realize that Jesus was explaining to His audience who He was, right? They didn't understand that He was the Son of God and that the father He spoke of was God. Context is important. I simply don't see the context here. Help please.

Prov 9:10 is clear but again not applicable. I fear (respect, hold in awe) The Lord. I asked you before what exactly Jesus said about homosexuality. To ask is not a sign of stupidity or a sign of disrespect.

I could go on but I hope you get the point.
 Quoting: Nefertiti

Jesus Christ is the living Word of the entire Bible (Gen. 1:1, John 1:1, 14)

To deny God's Word is to deny Jesus Christ (1 John 2:22)

All scripture is given by inspiration of God (2 Tim. 3:16)

For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. (2 Pet. 1:21)


If Jesus did not preserve God's perfect Word for Christ's creation, then there is no God.

Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar. (Prov. 30:5-6)

Therefore, when Jesus calls engaging in homosexuality a "vile" (Rom 1:26), "profane" (1 Tim. 1:10), "abomination" (Lev. 18:22, 20:13), that will preclude inheritance of the kingdom of God (1 Cor. 6:9), and bring the wrath of God upon society (Jude 1:7), Jesus means it.

It also means Jesus convicts you as a liar (Prov. 30:6).

all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. (Rev. 21:8)

God is not a man, that he should lie...hath he said, and shall he not do it? (Num. 23:19)
Anonymous Coward
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05/07/2013 11:45 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
As a religion, it's about as gay as you can get. I bet Jesus didn't even have any private parts!
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 11:48 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
This is for those who think sexuality is a choice. I was raised a Christian. Church, Sunday school every Sunday. I believed in my heart in God and that Jesus died on the cross to save us from our sins. I wasn't a "sissy". I did all the stuff any typical guy would do not because I felt I had to but because I enjoyed them...sports, camping, outdoors and all that, yet I didn't do some of the cruel things that even some of my buddies from church did. I'd always tried to do the right thing because I knew that's what Jesus wanted us to do. When I went into puberty I found I was attracted to guys. I knew it was wrong, so I prayed to God, to Jesus...please change me...I don't want to be this way. I prayed and prayed, wondering what it was I had done for God to allow this to happen to me. What did I do wrong? Everyone said what a nice guy I was, but they didn't know what was going on inside. All my buddies were dating, talking about their girlfriends, kissing them, talking about "how far" they could go...even some of my Christian buddies. I knew it was wrong to do some of the things the guys were talking about even if I was 'straight'. But even kissing a girl, I couldn't even do that, because it would have been a lie on my part. They kept asking why I didn't have a girlfriend. I was good looking and had a good built and it would have been no problem for me to "fake it", but I just couldn't do it. Some of the guys were really raunchy...I didn't want to even be associated with guys that did the things they did. So I became withdrawn. And I prayed. I prayed with all my heart for God to change me. It didn't happen and I couldn't figure out why. I even asked God, more than once, "God, you said seek, ye shall find...ask and it will be given unto you...knock and the door will be open unto you. I'm seeking, I'm asking and I'm knocking. Please help me". When that didn't work I asked God to show me where I went wrong, what I had done to be punished this way. Nada. I remembered the foot print in the sands thing, about Jesus carrying me when there were only one set of prints. I prayed on that. Nada. So I decided I'd just live my life...remember the Golden Rule just because that's a decent way to be. And that's where I am now.
So maybe one of you can tell me where I went wrong? What did I do to be 'punished' or whatever you want to call it? Please don't give excuses about my not really being a Christian to begin with. I prayed every night since I was old enough to talk...said the Lord's Prayer, and confessed and asked forgiveness for all my sins...every night without fail. Some of my buddies that were so wild in high school...married with kids and now grand and even great grand kids. I have none of that...and...WHY...??? It wasn't my choice to be gay, but I am. It makes me angry when people say it's a choice. What do you know, having been born heterosexual and then condemning me to hell because I'm not? "Hate the sin, not the sinner"...are you so perfect? Just how sinless are you to judge someone else? I think you don't get it. It's "do unto others as ye would have them do unto you", not "Speak my name and point out others sins because you're so special."
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39098660


Thanks for contributing to this debate. Your story is an example of decent human beings who are homosexuals. It seems to me that many people think that someone who is homosexual is very different from a normal person somehow. As if to say, if he is a homosexual, he probably does other bad things too.

Did you do something wrong? When would you have done this wrong thing? In a previous life? Christianity doesn't subscribe to reincarnation. So no, you didn't do something to deserve being ostracized by society because you are attracted to persons of the same sex by default. And that is the question. How do we explain people who are homosexuals from when they were kids? How come they have that inclination from the moment they can think sexual thoughts?

I sincerely believe that homosexuality isn't a choice. If someone says they chose to be homosexual, then they are probably bi-sexual IMO. People tell me that homosexuality has become the new "cool". I disagree. It is not a fad that will disappear with time. It is not fashionable...at least not in my world. The gay couple I know are pretty much like you. One of them is an atheist and grew up without religion but his partner came from a very strict Anglican home. He was and still is torn by the Church's stance on the matter. He, however, gave up on Church. Unfortunately as much as he wants to leave Christians alone, he feels under attack by them nonetheless. I guess it's because of the different campaigns going on. Massive pro-gay and anti-gay campaigns.

Last Edited by Nefertiti on 05/07/2013 11:49 AM
Nefertiti (OP)

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05/07/2013 01:39 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Thanks for the good karma people!! Just discovered what that is.

And those who gave me bad karma, well I'm glad I got you thinking.

hf
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05/07/2013 01:41 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
My country has been in the news for wanting to kill homosexuals. The facts are:

1) A single Member of Parliament drafted a Private Member's Bill that called for all manner of things against homosexuals. It isn't a government position.

2) Most Ugandans could care less about this Bill or about who is homosexual since it doesn't affect their daily lives.

3) A certain group of homosexual organizations have taken it upon themselves to "educate" children here about the what, how and why of homosexuality. In response, certain Christian groups and parents have launched a counter campaign.

I'm hetero. I have a couple of homosexual friends. I don't really like to think about what they do and I'm not comfortable with tv series where men kiss men. Being a woman, I'm repelled by the idea that a woman will hit on me. So personally, I wouldn't tell my kids that homosexuality is an option.

Does that mean we should discriminate against them? Should we be bullying them? Are they morally bankrupt compared to heteros? I don't think so. Most rape, pedophelia and deviant non consensual sex is committed by heterosexuals. So if someone is gay or lesbian, it doesn't mean that they are automatically deviant. Judging by some people's hatred, you would think they have never met a gay man or lesbian. If you know any, you'd find that they are human beings like the rest of us. In fact, if you found your son is gay, you'd quickly discover that this is more complicated than simply labeling them deviant.

The only thing that points to homosexuality as being immoral is Religion. But it also states a number of things that are immoral but that we "allow" to happen. Adultery, fornication, lust, envy....you name it. Where do we get off "hating" homosexuals? How do we justify giving this "sin" more weight than the others? If the wages of sin...is death, then we are all doomed, homosexual or not. We are all sinners. How are we different from homosexuals?
 Quoting: Nefertiti


AND THIS OP, IS WHY...

Thread: This Guys Parents must be Proud! If you can watch all of this then you might be Gay! Creep Video!

You can't blame them anymore. It's for the good of humanity.
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05/07/2013 02:27 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Thanks for the good karma people!! Just discovered what that is.

And those who gave me bad karma, well I'm glad I got you thinking.

hf
 Quoting: Nefertiti

you ought to be more concerned with your eternal salvation than with your glp karma points

he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. (1 john 5:12)

He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar (1 John 2:4)

all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death (Rev. 21:8)

Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. (Gal. 6:7)
Amazed Continually!
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05/07/2013 08:38 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Christians dont hate homos! You cant believe everything you read on the internet.

There are many Christian homos out there. Do you think they hate themseleves???? NO!! of course not.

Dont believe the internet or mainstream media. They want to divide and conquer not unite humanity.


Peace and safety!
peace hiding
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1743891


"Peace-Peace then Comes Sudden Destruction"

to be a friend to the world is to be friends with Sin

God lovers the Sinner, But hates the Sin

Are sins Separate us from a God who can easily empower us to defeat all are Sin problems

Saying that one is a Christian Homosexual is a kin to saying that God doesn't have the power to fix your sexual perversions and twisted fetishes

or worst still saying that God gave you a female brain in a male body or male brain in a female body, that God Made you defective, That really seems like Blaming God For your own Problem

God did No such thing, people choose to openly rebel against themselves, their family's and the natural order of things (The Order which God Created in Eden)

God didn't make anyone Gay just the same as God didn't force anyone to become a Junkie or a Alcoholic, people choose to go through those doors themselves, via their own bad choices, the friends and their influences to them.

People should Google: "Gay bowel syndrome"

just encase people are stupid enough to think being a gay christian is all puppy-dogs, ferry-floss, rainbows and unicorns

Gotta wonder if the Sodomites at Sodom and Gomorrah also Highjacked God's Rainbow Sign for themselves, I bet they did
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39394559


God loves the Sinner but hates the sin is another one of those stupid cliche's that people use, like God works in mysterious ways.

You need to go back to your Bible. GOD made everything... GOD makes some people gay. It is natural for them.

Could it be GOD makes gays as a test for his imbecilic followers, to see if they will oppress and discriminate against them? it's a great test because they continually fail the test.

Of course someone can be a homosexual Christian, there are imbecilic Christians, there are lying Christians, there are dishonest Christians, there are unknowing Christians, there are starving Christians, there are homeless Christians and GOD doesn't fix there plight... does he?

Has GOD fixed your lack of intellect?

You relating homosexuality to alcoholism and drug addiction proves my point.

Did GOD make you heterosexual or are you bi-sexual and choose to ignore your attraction to your own gender?

Here read an analysis of the story of LOT ... IT is absolute rubbish but you didn't have the intellect to notice.

I think we have categorically proved, that many Christians, will use any method, so that they can put themselves into a position of judging others, thereby going against Jesus' precise teachings, BUT, what does the Bible say about homosexuality really.

John 13:34 "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another"

Does homophobic bigotry destroy this verse?

So let's start with LOT.

Genesis 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where (are) the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

Firstly to know them is often misrepresented as to have sex with them. Whose got the smutty mind with that interpretation?

This story makes no sense whatsoever!

The alleged angels in the story couldn't protect themselves against these alleged ravaging hoards?... Some angels!

Even though this story is a load of rubbish let's continue.

LOT does something far worse. To allegedly protect the supposed angels he offers his virgin daughters instead.

Genesis 19:8 Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as (is) good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

What? To be raped by homosexuals?

Why didn't LOT just offer himself? Surely he was better bait than the daughters.

Why didn't LOT offer his wife?

I wonder what GOD would truly think of someone sacrificing up their daughters in such a terrible way?

Furthermore if the hoards were homosexual why would two virgin women distract them? It makes no sense.

Now to Moses' rubbish laws on this subject. Remember MOSES is the one who just told you that crazy LOT story.

Leviticus 18:22: "You shall not lie with a male as those who lie with a female; it is an abomination."

Leviticus 20:13: "If a man lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination and they shall surely be put to death."


These might be fine if it wasn't for the other crazy laws of MOSES. Like this one

Deuteronomy22:20-21 2 But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:

Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.


Stoning a woman who doesn't bleed on her wedding night, come on now, this is crazy. What if the husband and wife had made love before the wedding? She would have been stoned and he would have been set free!... AMAZING!

This means GOD knows nothing about the woman's body as a woman's hymen can break for many reasons, other than sex. Is GOD this dumb?

Are you accepting he designs a woman and doesn't understand the physiology? Really?

But also, if you choose to believe and oppress homosexuals because of these passages, why aren't you checking bride's bed sheets and punishing them still?

Sure, Jesus said not to stone people but you judgmental, punishing believers should be able to come up with some imaginative bullying system for the bride.

Ah selective Believers pick and choose who to discriminate against. Jesus didn't undo the checking of the sheets bit... did he?

What about the male? What if he wasn't a virgin? What punishment did he face... Oh that's right NONE!

That's right the writers of the Bible are oppressing women again.

Study Moses' ridiculous laws and you have to know they aren't from GOD.

Or this one

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;

Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.

WHAT? A woman is forced to marry her rapist as long as the rapist pays the father 50 fifty shekels of silver! Oh that's right women were only property like cattle in those days.

How could GOD approve of such a disgusting law?

Would you submit your daughter to such an horrific law?

Would you sell your raped daughter out for money?

Wouldn't this law encourage wealthy males to be above the law?

GOD DID NOT APPROVE OF SUCH THINGS!

LOOK! I could go on and on about the other occurances, the translatory errors and why only the women are punished for not being virgins... but anyone can see Mosaic Law is a farce.

I could pull out all the unGODly teachings by MOSES. I could go through the other disgusting verses, one by one, but surely you can see I'm right.

If you dislike homosexuals fine... BUT, you have no right to judge them, no right to bully them, and you as a believer cannot be a bigot!

Or are you saying JESUS taught the bigotry in your hearts?

WAKE UP! You demean GOD by accepting this stuff as "approved by GOD".

Remember it is MAD MOSES that is telling this tale.

This is all from Genesis 19

[link to www.blueletterbible.org]

So LOT goes to the mountains with his two daughters because he is afraid to live in Zoar.

He has just been helped by angels and GOD but he is still scared.

Now for the ultimate rubbish twist in the story.

Genesis 19:32-33 Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.

And they made their father drink wine that night: and the firstborn went in, and lay with her father; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose.

WHAT? Surely this can't be true. That poor LOT taken advantage of by his horrid virgin daughters, and when he was drunk, no less.

REALLY? Come on now... More likely LOT having no wife got drunk and raped his daughters.

BUT remember women were like possessions. Who would listen to a woman?

Luckily for LOT no-one!

So here we have the possibility of a terrible crime committed against the young women, by their father, and the story possibly twisted to protect the male.

Genesis 19:36 Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father.

What is the more likely scenario? Ever been drunk? He was so drunk he knew absolutely nothing about it? TWICE!

The same thing happened on the following night and he wasn't aware?

Give me a break!

How do people believe this rubbish without questioning what is a more likely scenario?

Anyone want to discuss how you allowed these women's names to be blackened when it was probably the other way around, and LOT was a creep?

Keep thinking! You haven't got things correct yet!

shark
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05/07/2013 08:46 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
We don't they hate Christians. Don't care what the Sodomites do so long as they leave us alone kkep it private and not seek special treatment.
Anonymous Coward
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05/07/2013 09:34 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Thanks for the good karma people!! Just discovered what that is.

And those who gave me bad karma, well I'm glad I got you thinking.

hf
 Quoting: Nefertiti


Nef, the people who gave you bad Karma were probably Christians.

The Christians who hand out bad karma because they disagree with you fail Jesus again.

They have been instructed to turn the other cheek and not to judge. They can't help judging, they can't turn the other cheek... They fail their LORD every time... I's laughable

Earlier I said noone on this thread seems to be Christian and following Jesus ' teachings. I think you are because you are using your enquiring mind to think your way through it.

GOOD for you... I said earlier Christians following Christ's teachings are very very rare.

hf
Amazed Continually!
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Thanks for the good karma people!! Just discovered what that is.

And those who gave me bad karma, well I'm glad I got you thinking.

hf
 Quoting: Nefertiti

you ought to be more concerned with your eternal salvation than with your glp karma points

he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. (1 john 5:12)

He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar (1 John 2:4)

all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death (Rev. 21:8)

Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. (Gal. 6:7)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


Rev. 21:8 All liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death

Ever told a lie? So do you qualify as a liar? OOps! You had better get your heat proof clothing. Surfing on those sulphur lakes is fun but it hurts without protective gear apparently... 1rof1

1 John 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar

OK... I don't know what country that you are from but can you claim you keep his commandments... REALLY?

Matthew 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Every person I have ever known has failed this one. How about you? Ever had a lustful thought about anyone?

You shall not steal.

Was your country stolen from Native people?

PROBLEM : If you buy a watch from a thief and you know it is stolen are you committing a crime? YES! You have taken possession of stolen goods. So as the land was stolen we knowingly live on stolen land.

BUT WORSE, the churches in our countries are all built on stolen land!

Lectures from believers on the keeping of the commandments are so hollow.

That is why JESUS advised people to "remove the log from their own eyes".

Time to reflect on you AC!

ohyeah
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Thanks for the good karma people!! Just discovered what that is.

And those who gave me bad karma, well I'm glad I got you thinking.

hf
 Quoting: Nefertiti


Nef, the people who gave you bad Karma were probably Christians.

The Christians who hand out bad karma because they disagree with you fail Jesus again.

They have been instructed to turn the other cheek and not to judge. They can't help judging, they can't turn the other cheek... They fail their LORD every time... I's laughable

Earlier I said noone on this thread seems to be Christian and following Jesus ' teachings. I think you are because you are using your enquiring mind to think your way through it.

GOOD for you... I said earlier Christians following Christ's teachings are very very rare.

hf
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1190661
^
He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. (Matt. 12:30)

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (John 14:6)

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. (John 8:24)

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Matt. 25:41)
Anonymous Coward
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05/07/2013 10:04 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
You wouldn't know a Homosexual if they came up to you and bit you on the ass.stfu
Amazed Continually!
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
...


I don't dodge you... I just don't like your ugly UnGODLY energy.

I don't like your selective use of the word abomination.

Here re-read this Thread: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different? (Page 8)

Why do you continue to make GOD look & sound unintelligent? I'm sorry that he isn't as unintelligent as you. Better luck next time... I was made in his image, you can't have been... 1rof1

You insult my GOD's intelligence. You judge too easily. Hence you are selective in your belief system.

Of course there is some types of objective morality which I would subscribe to, but there are some I wouldn't.

I don't believe in killing people... BUT I can understand someone killing someone in self defense. One has to remain a little flexible you know.

I believe in strong anti-discrimination laws... You would be trapped by those laws... I win!

Jesus didn't fully subscribe as he changed some OT laws. He changed "eye for an eye" to turn the other cheek.

I object and would oppose your selective morality - does that count? 1rof1

ohyeah
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661


In regards to the link, nobody ever said we were perfect. But through Jesus we are all cleansed, I didn't see any of that scripture in your thread. Why?

Because its a new covenant, and becoming a Christian doesn't make us better than the next person or elevate us above you to point the finger. We have to leave our sin behind.

And you seem to take the words almost to literally, to such an extreme to you miss the entire point. Don't you do any type of analysis? I mean regarding the Scottish kilts, that is rooted in their tradition. And during the time period in question regarding that scripture they all wore long robes. But clearly men wore men's style robes or something signifying male and female wore female stle. What is the matter with you? Don't you have any common sense?

Of course women can wear jeans and belts hats or whatever other nonsense you said. The point is do not blur the lines and dress according to your gender whatever time period you are in.

Does it make sense now? Can you see your arrogance now?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27329410


No but you still don't admit that you are an abomination and yet that is what the Bible says.

But this is typical Bible Babble that you speak and to be honest I am bored. It's kindergarten stuff.

You will be judged as I will be judged and I will be correct and you will be wrong. You have placed the sin of homosexuality as worse than your own sins. I know it, you know it.

If you are saved by the new covenant so are they. The old new covenant stuff is a load of rubbish anyway I just haven't got the time to explain it all and prove it.

So let's just agree to disagree... I am right and I know I'm right, you are wrong and I know you are wrong! AGREED!

lolsign
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661


Again you assume so much and i think that is why you are so misled. How do you know what i have and have not done. Again you dont, you just think you do. And as i mentioned you wallow and savor your arrogance. Seriosyl why do yo do it? I hve to know lol.

They can be saved by the new covenant if they get out of homosexuality. Read 1corinthians, that part of the new testament btw. You are lieing to yourself and other when you say its ok. And i hope you havnt told them God says its ok for your sake, repent of that please.

So really you are wrong and i want you to come around to it. Ill praythat ou get the picture sooner rather than later kthnxbyenow
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 24055248


Why do people continually quote Paul the Oppressor at me? They obviously haven't studied Paul.

You are reading your Bible with one eye closed. You accept Paul totally on homosexuality but ignore him totally on the oppression of woemn. Where did Jesus teach this?

Remind yourself of how Jesus became frustrated at times because people just didn't get it!

The first considerations for you regarding Paul (Sorry this is long)

1.What did Jesus say in Matthew 23 about Pharisees.

[link to www.biblegateway.com]
Now I was only really interested in one of the Pharisees – Paul

Acts 23:6 “But when Paul perceived that the one part were Sadducees, and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, Men and brethren, I am a Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee: of the hope and resurrection of the dead I am called in question.”

WOW! So now where does Paul show his true Pharisaical colours? Remember Satan is rather tricky and devious according to you guys!

1 Corinthians 14:34-35 “Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.

And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.”


Where did Jesus preach this? So by posting here as a woman are women breaking a law, a commandment stated by Paul! I know he is wrong, but do you? Shouldn't you be enforcing Paul's instructions as "GOD'S INERRANT WORD"?

But there is more -

1 Timothy 2:11-14 “Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.”


So if a woman is trying to teach a man, by posting here, they are also breaking a law stated by Paul! I know he is wrong, but do you?

Paul was just a man! And yet he continued the discrimination against women for a further 2000 years and beyond! Why would you listen to him?

1 Corinthians 11:6 For if a woman is not covered, let her also be shorn. But if it is shameful for a woman to be shorn or shaved, let her be covered.

Where did Paul's righteousness disappear to?

Yes this one Pharisee has authorized 50% of the population to be discriminated against!

So if you believe Paul represents "GOD's INERRANT WORD" - should women stop talking on religious matters and only discuss things with their husbands?

Why are you believers deliberately and intentionally defyl a commandment from Paul... OOPS the Lord? 1rof1

I'm sure you have missed most of this in your studies BUT I am opening your closed eye.

Also note - Paul lied in 1 Timothy 2:11-14 to justify his oppression of women “And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

What Adam didn't eat of the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil? Adam wasn't tempted? That is totally untrue!

It was Adam who GOD instructed directly.

Genesis 2:16-17 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.


What does THOU mean....... YOU! OOPS Houston we have a problem! Adama wasn't to eat of the fruit! A direct instruction from GOD!

Genesis 3:6 "And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat."

But there is an even bigger problem!

God gave Moses the Ten Commandments.

Jesus (the Son of God) gave three commandments although the first is re-stating Commandment 1 of the 10 commandments.

Mark 12:30-31 "And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

And the second like it, is this, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these. ... John 13:34 "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another"

Are commandments laws? So much for not living under the law!

But hang on Paul a man, and a Pharisee, (remind yourself about what Jesus thought of Pharisees in Matthew 23), says this –

1 Corinthians 14:37 “If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.”

Can a man make a commandment – Answer NO! Paul certainly got a bit full of himself here. But no-one notices... Did you know he wrote these things?

If these are commandments from the Lord as Paul claims you had better buy some shears to get those uncovered women's heads in Church shorn. You had better stop women speaking on religious issues and on get information from their husbands. 1rof1

Jesus (the Son of God) made 2 extra commandments BUT Paul says all his instructions are commandments!

So you see your dilemma. Everything Paul said was a commandment from the Lord, he mentions "the law" when telling women to refer to their husbands only, and he teaches things Jesus never said. Should women be shorn?

Paul invokes Pharisaical Law... And you didn't even notice it? I thought Jesus fulfilled the law.

So who do you believe Jesus or Paul?

If you believe in Jesus’, the Son of God's teachings over Paul’s teachings why hasn’t anyone pointed this out to you?

Why didn’t you notice these problems? If you didn't you are studying poorly.

Why didn't your Preacher teach you this vital information?

I didn't say don't pay attention to the disciples... I said "men are often wrong."

Why do you defend Paul and the Bible and ignore Jesus and GOD?

Paul is obviously wrong but in his being wrong he wrongs 50% of the population in one fell swoop - WOMEN!

Do you still wish to maintain Paul's righteousness or is that just another Bible Babble word?

So here you have a set of books called the Bible, where you can intimately study what Jesus, (the Son of GOD says), is alleged to have said and yet you keep wanting to study and quote man. And Paul especially.

I understand why... Paul's writings make up nearly half of the New Testament. BUT Paul is just a man!

Now finally on Paul there is a huge problem, which disproves totally Bible inerrancy. OOPS!

Acts 9:7 And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.

OR

Acts 22:9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.

So did they hear the voice or NOT?

How did you miss this?

Keep studying, and please stop quoting Paul... If he got the treatment of women 100% wrong... Can you trust anything he says?

tantrum
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User ID: 1190661
Australia
05/07/2013 10:29 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Thanks for the good karma people!! Just discovered what that is.

And those who gave me bad karma, well I'm glad I got you thinking.

hf
 Quoting: Nefertiti


Nef, the people who gave you bad Karma were probably Christians.

The Christians who hand out bad karma because they disagree with you fail Jesus again.

They have been instructed to turn the other cheek and not to judge. They can't help judging, they can't turn the other cheek... They fail their LORD every time... I's laughable

Earlier I said noone on this thread seems to be Christian and following Jesus ' teachings. I think you are because you are using your enquiring mind to think your way through it.

GOOD for you... I said earlier Christians following Christ's teachings are very very rare.

hf
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1190661
^
He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. (Matt. 12:30)

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (John 14:6)

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. (John 8:24)

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Matt. 25:41)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


WOW! Congratulations... You can point and quote scripture...

Do not hide behind Bible quotes to judge and bear false witness... That would make you unGODly.

What is your assessment of me... Where have I quoted the Bible wrongly? Where have I maligned Jesus?

If you really believe GOD condoned - Infanticide, rape, murder, animal and human sacrifice, ethnic cleansing, war crimes, torture, stoning, slavery and other atrocities - YOU ARE WRONG!

If you believe the above... I defend GOD/JESUS against you... Therefore where are you - for him or against him with your beliefs? 1rof1

Did GOD make you unable to converse?

Probably because what you would say isn't worth listening to...

lolsign
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User ID: 39119934
05/07/2013 11:00 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Thanks for the good karma people!! Just discovered what that is.

And those who gave me bad karma, well I'm glad I got you thinking.

hf
 Quoting: Nefertiti


Nef, the people who gave you bad Karma were probably Christians.

The Christians who hand out bad karma because they disagree with you fail Jesus again.

They have been instructed to turn the other cheek and not to judge. They can't help judging, they can't turn the other cheek... They fail their LORD every time... I's laughable

Earlier I said noone on this thread seems to be Christian and following Jesus ' teachings. I think you are because you are using your enquiring mind to think your way through it.

GOOD for you... I said earlier Christians following Christ's teachings are very very rare.

hf
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1190661
^
He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. (Matt. 12:30)

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (John 14:6)

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. (John 8:24)

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Matt. 25:41)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


WOW! Congratulations... You can point and quote scripture...

Do not hide behind Bible quotes to judge and bear false witness... That would make you unGODly.

What is your assessment of me... Where have I quoted the Bible wrongly? Where have I maligned Jesus?

If you really believe GOD condoned - Infanticide, rape, murder, animal and human sacrifice, ethnic cleansing, war crimes, torture, stoning, slavery and other atrocities - YOU ARE WRONG!

If you believe the above... I defend GOD/JESUS against you... Therefore where are you - for him or against him with your beliefs?

Did GOD make you unable to converse?

Probably because what you would say isn't worth listening to...
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661
^
But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God (Rom. 2:5)

Evil men understand not judgment (Prov. 28:5)

There is no fear of God before their eyes. (Rom. 3:18)

Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. (Rom. 12:19)


1rof1 lolsign
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661
^
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thess. 2:12)
Amazed Continually!
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05/07/2013 11:33 PM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
...


Nef, the people who gave you bad Karma were probably Christians.

The Christians who hand out bad karma because they disagree with you fail Jesus again.

They have been instructed to turn the other cheek and not to judge. They can't help judging, they can't turn the other cheek... They fail their LORD every time... I's laughable

Earlier I said noone on this thread seems to be Christian and following Jesus ' teachings. I think you are because you are using your enquiring mind to think your way through it.

GOOD for you... I said earlier Christians following Christ's teachings are very very rare.

hf
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1190661
^
He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. (Matt. 12:30)

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (John 14:6)

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. (John 8:24)

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Matt. 25:41)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


WOW! Congratulations... You can point and quote scripture...

Do not hide behind Bible quotes to judge and bear false witness... That would make you unGODly.

What is your assessment of me... Where have I quoted the Bible wrongly? Where have I maligned Jesus?

If you really believe GOD condoned - Infanticide, rape, murder, animal and human sacrifice, ethnic cleansing, war crimes, torture, stoning, slavery and other atrocities - YOU ARE WRONG!

If you believe the above... I defend GOD/JESUS against you... Therefore where are you - for him or against him with your beliefs?

Did GOD make you unable to converse?

Probably because what you would say isn't worth listening to...
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661
^
But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God (Rom. 2:5)

Evil men understand not judgment (Prov. 28:5)

There is no fear of God before their eyes. (Rom. 3:18)

Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. (Rom. 12:19)


1rof1 lolsign
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661
^
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thess. 2:12)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934



See you on judgement day... I'll be the one laughing at you...

BUT after sharing the joke I will then ask GOD to forgive you...

I'm like that... All you do is use scripture to threaten people.

Afterall, I have no problems turning the other cheek to you, if this is your methodology.

And you can't even understand that!

Whilst thinking let me remind you of a couple of relevant quotes from Jesus for you to keep in the back of your mind, if your mind are up to that much pressure.

Matthew 20:16 So the last will be first, and the first last. For many are called, but few chosen.

I put this first because you should beware… Your posting of scripture here might just be the straw that puts you into the fiery lakes that you are all so keen to threaten on others. He knows your heart and your motivation.

So in your postings are breaking two key foundational teachings of Jesus

Matthew 7:1-5 "Judge not, that ye be not judged....."

John 8:7 "…let he who has not sinned cast the first stone…."


Delude yourselves if you wish, BUT, you are probably breaking these two explicit instructions. That is of course, unless you are perfect, and haven’t sinned.

Do YOU represent your GOD well?


AMAZING!

1rof1
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 39119934
05/08/2013 12:06 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Do YOU represent your GOD well?
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661
^
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist (1 John 4:3)

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. (John 8:44)

all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. (Rev. 21:8)



Jesus is not threatening you, God came to save you from what you deserve. The wicked always accuse Jesus, the living Word, of threatening them, just as a pedophile would accuse a cop who would arrest him.


He that hath the Son hath life (1 John 5:12)

if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. (John 8:24)

I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life (Deut. 30:19)
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 39098660
United States
05/08/2013 01:17 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
This is for those who think sexuality is a choice. I was raised a Christian. Church, Sunday school every Sunday. I believed in my heart in God and that Jesus died on the cross to save us from our sins. I wasn't a "sissy". I did all the stuff any typical guy would do not because I felt I had to but because I enjoyed them...sports, camping, outdoors and all that, yet I didn't do some of the cruel things that even some of my buddies from church did. I'd always tried to do the right thing because I knew that's what Jesus wanted us to do. When I went into puberty I found I was attracted to guys. I knew it was wrong, so I prayed to God, to Jesus...please change me...I don't want to be this way. I prayed and prayed, wondering what it was I had done for God to allow this to happen to me. What did I do wrong? Everyone said what a nice guy I was, but they didn't know what was going on inside. All my buddies were dating, talking about their girlfriends, kissing them, talking about "how far" they could go...even some of my Christian buddies. I knew it was wrong to do some of the things the guys were talking about even if I was 'straight'. But even kissing a girl, I couldn't even do that, because it would have been a lie on my part. They kept asking why I didn't have a girlfriend. I was good looking and had a good built and it would have been no problem for me to "fake it", but I just couldn't do it. Some of the guys were really raunchy...I didn't want to even be associated with guys that did the things they did. So I became withdrawn. And I prayed. I prayed with all my heart for God to change me. It didn't happen and I couldn't figure out why. I even asked God, more than once, "God, you said seek, ye shall find...ask and it will be given unto you...knock and the door will be open unto you. I'm seeking, I'm asking and I'm knocking. Please help me". When that didn't work I asked God to show me where I went wrong, what I had done to be punished this way. Nada. I remembered the foot print in the sands thing, about Jesus carrying me when there were only one set of prints. I prayed on that. Nada. So I decided I'd just live my life...remember the Golden Rule just because that's a decent way to be. And that's where I am now.
So maybe one of you can tell me where I went wrong? What did I do to be 'punished' or whatever you want to call it? Please don't give excuses about my not really being a Christian to begin with. I prayed every night since I was old enough to talk...said the Lord's Prayer, and confessed and asked forgiveness for all my sins...every night without fail. Some of my buddies that were so wild in high school...married with kids and now grand and even great grand kids. I have none of that...and...WHY...??? It wasn't my choice to be gay, but I am. It makes me angry when people say it's a choice. What do you know, having been born heterosexual and then condemning me to hell because I'm not? "Hate the sin, not the sinner"...are you so perfect? Just how sinless are you to judge someone else? I think you don't get it. It's "do unto others as ye would have them do unto you", not "Speak my name and point out others sins because you're so special."
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39098660


Thanks for contributing to this debate. Your story is an example of decent human beings who are homosexuals. It seems to me that many people think that someone who is homosexual is very different from a normal person somehow. As if to say, if he is a homosexual, he probably does other bad things too.

Did you do something wrong? When would you have done this wrong thing? In a previous life? Christianity doesn't subscribe to reincarnation. So no, you didn't do something to deserve being ostracized by society because you are attracted to persons of the same sex by default. And that is the question. How do we explain people who are homosexuals from when they were kids? How come they have that inclination from the moment they can think sexual thoughts?

I sincerely believe that homosexuality isn't a choice. If someone says they chose to be homosexual, then they are probably bi-sexual IMO. People tell me that homosexuality has become the new "cool". I disagree. It is not a fad that will disappear with time. It is not fashionable...at least not in my world. The gay couple I know are pretty much like you. One of them is an atheist and grew up without religion but his partner came from a very strict Anglican home. He was and still is torn by the Church's stance on the matter. He, however, gave up on Church. Unfortunately as much as he wants to leave Christians alone, he feels under attack by them nonetheless. I guess it's because of the different campaigns going on. Massive pro-gay and anti-gay campaigns.
 Quoting: Nefertiti


You're welcome...I'm glad to contribute, but the vast majority of the time I'm hesitant because people just don't get it. They either stick their minds in the gutter about it or stick their minds in the Bible about it, and too often both.

When Women's Lib started, I said it should be civil rights. When Gay Lib started I said it should be civil rights. It's only civil to respect those that do no harm to others and treat them equally, but people twist what consists of 'harm' and the ignorant compare it to vices such as pedophiles and even murder. Twisted minds do that and what twists them is their not comprehending the Bible or their own sexuality and concentrating on negativeness.
I don't wear leather chaps with my bare ass showing, and I don't dress in drag, even though it doesn't bother me for others to do it and I support their rights to do it...in the proper places. Hell, I can't decorate a room, I hate to shop and I have no albums by Barbara Streisand or Judy Garland. I'm just me, a person trying to get along and my sexuality as to who I am is private and not the most important thing about me. I'd think, I HOPE most gays would tend toward that. Some I know do, some I know don't...to varying degrees.
I hear this idiocy of the "gay agenda" as if every gay person wants to shove their lifestyle down the throats of those who oppose. The few that HAVE made this kind of agenda are in the minority. Most gays just want the freedom of any other American and would rather not make waves unless injustice is demonstrated.
Hate crimes? ANY violent act against any person is a crime, and no more so for a gay person or a black person or a white person or a Jewish person or whatever. I've never heard of anyone ever doing a violent act against someone out of love.
I just wish everyone (gay or straight...or whatever) would learn to treat each other with respect and show compassion...because we're all human.
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05/08/2013 02:01 AM
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Re: Christians, Why hate Homosexuals? Are you any different?
Do YOU represent your GOD well?
 Quoting: Amazed Continually! 1190661
^
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist (1 John 4:3)

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. (John 8:44)

all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. (Rev. 21:8)



Jesus is not threatening you, God came to save you from what you deserve. The wicked always accuse Jesus, the living Word, of threatening them, just as a pedophile would accuse a cop who would arrest him.


He that hath the Son hath life (1 John 5:12)

if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. (John 8:24)

I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life (Deut. 30:19)

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 39119934


Seeing you are so knowing... OOps or are you can you explain who the him is in John 3:16 for me?

I guess not.

Ever told a lie? YOU FAIL!

ohyeah

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