Lawmakers want "Atheist Chaplains" in the military | |
NOLAangel User ID: 11685234 United States 07/23/2013 10:45 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
TunafishSammiches User ID: 24482144 Canada 07/23/2013 10:46 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I needed my chaplain. Without my chaplain I would have probably killed myself. I was in a horrible place when we were there. I hated myself for looking away for half a minute. I hated myself for calling the police. I hated myself for wanting to hurt another human being. I just plain hated myself. Quoting: Brandywine84 My chaplain helped me in more ways than he will ever know. God bless that man. So having a chaplain was a benefit to you, and you would deny (and deride) the same thing to another person who has a different set of beliefs than you? If it was an atheist person in the same situation, would you really say it was inappropriate for them to seek counsel with an atheist chaplain? Tuna did I ever say I deny them? No, I would not deny them the right to speak to anyone. They could worship the moon for all I care. If they want to speak to a counselor, by all means, speak to one. But call it what it is. They don't worship the moon, they don't worship anything. You're thinking of Wiccans, and I'm pretty sure there are already Wiccan chaplains. Once again, chaplain is a rank, with certain privileges in the military structure. If you wish Troops and their families to be treated equally (and I believe they should) it is a logical step to either have atheist chaplains or to allow counselors to become ranked in a seperate but equal role. You cannot have it both ways. |
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Brandywine84 User ID: 36020080 United States 07/23/2013 10:50 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I needed my chaplain. Without my chaplain I would have probably killed myself. I was in a horrible place when we were there. I hated myself for looking away for half a minute. I hated myself for calling the police. I hated myself for wanting to hurt another human being. I just plain hated myself. Quoting: Brandywine84 My chaplain helped me in more ways than he will ever know. God bless that man. So having a chaplain was a benefit to you, and you would deny (and deride) the same thing to another person who has a different set of beliefs than you? If it was an atheist person in the same situation, would you really say it was inappropriate for them to seek counsel with an atheist chaplain? Tuna did I ever say I deny them? No, I would not deny them the right to speak to anyone. They could worship the moon for all I care. If they want to speak to a counselor, by all means, speak to one. But call it what it is. They don't worship the moon, they don't worship anything. You're thinking of Wiccans, and I'm pretty sure there are already Wiccan chaplains. Once again, chaplain is a rank, with certain privileges in the military structure. If you wish Troops and their families to be treated equally (and I believe they should) it is a logical step to either have atheist chaplains or to allow counselors to become ranked in a seperate but equal role. You cannot have it both ways. AS I said in my karma post to you, but forgot to put my name on, I agree with you, I just dont think they should be named chaplains is all. It can have a different name, outreach officer, counselor, cognitive friend, whatever they want to call it. I personally think calling this position an Atheist Chaplain will backfire. Never be in a hurry; do everything quietly and in a calm spirit. Do not lose your inner peace for anything whatsoever, even if your whole world seems upset. ~Saint Francis de Sales To keep the body in good health is a duty... otherwise we shall not be able to keep our mind strong and clear. ~Buddha |
TunafishSammiches User ID: 24482144 Canada 07/23/2013 10:54 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | ... Quoting: TunafishSammiches So having a chaplain was a benefit to you, and you would deny (and deride) the same thing to another person who has a different set of beliefs than you? If it was an atheist person in the same situation, would you really say it was inappropriate for them to seek counsel with an atheist chaplain? Tuna did I ever say I deny them? No, I would not deny them the right to speak to anyone. They could worship the moon for all I care. If they want to speak to a counselor, by all means, speak to one. But call it what it is. They don't worship the moon, they don't worship anything. You're thinking of Wiccans, and I'm pretty sure there are already Wiccan chaplains. Once again, chaplain is a rank, with certain privileges in the military structure. If you wish Troops and their families to be treated equally (and I believe they should) it is a logical step to either have atheist chaplains or to allow counselors to become ranked in a seperate but equal role. You cannot have it both ways. AS I said in my karma post to you, but forgot to put my name on, I agree with you, I just dont think they should be named chaplains is all. It can have a different name, outreach officer, counselor, cognitive friend, whatever they want to call it. I personally think calling this position an Atheist Chaplain will backfire. Well that's the military for you though. I'm sure they'd be glad to file the paperwork somewhere in 2016. |
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Brandywine84 User ID: 36020080 United States 07/23/2013 10:57 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | ... Quoting: Brandywine84 Tuna did I ever say I deny them? No, I would not deny them the right to speak to anyone. They could worship the moon for all I care. If they want to speak to a counselor, by all means, speak to one. But call it what it is. They don't worship the moon, they don't worship anything. You're thinking of Wiccans, and I'm pretty sure there are already Wiccan chaplains. Once again, chaplain is a rank, with certain privileges in the military structure. If you wish Troops and their families to be treated equally (and I believe they should) it is a logical step to either have atheist chaplains or to allow counselors to become ranked in a seperate but equal role. You cannot have it both ways. AS I said in my karma post to you, but forgot to put my name on, I agree with you, I just dont think they should be named chaplains is all. It can have a different name, outreach officer, counselor, cognitive friend, whatever they want to call it. I personally think calling this position an Atheist Chaplain will backfire. Well that's the military for you though. I'm sure they'd be glad to file the paperwork somewhere in 2016. Too true. Never be in a hurry; do everything quietly and in a calm spirit. Do not lose your inner peace for anything whatsoever, even if your whole world seems upset. ~Saint Francis de Sales To keep the body in good health is a duty... otherwise we shall not be able to keep our mind strong and clear. ~Buddha |
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 1044117 United States 07/23/2013 11:14 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [link to www.atheistchaplain.com] His quote of the day: “Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear.” –Thomas Jefferson It doesn't sound like Jefferson is ruling out the existence of God in that quote. Is he? |
TunafishSammiches User ID: 24482144 Canada 07/23/2013 11:17 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [link to www.atheistchaplain.com] Quoting: RantProne Their quote of the day: “Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear.” –Thomas Jefferson It doesn't sound like Jefferson is ruling out the existence of God in that quote. Is he? To put it in this board's terms, he's saying "Don't be a sheeple." |
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 1044117 United States 07/23/2013 11:20 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [link to www.atheistchaplain.com] Quoting: RantProne Their quote of the day: “Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear.” –Thomas Jefferson It doesn't sound like Jefferson is ruling out the existence of God in that quote. Is he? To put it in this board's terms, he's saying "Don't be a sheeple." Old blog page, and one man's opinion. I'll have to do better. I'm getting lazy. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1044117 United States 07/23/2013 11:21 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | “Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear.” Quoting: RantProne –Thomas Jefferson Interpretation: If god exists it is by fear and not reason. Or: If God exists, He wants you to ask questions and think for yourself, rather than to blindly accept the fear that ignorance brings. |
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Angelic_Warrior User ID: 23290196 United States 07/23/2013 11:49 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Thought the same but I wasn't sure how to spell it.. oxymoron or oxymoran But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. I Corinthians 2:14 God doesn't choose favorites.. They choose HIM It is not the greatness of my faith that moves mountains but my faith in the greatness of God |
Angelic_Warrior User ID: 23290196 United States 07/23/2013 11:49 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14703874 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. I Corinthians 2:14 God doesn't choose favorites.. They choose HIM It is not the greatness of my faith that moves mountains but my faith in the greatness of God |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1544701 United States 07/23/2013 11:54 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It's called a therapist. They just want to avoid that word because it carries a stigma with some people. Atheists are always saying how religion is for stupid people, yet they always find a way to hijack and distort our traditions when its convenient. Most atheists celebrate Christmas even. Just the materialistic part of course. Oh, but its just an excuse to get together with family and friends! When you eliminate spirituality, you're left with materialism and science. Science, of course, is not necessarily bad, but it can't take the place of religion, no matter how hard you try, like by calling therapists chaplains. |
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 10401141 United States 07/24/2013 12:38 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It's called a therapist. They just want to avoid that word because it carries a stigma with some people. Atheists are always saying how religion is for stupid people, yet they always find a way to hijack and distort our traditions when its convenient. Most atheists celebrate Christmas even. Just the materialistic part of course. Oh, but its just an excuse to get together with family and friends! When you eliminate spirituality, you're left with materialism and science. Science, of course, is not necessarily bad, but it can't take the place of religion, no matter how hard you try, like by calling therapists chaplains. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1544701 THIS! It's funny that they want Therapists, but since they don't want to look crazy, they want them to be called something that belongs to what they don't believe in. Yep, that seems sane... |
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Éireann User ID: 43950289 United States 07/24/2013 01:55 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Atheist Chaplains. Isn't that like a complete oxymoron? Eireann~ I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. - Galatians 2:20 |
Doommincus Maximus User ID: 6085206 New Zealand 07/24/2013 02:12 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I think they are just naming it that to make it work. Men, Real men would not go see a shrink or therapist in the military, it would not happen, but since most are religious and they see their Chaplin's this would ensure the Atheist that need help from a shrink would not feel uncomfortable or outcast. Its better to name it Chaplin so they can get the help they need, then let them suffer in their own pain in fear of portraying themselves as weak. Maybe its a man thing Last Edited by Doommincus Maximus on 07/24/2013 02:15 AM Stand up for what you believe in, even if you stand alone. |