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Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)

 
my 2 cents

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08/02/2013 06:47 PM

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Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
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Thanks to Obama’s famed “no drama” coolness, it’s hard to detect when he’s breaking a sweat. But if you look at the substance of his actions, it’s clear the President is losing his famed poise, at least as far as Snowden and the surveillance state revelations are concerned. I’m not sure yet whether his missteps are simply the result of personal obsession, or whether Obama recognizes he’s slipping into lame duck status, and his frustration with his declining power is most evident where he is most stressed, which is on the NSA revelations front.

One sign that Obama is off balance is his unforced errors in dealing with Russia. The bizarre assumption from the get-go seemed to be that Putin would cooperate and hand over Snowden once the Russian leader was prodded a bit. Given the status of US-Russian relations, that was borderline delusional. As Michael Hirsh explained:

In the decade after the Soviet Union’s collapse in late 1991, the United States offered up a lot of poor economic advice — high-minded tinkering by the free-market consultants at the Harvard Institute for International Development, as well as the IMF…

That era of mistrust of America led directly to era of Putin. Since then, despite various attempts at what former Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton called a “reset” of relations, the U.S. has tended to encourage Russian suspicions by generally treating “Russia as heir to the USSR’s policies and objectives,” Leslie Gelb and Dimitri Simes write in a new article in The National Interest…. “This creates an impression that the West’s top priorities, long after the Cold War, include not merely containing Russia but also transforming it.”

Putin cleared his throat early on and reminded the US that Russia had no extradition treaty with the US and in general did not extradite people. Packing Snowden off because the US asked for him was not on the table. Putin took the position that the Snowden wasn’t worth exploiting for his annoyance value to the US: “It’s like shearing a piglet: a lot of squealing and little wool.”

Notice that that formulation did not foreclose the possibility that Russia might exchange Snowden for individuals in the US that Russia wanted returned, such as ex-KGB agent Oleg Kalugin.

But no, Obama immediately rejected that possibility, by insisting that Russia was obligated under international law to hand over Snowden (funny how international law is operative when Obama needs it, and not in matters like Kalugin, the force-feeding of Gitmo detainees, or drone murders of children in Pakistan). He also said:

I’m not going to be scrambling jets to get a 29-year-old hacker…I have not called President Xi personally or President Putin personally and the reason is … No. 1, I shouldn’t have to.

No. 2, we’ve got a whole lot of business that we do with China and Russia, and I’m not going to have one case of a suspect who we’re trying to extradite suddenly being elevated to the point where I’ve got to start doing wheeling and dealing and trading on a whole host of other issues.

So what’s happened since then? Well, Obama didn’t scramble jets personally, but if you think the diversion of Evo Morales’ plane wasn’t America’s doing, I have a bridge I’d like to sell you. And even though Putin had said “no extradition” in the clearest manner possible, Obama wasn’t willing to get the message. I’ve pointed to this passage from Moon of Alabama a couple of times, but it deserves all the attention it can get:

Putin has made it clear from the very beginning that any extradition of Snowden is not going to happen. Fullstop. Russian officials have repeated that again and even today:

Asked by a reporter whether the government’s position had changed, Dmitry Peskov told Russian news agencies that “Russia has never extradited anyone and never will.”

Is that so difficult to understand? Why then is the U.S. even trying?

It seems that this an Obama personality issue. He personally asked Putin to extradite Snowden even after Putin had publicly (thereby leaving zero chance to later change that decision) said he would not. Now Obama is miffed. How can HE get rebuked by country like Russia?

Two weeks ago, Obama phoned Putin and asked him to send Snowden back to the U.S., but Putin refused, according to one official who was briefed on the call. Following that perceived rebuke, the Obama team doubled down on its new policy to show the Russian government the cold shoulder.

“The Snowden affair is definitely affecting U.S.-Russia relations, no question. When you make it clear that something is very important to the U.S. and we are asking for cooperation and that request is rejected, that rejection is going to have an impact on the broader relationship,” said Samuel Charap, senior fellow for Russia and Eurasia at the International Institute for Strategic Studies. “There’s only so many times you can thumb your nose at a U.S. president and not expect consequences. When the president himself has gotten involved personally and been rebuffed, the rule book kind of goes out the window.”

Ahh – the rule book is out of the window. Screw public diplomacy. Just don’t care how the world sees the U.S.. It is all about Obama miffed that Putin is “thumbing his nose” at him. Who is this President of the Russian Federation that dares to do so to King Obama of the United States?

Apparently Obama forgot Russia still has nukes.

Now that Obama has found out that he can’t push Putin around, it looks like the US is trying to offer up enough people Russia wants for them to turn over Snowden

Read the rest at:

[link to www.nakedcapitalism.com]
Patriotism is supporting your country always -- and your government when they deserve it. Mark Twain


Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords. -Benjamin Franklin
AR 15-SPECIALIST
ADMIT IT.....WERE FUCKED!!!

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08/02/2013 06:55 PM

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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin is old school KGB. He knows Obama is his bitch and will bow to him also when directed to do so. Admit it... We're fucked!
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 06:57 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin is old school KGB. He knows Obama is his bitch and will bow to him also when directed to do so. Admit it... We're fucked!
 Quoting: AR 15-SPECIALIST


^ This is the truth. Russian leaders detest and exploit weakness. He's gonna F with Barry on fundamental principle.
fireman2013

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08/02/2013 07:05 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
The Snowden affair

 Quoting: my 2 cents



Alive In Jesus Christ
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 07:15 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
I know Putin et al are very smart, but I can't help think Snowden is Mossad with CIA ties and the plan is to get the US to go to war with Russia which will result in the US turned to rubble. China will rise to power fast and the jews will attach themselves like the parasites they are to China.
freethinkingguy

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08/02/2013 07:24 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin has put Obama in his place...Obama isn't the New World Order President after all. More scandals, up and coming.
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 08:12 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
In all my time on this site, I have to say this is the best article I have read.

1- shows that Russia sees what so many Americans don't, that the O is a WUS, arrogant, conceited, but doesn't have any ba...s. Has no foreign policy or rapport, can't function without a TelePrompTer or earphones.
2- he has no experience what so ever, and in his arrogance THINKS he can command another country and shrivels away when they don't bow. He has no clue what to do then.
3- the O is totally nonfunctional. THEY know he is not qualified and THEY know this is their chance.
4- it's so sad when you have more respect for Putin than anyone in office here.
5-snowden is the best thing that happened during this administration. It showed the O can wiggle around and cock his head and strut his stuff but is not only ineffective but an embarrassment. The entire world sees this, even the 3rd world countries. The whole world is laughing.

It would be wise if the king abdicates to at least save his own face. Maybe "consultant" or something superficial.

I STILL wonder, though, what was that secret between Medvedev and the O when he said he would be more flexible after the election. Frankly, I think the tables have turned.
my 2 cents (OP)

User ID: 26646007
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08/02/2013 08:34 PM

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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin has put Obama in his place...Obama isn't the New World Order President after all. More scandals, up and coming.
 Quoting: freethinkingguy

Yup, Putin makes Obama look like the foreign policy beginner he is.
Putin is playing chess while Obama is playing tiddly winks.
Patriotism is supporting your country always -- and your government when they deserve it. Mark Twain


Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords. -Benjamin Franklin
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 08:44 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Acting is so much better on the stage or screen.

More debth and all....
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 08:45 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
In all my time on this site, I have to say this is the best article I have read.

1- shows that Russia sees what so many Americans don't, that the O is a WUS, arrogant, conceited, but doesn't have any ba...s. Has no foreign policy or rapport, can't function without a TelePrompTer or earphones.
2- he has no experience what so ever, and in his arrogance THINKS he can command another country and shrivels away when they don't bow. He has no clue what to do then.
3- the O is totally nonfunctional. THEY know he is not qualified and THEY know this is their chance.
4- it's so sad when you have more respect for Putin than anyone in office here.
5-snowden is the best thing that happened during this administration. It showed the O can wiggle around and cock his head and strut his stuff but is not only ineffective but an embarrassment. The entire world sees this, even the 3rd world countries. The whole world is laughing.

It would be wise if the king abdicates to at least save his own face. Maybe "consultant" or something superficial.

I STILL wonder, though, what was that secret between Medvedev and the O when he said he would be more flexible after the election. Frankly, I think the tables have turned.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43908153


Berry is a sad sad man and the Ruskeis know he is weak and we have no real leaders in either of the two major parties as far as I can see. The next election is setting up to be Christy vs Clinton and that is as sad as what we have now
TheBryk
User ID: 43848549
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08/02/2013 08:46 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
In all my time on this site, I have to say this is the best article I have read.

1- shows that Russia sees what so many Americans don't, that the O is a WUS, arrogant, conceited, but doesn't have any ba...s. Has no foreign policy or rapport, can't function without a TelePrompTer or earphones.
2- he has no experience what so ever, and in his arrogance THINKS he can command another country and shrivels away when they don't bow. He has no clue what to do then.
3- the O is totally nonfunctional. THEY know he is not qualified and THEY know this is their chance.
4- it's so sad when you have more respect for Putin than anyone in office here.
5-snowden is the best thing that happened during this administration. It showed the O can wiggle around and cock his head and strut his stuff but is not only ineffective but an embarrassment. The entire world sees this, even the 3rd world countries. The whole world is laughing.

It would be wise if the king abdicates to at least save his own face. Maybe "consultant" or something superficial.

I STILL wonder, though, what was that secret between Medvedev and the O when he said he would be more flexible after the election. Frankly, I think the tables have turned.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43908153


Berry is a sad sad man and the Ruskeis know he is weak and we have no real leaders in either of the two major parties as far as I can see. The next election is setting up to be Christy vs Clinton and that is as sad as what we have now
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 09:00 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Barry is mostly losing it because his bosses can see how useless he is. They'll either step in to bail out his ass or let him twist in the wind. Let's hope it's the latter and he has to wear all his policies like an albatross around his neck. I see lame duckiness in his future.
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 09:06 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin is old school KGB. He knows Obama is his bitch and will bow to him also when directed to do so. Admit it... We're fucked!
 Quoting: AR 15-SPECIALIST


There was just something on the news and I think it said Snowden would be sent back.

It was in Portuguese so I only caught some of it.
Copperhead

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08/02/2013 09:29 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Barak "Chalkie White" Obama was installed to foment race tension in the US before the real shit hits the fan. He is the globalist puppet installed to hasten our downfall.
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 09:32 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
you all are tards....serious tards...Russia is a shell
of its former self...putin will play games with this just
make Russia look important...if you all really think Russia
is still the big bear you really need to do some checking
of facts for yourself....besides...snowden is a joke.....
yea they would like to have him back...but you don't start
a complete meltdown of ties over a nobody
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 25985201
United States
08/02/2013 10:06 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
you all are tards....serious tards...Russia is a shell
of its former self...putin will play games with this just
make Russia look important...if you all really think Russia
is still the big bear you really need to do some checking
of facts for yourself....besides...snowden is a joke.....
yea they would like to have him back...but you don't start
a complete meltdown of ties over a nobody
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22124161


wtf
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 10:11 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
I know Putin et al are very smart, but I can't help think Snowden is Mossad with CIA ties and the plan is to get the US to go to war with Russia which will result in the US turned to rubble. China will rise to power fast and the jews will attach themselves like the parasites they are to China.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 29030371


Cogent.
Anonymous Coward
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08/02/2013 10:34 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
It is a shame that on the one hand the US wants to have ties and cite justice and fairness along with international laws and yet on the other hand, they seem to flout any and all legal boundaries to get what they want such as in the case of Benghazi, Bin Ladin's rescue and subsequent death of all soldiers involved - who were on the ground in a firefight after the helo crashed, Prism, and not taking action against people who are vieweing child pornography while working for intelligence agencies or the loss of aome 9 trillion dollars out of government coffers, as just a few examples...

The question then arises of credibility, and as each scandal, cover up and firing occurs, there seems to be less of it with eachbpassing day, which is being noted the world over, and regardless of saber rattling to make demands to leaders of the world, less and less are responding favorably leaving what was once a great nation struggling to cast its influence beyond the threat of war.
Astral Goat
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08/02/2013 10:36 PM

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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
You all do know the range of the spying has increased since a certain...ahem, person got into office.

Last Edited by Astral Goat on 08/02/2013 10:36 PM
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pinkshirtguy

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08/02/2013 10:39 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin has put Obama in his place...Obama isn't the New World Order President after all. More scandals, up and coming.
 Quoting: freethinkingguy


goon
poyl
my 2 cents (OP)

User ID: 26646007
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08/02/2013 10:42 PM

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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin is old school KGB. He knows Obama is his bitch and will bow to him also when directed to do so. Admit it... We're fucked!
 Quoting: AR 15-SPECIALIST


There was just something on the news and I think it said Snowden would be sent back.

It was in Portuguese so I only caught some of it.
 Quoting: Down Under Wonder

I sure hope it's not true. Freedom loving people everywhere would never, ever forgive Putin.
Patriotism is supporting your country always -- and your government when they deserve it. Mark Twain


Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords. -Benjamin Franklin
Anonymous Coward
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United States
08/02/2013 10:49 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
In all my time on this site, I have to say this is the best article I have read.

1- shows that Russia sees what so many Americans don't, that the O is a WUS, arrogant, conceited, but doesn't have any ba...s. Has no foreign policy or rapport, can't function without a TelePrompTer or earphones.
2- he has no experience what so ever, and in his arrogance THINKS he can command another country and shrivels away when they don't bow. He has no clue what to do then.
3- the O is totally nonfunctional. THEY know he is not qualified and THEY know this is their chance.
4- it's so sad when you have more respect for Putin than anyone in office here.
5-snowden is the best thing that happened during this administration. It showed the O can wiggle around and cock his head and strut his stuff but is not only ineffective but an embarrassment. The entire world sees this, even the 3rd world countries. The whole world is laughing.

It would be wise if the king abdicates to at least save his own face. Maybe "consultant" or something superficial.

I STILL wonder, though, what was that secret between Medvedev and the O when he said he would be more flexible after the election. Frankly, I think the tables have turned.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43908153


He meant he could get his ankles all the way behind his head.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 44491244
Australia
08/02/2013 10:57 PM
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Re: Obama starting to lose it over Snowden (ha ha)
Putin is old school KGB. He knows Obama is his bitch and will bow to him also when directed to do so. Admit it... We're fucked!
 Quoting: AR 15-SPECIALIST


There was just something on the news and I think it said Snowden would be sent back.

It was in Portuguese so I only caught some of it.
 Quoting: Down Under Wonder

I sure hope it's not true. Freedom loving people everywhere would never, ever forgive Putin.
 Quoting: my 2 cents


Putin did mention previously that he would deport Snowden if he did not shut up.

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