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Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture

 
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 10:36 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
Remember:
Christ is love.
 Quoting: mikebo2


Oh trust me, I know he is. His father is not pure love. That's the truth, God is not love. God is perfect justice. God is omnipotent, God is almighty, God is everything, everywhere, and always in control.

God has a plan for everyone.

I seriously doubt that plan includes eternal torment.

It sounds like you need to remember that Christ is love.

And once you remember that, maybe you should re-read the book of revelation with that in mind.

And then ask yourself; does this really sound like Yeshua?



I ask you honestly:

Do the words of the Yeshua in revelation sound anything like the words from the Yeshua in the first four gospel?

Last Edited by Johnbert.Lennonstein on 08/16/2013 10:37 PM
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 10:40 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
We're all just angels and demons in disguise brother. Don't put yourself on the losing team.


Dreams -- sensations you prove
Are taken from nature
You find those emotions are true in your mind

Fight against the kingdom of fear
Sooner or later they'll try to convince you are wrong
But I'm sure..
We're just

Crawling Angels and Demons disguised
The truth you don't know so try to be sure
When your Angels and Demons arise
Face the Truth: God is not love!
Feel as fluid as life,
Love is a rainbow
As much as it seems to be real
It's all in your mind

Sooner or later I'm gonna convince that
The truth is a lie
There's no Judge when we die
Only dust
We're just
Crawling Angels and Demons disguised
The truth you don't know so try to be sure
When your Angels and Demons arise
But we're still not sure which way we should go
When the Angels and Demons disguise
Just confusing our brains with their lies
Enticing emotions
Revoltiong devotions
The Angels and Demons telling me lies!
-----

Revelation is just a book meant to instill fear in people.

FIGHT IT. Stop supporting it.

Last Edited by Johnbert.Lennonstein on 08/16/2013 10:40 PM
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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08/16/2013 10:41 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
Sorry but the #1 problem with Christianity is the book of revelation.

The sooner people stop thinking about that book, stop teaching that book, and fuck even stop talking about that book; the sooner the world will become a better place.

The biggest problem with "christians" is that half of htem are hypocrites who don't actually take my Master's words seriously.

They just simply care about paying lip-service and doing things which they feel will impress the father in order to keep them safe during the second coming.

A good majority of them don't actually care about ALL of human life; they are only in it for some sort of comfort in the belief of an eternal paradise; which is kind of fucked up, considering that Yeshua himself said that heaven would pass away.

Acting like Christ is enough.

He was a briliant man, who taught a beautiful philosophy. Taking concern with the afterlife, instead of taking pleasure in just living the word is a big big problem with that religion.

If he came back he would likely shame every one of the hypocrites who live for the sake of their own salvation, rather than living for the well-being of their neighbors.

He would likely tell people that he didn't even want to be worshiped or have a religion named after him. He wanted people to worship his father, yet for some reason he became the center of attention.

He would likely put his most "devout" and "righteous" zealots into everlasting contempt.

Everlasting meaning just an age; or likely a lifetime.

Daniel 12:
2“Many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake, these to everlasting life, but the others to disgrace and everlasting contempt.3“Those who have insight will shine brightly like the brightness of the expanse of heaven, and those who lead the many to righteousness, like the stars forever and ever.4“But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the book until the end of time; many will go back and forth, and knowledge will increase.”
 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


No need to be sorry there was nothing bad about your post and I said earlier we could expand the discussion. I see your point intimately and the truth is there is enough of a warning issued in the other books to still raise awareness where need for a Christian. Many come and stay in the faith never looking farther than the gospels and there is nothing wrong with that. We are all called for different purposes IMO and I could never say or begin to limit what knowledge will be needed for those roles. I have seen more people turn away from the faith by the churches refusing to answer questions than I have because a particular book was included in canon though.
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 10:46 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
NO, ON THE RAPTURE AS IS UNDERSTOOD...

WHY???

TO STAND UNDER ANYTHING BUT "THE TRUTH"...

IS DEATH...


TO STAND ON "THE TRUTH"...

OR WHAT IS ABSOLUTE...

WHEN YOU STAND "THE TRUTH" THAT IS "THE SECOND COMING"...

IN "THE WORD" YOU ARE "THE TRUTH"...

THIS IS WHAT ENOCH SAID...

I HAVE PLEASE GOD!!!

PEOPLE ARE LEAVING ALL THE TIME...

THIS IS WHAT IS MEANT...

BY SOME ARE TAKEN...
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 10:49 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
[

No need to be sorry there was nothing bad about your post and I said earlier we could expand the discussion. I see your point intimately and the truth is there is enough of a warning issued in the other books to still raise awareness where need for a Christian. Many come and stay in the faith never looking farther than the gospels and there is nothing wrong with that. We are all called for different purposes IMO and I could never say or begin to limit what knowledge will be needed for those roles. I have seen more people turn away from the faith by the churches refusing to answer questions than I have because a particular book was included in canon though.
 Quoting: ByFaithAlone


I undertand what you mean here 110%

I have turned my back on churches over and over again because they were unable to answer my questions.

Now my only teacher is Yeshua; he is the only source of answers that I need.

Most Priests, ministers, pastors, rabbis etc; are simply modern pharisees :/

Matthew 23:
Pharisaism Exposed

1Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to His disciples,2saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses;3therefore all that they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds; for they say things and do not do them.4“They tie up heavy burdens and lay them on men’s shoulders, but they themselves are unwilling to move them with so much as a finger.5“But they do all their deeds to be noticed by men; for they broaden their phylacteries and lengthen the tassels of their garments.6“They love the place of honor at banquets and the chief seats in the synagogues,7and respectful greetings in the market places, and being called Rabbi by men.8“But do not be called Rabbi; for One is your Teacher, and you are all brothers.9“Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven.10“Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ.11“But the greatest among you shall be your servant.12“Whoever exalts himself shall be humbled; and whoever humbles himself shall be exalted.


All is ONE my friends:

We're the orphans from the holy land, the tears of Jerusalem
And in darkness we have prayed and swore to rise up once again

We are the sons of the blazing sun
Sharing our faith through the barrel of a gun
Walk on holy water yet we burn
Brothers of the orient stand as one

An ancient promise in an orphaned land
A clenched fist becomes an open hand
Armed forces spill their blood on holy sands
Again and again we fail to see that all is one

Words like venom through our veins they run
Weaving a web of deception hope is gone
Shall we re-live the pain of wars before?
Or shall we be the light, the new folklore?

Evil falls on each of us, there's nothing new
Who cares if you're a Muslim or a Jew
The awakened ones are nothing but a few
And the one to make the difference now is you

From the Middle Eastern lands we ride, all children of Abraham
Our only sword, the light within, that burns as bright as sun
Wer're the orphans from the Holy Land, the keepers of Or-Shalem
So we bow to you our warriors for being simple men
----

The true jews are rising once more.

Last Edited by Johnbert.Lennonstein on 08/16/2013 10:56 PM
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 10:55 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
What are your thoughts concerning the rapture? Yes or no? Pre or post tribulation? This is not an issue about core doctrine and either way does not effect your ability to be a Christian. So lets try to keep it civil because there is alot of passion within our beliefs.

I am looking for your basis what you believe and why you believe it and how do you defend it to others.hf
 Quoting: ByFaithAlone




I don't "defend" my beliefs, nor my awareness but only profess such point blank

I know for a fact that there is no rapture mentioned in Gods Word

it is merely one of the many misinterpretations which the church itself jumped upon when it was first introduced into the world, as it benefited their main goal and purpose in so doing, which was nothing if not "short sighted" at the time

that being to get more people into their Churches, tithing

sadly that's was all the impetus required on that end, like as not, in the beginning

altho at this point the deconstruction of faith in the truth is more akin to a science than a business

religion being one of the hidden dynasties within our world, which places it foremost in the crosshairs with much of the rest of the truth of any matter, for reasons which are truly self evident in these latter days

the only "rapture" that will be effected will be at the folly of the "antichrist" when he returns prior to the return of the Christ to effectually mark all those whom he is capable of deceiving in any regard with reference to the truth of the matter at hand

in so doing, oddly enough, he will be fomenting Gods plan accordingly in separating the "sheep" from the "goats" as it were, altho it will be much the reverse of "as it's professed by himself at that point in time" accordingly

for obvious reasons
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 10:59 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
now if the people are referring to that instant wherein "all will be changed in the blink of an eye" at the 7th Trumpet

such is no rapture, it is exactly as written

a sudden, instantaneous change in the states of our "being"

wherein we go from existing in flesh bodies to no longer existing in flesh bodies "in that blink of an eye"

as no flesh enters into the Millennium which follows
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 11:08 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
we were PROMISED a promised land; HERE ON EARTH.

That promise takes precedence over a rapture (john of patmos really may have just been craaaaazy) I feel.



People need to piss off with the idea of the rapture already and embrace sailing to the promised land instead.

Last Edited by Johnbert.Lennonstein on 08/16/2013 11:09 PM
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:16 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
We Christians who are also religious are sick - mentally - we are sheep and easily deceived. Clearly there are wrong things in the Bible that shouldn't be there. Otherwise, there would not be the warning in the last part of Revelations to anyone who changes it. So, the deal is that there is no rapture. Rapture is a stupid idea. It is not a Godly concept. God would not abandon the masses. The only word of God is that which comes from people. And, at the most critical moment of society, God would not pull his people from this place. He will leave us here to help out. The idea of Rapture is pure selfishness.
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:20 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
My 2 cents on the matter, read the book of revelations.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43150734


"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand."
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:21 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
Sorry but the #1 problem with Christianity is the book of revelation.

 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand."
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:24 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
My 2 cents on the matter, read the book of revelations.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43150734


Hmmm.

You might want to read Revelations.
 Quoting: mikebo2


concerning the book of revelations
 Quoting: ByFaithAlone


It is The Book of Revelation. One. Singular. Not plural. Not Revelations.

If you do not know that minor detail about the title of the book, who likely is it that you really know much about the contents of that book?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45105053
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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08/16/2013 11:27 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
What are you doing AC35246469?
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 11:28 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
My 2 cents on the matter, read the book of revelations.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43150734


"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand."
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35246469


You do realize that anyone could write down shit like that and claim it's prophecy; right?

The fact that he makes claims like that, only makes it more unbelievable.

Name on prophecy in the entire bible that reads like that.

Last Edited by Johnbert.Lennonstein on 08/16/2013 11:30 PM
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:30 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
Sorry but the #1 problem with Christianity is the book of revelation.

The sooner people stop thinking about that book, stop teaching that book, and fuck even stop talking about that book; the sooner the world will become a better place.

The biggest problem with "christians" is that half of htem are hypocrites who don't actually take my Master's words seriously.

They just simply care about paying lip-service and doing things which they feel will impress the father in order to keep them safe during the second coming.

A good majority of them don't actually care about ALL of human life; they are only in it for some sort of comfort in the belief of an eternal paradise; which is kind of fucked up, considering that Yeshua himself said that heaven would pass away.

Acting like Christ is enough.

He was a briliant man, who taught a beautiful philosophy. Taking concern with the afterlife, instead of taking pleasure in just living the word is a big big problem with that religion.

If he came back he would likely shame every one of the hypocrites who live for the sake of their own salvation, rather than living for the well-being of their neighbors.

He would likely tell people that he didn't even want to be worshiped or have a religion named after him. He wanted people to worship his father, yet for some reason he became the center of attention.

He would likely put his most "devout" and "righteous" zealots into everlasting contempt.

Everlasting meaning just an age; or likely a lifetime.

Daniel 12:
2“Many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake, these to everlasting life, but the others to disgrace and everlasting contempt.3“Those who have insight will shine brightly like the brightness of the expanse of heaven, and those who lead the many to righteousness, like the stars forever and ever.4“But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the book until the end of time; many will go back and forth, and knowledge will increase.”
 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


There is and can be no legitimate disagreement with anything and everything you say.

You know everything. You are correct about everything.

Your understanding is perfect.

You are the true Christian. You understand the truths of Christ.

If anyone disagrees with you, they do not understand.

Thank you, thank you, thank you for being with us and speaking to us and teaching us.

In fact, are you sure you're not really the real Christ?
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:32 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
My 2 cents on the matter, read the book of revelations.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43150734


"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand."
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35246469


You do realize that anyone could write down shit like that and claim it's prophecy; right?

The fact that he makes claims like that, only makes it more unbelievable.

Name on prophecy in the entire bible that reads like that.
 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


You are free not to believe it.

I believe it.


I guess you believe in a God that cannot get a Book to us because Man must be superior to God.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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08/16/2013 11:33 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
We Christians who are also religious are sick - mentally - we are sheep and easily deceived. Clearly there are wrong things in the Bible that shouldn't be there. Otherwise, there would not be the warning in the last part of Revelations to anyone who changes it. So, the deal is that there is no rapture. Rapture is a stupid idea. It is not a Godly concept. God would not abandon the masses. The only word of God is that which comes from people. And, at the most critical moment of society, God would not pull his people from this place. He will leave us here to help out. The idea of Rapture is pure selfishness.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45271723


Thank you for your thoughts. People believe so many things scripture based or not. I have spoken to one that believes all will be raptured and the 144,000 are actually sent back here to preach and teach during the end times untouchable because they have been sealed. Where they got that I have no idea but they were very firm in their belief.
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:38 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
We Christians who are also religious are sick - mentally - we are sheep and easily deceived. Clearly there are wrong things in the Bible that shouldn't be there. Otherwise, there would not be the warning in the last part of Revelations to anyone who changes it. So, the deal is that there is no rapture. Rapture is a stupid idea. It is not a Godly concept. God would not abandon the masses. The only word of God is that which comes from people. And, at the most critical moment of society, God would not pull his people from this place. He will leave us here to help out. The idea of Rapture is pure selfishness.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45271723


It is The Book of Revelation. One. Singular. Not plural. Not Revelations.

If you do not know that minor detail about the title of the book, who likely is it that you really know much about the contents of that book?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45105053


Would do 3 out of 4 Christians not even get this correct?!
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08/16/2013 11:39 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
^^ Why do 3 out of 4 Christians not even get this correct?!
-GLP-Christian-

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08/16/2013 11:39 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
its my understanding that the 144,000 is the remnant of Israel - the last remaining Jewish Christians that are on the earth at the time of the rapture.

has nothing to do with saved gentile Christians

billions of people will be saved as long as they have Christ

(havent read the whole thread, but wanted to clear that up.)
 Quoting: Salt


It's not just an understanding the text is clear.
It says there's 144000 Jewish virgins that has come to Jesus Christ and will be evangelists to the World during the time of Jacob's trouble (Israel's trouble) what is also called the Tribulation, but the proper term is Jacob's trouble when the world will be in turmoil and basically most of the world will hate on Israel (we can see the build up to this right now).

Re 7:1 ¶ And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
Re 7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
Re 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
Re 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
Re 7:5 Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand.
Re 7:6 Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nepthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand.
Re 7:7 Of the tribe of Simeon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand.
Re 7:8 Of the tribe of Zabulon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.

Re 14:1 ¶ And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
Re 14:2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
Re 14:3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
Re 14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
Re 14:5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.

they're a very special group of guys.
The main reason people are confused is they use Alexandrian bibles, those that Egyptian gnostics altered.
People should use Antioch Bibles like the King James (The New King James is an Alexandrian one, it's title is a lie, it is not a King James Bible)

Here's a simple explanation of it:
[link to www.letusreason.org]

----------------------

Anyway back to the Rapture since it is what concerns us because that is the next step on the time table.

Some more things to ponder:
[link to raptureready.com]
[link to raptureready.com]
[link to according2prophecy.org]
[link to khouse.org]
[link to khouse.org]
[link to khouse.org]
[link to khouse.org]
Get saved wretch: [link to biblebelievers.com]
Everything you need to know about islam: [link to prophetofdoom.net]
The Jihad Triangle: [link to www.youtube.com (secure)]

FRANCE IS TEH GHEY!
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08/16/2013 11:42 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
Sorry but the #1 problem with Christianity is the book of revelation.

The sooner people stop thinking about that book, stop teaching that book, and fuck even stop talking about that book; the sooner the world will become a better place.
 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


Exquisite - this is a great point. It's like we've underlined all the dirty parts in the book. We're addicted to armchair sensationalism. If we could set aside the whole "end of the world" mentality and learn to become Christlike as we walk with Him, everything else will take care of itself.
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
we were PROMISED a promised land; HERE ON EARTH.

That promise takes precedence over a rapture (john of patmos really may have just been craaaaazy) I feel.



People need to piss off with the idea of the rapture already and embrace sailing to the promised land instead.
 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


That land will be given to God's people. Heaven is not the end game.

Revelation 21:1-4
1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. 2 Then I, John,[a] saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. 4 And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.”
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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08/16/2013 11:43 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
^^ Why do 3 out of 4 Christians not even get this correct?!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35246469


1dunno1 Maybe they are on tablet like I am with a keyboard too small and not native speaking english? Only matters if it is a limit in understanding and not a mistake so.....

Personally I would like to see the spelling issues dropped in this thread as I said before. It is very insulting when you do so not understanding with the limits of the internet.
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08/16/2013 11:45 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
the world will be in turmoil and basically most of the world will hate on Israel (we can see the build up to this right now).
 Quoting: -GLP-Christian-


Why, oh why would anyone hate Israel?
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
its my understanding that the 144,000 is the remnant of Israel - the last remaining Jewish Christians that are on the earth at the time of the rapture.

has nothing to do with saved gentile Christians

billions of people will be saved as long as they have Christ

(havent read the whole thread, but wanted to clear that up.)
 Quoting: Salt


It's not just an understanding the text is clear.
It says there's 144000 Jewish virgins that has come to Jesus Christ and will be evangelists to the World during the time of Jacob's trouble (Israel's trouble) what is also called the Tribulation, but the proper term is Jacob's trouble when the world will be in turmoil and basically most of the world will hate on Israel (we can see the build up to this right now).

Re 7:1 ¶ And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
Re 7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
Re 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
Re 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
Re 7:5 Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand.
Re 7:6 Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nepthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand.
Re 7:7 Of the tribe of Simeon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand.
Re 7:8 Of the tribe of Zabulon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.

Re 14:1 ¶ And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
Re 14:2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
Re 14:3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
Re 14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
Re 14:5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.

they're a very special group of guys.
The main reason people are confused is they use Alexandrian bibles, those that Egyptian gnostics altered.
People should use Antioch Bibles like the King James (The New King James is an Alexandrian one, it's title is a lie, it is not a King James Bible)

Here's a simple explanation of it:
[link to www.letusreason.org]

----------------------

Anyway back to the Rapture since it is what concerns us because that is the next step on the time table.

Some more things to ponder:
[link to raptureready.com]
[link to raptureready.com]
[link to according2prophecy.org]
[link to khouse.org]
[link to khouse.org]
[link to khouse.org]
[link to khouse.org]
 Quoting: -GLP-Christian-


Thats how I took it. Never really gave it a second thought even with the imagery we see in this book. Never knew anyone thought any different at all actually until this thread.

Makes me wonder what else could be missed if you mistake something as literal instead of figuratively.
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 11:46 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
we were PROMISED a promised land; HERE ON EARTH.

That promise takes precedence over a rapture (john of patmos really may have just been craaaaazy) I feel.



People need to piss off with the idea of the rapture already and embrace sailing to the promised land instead.
 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


That land will be given to God's people. Heaven is not the end game.

Revelation 21:1-4
1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. 2 Then I, John,[a] saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. 4 And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.”
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13281374


The new jerusalem will be a city without walls.

Zecheriah 2:
1Then I lifted up my eyes and looked, and behold, there was a man with a measuring line in his hand.2So I said, “Where are you going?” And he said to me, “To measure Jerusalem, to see how wide it is and how long it is.”3And behold, the angel who was speaking with me was going out, and another angel was coming out to meet him,4and said to him, “Run, speak to that young man, saying, ‘Jerusalem will be inhabited without walls because of the multitude of men and cattle within it.5‘For I,’ declares the LORD, ‘will be a wall of fire around her, and I will be the glory in her midst.’”



Saracen blood spilled as crosses are rising high
Men giving their lives, for the Holy See they die
Walls surround this golden city like a crown of thorns
Will the wailing ever cease, will we forever mourn?
Behold memories of wars
Are rising as we're building the New Jerusalem
Men and children toil in the blazing sun
Mortar and brick, no walls between father and son
These green and pleasant fields that surround
The city once apart that now is one
Bygone crusades and wasted lives
Are gone as we're breathing the New Jerusalem
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 11:49 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
There is and can be no legitimate disagreement with anything and everything you say.

You know everything. You are correct about everything.

Your understanding is perfect.

You are the true Christian. You understand the truths of Christ.

If anyone disagrees with you, they do not understand.

Thank you, thank you, thank you for being with us and speaking to us and teaching us.

In fact, are you sure you're not really the real Christ?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35246469


I am not the Christ.

But perhaps my knowledge is perfect simply because I give all credit to my maker, and my teacher.

I don't think too much about the things I write, I just let the spirit flow through me, and out of my mouth/fingertips.

Job 32:

32 So these three men stopped answering Job, because he was righteous in his own eyes. 2 But Elihu son of Barakel the Buzite, of the family of Ram, became very angry with Job for justifying himself rather than God. 3 He was also angry with the three friends, because they had found no way to refute Job, and yet had condemned him.[a] 4 Now Elihu had waited before speaking to Job because they were older than he. 5 But when he saw that the three men had nothing more to say, his anger was aroused.

6 So Elihu son of Barakel the Buzite said:

“I am young in years,
and you are old;
that is why I was fearful,
not daring to tell you what I know.
7 I thought, ‘Age should speak;
advanced years should teach wisdom.’
8 But it is the spirit in a person,
the breath of the Almighty, that gives them understanding.
9 It is not only the old[c] who are wise,
not only the aged who understand what is right.
10 “Therefore I say: Listen to me;
I too will tell you what I know.
11 I waited while you spoke,
I listened to your reasoning;
while you were searching for words,
12 I gave you my full attention.
But not one of you has proved Job wrong;
none of you has answered his arguments.
13 Do not say, ‘We have found wisdom;
let God, not a man, refute him.’
14 But Job has not marshaled his words against me,
and I will not answer him with your arguments.
15 “They are dismayed and have no more to say;
words have failed them.
16 Must I wait, now that they are silent,
now that they stand there with no reply?
17 I too will have my say;
I too will tell what I know.
18 For I am full of words,
and the spirit within me compels me;
19 inside I am like bottled-up wine,
like new wineskins ready to burst.
20 I must speak and find relief;
I must open my lips and reply.
21 I will show no partiality,
nor will I flatter anyone;
22 for if I were skilled in flattery,
my Maker would soon take me away.
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
Anonymous Coward
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08/16/2013 11:49 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
Johnbert.Lennonstein

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08/16/2013 11:56 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
basically I am really

REALLY

fucking sick of people doubting Gods plans; and I'm really sick of them thinking that he would forsake any of his children.

People are trying to justify themselves, their own actions, their own beliefs; instead of trying to justify The Almighty.
Go in peace, and find thy faith, evolve thyself, and lose all hate... so a heaven, you may create...
AC437
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08/16/2013 11:57 PM
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Re: Christians Only....Your thoughts on the rapture
Sorry but the #1 problem with Christianity is the book of revelation.

The sooner people stop thinking about that book, stop teaching that book, and fuck even stop talking about that book; the sooner the world will become a better place.

 Quoting: Johnbert.Lennonstein


If you read the books of Zechariah and Daniel you would see they contain almost the exact same vistions as Revelation.

Revelation is also like the story of Exodus.

In Exodus Moses witnesses to Israel and Israel is spared from the plagues. Israel is told to flee Egypt on eagle wings and is brought to God. Exodus 19:4

In Revelation a remnant of Israel (144K) will witness to the multitude of people. Israel is told to flee Babylon this time. The 144K will be spared from the plagues and many will come to believe. God will save Israel (Remnant) with Eagle Wings. See Revelation 12. Israel and the multitude come to God. The people themself will be the tabernacle of God with Christ at the head of the Church. God does not dwell in a church made by hand but in the body of his people.





GLP