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The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!

 
HollywoodDazzler1

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08/22/2013 11:14 AM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
From biblegateway.com NIV 2Peter 3:14 So then, dear friends, since you are looking forward to this, make every effort to be found spotless, blameless and at peace with him. 15 Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. 16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.

17 Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position. 18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and forever! Amen.

So whom should we believe? Someone as scripturally ignorant as yourself or an apostle who had the power to bind and loose things on Heaven and earth vested in him by Christ himself?
 Quoting: Jesus Christ is the way


THIS^^
“Knock, And He'll open the door
Vanish, And He'll make you shine like the sun
Fall, And He'll raise you to the heavens
Become nothing, And He'll turn you into everything.”
-Rumi

"Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you."
-Jesus (luke 17:21)
4Q529

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529

Please provide scripture...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


Read the reply of Jesus to the Sadducees in the Gospel of Matthew and the Gospel of Luke for the explanation of the term "the resurrection". (See, also, Chapter 27, verses 52-53 of the Gospel of Matthew.)

Read the Revelation of John for the term "synagogue of Satan".

Then use your brain.

Michael
4Q529

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08/22/2013 11:19 AM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Otherwise, you will be cooking and frying and crying in hell forever and ever!!
 Quoting: moses787 41084500


According to Chapter 28 of Deuteronomy, all rewards and punishments for the observance and the transgression of the Law are received in this world.

Nor can you tell me on which of the 6 days of Creation God Created the metaphysical 'heaven' and 'hell'...

Because He never did Create such things because He was not in need of them, having Power over this world to reward and punish people.

Michael
4Q529

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08/22/2013 11:23 AM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
The Great and Magnificent Super Michael 4Q529,

Who do YOU say that Jesus Christ is?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45544474


Who do YOU say that Mohammed is...

Who testified that Jesus was the messiah?

What makes the most difference about both Jesus and Mohammed is not who they were, but what they taught.

Michael

Last Edited by 4Q529 on 08/22/2013 11:25 AM
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 12:41 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529

Please provide scripture...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


Read the reply of Jesus to the Sadducees in the Gospel of Matthew and the Gospel of Luke for the explanation of the term "the resurrection". (See, also, Chapter 27, verses 52-53 of the Gospel of Matthew.)

Read the Revelation of John for the term "synagogue of Satan".

Then use your brain.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


That is not what was asked. You claim that Paul taught "the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave"

Provide scripture please.
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 12:46 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529

Please provide scripture...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


Read the reply of Jesus to the Sadducees in the Gospel of Matthew and the Gospel of Luke for the explanation of the term "the resurrection". (See, also, Chapter 27, verses 52-53 of the Gospel of Matthew.)

Read the Revelation of John for the term "synagogue of Satan".

Then use your brain.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


Matthew and Luke were not penned by Paul.
Revelation was not penned by Paul.

STOP muddying the water and tell me where PAUL said anything you claimed that resulted in the holocaust.

Use your brain
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 12:55 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
The Great and Magnificent Super Michael 4Q529,

Who do YOU say that Jesus Christ is?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45544474


Who do YOU say that Mohammed is...

Who testified that Jesus was the messiah?

What makes the most difference about both Jesus and Mohammed is not who they were, but what they taught.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


Why would a Christian believe anything that Muhammad taught?

HE HAD ONE LEFT TO SEND, A SON, WHOM HE LOVED. He sent him LAST OF ALL, saying, "They will respect my son." But the tenants said to one another, "THIS IS THE HEIR. Come, let's kill him, and the inheritance will be ours." So they took him and killed him, and threw him out of the vineyard

Please tell us, did the very Son of God forget to tell us something? So much so that he needed to send yet another prophet? A prophet that denied that Jesus Christ "is the Truth, the Way and the Life"?
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 01:03 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
The Great and Magnificent Super Michael 4Q529,

Who do YOU say that Jesus Christ is?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45544474


Who do YOU say that Mohammed is...

Who testified that Jesus was the messiah?

What makes the most difference about both Jesus and Mohammed is not who they were, but what they taught.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


Wrong again mickey.

What is important about them both is not what they taught, but who they were.

One is God incarnate.
The other a demonic counterfit.
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 01:21 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
God is not retarded and unable to watch over His word. The bible would be utterly corrupted and useless if what OP said were true. It isn't.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 40487804


Why are there several versions of the Bible right now?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1416114


Because there are slight differences in words between languages.

There are not different books proclaiming different messages.

Can you understand this?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45544474


But there are different Bibles that are using the aame langauge.
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 01:24 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
God is not retarded and unable to watch over His word. The bible would be utterly corrupted and useless if what OP said were true. It isn't.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 40487804


Why are there several versions of the Bible right now?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1416114


Because there are slight differences in words between languages.

There are not different books proclaiming different messages.

Can you understand this?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45544474


But there are different Bibles that are using the aame langauge.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1416114


One reason is any swinging dick reprobate like ol mickey can publish a book and call it a bible.

The KJV is all you need.
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 01:30 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529

Please provide scripture...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


Read the reply of Jesus to the Sadducees in the Gospel of Matthew and the Gospel of Luke for the explanation of the term "the resurrection". (See, also, Chapter 27, verses 52-53 of the Gospel of Matthew.)

Read the Revelation of John for the term "synagogue of Satan".

Then use your brain.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


"Since, then, you have been raised with Christ"
"If then ye were raised together with Christ"

Which means we were dead spiritually and made alive spiritually. We were raised from the dead. We are living a resurrected life, now.

"Your life is now hidden with Christ in God."
"When Christ, who is your life, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory"

Jesus Christ was hidden in God whilst on Earth until He was glorified.
His saints, likewise are hidden in Christ with God. They too, will be glorified with Him.
Both will come together.

Please tell us where Paul preached the "Egyptian god of the dead resurrection"?
4Q529

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08/22/2013 01:44 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Please tell us, did the very Son of God forget to tell us something? So much so that he needed to send yet another prophet? A prophet that denied that Jesus Christ "is the Truth, the Way and the Life"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45557573


Why capitalize "son of God"?

According to Jesus, the children of the resurrection are the "sons of God". His words.

No, he did not forget to tell you.

You forgot to listen.

Jesus said that Elijah had "already come" (his words)--i.e, John the Baptist--and that he would "come again" (his words).

But you don't care what Jesus said.

You take Paul's interpretation of the reply of Jesus to the Sadducees.

Michael
4Q529

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Please tell us where Paul preached the "Egyptian god of the dead resurrection"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45557573


You tell me.

I don't read Paul. I used to know, though.

Did not Paul interpret the physical resurrection of Jesus as a validation of the Doctrine of "resurrection"?

The doctrine of a physical raising of a dead body from the grave was expropriated from the Egyptian 'god of the dead' religion.

That is why Jesus repudiated that doctrine in Chapter 20, verse 38 of the Gospel of Luke.

Michael
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
[link to www.justgivemethetruth.com]

The Apostle Paul Was A Deceiver!

He was Satan In The Flesh! An Antichrist!

Matthew 24:4-5 states you will be deceived by people that come using Jesus’ name. Consider the parable of the sower. Jesus was warning us then that as soon as His Gospel was preached, the enemy (Paul) would be there to steal the truth!


***The real (untranslated) name of Jesus is Y'hoshua (pronounced like the name Joshua but with a Y, YoHoshua, some pronounce his name as Yeshua). All refer to the Son of God who came as the promised Messiah who died on the cross for our sins and rose again.

Now before you throw a tantrum and wonder why I haven't been struck by lightening straight from the throne room of God, I can prove to you that Paul was a Fraud using his own words. Of course, if you're a female, and you're in the ministry, you already know he was, you probably just didn't realize it! For to be a female and in the ministry of the Lord, you had to turn your back on Paul to follow Jesus. Congrats! You figured it out! You refused to buy into the lie pie Satan tried to sell you as Paul!

I'm going to make some startling points to wake your mind up into the truth, so hear me out, then I'll go through and explain each one and give you all the proof you need to see for yourself that what I'm saying is indeed the truth.

Paul was Satan in the Flesh

Paul was never recognized as an apostle by the Disciples OR Jesus

Paul was never trained by the disciples, the men who walked, talked, and broke bread with our Saviour. He received his knowledge from "revelations."

Paul's account of his Damascus Road Experience changed every time he told it, thus the disciples knew he was lying.

Paul declared he was teaching another Gospel of which he himself was the Father

Paul declared he himself was the son of God

Paul issued his own commandments and laws for people to adhere to

Paul taught the exact Opposite of what Jesus and His real disciples did.

Paul worked to destroy and undo everything Jesus and His disciples did and were doing.

Paul was never repentant for being the greatest persecutor of Christians at that time! He boasted about it! Over and Over!

Paul said God's law was a Curse. Jesus said it was a blessing. Who's lying?

Paul condemned Jesus and His disciples for false teachings, he condemned Jesus Himself for having long hair in 1 Corinthians 11:14, something approved in Numbers 6:5 and Judges 13:5.

Jesus Said: Keep the Sabbath (Mark 2:27), circumcise male children (Luke 2:21), Paul Said: Circumcision is not necessary (Romans 2:26) that is going against what the Christ said in Luke 2:21.

In 1 Corinthians 15:1 Paul says that he was not giving them anything but what “he preached.” He explained this even further in the second book (or letter) to the Corinthians (2 Corinthians 11:17). It reads - “That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord, but as it were foolishly, in this confidence of boasting.” He's telling you plain and simple he was speaking of himself and not from or of the Lord!"

Paul cursed Jesus and His disciples

Paul claimed he himself was the son of God

Paul Supported and demanded Adherence to Iniquity (Discrimination), Jesus said to not let it be found among us! Who's lying?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 510799



Peter most definitely credentialed Paul and if that is not enough to make you at least search the rest of Gods proofs that Paul is legit.. Well then you are obviously blinded for your own protection. Proof that God loves you which you will be shown at a later time.

But in the interim since you feel like you have all the answers. Why don't consider for yourself why you don't know what the key of the house of David is? Certainly you should know something as important as that if you are in tune with Gods plan..

Consider this reproof in Love.
Raymantheheretic

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08/22/2013 02:33 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Look for my replies in red
Alexander The Great & chauchat needed to get a room to hash out the minutia of the Law rather than trashing this thread with it.

Sheesh, almost three solid pages way off topic. Enough to make one think it was deliberately contrived as a smokescreen uhoh
 Quoting: Raymantheheretic


I guess I should feel flattered, if you're saying I helped contrive a smokescreen? Not smart enough to be that devious, even if I wanted to be.
'Sides,“I have not sat with men of untruth; and with those who hide what they are I do not come in.” (Psalm 26:4) What is meant by “those who hide what they are”? Some Bible translations here read “hypocrites.” As one reference work notes, this expression can be applied to “those who hide their purposes or designs from others, or who conceal their real character and intentions.” [link to wol.jw.org]

Why is it minutia[e]?
But actually, seems to me if ,as you claim, Paul can, no, MUST be thrown out of the Bible, what's to stop you from dismissing anything else you don't like or don't understand?

It's not our fault OP disappeared. And ATG's claiming we're still under the law covenant seems a big part of the whole anti-Paul bandwagon's resentment of Paul.
Paul clarified how and why no one is still under the law-covenant.
 Quoting: chauchat


You guessed wrong on multiple counts. No contriving on either side, only partaking. Possible on ATG's side but not likely on a conscious level. People hide what they are even from themselves. The behavior is as if the matter of Paul had been firmly dealt with so the better informed less clouded minds could move on and argue more substantial issues like the abominable status of pork and shrimp.
 Quoting: Raymantheheretic


I would say your manner and that of the other anti-Paulians is as if the matter of Paul has been firmly dealt with by "the better informed less clouded minds" and all that remains is to post the denunciations and link to the sites where the "better-informed" post the same [to me baffling] accusations over and over, and then sit back and collect your accolades from others who "just had a bad feeling" too about Paul and "thank you sooo much for the "facts" about Paul, and for your incredible bravery in posting them!"
Tit for tat I suppose is fair but maybe I should remind you I was speaking in the context of you and ATG essentially hijacking the thread off topic.

I'll re-post the links I suggested if need be since you obviously never read either because your statements based on them are patently untrue. They contain similar charges as stated here but along with heaping portions of Bible Old and New Testament quotations and references. jesuswordsonly.com breaks down almost all of Paul's books in detail to substantiate the charges. Seek and ye shall find.

Maybe in your own mind we truly are collecting accolades but suspect this is just more smoke from you since that "incredible bravery" bit is pure fabrication.

Are you getting the tiny picture yet?
While where Paul stands on the Law is huge to some it's more of giant sign or red flag to me. If you haven't thoroughly mastered the golden rule, which seems to include everyone one of us to some degree, the other 600 or so rules for living a good life and a maintaining a healthy society don't matter so much. Keeping in mind all of the Law is for our benefit, not God's, we've no honest incentive for holding various facets of the Law over the head of others in order to measure and improve their Godly performance...
 Quoting: Raymantheheretic


I really don't know how to respond to this. You seem to be addressing Alexander the Great's position , not mine. I've been quoting scripture to show that the law covenant is no longer in effect. Were you trying to grant me a concession by stating something you know I agree with? If so ,I'm sorry I interpreted it as a lecture, on something of which you maybe want readers to infer I'm guilty .

It applies to your "Why is it minutia?" question and your misplaced view of its relevance in the larger picture. It's not about about you, ATG or me and I have no intention of being further sidetracked by it at this time.

Oh man, now you got me doing it, argh...

I suggest you take up bible editing with someone who advocates it. Which is not me. Paul is the text book example of what happens when we allow a mere man to speak for God and the horrors that follow i.e. Revelations. On my life I would never choose to remove a single sentence of his inflammatory highly convoluted doublespeak. I just want people to see it for what is.
 Quoting: Raymantheheretic


Then you should be delighted I mostly posted Paul's writings so readers can see for themselves, as you believe they will, ""his inflammatory highly convoluted doublespeak.""

It's fascinating to me what you defenders of Paul choose to leave out when coming to his aid with Bible quotes. Perhaps I'll highlight a few prime examples down the road if I run into someone who is actually trying to grasp the truth. Which so far it doesn't seem to include you
"Paul clarified how and why no one is still under the law-covenant"

Right, yeah. Clear as evil dark viscous goo which you and ATG proved for going on three pages now.

'The Law is a curse!'
'All things are lawful unto me!'
'Should I break the Law? God forbid!'

[:woops- conscious not conscience]
 Quoting: Raymantheheretic


I grant you "clarified" in connection with Paul probably sounds crazy to most ppl. But he does clarify the matter for me, beautifully, and I'm definitely not alone in feeling that way about it, and in being very grateful to God for all scripture.

It doesn't sound crazy it is crazy when two people with the same words in front of them end up with polarized positions arguing endlessly. That is only a sample of Paul's magic spell. But still you somehow don't see it.
 Quoting: chauchat

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Please tell us where Paul preached the "Egyptian god of the dead resurrection"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45557573


You tell me.

I don't read Paul. I used to know, though.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


cruise

Spewing bullshit with no evidence? I guess you are in the right place.
chauchat

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529



According to Josephus the ""Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine""[<quoting 4Q529] was reincarnation.

"The Jewish Pharisees said that “the souls of good men only are removed into other bodies”?" (Wars of the Jews, Josephus, Book II, chap. VIII, par. 14)
4Q529

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529



According to Josephus the ""Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine""[<quoting 4Q529] was reincarnation.

"The Jewish Pharisees said that “the souls of good men only are removed into other bodies”?" (Wars of the Jews, Josephus, Book II, chap. VIII, par. 14)
 Quoting: chauchat


Well, Paul was a Pharisee; and he didn't believe that.

In any case, you have chosen to take the word of Josephus--who, by the way, was not the "Son of man"--rather than the explanation of Jesus?

Okey, dokey.

Michael
4Q529

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Please tell us where Paul preached the "Egyptian god of the dead resurrection"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45557573


You tell me.

I don't read Paul. I used to know, though.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


..no evidence?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


OK OK

I Corinthians 15:35-53.

The only real difference between this body and the body that is 'raised from the dead', according to Paul, is that the body that is 'raised from the dead' is imperishable; i.e., has eternal life.

There is NO such doctrine in either the Torah or the Prophets or the Teaching of Jesus.

What happened to the body of Lazarus?

He died.

What happened to the body of the daughter of Jairus?

She died.

What happened to all of those bodies 'raised from the dead' in Chapter 27, verse 52-53 of the Gospel of Matthew?

Nothing.

That is a figurative description of the revelation of the memories of previous lives; there being NO historical record of any such occurrence...by Josephus, for example.

Michael

Last Edited by 4Q529 on 08/22/2013 03:06 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529



According to Josephus the ""Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine""[<quoting 4Q529] was reincarnation.

"The Jewish Pharisees said that “the souls of good men only are removed into other bodies”?" (Wars of the Jews, Josephus, Book II, chap. VIII, par. 14)
 Quoting: chauchat


This is patently false and relies upon an insufficiently nuanced reading of Josephus, who reports Jewish beliefs in Greek terms for the benefit of his Gentile readers. Josephus says that the Pharisees believe that "the souls of good men only are removed into other bodies, but that the souls of bad men are subject to eternal punishment." (War 2.164) Not only is this contrary to reincarnation principles (as it undermines the idea of karma: bad men do not get another body of a lower form), it misunderstands "other bodies" -- which is a reference to the resurrection body.
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Please tell us where Paul preached the "Egyptian god of the dead resurrection"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45557573


You tell me.

I don't read Paul. I used to know, though.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


..no evidence?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


OK OK

I Corinthians 15:35-53.

The only real difference between this body and the body that is 'raised from the dead', according to Paul, is that the body that is 'raised from the dead' is imperishable; i.e., has eternal life.

There is NO such doctrine in either the Torah or the Prophets or the Teaching of Jesus.

What happened to the body of Lazarus?

He died.

What happened to the body of the daughter of Jairus?

She died.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


You confuse Jesus raising the dead with ressurection bodies.

The resurrection bodies are imperishable.
chauchat

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Look for my replies in red
I grant you "clarified" in connection with Paul probably sounds crazy to most ppl. But he does clarify the matter for me, beautifully, and I'm definitely not alone in feeling that way about it, and in being very grateful to God for all scripture.

It doesn't sound crazy it is crazy when two people with the same words in front of them end up with polarized positions arguing endlessly. That is only a sample of Paul's magic spell. But still you somehow don't see it.
 Quoting: chauchat

 Quoting: Raymantheheretic


It doesn't seem to me that there were any " two people with the same words in front of them" participating in this thread until I posted some of Paul's writings. You complained about that, saying it was minutia[e].
4Q529

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
The resurrection bodies are imperishable.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


Tell me where it states this in the Torah; which is where Jesus said the Sadducees should find the answer to their question.

Michael
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
I have heard it has been proven Paul didn't write book of Hebrews.
Keep2theCode

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08/22/2013 03:29 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
I have heard it has been proven Paul didn't write book of Hebrews.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45265819


He didn't. The writer of Hebrews refers to "those who have seen our Lord", but Paul saw him.
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
chauchat

User ID: 10858311
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08/22/2013 03:37 PM

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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
You forgot to specify his most important lie: He taught the Egyptian 'god of the dead'-Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine of the physical raising of a dead body from the grave, in opposition to the Revelation of "the resurrection" consisting of the Revelation of the Memory of Creation and the revelation of the memories of previous lives.

It was that lie that led directly to the Holocaust.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529



According to Josephus the ""Pharisaical ("synagogue of Satan") doctrine""[<quoting 4Q529] was reincarnation.

"The Jewish Pharisees said that “the souls of good men only are removed into other bodies”?" (Wars of the Jews, Josephus, Book II, chap. VIII, par. 14)
 Quoting: chauchat


This is patently false and relies upon an insufficiently nuanced reading of Josephus, who reports Jewish beliefs in Greek terms for the benefit of his Gentile readers. Josephus says that the Pharisees believe that "the souls of good men only are removed into other bodies, but that the souls of bad men are subject to eternal punishment." (War 2.164) Not only is this contrary to reincarnation principles (as it undermines the idea of karma: bad men do not get another body of a lower form), it misunderstands "other bodies" -- which is a reference to the resurrection body.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752

This is the best thing I've read about the law of karma and has formed my understanding of it.

"Amoral, Senseless and Hopeless.



Since reincarnation is a belief basic to witchcraft, it is not surprising that it is amoral. Instead of solving the problem of evil, it perpetuates it. If a husband beats his wife, the cause-and-effect law of karma decrees that he must be reincarnated as a wife who is beaten by her husband. That husband (who will have been prepared by his karma to be a wife beater) will in turn have to come back as a wife beaten by her husband, and so forth endlessly. The perpetrator of each crime must become the victim of the same crime, which necessitates another perpetrator, who in turn must become a subsequent victim at the hands of another ad infinitum, ad absurdum. Rather than solving the problem of evil, karma and reincarnation perpetuate it. Think of the evil that must yet be perpetrated upon future reincarnations of Hitler…"



Alan: And we add all the rest to that too, Stalin and all the rest of them.



"…in order to pay for his crimes! With few alleged exceptions, the average person has no recollection of the many past lives that he or she has supposedly lived. Without any memory of previous mistakes and lessons learned, what is the point of living again and again only to bear the burden of bad karma and the dire consequences of deeds one cannot remember? It's argued that subconsciously we have such memories (which can be induced and dealt with through hypnotherapy) and are thus benefiting at an unconscious level. If that were true, we should see evidence that humans individually and collectively, are living better more divine lives. That is patently not the case. Reincarnation is thus a senseless philosophy.



That reincarnation is also hopeless follows logically. The karma built up in the present life must be worked off in a future reincarnation. But in the process of working it off, more karma is accumulated, which must in turn be worked off in the next life and so forth endlessly. This is why the Hindu speaks of the wheel of reincarnation and why Gandhi called reincarnation "a burden too great to bear." There's no release; it goes on forever. Yoga was developed as a means of escape from this endless wheel of death and rebirth, but whether it actually is or not must be taken by faith. And faith and efficacy of amoral and senseless laws whose existence is not supported by the facts but appear to be misplaced." [link to cuttingthroughthematrix.com]
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 04:00 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
The resurrection bodies are imperishable.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


Tell me where it states this in the Torah; which is where Jesus said the Sadducees should find the answer to their question.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


Why do you lean on the Torah exclusivly? Cherry picking?

“But your dead will live; their bodies will rise. You who dwell in the dust wake up and shout for joy. Your dew is like the dew of the morning; the earth will give birth to her dead” (Isa. 26:19); and Daniel: “Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt” (Dan. 12:2); and Job: “I know that my Redeemer lives, and that in the end He will stand upon the earth. And after my skin has been destroyed, yet in my flesh I will see God; I myself will see Him with my own eyes—I, and not another. How my heart yearns within me!” (Job 19:25–27); and the Psalmist: “But God will redeem my life from the grave; He will surely take me to Himself” (Ps. 49:15).
4Q529

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08/22/2013 04:22 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
The resurrection bodies are imperishable.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


Tell me where it states this in the Torah; which is where Jesus said the Sadducees should find the answer to their question.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


Why do you lean on the Torah exclusivly? Cherry picking?

“But your dead will live; their bodies will rise. You who dwell in the dust wake up and shout for joy. Your dew is like the dew of the morning; the earth will give birth to her dead” (Isa. 26:19)....
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42022752


(Sigh.)

What do these words MEAN?

(That is what Jesus explains in his reply to the Sadducees.)

Isaiah also wrote "For precept must be upon precept..."

On what precept are these words to be interpreted literally as a physical raising of a dead body from the grave...

Especially when that is what the Egyptians believed?

And what is the MEANING of "secret and sealed" in Chapter 12, verse 9 of the Book of Daniel if the meaning of "the resurrection" is known by EVERYONE?

A Revealed Truth is something that cannot be arrived at by the human intellect.

How is it possible, then, that the Egyptians could have believed in the same "resurrection" as Isaiah believed in? They cannot both be Revelations.

All of this is clarified in the reply of Jesus to the Sadducees...

Something that the Christians REFUSE to discuss point by point for fear that their nonsensical doctrine will collapse; which it will.

Michael
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2013 04:26 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
Paul and organite... I love Sherry a lot, but these subjects are still challenging for me to swallow...

anonstoner
4Q529

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08/22/2013 04:28 PM
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Re: The biggest blunder in the church for years!! The Paul Deception!
This is the best thing I've read about the law of karma and has formed my understanding of it.

"Amoral, Senseless and Hopeless.

Since reincarnation is a belief basic to witchcraft, it is not surprising that it is amoral. Instead of solving the problem of evil, it perpetuates it. If a husband beats his wife, the cause-and-effect law of karma decrees that he must be reincarnated as a wife who is beaten by her husband. That husband (who will have been prepared by his karma to be a wife beater) will in turn have to come back as a wife beaten by her husband, and so forth endlessly. The perpetrator of each crime must become the victim of the same crime, which necessitates another perpetrator, who in turn must become a subsequent victim at the hands of another ad infinitum, ad absurdum. Rather than solving the problem of evil, karma and reincarnation perpetuate it. Think of the evil that must yet be perpetrated upon future reincarnations of Hitler…"

Alan: And we add all the rest to that too, Stalin and all the rest of them.

"…in order to pay for his crimes! With few alleged exceptions, the average person has no recollection of the many past lives that he or she has supposedly lived. Without any memory of previous mistakes and lessons learned, what is the point of living again and again only to bear the burden of bad karma and the dire consequences of deeds one cannot remember? It's argued that subconsciously we have such memories (which can be induced and dealt with through hypnotherapy) and are thus benefiting at an unconscious level. If that were true, we should see evidence that humans individually and collectively, are living better more divine lives. That is patently not the case. Reincarnation is thus a senseless philosophy.

That reincarnation is also hopeless follows logically. The karma built up in the present life must be worked off in a future reincarnation. But in the process of working it off, more karma is accumulated, which must in turn be worked off in the next life and so forth endlessly. This is why the Hindu speaks of the wheel of reincarnation and why Gandhi called reincarnation "a burden too great to bear." There's no release; it goes on forever. Yoga was developed as a means of escape from this endless wheel of death and rebirth, but whether it actually is or not must be taken by faith. And faith and efficacy of amoral and senseless laws whose existence is not supported by the facts but appear to be misplaced." [link to cuttingthroughthematrix.com]
 Quoting: chauchat


I don't believe in re-incarnation or karma.

The Doctrine is called "resurrection". It is in accordance with Deuteronomy Chapter 28, in which God rewards and punishes people in this world for the observance and the transgression of the Law.

You can argue theoretically to your heart's desire about how terrible the living of numerous lives is.

But you might as well yell against the roaring of the sea.

Memories of previous lives are real.

Michael

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