More Biblical Proof we are living the days spoken by the Prophet Daniel!

yes i do... cause that's what the OT says. why would i want to free myself from the law? it is not to be changed until mashiach comes, even jesus said don't touch the law. good work paul.

there are laws and instructions that tell us what to do if sacrifice is not possible, and it even says that sacrificing alone does not count! and it is said that it should be backed with true repentance and good deeds.
without it the sacrifice means nothing.

and repentance means doing the law!

jesus is not the mashiach that changed to law, and i proved this few posts up... and in many other places to.

there are laws for what to do, when sacrifice is impossible i already mentioned some them here.

jesus didn't lead you out of jail... how is your life a slave to the paganic old world order of the RCC different than my life?

every one WILL SEE AND KNOW when salvation occur! you don't see you sins forgiven when you take up jesus... you don't! you choose to believe it.

its an allegory of one man for one nation...

pharoa release Israel my SON (not plural) my first born.

keep watching, he gets to it.

The prophecies that cover what Jesus will do go back a very long way.

Lu:24:27:
And beginning at Moses and all the prophets,
he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

De:4:27:
And the LORD shall scatter you among the nations,
and ye shall be left few in number among the heathen, whither the LORD shall lead you.
De:4:28:
And there ye shall serve gods,
the work of men's hands,
wood and stone,
which neither see,
nor hear,
nor eat,
nor smell.
De:4:29:
But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God,
thou shalt find him,
if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.
De:4:30:
When thou art in tribulation,
and all these things are come upon thee,
even in the latter days,
if thou turn to the LORD thy God,
and shalt be obedient unto his voice;
De:4:31:
(For the LORD thy God is a merciful God;)
he will not forsake thee,
neither destroy thee,
nor forget the covenant of thy fathers which he sware unto them.

Lu:21:24:
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword,
and shall be led away captive into all nations:
and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles,
until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Lu:21:25:
And there shall be signs in the sun,
and in the moon,
and in the stars;
and upon the earth distress of nations,
with perplexity;
the sea and the waves roaring;

Verse 25 jumps up to Re:11 and the 42 months that the Gentiles have left before there are changes made. When the two witnesses die Satan has control for 3 1/2 days to 'play god'. The trumps are the events that unfold.

The 2500 days in Daniel are divided by 2 are they not as there is an evening and a morning 'prayer'.

The 1290 days and the 1335 might be applied to the days before a 1260 day period starts. The coals from the alter happen just before the trumps sound, if the 5th and 6th tale a full 1260 days and the first 4 take only 4 days then that is 26 days for the coals event.
The 1335 might have days before and after a 1260 in that Gentile walk to Jerusalem as seeing the devastation along the way is part of their witness to 'the day of the LORD', 45 days for the last to arrive at the literal river in Exe:47 and glorification of the body.


The book of Daniel covers from Neb up until before the end of the brass. The iron/clay verses start when the 5th trump sounds and it lasts for 42 months. Daniel 12 mentions the resurrection of Re:10 that starts as soon as the destruction of the 7 vials is finished. The 12 books listed after Daniel all have prophecies that are just about the day the Christ comes as a king. The first advent was to finish (bruise to the heel)some things and to start some things (bruise to the head).

Re:18:8:
Therefore shall her plagues come in one day,
death,
and mourning,
and famine;
and she shall be utterly burned with fire:
for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.

Zep:1:18:
Neither their silver nor their gold shall be able to deliver them in the day of the LORD's wrath;
but the whole land shall be devoured by the fire of his jealousy:
for he shall make even a speedy riddance of all them that dwell in the land.


Revelation and the Gospel of John were both written by a Disciple of John the Baptist. John was the last Prophet called by God, the Apostles were gathered by Jesus. Daniel and Revelation are they keys you need to piece together all the OT prophecy, with little or no twisting. There are not 24 days of the lord, there are 24 references to one day of the lord.



Daniels version has us still in the brass. Rome fulfilled all the verses below in the 500 years that she ruled over Jerusalem. Luke:21:24 starts a period where Gentiles rule over a Jerusalem that has no temple, that is the same way Jerusalem will be in the last 3 1/2 years of the time of the Gentiles. The two witnesses are the power that protects the holy ground, when they die Satan can put a throne on holy ground and claim to be God until the day the two are resurrected and that day is the end of sinners forever.


Sealed at Daniel's time, Revelation was the book that unsealed all hidden things. The ones killed by the sword in Isaiah 65 and Revelation 19 are one and the same, that chapter clarifies the fate of 'the rest' from Re:20:4.


John's disciple was the last one to remain alive and write messages to men, it is from those same words that a detailed picture of the last events can be drawn, like Rome being the one that fulfilled these verses. (including the RCC corrupting the message they were the first to receive, the whole of the NT)

Da:8:9:
And out of one of them came forth a little horn,
which waxed exceeding great,
toward the south,
and toward the east,
and toward the pleasant land.
Da:8:10:
And it waxed great,
even to the host of heaven;
and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground,
and stamped upon them.
Da:8:11:
Yea,
he magnified himself even to the prince of the host,
and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away,
and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.
Da:8:12:
And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression,
and it cast down the truth to the ground;
and it practised, and prospered.

Respectfully again to our Jewish friend - this is exactly what you are doing.

The law condemns us and exposes sin. When we were ignorant of sin we weren't condemned under the law, but now we know the law and remain condemned because all have sinned.

Jesus atonement freed us from condemnation so we can be freely resurrected into God's new system.

Not as an excuse for 'inducement of the flesh' but so that Jehovah, the God of Abraham, would release his 'legal case' against us.

edit: the 'RCC' is the MOST pagan religion on earth today

We aren't arguing for the preposterously obvious apostate RCC. (now it makes sense where you are coming from though)

If you believe in Judaism you are apostate as well - since I presume you violate the eating laws, association laws, and a MASSIVE number of Levitical laws.

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:01 PM

but he didn't fulfill the law!

you keep resorting to a book which its credibility has been damdged a lot throughout this thread. to prove that the ot has proof for the nt.

the law is not to touched(even jesus said it) until mashiach comes. but mashiach must come in the end times, and when the prophecies of ressurction and salvation are fulfilled WORLD WIDE UTOPIA FOREVER (not a temporary utopia of 13 stoned dudes walking around in Judea)
the times of mashiach had not come yet. if jesus was the mashich then we should have been living in utopia.
your only explaination for why were not living in utopia is the nt! which is a lie!
we are not living in utopia because mashiach had not come.

paul couldn't help himself, he went against jewish teaching, not only did he abolish the law, he added upon it!
fulfillment of law(which jesus didn't not fulfill) does not mean adding to it.

Are you ready to stone homosexuals?

What about adulterers?

Have you ever worked on a Sabbath?

Do you REALLY want to be under that law?


Who are you married to? Better be an Israelite ... or you may have to force her to leave.

"the sabbath was created FOR man, not man for the sabbath"

No shellfish!

Do you understand the idea that Jesus fulfilled the law because he lived up to it perfectly? Rather than be a pharisee he UNDERSTOOD the INTENT of the law, and completed it perfectly.

"That is why, just as through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men because they had all sinned—. For until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not charged against anyone when there is no law. Nevertheless, death ruled as king from Adam down to Moses, even over those who had not sinned after the likeness of the transgression by Adam, who bears a resemblance to him that was to come.

But it is not with the gift as it was with the trespass. For if by one man’s trespass many died, the undeserved kindness of God and his free gift with the undeserved kindness by the one man Jesus Christ abounded much more to many. Also, it is not with the free gift as it was with the way things worked through the one [man] that sinned. For the judgment resulted from one trespass in condemnation, but the gift resulted from many trespasses in a declaration of righteousness"

^ how can you both know Jehovah, and reject the above?

You can't.

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:11 PM

luke is basically resupporting what happens to the jews according to god!
i don't need further proof for my book.

so your saying that an evil horn of the evilest of beasts is rcc? well the beast itself is the RCC which gave you your authorized bible and its jesus to distract you from the messiah that would come!

the little horn is its most powerful agent Muhammad. he fulfilled those verses. the clay fingers are islam merging with the iron that is edom RCC.
it wont hold forever.

the clay iron empire is the one that is still ruling today!

andm messiach comes at the end of this beast! not 2000 years ago.

in case you don't know...

Acts:10 had a vision make all Gentile food clean for jews as an aid from God to help them spread the word throughout the world. That message hasn't gotten through yet.

Blood sacrifice became an abomination at the time of the cross, no other words needed.

Isa:66:3:
He that killeth an ox is as if he slew a man;
he that sacrificeth a lamb,
as if he cut off a dog's neck;
he that offereth an oblation,
as if he offered swine's blood;
he that burneth incense,
as if he blessed an idol.
Yea,
they have chosen their own ways,
and their soul delighteth in their abominations.

Even the passover lamb can be substituted if none are available. Fine barley flour is available at that time of the year. De:4:30 made prayer available, that is what Daniel was using in Da:9.

The 10 commandments weren't changes at all in the wording, what changed is how you came to be sin.

Jas:2:8:
If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture,
Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself,
ye do well:
Jas:2:9:
But if ye have respect to persons,
ye commit sin,
and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
Jas:2:10:
For whosoever shall keep the whole law,
and yet offend in one point,
he is guilty of all.
Jas:2:11:
For he that said,
Do not commit adultery,
said also,
Do not kill.
Now if thou commit no adultery,
yet if thou kill,
thou art become a transgressor of the law.

M't:5:28:
But I say unto you,
That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Jas:2:14:
What doth it profit,
my brethren,
though a man say he hath faith,
and have not works?
can faith save him?
Jas:2:15:
If a brother or sister be naked,
and destitute of daily food,
Jas:2:16:
And one of you say unto them,
Depart in peace,
be ye warmed and filled;
notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body;
what doth it profit?
Jas:2:17:
Even so faith,
if it hath not works,
is dead,
being alone.

Are you ready to stone homosexuals?

What about adulterers?

Have you ever worked on a Sabbath?

Who are you married to? Better be an Israelite ... or you may have to force her to leave.

No shellfish!

"the sabbath was created FOR man, not man for the sabbath"


"That is why, just as through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men because they had all sinned—. For until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not charged against anyone when there is no law. Nevertheless, death ruled as king from Adam down to Moses, even over those who had not sinned after the likeness of the transgression by Adam, who bears a resemblance to him that was to come.

But it is not with the gift as it was with the trespass. For if by one man’s trespass many died, the undeserved kindness of God and his free gift with the undeserved kindness by the one man Jesus Christ abounded much more to many. Also, it is not with the free gift as it was with the way things worked through the one [man] that sinned. For the judgment resulted from one trespass in condemnation, but the gift resulted from many trespasses in a declaration of righteousness"

^ how can you both know Jehovah, and reject the above?

You can't.

But I think you want to know Jehovah.. so drop this preposterous assertion that the RCC represents Christianity.

The RCC was born in blood and has attempted to KILL Christians for 1700 years.

You profess to know the prophecies and the scriptures, good, but you are making classic mistakes the RCC made!

[which is EXACTLY why the RCC is the apostate pagan organization it is today]

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:14 PM

dude that's the law, deal with it. you don't like it don't follow it.

your law are the noachite laws.

perfectly? killing swines is enough to see he didn't live up to it. cursing fruit giving tree?
you cant say he is allowed to break the law because he lived it perfectly.

and again you resort back to prove the NT from the NT.

OK, so you agree that stoning people is justified.

Doesn't that expose your lack of understanding of the OT?

Riddle me this:

What Messiah was 'cut off' between 30 BC - 30 CE?

Because Daniel explicitly says that the messiah would be cut-off within that time frame.

So who is that messiah?

Either you reject Daniel as inspired, or you MUST provide an answer.

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:21 PM

now try to prove the NT from the OT.

and don't go pick up a random verse and say its about the nt because the nt says so. it doesn't work like that.

i on the other hand gave showed you how the NT doesn't not go together with the OT.

the only you can rebuke me is by disprobving the OT and then youd be disproving jesus.

Riddle me this:

What Messiah was 'cut off' between 30 BC - 30 CE?

Because Daniel explicitly says that the messiah would be cut-off within that time frame.

So who is that messiah?

Either you reject Daniel as inspired, or you MUST provide an answer.

What do you think Isaiah 6:10 means:

Then he said to me, “Make the minds of these people dull, their ears deaf, and their eyes blind, so that they cannot see or hear or understand. If they did, they might turn to me and be healed.”

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:23 PM

you calculation is wrong, WAY wrong first it doesn't say THE mashiach it says, mashiach. saul was mashiach david was mashiach Solomon was mashiach cyrus was mahiach... they were all anointed, so were the priests and the ark! the ark is mashiach!!
the calculation results in the destruction of the temple, and the priests were cut off.

the calculation is not from artaxeres' decree but cyrus. and you have it all wrong! please watch the vid i provided about daniels time line. it explains it all! thoughraly.

why would the new testament mention so many things jesus fulfilled but not a prophecy apparently suggest the time messiah dies?
they had a good reason not to mention it, watch the vid.

please

who am i to tell you if stoning people is justified or not?

his ways are not our ways, his thoughts are not our thoughts. i could never pretend to understand his reasons of judgment.

I debunked that, thoroughly! If you prefer sophistry that is your choice.

What about all of the OT prophecies about God blinding the eyes of Israel?

"And I began to hear the voice of Jehovah saying: “Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?” And I proceeded to say: “Here I am! Send me.” And he went on to say: “Go, and you must say to this people, ‘Hear again and again, O men, but do not understand; and see again and again, but do not get any knowledge.’ Make the heart of this people unreceptive, and make their very ears unresponsive, and paste their very eyes together, that they may not see with their eyes and with their ears they may not hear, and that their own heart may not understand and that they may not actually turn back and get healing for themselves.” Isaiah 6:10

What do you think that is talking about?

OK - so who was the messiah that was cut-off?

If it wasn't THE messiah, then what small 'm' messiah was it?

(note: preposterous assertion man - as if the extremely profound Daniel was talking about some NON-event of a small "m" messiah!)

Almost the entire book of Daniel is a foreshadow of the MESSIAH / time of the end / Seleucid empire. Why ignore the obvious?

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:29 PM

what is sophistry?

something used for debating in the jewish and Islamic world?

yeah you know,,, were are kinda brothers. both come from Abraham.

genes are not so different.

Sophistry is ignoring the clear meaning of a statement in leiu of 'word' argumentation.

For example:

"The RCC is a Greco-Roman pagan expression"

Sophists argument: "no it isn't, the Romans permuted the names of their Gods, so it's only Roman and not Greek"

Christianity is FULL of sophists.

The trinity and idea of "hell" is based PURELY on sophistry.

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:33 PM

the calculation of Daniel results in the destruction of the temple. were anointed priests were cut off. it is a refrence the the great priest. who was anointed with all his priests, hence he is counted has anointed - messiah.

Let's look at Daniel 9 in question:

"There are seventy weeks that have been determined upon your people and upon your holy city, in order to terminate the transgression, and to finish off sin, and to make atonement for error, and to bring in righteousness for times indefinite, and to imprint a seal upon vision and prophet, and to anoint the Holy of Holies. And you should know and have the insight [that] from the going forth of [the] word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Messi'ah [the] Leader, there will be seven weeks, also sixty two weeks. She will return and be actually rebuilt, with a public square and moat, but in the straits of the times.

“And after the sixty two weeks Messiah will be cut off, with nothing for himself."


A) this is about 'atonement for error' right?

B) this is about righteousness for 'times indefinite' right?

Sounds pretty profound eh?

So who / what atoned for error for time indefinite? Am I to believe the MOST profound event in history was a non-event and you don't even know the name of the priest?

Isn't that nonsensical? I say this with the utmost respect for a fellow human.

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:40 PM

this isn't sophistry. because as someone with common sense i would say the rcc represents rome alone, the rcc represents Babylon!

gold head - Babylon
silver torso - Persia and median.
copper - alexander and ptolemites.
rome- iron, which now mixes with clay that is islam.
all is one body, with rcc as its newest manifestation.

and messiah is not to come until the end of this! and its not over

Partially correct, but you're confusing interpretive mechanisms.

Each of those elements represent an EMPIRE.

Gold - Babylon, as Daniel describes
Silver - Medo-Persia
Copper - Greece, as Daniel describes
Iron - Rome
Iron mixed with Clay - The roman empire MIXED with the 'people' (clay ALWAYS represents people in Biblical prophecy)
So a Democratic-nation-state system which we've seen since ~1200 / magna carta / officially dead Roman empire [debatable end date]

Now the feet of the statue is struck by a 'rock not formed by human hands' (clearly the Messiah)

So EXACTLY like the 7 headed beast of Revelation, this prophecy gives an overview of the national groups which exist through history until Jehovah's judgment and installation of his Messiah.

But that is only one small part of the story isn't it?

For example we get more details with the 4 horns of 'Greece' after the 'little horn' is cut off -> Seleucid et al to the land of decoration.

What is the take-away?

We need to look at all of the OT prophecies for a full picture. Just because the 'rock not formed by human hands' prophecy doesn't include the messiah being cut-off, doesn't mean you're getting the whole picture. As we've discussed, look at Daniel 9 or Isaiah 53.

In Revelation we get more details.

For example "Babylon the Great" is seen to be 'riding' on ALL of these empires.

What could that mean?

Well certainly the RCC is typified by Babylon the Great, but why is it pictured riding on all of the empires?

Well, look at what came out of literal Babylon:

A) trinity
B) hell
C) eternal soul

EVERY religion on earth except Judaism and Christianity teach the above.

So while I agree that the RCC is most definitely a part of 'Babylon the Great', it's larger than that.

It represents all religious untruth.

Christianity has been perverted by it, and so has Judaism.

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/05/2013 10:51 PM

maybe the holy of holies that has been anointed is is that little m mashiach im talking about?

in Hebrew it says, le'mshoach (see the word masiach there?) kodesh kodashim

It's a little more than that.
The sermon that is being referenced also has another part set in the future, a time that is farther away than the scattering that was to happen in 70AD. The first verse below if for a period that is future from today and then it jumps back to the bulk of the verses that says the ones sitting there will experience certain things. Acts say that when Stephen was killed that Christians left and only the Apostles stayed in Jerusalem so 4 decades later the scattering would have bee listened to by very few Christians.

Lu:21:11:
And great earthquakes shall be in divers places,
and famines,
and pestilences;
and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
Lu:21:12:
But before all these,
they shall lay their hands on you,
and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues,
and into prisons,
being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.
Lu:21:13:
And it shall turn to you for a testimony.
Lu:21:14:
Settle it therefore in your hearts,
not to meditate before what ye shall answer:
Lu:21:15:
For I will give you a mouth and wisdom,
which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
Lu:21:16:
And ye shall be betrayed both by parents,
and brethren,
and kinsfolks,
and friends;
and some of you shall they cause to be put to death.
Lu:21:17:
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake.
Lu:21:18:
But there shall not an hair of your head perish.
Lu:21:19:
In your patience possess ye your souls.
Lu:21:20:
And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies,
then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
Lu:21:21:
Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains;
and let them which are in the midst of it depart out;
and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
Lu:21:22:
For these be the days of vengeance,
that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
Lu:21:23:
But woe unto them that are with child,
and to them that give suck,
in those days!
for there shall be great distress in the land,
and wrath upon this people.
Lu:21:24:
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword,
and shall be led away captive into all nations:
and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles,
until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Lu:21:25:
And there shall be signs in the sun,
and in the moon,
and in the stars;
and upon the earth distress of nations,
with perplexity;
the sea and the waves roaring;



One of us needs to start using shorter sentences.
I am saying the prophecy meant that in 323AD the RCC was holding onto the truth, by 500AD the Latin Bible had replaced the Greek NT. They are not the same message.


Now promote that using some verses, like counting kings. Neb is 1, there are 2 in the silver so that is 3. Alex is the first in the brass so he (and any general that took over) are #4 and then there is a possible 4 more kings before the final king rules before the kingdom of God rules for eternity. Only Rome completed all those Da:8 verses as well as qualify for the verse below.

Da:2:39:
And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee,
and another third kingdom of brass,
which shall bear rule over all the earth.


Not if Rome was the first king to start a period of undetermined time that is given a specific name.

Rome is the 6th king in the verse below. Alex was #4 and 1 took over which makes #5 and Rome takes over i 63BC as king #6 and the 5th trump sounding starts a 42 month rule bt the 8th king, the Beast from the Pit, a fallen angel and the head wound was when it was put into the Pit during the flood of water.

De:33:2:
And he said,
The LORD came from Sinai,
and rose up from Seir unto them;
he shined forth from mount Paran,
and he came with ten thousands of saints:
from his right hand went a fiery law for them.


He is the one to sent the Beast and the False Prophet to the fiery lake as well as bind lucifer and sent all sinners in the Nations to the grave.

Jer:25:31:
A noise shall come even to the ends of the earth;
for the LORD hath a controversy with the nations,
he will plead with all flesh;
he will give them that are wicked to the sword,
saith the LORD.
Jer:25:32:
Thus saith the LORD of hosts,
Behold,
evil shall go forth from nation to nation,
and a great whirlwind shall be raised up from the coasts of the earth.
Jer:25:33:
And the slain of the LORD shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth:
they shall not be lamented,
neither gathered,
nor buried;
they shall be dung upon the ground.

Isa:28:9:
Whom shall he teach knowledge?
and whom shall he make to understand doctrine?
them that are weaned from the milk,
and drawn from the breasts.
Isa:28:10:
For precept must be upon precept,
precept upon precept;
line upon line,
line upon line;
here a little,
and there a little:

Zec:13:9:
And I will bring the third part through the fire,
and will refine them as silver is refined,
and will try them as gold is tried:
they shall call on my name,
and I will hear them:
I will say,
It is my people:
and they shall say,
The LORD is my God.

man? i already explained isiah 53 here, it is not about jesus. it is about is SERVANT ISRAEL which is us the jews and lost Israelites. who suffer because of their sins.

Daniel 9 is also not talking about jesus.
please watch the videos they are here, you will understand far better than i could explain.

in both cases the new testament that makes such a good job pointing for cases jesus fulfilled law, doesn't mention them!

they have a good reason not to mention them.

clay is islam.
muhamad is the little horn. he tore down the altars of arabaic paganism he formulated a god which his fathers didn't know, he appointed himself high!

how do they say? allah is god and muhamad is his prophet...

[link to www.scripture4all.org]

Here is an interlinear.

(I wish I could share the application I have - I can click a Hebrew word and see ALL occurrences)

Daniel 9 is most certainly talking about THE messiah.

The one foretold since Genesis who would destroy the head of the snake and be a blessing for ALL of mankind.

Note: in Genesis where we find the first prophecy about the messiah, the "snake" bites his heal.

This is the 'cutting off'.

The end when the "rock not formed by human hands" destroys the snakes head is the statue prophecy.