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Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]

 
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Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
UPDATE: Original image no longer described as ISON + research error on my part fixed. Still might be relevant references later.
********************************************

So there was this thing...
[link to www.flickr.com]
...which was being discussed in detail here...
Thread: ISON ~ Massive Cloud Of Debris Located By Amateur Astronomer? (Confirmation Required)

I compiled all the information and pinpointed previously predicted path locations along side the new information provided in that photo in an "easy to understand" format. I messed it up, and have fixed it. Just because.

And then there was this a couple days before that...
Thread: The path of Comet ISON; before and after. "Dead" yes, "Erased from existence" no. [DEAD TOPIC]
...with the bottom line being that the debris WOULD be off course.

So the photo ended up being recanted as ISON remnant and we're back where we started. But here's the breakdown anyways under the assumption that it had been real.-

Using the new photo as a starting point, I based all my observations off a location of Mauna Loa Observatory, Hawaii, with a mean observation time of 14:09 UTC, Dec. 29th 2013. The 4 "predicted path" locations I used for that time were:

JPL Horizons (NASA) - 16 29 49 +62 35 14
Stellarium (old data) - 16 30 03 +62 41 12
Solar System Scope/ISON - (approximate)
The photographer, Hiro C. - (approximate)

*If I made any MORE errors, please excuse me again.--
As it turns out I got 4 nearby, but not at all the same, locations. I used NGC 6189/6223/6247 & Draco 14 as frames of reference when not using actual coordinates.

First off, using Stellarium, I sectioned off the approximate section of space shown in the photograph. Top corner 16 56 28 +64 06 52, bottom corner 16 16 13 +58 47 52. Fortunately this area covers all plot points. I then drew an approximation of the "debris field" onto the map. The end result is this...
[link to i.imgur.com]
...Now the first thing you might notice is that all 4 "predicted" locations are different, & more notably that the "blob" encompasses NONE of them. Without bothering to show an illustration, let me mention that the "blob" is precisely in the direction of the Sun from those other points. That would mean that the debris field is off course. Probably closer.

The comical part is when you take that image and compare it to something in the sky you can see, you start to see how B-I-G the debris cloud would be...
[link to i.imgur.com]
YES, that is friggin ORION'S BELT! TO SCALE! It's about 2.5x the size of it.

---
If you want to know how to find Orion's Belt, here is an easy chart. Also, Betelgeuse.
[link to i.imgur.com]
Start at Jupiter, the brightest thing now. It's Orange. Go to the next orange star (our neighbor Betelgeuse), and look at the 3 equally bright stars in a row. Not the small trio to the side, the BIG ONE.
---

This "debris cloud" would be 2.5x LARGER than the belt! That would have been quite the something. Now, this photo only shows location, which we can determine is closer to us or the Sun or both than ISON should have been. 2D images do not translate to 3D easily. It could have been 66 million miles and leaving or it might have been one hell of a lot closer. Likewise, outlying debris would not be shown.

********************************************
In the end, nothing amazing was found. But I tried. I did, however, make this nifty Googly Eyed Space Monster as compensation...
[link to i.imgur.com]
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2013 10:21 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
yet a one liner is a free bump.
[link to www.youtube.com]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2013 10:22 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
EDIT: Obsolete
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2013 10:24 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
yet a one liner is a free bump.
[link to www.youtube.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52134172


Truth.
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2013 10:26 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
So what.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2013 10:28 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
So what.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52213783


So..
If it hasn't completely passed us, we could get hit by a lot of fragments.
That's a big "what."
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2013 10:29 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
Bro I hate to break it to you but, Comet Ison exploded into dust hitting the Sun long ago cruise
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2013 10:30 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
So what.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52213783


If it hasn't completely passed us, we could get hit by a lot of fragments.
That's a big "what."
 Quoting: Shenzon


So if you are talking about "fragments", even though there is none bigger than a grain of sand.
Then why do you put in the thread title "Comet Ison"?
Like it is still an intact full matter comet?
Is this because you are a sensationalist wanker who wants attention?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2013 10:31 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
Bro I hate to break it to you but, Comet Ison exploded into dust hitting the Sun long ago
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52026328


Potentially:

Explode = Spread out = Closer to Earth

Nuff said.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2013 10:32 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
So if you are talking about "fragments", even though there is none bigger than a grain of sand.
Then why do you put in the thread title "Comet Ison"?
Like it is still an intact full matter comet?
Is this because you are a sensationalist wanker who wants attention?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52026328


Title included (at that time)...
"Debris cloud is MASSIVE"

This was allegedly Comet ISON's debris. I think the title qualified.
beeches

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12/30/2013 10:35 PM

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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
bump. I like how you are discussing this. I have little to add, sometimes you gotta know when to be the audience. This is my time.
Thank you for this thread. It is great.
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M*walk
Low Earth Orbit

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12/30/2013 10:39 PM

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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
So what.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52213783


If it hasn't completely passed us, we could get hit by a lot of fragments.
That's a big "what."
 Quoting: Shenzon


So if you are talking about "fragments", even though there is none bigger than a grain of sand.
Then why do you put in the thread title "Comet Ison"?
Like it is still an intact full matter comet?
Is this because you are a sensationalist wanker who wants attention?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52026328


Beat it troll...
“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.”
M*walk
Low Earth Orbit

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12/30/2013 10:41 PM

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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
So what.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52213783


If it hasn't completely passed us, we could get hit by a lot of fragments.
That's a big "what."
 Quoting: Shenzon


So if you are talking about "fragments", even though there is none bigger than a grain of sand.
Then why do you put in the thread title "Comet Ison"?
Like it is still an intact full matter comet?
Is this because you are a sensationalist wanker who wants attention?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52026328


See title...
"Debris cloud is MASSIVE"

Would you prefer I called it "Random Debris Cloud"?
 Quoting: Shenzon


Another thing the sheep aren't realizing is that ison was 30 times the size of our planet, and there's a whole lot of debris out there.
“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.”
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2013 10:47 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
bump. I like how you are discussing this. I have little to add, sometimes you gotta know when to be the audience. This is my time.
Thank you for this thread. It is great.
 Quoting: beeches


Thanks. I just wanted to compile the information and let people decide what it means to them, if anything. I have little more to add myself at this point.

So what.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52213783


If it hasn't completely passed us, we could get hit by a lot of fragments.
That's a big "what."
 Quoting: Shenzon


So if you are talking about "fragments", even though there is none bigger than a grain of sand.
Then why do you put in the thread title "Comet Ison"?
Like it is still an intact full matter comet?
Is this because you are a sensationalist wanker who wants attention?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52026328


Beat it troll...
 Quoting: M*walk


Never have more appropriate words been said.
Rph
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12/30/2013 10:50 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
Thank you for crunching the image . This is really hard to wrap my head around...
I never could shake the thought that when disintegrating there was a (rotational) vector , which I suspected was the reason perihelion was "blacked out" , I know allot of NAVY , they don't make mistakes like that

If in any way ISON poses an impact danger they would not be able to tell us , until we could tell for ourselves.

I hope new images will make the scenario clearer.

Bro I hate to break it to you but, Comet Ison exploded into dust hitting the Sun long ago
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52026328


Explode = Spread out = Closer to Earth

Yeah, that's kinda the point here.

And that's even if it WERE on track, which it's not.

And who says "dust"? Those who can't see anything smaller than a mountain? If it really is just dust, fantastic. If not, the thousands of people following ISON here might want to put this new info into perspective. I can't determine anything from this so far. Might be nothing.
 Quoting: Shenzon
green_girl

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12/30/2013 10:58 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
was looking at your pics. You seem to have given what you call ison a funny wonky shape. I think you said a ball with a string attached to another ball. But i thought ison - if htat was what was in the image, was the other, fainter shadow. Skygrazer comets said it was running full height of the image from upper left down to bottom right.
Or did i get it wrong? I only had time to do a quick glance at everything.
:malefav:
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12/30/2013 11:06 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
was looking at your pics. You seem to have given what you call ison a funny wonky shape. I think you said a ball with a string attached to another ball. But i thought ison - if htat was what was in the image, was the other, fainter shadow. Skygrazer comets said it was running full height of the image from upper left down to bottom right.
Or did i get it wrong? I only had time to do a quick glance at everything.
 Quoting: green_girl



EDIT: FIXED!
***********************************
OMG, you were right. I counted "Integrated Flux Nebulae" as the debris. Those overlapping boxes confused me. The actual field is even worse. We now have at least 2x the length of Orion's Belt. Let me get back to my images and see what to make of it. All other info (except the cloud not overlapping original trajectory) still stands though. Almost seems unbelievable it could be that big. Thanks for pointing that out.
grumpier

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12/30/2013 11:11 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
Thanks Shenzon, great info.

bumpbumpbump
If you think a thread is important enough for others to read, go to page one and click on the green pin!!!
green_girl

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12/30/2013 11:11 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
was looking at your pics. You seem to have given what you call ison a funny wonky shape. I think you said a ball with a string attached to another ball. But i thought ison - if htat was what was in the image, was the other, fainter shadow. Skygrazer comets said it was running full height of the image from upper left down to bottom right.
Or did i get it wrong? I only had time to do a quick glance at everything.
 Quoting: green_girl


OMG, you are right. I counted "Integrated Flux Nebulae" as the debris. Those overlapping boxes confused me. The actual field is even worse. We now have at least 2x the length of Orion's Belt. Let me get back to my images and see what to make of it. All other info (except the cloud not overlapping original trajectory) still stands though. Almost seems unbelievable it could be that big. Thanks for pointing that out.
 Quoting: Shenzon


No problem. Happy to help. But it sounds like it is not Ison regardless. Event he guy that took the pic is saying he was wrong.
:malefav:
I love this place!!
Rphunter
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12/30/2013 11:16 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
This is not a casual conversation... Here are some research links to help those who want to understand what is eventually observed...

Search for
" rotational dispersion of disintegrating comet nucleus perihelion "

[link to www.google.com]

The link Amy not work ... One of the links goes over the basics of nucleus disintegration .... Book COMETS II.

[link to books.google.com]
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2013 11:21 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
If something will happen we will se here... [link to www.merriott-astro.co.uk]
valles

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12/30/2013 11:21 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
was looking at your pics. You seem to have given what you call ison a funny wonky shape. I think you said a ball with a string attached to another ball. But i thought ison - if htat was what was in the image, was the other, fainter shadow. Skygrazer comets said it was running full height of the image from upper left down to bottom right.
Or did i get it wrong? I only had time to do a quick glance at everything.
 Quoting: green_girl


OMG, you are right. I counted "Integrated Flux Nebulae" as the debris. Those overlapping boxes confused me. The actual field is even worse. We now have at least 2x the length of Orion's Belt. Let me get back to my images and see what to make of it. All other info (except the cloud not overlapping original trajectory) still stands though. Almost seems unbelievable it could be that big. Thanks for pointing that out.
 Quoting: Shenzon


Haha, a terrible mistake to make at the beginning of your research, but an easy one to make. Battams tweeted an explanation yesterday. Nevertheless, I'm keeping my eye on this. Good work mate.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2013 11:36 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
No problem. Happy to help. But it sounds like it is not Ison regardless. Event he guy that took the pic is saying he was wrong.
 Quoting: green_girl


I see his latest message now. Time to revamp or abandon the thread.
EDIT: FIXED!

This is not a casual conversation... Here are some research links to help those who want to understand what is eventually observed...

Search for
" rotational dispersion of disintegrating comet nucleus perihelion "

[link to www.google.com]

The link Amy not work ... One of the links goes over the basics of nucleus disintegration .... Book COMETS II.

[link to books.google.com]
 Quoting: Rphunter 51957314


Great info, thanks.

If something will happen we will se here... [link to www.merriott-astro.co.uk]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52024764


Keep an eye on those for us if you would.

Haha, a terrible mistake to make at the beginning of your research, but an easy one to make. Battams tweeted an explanation yesterday. Nevertheless, I'm keeping my eye on this. Good work mate.
 Quoting: valles


I know right? I don't feel it was time wasted either way and thanks.
green_girl

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12/30/2013 11:40 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
No problem. Happy to help. But it sounds like it is not Ison regardless. Event he guy that took the pic is saying he was wrong.
 Quoting: green_girl


I see his latest message now. Time to revamp or abandon the thread.

This is not a casual conversation... Here are some research links to help those who want to understand what is eventually observed...

Search for
" rotational dispersion of disintegrating comet nucleus perihelion "

[link to www.google.com]

The link Amy not work ... One of the links goes over the basics of nucleus disintegration .... Book COMETS II.

[link to books.google.com]
 Quoting: Rphunter 51957314


Great info, thanks.

If something will happen we will se here... [link to www.merriott-astro.co.uk]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52024764


Keep an eye on those for us if you would.

Haha, a terrible mistake to make at the beginning of your research, but an easy one to make. Battams tweeted an explanation yesterday. Nevertheless, I'm keeping my eye on this. Good work mate.
 Quoting: valles


I know right? I don't feel it was time wasted either way and thanks.
 Quoting: Shenzon


If you are looking for the truth - then it is never time wasted!! :)
:malefav:
I love this place!!
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12/30/2013 11:46 PM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
If you are looking for the truth - then it is never time wasted!! :)
 Quoting: green_girl


Indeed.

I am neither in search of doom or comfort; but that which you speak of.
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12/31/2013 01:00 AM
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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
UPDATE: Dead info but Googly Eye Space Monster was found...
[link to i.imgur.com]
#Geomagnetic_Storm#

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12/31/2013 03:39 AM

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Re: Inaccurate info. Hiro @ Mauna Loa Obsv. recanted ISON findings. Still worthwhile reading here with visual references. [DEAD TOPIC]
UPDATE: Dead info but Googly Eye Space Monster was found...
[link to i.imgur.com]
 Quoting: Shenzon


Looks legit!!!

ahhh ahhh ahhh
Geoshill


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