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Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology

 
waterlily
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Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
What is amazing about the Iron Pillar of Delhi is that, in spite of being at least 1,500 years old and possibly much older, it is so impenetrable to corrosion that even modern technology fails to match it.

The 24-foot pillar is 99.72 percent iron, according to Professor A.P. Gupta, Head of the Department of Applied Sciences and Humanities at the Institute of Technology and Management in India.

In modern times, wrought iron has been made with a purity of about 99–99.8 percent, but it contains manganese and sulfur, two ingredients absent in the pillar. The pillar was also coated in a protective oxide film. It is unlike anything produced today.

[link to www.theepochtimes.com]
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 10:48 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
The Ancient Alchemists were very Skilled.
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01/12/2014 10:53 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
What is amazing about the Iron Pillar of Delhi is that, in spite of being at least 1,500 years old and possibly much older, it is so impenetrable to corrosion that even modern technology fails to match it.

The 24-foot pillar is 99.72 percent iron, according to Professor A.P. Gupta, Head of the Department of Applied Sciences and Humanities at the Institute of Technology and Management in India.

In modern times, wrought iron has been made with a purity of about 99–99.8 percent, but it contains manganese and sulfur, two ingredients absent in the pillar. The pillar was also coated in a protective oxide film. It is unlike anything produced today.

[link to www.theepochtimes.com]
 Quoting: waterlily


There are legions of fools on this site who trumpet made up crap from the past.
You show them REAL EVIDENCE OF SOMETHING SPECTACULAR AND YOU GET 'chirp chirp"

FIVE STAR POST AND A PIN REQUEST .......
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 11:01 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
awesome. i'm impressed :)

also in the Vedas there's lots of references to UFOs too.

vimanas


hf
waterlily  (OP)

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01/12/2014 11:06 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
What is amazing about the Iron Pillar of Delhi is that, in spite of being at least 1,500 years old and possibly much older, it is so impenetrable to corrosion that even modern technology fails to match it.

The 24-foot pillar is 99.72 percent iron, according to Professor A.P. Gupta, Head of the Department of Applied Sciences and Humanities at the Institute of Technology and Management in India.

In modern times, wrought iron has been made with a purity of about 99–99.8 percent, but it contains manganese and sulfur, two ingredients absent in the pillar. The pillar was also coated in a protective oxide film. It is unlike anything produced today.

[link to www.theepochtimes.com]
 Quoting: waterlily


There are legions of fools on this site who trumpet made up crap from the past.
You show them REAL EVIDENCE OF SOMETHING SPECTACULAR AND YOU GET 'chirp chirp"

FIVE STAR POST AND A PIN REQUEST .......
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 52755474


Thank you!

hf

Glad you found it interesting. I did.
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
waterlily  (OP)

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01/12/2014 11:06 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
awesome. i'm impressed :)

also in the Vedas there's lots of references to UFOs too.

vimanas


hf
 Quoting: gardenvariety


That's interesting! I'll look it up
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 11:09 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Fallen angel Azazel tought man metallurgy.
Sir France's Beercan

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01/12/2014 11:10 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
I visited it. It is quite amazing and even has some dents where former rulers tried to knock it down if I recall.
waterlily  (OP)

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01/12/2014 11:15 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
I visited it. It is quite amazing and even has some dents where former rulers tried to knock it down if I recall.
 Quoting: Sir France's Beercan


Really! Couldn't bring it down... now that is something remarkable.

Rulers wanting to erase evidence of former reigns are usually pretty inventive and successful.

Thanks for the info.

hf
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
waterlily  (OP)

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01/12/2014 11:16 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Fallen angel Azazel tought man metallurgy.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42370202


Really! Do you have a good book or article you would recommend about that? Sounds intriguing.
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 11:21 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Fallen angel Azazel tought man metallurgy.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42370202


Really! Do you have a good book or article you would recommend about that? Sounds intriguing.
 Quoting: waterlily


Book of Enoch for example, but google Azazel and metallurgy you will find plenty of information. Tought man to make weapons also, swords, shields, breastplates etc.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 11:23 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Fallen angel Azazel tought man metallurgy.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42370202


Really! Do you have a good book or article you would recommend about that? Sounds intriguing.
 Quoting: waterlily



Jesus taught us the Alchemy of the Stone.

He shows us how to make the Eucharist when he did the Transubstantiation.


But he was crucified for it.

And the Grail was Lost.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 11:26 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Fallen angel Azazel tought man metallurgy.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42370202


Really! Do you have a good book or article you would recommend about that? Sounds intriguing.
 Quoting: waterlily



Jesus taught us the Alchemy of the Stone.


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15740069


Can't be true because metallurgy is much older, before the great flood.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 11:30 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
yeah, pretty much everything did until them dogon folks got here, changed all the faces on the piramids and enslaved the world.
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01/12/2014 11:48 AM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
bsflag

india and indians are SHIT.
waterlily  (OP)

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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Fallen angel Azazel tought man metallurgy.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42370202


Really! Do you have a good book or article you would recommend about that? Sounds intriguing.
 Quoting: waterlily


Book of Enoch for example, but google Azazel and metallurgy you will find plenty of information. Tought man to make weapons also, swords, shields, breastplates etc.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 42370202


I will do that. Very interesting.
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 12:43 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
They made it from a dense Iron Ore vein that was already low in impurities. My Theory.

finding out what mine this came from will be vary important in cracking this mystery either way.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 12:46 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
I know that you can collect some real pure metal ore in North India. This is where the Indian plate pushed up, exposing the Earths Crust on the surface.
Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs
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01/12/2014 12:49 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
They made it from a dense Iron Ore vein that was already low in impurities. My Theory.

finding out what mine this came from will be vary important in cracking this mystery either way.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


meteoric iron

what type of fuel was used in the several stages

woods/plants produce ashes that can react, unlike only using coal or coke.
Kali Yuga

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01/12/2014 12:50 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Thread: Nuclear Explosion in India ... Ancient Alien Technology?
Always look on the bright side of life.

Instant Karma!
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2014 01:04 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
They made it from a dense Iron Ore vein that was already low in impurities. My Theory.

finding out what mine this came from will be vary important in cracking this mystery either way.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


meteoric iron

what type of fuel was used in the several stages

woods/plants produce ashes that can react, unlike only using coal or coke.
 Quoting: Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs 52841803


I think you can get away with using a Charcoal Forge. its easy to make but burns up faster the Coal.

What kind of crusoval do you think they would have used?

Steel?
Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
maybe they pretreated the ore by soaking it in a reactant...if they were big on oxidizing things, who knows.
Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs
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01/12/2014 01:11 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
They made it from a dense Iron Ore vein that was already low in impurities. My Theory.

finding out what mine this came from will be vary important in cracking this mystery either way.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


meteoric iron

what type of fuel was used in the several stages

woods/plants produce ashes that can react, unlike only using coal or coke.
 Quoting: Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs 52841803


I think you can get away with using a Charcoal Forge. its easy to make but burns up faster the Coal.

What kind of crusoval do you think they would have used?

Steel?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


Probably. Also have read that there are indications that they had advanced knowledge in magnetics.

That is, if the Aliens didn't beam the pillar down themselves

5a
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01/12/2014 01:13 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
I melt Aluminum and Bronze with a Charcoal Forge. Iron is harder to melt with it but not impossible. I use regular bees wax and sawdust as a "flux" to lift those impurities out. You can make a flux out of many things. The Indians secret was in the Flux.

could be a fine mix exotic oils and shit. The evidence should be in the Slag for the remains of flux.
Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs
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01/12/2014 01:16 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
I melt Aluminum and Bronze with a Charcoal Forge. Iron is harder to melt with it but not impossible. I use regular bees wax and sawdust as a "flux" to lift those impurities out. You can make a flux out of many things. The Indians secret was in the Flux.

could be a fine mix exotic oils and shit. The evidence should be in the Slag for the remains of flux.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


They probably perfected the sequence of fluxes too.
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01/12/2014 01:17 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
They made it from a dense Iron Ore vein that was already low in impurities. My Theory.

finding out what mine this came from will be vary important in cracking this mystery either way.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


meteoric iron

what type of fuel was used in the several stages

woods/plants produce ashes that can react, unlike only using coal or coke.
 Quoting: Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs 52841803


I think you can get away with using a Charcoal Forge. its easy to make but burns up faster the Coal.

What kind of crusoval do you think they would have used?

Steel?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


Probably. Also have read that there are indications that they had advanced knowledge in magnetics.

That is, if the Aliens didn't beam the pillar down themselves

5a
 Quoting: Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs 52841803


Magnetics to lift impurities maybe. Ive never thought of this, Ill look it up,..and then look at Aliens I promise. rolleyes
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
I melt Aluminum and Bronze with a Charcoal Forge. Iron is harder to melt with it but not impossible. I use regular bees wax and sawdust as a "flux" to lift those impurities out. You can make a flux out of many things. The Indians secret was in the Flux.

could be a fine mix exotic oils and shit. The evidence should be in the Slag for the remains of flux.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45154815


They probably perfected the sequence of fluxes too.
 Quoting: Montclair de Rallo-Tubbs 52841803


That's what I think too now.

The Norse Vikings and Japanese did so why not East Indians?
waterlily  (OP)

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01/12/2014 01:31 PM
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
It is amazing the direction this thread is taking! There are some really educated comments here. The comments on the fluxes and magnetics are far, far beyond what I ever expected.

Thanks so much for all your input, GLPs.

hf

I am going to

bump

this thread for continuing interest
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
G. House

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01/12/2014 01:37 PM

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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Figured out 12 years ago:

[link to www.freerepublic.com]

Metallurgists at Kanpur IIT have discovered that a thin layer of "misawite", a compound of iron, oxygen and hydrogen, has protected the cast iron pillar from rust.

The protective film took form within three years after erection of the pillar and has been growing ever so slowly since then. After 1,600 years, the film has grown just one-twentieth of a millimeter thick, according to R. Balasubramaniam of the IIT.

In a report published in the journal Current Science Balasubramanian says, the protective film was formed catalytically by the presence of high amounts of phosphorous in the iron—as much as one per cent against less than 0.05 per cent in today's iron.


More at the link.
"Everybody lies."
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Corrosion resistance of Delhi iron pillar

Apropos to the article `Delhi iron pillar and nano powder' published in these pages on 29 August, R. Balasubramaniam, Department of Materials & Metallurgical Engineering, IIT, Kanpur, writes:

ALL ASPECTS of the 1600-year old Delhi iron pillar have been addressed in the book published by the author. New insights on the nature of the protective passive layer on the corrosion resistant Delhi iron pillar have now been obtained through modern state-of-art experimental studies.

Rust samples from the pillar were characterised by X-ray diffraction, Fourier transform infrared spectroscopy and Mossbauer spectroscopy.

The major constituents of the scale were crystalline iron hydrogen phosphate hydrate (FePO{-4}H{-3}PO{-4}4H{-2}-O) y-, y-, y-FeOOH and magnetite. The iron oxide/oxyhydroxides were present in the amorphous form. The process of protective rust formation on the Delhi pillar iron could be outlined on the basis of data from the rust analysis.

The iron contains a relatively high percentage of P compared to modern steels, because limestone was not added in the charge of ancient Indian bloomery furnaces.

Initially, the corrosion rate of iron is very high due to the presence of entrapped slag particles. This results in enhancement of surface P content.
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Re: Mysterious Ancient Indian Metal Works Surpass Modern Technology
Corrosion resistance of Delhi iron pillar

Apropos to the article `Delhi iron pillar and nano powder' published in these pages on 29 August, R. Balasubramaniam, Department of Materials & Metallurgical Engineering, IIT, Kanpur, writes:

ALL ASPECTS of the 1600-year old Delhi iron pillar have been addressed in the book published by the author. New insights on the nature of the protective passive layer on the corrosion resistant Delhi iron pillar have now been obtained through modern state-of-art experimental studies.

Rust samples from the pillar were characterised by X-ray diffraction, Fourier transform infrared spectroscopy and Mossbauer spectroscopy.

The major constituents of the scale were crystalline iron hydrogen phosphate hydrate (FePO{-4}H{-3}PO{-4}4H{-2}-O) y-, y-, y-FeOOH and magnetite. The iron oxide/oxyhydroxides were present in the amorphous form. The process of protective rust formation on the Delhi pillar iron could be outlined on the basis of data from the rust analysis.

The iron contains a relatively high percentage of P compared to modern steels, because limestone was not added in the charge of ancient Indian bloomery furnaces.

Initially, the corrosion rate of iron is very high due to the presence of entrapped slag particles. This results in enhancement of surface P content.
[link to www.hindu.com]
 Quoting: Creepy-Ass Cracker


ya I didn't think they used a Carbonate as a flux. The metals content was just unique. that's still really fascinating. They should find the mine it came from and make some Obelisks to inscribe world history on it. That would be cool.





GLP