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UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387

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Luisport (OP)

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04/04/2014 03:40 PM

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387

zerohedge ‏@zerohedge · 12 min
US Threatens Russia With Sanctions Over Petrodollar-Busting Deal [link to www.zerohedge.com]



Gregor Peter ‏@L0gg0l · 19 min
Satellite pictures show Russian military buildup at Belgorod near Ukraine border [link to www.janes.com] … #Ukraine [link to twitter.com (secure)]



 Quoting: Luisport


Luis my friend!!!
That's the escalation I been waiting for!!
Once the petro dollar is under attack, WW3 is just around the corner!!!

PS!! Sorry for not posting so much, got work over my head

hf
 Quoting: Limpan


Yes i agree with you! Don't worry you are here with us! hf
Possum777

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04/04/2014 03:40 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
Good Afternoon Luis!

Bad news for the US about the Petrodollar, but I don't blame Russia and China.

Further US sanctions will be a laugh
Luisport (OP)

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04/04/2014 03:41 PM

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
Good Afternoon Luis!

Bad news for the US about the Petrodollar, but I don't blame Russia and China.

Further US sanctions will be a laugh
 Quoting: Possum777


tounge
Reader.

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04/04/2014 03:44 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
They just closed all MacDonalds in Crimea......Obviously this mean War!

hiding
RBR

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04/04/2014 03:44 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387

zerohedge ‏@zerohedge · 12 min
US Threatens Russia With Sanctions Over Petrodollar-Busting Deal [link to www.zerohedge.com]



Gregor Peter ‏@L0gg0l · 19 min
Satellite pictures show Russian military buildup at Belgorod near Ukraine border [link to www.janes.com] … #Ukraine [link to twitter.com (secure)]



 Quoting: Luisport


Luis my friend!!!
That's the escalation I been waiting for!!
Once the petro dollar is under attack, WW3 is just around the corner!!!

PS!! Sorry for not posting so much, got work over my head

hf
 Quoting: Limpan


Yes i agree with you! Don't worry you are here with us! hf
 Quoting: Luisport


Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 03:44 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
McDonalds chain is closed in Crimea. :( No more bigmacs for the kids. Will be replaced with Putins desert.
Polemarchos

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04/04/2014 03:47 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
I know some things along those lines have happened, I just don't know which act in particular you claim is "economic coercion". You have used words "punishment" and now "retaliation" but the key words are "economic coercion".

And you still haven't defined what it means - I take it, it is because you don't know.

It's a quite narrow concept AFAICT - I think it is limited to cutting off a vital resource for no reason. For example, if Russia said, we will cut off your gas and oil unless you give us Crimea - that would be economic coercion. Sanctions are another form of economic coercion - so what the "West" is currently doing to Russia, that may very well fall under "economic coercion". I just don't know exactly what the words mean :).

But "we will cease granting you favorable trade tariffs if you join EU because it would harm our domestic industries", that to me clearly is not. Even if the result is economically damaging to the other side.
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


Russia did what it did to Moldova too - imposing trade embargoes invoking some sudden failure to conform to sanitary standards or other product standards. See these cases for example:

[link to www.globalpost.com]

[link to www.globalmeatnews.com]

We do have Nuland confessing to spend $5 billion on "democracy" in Ukraine. There is plenty of evidence of various government-funded NGOs being involved in the process. Maybe you will itemize how all that money was spent? Writing a syllabus for a course on civic virtues?
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


That 5 billion $ was spent in 24 years or so to promote rule of law principles, human rights, freedom of the press, minority rights and other stuff NGOs deal with. And maybe joint programs with Ukrainian authorities. From that to "financing mobs to overthrow the government" is a long way.

Some of the support and interference was, however, incontrovertible. When the radicals among the protesters were throwing molotov cocktails and bricks at police, the EU and US were warning Yanukovych and Ukraine of sanctions and other punishment if the government tried to restore order. Then you had US/EU politicians going on stage and encouraging the protesters to instigate regime change. These acts are enough to violate the Budapest Memorandum.
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


EU imposed sanctions after that bloody crackdown in Kiev.

US/EU politicians instigated protesters to do regime change? Really?

The basing agreement allowed Russia forces to leave the base, though I don't know the exact circumstances. But the constitutional president of Ukraine asked for Russian military help to maintain order - that's enough to allow them off the base under the agreements, I would think, I can't say for sure as I don't have the agreements in front of me :).
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


Yeah right so the Russian military "maintained order" by taking control of airports and surrounding Ukrainian soldiers in their bases....

Once the President leaves the country and his location, condition and freedom is not verifiable whatever he says has little value and he is no longer "constitutional". He could be held against his will and made to say something another state/force wants for example. Anyhow, the Russians in Ukraine don't even care about him, they want to unite with Russia. So whatever he says is only used as a pretext. They are not struggling to get him back in power or anything.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
McDonalds chain is closed in Crimea. :( No more bigmacs for the kids. Will be replaced with Putins desert.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54622593


cruise.. LOL LOL LOL
Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 03:50 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
McDonalds chain is closed in Crimea. :( No more bigmacs for the kids. Will be replaced with Putins desert.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54622593


Less fat people in Crimea??

ohyeah
Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 03:52 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
McDonalds chain is closed in Crimea. :( No more bigmacs for the kids. Will be replaced with Putins desert.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54622593


cruise.. LOL LOL LOL
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7901784


Guess they can't supply them properly.
gomeroski

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04/04/2014 04:04 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
I am just putting some more fire on gasoline :-) ...

North Korea tells world to 'wait and see' on new form of nuclear test

North Korea said on Friday that the world would have to "wait and see" when asked for details of "a new form" of nuclear test it threatened to carry out after the UN Security Council condemned Pyongyang's recent ballistic missile launch, Reuters reports.

[link to voiceofrussia.com]


dead3
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7901784


some new type of nuclear cluster bomb?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56432896


low yield, high altitude maybe?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55875488


That in fact describes an EMP bomb.
Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 04:18 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387


some new type of nuclear cluster bomb?


low yield, high altitude maybe?


That in fact describes an EMP bomb.


exactly, was my first though with all the rocket tests lately(not really sure how big the rocket were or if EMP nuke was ever "real-world" tested)
Sun_dancer

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04/04/2014 04:29 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
Russia did what it did to Moldova too - imposing trade embargoes invoking some sudden failure to conform to sanitary standards or other product standards. See these cases for example:

[link to www.globalpost.com]

[link to www.globalmeatnews.com]
 Quoting: Polemarchos


So you still don't know what "economic coercion" means but claim that banning some chocolates and meat products for adulteration - which are very small part of Ukrainian/Russian trade - is "economic coercion"?

You know Russia bans a lot of things for adulteration. GMO crops, radioactive cars, etc.

Indeed every country bans some imports, I have never heard it labeled "economic coercion" before :).
We do have Nuland confessing to spend $5 billion on "democracy" in Ukraine. There is plenty of evidence of various government-funded NGOs being involved in the process. Maybe you will itemize how all that money was spent? Writing a syllabus for a course on civic virtues?
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


That 5 billion $ was spent in 24 years or so to promote rule of law principles, human rights, freedom of the press, minority rights and other stuff NGOs deal with.
 Quoting: Polemarchos


So you say. Frankly if they did that there money was horribly spent :). BTW "human rights" and "freedome of the press" and "minority rights" are not "democracy", they are constitutional rights and anti-democratic. Just sayin'.

But some of us (like me) have been following US meddling in other countries' affairs for 30 years. So forgive me if I don't buy that "it's all for the good of the people" line for a second.

Some of the support and interference was, however, incontrovertible. When the radicals among the protesters were throwing molotov cocktails and bricks at police, the EU and US were warning Yanukovych and Ukraine of sanctions and other punishment if the government tried to restore order. Then you had US/EU politicians going on stage and encouraging the protesters to instigate regime change. These acts are enough to violate the Budapest Memorandum.
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


EU imposed sanctions after that bloody crackdown in Kiev.

US/EU politicians instigated protesters to do regime change? Really?
 Quoting: Polemarchos

EU was threatening sanctions long before Feb. 18. Even in December already. I was living in Kiev at the time, so I am quite aware of what was happening.

You have to bear in mind that the entire presence of the Maidan movement was violent. They took over and blocked the main street in downtown Kiev and occupied government buildings and refused to leave, using violence against police when they tried to restore law and order. When Yanukovych simply tried to clear the street - not break up the protests, mind you, but just remove the barricades and allow traffic through - EU threatened him personally and Ukraine generally with sanctions. It was essentially a siege and military occupation of a part of Kiev - the "opposition leaders" were always instructing not to permit police in, created their own "self-defense units", etc. - they kicked the government out of a critical part of downtown Kiev and even set up a parallel "government" from which they attempted to rule.

This is how I saw it already then (when I was actually quite pro the protests and went to Maidan numerous times), and even more so with benefit of hindsight.

And when Nuland and McCain went to Independence Square and encouraged the protesters - they were in this area, controlled by protesters where police were not allowed. They were encouraging the protesters to keep their "land" they had seized, and to topple the government (which was the primary demand of the leaders - to have the elected President resign to be replaced by somebody not even the protesters voted for). These are just facts.

The basing agreement allowed Russia forces to leave the base, though I don't know the exact circumstances. But the constitutional president of Ukraine asked for Russian military help to maintain order - that's enough to allow them off the base under the agreements, I would think, I can't say for sure as I don't have the agreements in front of me :).
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


Yeah right so the Russian military "maintained order" by taking control of airports and surrounding Ukrainian soldiers in their bases....
 Quoting: Polemarchos

Sure, they (whether it was Russian military or Crimean military or self-defense forces) didn't hurt anybody, but they did stop the military from interfering with the referendum, no?

Once the President leaves the country and his location, condition and freedom is not verifiable whatever he says has little value and he is no longer "constitutional".
 Quoting: Polemarchos


Sorry, that is not how either the Ukrainian constitution or international law works. And this would be the case even if he weren't fleeing for his life from the violent coup government that was trying to arrest and/or kill him.

He could be held against his will and made to say something another state/force wants for example. Anyhow, the Russians in Ukraine don't even care about him, they want to unite with Russia. So whatever he says is only used as a pretext. They are not struggling to get him back in power or anything.
 Quoting: Polemarchos

Speculation and irrelevant. As to nobody wanting him back, I did hear some calls for that from Donetsk people. But given that he was accused of murdering the Heavenly Hundred, he is not so popular in Ukraine (and also accused of stealing $70 billion - I'd say a lot of false and unprovable accusations, but they have been repeated to often by the usurpers of power and the oligarch media that people believe them).

Last Edited by Sun_dancer on 04/04/2014 04:31 PM
Sun_dancer
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387

...


... and in Italy too.

grumpy2
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7901784


As a matter of fact, why doesn't the US just go home already. They are everywhere and constantly occupying some country or having their troops stationed there, citing threats for their national security of a country on the other end of the world. What the heck, isn't it time they leave.

GO HOME USA!

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56430216


The majority of Americans are great people. Why be so rude?
 Quoting: Kent 56434343

You obviously don't live in the United States. Otherwise, you would know this to be untrue. The US government is a reflection of its people.
luispes12

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
bump
~sIcKaNdTwIsTeD~

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
McDonalds chain is closed in Crimea. :( No more bigmacs for the kids. Will be replaced with Putins desert.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54622593


cruise.. LOL LOL LOL
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7901784


Guess they can't supply them properly.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56400788


Trash collection has been placed on hold as fear of war continues to build. McDonald's will reopen its doors after the food requisition supply line errrp, trash collection starts back up.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
I am just putting some more fire on gasoline :-) ...

North Korea tells world to 'wait and see' on new form of nuclear test

North Korea said on Friday that the world would have to "wait and see" when asked for details of "a new form" of nuclear test it threatened to carry out after the UN Security Council condemned Pyongyang's recent ballistic missile launch, Reuters reports.

[link to voiceofrussia.com]


dead3
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7901784


some new type of nuclear cluster bomb?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56432896


low yield, high altitude maybe?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55875488

I think they are going to test a hydrogen bomb. They already stated that they achieved a breakthrough in nuclear fusion. Most people thought that they were lying about a breakthrough in producing the elusive nuclear fusion reactor for propaganda reasons. So far North Korea hasn't lied about their nuclear program. The three tests came just as they announced. I believe the first two tests were probably tests of fission primaries for hydrogen bombs. The third test was probably the test of a battlefield fission bomb, possibly an artillery round. That is why it's yield was higher, yet still smaller than Hiroshima. This upcoming test should produce a much higher magnitude on the seismic scales. I would guess a yield in the hundreds of kilotons, possibly even reaching the megaton range.

kim
djdandew1

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
WASHINGTON, April 4, 2014 (AFP) - Moody's downgrades Ukraine rating, outlook negative

CUT TO Caa3 FROM Caa2

Last Edited by djdandew1 on 04/04/2014 05:04 PM
“This is a memo that describes how we’re going to take out seven countries in five years, starting with Iraq, and then Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and, finishing off, Iran.” General Wesley Clark
Anonymous Coward
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
WASHINGTON, April 4, 2014 (AFP) - Moody's downgrades Ukraine rating, outlook negative

CUT TO Caa3 FROM Caa2
 Quoting: djdandew1


The country is under threat of military invasion and has just been through a coup. Cut them some slack, ya vulture bankers!
Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 05:10 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
zerohedge @zerohedge
UKRAINE CUT TO Caa3 FROM Caa2 BY MOODY'S, OUTLOOK NEGATIVE
djdandew1

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04/04/2014 05:16 PM

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
@ria_novosti 2m
Ukraine Puts Mothballed Mig-29 Fighter Jets Back in Service
“This is a memo that describes how we’re going to take out seven countries in five years, starting with Iraq, and then Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and, finishing off, Iran.” General Wesley Clark
Sun_dancer

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
WASHINGTON, April 4, 2014 (AFP) - Moody's downgrades Ukraine rating, outlook negative

CUT TO Caa3 FROM Caa2
 Quoting: djdandew1


The country is under threat of military invasion and has just been through a coup. Cut them some slack, ya vulture bankers!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54504562

Their biggest danger is not threat of invasion but threat of kleptocracy. Maybe you want to lend Ukraine some of your hard-earned money that the oligarchs and "government" can stick in their pockets and the taxpayers have no foreseeable way to repay? Bankers stopped lending to Ukraine a long time ago .... Last few auctions have failed.

www. ROOTERS .com/article/2014/04/04/idUSL4N0MW3WW20140404 ("citing an escalating political crisis and stressed external liquidity position as Russia withdrew financial support").
Sun_dancer
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04/04/2014 05:24 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
[link to en.itar-tass.com]

Ukraine won't give $1 billion dollars for Russian gas unless Russia loans them $14 billion
Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 05:26 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
In the long run Russia and China have the same imperialistic goals as the USA, the only difference is the way in which they plan to achieve those goals !

I dunno about you guys but if these are my only 3 options, I'm willing to take American imperialism any day over Russia or China !

At least with America at the helm I have Breaking Bad on TV and McDonald's at the corner ! afro
Polemarchos

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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
So you still don't know what "economic coercion" means but claim that banning some chocolates and meat products for adulteration - which are very small part of Ukrainian/Russian trade - is "economic coercion"?

You know Russia bans a lot of things for adulteration. GMO crops, radioactive cars, etc.

Indeed every country bans some imports, I have never heard it labeled "economic coercion" before :).
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


This wasn't some random ban on imports, it was politically motivated and was part of a wider regional game of bans:

[link to www.ft.com]

So you say. Frankly if they did that there money was horribly spent :). BTW "human rights" and "freedome of the press" and "minority rights" are not "democracy", they are constitutional rights and anti-democratic. Just sayin'.

But some of us (like me) have been following US meddling in other countries' affairs for 30 years. So forgive me if I don't buy that "it's all for the good of the people" line for a second.
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


So we have one side "confessing" of meddling. When is a Russian official going to publicly confess about the money Russia spent to influence beliefs and perceptions inside Ukraine? Maybe to stoke Russian nationalism among the Russian ethnics? Or to finance pro-Russian NGOs? Or buy the loyalties of people in the army and secret services? Yeah, never. But not because it didn't happen.

EU was threatening sanctions long before Feb. 18. Even in December already. I was living in Kiev at the time, so I am quite aware of what was happening.

You have to bear in mind that the entire presence of the Maidan movement was violent. They took over and blocked the main street in downtown Kiev and occupied government buildings and refused to leave, using violence against police when they tried to restore law and order. When Yanukovych simply tried to clear the street - not break up the protests, mind you, but just remove the barricades and allow traffic through - EU threatened him personally and Ukraine generally with sanctions. It was essentially a siege and military occupation of a part of Kiev - the "opposition leaders" were always instructing not to permit police in, created their own "self-defense units", etc. - they kicked the government out of a critical part of downtown Kiev and even set up a parallel "government" from which they attempted to rule.
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


True, the EU raised its rhetoric a bit after the anti-democratic protest laws were adopted:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Yanukovych tried to crack down on the protesters, but the authorities abandoned him. And he fled. The interim leadership then set out to organize elections in May. You can call it a coup, others call it a revolution. Whatever it was, it did not mean another country could legally walk in and annex a chunk of Ukraine without that meaning breaking international law. There have been many coups/revolutions all over the world in the past 60 years but how many subsequent annexations?

This is how I saw it already then (when I was actually quite pro the protests and went to Maidan numerous times), and even more so with benefit of hindsight.

And when Nuland and McCain went to Independence Square and encouraged the protesters - they were in this area, controlled by protesters where police were not allowed. They were encouraging the protesters to keep their "land" they had seized, and to topple the government (which was the primary demand of the leaders - to have the elected President resign to be replaced by somebody not even the protesters voted for). These are just facts.
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


A government can resign when faced with massive popular protests. And either a new government is formed or elections are held. Same for a president. Or it can be toppled in parliament. Maybe those EU officials were referring to this, because I really doubt they were calling for the violent toppling of the government. They always talked about political solutions, not mob/violence solutions.

Sorry, that is not how either the Ukrainian constitution or international law works. And this would be the case even if he weren't fleeing for his life from the violent coup government that was trying to arrest and/or kill him.
 Quoting: Sun_dancer


Ukraine has moved on without him. He was left with no allies in Ukraine. He can cry as much as he likes but why didn't the authorities enforce his view of things? After the May 25 elections he is officially history.
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387
[link to en.itar-tass.com]

Ukraine won't give $1 billion dollars for Russian gas unless Russia loans them $14 billion
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54504562


Fact of the matter is, and many other matters, Russia has said they will deal only with a legitimately elected government.
Anonymous Coward
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[link to en.itar-tass.com]

Ukraine won't give $1 billion dollars for Russian gas unless Russia loans them $14 billion
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54504562


laugh
Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 05:34 PM
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Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387

...


As a matter of fact, why doesn't the US just go home already. They are everywhere and constantly occupying some country or having their troops stationed there, citing threats for their national security of a country on the other end of the world. What the heck, isn't it time they leave.

GO HOME USA!

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56430216


The majority of Americans are great people. Why be so rude?
 Quoting: Kent 56434343

You obviously don't live in the United States. Otherwise, you would know this to be untrue. The US government is a reflection of its people.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56367673


i respectfully disagree that this current gooberment is a reflection of the people. maybe the stupid and the dead since they where the majority of voters in 08 and 12 but not everyone.
Anonymous Coward
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04/04/2014 05:35 PM
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[link to en.itar-tass.com]

Ukraine won't give $1 billion dollars for Russian gas unless Russia loans them $14 billion
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54504562


laugh
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56439317


if that works ima tryin it with my mortgage
luispes12

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[link to en.itar-tass.com]

Ukraine won't give $1 billion dollars for Russian gas unless Russia loans them $14 billion
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54504562


laugh
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56439317


if that works ima tryin it with my mortgage
 Quoting: Whynow


wtftounge

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