Gun Control - This is our reality

I am passionate about the issue of gun control, but only have been for the past few years. Before then, I was apathetic. Eventually, I began to recognize increasing government tyranny. Knowing that the police will only arrive after a crime has been committed and living in an urban area, I got smart and bought a gun.

This uptick in sensational shooting sprees so far in 2014, followed by the onslaught of media attention and political jockeying is intriguing. Obama tries to make us feel objected to gun ownership on moral grounds, like we as a people have a responsibility to give up our right to own firearms so that the country will be safer, regardless of whether or not studies show if lower gun ownership actually leads to more safety. This is a moral argument being made by the politicians and media.

Everyone is talking about gun control, and people are very opinionated it seems. I like to get into discussions on social media sites, but the responses in defense of strict gun control are sometimes too much.

This is the kind of argument we're dealing with:


OP posts this article - [link to billmoyers.com]

Me: The answer is more gun ownership and education, not less. It's a lot easier to cause mayhem in a gun free zone.

OP: I disagree [redacted] - There are plenty of owners already, [redacted] although I agree with educating them, it only works if they want to learn?!?!

Me: In states, cities, or counties in the USA where you see very strict gun control laws, you also see higher violent crime. In states, cities, or counties where you see very relaxed gun control laws and high gun ownership, you also see violent crime go down. Here is a Harvard study to illustrate my point.

[link to www.law.harvard.edu]

It is important to note historically that complete eradication of gun ownership almost always leads to mass genocide and elimination or personal freedoms. Nazi Germany, Mao's Red China, Stalin's Soviet Union... the list goes on. This whole campaign about it being "our responsibility" to have "more responsible" gun laws is complete propaganda. These are just buzz words communications people use to make us feel like it's a moral or ethical issue, when clearly it is a control issue. They already do strict background checks. The data clearly shows that increased gun ownership leads to increased safety from violent crimes, not the other way around. Think about it. If you are a criminal, and you know it is very likely that every single home in the neighborhood has at least one if not two gun owners, you will be very unlikely to rob or murder in that neighborhood. Conversely, if you know FOR CERTAIN that individuals in that neighborhood are not allowed to own guns, you can rob and maim as you see fit without the fear of being gunned down midst your crimes. We need much higher individual gun ownership coupled with safety education. This is also to protect us from an increasingly corrupt and militarized police force and a completely insane federal government.

OP: I'm not talking about eradication. Background checks are anything but strict -- you can go online or to a gun show and get them on the spot easily. The buzz words you refer to are serious to me, and many of my friends & family.. Believe me, I have thought about it and have read about it too. It's not about logic. It is about safety, and includes moral and ethical thinking as well as more responsible laws to protect the innocent. I don't have the answers but I pay attention and research everything before I speak. This is my opinion, and I appreciate yours.

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I just left it at that. It wasn't an epic convo or anything. It really gets down to the argument at it's core though, as it often comes down to LOGIC vs. MORALS/ETHICS. At least that what it is supposed to be. If you just take the logic step one part further you will see that it is actually the morally and ethically correct side as well because higher gun ownership leads to lower violent crime. If you aren't for gun ownership, you are for violent crime. So while the gun grabbers claim the moral high ground, try to show them the facts and the data.

Most conservatives are for gun ownership. It is the liberals you need to convince. Though as humans they can be naturally thick headed, calmly explain the correlation between gun laws and violent crime, changed their minds on the moral side and you will win the argument and their minds. Unfortunately, not all will change their minds. Some just lack the brain power. But those that are open minded and smart will have trouble denying the data, and if they continue to not want to believe (because at this point it is a choice) then they aren't as smart as you thought they were.

If you question a liberals' intelligence AND their morals, they really have nothing left and will be forced to change their minds. People who consider themselves progressive or liberal put a lot of their self worth into their intelligence and strong moral fiber, which is why they vote for and are so passionate about ALL of the social issues like abortion, gay rights, environmental rights, climate change, racism and civil rights, women's rights and always tout the high rate of college degreed people that vote democrats.

Look at this article on Politifact: [link to www.politifact.com]

See they put these things out their to make people feel like, "ya see look at all these smart people who have college degrees that are democrat. Anyone who voted republican is more likely to be a high school dropout" It has nothing to do with the education system just being very liberal in general and the college system even moreso. This is complete bullshit used to get stupid people to vote for democratic candidates and so they can feel smarter. It's about how a person views their self worth.

Moral of the story here, is when arguing with a person who considers themselves liberal, avoid logic based arguments, economic arguments or saying anything about government tyranny at all costs. To a liberal, the government is good and only does good things. When it does bad things it was either a mistake, a bad apple, or for the greater good. If you find yourself in an argument focus on facts, hard facts. Use them to get a liberal to question his or her own intelligence, and then swat them with a moral argument supported by those facts.

High gun ownership = high safety from violent crime
Low gun ownership = low safety from violent crime

Force them to show you an example of a country with strict gun laws and low violent crime. They won't be able to because there aren't any.

You can do this.