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If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?

 
Moreinfoplease
User ID: 106184
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07/05/2006 11:54 AM
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If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
I ran into a mason the other day.

Note: I am not starting a thread on the legitamacy of the bible. Just take it for what I say below for the sake of the argument.

He told me the bible was correct, and promptly told me it contradicts itself.

Wait a minute. It's correct yet it contradicts itself? Did he study under Confucious?

Then he tells me that he is not contradicting his own self.

I said God made a bible for us to follow then couldn't this God make sure that despite human interfence that the truth could still be learned?

He says No, (as if this is too big of a task for god). "God probably didnt want everyone to find the truth".

rantI forgot to ask him if masonry is so good then why is it so secretive?
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 11:59 AM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
That's the 69 dollar question isn't it?
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 12:14 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
If Masonry was SO great they would be open about it and evryone would except it themselves. God knows that we are all looking for something better right now.

The only thing I know is this:

When wiccan occultists end a ceremony they say, O mote it be!

When freemasons end theirs, they say, O mote it be!

I also know that there is truth behind the thinking that power corrupts.

And Masons have a strange way of becoming powerful, rich men...
20-40

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07/05/2006 12:21 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
That's the 69 dollar question?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 113001

He should ask: Who is your god ?
Derek One Seven (Viable Light Being) on Spiritual warfare thread:

quote 1: 20-40, you seem to take a page out of Nazi Joesph Goebbells', and Adolf Hitler's handbooks (about need to repeat a lie) THEN:
quote 2: 20-40, it is of no surprise to me that you, an obviously concienceless pervert.
quote 3: 20-40, it is of no surprise to me that you, an obviously concienceless pervert.
quote 4: and you are a liar, with admitted connections to the CIA.
quote 5: you are a hypocritical pervert, with admitted connections to the CIA.
quote 6: you are an obvious concienceless hypocrite and pervert, 20-40.

Over and over and over and over. Same post with few sentences added or omitted, same lies and whatever I have tried to say, he has ignored it, and keep posting the same.
BTW, I swear on bible that I have never tried to warn him about misspelled word "concienceless".
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 12:22 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
bartmoon
W. W. Raupp

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07/05/2006 12:22 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
MONEY!
To shape the world is to become immortal
Spiritheart

User ID: 106182
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07/05/2006 12:26 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
If you could understand a paradox when you see one, your questions would be answered.
All seen things are temporary. All unseen things are eternal. Take time and know that what you seek is like music; it sweeps you aloft so you are moving in glory among the stars.
Take time to find the unseen."
- A Wrinkle in Time
Moreinfoplease (OP)
User ID: 106184
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07/05/2006 12:28 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
I agree with all of you except bart. Anyways its hillarious because he thought I knew nothing about masons, but I have done some research.

For instance he told me in the bible its shows Hiram Abif was assasinated.

I asked him where?

He showed me a scripture talking about the killing of "men". These men where killed because they raped a woman and her brothers returned to avenge her.

He says my bible is translating it wrong and he could show me in his king james. I told him to go get it.

He reply's with the weak excuse that he doesnt want to get it because he has undelined scriptures. Sure...
The Dame Tamer
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07/05/2006 12:32 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
Freemasony in the USA is not secret. Freemasons meet in public; a square and compass is on the exterior of every 'Lodge'.

Masonic meetings and charity events are mentioned proudly in local newspapers. Contact information for your local Lodge can be found in the Yellow Pages under "Fraternal Organizations".

You can learn virtually everthing about it's ceremonies, symbolism, history and philosophy in many the books available.

The only thing "secret" are the words and signs of each degree.

Alas, freemasons cannot solict membership, so it might seem to the uninitiated that freemasonry is secret, stand-offish, or elitist. None of this is true.

Prospective candidates must apply for membership of their own free will and accord. 2 B 1 Ask 1
Moreinfoplease (OP)
User ID: 106184
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07/05/2006 12:38 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
My research has shown that lower masons are lied to as to the true nature of their association. The truth is therefore a secret to many of its own members.

The mason I have met are intent on keeping what they know 'secret'. Therefore by their own admission they are secretive as I have stated above.

Just because you can buy books on them or ask to join doesnt mean they are not secretive. Please dont try to mislead based on the fact that they have a public face.
The Dame Tamer
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07/05/2006 12:38 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
I agree with all of you except bart. Anyways its hillarious because he thought I knew nothing about masons, but I have done some research.

For instance he told me in the bible its shows Hiram Abif was assasinated.

I asked him where?

He showed me a scripture talking about the killing of "men". These men where killed because they raped a woman and her brothers returned to avenge her.

He says my bible is translating it wrong and he could show me in his king james. I told him to go get it.

He reply's with the weak excuse that he doesnt want to get it because he has undelined scriptures. Sure...
 Quoting: Moreinfoplease 106184



The legend of Hiram Abiff is an allegory - loosly based on the historical architect of the temple.

Masonic ritual is based on Old Testament stories used to teach us how mankind can live a moral, productive life aligned with the wishes of our creator.
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 12:39 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
If Masonry is so bad why is it so secretive?
The Dame Tamer
User ID: 105835
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07/05/2006 12:40 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
My research has shown that lower masons are lied to as to the true nature of their association. The truth is therefore a secret to many of its own members.

The mason I have met are intent on keeping what they know 'secret'. Therefore by their own admission they are secretive as I have stated above.

Just because you can buy books on them or ask to join doesnt mean they are not secretive. Please dont try to mislead based on the fact that they have a public face.
 Quoting: Moreinfoplease 106184



If you have already made up your mind about freemasonry than why do you require "Moreinfoplease".
Anonymous Coward
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Netherlands
07/05/2006 12:41 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
Its secretive cus the vatican tryd 2 holocaust them over the centuries cus they r trying 2 protects 'god's word'
With 'god's word' i mean what the vatican thinks is god's word.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 80475
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07/05/2006 12:45 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
Asymmetric non-reciprocal networking is bad. That's the most important message in the bible. Freemasonry is based upon this bad style of networking, but when people get caught up in a system they feel the need to defend and justify their choice.
The Dame Tamer
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07/05/2006 12:49 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
My research has shown that lower masons are lied to as to the true nature of their association. The truth is therefore a secret to many of its own members.
 Quoting: Moreinfoplease 106184


The Master Mason or 3rd Degree is the "highest" degree of Freemasonry.

Any Master Mason in good standing and with the desire is encouraged to be active as an officer in the lodge, eventually becoming Worshipful Master. From there, any mason can ascend to whatever leadership postition they desire.

The mason I have met are intent on keeping what they know 'secret'. Therefore by their own admission they are secretive as I have stated above.
 Quoting: Moreinfoplease 106184


Yes, the ritual require a mason to keep secret the words and signs of each degree by pentaly of death.

If you want to learn the what freemasonry is about, apply for membership.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 112398
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07/05/2006 12:55 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
I ran into a mason the other day.

Note: I am not starting a thread on the legitamacy of the bible. Just take it for what I say below for the sake of the argument.

He told me the bible was correct, and promptly told me it contradicts itself.

Wait a minute. It's correct yet it contradicts itself? Did he study under Confucious?

Then he tells me that he is not contradicting his own self.

I said God made a bible for us to follow then couldn't this God make sure that despite human interfence that the truth could still be learned?

He says No, (as if this is too big of a task for god). "God probably didnt want everyone to find the truth".

rantI forgot to ask him if masonry is so good then why is it so secretive?
 Quoting: Moreinfoplease 106184


The Holy Bible is in code. It IS correct esoterically/symbolically but most folk "don't have eyes to see"...especially Christian Zealots who only see the exoteric - the outer meaning. You don't throw pearls before swine.
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 12:55 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
If you take two different cultures, one based on symmetry and the other on asymmetry, and combine them into a single community what you'll find is that the subgroup based on symmetry will end up dominating the other group. History shows this pattern again and again and again ad nauseum but people never learn.
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 12:57 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
All things made by God that are natural are created with symmetry.

All things that are made by man that are bad have asymmetry.
Anonymous Coward
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United Kingdom
07/05/2006 12:59 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
My research has shown that lower masons are lied to as to the true nature of their association. The truth is therefore a secret to many of its own members.

The mason I have met are intent on keeping what they know 'secret'. Therefore by their own admission they are secretive as I have stated above.

Just because you can buy books on them or ask to join doesnt mean they are not secretive. Please dont try to mislead based on the fact that they have a public face.
 Quoting: Moreinfoplease 106184


That is very true!
The Dame Tamer
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07/05/2006 01:04 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
Its secretive cus the vatican tryd 2 holocaust them over the centuries
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 74191


Yes, to protect themselves (at that time in history) from the vatican or other other religious and political totalitarian groups. What is interesting historically is that when the "state" becomes fascist, the first thing to be removed from society are the freemasons.


Also, freemasony is derived from specualtive stone-masonry. Stone masons keep secrets of their craft (ie. their building methods, mathematical abilites, etc.) to remain employed - just like trade unions do today.

If you want to become a carpenter today (Entered Apprentice), for example, you need a journeyman to teach you the skills of a carpenter (Fellow Craft) and eventually you can become a general contractor with your own business (Master Mason).

And if you work on a union job, you have to go to union school, (degees of freemasony) and pay union dues, (lodge dues) and what you receive for your labor? Besides staying gainfully employed, as a union member you are elligle for retirement and health benefits (knowldege of God's plan).

Simple, huh?
The Dame Tamer
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07/05/2006 01:06 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
All things made by God that are natural are created with symmetry.

All things that are made by man that are bad have asymmetry.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 80475


Not necessarily bad, but in masonic allegory, the rough and perfect ashlar.
Moreinfoplease (OP)
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07/05/2006 01:08 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
105835 and other masons in this thread.

105835 what you said sounds reasonable enough except for the fact that you have accepted the possibility of DEATH by BEHEADING if you tell others the secrets of GOD?

Wow your god is very loving. So you swear an oath to be killed if you tell people about the inner workings of you rituals which God has given you to do?
Moreinfoplease (OP)
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07/05/2006 01:09 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
The mason I spoke of the assination of Hiram Abif as it was factual not an allegory. He was very self assured he knew all, but he didn't know this was an allegory.

Has he been lied to? Will he learn the truth when he gets higher up into the order?
Anail

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07/05/2006 01:14 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
Is that you, SoT?
Moreinfoplease (OP)
User ID: 106184
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07/05/2006 01:15 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
Sorry dont know who SoT is
Anail

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07/05/2006 01:17 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
Lucky you.
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 01:21 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
no one would have met in secret if someone else wasn't killing people for telling the truth
who built the roads?
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 01:23 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
.´.

Freemasons are but the personal armies of the NWO and TPTB. They are just soldiers. You dont tell the grand plan to the soldiers, you just give them enough information so they can fulfill their orders.

.´.

Idol1

Meanwile, all the power and prestige they share becouse of the Order, along with a million other reasons, makes them fell and believe that they are better and have more understanding about 'god', humanity and the universe tham us, mere mortals.

They really believe they are doing the work of god. But only after many degrees they will find out what god is it that they are serving.

I have reasons to believe some kind of non-human entity actually contacts those 33° and above in a very secret ceremonial ritual, and presents itselfe as god and as the creator. This 'buys' almost ethernal loyalty and secrecy from those Grand-Grand-Grand-Masters

Its a shame, lots of great people get cautgh on this spider-web that is freemansory. The spider web is actually on of their symbols.

.`.
The Dame Tamer
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07/05/2006 01:23 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
105835 and other masons in this thread.

105835 what you said sounds reasonable enough except for the fact that you have accepted the possibility of DEATH by BEHEADING if you tell others the secrets of GOD?

Wow your god is very loving. So you swear an oath to be killed if you tell people about the inner workings of you rituals which God has given you to do?
 Quoting: Moreinfoplease 106184



That is a distortion of the truth.

The obligation of a candidate doesn't say a freemason or God will harm a another mason who imparts the words or signs of freemasonry to a non-freemason.

The ritual says IF i impart the words or signs then let _____ happen to me.

In another context, It's like your hangin' out your friends and you say "if I get out of line, somebody slap me. I know better than that".
Anonymous Coward
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07/05/2006 01:29 PM
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Re: If Masonry is so good why is it so secretive?
That is a distortion of the truth.

The obligation of a candidate doesn't say a freemason or God will harm a another mason who imparts the words or signs of freemasonry to a non-freemason.

The ritual says IF i impart the words or signs then let _____ happen to me.

In another context, It's like your hangin' out your friends and you say "if I get out of line, somebody slap me. I know better than that".
 Quoting: The Dame Tamer 105835



Sounds very open to me!

Hahahahahaha...

rolleyes

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