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HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid?
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184
7/18/2006 9:46 AM
Report abusive post | HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid?
| Quote |
HI GLP.
I have a legal/financial issue that may be going to court soon. I cannot afford to lose!
I lost my job some time ago and was unable to keep up on payments for a car loan.
While considering declaring bankruptcy I discovered the 'Straw man'/Soveriegnty websites out there. Here are the sites i have found.
[link to www.worldnewsstand.net]
[link to www.the7thfire.com]
[link to www.halexandria.org]
[link to www.wealth4freedom.com]
Does anyone know if this stuff really works? Any legal eagles out there can tell me about this or if there is an alternative recourse?
I need someone who is not just preprogrammed by the system but someone who has tried it. |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 9:47 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
While I only owed 6,000 when it got sent to lawyers they say I owe $16,000. BASTARDS |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 42896
7/18/2006 9:57 AM | |
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 9482
7/18/2006 10:02 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
It will only work in the sense that you pay them some money for a CD/Book/Tape and they get richer thereby forstalling their bankruptcy while pushing you closer to yours and instilling a blind hope in fatally flawed logic.
YOU borrowed money to buy a car and YOU have to pay it back. Sorry, but life is tough at times. There is no miracle solution that can be bought off an internet website. |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 10:12 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
42896
Thanks for the info. I expect that it will be difficult to pull off as TPTB never want to part with a slave or with money. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 118505
7/18/2006 10:35 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Just kill the slave owners. Simple. Fuck legality. Kill your way to freedom. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 42896
7/18/2006 10:54 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Just kill the slave owners. Simple. Fuck legality. Kill your way to freedom. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 118505
There is another answer short of civil war and without the bloodshed and destructiion. Take command of the money system. Decentralize. Centralied money and centralized power are a symbiotic pair.
Power brokers agree on the principles of the communist manifesto; especially the fifth plank.
In the meantime, read the "Dispatch of Merchants" here: [link to www.famguardian.org] |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 9482
7/18/2006 11:01 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
You people talk as though the money system is devised as a way to keep you down. It's not. YOU CHOOSE to take loans and/or credit cards. YOU CHOOSE to use them to accumulate debt. Then when YOUR CHOICES prove to be bad, you blame the system. Ever hear of personal accountability? |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
7/18/2006 11:01 AM
 | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
dude. I think i responded to your issue earlier.
what you will find is that the so called "loan" was sold by the bank to either a mortgage company or sent to the Federal Reserve directly.
the only thing you need to do is insist on inspecting the ORIGINAL NOTE!
Go ahead...tell them you will pay off the amount due, but you want to inspect the original note!
they won't be able to produce it!
guess what, no note..no debt.
i've used it at least 6 times on debt collection scumbags and it's worked every time.
fuck them and their bogus papers.
forget the strawman bullshit. it's true to a degree, but its so convoluted no one has ever made it work.
NO NOTE NO DEBT. that is well rooted in commercial law, but people are too stupid to get it.
and fuck those people that say it can't be done.
and OP....you didn't pay a cent for this info. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
7/18/2006 11:03 AM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
You people talk as though the money system is devised as a way to keep you down. It's not. YOU CHOOSE to take loans and/or credit cards. YOU CHOOSE to use them to accumulate debt. Then when YOUR CHOICES prove to be bad, you blame the system. Ever hear of personal accountability? Quoting: Anonymous Coward 9482
you are a loser and have a losers mentality
the system has dumbed down americans and taken away their money and replaced it with FRN's. not that americans aren't to blame...but why perpetuate the bullshit??
sheep |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
7/18/2006 11:04 AM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
9482====loser and bullshit hack |
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GREY LENSMAN  
Forum Moderator
User ID: 118620
7/18/2006 11:07 AM
 | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
SHIBUMI, I BELIEVE YOU ARE CORRECT, FOR THE AGENCY TO COLLECT THEY MUST PROVE THE DEBT IF CHALLENGED. I ALSO READ THAT CORRESPONDANCE ASKING FOR THE PROOF SHOULD BE SUBMITTED TO PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE AS THEN COURT CANNOT REFUSE TO TAKE IT AS EVIDENCE.
STRAW MAN AND PROOF OF DEBT ARE VALID BUT ANY CASE AGAINST THE SYSTEM IS STACKED AGAINST YOU.
THE ABSOLUTE LEGALITY OF CREDIT CARD DEBT, THE WAY THEY DOUBLE OR TREBLE IT, SHOULD YOU GET A PROBELM AND THEIR SWEET TALK, DISCUSS YOU PROBLEM WITH US SO THAT THEY CAN THEN SELL IT AT A PROFIT BEGGARS BELIEF.
GL |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 118505
7/18/2006 11:09 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
dude. I think i responded to your issue earlier.
what you will find is that the so called "loan" was sold by the bank to either a mortgage company or sent to the Federal Reserve directly.
the only thing you need to do is insist on inspecting the ORIGINAL NOTE!
Go ahead...tell them you will pay off the amount due, but you want to inspect the original note!
they won't be able to produce it!
guess what, no note..no debt.
i've used it at least 6 times on debt collection scumbags and it's worked every time.
fuck them and their bogus papers.
forget the strawman bullshit. it's true to a degree, but its so convoluted no one has ever made it work.
NO NOTE NO DEBT. that is well rooted in commercial law, but people are too stupid to get it.
and fuck those people that say it can't be done.
and OP....you didn't pay a cent for this info. Quoting: shibumi2
TEACH ME MORE. Please..
 |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:19 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
MAN YOU GUYS ROCK! |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:21 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
dude. I think i responded to your issue earlier.
what you will find is that the so called "loan" was sold by the bank to either a mortgage company or sent to the Federal Reserve directly.
the only thing you need to do is insist on inspecting the ORIGINAL NOTE!
Go ahead...tell them you will pay off the amount due, but you want to inspect the original note!
they won't be able to produce it!
guess what, no note..no debt.
i've used it at least 6 times on debt collection scumbags and it's worked every time.
fuck them and their bogus papers.
forget the strawman bullshit. it's true to a degree, but its so convoluted no one has ever made it work.
NO NOTE NO DEBT. that is well rooted in commercial law, but people are too stupid to get it.
and fuck those people that say it can't be done.
and OP....you didn't pay a cent for this info. Quoting: shibumi2
TEACH ME MORE PLEASE!
ANY Websites i should reasearch first?
 |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 9482
7/18/2006 11:23 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
"9482====loser and bullshit hack"
So basically you want to borrow money from a lender then not pay them back because they sold the debt the right to collect the debt to someone else?
Who is the real loser and hack in this scenario? Say hello to ZERO credit score. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:30 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
9482 doesnt realize the entire system is based on fraud. Its designed to screw us over. The fact that I borrowed money doesnt mean that I wasnt unknowingly being defrauded.
If it is based on fraud on the lenders side (which it is) then it is a non-valid debt. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
7/18/2006 11:31 AM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Hey GL...you're right, mostly.
the fact, well founded in common law and backed by solid case law is that someone trying to collect a debt MUST PROVE THE EXISTANCE OF THE DEBT.
In a commercial note with a NATIONAL bank (Citibank/Bank 1, Wells Fargo...all the large banks) the original (signed) mortgage is LONG GONE. Credit cards too. I once got a credit card ONLINE...there never was a fucking signature...I told them to go pound sand...and they went away.
Can a copy of a mortgage suffice in a collection action???? NOPE.
UNLESS...the person that actually made the copy will sign an affidavit and testify under oath that the inspected the original (word for word) and it is identical to the copy. No one would do that because no one did. In any event, there is no way for that person to be identified. NO MATERIAL WITNESS.
SO, some bogus institution presents a COPY of a mortgage, credit card statement or WHATEVER....how many people challenge that and say they want to see the original???? ANSWER==almost zero. So, if you don't challenge it, the court assumes it's valid. And why wouldn't they. Court is lawful to do that.
Attorneys will almost ALWAYS get YOU to TESTIFY AGAINST YOURSELF!!! As in....Mr. Dumbshit, is that your signature on the vehicle loan application? ...... Mr. Dumbshit...UH, I guess so.
Guess what...you just authenticated the signature and hung yourself. BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE OUT THERE CAN AUTHENTICATE YOUR SIGNATURE...you are the only one that can do so. So say...I don't know...it's a copy...I sign a lot of papers...and you know with scanners and Photoshop I've heard that convincing documents that look authentic can be produced...
if you don't authenticate your own signature and they don't have an ORIGINAL note....how do they prove anything???????
FUCK...it's so simple and it works...its worked for me every time i've used it!!
FUCK YEAH.. SHOW ME THE ORIGINAL NOTE< BITCH.
Actually, don't do that. DOn't let it get into a court setting---and be polite....don't create enemies even if the scumbags are making your life miserable. You will make their life miserable by cutting them off from the source of your money.
When the original demand for payment comes, start a paper trail, and send everything in writing certified, return receipt. I WANT TO INSPECT THE ORIGINAL NOTE.
don't talk to ANYONE on the phone...it does no good anyway.
SHOW ME THE ORIGINAL NOTE |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:33 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
THE ABSOLUTE LEGALITY OF CREDIT CARD DEBT, THE WAY THEY DOUBLE OR TREBLE IT, SHOULD YOU GET A PROBELM AND THEIR SWEET TALK, DISCUSS YOU PROBLEM WITH US SO THAT THEY CAN THEN SELL IT AT A PROFIT BEGGARS BELIEF.
GL Quoting: GREY LENSMAN
I am loosing you meaning in here GL. Please restate/clarify. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 118505
7/18/2006 11:36 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Hey GL...you're right, mostly.
the fact, well founded in common law and backed by solid case law is that someone trying to collect a debt MUST PROVE THE EXISTANCE OF THE DEBT.
In a commercial note with a NATIONAL bank (Citibank/Bank 1, Wells Fargo...all the large banks) the original (signed) mortgage is LONG GONE. Credit cards too. I once got a credit card ONLINE...there never was a fucking signature...I told them to go pound sand...and they went away.
Can a copy of a mortgage suffice in a collection action???? NOPE.
UNLESS...the person that actually made the copy will sign an affidavit and testify under oath that the inspected the original (word for word) and it is identical to the copy. No one would do that because no one did. In any event, there is no way for that person to be identified. NO MATERIAL WITNESS.
SO, some bogus institution presents a COPY of a mortgage, credit card statement or WHATEVER....how many people challenge that and say they want to see the original???? ANSWER==almost zero. So, if you don't challenge it, the court assumes it's valid. And why wouldn't they. Court is lawful to do that.
Attorneys will almost ALWAYS get YOU to TESTIFY AGAINST YOURSELF!!! As in....Mr. Dumbshit, is that your signature on the vehicle loan application? ...... Mr. Dumbshit...UH, I guess so.
Guess what...you just authenticated the signature and hung yourself. BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE OUT THERE CAN AUTHENTICATE YOUR SIGNATURE...you are the only one that can do so. So say...I don't know...it's a copy...I sign a lot of papers...and you know with scanners and Photoshop I've heard that convincing documents that look authentic can be produced...
if you don't authenticate your own signature and they don't have an ORIGINAL note....how do they prove anything???????
FUCK...it's so simple and it works...its worked for me every time i've used it!!
FUCK YEAH.. SHOW ME THE ORIGINAL NOTE< BITCH.
Actually, don't do that. DOn't let it get into a court setting---and be polite....don't create enemies even if the scumbags are making your life miserable. You will make their life miserable by cutting them off from the source of your money.
When the original demand for payment comes, start a paper trail, and send everything in writing certified, return receipt. I WANT TO INSPECT THE ORIGINAL NOTE.
don't talk to ANYONE on the phone...it does no good anyway.
SHOW ME THE ORIGINAL NOTE Quoting: shibumi2
You've won, dude. I may be a sheeple to nice sounding arguments, but this rings as true. I got some laughs as well.
I'll tell my family about this method of liberty. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
7/18/2006 11:36 AM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
9482 doesnt realize the entire system is based on fraud. Its designed to screw us over. The fact that I borrowed money doesnt mean that I wasnt unknowingly being defrauded.
If it is based on fraud on the lenders side (which it is) then it is a non-valid debt. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 106184
yup. check out the difference between unlawful and illegal....look up the definition of a SOVERIGN...
learn the difference between a democracy and a REPUBLIC...figure out how a state citizen (you) is being bled dry by the federal/fraud government.
why is their such an emphasis on everyone APPLYING for a SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER...and what the fuck does NEXUS mean??
look at what is printed on the early FEDERAL RESERVE PAPERS and what words they removed which, in one fell swoop, bankrupted an entire country of its wealth in the greatest fraud in the history of the world.
americans may be the dumbest people in the history of the world...but i believe there is an awakening at hand. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
7/18/2006 11:39 AM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Hey GL...you're right, mostly.
the fact, well founded in common law and backed by solid case law is that someone trying to collect a debt MUST PROVE THE EXISTANCE OF THE DEBT.
In a commercial note with a NATIONAL bank (Citibank/Bank 1, Wells Fargo...all the large banks) the original (signed) mortgage is LONG GONE. Credit cards too. I once got a credit card ONLINE...there never was a fucking signature...I told them to go pound sand...and they went away.
Can a copy of a mortgage suffice in a collection action???? NOPE.
UNLESS...the person that actually made the copy will sign an affidavit and testify under oath that the inspected the original (word for word) and it is identical to the copy. No one would do that because no one did. In any event, there is no way for that person to be identified. NO MATERIAL WITNESS.
SO, some bogus institution presents a COPY of a mortgage, credit card statement or WHATEVER....how many people challenge that and say they want to see the original???? ANSWER==almost zero. So, if you don't challenge it, the court assumes it's valid. And why wouldn't they. Court is lawful to do that.
Attorneys will almost ALWAYS get YOU to TESTIFY AGAINST YOURSELF!!! As in....Mr. Dumbshit, is that your signature on the vehicle loan application? ...... Mr. Dumbshit...UH, I guess so.
Guess what...you just authenticated the signature and hung yourself. BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE OUT THERE CAN AUTHENTICATE YOUR SIGNATURE...you are the only one that can do so. So say...I don't know...it's a copy...I sign a lot of papers...and you know with scanners and Photoshop I've heard that convincing documents that look authentic can be produced...
if you don't authenticate your own signature and they don't have an ORIGINAL note....how do they prove anything???????
FUCK...it's so simple and it works...its worked for me every time i've used it!!
FUCK YEAH.. SHOW ME THE ORIGINAL NOTE< BITCH.
Actually, don't do that. DOn't let it get into a court setting---and be polite....don't create enemies even if the scumbags are making your life miserable. You will make their life miserable by cutting them off from the source of your money.
When the original demand for payment comes, start a paper trail, and send everything in writing certified, return receipt. I WANT TO INSPECT THE ORIGINAL NOTE.
don't talk to ANYONE on the phone...it does no good anyway.
SHOW ME THE ORIGINAL NOTE
You've won, dude. I may be a sheeple to nice sounding arguments, but this rings as true. I got some laughs as well.
I'll tell my family about this method of liberty. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 118505
DUDE...if you learn the truth, and you're SMART enough to embrace the new knowledge...even though it is contrary to a lifetime of brainwashing/television viewing...YOU, dude, and your family are the WINNERS.
I'm telling you not to embarass or humiliate...but to awaken. It took me about two years to learn the truth...its out there, believe ti.
KUDOS to you for having an open mind. |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:41 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
shibumi2 and GREY ROCK!
You have made my day!  |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
7/18/2006 11:41 AM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
While I only owed 6,000 when it got sent to lawyers they say I owe $16,000. BASTARDS Quoting: BrokeAC 106184
what is the breakdown of these $10,000 of extra fees.
make sure and get it detailed in writing...you can use it to hang them later with your own lawsuit against them for FRAUD |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:42 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
shibumi2
I can ask the company to produce the original note outside of court? Will they actually send it to me? (the original that is)? |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 9482
7/18/2006 11:45 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
"9482 doesnt realize the entire system is based on fraud. Its designed to screw us over. The fact that I borrowed money doesnt mean that I wasnt unknowingly being defrauded."
So basically you are a dumbass who can't read and understand a debt instrument? |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 9482
7/18/2006 11:47 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
"Credit cards too. I once got a credit card ONLINE...there never was a fucking signature...I told them to go pound sand...and they went away."
So you admit you obtained a credit card online, then claim that since you didn't sign anything, you don't owe the money because they cant prove it? I guess this is admittance enough that you obtained the debt. Shame they can't bust your fradulent ass. |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:48 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
9482 == ignorant slave
not that I havent been, but I am learning how not to be one.
Anyone can read a debt istrument 9482, but not everyone understands the system is built on lies and defrauding you.
You probably believe the stock market is 'free' and that you are not a slave cuz the media says we are 'free'.
You probably still think Iraq has weapons of mass destruction too.
 |
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GREY LENSMAN
User ID: 118620
7/18/2006 11:52 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
I WAS REFERRING TO THE ADVICE " CONTACT YOUR LENDER AS SOON AS YOU HAVE PROBLEMS, TOGETHER YOU CAN WORK SOMETHING OUT"
NOBODY I KNOW HAS SUCCEEDED IN THAT. TELLING THEM YOUR WOES SEEMS TO BE A SIGNAL FOR SOME CLERK TO LOAD UP THE DEBT, DISCOUNT IT AND SELL IT AT NO LOSS TO THEM BEFORE YOU HAVE EVEN PUT THE PHONE DOWN.
FRIEND OF MINE HAD THREE PHONE CALLS IN A COUPLE OF HOURS DEMANDING INSTANT PAYMENT, NOW, FOR USD 2. SHE COULD NOT STAND IT, DROVE INTO TOWN PAID IT AND WHEN SHE RETURNED GOT ANOTHER CALL DEMANIDING INSTANT PAYMENT.
ALL I CAN SAY IS "FUCKING UNBELIEVABLE"
GL |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 9482
7/18/2006 11:55 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Well it is good to see that all the self-rightous woo-woo's are not confined to 9/11 and Bush hating, but also deeply involved in the realm of monetary and credit policy and law.
 |
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BrokeAC
User ID: 106184 (OP)
7/18/2006 11:59 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
SHIBUMI2
I can ask the company to produce the original note outside of court? Will they actually send it to me? (the original that is)? |
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