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HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid?
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MonkeyTornado
User ID: 134466
8/22/2006 5:25 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
I just found your thread doing a search for something else and I'm curious how you know that a county recorder can't refuse a document. Do you have a code you can quote to back that up? I tried filing some papers in California and they wouldn't accept it asking me to find a code that allows them to file it. They were POA docs for my straw man.
Shibumi2
I am interested in the info. You can mail it to me if you wish. Scanned is fine with me also.
I have bad news as I was not able to reach the court house in time to file the papers yesterday and my 35 day limit expired. I was on my way from work and wouldnt you know it....an accident jammed traffic up.
I think they are getting the default judgement against me. I am sending my sister up to file it today if they say it is still valid to submit it and if they say it will be considered.
I am screwed if they wont consider it.
Just to make sure you're clear on this....THEY HAVE TO ACCEPT YOUR FILING. The clerk of court has no discretion to accept or not accept. The date on the summons means nothing and the clerk is probably not even aware of it.
MAKE SURE AND FILE TODAY! Seriously. |
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CAPTAIN BUCKNER
User ID: 135966
8/26/2006 12:46 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Are there any more methods of cheating the system that I should know about? Thanks for your time  |
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Moreinfoplease
User ID: 143186
9/13/2006 3:53 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
YEAH SHIBUMI2 IS DA MAN!!!
THEY DROPPED THE COURT CASE AGAINST ME. YOU WERE RIGHT. LET THEM KNOW YOU KNOW THEIR SCAM AND GAME OVER!!!
THAT'S $16,000 I dont have to pay. ANYONE IN FINANCIAL TROUBLE SHOULD REREAD THIS THREAD.
The famous Jewish historian Josephus attests to its authenticity. He says that Alexander the Great, during his war against Persia in the fourth century B.C.E., came to Jerusalem, where the priests showed him a copy of the book of Daniel. Alexander himself concluded that the words of Daniel’s prophecy that were pointed out to him referred to his own military campaign involving Persia. This would have been about a century and a half before the “forgery” as proposed by critics. |
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Moreinfoplease
User ID: 143186
9/13/2006 4:00 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
YAY FOR THE GLP FINANCIAL ADVISORY GROUP!
The famous Jewish historian Josephus attests to its authenticity. He says that Alexander the Great, during his war against Persia in the fourth century B.C.E., came to Jerusalem, where the priests showed him a copy of the book of Daniel. Alexander himself concluded that the words of Daniel’s prophecy that were pointed out to him referred to his own military campaign involving Persia. This would have been about a century and a half before the “forgery” as proposed by critics. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 76936
9/13/2006 5:22 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Wow, I just now found this thread (thanks for bumping it) Great info... a keeper for sure! |
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Moreinfoplease
User ID: 143186
9/13/2006 5:33 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Also i learned that NJ case law supports that the UCC 4 year statute of limitations applies. There for the SOL is not 6 years but is indeed 4 years!
Its up to you too mention that tho! They arent going to bring it up!
This most like likely will stand up in any state since UCC-1 is used everywhere.
The famous Jewish historian Josephus attests to its authenticity. He says that Alexander the Great, during his war against Persia in the fourth century B.C.E., came to Jerusalem, where the priests showed him a copy of the book of Daniel. Alexander himself concluded that the words of Daniel’s prophecy that were pointed out to him referred to his own military campaign involving Persia. This would have been about a century and a half before the “forgery” as proposed by critics. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 62244
9/14/2006 8:09 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
It's been nearly 3 months and counting that the creeps at DMV should have suspended my licence and so far......
NOT A PEEP
I think it's safe to say I called their bluff. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 117085
9/14/2006 10:58 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Shibumi2,
so does any of this apply to student loans? sure they are backed by the government or whatever, but didn't you sign a contract with them too... why should they be any different? why shouldn't i go after these liars just the same as i would go after anyone else.
there was a thread on her within the last week and people were talking about how bad sallie mae has become, some were stating sallie mae at this point is no different than credit cards/banks in the way that they treat you anymore... if you fall behind that is.
for all you dickheads who state... why don't you just pay your bills... i would but getting run over(in my car) by some asshole kid running from the police kind of threw a monkey wrench in my life. |
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mrmitee
User ID: 144595
9/17/2006 9:19 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Check out this video:
[link to video.google.com]
or just google "Bursting Bubbles of Government Deception"
Some good stuff there... |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 12:58 PM
 | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Shibumi2,
so does any of this apply to student loans? sure they are backed by the government or whatever, but didn't you sign a contract with them too... why should they be any different? why shouldn't i go after these liars just the same as i would go after anyone else.
there was a thread on her within the last week and people were talking about how bad sallie mae has become, some were stating sallie mae at this point is no different than credit cards/banks in the way that they treat you anymore... if you fall behind that is.
for all you dickheads who state... why don't you just pay your bills... i would but getting run over(in my car) by some asshole kid running from the police kind of threw a monkey wrench in my life. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 117085
the techniques above are effective against THIRD PARTY DEBT COLLECTORS that fraudulently pursue claims against people and have no legal or lawful standing to do so.
The essential elements in the process are the same for the items you mention, although the specifics differ somewhat.
However, MAKE THEM PRODUCE THE ORIGINAL SIGNED DOCUMENT....IF THEY CAN'T OR WON'T...CASE CLOSED |
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CHIEF NUT
User ID: 117085
9/18/2006 1:26 PM
 | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
thanks,
i hate people looking down their noses at me, pisses me off and makes me even more determined to beat them. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 1:58 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
It's not hard CN...but you do have to educate yourself and make the effort to learn.
The OP of this thread went from 0-100 in 2 seconds...literally went from knowing nothing to getting a $16K "debt" discharged in under 2 months. Follow the thread and see how his understanding grew during that time.
Don't accept anything they contend...challenge every assertion...make them PROOVE everything and back it up with ORIGINAL documents...which they never have.
fuck them and their criminal enterprises |
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poisonivy
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 2:29 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 380
9/18/2006 4:53 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
"9482 doesnt realize the entire system is based on fraud. Its designed to screw us over. The fact that I borrowed money doesnt mean that I wasnt unknowingly being defrauded."
So basically you are a dumbass who can't read and understand a debt instrument? Quoting: Anonymous Coward 9482
Why don't you stifle yourself, already.You and your bullshit moralizing are adding nothing to this thread.
There is nothing moral about entrapping people with debt, and there is nothing immoral about escaping said trap.
Your moralizing is itself, immoral. |
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Sunny1
User ID: 129238
9/18/2006 6:20 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Shibumi2,
so does any of this apply to student loans? sure they are backed by the government or whatever, but didn't you sign a contract with them too... why should they be any different? why shouldn't i go after these liars just the same as i would go after anyone else.
there was a thread on her within the last week and people were talking about how bad sallie mae has become, some were stating sallie mae at this point is no different than credit cards/banks in the way that they treat you anymore... if you fall behind that is.
for all you dickheads who state... why don't you just pay your bills... i would but getting run over(in my car) by some asshole kid running from the police kind of threw a monkey wrench in my life. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 117085
Don't apologize AC. I took out a student loan for a very modest sum of $5000. Ten years later I have paid them $9000 and I still owe $3000. Sallie Mae is the biggest ripoff ever. I got laid off my job and am now in deferrment but all that means is the interest adds up while I don't pay any payments. I will owe more when the deferment ends in November than I did last November.
I wish there was a way to cut off the money pit. Maybe some Guru out there in GLP land will know how to discharge student loans.
Blessings, Sunny1 |
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Shadow Dancer
User ID: 134567
9/18/2006 6:56 PM
 | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
dude. I think i responded to your issue earlier.
what you will find is that the so called "loan" was sold by the bank to either a mortgage company or sent to the Federal Reserve directly.
the only thing you need to do is insist on inspecting the ORIGINAL NOTE!
Go ahead...tell them you will pay off the amount due, but you want to inspect the original note!
they won't be able to produce it!
guess what, no note..no debt.
i've used it at least 6 times on debt collection scumbags and it's worked every time.
fuck them and their bogus papers.
forget the strawman bullshit. it's true to a degree, but its so convoluted no one has ever made it work.
NO NOTE NO DEBT. that is well rooted in commercial law, but people are too stupid to get it.
and fuck those people that say it can't be done.
and OP....you didn't pay a cent for this info. Quoting: shibumi2
Has this worked shibumi2? 
All choices have consequences, choose wisely, CHOOSE WISELY. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 7:14 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Hi Shadow...
It works and it's true...
Did you read the entire thread?
I have used it myself and helped others as well...it ALWAYS works as long as one follows the correct steps and procedures...most of which are detailed in this thread.
If you need any specific help, please PM me and I'd be glad to assist you. |
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 145121
9/18/2006 7:18 PM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
doesn't matter if the document is certified or not...they have to produce the original, or prove the existence of the original.
if not, when the note is "paid", must you not receive ther ORIGINAL back? YES. Otherwise the debt is not really discharged.
to illustrate this point, take a $100 bill and make a color copy. take that copy to a notary and pay them to notarize that your copy is an exact/certified copy. Then ask the judge or bank if they will honor your certified copy. By honor, i mean honor it for face value or redeem it Quoting: shibumi2
I haven't read through the whole thread yet so I'm sorry if someone already addressed this. But Shibumi, your point makes total logical sense. If the original note is still "out there" somewhere, what is to stop someone else from collecting on it? Over and over? |
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Shadow Dancer
User ID: 134567
9/18/2006 7:19 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
I read alot of it and working on keeping parts of it as I am game and down as a warrior for right-incredible
I am going to read the whole thing and passing the info out amap. Thx alot!
gives me a good glow 
thx very much 
holding the line is fine!
All choices have consequences, choose wisely, CHOOSE WISELY. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 7:23 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
that's the point of law that has been upheld since the beginning.
An original note is the only real basis for which to make a claim. If a copy were acceptable, thousands of copies, and claims could be made...right?? Of course, you could challenge them but that's why the ORIGINAL note is superior.
A note is really never satisfied until the ORIGINAL is marked PAID IN FULL and delivered to the debtor...it's your right to insist on it, and receive it back.
One person in arguing this point produced a copy of a hundred dollar bill and asked the judge if he would honor it for its apparent face value...you can imagine the answer but the case was dismissed. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 7:24 PM
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I guess I already made that point--sorry |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 7:26 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
I read alot of it and working on keeping parts of it as I am game and down as a warrior for right-incredible
I am going to read the whole thing and passing the info out amap. Thx alot!
gives me a good glow
thx very much
holding the line is fine!
Cool! The procedure is essentially to respond to any demand from a third party debt collector with...Show me the original.
An example of a letter I've used before with great results is pasted into this thread.
It's amazing how good it feels to beat the scum that prey on people that find themselves in difficult circumstances for whatever reason. |
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Shadow Dancer
User ID: 134567
9/18/2006 7:33 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
There are a few letters but you mentioned one wasn't as good as the other?-I am learning,so the main basis is the original debt paper, and the letter to send to demand...original contract From what I have been reading it doesn't take more than one letter usually-
and no outstanding court actions can be filed prior to demanding orig contract?
All choices have consequences, choose wisely, CHOOSE WISELY. |
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Shadow Dancer
User ID: 134567
9/18/2006 7:36 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
I have added this thread to my favorites-
it rocks to level the playing field as the constant infringement by the radicals is wearisome 
All choices have consequences, choose wisely, CHOOSE WISELY. |
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mercury2
User ID: 145121
9/18/2006 9:17 PM
 | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
This really is a great thread, I just read through the whole thing. I'm glad the name Benjamin Dover came up, I had a couple of his books which helped me really a lot with a couple of situations I was in a few years back. Getting a grip on this information about debt collector scams certainly is psychologically helpful when they try to intimidate you. I don't scare too easy any more, that's for sure.
I got garnished for my student loans this year. They are from twenty years ago and I have paid thousands of dollars on them over the years. The original principal amount was 11,000. The balance today is 39,000. Several different times when they sent it to collections they tacked a 5,000 dollar "collection fee" on it.
I have never had the money to pay this debt. When I was making payments on it different times in the past, I was basically sending them my grocery money. I was paying them when I was having serious dental health problems and couldn't afford to go to the dentist. I will never do that again.
They garnished me in February and I could have had it lifted if I would have sent them full documentation of all my expenses with backing copies of all my bills, lease, etc. I filled all that out and could not bring myself to send it in. It would have lifted the garnishement under the "hardship case" rules but I just could not send that much personal information to total strangers (third party debt collectors) who don't have my best interest in mind. They would probably make it into a nice file to sell to Choicepoint as a side source of income.
I also had sworn that I would never sign another piece of paper (well, maybe a tax return, but that's another story) that says "I certify that the above information is true, complete and correct under penalty of fraud charges of a 10,000 dollar fine or five years in jail" or whatever the f--k it says, without consulting an attorney. I am not going to put myself in that position, without advice, when who gets to decide what constitutes fraud? Or an "incomplete" disclosure? That's right, they do. and I have no control over that, and I can't afford a lawyer, so my heart would not let me send in the documentation.
I did not want to put the ball back in their court. This way, the ball is my court still. I really did not want to engage them at all.
I did talk to them once on the phone, and they did say that wage garnishment is "worst case scenario", like they didn't have anything else to pull out of their bag of tricks over this student loan. However, I remember that Ben Dover says, the #1 rule to remember is "bill collectors lie" and #2 is See #1.
Anyway what I ended up doing is going part time, because if you work it so you are only taking home 30 times the federal minimum wage ($309.00 every two weeks, 618.00 a month total net income) then they can't take any of it. The original garnishment of 15% of my take home was basically all my money anyway, and only left me enough to pay my bills and buy groceries. The amount I am taking home now pays my rent and bills, and I am scrounging for groceries. I don't mind, I am only working three days a week, have four days off in a row to start a business, which I have been working on for the last couple of months.
In the book "Asset Protections Secrets" Arnold Goldstein said,
"If you're self employed, it's going to be pretty hard for them to get you to garnish your own wages".
The truth of this was borne out repeatedly for both myself and my business partner in my previous self employment adventures. She and I both had IRS and Student Loan problems. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 10:41 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
There are a few letters but you mentioned one wasn't as good as the other?-I am learning,so the main basis is the original debt paper, and the letter to send to demand...original contract From what I have been reading it doesn't take more than one letter usually-
and no outstanding court actions can be filed prior to demanding orig contract?
If you really want to get a handle on the whole procedure, google FAIR DEBT COLLECTION PRACTICES ACT and read it...it's the law that third party debt collectors have to adhere to, and almost none of them do. So when you call them on it, they just slink away and harass the next mope on their list.
Essentially, they have to send a DUNNING letter, which must state that YOU HAVE 30 DAYS TO DISPUTE THE DEBT....so you do and they are required to PROVE the debt, which they can never do...so they are screwed.
They may bluster and make threats, but they know its hopeless unless they can produce the original document, and they NEVER had possession of that document...EVER.
Game Over. You 1, Scumbags 0. |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 10:44 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
The Fair Debt Collection Practices Act is one of those RARE consumer friendly laws that come along...oh, every 230 years or so. The last one being the CONSTITUTION.
It's a pretty easy read and if you look at case law, it generally supports the consumer. Also, the Federal Trade Commission will help if you pull them into it. I always copy my letter to the FTC, whihc the scumbags HATE and it provides a lot of incentive to quit.
The address is:
Consumer Response Center
Federal Trade Commission
Washington D.C. 20580 |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 10:48 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Hey mercury2...I couldn't tell from your post if you ever validated your debt...IE did you admit in writing (or in court) that the debt was yours?
Is the debt still outstanding and are you being harassed presently? |
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shibumi2
User ID: 74188
9/18/2006 10:51 PM
| | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
There are a few letters but you mentioned one wasn't as good as the other?-I am learning,so the main basis is the original debt paper, and the letter to send to demand...original contract From what I have been reading it doesn't take more than one letter usually-
and no outstanding court actions can be filed prior to demanding orig contract?
yeah, once a demand to validate the debt is made, they can't move forward until the debt is validated...
CHECKMATE, because they can't possibly validate.
The last supposed validation I received was a complete fraud, and laughable. The only way to validate is the ORIGINAL CONTRACT (not a copy!!) a court order, which if they had they wouldn't be sending you letters, or YOU TESTIFYING FOR THEM...which you never want to do for obvious reasons...that's how they trick most people into hanging themselves.
If you don't fuck yourself over by testifying against yourself, you can't lose. |
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Sir_Chancealot
User ID: 123147
9/19/2006 12:32 AM | | Re: HELP! Legal Straw Man and Sovereignty UCC-1 theory valid? | Quote |
Shibumi2,
Here is something that you might find interesting. I have no idea if it was/is valid, I just ran across it one time.
[link to www.worldnewsstand.net]
If it still stands (or ever did) can you imagine the effects on the banking system?
Enjoy. |
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