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TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee

 
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 05:14 PM
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TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
[link to arstechnica.com]

This is a game changer for people which want to go off grid.

10 kwh is enough storage for any home to breach the time between sunlight and no sunlight exposure for an off-grid solar system unless you are an eco-pig and consume more than that during nighttime.


That's only 350 USD per kwh, far far less you have to pay than other similar systems out there on the market.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 05:21 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
10kwh requires a lot of Charging amps to exercise the battery properly...

Wish they gave some specs On the charging systems...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/01/2015 05:29 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
What's strange is the huge difference in kwh consumption between a US 5 members family home and EU 5 members family house.

In the US the total per day ranges between 20-30 kwh while in the EU it is only 5-7 kwh per day. Anything above is considered wasteful.


So this battery pack would be plentiful for the EU for a whole family, while in the US it would be OK still, as long as you would do everything requiring a lot of kwh, like running the washing machine, during the day time mostly.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/01/2015 05:49 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Also, having a 10kw solar system on my roof, i know about how many kwh such a system outputs.

During the spring/summer time i am getting 50-60 kwh per day out of it.

But in high winter time, it is only about 5kwh average per day.

So in the winter times, such a system would not suffice for any US home. You would have to add at least some wind turbines to produce min 5kwh average per day extra and not be wasteful.

Heating with your solar system in winter times is out of the question. That's not doable unless you are going for a 100kw system which won't fit on any roof :D

You need about 70kwh to heat up a 100 square meter home on average, given it has some good enough insulation.

So for heating purposes you would need gas mostly still.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 06:03 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
10kwh is nothing!!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/01/2015 06:18 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
10kwh is nothing!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 4447844


Depends on how you live.

You can get a freezer which consumes only 1/3 kwh to half daily, or only which consumes 2 kwh per day.

You can have ten 100w old lamps burning all day, including lightning your garden for a total of 24 kwh daily, or you can get LED lamps which will light up just as much and consume only 1 kwh daily.


You can run an old desktop PC which will consume around 4kwh daily without any sleep mode, or you can have an energy efficient broadwell laptop which will be happy with less than 0.5kwh daily if you have it always on.


People which go off grid take all this into consideration and adjust their behavior to be less wasteful without really affecting much of their quality of life.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 06:21 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
10kwh is nothing!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 4447844


bsflag
Strike

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05/01/2015 06:25 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
What's strange is the huge difference in kwh consumption between a US 5 members family home and EU 5 members family house.

In the US the total per day ranges between 20-30 kwh while in the EU it is only 5-7 kwh per day. Anything above is considered wasteful.


So this battery pack would be plentiful for the EU for a whole family, while in the US it would be OK still, as long as you would do everything requiring a lot of kwh, like running the washing machine, during the day time mostly.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Electric Stove/Electric Water Heater
750 watt PC
42' Tv or Two
Lights
Microwave
Coffee pot
Networking
Dishwasher
Dryer
Washing Machine
Cooler/Freezer

Whatever you have in a garage
Heating and Air
etc...
bigD111

User ID: 65945302
United States
05/01/2015 07:09 PM

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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
deplorably republican
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Greece
05/01/2015 07:16 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
 Quoting: bigD111


A furnace does not use 5000w at all times. That's only during the heat up phase.

Cooking a meal for a family is about 1-2 kwh consumed. Also, you do not use the battery at all during day time. So any cooking done during the day does not remove anything from the 10kwh stored for the night.
bigD111

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05/01/2015 07:24 PM

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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
 Quoting: bigD111


A furnace does not use 5000w at all times. That's only during the heat up phase.

Cooking a meal for a family is about 1-2 kwh consumed. Also, you do not use the battery at all during day time. So any cooking done during the day does not remove anything from the 10kwh stored for the night.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Clothes dryers also use 5000 watts. Plus I have 3 freezers since I live in the country, really I think it is too small.
deplorably republican
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 07:26 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
 Quoting: bigD111


A furnace does not use 5000w at all times. That's only during the heat up phase.

Cooking a meal for a family is about 1-2 kwh consumed. Also, you do not use the battery at all during day time. So any cooking done during the day does not remove anything from the 10kwh stored for the night.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Clothes dryers also use 5000 watts. Plus I have 3 freezers since I live in the country, really I think it is too small.
 Quoting: bigD111


you really don't know what you are talking about.
bigD111

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05/01/2015 07:34 PM

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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
 Quoting: bigD111


A furnace does not use 5000w at all times. That's only during the heat up phase.

Cooking a meal for a family is about 1-2 kwh consumed. Also, you do not use the battery at all during day time. So any cooking done during the day does not remove anything from the 10kwh stored for the night.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Clothes dryers also use 5000 watts. Plus I have 3 freezers since I live in the country, really I think it is too small.
 Quoting: bigD111


you really don't know what you are talking about.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56151070


I have a 25000 kw generator in case of long term power outage. I don't think you know what you are talking about.
deplorably republican
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 07:41 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
bump
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 07:45 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
if u need all those machines you aint ready for the collapse
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Greece
05/01/2015 07:45 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
 Quoting: bigD111


A furnace does not use 5000w at all times. That's only during the heat up phase.

Cooking a meal for a family is about 1-2 kwh consumed. Also, you do not use the battery at all during day time. So any cooking done during the day does not remove anything from the 10kwh stored for the night.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Clothes dryers also use 5000 watts. Plus I have 3 freezers since I live in the country, really I think it is too small.
 Quoting: bigD111


An efficient cloth dryer will consume about 1.5 kwh per run.

An efficient washing machine is about 1 kwh per run at 60°C.

Well, 3 freezers depends very much on the kind of freezers. It could be anywhere from 1 kwh for all 3 to 6kwh for all 3 per day.

Note that this is the per day consumption. You need the battery only for the night.

Someone going off grid with a 10-15 kw solar system, would do laundry during day times mostly.

However, seeing how much electricity US families consume, not even a 15kw solar system would suffice during winter times unless you learn to be more energy efficient.

I am not sure however if the "official" numbers i get of for the average power consumption of a 5 members family per day in the EU can be accurate.

Just cooking a meal for 5 people should be close to 2 kwh with efficient electric devices. And here we are told the total average is 5-7 kwh daily, with anything above being wasteful.
Maybe if you cook with gas instead or eat only once per day :D...
Anonymous Coward
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Canada
05/01/2015 07:45 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Electric Stove/Electric Water Heater
750 watt PC
42' Tv or Two
Lights
Microwave
Coffee pot
Networking
Dishwasher
Dryer
Washing Machine
Cooler/Freezer
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 29696048
United States
05/01/2015 07:48 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
What's strange is the huge difference in kwh consumption between a US 5 members family home and EU 5 members family house.

In the US the total per day ranges between 20-30 kwh while in the EU it is only 5-7 kwh per day. Anything above is considered wasteful.


So this battery pack would be plentiful for the EU for a whole family, while in the US it would be OK still, as long as you would do everything requiring a lot of kwh, like running the washing machine, during the day time mostly.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Your climate is not like the USA.
if it's over 85F and humid.....the AC is ON.

Same goes for below 50F with heat.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
05/01/2015 07:49 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Also, having a 10kw solar system on my roof, i know about how many kwh such a system outputs.

During the spring/summer time i am getting 50-60 kwh per day out of it.

But in high winter time, it is only about 5kwh average per day.

So in the winter times, such a system would not suffice for any US home. You would have to add at least some wind turbines to produce min 5kwh average per day extra and not be wasteful.

Heating with your solar system in winter times is out of the question. That's not doable unless you are going for a 100kw system which won't fit on any roof :D

You need about 70kwh to heat up a 100 square meter home on average, given it has some good enough insulation.

So for heating purposes you would need gas mostly still.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


You'd have to have any incredibly large solar array to get anything close to 50-60kwh... how many square meters is it?
Strike

User ID: 69092805
United States
05/01/2015 08:03 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
 Quoting: bigD111


A furnace does not use 5000w at all times. That's only during the heat up phase.

Cooking a meal for a family is about 1-2 kwh consumed. Also, you do not use the battery at all during day time. So any cooking done during the day does not remove anything from the 10kwh stored for the night.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Clothes dryers also use 5000 watts. Plus I have 3 freezers since I live in the country, really I think it is too small.
 Quoting: bigD111


An efficient cloth dryer will consume about 1.5 kwh per run.

An efficient washing machine is about 1 kwh per run at 60°C.

Well, 3 freezers depends very much on the kind of freezers. It could be anywhere from 1 kwh for all 3 to 6kwh for all 3 per day.

Note that this is the per day consumption. You need the battery only for the night.

Someone going off grid with a 10-15 kw solar system, would do laundry during day times mostly.

However, seeing how much electricity US families consume, not even a 15kw solar system would suffice during winter times unless you learn to be more energy efficient.

I am not sure however if the "official" numbers i get of for the average power consumption of a 5 members family per day in the EU can be accurate.

Just cooking a meal for 5 people should be close to 2 kwh with efficient electric devices. And here we are told the total average is 5-7 kwh daily, with anything above being wasteful.
Maybe if you cook with gas instead or eat only once per day :D...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


Electricity usage of a Clothes Dryer
A clothes dryer is a common household appliance to dry clothes or other fabrics after they have been washed using a washing machine. Clothes dryers use quite a bit energy because they need to spin and produce heat. The energy use of a dryer varies between 1800 watts and 5000 watts, a typical dryer will use around 3000 watts.
[link to energyusecalculator.com]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 69017783
Greece
05/01/2015 08:25 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Also, having a 10kw solar system on my roof, i know about how many kwh such a system outputs.

During the spring/summer time i am getting 50-60 kwh per day out of it.

But in high winter time, it is only about 5kwh average per day.

So in the winter times, such a system would not suffice for any US home. You would have to add at least some wind turbines to produce min 5kwh average per day extra and not be wasteful.

Heating with your solar system in winter times is out of the question. That's not doable unless you are going for a 100kw system which won't fit on any roof :D

You need about 70kwh to heat up a 100 square meter home on average, given it has some good enough insulation.

So for heating purposes you would need gas mostly still.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


You'd have to have any incredibly large solar array to get anything close to 50-60kwh... how many square meters is it?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69101846


Not really that big of an area required if your roof if suited. I believe flat roofs are best, as you then can place the the panels on their own construction and turn them at exactly the right angle and face them perfectly. But it looks ugly then...

The house is about 100 square meters and there is space for a few more panels i guess, but not a lot more. You do not want to pack it too much as you might have to repair something or want to clean them (haven't cleaned them ever yet however, but they do output almost the same still after 4 years).

You need about 6 m^2 for a 1 kw system. So about 60 m^2 for a 10 kw system.

here is what it produced last month (not sure why it doesn't show the last 2 days)

[link to imgur.com]

It depends a lot on the panels you use too. I think mine are 16% efficient, but there are top panels with over 20% efficiency out by now, requiring less space.


The best would be if you had some really large property and could build a large garage/storehouse/workshop with a 60^2 roof facing towards the best position with the best angle and then use the panels as a roof.

I have to admit that having those panels on my roof makes me a little uncomfortable when thinking about the case of having to do some repairs.... that would be costly if one had to remove all.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 08:29 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
10kwh is nothing!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 4447844


thats no central air conditioner and no electric dryer for SURE.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Greece
05/01/2015 08:34 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
note that this is not peak production, as april is not such a hot month in greece. June to august are the best months.

I'd say that on average i get 40-50 kwh per day from April to September. Then it gets a little meh, some days getting almost nothing at all.

This is a hybrid system however. I sell everything produced for quite a lot per kwh as this was part of a program here in Greece. It would be stupid for me to consume it myself as i get much more for this "eco" power.


There is a switch however which turns half of my panels into an off grid system. 5kw feeds a charge controller/inverter/power loss backup system just in case of a zombie apocalypse or whenever there is one of the many power outages here in my area. Hate it when my PC shuts off all of the sudden and i cannot get onto the net for hours, plus possible data loss.

I have only 4 batteries connected to this system at the moment, as i sell all electricity anyway. They just need to give me enough power to feed my PC for a few hours if there is a power outage.
Baconspiracist

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Germany
05/01/2015 08:34 PM

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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
bump
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05/01/2015 08:40 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
solar shingles
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Greece
05/01/2015 08:45 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
10kwh is nothing!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 4447844


thats no central air conditioner and no electric dryer for SURE.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 11363904


If we are talking using the air conditioner in hot summer days to cool the room, a 10kw system with this battery should work as you need to cool mostly at day time which means no battery use. At night time it depends i guess. You might need two such batteries which in summer times would certainly fill up to max with 50-60 kwh produced daily.

You would also have to use an efficient air conditioner (inverter) which adjusts the pump depending on how hot it is, rather than a simple on/off unit which consumes 30% more energy on average.

As for heating with an air conditioner in winter times, you can forget about that. Heating up a house is a lot of kwh, no solar system can provide that fits on a roof.
The exception would be the extreme of a highly insulated passive house.
Anonymous Coward
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Germany
05/01/2015 09:22 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
note that this is not peak production, as april is not such a hot month in greece. June to august are the best months.

I'd say that on average i get 40-50 kwh per day from April to September. Then it gets a little meh, some days getting almost nothing at all.

This is a hybrid system however. I sell everything produced for quite a lot per kwh as this was part of a program here in Greece. It would be stupid for me to consume it myself as i get much more for this "eco" power.


There is a switch however which turns half of my panels into an off grid system. 5kw feeds a charge controller/inverter/power loss backup system just in case of a zombie apocalypse or whenever there is one of the many power outages here in my area. Hate it when my PC shuts off all of the sudden and i cannot get onto the net for hours, plus possible data loss.

I have only 4 batteries connected to this system at the moment, as i sell all electricity anyway. They just need to give me enough power to feed my PC for a few hours if there is a power outage.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


damn it, thats a nice yield. cool2

this TESLA unit is indeed a game changer for those who are on the lucky side already.

call me when they invent solar panels who work in this dark sh!thole of Central Europe. these units would need to literally suck in light rays to reach a sufficient power output.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 69017783
Greece
05/01/2015 10:35 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
note that this is not peak production, as april is not such a hot month in greece. June to august are the best months.

I'd say that on average i get 40-50 kwh per day from April to September. Then it gets a little meh, some days getting almost nothing at all.

This is a hybrid system however. I sell everything produced for quite a lot per kwh as this was part of a program here in Greece. It would be stupid for me to consume it myself as i get much more for this "eco" power.


There is a switch however which turns half of my panels into an off grid system. 5kw feeds a charge controller/inverter/power loss backup system just in case of a zombie apocalypse or whenever there is one of the many power outages here in my area. Hate it when my PC shuts off all of the sudden and i cannot get onto the net for hours, plus possible data loss.

I have only 4 batteries connected to this system at the moment, as i sell all electricity anyway. They just need to give me enough power to feed my PC for a few hours if there is a power outage.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


damn it, thats a nice yield. cool2

this TESLA unit is indeed a game changer for those who are on the lucky side already.

call me when they invent solar panels who work in this dark sh!thole of Central Europe. these units would need to literally suck in light rays to reach a sufficient power output.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 47361395


It's not that bad for Germany really. Maybe 20% less yearly in production compared to my area.
So adding extra 20% solar panels won't really make a big difference in the total cost. The panels have gone down in pricing a lot. It's the inverters/charge controllers/battery packs and the installation cost which adds a lot.

Especially the battery packs for off-grid systems were way overpriced and this is why this TESLA battery which i expect to last 20 years is a game changer. By then, there will be much cheaper and better batteries out and you will replace it anyway.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 10:40 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
Seems like not enough to me. A furnace uses 5000 watts by itself.
 Quoting: bigD111


A furnace does not use 5000w at all times. That's only during the heat up phase.

Cooking a meal for a family is about 1-2 kwh consumed. Also, you do not use the battery at all during day time. So any cooking done during the day does not remove anything from the 10kwh stored for the night.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


You have to spec for peak draw at startup.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2015 10:43 PM
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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
That'd be a bitchin' retrofit for a Prius!
Baconspiracist

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05/01/2015 10:53 PM

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Re: TESLA to offer 10kwh battery for only 3500 USD and 10 years warantee
note that this is not peak production, as april is not such a hot month in greece. June to august are the best months.

I'd say that on average i get 40-50 kwh per day from April to September. Then it gets a little meh, some days getting almost nothing at all.

This is a hybrid system however. I sell everything produced for quite a lot per kwh as this was part of a program here in Greece. It would be stupid for me to consume it myself as i get much more for this "eco" power.


There is a switch however which turns half of my panels into an off grid system. 5kw feeds a charge controller/inverter/power loss backup system just in case of a zombie apocalypse or whenever there is one of the many power outages here in my area. Hate it when my PC shuts off all of the sudden and i cannot get onto the net for hours, plus possible data loss.

I have only 4 batteries connected to this system at the moment, as i sell all electricity anyway. They just need to give me enough power to feed my PC for a few hours if there is a power outage.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783


damn it, thats a nice yield. cool2

this TESLA unit is indeed a game changer for those who are on the lucky side already.

call me when they invent solar panels who work in this dark sh!thole of Central Europe. these units would need to literally suck in light rays to reach a sufficient power output.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 47361395


It's not that bad for Germany really. Maybe 20% less yearly in production compared to my area.
So adding extra 20% solar panels won't really make a big difference in the total cost. The panels have gone down in pricing a lot. It's the inverters/charge controllers/battery packs and the installation cost which adds a lot.

Especially the battery packs for off-grid systems were way overpriced and this is why this TESLA battery which i expect to last 20 years is a game changer. By then, there will be much cheaper and better batteries out and you will replace it anyway.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 69017783



hesright
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