Christians! Can you lose your salvation once you have gained it?

so god is the one torturing us in hellfire for eternity for not bowing and serving him??

who would follow a god like that???

Jesus Gave HIS Life on calvary to remove the stain of sin from all men who might Come Unto The Father.


God The Father cannot look upon sin.



What matters this to you?



When you make your Leap Of Faith, your surrender of self and will Unto The Father; you will KNOW you have been IN HIS Presence.

KNOW...


You will KNOW that Father Gave you A New Heart. You will feel "new". Others who know you will remark that you've changed.



If you've never given your life and will over to The Father and promised to live your life through HIS Guidance and seek only HIS Will, then you aren't HIS...


Laodiceans, as gathered here, are unwilling to contemplate that giving their life over to The Father is right and just... We say HIS Will, not our's be done; but we don't mean it... We say HE IS God, but won't allow HIM To BE God...

All because of our carnal-heart and our failure to realize what "trust" means in the scope of being alive...


Yet God's Will IS Always Perfect!

If you fail to Come Unto The Father, you are merely a failed vessel.

St. Paul writes to Timothy in 2nd Tim 2:6 that those who would minister/teach/preach "Ought First BE Partakers Of The Fruits". This means they ought be Born-Agains...

So few are though.
Even fewer that minister/teach/preach...
Such is Laodicea.


Time For YOU To Decide.
These are The Final Moments...

Can you Trust God with every aspect of your life and will you Tell HIM So?

Might take 10 or 15 minutes to make your surrender, your Leap Of Faith...

Probably too busy to make the time...

Que sera, sera
God's Will IS ALWAYS Perfect!

It is my opinion from study the only thing that could take away your salvation would be to renounce Christ become Muslim atheist Buddhist Ect. If sin could make you lose your religion than Christ died for nothing the best you could hope for in going to heaven would be maybe maybe not that's not good news if you ask me. The good news is God knows you cannot stop sinning but he loves you any way so he made an escape plan you either believe or not. Now rewards in heaven that's quite a different story you get more you get less you get nothing that's on you and it only takes a second of thought to answer that question yourself.

The Holy Spirit Helper arrives in us, and is like eating Astronomical Seed.

With that seed given, you activate the inner eternal root, which will help us fight against the outward creature lower life millstone, where it becomes silenced and shut up. The Holy Spirit helper helps us build and finish the Inward Temple Sanctuary.

We no longer have the desire to follow after the herd because we have come to the Dwelling-place of rest and changed inwardly. As if death to the former fallen person, to a made new person

Going back to the former life, would be as a dog returning to his own vomit.

:innerwheelworks:

Many considerations, but let's touch one, to keep it simple.

If you have more questions, other considerations can then be considered.

Let's imagine there's a "heavenly place" where everyone there,

are using their freewil to be kind and loving to each other.

If they weren't kind and loving to each other, would this heaven?

No?

So if you allowed people who were still cruel and mean to each other, this is no longer "heaven". This would be just like Earth.

So Jesus said, if you love me

keep my command,

and my command is that you love one another.

So we love God,

by doing what pleases him,

which is to be kind and loving to others.

that will mean a person never loved G-d to do such things and turn away so he was never to a point he can say of himself salvation or being saved. But this is not an answer from a complete Christian perspective with all respect. But i cant imagine turning away from the awesome righteous all wise living G-d, are you crazy? I trust G-d over everything in this life and will hate it any other way sounds like a horrible life to me

According to scripture, if one is still sinning, then one has not yet been born again. (see above)

Does being born again happen after death?

"Saved" is an imaginary condition Christians blindly believe. Saved from what? From hell? What is hell? Hell is another , object of blind believe, again. Not saying hell does not exist, but a blind belief is a blind belief, not fact.

In the mean time, what Christians do is to convince themselves they're saved based on certain believed doctrine. Well, for most people, self deception perhaps is better than really knowing your condition which, if you can not accept it, you could become insane.

So, can you lose your salvation once you gain it? A better self deception for self deceptive people is to believe, no, once saved forever saved. It's a self deceptive answer people give to themselves instead of honestly facing cognitive dissonance or admitting they don't know.

Most people would rather pretend they live in the light even though they can't see anything, rather than admitting the fact that it's darkness.

Indeed. Also, The Life of Apollonius of Tyana, by Philostratus is full of metaphorical wisdom.

There is nothing in the world that cannot be found once it is lost and nothing that cannot be lost once it is found. There are many people in today's societies that have adopted the "everything goes, everybody is ok, all are special and trophies abound for all". This is in direct conflict with "many are called but few are chosen". If salvation is something that can be easily purchased with one good deed or magic words, then how can it possibly have any value whatsoever? If we are born again in the Spirit once we shed this mortal anchor, then it would be logical that the state of our being at this time would determine the degree of our salvation as we move into the next dimension. There is very little to be risked by proceeding forward with this in mind.

Show us ONE human past or present who stops sinning while on earth? Anyone who claims such is deceived.

Throughout the OT, the key action that is consistently told by the prophets is to repent.

It ALSO happens to be the very first thing that Jesus taught...repent, for the kingdom is at hand.

By repenting, a sinner shows reverance towards the Father, and therefore respect / love AND Belief.

Manly Hall once said:

There exists in the world today, and has existed for thousands of years, a body of enlightened humans united in what might be termed, an Order of the Quest.

but if you don't do what please god he'll torture you for eternity in a fire pit

I used to believe you couldn't lose your salvation--then I came across this Scripture about 7 years ago...and now I just don't know.


Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.


I havne't been able to find anyone who can convince me with Scripture that this doesn't say what is says...

I've had people give opinions on what they think...but this seems to say you can fall way to a point where it is impossible to be brought back.

People have said to me..."these people aren't really saved"...but it says they were enlightened...tastes of the heavenly give, were partakers of the Holy Ghost--they sound saved to me.

Dont forget to repent if you sin.

MPH was one of humanity's greatest philosophers

now cue some person to make a comment about him being a freemason

To find the laws, that, when broken lead to sin, you must recognize the true nature and capacity of Man-kind. No Book can tell you what is totally correct, or incorrect. But, as far as moral human conduct is concerned, society cares not; and just because society has granted permission for certan conduct to be legal, it will probably be morally and ethically illegal in regards to the universal laws for the conduct of man.

Just because you can, does not mean you should.

Look around you; what part of your character or conduct, could you change, even though it may be difficult? Can you stop eating flesh?, Can you stop being greedy? Can you stop chasing bodily pleasures, like sex and drugs? Within these difficult vices, are probably the broken laws, that society promotes, but traps us into a lower vulgar state, that is at the core of practically every ancient religion.

Dantes Inferno can give you a good Idea, of what to avoid.

Heaven is God's domain. So if you want to go there then you have to obey God's rules.

If you dont want to be with God, then you are going somewhere else, simple as that. Not God's choice, its yours.

I study philosophy diligently and I will say without a doubt, Manly Hall was the greatest true Philosopher of the 20th century. Only a truly evil force, would attempt to assassinate his character.

Hall often said "you can't do what you want and get away with it"

meaning you can't overindulge in excess, it will come back to collect its debt

oddly enough at the end of his life hall had a voracious sweet tooth and gained a lot of weight

being perfect and pure is an extremely difficult exercise in self discipline

and that's the point of all the stories of mankind

to overcome the lower self, to express self control in face of great temptation

most, like myself, fail on this daily

have said the same about the 20th century, hands down one of the greatest, but would put him up there with all the great philosophers of human history

what other philosophers covered the breadth of subjects that he did?

have said the same about the 20th century, hands down one of the greatest, but would put him up there with all the great philosophers of human history

what other philosophers covered the breadth of subjects that he did?

Why? Because God was not sovereign enough to send His only begotten Son to die for you and that be enough? His death wasn't good enough? His Blood wasn't powerful enough? You just had to go and add your filthy rags of good works to His perfect Son in order to pay for your sin? Is that the reason?

You have a small god.

They are out there, even if you have never met them. The gate to life is narrow, and, according to Jesus' own words, there are few who find it. Have you ever met a person from Uzbekistan? Or Zambia? Most people I know have never met anyone from either of those countries. How do you know if you have or haven't? Didn't Paul say to be careful to give hospitality to strangers for you never know when you've entertained "angels unaware?"

But that is not relevant, really, to your question.

What difference does it make whether or not you've met a person who has successfully overcome the world as the bible instructs?

You are either reading the scriptures and seeking for the answers that they provide, or you are relying on church teachings, which completely contradict scripture. I'll admit, it feels safer and far more comforting to be counted within a group of like-minded people. But what is the use of belonging to a group that all thinks the same, if those thoughts are incorrect?

Many, many years ago, people knew that perfection was the only way to the kingdom, and that Jesus was the only Way to achieve that perfection, (sinless state). Why do the churches teach differently?

I personally have met three separate people who have achieved it and two that were far closer than anyone else I had ever known before they died. But my own experiences shouldn't mean anything to you or anyone else.

If it is Jesus and the salvation He brings that we seek, then we should attempt to understand the scriptures that write about Him. And, when faced with very clear statements like the one in 1John 3, that disturb us, or cause agitation, we are not doing ourselves any favors by rejecting those scriptures out of hand. Especially considering the subject matter.

Churches teach those scriptures that seem to indicate that sinning is okay. But sinning was what got us kicked out of the kingdom in the first place. Doesn't make sense to me.

On the other hand, the scriptures that were written about Jesus say that by His almighty power, we can overcome the flesh and become sinless so as to re-enter the kingdom that we were kicked out of.

Edit to add: Sorry about the unintentional italics.

Last Edited by BiblioPhile on 07/13/2017 01:51 PM

This passage proves eternal security. Because it says I would be Impossible to be save once again if you could los salvation because it would crucify Christ again and put Him to an open shame.

When it comes to sin that you go to hell for there is no differentiation in degree. The way you are interpreting this passage would say that if you sin again after having been saved you lose it. And this passage says if you were able to lose it you cannot get it back.

So whom am I to believe. Your misinterpretation or the scripture?

I highly doubt that you have not sinned and any sin is falling away. Any and all sin is that which would keep us from heaven if there were no payment.

You can't have this scripture both ways, quote it out of hermeneutical context with the rest of scripture and have it stand on its own falsely interpreted.

The biggest question is; Upon what do you base your being saved?
A church's Doctrine or the Bible?

Jesus never said that answering an altar call or saying a few word saved anyone.
His answer was always to become a Disciple and follow him.
So if you are not Following Him daily, you probably are not saved in the first place.
This is the problem with Once Saved, always Saved theology. It fails to properly define what is Salvation. Some people follow a church or group or belong to a nation and think they are Saved because of that.

Only following his path and having a relationship with Jesus saves you.
Now if you have that, then Once Saved Always Saved, Applies. No matter how much you mess up he will forgive you. But in messing up, it will hurt you because you know you hurt him in the process, so you will change what you are doing.

He died in 90, and this video was from 90. He did not die fat, in fact, he looks quite thin.

it's amazing isn't it...when you understand the allegories and metaphors and how the ancients taught man through story

and then it's also amazing to see how those stories have been so misunderstood for centuries and centuries and centuries

when you understand them, when people like Hall help you see the way the ancients taught, all the sudden those weird cryptic strange stories start to make perfect sense

Agreed! He's may even surpass many of the greatest.

Most definitely.