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What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-

 
Anonymous Coward
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Israel
11/09/2007 01:47 PM
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What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
The JPost is reporting that the 'Palestinians' have made what might be considered an important concession in the lead-up to Annapolis:

Late Wednesday, Israeli sources said, Palestinian negotiators accepted Israeli security demands. These assert that progress following the conference will depend on the Palestinians fulfilling obligations set down in the first stage of the road map peace plan, namely the disarming and disbanding of all terror groups.

The breakthrough was reportedly achieved during a late-night meeting between chief Israeli and Palestinian negotiators Tzipi Livni and Ahmed Qurei.
But does it mean anything? No one else seems to think so:

In response to the reports of progress in the talks, a member of the Palestinian negotiating team who claimed he had attended the said meeting between Qurei and Livni, told Israel radio that the "breakthrough" was being trumpeted for more than it was worth.

"I did not sense that there was any progress in the talks with the Israeli side," the negotiator said. He then laughed and further retorted, "What's new about the principle stating that the implementation of commitments depends upon [the Palestinians] fighting terror? Indeed, it appears in the road map, and we of course agreed to the road map."
Israeli MK Aryeh Eldad agrees with the 'Palestinian' negotiator:

"Abu Mazen, who cannot fight car thieves in his neighborhood of Ramallah, promises to fight terror effectively and in exchange [Prime Minister] Olmert is willing to give him Judea and Samaria, Jerusalem, and allow refugees in," said Eldad.

"There is nothing cheaper than empty words," said Eldad. "It is too bad that Israel is willing to pay for them with land and blood."
A 'concession' is only meaningful if there is a real commitment and an ability to follow through on it. No concession from the 'Palestinians' fulfills either of those criteria.




GAIA
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2007 01:57 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Here we go again.

I DEEPLY respect your question. ALL should stop until ALL sides agree on the answer. It is the first and most meaningful question. Nothing else counts in the negotiations if that question has no agreement.

Israel should take that statement to heart, very deeply to heart. The lives and future of many depend on their wisdom.
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2007 01:59 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
You're lying again gaia.

Stop pushing the propaganda.

There is only one nation that has at every turn, ipeded any attempt at peace and that is Israel. Well, the US too. But like the first Nazis they too are just following orders, from Israel.

The Israeli leadership must be prosecuted and then executed so that Israel can start over with a governmetn tat is not corrupt.

the same goes for the US government.

Stop being the new Goebbels gaia.
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2007 02:03 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
[link to files.meetup.com]
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2007 02:03 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
You're lying again gaia.

Stop pushing the propaganda.

There is only one nation that has at every turn, ipeded any attempt at peace and that is Israel. Well, the US too. But like the first Nazis they too are just following orders, from Israel.

The Israeli leadership must be prosecuted and then executed so that Israel can start over with a governmetn tat is not corrupt.

the same goes for the US government.

Stop being the new Goebbels gaia.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 324026

Do you have any friends??? What are they like???
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Israel
11/09/2007 02:08 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
You're lying again gaia.

Stop pushing the propaganda.

There is only one nation that has at every turn, ipeded any attempt at peace and that is Israel. Well, the US too. But like the first Nazis they too are just following orders, from Israel.

The Israeli leadership must be prosecuted and then executed so that Israel can start over with a governmetn tat is not corrupt.

the same goes for the US government.

Stop being the new Goebbels gaia.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 324026



Oh really?
Why are you making up stories?
Do you feel bored?
Dont bored us around..:c:





David Bedein Wednesday, July 26, 2006

First, Israel was offered "land for peace". That didn't work. That was The Oslo Process.


Then, Israel was offered "land for nothing". That didn't work.That was The Disengagement Process.


Now Israel is offered "land for rockets". Israel gets hit with rockets in the North and provides the other side with launching pads in Judea and Samaria from where rockets can hit the whole country. That is The Realignment Plan.

Will that work?




[link to myrightword.blogspot.com]
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2007 02:20 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Israel expands Jewish settlements defying peace.

AFP, Jerusalem



The construction of Jewish settlements in the occupied West Bank has accelerated even as Israel and the Palestinians work to relaunch the Middle East peace process, a settler watchdog said on Wednesday.

The construction of settlements "puts the chances of success at the Annapolis meeting in grave danger," Yariv Oppenheimer, secretary general of the Israeli Peace Now group told AFP. "If it continues like this we will soon have a settler state instead of a Palestinian state" in the West Bank, he said.

In a report covering the period from may to October, Peace Now said construction is underway in 88 settlements, ranging from single buildings to the development of hundreds of housing units.

Citing government statistics published in June, the group said the number of settlers in the West Bank has reached 267,500, an annual growth of 5.8 percent, versus 1.8 percent growth within Israel during the same period. "This means that the growth of settlements is much more than the 'natural growth' and includes massive migration of settlers to the West Bank," the report said. But Mark Regev, a spokesman for the Israeli foreign ministry, called the numbers "problematic" and insisted that the growth reflects the higher birth rates of settlers, who tend to be ultra-Orthodox Jews.


[link to nation.ittefaq.com]
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2007 02:30 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Israel should stop being soft in the head. Every Arab country that the Palestinians have planted themselves in have forcibly kicked them out rather then share power or allow their coercion. Israel should do the same once and for all. We will all be closer to peace.

Negotiating with those that have no respect for you is a mistake. In the case of the Arabs they have no respect for respect itself, peace is not possible, nor is it desirable under those conditions. They continuously offend, attack and threaten no sensible people would tolerate that. Homicide bombers in cafes and buses that would not be tolerated for a single second in the United States and in Israel they talk of peace.

And these Arabs reject all approaches that seek sincerity. What are we to think of this?
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 03:38 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
How To Negotiate With Terrorists



A peacemaker walks up to the left side of a line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker introduces himself. The terrorist kills him.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker asks, "why did you kill my friend?" The terrorist kills him and rapes his wife.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker says, "Stop that!" The terrorist kills him, rapes his daughter and kills his wife.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker says, "I'll pay you $1000 if you stop attacking us." The terrorist agrees to the deal, takes th! e $1000 , and kills him.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker appeals to the United Nations. The United Nations says the peacemaker is at fault. The terrorist kills him.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker now has a gun, and threatens to use it. Other peacemakers start chanting the old 60's whine, "Can't we all just get along?" The peacemaker hesitates. The terrorist kills him.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker tries to convince his peacemaker friends that the terrorists aren't going to respond to negotiations, but they insist that if he kills the terrorist it'll just make the other terrorists mad. The peacemaker reluctantly agrees to try negotiating again. The terrorist kills him., his entire family, and his neighbo! r's fam ily.

A heated debate now ensues between the peacemakers who want to be nice to the terrorists and the peacemakers who believe that there can never be peace until the terrorists are all dead. While they are debating, the terrorists kill 15 more peacemakers.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker asks himself, "Which is more important: being liked by everyone, or protecting my family?" The terrorist pulls a knife to kill the peacemaker, but the peacemaker pulls a gun and kills the terrorist first. The United Nations condemns the peacemaker's use of unproportional force. Many of his peacemaker friends turn against him.

A peacemaker walks up to the left side of the line. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line. The peacemaker apologizes for what his friend did to the other terrorist. The terrorist kills him, his entire family and his neighbors, and threatens to destroy! the ci ty as soon as they develop a bigger weapon.

A peacemaker refuses to meet at the line because every time a peacemaker goes to the line the terrorist kills him. A terrorist walks up to the right side of the line and fires rockets into the peacemaker's town. The United Nations condemns the way the peacemaker provoked the terrorist by refusing to come to the line and meet with him.

Generations pass and not much changes until one day when the son of a peacemaker decides that the old strategy simply won't work. He walks up to the left side of the line a little early. As the terrorist approaches the right side of the line the peacemaker shoots him. Another terrorist approaches to replace the first, and the peacemaker shoots him too. This scene plays out several more times. Then a terrorist approaches carrying a white flag, but he also has weapons. The peacemaker shoots him. A terrorist next approaches with a ceasefire resolution from the U.N. The peacemaker shoots him! also. A large group of terrorists approach and the peacemaker shoots them all and drops a nuclear bomb on the city they came from. The peacemaker continues killing the terrorists until the terrorists are all dead.

There is finally peace on earth and the United Nations takes the credit.








[link to www.theodoresworld.net]

g
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 04:11 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Israel doesn't want peace. You cannot negotiate with anyone when you tell the other side that they have to agree to everything you want before the negotiations start.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 04:13 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
"By way of deception thou shalt do war" --- Mossad Motto
_____________________________________________________________​______

Source: Al-Ahram

Furl the flag

Gamal Nkrumah reflects on Sarkozy's bad week

As if his marital challenges were not enough cause for concern, "Sarco the Sayan" has suddenly emerged as the most infamous accolade of French President Nicolas Sarkozy. The influential French daily Le Figaro last week revealed that the French leader once worked for -- and perhaps still does, it hinted -- Israeli intelligence as a sayan (Hebrew for helper), one of the thousands of Jewish citizens of countries other than Israel who cooperate with the katsas (Mossad case-officers).

A letter dispatched to French police officials late last winter -- long before the presidential election but somehow kept secret -- revealed that Sarkozy was recruited as an Israeli spy. The French police is currently investigating documents concerning Sarkozy's alleged espionage activities on behalf of Mossad, which Le Figaro claims dated as far back as 1983. According to the author of the message, in 1978, Israeli prime minister Menachem Begin ordered the infiltration of the French ruling Gaullist Party, Union pour un Mouvement Populaire. Originally targeted were Patrick Balkany, Patrick Devedjian and Pierre Lellouche. In 1983, they recruited the "young and promising" Sarkozy, the "fourth man".

Ex-Mossad agent Victor Ostrovsky describes how sayanim function in By Way Of Deception: The Making and Unmaking of a Mossad Officer. They are usually reached through relatives in Israel. An Israeli with a relative in France, for instance, might be asked to draft a letter saying the person bearing the letter represents an organisation whose main goal is to help save Jewish people in the Diaspora. Could the French relative help in any way? They perform many different roles. A car sayan, for example, running a rental car agency, could help the Mossad rent a car without having to complete the usual documentation. An apartment sayan would find accommodation without raising suspicions, a bank sayan could fund someone in the middle of the night if needs be, a doctor sayan would treat a bullet wound without reporting it to the police.

And, a political sayan ? It's rather obvious what this could mean. The sayanim are a pool of people at the ready who will keep quiet about their actions out of loyalty to "the cause", a non-risk recruitment system that draws from the millions of Jewish people outside Israel.

Such talk sends chills down spines, especially Arab and Muslim ones. Indeed, the revelation did not go unnoticed in Arab capitals or come as much of a surprise. Paris can be a sunny place for shady people. When it comes to intelligence gathering on behalf of Israel, a question mark is immediately raised on the moral calibre of the person in question. But, how does this scandal influence France's foreign and domestic politics?

[Extract]

Entire Article:

[link to weekly.ahram.org.eg]
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 04:15 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
: "By way of deception thou shalt do war" --- Mossad
: Motto

By way of deception shalt thou do everything...

Sarko returned from his Bushian love fest to find his transport strike expanding to many more sectors of the economy, the economy itself starting to feel the spreading fallout of the US subprime mortgage debacle (freaking out bankers)... and a great many French who are beginning to wonder WTF they were thinking when they voted for this war whore neo-con.

Little Sarko has created a target rich environment for Villipin and the opposition. The press is giving him a much deserved thrashing. I don't think his political future is very bright unless he can pull off a French 911... and even then I don't think the French will swallow it... not after the Mossad revelations.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 04:28 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Israel doesn't want peace. You cannot negotiate with anyone when you tell the other side that they have to agree to everything you want before the negotiations start.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 323776



:paz:
Dismas

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11/10/2007 05:38 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Hi ya' Gaia. hf

Palestinian making concessions? That'll be the day!
Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, is talking about putting Jerusalem on the table for grabs! Now, that's a concession-it's also stupid!

[link to news.yahoo.com]

The Palestinians want the Temple Mount-will Olmert put that on the table too? Jerusalem won't be enough-they'll always want more.

Thread: Palestinians have completely LOST their minds!

Olmert needs to remember the fate of Ariel Sharon when considering such dumb ideas. Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel! They are due no land!

Thread: "Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel!"

They are lucky to have it so good-they should consider life outside of the Israeli realm!

[link to www.sayanythingblog.com]

Truth be known, Palestinians don't really want peace with Israel-they simply want to take over Israel (flip-flop it!)

[link to www.freerepublic.com]

I just wish that Israel would stand their ground and refuse any kind of land trade. Provide the Palestinians with a "full" citizenship and assimilate them into the society. Those Palestinians refusing the offer-deport them or house them in a designated "reservation" without the benefits (of Israeli-Palestinians.)

The time to resolve this matter (once & for all) is at hand-be firm but, fair to the Palestinians.
Dismas Zoathan

I've been there-done that so, follow me, I might be a little less lost than you. If not-tag, you're it!
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 06:44 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Hi ya' Gaia. hf

Palestinian making concessions? That'll be the day!
Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, is talking about putting Jerusalem on the table for grabs! Now, that's a concession-it's also stupid!

[link to news.yahoo.com]

The Palestinians want the Temple Mount-will Olmert put that on the table too? Jerusalem won't be enough-they'll always want more.

Thread: Palestinians have completely LOST their minds!

Olmert needs to remember the fate of Ariel Sharon when considering such dumb ideas. Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel! They are due no land!

Thread: "Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel!"

They are lucky to have it so good-they should consider life outside of the Israeli realm!

[link to www.sayanythingblog.com]

Truth be known, Palestinians don't really want peace with Israel-they simply want to take over Israel (flip-flop it!)

[link to www.freerepublic.com]

I just wish that Israel would stand their ground and refuse any kind of land trade. Provide the Palestinians with a "full" citizenship and assimilate them into the society. Those Palestinians refusing the offer-deport them or house them in a designated "reservation" without the benefits (of Israeli-Palestinians.)

The time to resolve this matter (once & for all) is at hand-be firm but, fair to the Palestinians.
 Quoting: Dismas




Hi ....you didnt answer my mail....yet..?



gaia
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 06:54 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Hi ya' Gaia. hf

Palestinian making concessions? That'll be the day!
Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, is talking about putting Jerusalem on the table for grabs! Now, that's a concession-it's also stupid!

[link to news.yahoo.com]

The Palestinians want the Temple Mount-will Olmert put that on the table too? Jerusalem won't be enough-they'll always want more.

Thread: Palestinians have completely LOST their minds!

Olmert needs to remember the fate of Ariel Sharon when considering such dumb ideas. Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel! They are due no land!

Thread: "Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel!"

They are lucky to have it so good-they should consider life outside of the Israeli realm!

[link to www.sayanythingblog.com]

Truth be known, Palestinians don't really want peace with Israel-they simply want to take over Israel (flip-flop it!)

[link to www.freerepublic.com]

I just wish that Israel would stand their ground and refuse any kind of land trade. Provide the Palestinians with a "full" citizenship and assimilate them into the society. Those Palestinians refusing the offer-deport them or house them in a designated "reservation" without the benefits (of Israeli-Palestinians.)

The time to resolve this matter (once & for all) is at hand-be firm but, fair to the Palestinians.
 Quoting: Dismas

Why don't you just offer the palistians some other land for the west bank? Like land that connects to the Gaza strip? Then you can build a fence and cut them loose to do their own thing. In fact get Jordan to throw in a little land since they are nothing but a British invention. maybe Egygt too. Hell if everyone pitched in a little they could have a decent sized country and all will be peaceful.
gooderboy

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11/10/2007 07:03 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
... peace?????.... they're talking peace????... gee, all I ever hear them talking about is like real estate dealies.... go figure, huh?
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 07:13 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
... peace?????.... they're talking peace????... gee, all I ever hear them talking about is like real estate dealies.... go figure, huh?
 Quoting: gooderboy

Well st least they are just talking real estate while the Zionists remain silent as they just take real estate on the West bank. So yes I suppose the bottom line for all you morons is real estate. No one thinks any of you criminals are ever going to love each other so if you can just agree not to kill and murder each other then maybe the rest of the world can feel safe that the insanity of Israels "goliath option" will not take out this whole planet.


.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 07:23 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
... peace?????.... they're talking peace????... gee, all I ever hear them talking about is like real estate dealies.... go figure, huh?
 Quoting: gooderboy

Anyway it's a shame you assholes think this is a big joke. It's clear you can't even be serious about this to an outside observer. You people must love conflict, peace with you crazies is an impossibility from my observations. What is the big problem? All that money coming from the U.S. might dry up if there is peace? Does money mean that much to you? I pity you.
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11/10/2007 10:05 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
ARAB NEWS - Sunday, 24, December, 2006 (04, Dhul Hijjah, 1427)


Dr. Khaled Batarfi, [email protected]

The Israeli lobby in America is under pressure these days. It seems they crossed so many red lines that some hot-blooded Americans felt obliged to protest.

The 2002 Nobel Peace Prize winner, former US President Jimmy Carter, is not alone with his recent book "Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid" and LA Times and Guardian article, "How I See Palestine." A recent Harvard study entitled "The Israel Lobby" by Professors John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt details the ways of the lobby and its victims. Tellingly, they later joined the victim list. There are similar studies and books exposing the lobby, like "They Dare to Speak Out: People and Institutions Confront Israel’s Lobby" by 22-year veteran Congressman Paul Findley whose stand cost him dearly, and "Jewish Power: Inside the American Jewish Establishment" by American-Jewish insider, J. J. Goldberg.

Some still think this is a lobby like any. An American friend argued that the tobacco and gun lobbies are among the strongest in the US. They use similar aggressive methods to advance their agenda and influence decision makers in Congress and the Administration — what is the difference? I explained that these groups are working on an all-American platform, claiming to represent and defend the interests of the American public and businesses.

In the Israeli lobby case, it is Americans for Israel. They fight and pressure not for the good of the American nation, but for that of a foreign country. They even dare to say it loud and clear, like former House Majority Leader Dick Armey who pronounced in September 2002: "My No. 1 priority in foreign policy is to protect Israel." (Not America!)

This Christian Zionist congressman and chief author of the Republican Contract with America, who called in May 2004 for ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, is not alone. According to the Harvard study, the lobby also includes prominent Christian evangelicals like Gary Bauer, Jerry Falwell, Ralph Reed and Pat Robertson, as well as Tom DeLay, former majority leader in the House of Representatives and Trent Lott, Senate minority leader. All of whom believe Israel’s rebirth is the fulfillment of biblical prophecy and support its expansionist agenda; to do otherwise, they believe, would be contrary to God’s will. Neo-conservative gentiles such as John Bolton; Robert Bartley, the former Wall Street Journal editor; William Bennett, the former secretary of education; Jeane Kirkpatrick, the former UN ambassador; and the influential columnist George Will are also steadfast supporters. Other Jewish senators and congressmen work to ensure that US foreign policy supports Israel’s interests.

You can’t argue with success. For decades, the centerpiece of US Middle Eastern policy has been its relationship with Israel. The combination of unwavering support for Israel has inflamed Arab and Islamic opinion and jeopardized not only US security but that of much of the rest of the world. This situation has no equal in American political history.

According to the Harvard study, Washington has provided Israel with a level of support dwarfing that given to any other state. It has been the largest annual recipient of direct economic and military assistance since 1976, and is the largest recipient in total since World War II, to the tune of well over $140 billion (in 2004 dollars). Israel receives about $3 billion in direct assistance each year, roughly one-fifth of the US foreign aid budget, and worth about $500 a year for every Israeli. This largesse is especially striking since Israel is now a wealthy industrial state with a budget surplus and a per capita income roughly equal to that of South Korea or Spain.

Since 1982, the US has vetoed 32 Security Council resolutions critical of Israel. It blocks the efforts of Arab states to put Israel’s nuclear arsenal on the International Atomic Energy Agency’s agenda.

The US consistently supported the Israeli position in every peace negotiation. An American participant at Camp David in 2000 later said: "Far too often, we functioned...as Israel’s lawyer." Finally, the Bush Administration’s ambition to transform the Middle East is at least partly aimed at improving Israel’s strategic situation.

Israel knows it could rely on the lobby and its friends in the American power structure. They never fail it even if it means sacrificing their own country’s best interests. Whatever Israel wants Israel gets.


That is why Israeli former Prime Minister Ariel Sharon in Oct. 3, 2001 said to Shimon Peres, as reported on Kol Yisrael radio, "Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that...I want to tell you something very clear: Don’t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it."

I wonder what type of Americans know this and accept it. I am pretty sure it is not the American public.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 10:19 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
BOOK REVIEW:No Beauty in the Beast: Israel without Her Mascara
Quote

No Beauty in the Beast: Israel without Her Mascara

By Curt Maynard

Mark Glenn is an accomplished author and the webmaster of Crescent and the Cross -

As a politically correct apostate I have rejected the religion of political correctness which has freed me from the dogmatic and confining requirement to please everyone all the time. This allows me to write what I like, when I like, and about whom I like without qualms. I am completely free of the self imposed limitations that an embrasure of the PC Agenda guarantees and I prefer it that way.

Mark Glenn too is a politically correct apostate; he more than proves this with his latest book “No Beauty in the Beast: Israel Without Her Mascara.” Glenn has taken political incorrectness to a whole new level, this book hones in on Israel like no other I have ever read. It is hands down the absolute best book I have ever read on the hypocrisy so intimately associated with the religious right in the United States and its love affair with a group of people and a nation that quite literally despise them. This unbelievable and un-Christian sycophancy has reached the point now where several hundred Christian Zionists from the United States recently appeared in the Israel Parliament [Knesset] asking Israel for its forgiveness for “centuries of Christian anti-Semitism.” Folks, this is a sickness, when so called Christian leaders have reached the point where they openly worship those associated with a religion that rejects every single significant tenet of Christianity [Whereas in comparison, Islam does not] – this isn’t my personal opinion and/or even a particular religious point of view, this is an undeniable and empirical fact. In any case, Glenn excises all of the superfluous garbage necessary in a tome that was written to please everyone and gets right down to the facts. The author does this so well in fact that even I was irked by his insight and unapologetic honestly a time or two, but I couldn’t put the book down. More on this later…

No Beauty in the Beast: Israel Without Her Mascara was written from the point of view of an educated Christian, a rarity these days, when so many so-called Christians couldn’t find Israel on a map with the assistance of a cartographer. Believe it or not, geography is important, it is an indication as to whether or not someone has an “educated opinion ,” consider the so called Christian soccer mom I spoke with a week ago that casually informed me that she supported our troops in Kuwait. That’s right, she literally thought the war was being fought in Kuwait, she wasn’t even aware of the fact that US soldiers were occupying Iraq. When I encounter such incredible ignorance, I don’t even know how to respond to it. I have a Turkish friend that uses a “rule of three,” he tells me if he encounters an American with an opinion on Iraq, he’ll ask them if they can name three countries bordering Iraq; if they can’t, he’ll refuse to even discuss the issue with them. That’s pretty sage advice.

No Beauty in the Beast: Israel Without Her Mascara exposes Israel and Zionism for what it really is, an unrepentant, burnt out, unconscionable syphilitic whore. Michael Collins Piper said it slightly differently, but he said it just the same, when he wrote in the forward of Glenn’s book No Beauty in the Beast, “Mark Glenn demonstrates, beyond any doubt, that Israel ‘without her mascara’ is no beauty, but, instead a beast.”[1]

Glenn is a fantastic writer; the fact that he is fluent in a number of languages and has taught them over the years may have something to do with this, but his objective passion really makes the book what it is, despite the fact that he vehemently dislikes Zionism and the Jewish Supremacism associated with it, he makes clear that he does not view all Jews as part and parcel of this monolithic evil, but instead sees many Jews as victims of the same lies Gentiles are force fed. This isn’t to say that he coddles these Jews, he doesn’t; he subjects them to exactly the same level of scrutiny and criticism he applies to modern fundamentalist Christians and by so doing, reveals clearly how both groups, despite being deceived, are in fact very responsible for the Jewish Supremacist agenda being applied around the globe.

The agenda, according to Glenn, was revealed to him in all of its ugly nakedness, by a young man named Amir Ayyad, a figure that remains relatively nebulous until later in the book when Glenn reveals that young Amir, a Palestinian child of two years who “died with his eyes open” and the crown of his skull missing, the result of Israeli brutality, convinced Glenn as to who was truly behind all of the lies about Palestine, “After a year of looking for the truth, I finally found it, and it was the last argument that I needed to consider when making up my mind about who was right and who was wrong.”[2] The photograph of the dead child spoke to Glenn as nothing else could, slapped awake by the cold reality of a beautiful child, eyes open, but unseeing. I know from where Glenn comes, I have seen hundreds of photos of dead children, beautiful and innocent, splayed out in the informality of death – I have wept and I have spent countless hours attempting to understand – but there is nothing to understand, there is no logic to it, just hatred.

To this day, Glenn maintains a photograph of the young child above his desk at home, a constant reminder of the seriousness of what is truly an apocalyptic battle for the truth. Glenn suffers under no illusions, he knows what the stakes are, and he has chosen to fight the good fight, a truly rare and admirable man in this day and age.

No Beauty in the Beast opens with a chapter entitled “In their own words,” in which Glenn lays out a number of direct quotations associated with past and present Israeli and Zionist leaders and their views of the Goyim [read cattle or chattel property], that make racism of the old Jim Crow variety pale in comparison. Consider the words of Ariel Sharon in 1982:

“We are Judeo-Nazis, and why not? If your nice civilized parents, rather than writing books about their love for humanity had instead come to Israel and killed six million Arabs, what would have happened? Sure, two or three nasty pages would have been written in the history books, and we would have been called all sorts of names, but we would be here today as a nation of 25 million. What you don’t seem to understand is that the dirty work of Zionism is not finished yet, far from it.”

Consider how the Talmud, Judaism’s holiest book sees it: [All original Talmudic Quotes/Translations were obtained from Michael A. Hoffman's webpage "Truth about the Talmud" found HERE
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 10:30 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
“If a Gentile [non-Jew] hits a Jew, the Gentile must be killed.” [Sanhedrin 58b]

“All Gentile children are animals” [Yebamoth 98a]

“If a Jew is tempted to do evil, he should go to a city where he is not known [meaning a Gentile city] and do the evil there. [Moed Kattan 17a]

Consider the words of Israeli’s first Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion, a man that is portrayed as a hero in the American media:

“We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting off of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population.”

Consider the words of an average fourteen year old Israeli named Orri Joseph Avraham:

“I am a Jew. I am an Israeli. I am a Zionist, and I am both racially and intellectually superior to you, the non Jew. For your lies, your pathetic stupidity, and your anti-Semitism, your people will suffer under punishment of the world’s future super power, Israel! Jews are superior to dirty blooded non-Jews like you… Beware, for your kind will come to fear us. The coming thirty years will make your eyes twitch my Gentile… I am a Jew, you are not. I have the privilege of having God by my side.”

Consider the words of the Israeli writer Benny Morris:

“I’m trying to be realistic. Preserving my people [Jews] is more important than any universal moral concepts.”

Consider the words of Rabbi Yitzhak Ginsburg:

“Jewish blood and a goy’s blood are not the same.”

Or Rabbi Yaacov Perrin:

“One million Arabs are not worth one Jewish fingernail.”

Of course views such as the above pave the way for the evil thinking that justifies and perpetrates the below:

“Thai police discovered a production studio operated by Australian Jewish gangsters who had been involved in the making of child rape pornography and ritual murder movies. Four Thai and ten Australian Jews were arrested after Thai police discovered they had been kidnapping Thai children between the ages of three and nine years old from the countryside in Thailand, and then filming them being tortured, raped and murdered in ritualistic sacrificial scenes.” [Reported in the Guardian of London 2002].


So why haven’t you heard about any of these statements from a hyper attentive media that seems to fixate on anything that could in any way be considered “racist?” Well dear reader, the media’s attention is only focused on non-Jewish racism, and that’s because the media is absolutely monopolized by ethnic Jews – there is no getting around it any more, no apologies necessary, if you don’t know this by now - you haven’t been paying attention.

The truth is - if you still believe anything you seen and/or hear on the television or radio, you are in danger of being seriously misled. If proof is necessary that the entire media apparatus is rotten to the core, consider how Bush was received on March 29, 2007 at the Radio and Television Correspondents Association Dinner, he cracked jokes and all of the allegedly objective journalists laughed hysterically at what cannot be described as anything but the most grotesque and macabre attempts at humor I have ever seen. Consider everything that is happening in the world today, consider the lies being forced down our throats, consider the bodies of children blown to bits by American made bombs and then consider that Bush still feels comfortable enough to crack jokes at a dinner attended primarily by liberal journalists. No reader, these people will never tell you the truth, you can wait forever for one of them to corner Bush on Live Television with a relevant question, it’ll never happen. Oh yeah, by the way, even if it were to happen, live television is no longer “live,” and the media would edit out any non-kosher comments before they ever reached your eyes and ears.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 10:38 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Fortunately for us the alternative media has essentially taken the place of the lying mainstream. Prior to all the negative attention Jews are now facing, most were fairly content to accept the Zionist agenda – this is changing now however and worried Jews are coming forward at last in large numbers and speaking out against the Jewish Supremacist Agenda. We’re starting to see articles like “Zionism Polarizing the Jewish People,” which details the fact that Jews are collectively asking themselves if Israel is good for the Jews, a question that they should have asked themselves long ago. It is a sad fact that the only reason most Jews are asking themselves this question today, is because of the scrutiny they as a group are currently being subjected to worldwide. Nonetheless, it is a valid question; and better late than never.

No Beauty in the Beast truly stands out as the great book it is because of Glenn’s unapologetically honest critique of modern American Christian fundamentalism. Glenn does a better job than anyone else I am familiar with in exposing and dissecting the unbelievable ignorance and hypocrisy associated with the so called American Christian Zionist and their support of the state of Israel. I have personally seen with my own eyes people that subscribe to this philosophy literally go into a trance of denial, their eyelids droop, their faces relax, and they almost appear to fall asleep when Israel, Zionism and the Jewish Supremacist Agenda is being exposed to them in a manner in which they aren’t capable of contesting, when they realize they are unarmed with facts, and cannot argue their case and cause with any legitimacy, they fall into an obstinate stupor rather than listen and learn, it is a scary sight, but one that clearly reveals their programming.

Glenn pulls no punches when describing these automatons, he too has seen their eyelids drop and their bodies go limp, and he isn’t afraid to call a spade a spade, he writes:

“Despite whatever noble pretenses they may use in justifying their position, the truth of the matter is that it is but sheer stupidity laced with the complacency that follows in the wake of a comfortable lifestyle that is to blame for their disinterest in what is going on in the Middle East”[3] [Remember the soccer mom above?]. “For those with eyes to see, the obscene spectacle that is today the complacency of the Christian world towards the events in the Middle East is so dramatic and outrageous in its scope as to almost be surreal…”

Glenn reveals how the modern American Christian has given up worshipping Christ and instead worships the Jew and the Jewish Supremacist Agenda. What else can explain the blinders worn by those that profess a belief in Christ’s divinity, yet will vehemently defend the Pharisees that killed him, to even suggest to these individuals that Jews dominate Hollywood and have been the primary force behind much of the negative social changes that Christians profess to dislike, i.e. abortion, feminism, pornography, invasive government, the breakdown of the family unit, enforced secularism, the increase in crime and its unreported and/or distorted presentation, etc… etc… will elicit the same beguiled look eluded to earlier. These people literally expect to find their names written in the Book of Life for no other reason that they expect to find it there. Glenn writes, “This system of morals, as malevolent as Christianity was benevolent,’ has flooded the west with pornography, moral relevance, the murder of the unborn, the destruction of the family, and in all observable ways has all but destroyed the foundation of an entire civilization and culture. Through its [Zionism’s] stranglehold over media, the Christian West has been turned into a collective body of “useful idiots” whose resources and energies have been put to the service of the Zionist agenda.

Truer words have never been written – Glenn understands the nature of the beast and further elaborates on it by writing that “Christians around the world [that have allowed their fear of the Jew to silence them] should think twice about the scenarios that they have envisioned for themselves [i.e. eternal paradise]. Within the scope of their 2000-year history, not an instance can be found in which an individual was rewarded by the Master for cowardice, laziness or complacency.”[4] And to the chagrin of many a lazy Christian, Glenn writes, “On the contrary, it has been demonstrated in exhortation after exhortation by their founder [Christ] that it is the diligent who are rewarded, and those who have chosen to remain cold have in effect made themselves the worthless servants whom their leader said he would “vomit forth” for choosing to remain neutral in the battle between good and evil.”

The author makes it very clear in No Beauty in the Beast that giving unto Caesar when Caesar is an evil, no good son of a bitch is no guarantee one will see the Kingdom of Heaven. Deluding ones self or ignoring the evil of Caesar is likewise not an acceptable excuse that Christ is likely to consider when determining whether or not an individual will be allowed entry to Paradise.

In conclusion, Glenn eloquently describes how it is that Muslims are actually the allies of the Christian west in this titanic battle between good and evil and how they have willingly assumed positions on the front line, knowing full well what the results are likely to be. The so called Christian west has essentially fallen to the onslaught of filth and degeneracy provided by the Jewish Supremacist Agenda, but the Muslims haven’t surrendered their sovereignty, nor are they likely to without a fight. The question is; will the Pharisees’ be able to convince the west to murder more Muslims as the proxy agent of Zion, or will a tipping point manifest itself and a rebellion occur? A military draft may be what’s required to wake up Suzy soccer mom and Joe Sixpack, perhaps when they see little Johnny inducted into the service of Zion and then brought back home in a wooden box and/or treated with contempt as an amputee at a military hospital staffed by uncaring immigrants brought in to displace American workers they’ll wake up.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 10:47 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
The problem this writer had with Glenn’s book No Beauty in the Beast is that it was occasionally too honest even for me, a self described politically correct apostate. Glenn’s description of the behavior of American soldiers and the atrocities they have indeed committed hit a little too close to home a time or two. I served in the United States Army back in the 1980s and proudly served as a very naïve young man in Killer Troop, 3/2 Armored Cavalry Regiment. There was a time I reveled in the name of my troop and readily admitted with a misguided sense of pride that we were indeed killers and we were, that is what we were trained to do, and that is what our intentions were should we be called to battle. In Recognition of the indisputable fact that wars are won by killing more people than a nation sacrifices, I still find it hard to condemn the individual soldier and want to hold their leadership solely responsible [In the case of Iraq, I want to see the entire American government held responsible], but at the same time I must admit that there comes a time when the individual either embraces evil or rejects it. I must admit that Glenn convincingly describes in No Beauty in the Beast how it is that so many soldiers have come to accept the idea of killing innocent people, that they have been indoctrinated with this mentality since birth, intentionally subjected to violent television programming and equally violent video games, movies and other associated Zionist tools of opinion formation/manipulation with the sole purpose of creating an unfeeling and unthinking killing machine, willing to do the bidding of Zion.


[1] Glenn, Mark. No Beauty in the Beast: Israel Without Her Mascara [2005] The Barnes Review. Washington DC. Pg. 2.
[2] Ibid Pg. 245
[3] Ibid Pg. 96.
[4] Ibid Pg 262-263.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 10:54 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
All Hail Mark Glenn. He is a great writer, as I have read a few of his articles and essays. High praise, as well to all the Apostates. As has been said however, enough ink has been spilled. Foxman, Abrams, Dershowitz, et all need to be shown the error of their ways. As for the so called Christian-Zionist morons, they are all traitors to their races, be they white, black, hispanic or whatever. Not only is their mindless belief in superstition appalling, the fact that they have perverted even that into support for the Israelis, is beyond my comprehension. There may very well be too few awakened whites to have any impact on the events to come. What a shame.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 11:00 AM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
I respect the desires of those who want peace and liberty and justice. I respect those who live and let live by staying out of the business of others.

Let's be honest - truly honest. Shouldn't everyone apologize to everyone else? Do you really love your neighbor the way you love yourself?

There is a difference between Jews, Judaism and Zionism. Unfortunately and tragically for the nations of people worldwide, very few seem to know the difference.

I've had to reeducate myself after having been programmed by culture, media and controlled public education. As a result, I will say this bluntly.

The Christian church is lost. I invite all people living in Israel, including all the Jews, to immigrate to the United States. We have plenty of room and can use your talents. But defending the UN created state of Zionist Israel is not on my list of priorities. Israel has my permission to defend itself without US help and without using Israeli nukes. Can it do that? Will G-d permit a victory in that instance?

The hypocrisy is so thick and so apparent that common sense is insulted and further argument becomes a waste of time.

I just have some warnings to issue to anyone who wishes to separate the American people from their constitution and Bill of Rights including the right to criticize anyone and any thing including movements, policies, philosophies, religions, races and people. It's called free speech - a G-d given right.

We are all humans. It's time some people began to recognize and honor that.
Dismas

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11/10/2007 03:28 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
Hi ya' Gaia. hf

Palestinian making concessions? That'll be the day!
Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, is talking about putting Jerusalem on the table for grabs! Now, that's a concession-it's also stupid!

[link to news.yahoo.com]

The Palestinians want the Temple Mount-will Olmert put that on the table too? Jerusalem won't be enough-they'll always want more.

Thread: Palestinians have completely LOST their minds!

Olmert needs to remember the fate of Ariel Sharon when considering such dumb ideas. Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel! They are due no land!

Thread: "Palestinian Arabs are not indigenous of the Land of Israel!"

They are lucky to have it so good-they should consider life outside of the Israeli realm!

[link to www.sayanythingblog.com]

Truth be known, Palestinians don't really want peace with Israel-they simply want to take over Israel (flip-flop it!)

[link to www.freerepublic.com]

I just wish that Israel would stand their ground and refuse any kind of land trade. Provide the Palestinians with a "full" citizenship and assimilate them into the society. Those Palestinians refusing the offer-deport them or house them in a designated "reservation" without the benefits (of Israeli-Palestinians.)

The time to resolve this matter (once & for all) is at hand-be firm but, fair to the Palestinians.




Hi ....you didnt answer my mail....yet..?



gaia
 Quoting: ~GAIA~


I'm sorry. I'll try to this week. I've pretty much been in and out this week. Hitting the forum here on the odd moments. Cheers. hf hf hf
Dismas Zoathan

I've been there-done that so, follow me, I might be a little less lost than you. If not-tag, you're it!
-Ajax-
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11/10/2007 04:05 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
... peace?????.... they're talking peace????... gee, all I ever hear them talking about is like real estate dealies.... go figure, huh?
 Quoting: gooderboy

hehehe...right on Gooder...my thoughts exactly.
Peace with you man.
A
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2007 04:26 PM
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Re: What makes a 'concession' meaningful? -Peace in Middle East-
I think it is amazing the incredible intricate details that show up in the anti-Jewish anti-Israel camp. Not one bit of proof or a single thing besides he said she said.

Now no one can argue at all about the president of Iran and what he says and what position he has in regards to Israel and its people.

Yet when Israelis pick up a gun, provide for their security, secure an alliance, cries of trickery and brutality and connivance are heard all around. Here is my conclusion to this deep dark prejudice...

YOU WILL NEVER BE EQUAL ISRAEL.....KILL THEM WHAT OTHER CHOICE DO THEY GIVE YOU???????





GLP