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Best ever proof of moon hoax?

 
rodin
User ID: 455404
United Kingdom
06/24/2008 01:55 PM
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Best ever proof of moon hoax?
I refer you to this video


Here's an interesting observation. A paper? bag containing moon dust? (fairy dust more like) is dropped from a height of about 3-4 feet ie backback. Frame 51.05 seconds just starting. By frame 52 seconds the descent is already complete

g(moon) = g(earth/6)

Time to drop 8 feet on Earth = 1 sec. (1st second)
Time to drop 8 feet on Moon = 6 sec. 1st 3-4 feet about 3 seconds.

Now of course, if, as maintained by some, the film footage is half speed, the bag's descent speed exactly matches that expected on Earth. As it is it falls 3x too fast for the moon

Can anyone debunk this proof?

And if they can't does this mean the case for a hoax is proven beyond a moon shadow of doubt?

Bet the OP here is getting an earful from HQ...


 [link to goldismoney.info] 

Anonymous Coward
User ID: 419777
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06/24/2008 02:01 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
That thing falling is very interesting to say the least.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 401342
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06/24/2008 02:04 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Since there's no weather on the moon, shouldn't there be a shit load of U.S. flags there when/if some other country goes there?
rodin (OP)
User ID: 455404
United Kingdom
06/24/2008 02:15 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Sorry wrong video my bad. It is in the GIM thread abut here also now. Cheers

TLD3

User ID: 455280
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06/24/2008 02:34 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
rodin (OP)
User ID: 455404
United Kingdom
06/24/2008 02:55 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
The above video I know about but it can be claimed as a spoof.

This is from official NASA footage

I have refined the presentation here

Please check this out

[link to goldismoney.info]

If this proof is as watertight as I think it may be, the government will have no answer to it. Think of the implications of that.
Barls Knarkley
User ID: 401789
Australia
06/24/2008 08:51 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
g(moon) = g(earth/6)
 Quoting: rodin 455404


Yes, the Moon's gravity is one sixth of the Earth's, but that doesn't mean that the relationship of the time taken to fall a given distance on the two worlds is a linear ratio. See below.

Time to drop 8 feet on Earth = 1 sec. (1st second)
 Quoting: rodin 455404


Well, this is flat out wrong for a start. From Newton's laws we get s=ut+0.5a(t squared). With initial velocity u=0, then in one second on Earth an object will fall 0.5*9.8*1 = 4.9 meters, much higher than your figure of 8 feet!

Time to drop 8 feet on Moon = 6 sec. 1st 3-4 feet about 3 seconds.
 Quoting: rodin 455404


Wrong again, sorry. Using the same equation as above, and with acceleration set to one sixth of the Earth's 9.8 meters per second per second, then in one second we get s = 0.5*1.6*1 = 0.8 meters, or under three feet. That t squared factor in the motion equation is why you can't just divide the time by six to get the figure for the Moon - it's not a linear relationship, it's a quadratic one.

To rearrange the equation to solve for t given a known s and an initial velocity u = 0, we get t=square root(2s/a). So for a distance of one meter, on Earth it would take sqrt(2/9.8) = 0.45 seconds. On the Moon, we get t = sqrt(2/1.6) = 1.1 seconds.

So the time the bag takes to reach the ground is entirely consistent with falling in lunar gravity.

Now of course, if, as maintained by some, the film footage is half speed, the bag's descent speed exactly matches that expected on Earth.
 Quoting: rodin 455404


Over a distance of one meter, yes, that happens to be roughly true in this case. But the double speed explanation simply doesn't hold water if you look at all the footage, not just a few snippets a few seconds long that have been taken in isolation. The astronaut's arm movements are wrong, and gravity only acts in one direction (up and down), while movements in the other two dimensions occur at normal speed. Try looking at extended bits of footage at double speed, not just the fragments you have been told to take out of context, and you will see that this is not a viable explanation.

And if they can't does this mean the case for a hoax is proven beyond a moon shadow of doubt?
 Quoting: rodin 455404


Well no, of course not. The bag drop in this clip is clearly not intentional. So why leave it in the footage? Why not reshoot rather than leave in something incriminating? As it is, the calculations above clearly show that there is nothing inconsistent about the clip.
Anonymous Coward
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Finland
06/24/2008 09:22 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?


How would the moon gravity effect the lunar sand what rover throws in the air when driving?
Just curious :D..One could think it would fly farther away than in earth.
-jf
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 193848
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06/24/2008 10:08 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Well no, of course not. The bag drop in this clip is clearly not intentional. So why leave it in the footage? Why not reshoot rather than leave in something incriminating? As it is, the calculations above clearly show that there is nothing inconsistent about the clip.
 Quoting: Barls Knarkley 401789


How do you explain all of those lens flares and wire tricks from the first video? It does appear that wires were used to support the astro-nots.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 457657
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06/24/2008 10:16 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Some math helps.

The best proof I've seen is the pic of the earth from the moon. The earth is too small in the pic. The earth, as you may know,is 4x bigger than the moon, and should be in the pic.

[link to www.arcadiastreet.com]
small earth
[link to www.aulis.com]
[link to www.aulis.com]
nomuse (NLI)
User ID: 457742
United States
06/24/2008 10:28 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Some math helps.

The best proof I've seen is the pic of the earth from the moon. The earth is too small in the pic. The earth, as you may know,is 4x bigger than the moon, and should be in the pic.

[link to www.arcadiastreet.com]
small earth
[link to www.aulis.com]
[link to www.aulis.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 457657



How big would the Moon be, taken with the same lens and cropped in the same way? Have you determined that? Have you perhaps calculated based on the field of view of the lens how far the Earth (or the Moon) should subtend across the image field?

Or have you merely compared what the Earth "looks like" in a few Apollo pictures versus what it "looks like" taken with a typical consumer camera?

I'd be interested to know how you arrived at the measurement that shows the Earth is too small.
Barls Knarkley
User ID: 401789
Australia
06/24/2008 10:30 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
How do you explain all of those lens flares and wire tricks from the first video? It does appear that wires were used to support the astro-nots.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 193848


How is a lens flare proof of a hoax?

There are no wire tricks in that clip. For a start, there is an antenna projecting out of the top of the backpack. It was shaped like a tape measure - broad and flat, so it can flare based on the angle it makes between the sun and camera.

The other flares of light are compression video effects or video tube washout. For example, at the same time that you see the "suspicious flare" at the top of the screen that is supposedly a wire, there is a flash from the bottom of the astronaut's backpack. Why isn't our attention drawn to this? Perhaps it's some sort of booster rocket used to aid in the low gravity simulation! In reality, they are both video artifacts. They occur at numerous points in the extended clip this is taken from, at points well away from the astronauts and clearly unrelated to him. Your attention is just being drawn to this one short clip and no context is given in order to drive your conclusions towards a specific and erroneous end.

Additionally, if we are to believe that the antenna flare and video artifact at the top of the screen are really meant to be a wire, then why does it shine so brightly? Wires used in film and television are painted black, precisely so that these bright flares don't occur. Why would they use reflective ones?

Thirdly, the "wire" as shown is meant to be attached to the backpack? Think about where the astronaut's center of gravity is. If he really was lifted by such a wire he would pendulum forward quite noticeably. It would not look anything like what we see in the video.
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2008 10:56 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
bsflag
avenyou
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10/30/2009 07:52 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Don't you think the Russians would have revealed the hoax if it was true. Get a life.
Anonymous Coward
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Canada
10/30/2009 08:00 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
[link to www.moontoday.net]

LRO maneuvered into its 50-km mapping orbit on September 15. The next pass over the Apollo 17 landing site resulted in images with more than two times better resolution than previously acquired. At the time of this recent overflight the Sun was high in the sky (28° incidence angle) helping to bring out subtle differences in surface brightness.

The descent stage of the lunar module Challenger is now clearly visible, at 50 cm per pixel (angular resolution) the descent stage deck is 8 pixels across (4 meters), also note that the legs are also now distinguishable. The descent stage served as the launch pad for the ascent stage as it blasted off for a rendezvous with the command module America on 14 December 1972.
Reality Is B.S

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10/30/2009 08:06 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Don't you think the Russians would have revealed the hoax if it was true. Get a life.
 Quoting: avenyou 806803

Of course not, the Cold War was a hoax for the sheep. Looks like you bought it.
Throwing more erroneous useless information into the original arguement.
JackStorm

User ID: 42007451
New Zealand
06/19/2013 11:54 PM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
There are 100 reasons why the moon landing is real.

There are 100 mirrors placed around the landing site.
[link to science.nasa.gov]

Reflect on that!
JackStorm
REALLY
User ID: 24388694
United States
08/24/2013 04:59 AM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Really people really. go to you tube type in why we can't fake a moon landing and watch. This man explains that usa at the time had the capability and audacity to go to the moon... BUT we did not have the capability to fake it for one huge reason IN 1969 when the Apollo mission was aired to over 600 million people including my self thank you the program lasted for over two hours. Ok stay with me now America did not have any high speed cameras back then nobody did SO they had to use FILM now the problem with film is you have to change reels and make sure no dust or damage came to the reels or you would see it. Well hate to break it to you but the only film cartridge big enough to hold TWO HOURS worth of film would be the size of a CAR really a CAR usa went bottom line.
Anonymous Coward
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08/24/2013 09:42 AM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Don't you think the Russians would have revealed the hoax if it was true. Get a life.
 Quoting: avenyou 806803


The Russians were doing their own hoax after hoax, humiliating Americans in the space race. They just lied about their progress. So Americans just came up with a really big lie to keep up pace. It was all a game in deceit; the Soviets had no real interest in ending all the fun by exposing their game.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
08/24/2013 09:45 AM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Really people really. go to you tube type in why we can't fake a moon landing and watch. This man explains that usa at the time had the capability and audacity to go to the moon... BUT we did not have the capability to fake it for one huge reason IN 1969 when the Apollo mission was aired to over 600 million people including my self thank you the program lasted for over two hours. Ok stay with me now America did not have any high speed cameras back then nobody did SO they had to use FILM now the problem with film is you have to change reels and make sure no dust or damage came to the reels or you would see it. Well hate to break it to you but the only film cartridge big enough to hold TWO HOURS worth of film would be the size of a CAR really a CAR usa went bottom line.
 Quoting: REALLY 24388694


So you think it would be easier to send a man to the moon than to make a really big film cartridge? This is why they can deceive us so easily...because we want to believe.
MHz

User ID: 2956246
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08/24/2013 10:13 AM
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Re: Best ever proof of moon hoax?
Some math helps.

The best proof I've seen is the pic of the earth from the moon. The earth is too small in the pic. The earth, as you may know,is 4x bigger than the moon, and should be in the pic.

[link to www.arcadiastreet.com]
small earth
[link to www.aulis.com]
[link to www.aulis.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 457657



How big would the Moon be, taken with the same lens and cropped in the same way? Have you determined that? Have you perhaps calculated based on the field of view of the lens how far the Earth (or the Moon) should subtend across the image field?

Or have you merely compared what the Earth "looks like" in a few Apollo pictures versus what it "looks like" taken with a typical consumer camera?

I'd be interested to know how you arrived at the measurement that shows the Earth is too small.
 Quoting: nomuse (NLI) 457742

The diameter of the earth is slightly more than 3.5 times that of the moon. Some shots that show the curve of the moon could determine the focal length of the lens used. 70MM for that camera would be about 50mm on a 35mm filmstrip.

The math can't be that difficult once the conversion factors are in or find an existing photo taken from the earth with the same film/lens combination and use a ruler.

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