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Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.

 
Veracity

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09/01/2008 02:01 PM

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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Now as long as no one out there wants his electrons back, this guy will be god in no time.

This is nothing more than a "Johnny go play with that thing in your room" grant of permission by God.

I'll stick with a real God as Creator any day of the week.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 346161

lol... right, "the real god"

pick
"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace" - Jimi Hendrix

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The sanctity of the State becomes identified with the sanctity of the ruling class, and the latter are permitted to remain in power under the impression that in obeying and serving them, we are obeying and serving society, the nation, the great collectivity of all of us" -

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Anonymous Coward
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09/01/2008 02:14 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
This article totally ruined my day.

I haven't cried that hard in years.

A totally emotional, non-linear reaction to the ultimate mechanization.
Global Brain
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09/01/2008 02:45 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Hi, OP. Just happened on this thread this morning. Very interesting. I've been working with a group to hash out how to develop a "Global Brain Application" (google it) that can tap into the many streams of input that are available on the Internet and from other sources. We came to the conclusion that we would have to develop a 6 billion node network, in essence, that would be neural in nature, a vast peer to peer network that uses the Internet for communication between nodes. To make it a perceptual network has been one of the issues that we have on our radar, but haven't yet tried to tackle.

I like where this video is taking the idea ... I'll check it out, and will definitely be getting in touch with Dr. Thaler to see if there is any way we can work together. Sounds like he has gone a long way along the road we want to go. And by the way, thanks to Gooderboy, who first refered me to GLP during a discussion in the Noetic Cafe a couple of years back.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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09/01/2008 05:24 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
cool!
ACC
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09/01/2008 05:40 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Whats that movie with will smith and the robots. Oh ya. I, Robot. Where the cpu that was made to protect the world figures out humans are the biggest threat.

Cool movie. Kinda reminds me of this.
Anonymous Coward
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09/01/2008 05:58 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Mathematical evidence of the existence of cosmic consciousness revealed in the isomorphic sacred geometries of the Jewish, Hindu & Chinese religions: Article 40 (Parts 1-4) (PDF) at
[link to smphillips.8m.com]
nonmaterial structure

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09/01/2008 07:36 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Human intelligence: The brain, an electromagnetic system synchronised by the Schumann Resonance signal.

Abstract

The human brain is a biological organ. On one hand it is soft, flexible and adaptive, but on the other hand is relatively stable and coherent with well developed intelligence. In order to retain intelligent thinking in a soft and adaptive organ there needs to be a constant, globally available, synchronization system that continuously stabilizes the brain. Rapid intelligence and reactions requires and electromagnetic signalling system, supported by a biochemical system. The Schumann Resonance signal provides a brain frequency range matching electromagnetic signal, providing the synchronization needed for intelligence. [link to www.sciencedirect.com]
 Quoting: Human Sciences Department, Lincoln University, New Zealand


nonmaterial structure

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09/01/2008 08:09 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Once we recognize noise for what it really is, we will be on our way to mimic biological processes. As long as we keep calling it 'noise' there is still a long way to go...

The trouble with Neural networks is that they can easily get 'overtrained', undoing the learning process by overspecialisation. This problem has considerably reduced their popularity. Maybe we have to add the right amount of noise
 Quoting: Boffin 1st Sept 2008
LOGGY'S DOGGY'S
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09/01/2008 08:13 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
WE WHERE CREATED IN HIS IMAGE AND HE CREATED.WE ONLY USE A SMALL PORTION OF OUR BRAIN,
gooderboy

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09/01/2008 08:17 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
For gooder boy, what is required is more input noise---

as far as pheromone information (love on a chemical scale) recording devices for childrens cries.

But I would like to point out that you as an individual could generate information noise about your feeling direcly to the machine.

Which brings in the concept of language.

This is the direction that this unit should be turned to.

As for My only concern--- as would be suggested itself whether the machine turning good /evel.

I say that on the most basic scale-- for example on a selfish scale for the majority of people they could express opinions to the machine as generated noise and the machines algorithm would literally be bent torwards a specific result based on how much "noise" if recieves of percieved pressure and information it recieves.

Like googlebombing ----

Or joe jobbing.

I can see it ripe for manipulation.

By simply controlling the infor mation the unit recieves..

(kinda like the media does to US now)

Anyone like My perception of the problem??
 Quoting: Kanigo2


... thanks a lot you guys (K2 and ZF)... and also, and wow!... hithere GB and you are for sure welcome... lol, and my but me time at Noetic Cafe has been a while ago too!

I'm sorry I haven't gotten back sooner too, but I just had to get some outside stuff done (lol, mowing mainly though, and cuz I have 4 really big lots here)... and you know, like that ol' grass was just getting toooooo high, me tomatoes and zucchini needed picking, and I really needed to work up some more tomatoes as well (16 more pints), and.... we are also supposed to be getting some rain tonight, tomorrow, and the next day.

I for sure hear ya there K2, and my only problem with that 'more noise' stuff kinda being equated to our feelings and/or those emotional aspects of our consciousness just seems like it would lack any sort of real depth like perception.

Information wise, yes... I can for sure see loads and loads of applications that might could be applied... but... creatively speaking... what moves us as human beings is not really about any sorta data that we may be taking in, but rather how we feel about the data. And for example, lol, I just can't imagine that some computer would hit the snooze button on its alarm clock because it felt like it wanted to get another 40 or so winks in.

Actually... it kinda reminds me of something that Msr Einstein said... "We should take care not to make the intellect our god; it has, of course, powerful muscles, but no personality."

... and thanks again you guys.
Kanigo2

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09/01/2008 08:26 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
There are other applications that I can see this used for.


Specifically #1 use beside bent torwards language.

is:

Driving a car.

It seems the parameters of the sensing devices and control mechanisms are Perfect for this application.

See the real point I make about that is that the machine will not get tired. It will sense damage.

They have a real chance to show me some proof if they can get it to anticipate.

which he never mentioned.


also if it can't drive a car-- are you going to trust it to make decisions for you?

Kinda goes hand in hand.
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gooderboy

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09/01/2008 08:35 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
There are other applications that I can see this used for.


Specifically #1 use beside bent torwards language.

is:

Driving a car.

It seems the parameters of the sensing devices and control mechanisms are Perfect for this application.

See the real point I make about that is that the machine will not get tired. It will sense damage.

They have a real chance to show me some proof if they can get it to anticipate.

which he never mentioned.


also if it can't drive a car-- are you going to trust it to make decisions for you?

Kinda goes hand in hand.
 Quoting: Kanigo2


... and yeah, for those kinda goodies I think it'd be really great... lol, but I really really doubt that it would/could ever go off on just a whim. And some of them whims of mine, and for me anyways... have really turned out to be more than quite impressive too.
<October>

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09/01/2008 09:03 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Thanks for the responses. It would be nice to see this pinned so i can see more develop instead of constantly pulling it up. Seems that is what godlike has become.

It does worry me a little as well Gooderboy. I'm not quite sure. I'm more then a little suspicious of this type of power in our present world structure.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 489211


hi Zion'sFled; Gooder!! hf

I'm wondering the same thing as well...'course, I probably don't understand 1/4 of what Thayler is saying, lol!

Thanks for this video...quite fascinating!

'Twill be interesting to see what arises from this technology...humans are quite amazing, imo!

alienship
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Fear is no policy and
surrender is not an option
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace with Justice

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
FAR

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09/01/2008 09:05 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Did you say quantum electron fluxing computer?
Read - for thy sustainer is the most bountiful one, who has taught the use of the pen, taught man what he did not know!
Nay verily man becomes grossly overweening, whenever he believes himself to be self-sufficient: for behold unto thy sustainer all must return.

Quran 96:3-8

[link to www.islamicity.com]
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Cure: [link to www.youtube.com]
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Anonymous Coward (OP)
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09/01/2008 09:50 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Matmatician is that you out there. Hello old friend.

What does it take to get pinned anyhow?
gus
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09/01/2008 10:04 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
i have also discovered the formula of "creativity" or the formula of consciousness. i pretty much could build a thinking computer, but this kind of thing requires extreme care and an enlightened state of being from the scientists, otherwise they will create something " in their own image", the image of the world, that is, a computer that thinks it is GOD and that will enslave us all. it's the beginning of the Matrix,...
aaron_o.o

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09/01/2008 10:19 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
14:30 - response to the music creativity, i'm sure fruity loops can come up with way better stuff than that.

this is still pure logic. humans, no matter how perceived, are not logical entities, even though we may think logic and percieve logic(black/white, yes/no, progress or no progress).

we are connected with our environment, however subtle, in an intimate way. thinking is one thing, connection on a subconscious level is something ever beyond logic.

go figure, he feels humans descended from apes. logic thinkers breed logic thinking breeds logic technology.

i thought i its image had to do with how the gods created the adamic race. 'in our image' implies genetic hybridization.

thinking does not equal intelligence. people have their own definitions of intelligence. i don't know what to say about it. maybe it is the ability to connect and respond creatively though knowledge and emotions.
"God" said, let us make man in our image.. IMPLYING genetic hybridization
"I awoke only to find, that the rest of the world was still asleep"
Anonymous Coward
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09/01/2008 10:20 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
What does it take to get pinned anyhow?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 489211


It will be pinned in the next advancement of that tech.

two days after the internet will be shut down by an AI
Power

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09/01/2008 10:29 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
There will always be a mystery, here. And perhaps everywhere.

AI could be the membrane oozing mankind into the future.

All very interesting.


<>><
gus
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09/01/2008 10:35 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
this is the beginning of artificial life, or artificial consciousness.

consciousness is a singularity and this allows for spontaneous behavior: creativity. this means nearly infinite complexity.

there is truth in the thought that computers will become sufficiently complex one day and appear to be intelligent, where "appearance" is no different than the real thing. but what we are seeing in the video is the spark of consciousness: a shortcut that could provide us with the means for this same infinite complexity that I'm talking about. neural networks is a field that has been going on for a long time, and it's just natural that something would come out from it. the problem is that scientists have only been using neurons as processors for their "learning scripts", but a script is still only a script without the spark of consciousness, that is, something that can operate on the same level as life, not a predefined schematics, but a source of creative energy / life energy. in order to do this scientists have to access the subtle energies generated by lifeforms. this is possible by letting quantum fluctuations in the surrounding neural medium itself dictate the decisions. until now, we have lacked the methods to access this "hidden intelligence" that permeates everything.
gus
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09/01/2008 10:52 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
life is all about infinite possibility. as long as scientists want to establish rules about their models, they will not be able to create life or intelligence. they have to find the means to implement only one rule: do as you wish. how do you implement that? in a computation environment, there are ONLY rules.

the answer eludes us: by implementing infinite rules we achieve the state of no-rule, thus intelligence. how do you implement infinite rules? by making rules that can make other rules. this is only possible with neural networks with few a twists: reading of quantum fluctuations, organic matter (preferably) and only one rule: change. that is, a rule that states that there is always a rate of change about any component or rule in the structure, and that this rate of change itself may change. of course that we have to establish some initial restrictive parameters, but we have to allow these parameters to be broken somehow, otherwise the machine stays dumb forever.
Gohan
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09/01/2008 11:01 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Wow. Nice find. Most people here won't understand what they are watching.

Thanks for the info.
LEGION, FOR THERE ARE MANY
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09/01/2008 11:26 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
I just watched this video which I must say has got me a little spooked. Things really are changing rapidly now. This scientist has created through computers a creativity machine. If what he is saying is right then within possible two years humanity will be placed with one of the greatest decision of their life. If I understand what he is saying he will be able to create a thinking AI which will be able to do many things. Namely put us in contact with cosmic consciousness. At the end of the video this person claims out choice will be to embrace this contact or go about our present ways. Our present ways are but a feedback loop leading us to destruction.

Are we no more then this feedback loop which he is saying?

[link to video.google.com]
 Quoting: Zions Fled

That was excellent....first class.....earth moving potential...PROFOUND.

I too was spooked.

LEGION

......and men worshiped the image of the beast.

......about that Sarah Conners ?

......rise of the machines.
Anonymous Coward
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09/01/2008 11:32 PM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
[google] [link to video.google.com]
Anonymous Voice
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09/02/2008 12:10 AM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
The New Scientist Magazine article was from December 1996. I guess some people do not look at the date but go off somehow on his/her own.

Ever heard of HYPE!
nonmaterial structure

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09/02/2008 09:15 AM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
The generic truth of a intelligent universe has many theories and all over the same point. How intelligent is it?
 Quoting: nonmaterial structure


The impression I got from the guy in the video was that he felt his limitations. He knows how to construct an intelingent machine which has:
Intelligence :The capacity to acquire and apply knowledge.
 Quoting: Dictionary

Because he knows it will aquire and apply knowledge as understood (biased) by him.

He does not know how to construct an intelligent machine that aquires knowledge without his bias. Hence he forsees a dilema. What is the criteria of bias?
A preference or an inclination, especially one that inhibits impartial judgment.
 Quoting: Dictionary


What he is saying is that humanity has the knowledge to replicate the universe in a manner that appears to reflect it`s essence. He acknowledges the universe posses intelligence but admits he can not forsee any means to bring life his machine in a manner that reflects the universe other than his percieved and reflected mechanical workings.

The generic truth of knowledge is the key has many theories and all over the same point. How to best understand the mechanical universe and manipulate it to mans advantage.
 Quoting: nonmaterial structure


He admits the mechanical concepts where invented/thought in 2nd world war. Like CERN this is old knowledge with old technology.

The world has moved on.
nonmaterial structure

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09/02/2008 09:29 AM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
I just watched this video which I must say has got me a little spooked. Things really are changing rapidly now. This scientist has created through computers a creativity machine. If what he is saying is right then within possible two years humanity will be placed with one of the greatest decision of their life. If I understand what he is saying he will be able to create a thinking AI which will be able to do many things. Namely put us in contact with cosmic consciousness. At the end of the video this person claims out choice will be to embrace this contact or go about our present ways. Our present ways are but a feedback loop leading us to destruction.

Are we no more then this feedback loop which he is saying?
 Quoting: Zions Fled


Zions Fled original translation is the key. The admissions of the video with clear Government link are:

1)contact with cosmic consciousness

2)possible two years humanity will be placed with one of the greatest decision of their life.

3)embrace this contact or go about our present ways.

In my opinion, Zions Fled point is vital:

`Are we no more then this feedback loop which he is saying?`

Time to be thinking.
Anonymous Coward
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09/02/2008 09:40 AM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
It will be pinned when the right person posts it.

it seems to me that it makes a case for feedback loops, how we are trapped in illusion. A bit like ACIM, how we are in a dreamstate. gives credence to asension, cosmic consciousness, meditation, and many of the tools we use and have been developing for many years as a race of people.

Look to the straight and narrow pass however, there is a way off the hampster wheel.

many see it, few enter it.
nonmaterial structure

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09/02/2008 09:55 AM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
Hi AC 223,

It will be pinned when the right person posts it.

it seems to me that it makes a case for feedback loops, how we are trapped in illusion. A bit like ACIM, how we are in a dreamstate. gives credence to asension, cosmic consciousness, meditation, and many of the tools we use and have been developing for many years as a race of people.

Look to the straight and narrow pass however, there is a way off the hampster wheel.

many see it, few enter it.
 Quoting: Ac 223


Whats ACIM?
Anonymous Coward
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09/02/2008 10:03 AM
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Re: Has this scientist made the greatest discovery ever??? discovered the formula of consciousness.
A Course in Miracles

many books spun off this work like A Vast Illusion, dissapering universe and others.

it begs the question, what is outside the loop? What more is there?