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ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!

 
A Concerned Canadian

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11/17/2008 02:35 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
FYI: I belong to no religious cult, I have read the book of enoch, and the mosque is not built on the foundations of the temple, but on the gentiles court. The abonomation will be the one world government. Created by the beast. Man.

Cheers


Al-Aqsa Mosque (Arabic:المسجد الاقصى, [IPA /æl'mæsdʒɪd æl'ɑqsˁɑ/, al-Masjid al-Aqsa (help·info) translit: "the Farthest Mosque"), also known as al-Aqsa, is an Islamic holy place in the Old City of Jerusalem. The mosque itself forms part of the al-Haram ash-Sharif or "Sacred Noble Sanctuary", a site also known as the Temple Mount and considered the holiest site in Judaism, since it is believed to be where the Temple in Jerusalem once stood.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]
 Quoting: HI-JACKER 553089


Some say potato, some say potato.

I believe the dome of the rock is on the court of the gentiles.

Re 11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. 2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months

Now for the dome of spirits? That may be the exact location of the temple.

[link to atheism.about.com]

""Located on the Temple Mount and close to the Dome of the Rock is the Dome of the Spirits, Aubbat el-Arwah. Underneath this dome is bare bedrock which, according to some, the original Holy of Holies of the Herodian and Solomonic Temples was located. ""
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:37 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Book of Thessalonian was written in 50AD and many apostles were schooled by the Book of Enoch which was written centuries before the New Testament.


Book Of Enoch.


2Enoch.65:[6]There will be one aeon, and all the righteous who shall escape the LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon, for the righteous the Great aeon will begin, and they will live eternally, and then too there will be amongst them neither labour, nor sickness.

LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon,


The One who wrote the story "first" is the AUTHOR of that story, you gotta believe in the GOD in which the rapture story was written in to be a part of that story. Judaism is a forged copy from the book of Enoch that's why the rapture is mentioned in Joel, and thereafter in the New Testament.


[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[
]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

1. Who do you believe is the AUTHOR of the Book of Enoch?

2. New Testament scripture refers back to ancient texts, including the Old Testament and even the Book of Enoch. Does that make the New Testament false or a "forgery", because it references something else, or is in agreement with it, or is a subsequent text?

3. Are you contending that because the Book of Enoch was not included within the canonized text that therefore all of the text of the Old Testament and the New Testament is false?

3b.And subsequently that there is a different God and a different Messiah referenced?

3c.Does the Book of Enoch prophesy of Jesus? The Jews thought it did - that's why they left it out!

3d.So, you're saying if I worship the God of the New Testament - then I do not worship the God in the Book of Enoch?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 426194

Nothing is flawed from my words.

1. Enoch is the author of the book of Enoch.

2. Yes it makes it a forgery because they did not copy exactly how Enoch wrote them, and those who forged did so with intent for they did not refer to their writings as 'the book of Enoch.'

3. Not completely because some sections are carbon copies.

3b. Yes. This is why when the jews in the NAZI camps prayed to the jewish God the true GOD who saved them in Egypt did not come and save them.

3c. There is not 'one' mention of this Jesus, not one.

3d. Correct. And you are as misled as the jews were in those camps waiting for a false god to rescue them.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:39 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Book of Thessalonian was written in 50AD and many apostles were schooled by the Book of Enoch which was written centuries before the New Testament.


Book Of Enoch.


2Enoch.65:[6]There will be one aeon, and all the righteous who shall escape the LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon, for the righteous the Great aeon will begin, and they will live eternally, and then too there will be amongst them neither labour, nor sickness.

LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon,


The One who wrote the story "first" is the AUTHOR of that story, you gotta believe in the GOD in which the rapture story was written in to be a part of that story. Judaism is a forged copy from the book of Enoch that's why the rapture is mentioned in Joel, and thereafter in the New Testament.

]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

I'm not sure exactly what you're getting at. The book of Enoch, I believe is true. It lines up perfectly with the events being described in the OT and NT. The one who wrote the "story" is God. It was given to Enoch by God.

No Enoch wrote it down this is why GOD called him "the righteous scribe" and the Book makes no mention of Jesus ever, this is why the devil 'had' to have it removed from his bible, GOD doesn't like his word mixing with the Other.
 Quoting: HI-JACKER 553089



Common thought is that the Book of Enoch could have very well been written by different authors and the text was widely and commonly known to Jews at one time. That's why it was quoted in Jude.

Jesus called Himself the Son of Man. Wonder why He did that?
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:39 PM
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I wasn't being offensive as you have proven you can't think outside of what the system has taught you. And I don't want to sway anyone who doesn't deserve being raptured, those who deserve punishment I will be more then glad to assist in their just punishment......

0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

Wow! You ARE offensive, and also deceived. It is not your place to assist in anyone's just punishment. You would place yourself on God's throne?

You should repent of the sin of pride. Pride IS sin. The Book of Enoch says so.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 426194

Go away satan, anyone who doesn't assist with the Godly things is of the OPPOSITION.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:41 PM
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31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

As the days of Noah; Meaning that the flood surprised everybody an KILLED them!! Those that were taken were not saved, but CONDEMNED!!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 552714



YOU ARE TWISTED. It clearly says they were not expecting God's judgement - the same will happen again.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:41 PM
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Al-Aqsa Mosque /, al-Masjid al-Aqsa (help·info) translit: "the Farthest Mosque"), also known as al-Aqsa, is an Islamic holy place in the Old City of Jerusalem. The mosque itself forms part of the al-Haram ash-Sharif or "Sacred Noble Sanctuary", a site also known as the Temple Mount and considered the holiest site in Judaism, since it is believed to be where the Temple in Jerusalem once stood.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

-=----===--------====------==---------===----=----

Some say potato, some say potato.

I believe the dome of the rock is on the court of the gentiles.
 Quoting: A Concerned Canadian

It doesn't matter what you believe, its 'what it is' that counts.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/17/2008 02:42 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Book of Thessalonian was written in 50AD and many apostles were schooled by the Book of Enoch which was written centuries before the New Testament.


Book Of Enoch.


2Enoch.65:[6]There will be one aeon, and all the righteous who shall escape the LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon, for the righteous the Great aeon will begin, and they will live eternally, and then too there will be amongst them neither labour, nor sickness.

LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon,


The One who wrote the story "first" is the AUTHOR of that story, you gotta believe in the GOD in which the rapture story was written in to be a part of that story. Judaism is a forged copy from the book of Enoch that's why the rapture is mentioned in Joel, and thereafter in the New Testament.

]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

I'm not sure exactly what you're getting at. The book of Enoch, I believe is true. It lines up perfectly with the events being described in the OT and NT. The one who wrote the "story" is God. It was given to Enoch by God.

No Enoch wrote it down this is why GOD called him "the righteous scribe" and the Book makes no mention of Jesus ever, this is why the devil 'had' to have it removed from his bible, GOD doesn't like his word mixing with the Other.
 Quoting: HI-JACKER 553089


If God called him the righteous scribe then isn't it God-sanctioned - ultimately approved to be of God? How is Christ not in that book? He's all through it!!! Read it again. He is referred to as THE ELECT ONE!!

Enoch 44:3-4
3
On that day Mine Elect One shall sit on the throne of glory
And shall try their works,
And their places of rest shall be innumerable.
And their souls shall grow strong within them when they see Mine Elect Ones,
And those who have called upon My glorious name:

4
Then will I cause Mine Elect One to dwell among them.

That bible jives with the book of enoch perfectly. The fact that you're trying to say that the bible's account of the gathering is false because the real truth lies in the book of enoch is ludacris. They're both correct.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:43 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
I wasn't being offensive as you have proven you can't think outside of what the system has taught you. And I don't want to sway anyone who doesn't deserve being raptured, those who deserve punishment I will be more then glad to assist in their just punishment......

0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

Wow! You ARE offensive, and also deceived. It is not your place to assist in anyone's just punishment. You would place yourself on God's throne?

You should repent of the sin of pride. Pride IS sin. The Book of Enoch says so.

Go away satan, anyone who doesn't assist with the Godly things is of the OPPOSITION.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553089



LOL - I am not Satan, but you are influenced by him clearly.

You are not the judge. God is the judge, and you do not punish, the Almighty punishes.

You will fall the way of the prideful, I'm sure...unless you repent and are delivered of the demon that is deluding you.
A Concerned Canadian

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11/17/2008 02:45 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
It doesn't matter what you believe, its 'what it is' that counts.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553089

Ok... The mosque "IS" on the court of the gentiles.

Better?
Cassie :-)

User ID: 507059
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11/17/2008 02:46 PM

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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Joel 2:31
The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the LORD come.

Joel 3:115
The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.

Isaiah 13:10
For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Do you see the correlation between all these verses? That's right, they all describe the same celestial events: Sun & moon darkened, stars shall not give their light
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 551607


It will be a little hard for our Lord to have a thief in the night type, imminent, surprise arrival after the above quoted awe striking celestial events.

You will have people deceived into thinking they can just wait for these MAJOR tell tale signs to get right with the Lord. We are instructed to be watching and were told to pray to be accounted worthy to escape the testing to come upon the world.

And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
Luke 21:33-36

I Thessalonians 1:10
And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
I Thessalonians 5:9

Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.
Rev 3:10-11

The next verse says hes coming for those LOOKING for Him!
When he returns we all know that all will not be looking for him. He's returning the second time to those that ARE looking for him. That's why we're instructed to watch.

Hebrews 9:28
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation

Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Titus 2:13

HE IS COMING SOON!!!
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

"...the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin." I John 1:7

"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." Romans 6:23

And this is the record, that God hath given
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:46 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Book of Thessalonian was written in 50AD and many apostles were schooled by the Book of Enoch which was written centuries before the New Testament.


Book Of Enoch.


2Enoch.65:[6]There will be one aeon, and all the righteous who shall escape the LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon, for the righteous the Great aeon will begin, and they will live eternally, and then too there will be amongst them neither labour, nor sickness.

LORD'S Great judgment, shall be collected in the Great aeon,


The One who wrote the story "first" is the AUTHOR of that story, you gotta believe in the GOD in which the rapture story was written in to be a part of that story. Judaism is a forged copy from the book of Enoch that's why the rapture is mentioned in Joel, and thereafter in the New Testament.


[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[
]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

1. Who do you believe is the AUTHOR of the Book of Enoch?

2. New Testament scripture refers back to ancient texts, including the Old Testament and even the Book of Enoch. Does that make the New Testament false or a "forgery", because it references something else, or is in agreement with it, or is a subsequent text?

3. Are you contending that because the Book of Enoch was not included within the canonized text that therefore all of the text of the Old Testament and the New Testament is false?

3b.And subsequently that there is a different God and a different Messiah referenced?

3c.Does the Book of Enoch prophesy of Jesus? The Jews thought it did - that's why they left it out!

3d.So, you're saying if I worship the God of the New Testament - then I do not worship the God in the Book of Enoch?
Nothing is flawed from my words.

1. Enoch is the author of the book of Enoch.

2. Yes it makes it a forgery because they did not copy exactly how Enoch wrote them, and those who forged did so with intent for they did not refer to their writings as 'the book of Enoch.'

3. Not completely because some sections are carbon copies.

3b. Yes. This is why when the jews in the NAZI camps prayed to the jewish God the true GOD who saved them in Egypt did not come and save them.

3c. There is not 'one' mention of this Jesus, not one.

3d. Correct. And you are as misled as the jews were in those camps waiting for a false god to rescue them.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553089



Thanks for your answers.

oooooohkay.

That clears it up. I deduce that you are indeed twisted.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:47 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Joel 2:31
The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the LORD come.

Joel 3:115
The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.

Isaiah 13:10
For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Do you see the correlation between all these verses? That's right, they all describe the same celestial events: Sun & moon darkened, stars shall not give their light


It will be a little hard for our Lord to have a thief in the night type, imminent, surprise arrival after the above quoted awe striking celestial events.

You will have people deceived into thinking they can just wait for these MAJOR tell tale signs to get right with the Lord. We are instructed to be watching and were told to pray to be accounted worthy to escape the testing to come upon the world.

And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
Luke 21:33-36

I Thessalonians 1:10
And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
I Thessalonians 5:9

Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.
Rev 3:10-11

The next verse says hes coming for those LOOKING for Him!
When he returns we all know that all will not be looking for him. He's returning the second time to those that ARE looking for him. That's why we're instructed to watch.

Hebrews 9:28
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation

Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Titus 2:13

HE IS COMING SOON!!!
 Quoting: Cassie :-)



Thanks, Cassie - this is the direction I lean as well.

Difficult to have a surprise, if folks are expecting it, huh?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 553089
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11/17/2008 02:51 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
If God called him the righteous scribe then isn't it God-sanctioned - ultimately approved to be of God? How is Christ not in that book? He's all through it!!! Read it again. He is referred to as THE ELECT ONE!!

Enoch 44:3-4
3
On that day Mine Elect One shall sit on the throne of glory
And shall try their works,
And their places of rest shall be innumerable.
And their souls shall grow strong within them when they see Mine Elect Ones,
And those who have called upon My glorious name:

4
Then will I cause Mine Elect One to dwell among them.

That bible jives with the book of enoch perfectly. The fact that you're trying to say that the bible's account of the gathering is false because the real truth lies in the book of enoch is ludacris. They're both correct.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 551607

You have been misled O-P, and its not surprising many, many will be misled. Jesus is never mentioned but his apostles are, here read this verse.

1Enoch.89:[25]Then I saw, that the man, who wrote the book at the word of the LORD, opened the book of destruction, of that destruction which the last twelve shepherds wrought; and pointed out before the LORD of the sheep, that they destroyed more than those who preceded them.

The last 12 shepherds were supposed to testify from the Book of Enoch but were misled by a Fallen son of GOD (devil).



The Elect One is the Messiah, the Son of Man.

Read all of Chapter 70


1Enoch.70:[12]With them was the Ancient of Days, whose head was white as wool, and pure, and his robe was indescribable.

[13]Then I fell upon my face, while all my flesh was dissolved, and my spirit became changed.

[14]I cried out with a loud voice, with a powerful spirit, blessing, glorifying, and exalting.

[15]And those blessings, which proceeded from my mouth, became acceptable in the presence of the Ancient of days.

[16]The Ancient of Days came with Michael and Gabriel, Raphael and Phanuel, with thousands of thousands, and myriads and myriads, which could not be numbered.

[17]Then that angel came to me, and with his voice saluted me, saying, You are the Son of man, (74) who art born for righteousness, and righteousness has rested upon you. [18]The righteousness of the Ancient of days shall not forsake you.


CASE CLOSED, Enoch is the Messiah, he's the Son of Man.
A Concerned Canadian

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11/17/2008 02:52 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Hey AC ***089

Who is the first MAN to ascend into heaven.

What is the second coming?

Out of curiosity, answer for me.
A Concerned Canadian

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11/17/2008 02:54 PM
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Hey AC ***089

Who is the first MAN to ascend into heaven.

What is the second coming?

Out of curiosity, answer for me.
 Quoting: A Concerned Canadian

NM. You answered a minute earlier.

Cool
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:56 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Go away satan, anyone who doesn't assist with the Godly things is of the OPPOSITION.

]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]


LOL - I am not Satan, but you are influenced by him clearly.

You are not the judge. God is the judge, and you do not punish, the Almighty punishes.

You will fall the way of the prideful, I'm sure...unless you repent and are delivered of the demon that is deluding you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 426194

ROTF

I'm one of the very few on this forum that believes all that has been disclosed to you by the Book of Enoch and all the threads Punisher has made available. The road to hell is empty in this case and very narrow because those like me who walk this road believe all world religions including Islam, Judaism, Christianity and the rest are a forgery of the book of GOD (Enoch).



The end will tell..
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/17/2008 02:57 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Joel 2:31
The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the LORD come.

Joel 3:115
The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.

Isaiah 13:10
For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Do you see the correlation between all these verses? That's right, they all describe the same celestial events: Sun & moon darkened, stars shall not give their light


It will be a little hard for our Lord to have a thief in the night type, imminent, surprise arrival after the above quoted awe striking celestial events.

You will have people deceived into thinking they can just wait for these MAJOR tell tale signs to get right with the Lord. We are instructed to be watching and were told to pray to be accounted worthy to escape the testing to come upon the world.

And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
Luke 21:33-36

I Thessalonians 1:10
And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
I Thessalonians 5:9

Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.
Rev 3:10-11

The next verse says hes coming for those LOOKING for Him!
When he returns we all know that all will not be looking for him. He's returning the second time to those that ARE looking for him. That's why we're instructed to watch.

Hebrews 9:28
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation

Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Titus 2:13

HE IS COMING SOON!!!



Thanks, Cassie - this is the direction I lean as well.

Difficult to have a surprise, if folks are expecting it, huh?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 426194


Once again the imminence doctrine is taken severly out of context.


This doctrine has it’s beginnings in Matt 24:43

43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the THIEF would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

We must obey the law of context. Let’s read the surrounding verses:

29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Jump down to verse 36 Christ continues his description:

36But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

I absolutely agree with this verse. Christ makes it perfectly clear that NO MAN can know that exact time of Christ’s return. This does not mean that we cannot know the month or the year!

40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

This is a definite description of the gathering described in Matt 24:31

Let's continue:

42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the THIEF would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

This verse begins the “thief in the night” analogy that is referenced throughout the rest of the New Testament.

Do you see that when these verses are put together that are all in relation to the Post trib rapture event described by Christ?

Can you see that the “thief” analogy is in context with verses 29-31?

The point that Christ is trying to convey is that he only comes as a thief to those who aren’t ready and are not watching for his post tribulation return!!

In rev 3:3
Christ reminds the church of Sardis:

3Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

He uses the thief analogy again. He says: “watch for my second coming OR I will come upon you as a thief.

Paul addresses this same topic:

I Thess Chapter 5:2-6
2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
5Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

Paul clearly tells us that for those who are watching, that day will not overtake us as a thief!

It is imminent ONLY for those who are not watching for the preceding signs and finally for his return!
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 02:59 PM
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Hey AC ***089

1-Who is the first MAN to ascend into heaven.

2-What is the second coming?

Out of curiosity, answer for me.
 Quoting: A Concerned Canadian


1-Enoch.

2-Same as the first almost, GOD removes the Fallen angels around us, establishes generations of righteousness by rapturing the just and building the final everlasting Temple, pass judgment on azazel and associates, and we enter Eternity Amen!!!!!
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 03:03 PM
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"As a thief in the night". Essentially the "mystery" is summed up in observation of the fact that the pre-trib rapture is a highly anticipated event. And since it will not occur before the tribulation "believers" will scurry, and basically lose thier minds (even though IMO they had lost that the moment they accepted the pre-trib rapture lie).

The saddest and most depressing part of this argument is the blatant denial of obvious scripure by rapture believers.

For instance in Matthew 24:29 - 31

29.) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30.) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31.) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


These scriptures are Jesus himself explaining what will happen. I don't think he could have been more precise, and staright forward about what would be happening.

He then continues and in doing so he basically is telling us that people will be decieved by false doctrine telling them quite the opposite of the words he had just stated.


32.) Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33.) So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34.) Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

35.)Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36.) But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37.) But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38.) For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39.) And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40.) Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41.) Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42.) Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43.) But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44.) Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

45.) Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

46.) Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48.) But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49.) And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50.) The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51.) And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
A Concerned Canadian

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11/17/2008 03:04 PM
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Hey AC ***089

1-Who is the first MAN to ascend into heaven.

2-What is the second coming?

Out of curiosity, answer for me.


1-Enoch.

2-Same as the first almost, GOD removes the Fallen angels around us, establishes generations of righteousness by rapturing the just and building the final everlasting Temple, pass judgment on azazel and associates, and we enter Eternity Amen!!!!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553089

Where do we spend eternity?

I'm not testing you. I'm just curious.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 03:05 PM
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For instance in Matthew 24:29 - 31

29.) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30.) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31.) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Lotus Feet

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11/17/2008 03:06 PM
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The sign of the Son of Man was formed by the planets and it was divine intervention and a celestial event that was celebrated by Spiritual people and the elect all around the world. The engagement with God was in November 2003 and it was called the Harmonic Concordance.

Within a few weeks the Asian disaster also happened.

The sun is in darkness would indicate the falling away from the sacred to the profane. The moon and blood would also represent the religious and their holy wars.

Enoch misconstrued the word of God and that is why he was nearly brought to justice.

The Dead Sea scrolls talked about the coming of Melchizedek. Jesus was from the Order of Melchizedek. Melchizedek also came to earth with many elders on the 13th May 2006.

God also called some of the prophets Son of Man and this term means Son of my people.


"Let your hand rest on the man at your right hand, the son of man you have raised up for yourself. " Psalm 80:16-18

"O LORD, what is man that you care for him, the son of man that you think of him?" Psalm 144:2-4

"He said to me, "Son of man, stand up on your feet and I will speak to you."
Ezekiel 2:1-3

"He said: "Son of man, I am sending you to the Israelites, to a rebellious nation that has rebelled against me; they and their fathers have been in revolt against me to this very day." Ezekiel 2:2-4

"And you, son of man, do not be afraid of them or their words. Do not be afraid, though briers and thorns are all around you and you live among scorpions. Do not be afraid of what they say or terrified by them, though they are a rebellious house." Ezekiel 2:5-7

"Therefore prophesy against them; prophesy, son of man." Ezekiel 11:3-5

"Son of man, you are living among a rebellious people. They have eyes to see but do not see and ears to hear but do not hear, for they are a rebellious people" Ezekiel 12:1-3






Lotus
i love satan
Anonymous Coward
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Matthew 24:29 - 31

29.) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30.) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31.) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
czygyny

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11/17/2008 03:06 PM
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As it has been said before, and seems to be of value:

Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

Besides, you do not know the hour of your visitation. Those who would come to gather you to stand before Him may come to you even today, if your 'time' is up.

The point is that you should always be spiritually girded and standing ready for anything, tirelessly.

It comes down to trust and endurance in the Creator, the patience of the saints.
Kletos, Eklektos & Pistos
Anonymous Coward
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For instance in Matthew 24:29 - 31

29.) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30.) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31.) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 03:07 PM
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Matthew 24:29 - 31

29.) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30.) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31.) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
czygyny

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Where do we spend eternity?

I'm not testing you. I'm just curious.
 Quoting: A Concerned Canadian


Where He is, we will be.

'Tis enough for me.
Kletos, Eklektos & Pistos
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11/17/2008 03:09 PM
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Re: ENDING THE "RAPTURE" DEBATE USING BIBLE VERSES!!!
Matthew 24:29 - 31

29.) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30.) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31.) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 03:10 PM
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2-Same as the first almost, GOD removes the Fallen angels around us, establishes generations of righteousness by rapturing the just and building the final everlasting Temple, pass judgment on azazel and associates, and we enter Eternity Amen!!!!!

[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[

Where do we spend eternity?

 Quoting: A Concerned Canadian

In this very Universe...
Anonymous Coward
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11/17/2008 03:13 PM
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Matthew 24:29 - 31

29.) Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30.) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31.) And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Does it get any easier to understand than this?

Rapture believers will come back with a plethora of sciptures that form a "riddle" that "proves" there is a rapture pre-tribulation.

In essence what these rapture believers are saying is that Jesus own words (in bold above) are meanto to deceive the dumb people that cannot understand the "riddle" in the verses.

So basically they are calling Jesus himself a liar!

Blasphemy!

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