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| | Page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 | God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible???
| Jodido
User ID: 17974
11/17/2008 5:33 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
BUT
I have always been god curious. My upbringing was catholic and jewish (go figure), but the catholic side did not attend church on a regular basis. It was not drilled into me how to believe in god.
What I was always curious about was the concept of God; exactly who or what is that?
What is a god in the flesh?
Here is one idea. That this is a dream; we all exist in god's dream. We all go to sleep at night, and have our own dreams, but always wake up in god's dream. Therefore, a god in the flesh would be god appearing in his own dream. Maybe we all are. But I am thinking here of an individual, say a Jesus.
You look in a mirror, what do you see? You, right? Thats they way I see a god in the flesh is, one living in his/her own mirror.
Take a human, any human, now get everything, every thought, emotion, nuance, ect, out of that human. Get every last morsel. Now, take that and create reality out of it.
There may be a man living now that is god, and not even know it.
In my rainbow and the white light thing, I say that humanity, altogether, make up all the colors of the rainbow. A god in the flesh would be one that is all the colors of the rainbow, in one person.
We are made in the image of god. I take that to mean that we largely have all the colors within us, but maybe like focused.
>>We are made in the image of god<<
Reading that post made me think of something and i would like to point it out to you. Sometime you just have to stand back and take another look at something you thought you already knew.
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Those verses are NOT telling you that we are made in God's image. Only one man was made in God's image and that was Jesus the Christ.
The rest of us were made in the image of the others (the ones referred to in OUR).
Now the question is - who were these others.
Think about it.
I know - but do you?
I have an idea. If Jeus was/is god in the flesh, then the human(oids) here are all aliens. The way I see it, a human's counterpart is a star, out there. The Man's counterpoint is our star....
Meaning I think this planet is a melting pot, like how the United States is a melting pot. And it is this way for a reason. Lets say that there is a war in the universe; the rebellious Satan is trying to take over. Well lets say this 'war' is being played out on Earth.
You are on the right track but we are not aliens or humanoids. We are the )for lack of a better word 'the angels).
You first have to realize why we are here to begin with and then you will start to understand.
God was talking to the 'angels' in Genesis.
We are here to be tested. Some refused to be tested (Satan and the fallen ones) therefore they have no chance but we do and there is where the free will comes in.
We are born with out prior knowledge of the world that was - with a clean slate to decide who we will follow - God or satan. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553260
Choose between God or the Devil eh? Again, thats duality. And besides, what is god? Is not god all that is? Would that not include the Devil? Try to intergrate, rather than seperate... |
| Jodido
User ID: 17974
11/17/2008 5:35 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Oh, and I know something which maybe you do not know. I know that we live on the heart planet of this solar system. And, I am thinking, the heart planet of the universe. That means the reason why we are here is to live out the heart.
Of what?
Of God. |
| The Professor
User ID: 385883
11/17/2008 5:45 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Deuteronomy 30:19 (New King James Version)
19 I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live" Quoting: Anonymous Coward 527576
There are many verses in the Bible which indirectly support the concept of free will, but your citation addresses the issue head on.
I am not a Bible believer, in fact, I am a Bible basher; however, I am a very good reader, and there is only one possible interpretation of the quoted verses: one has the free will to chose between life and death, that is the pathway to death or eternal life. However, this is not a single choice that one makes, but rather many choices over one’s lifetime. It is the accumulation of choices we make that determines our divine destiny. I think Ezekiel says it best:
“The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.
Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.
Yet ye say, The way of the Lord is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal? When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die. Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive.
Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
Yet saith the house of Israel, The way of the Lord is not equal. O house of Israel, are not my ways equal? are not your ways unequal? Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin. Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel? For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.” (Ezekiel 18:20-32)
According to the verses you cited from Deuteronomy, and the verses I have cited from Ezekiel, the choice of life versus death is really a choice between living a virtuous or sinful life. The Bible is clear on this issue: YOU are to make the choices, not God.
Having said all of this, I must add that I do not personally believe in free will; however, I am convinced that this is the Biblical message, expressed in clear and simple terms. |
| Jodido
User ID: 17974
11/17/2008 5:46 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Oh, and I know something which maybe you do not know. I know that we live on the heart planet of this solar system. And, I am thinking, the heart planet of the universe. That means the reason why we are here is to live out the heart.
Of what?
Of God. Quoting: Jodido
But that is how all humans are aliens. They are extensions of ther stars....
All the blood passes thru the heart. |
| Jodido
User ID: 485437
11/18/2008 1:41 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Deuteronomy 30:19 (New King James Version)
19 I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live"
There are many verses in the Bible which indirectly support the concept of free will, but your citation addresses the issue head on.
I am not a Bible believer, in fact, I am a Bible basher; however, I am a very good reader, and there is only one possible interpretation of the quoted verses: one has the free will to chose between life and death, that is the pathway to death or eternal life. However, this is not a single choice that one makes, but rather many choices over one’s lifetime. It is the accumulation of choices we make that determines our divine destiny. I think Ezekiel says it best:
“The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.
Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.
Yet ye say, The way of the Lord is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal? When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die. Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive.
Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
Yet saith the house of Israel, The way of the Lord is not equal. O house of Israel, are not my ways equal? are not your ways unequal? Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin. Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel? For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.” (Ezekiel 18:20-32)
According to the verses you cited from Deuteronomy, and the verses I have cited from Ezekiel, the choice of life versus death is really a choice between living a virtuous or sinful life. The Bible is clear on this issue: YOU are to make the choices, not God.
Having said all of this, I must add that I do not personally believe in free will; however, I am convinced that this is the Biblical message, expressed in clear and simple terms. Quoting: The Professor 385883
I see and understand that. To me its imaturity vs. maturity. But I say we are here to do more than just that. I say we are here to be co-creators. I think that we live in this veil of ignorance, in order to have the freedom (free will) to imagine.
In my concept of this white light ~ rainbow, I am stating that we exist in a seperation in order to have the freedom to be. What I am saying here is that we are more god than what is let on.
For instance, I say we are in the heart. Well, what does the heart do? I say the heart tells the mind what it wants, then the mind goes about figuring out how to make it happen. In that way it is the heart that is the source. |
| acolyte 
Beyond The Rubicon
User ID: 308272
11/18/2008 1:43 PM
 | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Nice thread Jodido :)
acolyte@workmail.co.za |
| Jodido
User ID: 485437
11/18/2008 2:22 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
What is unseen is by far more valid and true than what is seen. This does not mean that all we see is a lie does it? Just perhaps a different kind of real. Quoting: Free Indeed
I have this notion that reality is a dream, and that the existance we are in, as humans, are the most real, of that dream. Have you heard that for every human alive here, there are lots of souls that want to be here? I always think of "the crest of the wave of reality". I think of it in terms of manifestation. We are the outermost of the manifestation. Dig? I have also heard that a reason why souls want to live a life here is that here a soul can change the most.
All this just points to my thinking that the whole "war" between heaven and hell is taking place on this planet. In corrleation to that I think this planet is going thru a process now that other earth type planets go thru (EG the learning of good & evil), but here it is special. |
| Jodido
User ID: 485437
11/18/2008 2:29 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
>>We are made in the image of god<<
Reading that post made me think of something and i would like to point it out to you. Sometime you just have to stand back and take another look at something you thought you already knew.
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Those verses are NOT telling you that we are made in God's image. Only one man was made in God's image and that was Jesus the Christ.
The rest of us were made in the image of the others (the ones referred to in OUR).
Now the question is - who were these others.
Think about it.
I know - but do you? Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553260
I thought about that, and I have to disagree. According to the christian lore, Jesus was god in the flesh. The closest you can get to a representation of God in the physical. Correlating that to the text, I would say that there is Jesus, and the rest of humanity is made in the image of...
wait for it
....
Jesus.
I come to this, in part, because of my concept of what a god in the flesh is.
Jesus may have been Adam. The same soul (reincarnation). |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 2:39 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
I just re-read the beginning of Genesis:
AND GOD DIVIDED!!!!
Duality. My thing is: god is one, therefore to know god (or like see the process), one has to rise above the duality; to get, like, on the same level as god (from two to one).
But in Genesis it plainly states that god created light. Light is like in opposition to dark. Then god saw the light was good, another duality statement. Then god seperated the waters.
I find this seperation of the waters intriquing. It is the first time, since my epiphany, that I have read those words. My epiphany was a seeing that our world, Earth, is a representation of the universe, like a microcosm.
Since then I have imagined what represents what. The night I had that epiphany I was standing on a beach, which faced the ocean. Then I saw that the oceans are deep space; all that stuff inbetween stars.
This Correlates with what is said in Genesis, about god seperating the waters from the firmament (heaven: outerspace). Then god seperated even more. Go ahead, read it.
You see, my understanding of why we have duality is to enable the creation. For instance, what makes electricity?
I also think that our solar system, in fitting with Earth being representational of the universe, is also representational of the universe. In that context, I see the asteroid belt aslike a wall between two parts. I think the paragraph in Genesis that talks about god dividing the waters, like above and below the Firmament, can be seen by that (the asteroid belt being a divider).
Of course, then I liken the asteroid belt as the veil of ignorance. I also think it represents the universe at large; all the little planetoids in it represent all the 'stars' of the universe.
I said he earleir in this thread, briefly. I want to reiterate here; I think humans are counterpoints to stars out there. In one way, it could be that it is here that they build-up a wish list on what they want in their respective solar system. |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 2:42 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Just thought of this analogy: To see the forest for the trees, one must rise above the tree level. |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 2:45 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
I think you could easily derive the Big Bang from the 1st part of Genesis: God created light... god seperated the firmament from the waters (in this context the water is space, and the firmament is stars, or gas, or other than space). |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 2:46 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Look at some pictures of space gas, what we call nebulas. I see all kinds of animals and other lifelike things there. Like that Horus's Eye. |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 554673
11/19/2008 2:56 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
God is infinite.
Man is a creation of God.
There is no move, through the mind, body or soul, that God does not already know we will make.
But since we're His creation and He is INFINITE, the sole creator of Knowledge... then it makes perfect since that we do not have free will.
Infinite is a mighty big word. I would go so far as to say its an absolute word. But saying that god is infinite, and all knowing, does not answer my question. Quoting: Jodido
---------------------------------------------------
FREE WILL FROM THE BIBLE GOD IS COMPLETELY BOGUS.
[link to www.godlikeproductions.com]
------------ |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 2:57 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
I see that what we have been going thru, for atleast the last 6000 years, this learning of good and evil, is an immersion into duality. To do what? To create.
Jose Arguellos, in his book The Mayan Factor said that the Mayans say that we have been in some energy beam from the center of our galaxy for the last 5000 years. For a reason. I think Jose said that it was to speed up the process (I read that book like 20+ years ago). It was at the end of this 5000 year period that we like totally chnge, or something (The ending has not been quite figured out...). That is 2012.
I think that, at the end, this immersion in duality will be lifted; the job we are doing is done.
And that is how, I think, this thing about doomsday is so present. Some think that, in order to rise, first there has to be this clearing.
But I think its gonna be more comparable to what the kids felt in The Magician's Nephew, when they were in that place, between worlds, that had all the little pools; much more than a physical doomsday, ala Nancy Leider... |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 554673
11/19/2008 2:58 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
1. ALL KNOWING GOD. Knows ALL.
knows what everyone will do BEFORE we do
it.
SO....all knowing.....= .... NO FREE WILL.
2. DUMB GOD:
Doesn't know what anyone will do next.
SO....dumb god....= ..... FREE WILL
If god is "all knowing" we don't have free will.
If god is dumb, we do have free will.
However you choose to believe.....
If god is ALL POWERFUL,
Why doesn't he wave his hand and stop:
A. Rapes of babies.
B. babies being blown to pieces in wars.
C. Babies being born with two heads.
D Abortions.
E. Murder of babies that have been born.
F. Babies being born diseased.
G. Babies being born deformed.
Either the bible god is not ALL POWERFUL, or the bible god just doesn't care at all about babies.
There are no other choices. |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 3:01 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 554673
I look at it this way. We exist in the rainbow (God is the white light) In that, god can predict what we will do, predict events; based on the color(s) you are. That doesn't mean that you will always act that way.
I also think there is a process that we are going thru, that we do not know about. The Mayans might have known.
To say something is completely something I disagree with, by definition :) |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 3:04 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Why doesn't he wave his hand and stop:
A. Rapes of babies.
B. babies being blown to pieces in wars.
C. Babies being born with two heads.
D Abortions.
E. Murder of babies that have been born.
F. Babies being born diseased.
G. Babies being born deformed.
Either the bible god is not ALL POWERFUL, or the bible god just doesn't care at all about babies.
There are no other choices. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 554673
Or, that we are manifesting all the colors of the rainbow, now; the good, the bad, the selfrighteous indignant.
The people that do these bad things; did they have the free will to do them?
Do you have the free will to think about doing something bad? |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 3:10 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
After we rise, we will still exist in the rainbow; for that is what the function is. Existing in the rainbow is to create. We will not go and be the white light.
But, in comprison, it will be like taking our finger out of the light socket. And, it will be like going into the light; a step closer to god.
But Earth is the heart; thats its function... |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/19/2008 3:11 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Um, I have to amend that last post. If you have run across me talking of the reverse rapture; some may be re-absorbed... |
| Jodido
User ID: 13493
11/19/2008 3:57 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
This 2012 event, change. One thing that is known is that we, this solar system, is crossing the galactic plane. The galaxy is relatively flat, like a record. We are going from the underside to the topside.
Ever swim in a pool? Ever swim up to the surface of a pool, from underwater? Ever open your eyes, when you do, and try to see outside of the pool, before you break the surface of the water? Everything outside is blurry, like looking into a circus mirror.
Thats what I liken is going on with us. We are swimming to the surface, about to break the surface. And some of us, like those here at GLP, have opened their eyes, and are trying to see what is above the surface of the water. It will be like us breaking the surface of the water. It will be like; "Oh, so thats it." The lifting of the Veil of Ignorance.
Ya know the Christain ceremony of Baptism? Thats what I liken it to; we are, have been for the past who knows how many years, been dunked in the water.
But, in contrast to that, though I find that free will is not in the Bible, I am a firm believer in free will. Being in the rainbow, this seperation is necessary to have the free will to create. So, I suspect tha humanity, in general, will feel something, but not have a complete lifting of the Veil. Something may happen, though, like we all see PX in the sky. But, we will rise, so doomsday is averted.
Actually, Nancy Leider, in her Zetatalk website, said that we could avert this if a mass percentage of humanity is like ready for it. |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 13493
11/19/2008 4:35 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Then I tie in this Jesus, god in the flesh, thing. I think the change we are about to go thru is the will of the Father. With Jesus we had the will of the Son, except when he died.
Will of the Son; all the miracles He performed.
One of them was a taking out of a human the demons within that human. That is what I see is gonna happen here; except it is the father, and He is taking the demons out of everybody, everything... |
| Jodido
User ID: 11527
11/20/2008 2:32 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Speaking of rising out of the water, we are going from the age of pisces to the age of acquarious. Pisces is what, a fish? What do fish live in, and under? |
| Jodido
User ID: 10120
11/20/2008 3:55 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
This solar system. It is in two parts, the part outside the asteroid belt, and the inner part. I see that they mirror each other:
Pluto ~ Mercury
Neptune and Uranus ~ Venus
Saturn ~ Earth
Jupiter ~ Mars
We are on Earth, the inner part, what scientists refer to as the ecosphere, which includes Venus and Mars.
Pluto and Mercury remind me of the ends of the; can't think of the buzzword, but how information is sent on the Internet. The information is sent in parcels, each parcel has end pieces which identify it, among other things. I learned this in school but forgetting it now. You can see the planets as the message, and Pluto and Mercury as the end pieces. Mercury is known as the messenger planet.
In Venus, Earth, and Mars; I see like a "Oh this one is too big, this one too small: this one is just right" kinda thing. Earth has been called a Goldilocks. This is scientific Jargon meaning it is so perfectly matched as to hint at intelligent design. |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 10120
11/20/2008 4:36 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
From Genesis: "And God said, Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together unto one place"
Ya know how I think Earth is a microcosm? Well, I think those words say it. There a sentence or two later it says god called the place Earth. |
| Jodido
User ID: 32814
11/20/2008 4:47 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
From wikipedia:
"The Three Bears story is the origin of the use of the term "Goldilocks" in other contexts. Generally, the Goldilocks phenomenon describes a situation which is just right, not too big or hot or small or cold, a concept used in astronomy and economics." |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 224676
11/20/2008 4:55 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
Calvinism is still a daughter of Rome.
Calvinism is "Christian" muhammadanism.
Both denies free will, both claims some people are made to be destroyed.
TULIP
Total Depravity
Unconditional Election
Limited Atonement
Irresistable Grace
Perseverance of the Saints
Totally false...
refutes Calvinism - Total Depravity:
2 Corinthians 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
refutes Calvinism - Limited Atonement:
2 Corinthians 5:14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:
2 Corinthians 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.
2 Corinthians 10:1 Now I Paul myself beseech you by the meekness and gentleness of Christ, who in presence am base among you, but being absent am bold toward you:
- Why is Jesus meek and gentle if he has predestined people to hell?
refutes Calvinism -
2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
2 Corinthians 11:4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel,
which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.
2 Corinthians 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
2 Corinthians 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2 Corinthians 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
Unsaved people:
1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
refutes Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Hebrews 2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;
Hebrews 2:4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?
Why is God mindful of man if he's predestined them to hell?
Hebrews 2:6 But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him?
refutes Calvnism - Limited Atonement:
Hebrews 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
refutes Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Hebrews 3:8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
refutes Calvinism - Irresistable Grace + Unconditional Election:
Hebrews 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
refutes Calvinism
Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Why does the Holy Bible speak about hope? If Calvinism is true, there is no hope.
What is the point of the Holy Bible and the blessed Gospel if Calvinism is true? If Calvinism is true there is no point, more like rub it in your face.
Why is there wrath if all are either predestined to heaven or hell? That makes no sense at all.
Predestination = Robotic state of being.
and contrary to:
Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air,
and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Sin is rendered pointless if Calvinism is true. You can't obey or disobey if you're already predestined.
How can it be Good News if all aren't able to be saved? Then it's just Good News for some.
Evangelizaton is pointless if Calvinism is true.
Why will there come Two Witnesses if Calvinism is true? Another pointless point.
Why apostles if things are settled already?
Hebrews 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Dying for just the sin of some? Is God's blood only capable of saving some?
Why is there coming Judgment? That seems just cruel if you're predestined.
Matthew 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Child like faith + Calvinism = not possible.
Pharisées + Calvinist + Muslims = Same school of thought.
Calvinism = Elitist thinking just as Pharisées and Muslims (eventhough they're the most stupid on the planet).
Only grumpy old men.
Only they can tell you the truth (guru mentality), and definately not anyone without a Ph.D
Against Soulwinning - Kills Evangelism = doctrine straight out of hell
Luke 10:2 Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.
Why are there labourers if all is done already?
Calvinism came straight out of Rome with the Roman Catholic Priest John Calvin.
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
2 Peter 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
refuting Calvinism -
2 Peter 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
refuting Calvinism -
1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
Why an advocate if all are predestined?
refuting Calvinism - Limited Atonement:
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
refuting Calvinism - Irresistible Grace:
Jude 1:22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
Jude 1:23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
refuting Calvinism - Limited Atonement:
Revelation 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
Question for Calvinists:
Proverbs 11:30 The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and he that winneth souls is wise.
refuting Calvinism -
Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
- Why would God praise a man that is a jew inwardly if the man didn't make the decision to follow God and become a spiritual jew?
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 3:3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
Romans 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 4:24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 5:4 And patience, experience; and experience, hope:
Romans 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
refuting Calvinism - Limited Atonement:
Romans 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
Romans 5:7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
refuting Calvinism - Limited Atonement:
Romans 5:15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
Romans 5:16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.
refuting Calvinism - Limited Atonement:
Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Romans 10:11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
refuting Calvinism - predestination
Romans 10:15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
refuting Calvinism - Irresistable Grace:
Romans 10:21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.
refuting Calvinism - predestination, Limited Atonement
Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
Romans 16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
Why avoid if predestined already? What's the danger then?
refuting Calvinism - Limited Atonement & Uncondtional Election
1 Corinthians 9:20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;
1 Corinthians 9:21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.
1 Corinthians 9:22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.
refuting Calvinism - Total Depravity & Unconditional Election
1 Thessalonians 1:4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.
refuting Calvinism - Limited Atonement
1 Thessalonians 2:4 But as we were allowed of God to be put in trust with the gospel, even so we speak; not as pleasing men, but God, which trieth our hearts.
Why 'trieth out hearth' if all is already done, that is absurd, no reason for trying hearts.
refuting Calvinism - Unconditional Election
2 Thessalonians 1:5 Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:
NEVER TRUST A CALVINIST/REFORMED/PRESBYTERIAN (OR WHATEVER THEY CALL THEMSELVES, THEY TEND TO SWAP NAMES OFTEN) THEY'RE ALL DECEIVERS
Another interesting aspect of their teachings are that they seem to have that same sort of spirit the evolutionist crowd has, that "I'm smart, you're dumb", same spirit as Hardly Truth has, same arrogance. Same stupid people that think they're smart.
So the bikini wearer that said there's no free will is uninformed at best. And you've just gotten your answer OP, there's more than this, this is just a little taste of what the Word says. |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 224676
11/20/2008 5:03 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
If god is ALL POWERFUL,
Why doesn't he wave his hand and stop:
A. Rapes of babies.
B. babies being blown to pieces in wars.
C. Babies being born with two heads.
D Abortions.
E. Murder of babies that have been born.
F. Babies being born diseased.
G. Babies being born deformed.
Either the bible god is not ALL POWERFUL, or the bible god just doesn't care at all about babies.
There are no other choices. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 554673
So time for a question, what happens to these babies when they die?
Do they go to heaven or hell?
Careful now how you answer and remember these words:
Mark 10:14 But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Disease and deformed children, you shouldn't have broken the laws and married your sister, but still you and your relatives decided to break the laws and marry contrary to what was told to do.
See the point here? You try to blame your sins on God.
You suck dude. |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 224676
11/20/2008 5:08 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
If god is ALL POWERFUL,
Why doesn't he wave his hand and stop:
A. Rapes of babies.
B. babies being blown to pieces in wars.
C. Babies being born with two heads.
D Abortions.
E. Murder of babies that have been born.
F. Babies being born diseased.
G. Babies being born deformed.
Either the bible god is not ALL POWERFUL, or the bible god just doesn't care at all about babies.
There are no other choices.
So time for a question, what happens to these babies when they die?
Do they go to heaven or hell?
Careful now how you answer and remember these words:
Mark 10:14 But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Disease and deformed children, you shouldn't have broken the laws and married your sister, but still you and your relatives decided to break the laws and marry contrary to what was told to do.
See the point here? You try to blame your sins on God.
You suck dude. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 224676
and also when God takes you freaks out by making sure you baby killers are killed you scream about God murdering you.
See how stupid you people really are?
You do the crime, then you blame God for his longsuffering, and then when he deals with you justly then you whine about God being too just with you.
Can't please you freaks one way or the other, always the same bait and switch with you.
God deals with you in his time, you should thank him that he is indeed longsuffering, if he wasn't, he would have killed you guys years ago for all your crimes, I mean the amount of thefts, lies, murders etc. you people do, yes you two fall short of the law everytime, you've probably broken the law 100 times today already. |
| Anonymous Coward
User ID: 224676
11/20/2008 5:11 PM | | Anonymous Coward
User ID: 554016
11/20/2008 6:02 PM | | Re: God gave Man free will. What; NOT in the Bible??? | Quote |
The reason we are here are to replace the angels in heaven. God is working on perfecting heaven. God is lonly and didnt want to create more robot angels. He wanted angels that would worship him on their own.
In order to have free will there must be choice. God being perfect and good could not tempt man with evil directly so he created an angel to do his dirty work for him. Some call this angel Satan. Satan does not have free will which can be seen in JOB. Satan had to have permission from God as to how far he could tempt JOB.
When Judgement day comes only those that choose to do the will of God (keep his commandments) will replace those bots in heaven. |
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