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| 11:41 PM | ||
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| 11:41 PM | ||
Fermilab Closer To Discovering Higgs Boson 'God Particle' | |
| WebsiteAussie User ID: 634734  Australia03/16/2009 08:09 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 161668  Brazil03/16/2009 11:56 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | lol as if someone gives a shit. just imaginary particles based on data on the computer screen. all they do is measure energy states that are recurrent and stable enough to be detected and then they call it a "particle". like children ,they are still trying to divide what cannot be divided, nor understood completely in terms of divisions. the only reason everybody is excited about the imaginary boson particle is because it will bring lots of moneys to the pockets of those who "predicted" the existence of this particle --> of course, all particles and states of energy exist already in space. it is just a matter of tuning your equipment to detect it. space is filled with infinite energy. they will keep discovering all kinds of "particles" until the end of time. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 595472  United States03/17/2009 12:10 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | how exactly does proof of a particles existance (or non-existance) put money in someone's pocket? I don't see anything wrong with trying to figure things out.and while there may be an infinite number of particles, it doesn't mean they exist in any arbitrary state. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 161668 Brazil03/17/2009 12:25 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | how exactly does proof of a particles existance (or non-existance) put money in someone's pocket? Quoting: Anonymous Coward 595472I don't see anything wrong with trying to figure things out.and while there may be an infinite number of particles, it doesn't mean they exist in any arbitrary state. the particles exist in any state that you want them to exist. it's consciousness shaping reality through desire and effort. they will always find what they want through sufficient effort. come on, the observer effect has already given us hints of this process. i don't think it's wrong. not many things that i do in my life have a higher purpose as well..it's the effort that matters. but i just think that it becomes irrelevant and childish after a while. humanity needs a change of paradigm, not this reductionism and determinism reshaped over and over again. they keep trying to shove everything into logical structures, systems and causal relationships, even when the universe has clearly shown that higher understanding comes out from infinite creative chaos. to unify the paradox of existence into our minds is the ultimate "structure" that we need to find. then we can play with this structure like they are doing now, but without the first step accomplished. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 548848 United States03/17/2009 12:32 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I feel depressed about science in the modern world. every issue has political and economic baggage, and all of it is spun to advance someone's agenda. all the media are owned by defense contractors or joooooos with something to hide or another scam to foist on us. I wish ETs would come and mete out justice. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 548848 United States03/17/2009 12:44 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 491220 United States03/17/2009 12:57 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | it's a shame that your idea of how everything fits together doesn't allow for the scientific method. I mean, while I know it's not the definitive answer, it has held up rather well over the course of the last couple hundred years at least. why don't you take a little of that condescending angst and put it towrds a little more proof, and a little less heresay? |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 161668 Brazil03/17/2009 01:02 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | it's a shame that your idea of how everything fits together doesn't allow for the scientific method. I mean, while I know it's not the definitive answer, it has held up rather well over the course of the last couple hundred years at least. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 491220why don't you take a little of that condescending angst and put it towrds a little more proof, and a little less heresay? i have scientific background dude. i went to university. the fact is that i don't give a lot of importance to the scientific method. been there done that. yet I see the importance of using it to produce "evidence" for the world. you cannot convince the majority without hard evidence and logical structure that they can understand. there is a fine line between being "spiritual" and egotistical. what is your spiritual good for if you can't communicate it? you are right about this point. i also know that it takes almost the same amount of energy to put your ideas of how everything fits together in the paper. i'm doing it, slowly but sure. |
| WebsiteAussie User ID: 636573 Australia03/17/2009 01:03 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | it's a shame that your idea of how everything fits together doesn't allow for the scientific method. I mean, while I know it's not the definitive answer, it has held up rather well over the course of the last couple hundred years at least. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 491220why don't you take a little of that condescending angst and put it towrds a little more proof, and a little less heresay? Maybe you could word it so it is conducive to growth. I have no anger, genuine interest in etheric energy only. WebsiteAussie |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 161668 Brazil03/17/2009 01:04 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | i mean, finding the perfect structure takes the same amount of energy as putting in the paper. i believe many people have attained great knowledge of how everything works, but they cannot or won't put in the paper. it takes twice the energy. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 161668 Brazil03/17/2009 01:12 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | i mean, finding the perfect structure takes the same amount of energy as putting in the paper. i believe many people have attained great knowledge of how everything works, but they cannot or won't put in the paper. it takes twice the energy. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 161668while the scientists, ordinary man with low energy levels (except a few), can't achieve "perfect" structures because of their limitations, they sure can divide their time to put whatever little truths they achieve in the paper. thus, their knowledge increases and becomes more solid bit by bit, although in a crippled manner. Einstein for example did not achieve the "final" answer, but it was one hell of a good answer. and he also managed to PUT it in the paper, even though his wife helped him a lot. that alone beats the know-it-all guru that rants about his Theory of Everything on the Internet , but never get to put a concise description of it. once i was going for the guru path, but now i recognize the importance of a good scientific model. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 491220 United States03/17/2009 01:24 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | in response to your original question, Aussie... the discovery of the higgs boson would help us explain why photons carry no mass (electromagnetism), and why other particles we have observed do have mass (weak and strong nuclear forces). it's fascinating to think about the implications of what this even means. there may be something tying together electromagnetism and gravity, allowing us to create and manipulate gravity the same way we do magnetic fields. on the other side, if we can't pin down the Higgs boson, that means we need to seriously reasses our standard model of physical understanding. even Stephen hawkins doesn't think we'll be finding in all that soon, if it even exists. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 247873 United States03/17/2009 01:39 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| WebsiteAussie User ID: 636573 Australia03/17/2009 01:58 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | in response to your original question, Aussie... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 491220the discovery of the higgs boson would help us explain why photons carry no mass (electromagnetism), and why other particles we have observed do have mass (weak and strong nuclear forces). it's fascinating to think about the implications of what this even means. there may be something tying together electromagnetism and gravity, allowing us to create and manipulate gravity the same way we do magnetic fields. on the other side, if we can't pin down the Higgs boson, that means we need to seriously reasses our standard model of physical understanding. even Stephen hawkins doesn't think we'll be finding in all that soon, if it even exists. How do we know photons have no mass? WebsiteAussie |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 161668 Brazil03/17/2009 02:02 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | How do we know photons have no mass? Quoting: WebsiteAussie 636573WebsiteAussie the real answer is because photons are living paradoxes that have energy and don't have energy at the same time. e=mc^2 energy is interchangeable with mass. sounds stupid? yes but it's the truth. a paradox. no understanding is possible, only acceptance, only a change of paradigm. of course that you won't read this anywhere else. the explanations are always trying to give reasons for what deos not have a logical reason. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 491220 United States03/17/2009 02:07 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | it's kind of confusing, but a photon doesn't have any rest mass, but beacuse it is a form of energy, carries relatavistic mass. this means if you could stop a photon it would cease to exist, but, because it is moving, carries some mass-like properties. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 597443 United States03/17/2009 02:16 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| WebsiteAussie User ID: 636573 Australia03/17/2009 02:41 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | well, basically because relativity states that nothing that has mass can travel at the speed of light. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 491220it's kind of confusing, but a photon doesn't have any rest mass, but beacuse it is a form of energy, carries relatavistic mass. this means if you could stop a photon it would cease to exist, but, because it is moving, carries some mass-like properties. I thought relativity was how something appeared to be in relation to the observer. Like how the centre of some galaxies appear dark because they are moving away from Earth to fast to reflect light. I don't think gravity has anything to do with magnetic attraction either. Gravity is just one thing falling toward another. I think this because of the sling shot effect that occurs in space. The same may be true at a micro level also. I submit that the alpha point of a wave and the omega point of a wave are the same particle. The wave is formed by our perception alone or our position relative to the particle making the wave. I could write a formal paper and do the math. I could devote my life to struggling through the brainwashing of university science and what it is 'meant to be' however I would not be able to stand back and hypothesize as I do now after I am 'trained' in the art of scientific writing, I am certain of that. I am happy to dig holes and fill them in. WebsiteAussie |
phraust  User ID: 491220 United States03/17/2009 02:51 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I thought relativity was how something appeared to be in relation to the observer. Like how the centre of some galaxies appear dark because they are moving away from Earth to fast to reflect light. Quoting: WebsiteAussie 636573I don't think gravity has anything to do with magnetic attraction either. Gravity is just one thing falling toward another. I think this because of the sling shot effect that occurs in space. The same may be true at a micro level also. I submit that the alpha point of a wave and the omega point of a wave are the same particle. The wave is formed by our perception alone or our position relative to the particle making the wave. I could write a formal paper and do the math. I could devote my life to struggling through the brainwashing of university science and what it is 'meant to be' however I would not be able to stand back and hypothesize as I do now after I am 'trained' in the art of scientific writing, I am certain of that. I am happy to dig holes and fill them in. WebsiteAussie Well, the famous equation E=MC^2 says that energy and mass are one in the same. We can tell that photons are massless, because when we stop them (say, with an electron), that kinetic energy (relativistic mass) that the photon had is transferred to the electron (and vice versa, when an electron drops from a certain energy state and emits a photon). It just so happens that all the math works out pretty well. How I think of gravity, is the interaction of mass (or a mass-charge, like the higgs boson would impart) across space/time. In a lot of ways, this looks very close to what happens with electromagnetism (with an electromagnetic charge across space/time). I try to visualize interactions from higher and lower dimensional point's of view. It seems that basic two dimensional interactions (say, electrical charge along a wire from point a to point b), impart an upper dimensional field (in this case, a magnetic field through the third, higher dimension). At the same time, however, imparting a three dimensional magnetic field along a two dimensional wire would still effect a two dimensional charge. I don't see why electromagnetism and gravity wouldn't operate the same way, only through a higher dimensional interaction that we don't have the ability to observe directly. So I guess, what you are saying about the alpha and omega points of a wave being the same the same particle, only we perceive them different based on our point of view, could very well be correct. bury the past™ |
| WebsiteAussie User ID: 636573 Australia03/17/2009 04:23 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I thought relativity was how something appeared to be in relation to the observer. Like how the centre of some galaxies appear dark because they are moving away from Earth to fast to reflect light. Quoting: phraustI don't think gravity has anything to do with magnetic attraction either. Gravity is just one thing falling toward another. I think this because of the sling shot effect that occurs in space. The same may be true at a micro level also. I submit that the alpha point of a wave and the omega point of a wave are the same particle. The wave is formed by our perception alone or our position relative to the particle making the wave. I could write a formal paper and do the math. I could devote my life to struggling through the brainwashing of university science and what it is 'meant to be' however I would not be able to stand back and hypothesize as I do now after I am 'trained' in the art of scientific writing, I am certain of that. I am happy to dig holes and fill them in. WebsiteAussie Well, the famous equation E=MC^2 says that energy and mass are one in the same. We can tell that photons are massless, because when we stop them (say, with an electron), that kinetic energy (relativistic mass) that the photon had is transferred to the electron (and vice versa, when an electron drops from a certain energy state and emits a photon). It just so happens that all the math works out pretty well. How I think of gravity, is the interaction of mass (or a mass-charge, like the higgs boson would impart) across space/time. In a lot of ways, this looks very close to what happens with electromagnetism (with an electromagnetic charge across space/time). I try to visualize interactions from higher and lower dimensional point's of view. It seems that basic two dimensional interactions (say, electrical charge along a wire from point a to point b), impart an upper dimensional field (in this case, a magnetic field through the third, higher dimension). At the same time, however, imparting a three dimensional magnetic field along a two dimensional wire would still effect a two dimensional charge. I don't see why electromagnetism and gravity wouldn't operate the same way, only through a higher dimensional interaction that we don't have the ability to observe directly. So I guess, what you are saying about the alpha and omega points of a wave being the same the same particle, only we perceive them different based on our point of view, could very well be correct. Thank you for your insight. It has given much food for thought. There are too many similarities between our solar system and our atoms to discount them as being one and the same. My guess is that some beings out there can see Earth and our Sun as a distant moving stream of energy rather than a motionless body of particles. To some we live within a wave. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. WebsiteAussie |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 656642 United States10/06/2009 09:10 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | in response to your original question, Aussie... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 491220the discovery of the higgs boson would help us explain why photons carry no mass (electromagnetism), and why other particles we have observed do have mass (weak and strong nuclear forces). it's fascinating to think about the implications of what this even means. there may be something tying together electromagnetism and gravity, allowing us to create and manipulate gravity the same way we do magnetic fields. on the other side, if we can't pin down the Higgs boson, that means we need to seriously reasses our standard model of physical understanding. even Stephen hawkins doesn't think we'll be finding in all that soon, if it even exists.  |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 656642 United States10/06/2009 09:59 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | At least some of the stimulus monies are going for research [link to www.interactions.org] Fermilab is investing the funds in critical scientific infrastructure to strengthen the nation's global scientific leadership as well as to provide immediate economic relief to local communities. Out of the additional $60.2 million, the laboratory will devote $52.7 million to research on next-generation accelerators using superconducting radio frequency technology. This technology provides a highly efficient way to accelerate beams of particles with potential applications in medicine, energy and material science. Fermilab will use the remaining $7.5 million for preliminary design for a future neutrino experiment. With this final round of projects, the Obama Administration has now approved projects covering the full $1.6 billion that the DOE Office of Science received from Congress under the Recovery Act. "The Recovery Act funding will put our neighbors and fellow Americans to work," said Fermilab Director Pier Oddone. "We are investing the funds in local firms and other U.S. companies who will be our partners in strengthening the nation's scientific leadership." More information about Fermilab and the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act is available at [link to www.fnal.gov] |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 776822  China10/06/2009 10:17 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Fermilab Closer To Discovering Higgs Boson 'God Particle' Quoting: WebsiteAussie 634734Scientists looking for something already found. Lao Tzu discovered that centuries ago. The tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao The name that can be named is not the eternal Name. The unnamable is the eternally real. Naming is the origin of all particular things. Free from desire, you realize the mystery. Caught in desire, you see only the manifestations. Yet mystery and manifestations arise from the same source. This source is called darkness. Darkness within darkness. The gateway to all understanding. |
| kalamity kool User ID: 786019 Australia10/06/2009 10:50 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | "Could it be that the elusive particle they seek is the constant radiation from the sun and stars, the visible part of which, we call light. Light does amazing things in the right conditions. Imagine what the other aspects of radiation are capable of." [quoting Website Aussie] Could it be that the Higgs particle is what we, as observers of reality, and as bodies consuming and using light, and radiation from the Sun, somehow transform, and excrete back into the atmosphere and mass of the planet? |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 656642 United States10/06/2009 10:58 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | "Could it be that the elusive particle they seek is the constant radiation from the sun and stars, the visible part of which, we call light. Light does amazing things in the right conditions. Imagine what the other aspects of radiation are capable of." Quoting: kalamity kool[quoting Website Aussie] Could it be that the Higgs particle is what we, as observers of reality, and as bodies consuming and using light, and radiation from the Sun, somehow transform, and excrete back into the atmosphere and mass of the planet? This would be in line with the premise of the Matrix that A.I. was built to run off solar power, man then blocked the sun to kill off the A.I. The A.I then found that humans exude energy thus the pods of humans were formed and the Matrix born. Fermilab and CERN are working on new forms of energy, the monies invested in these projects are vast. The research is cutting edge and most likely further along than what is told to the media. I hope that more people review this thread, there is all the right elements...secret physics experiments that could kill mankind, the gov't keeping a tight lid on where the money is going, Fermilab is based right outside of Chicago with Bill Ayer's father company Commonwealth Edison heavily involved and the possibilities for conspiracy theories of the Mitre Corporation involvement are endless. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 587335 United States10/06/2009 11:08 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| kalamity kool User ID: 786019 Australia10/06/2009 11:13 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | "Could it be that the elusive particle they seek is the constant radiation from the sun and stars, the visible part of which, we call light. Light does amazing things in the right conditions. Imagine what the other aspects of radiation are capable of." Quoting: Anonymous Coward 656642[quoting Website Aussie] Could it be that the Higgs particle is what we, as observers of reality, and as bodies consuming and using light, and radiation from the Sun, somehow transform, and excrete back into the atmosphere and mass of the planet? This would be in line with the premise of the Matrix that A.I. was built to run off solar power, man then blocked the sun to kill off the A.I. The A.I then found that humans exude energy thus the pods of humans were formed and the Matrix born. Fermilab and CERN are working on new forms of energy, the monies invested in these projects are vast. The research is cutting edge and most likely further along than what is told to the media. I hope that more people review this thread, there is all the right elements...secret physics experiments that could kill mankind, the gov't keeping a tight lid on where the money is going, Fermilab is based right outside of Chicago with Bill Ayer's father company Commonwealth Edison heavily involved and the possibilities for conspiracy theories of the Mitre Corporation involvement are endless. GLP has a Hadron Collider tradition, I'm sure many of us are following what happens, and I'm equally sure all possible related conspiracies will be given a once over twice or more.. I think the builders of the A.1. could not enslave the consciousness that is born out of free will, and which may be reacting to the current changes in our magnetosphere. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 275013 United States10/06/2009 11:15 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| kalamity kool User ID: 786019 Australia10/06/2009 11:27 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 656642 United States10/14/2009 10:00 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | in response to your original question, Aussie... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 491220the discovery of the higgs boson would help us explain why photons carry no mass (electromagnetism), and why other particles we have observed do have mass (weak and strong nuclear forces). it's fascinating to think about the implications of what this even means. there may be something tying together electromagnetism and gravity, allowing us to create and manipulate gravity the same way we do magnetic fields. on the other side, if we can't pin down the Higgs boson, that means we need to seriously reasses our standard model of physical understanding. even Stephen hawkins doesn't think we'll be finding in all that soon, if it even exists. |
