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This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.

 
Clerky
User ID: 126139
United States
06/10/2009 08:03 PM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
Murder: The unlawful killing of a human being with malice aforethought.

This is the common law version of what is typically called "2nd Degree" Murder. A conviction of 2nd degree murder could carry with it a maximum setnece of life imprisonment (25 to life, most likely, but any setence that has the possability of life is considered a life setence.)

If you take the definition above for second degree murder and add the additional elements of premediation and deliberation to it, you have the common law definition of 1st Degree murder, which could carry with it the death penalty.

The murder convictions relating to DUI/DWI are 2nd degree murder convictions. The prosecution must prove malice aforethought.

Malice can be either express or implied malice. DWI murder convictions use an implied malice theory. The theory goes that the persons actions are reckless and present a danger of great bodily harm to others.

In most circumstances there will be no murder conviction unless there is a prior DUI conviction. When your convicted of a DUI in California the court admonishes you (tells you that if you get another DUI which results in death that you can be charged with murder). The authority behind this is a california case entitled People v. Watson. Hence, when a person is on trial for murder resulting from a DUI it is referred to as a "Watson" case.
Princess Bride

User ID: 699825
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06/10/2009 08:12 PM

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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
I'm all for the murder charge for drunk drivers. Getting behind the wheel drunk is a deliberate decision-premeditated. You know your actions can cause someones death and you do it anyway? Murder.


In that scenario, your INTENT is not to murder, it is to get from one place to another by car... premeditated murder means your intent is expressly to kill and you have laid plans beforehand to do solely that, kill.


It's murder because while you may want to get from one place to another-you don't care whether or not your driving drunk kills someone.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 516154

Mens Rea is an element to First Degree murder.
No Mens Rea, no first degree murder.
Second degree... manslaughter... okay. Not first degree.
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 339051
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06/10/2009 08:29 PM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
I don't think it's out of line at all, as a matter of fact I think it should be premeditated murder.
Olibow

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06/10/2009 08:50 PM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
The Cops in L.A. are charging the driver of the car that killed Angels pitcher Nick Adenhart and two others with three counts of MURDER.
Now I'm all for locking the guy up but they are starting to charge people with shit they didn't do because they don't like the maximum sentence of the charge that he actually DID do.

That's getting a little scary now isn't it?
 Quoting: XinTexas



I always thought they should get more than a ten dollar fine for murdering someone. Good.

Probably the 30th times he'd driven drunk. They are extremely lenient on those bastards, so his record must be terrible. And if the judge has done everything, up to revoking a license, if the drunk gets in the car with the sole intent of getting waster and drives, it is premeditated. These scoff laws suck. menace to society. And they do NOT care. Addicts dont' give a shit.

Last Edited by Olibow on 06/10/2009 08:53 PM
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The Professor
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06/10/2009 10:04 PM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
You willingly jeopardize the lives of others , you cant come along and say "Gee , I didn't realize that driving drunk could kill people"


When you commit a crime , and someone dies because of that crime , its called MURDER.
 Quoting: Lastcall 647480


I believe you are talking about what is know as "felony murder":

[link to www.google.com]

Felony murder:

An unlawful homicide that occurs in the commission or attempted commission of a felony, which is considered first degree murder by operation of this doctrine. In many modern statutes, only homicides that occur in the course of certain specified felonies are "felony murders." See N.J.S.A. 2C: 11-3 (3). The evil mind or malice that is necessary to find someone guilty of murder is implied or imputed from the actor's intent to commit a felony. See 383 F. 2d 421, 426. For example, if someone burned down a warehouse and thereby committed arson, which resulted in the death of a person in the building, the arsonist is guilty of first degree murder ("felony murder") even if he did not know of the presence of the person and he had taken special precautions to try to avoid any loss of life. The harshness of this doctrine has led to a limitation of its use except against the person who actually committed the underlying felony. See Model Penal Code §§210.1 et seq.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
10/07/2012 01:29 AM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
They aren't just charging people either...

Appeals court upholds Bakersfield DUI murder sentence

The murder conviction and life prison term for a four-times convicted drunken driver has been affirmed by an appeals court.

Esteban Demecio Hernandez, 42, had a blood-alcohol level three times the legal limit on March 17, 2007 when the car he was driving crossed the centerline on Comanche Drive north of Arvin and struck a car driven by Reynalda Bazaldua, 40.

Bazaldua died of her injuries. Her two daughters, then 12 and 5 and also in the car, also were injured.

Hernandez was convicted of second-degree murder and driving on a suspended or revoked license.

When Judge Kenneth C. Twisselman heard Hernandez had three prior DUI convictions and was on probation for DUI, he ordered consecutive sentences: 15-years-to-life plus four years.

On appeal, Hernandez claimed his Sixth Amendment right to trial by jury was violated when the judge ordered the consecutive sentences. He contended he was entitled to a jury trial on the issue of sentence.

But the 5th District Court of Appeal in Fresno dismissed that argument in a one-paragraph discussion. The three justices noted the California Supreme Court had long ago ruled there was no right to trial by jury on such questions, and that the United States Supreme Court made the same ruling three months ago.

The case is Peo. v. Hernandez, F055155.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 605167
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 25105806
United States
10/07/2012 01:29 AM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
They aren't just charging people either...

Appeals court upholds Bakersfield DUI murder sentence

The murder conviction and life prison term for a four-times convicted drunken driver has been affirmed by an appeals court.

Esteban Demecio Hernandez, 42, had a blood-alcohol level three times the legal limit on March 17, 2007 when the car he was driving crossed the centerline on Comanche Drive north of Arvin and struck a car driven by Reynalda Bazaldua, 40.

Bazaldua died of her injuries. Her two daughters, then 12 and 5 and also in the car, also were injured.

Hernandez was convicted of second-degree murder and driving on a suspended or revoked license.

When Judge Kenneth C. Twisselman heard Hernandez had three prior DUI convictions and was on probation for DUI, he ordered consecutive sentences: 15-years-to-life plus four years.

On appeal, Hernandez claimed his Sixth Amendment right to trial by jury was violated when the judge ordered the consecutive sentences. He contended he was entitled to a jury trial on the issue of sentence.

But the 5th District Court of Appeal in Fresno dismissed that argument in a one-paragraph discussion. The three justices noted the California Supreme Court had long ago ruled there was no right to trial by jury on such questions, and that the United States Supreme Court made the same ruling three months ago.

The case is Peo. v. Hernandez, F055155.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 605167
daughter
User ID: 25105806
United States
10/07/2012 01:37 AM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
what about the daughters? Has anyone asked how they felt? How that man that had 3v previous DUI convictions changed their lives forever?
What about the man that owned the van that Hernandez was driving? Why did he let him borrow his van knowing that Hernandez had a suspended licence and was more likely going to get drunk? These are all questions that come up when thinking about this case.
TSWB21

User ID: 1267719
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10/07/2012 01:39 AM

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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
I'm all for the murder charge for drunk drivers. Getting behind the wheel drunk is a deliberate decision-premeditated. You know your actions can cause someones death and you do it anyway? Murder.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 516154


that's the definition of manslaughter not murder.
Judethz
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10/07/2012 01:49 AM

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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
The Cops in L.A. are charging the driver of the car that killed Angels pitcher Nick Adenhart and two others with three counts of MURDER.
Now I'm all for locking the guy up but they are starting to charge people with shit they didn't do because they don't like the maximum sentence of the charge that he actually DID do.

That's getting a little scary now isn't it?
 Quoting: XinTexas


4454 Not really. In India one of the reasons that anyone who can afford to do so has a chauffeur, is because there is a high chance that the driver of a car that kills someone will get lynched on the spot by an angry mob.

I suppose that most of us have done it occasionally, but the times they are a changing.

Also Clerky made a good point: In most circumstances there will be no murder conviction unless there is a prior DUI conviction. When your convicted of a DUI in California the court admonishes you (tells you that if you get another DUI which results in death that you can be charged with murder). The authority behind this is a California case entitled People v. Watson. Hence, when a person is on trial for murder resulting from a DUI it is referred to as a "Watson" case.

Last Edited by Judethz on 10/07/2012 01:53 AM
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 25106341
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10/07/2012 02:05 AM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
The drinking and then driving was premeditated. The vehicle becomes a weapon at that point, and the drunk driver knows it. To take it out on the road is malicious, is knowingly dangerous to others.

It's murder.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 25105187
Italy
10/07/2012 02:21 AM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
The Cops in L.A. are charging the driver of the car that killed Angels pitcher Nick Adenhart and two others with three counts of MURDER.
Now I'm all for locking the guy up but they are starting to charge people with shit they didn't do because they don't like the maximum sentence of the charge that he actually DID do.

That's getting a little scary now isn't it?
 Quoting: XinTexas


Wow you're a total dumbass. Every drunk driver should be charged with 1st degree murder. I read about this scumbag drunk driver who got 51 years for killing 3 people in the USA, it sounds so good and it will prevent him to commit more reckless homicides for the next 51 years.

You're not cool if you drive drunk, your just an ass. You aren't exercising your freedom when you drive drunk, you're just endagering oblivious people and everyone should be free to shot you on sight for the sake of their own safety.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 25105187
Italy
10/07/2012 02:22 AM
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Re: This is starting to get a little bothersome. Charging DUI/DWI suspects with MURDER.
I don't think it's out of line at all, as a matter of fact I think it should be premeditated murder.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 339051


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