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Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!

 
George B
Extinct But Not Forgotten!

User ID: 976283
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06/02/2010 04:41 PM

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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
In other words, the chemk00ks don't WANT the question resolved.

You can assume that . . . I rather think they are doing the best they can with the resources at their disposal. They may eventually be able to do just what your are demanding for your proof; however, I think even then you would find and objection.



Try it and find out.
 Quoting: The Commentator

I would love too!
Martin Luther King . . . Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter!

"Email: MonaAnnLisa@yahoo.com"

All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them.
Galileo Galilei, Italian astronomer & physicist (1564 - 1642)

The only thing guaranteed in life is deception. . . everything else is optional . . . George B
George B
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06/02/2010 04:44 PM

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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
And you were challenging very knowledgeable people to debate the subject with only THIS?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 218281

NO!

Sorry, I have to run again.

Last Edited by George B on 06/02/2010 04:45 PM
Martin Luther King . . . Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter!

"Email: MonaAnnLisa@yahoo.com"

All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them.
Galileo Galilei, Italian astronomer & physicist (1564 - 1642)

The only thing guaranteed in life is deception. . . everything else is optional . . . George B
The Commentator

User ID: 587619
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06/02/2010 04:48 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
In other words, the chemk00ks don't WANT the question resolved.

You can assume that . . . I rather think they are doing the best they can with the resources at their disposal. They may eventually be able to do just what your are demanding for your proof; however, I think even then you would find and objection.



Try it and find out.

I would love too!
 Quoting: George B



Wonderful, when can we expect a preliminary report on your findings?
non sufficit Orbis

Being a zetatard means never having to make sense.

"Nancy pays me to post on Her threads"

Free Store admits to being a paid zetadrool shill

NO max/bridget EVER!!!!!
NO luser EVER!!!
NO clunker EVER!!!!!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 990324
Ireland
06/02/2010 04:50 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
So what is it chemtrails are supposed to do?

And where is Clare? I haven't had my fix of relational predisposed superpositional interstitial grass-roots homiligook today. I mean damn, did we run off the only chick in the room?


Some of the purposes listed by advocates:

1. Climate Modification . . . combat global warming
2. Weather Modification . . . for good and bad reasons
3. Radar suppression
4. Medium used to detect energy weapons used against the US
5. Spy in the sky suppression
6. Research to enhance 3D imaging on the battle field
7. Distribution of pathogens and toxins
8. Medium used to support HAARP
9. Zeta claim to obscure Planet-X, etc.
10. Zeta claim to slow down or make people too ill to escape their demise in the pole shift
 Quoting: George B


Ah good ole chemtrails, the swiss army knife in the conspiracists arsenal.

Is there anything chemtrails can't do?
The Commentator

User ID: 587619
United States
06/02/2010 04:56 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
So what is it chemtrails are supposed to do?

And where is Clare? I haven't had my fix of relational predisposed superpositional interstitial grass-roots homiligook today. I mean damn, did we run off the only chick in the room?


Some of the purposes listed by advocates:

1. Climate Modification . . . combat global warming
2. Weather Modification . . . for good and bad reasons
3. Radar suppression
4. Medium used to detect energy weapons used against the US
5. Spy in the sky suppression
6. Research to enhance 3D imaging on the battle field
7. Distribution of pathogens and toxins
8. Medium used to support HAARP
9. Zeta claim to obscure Planet-X, etc.
10. Zeta claim to slow down or make people too ill to escape their demise in the pole shift


Ah good ole chemtrails, the swiss army knife in the conspiracists arsenal.

Is there anything chemtrails can't do?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 990324



Make their believers study the Scientific Method.....
non sufficit Orbis

Being a zetatard means never having to make sense.

"Nancy pays me to post on Her threads"

Free Store admits to being a paid zetadrool shill

NO max/bridget EVER!!!!!
NO luser EVER!!!
NO clunker EVER!!!!!
Reality420
User ID: 990346
United States
06/02/2010 05:08 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I would say the evidence resides in several categories:
1. Government documentation, some going back many years
2. Environmental samples of expected Chemtrail residue showing similar results in many locations where persistent Contrails have been witnessed
3. The existence of Chemtrail activist that are found in almost every developed country in the world (some mentioning trails associated with military activity)
4. Scientific proposals which can be documented that propose weather modification strategies and climate mitigation through particulate dispersal processes almost identical to Chemtrails
5. Development of genetically engineered crops which can thrive in area where certain metals concentrations are toxic . . .

This is a partial list . . . I don't want to give away all my cards just yet.

And by the way . . . by using my good looks, persuasion, logic and common sense . . . most people will and can connect the dots when given adequate data.
 Quoting: George B


How about some more irrelevent "dots" to connect:

6. Many gov'ts have built underground shelters. Chemtrails or PX?
7. Home HEPA filters became common in the 1980s & 1990s. Why?
8. There have been a lot of websites created dealing with asthma. Why?
9. Part of the Planet X story is "red dust". Fibreglass insulation is pink. Chaff is metallized silica glass. Connect the dots, people.
10. Bigfoot was a popular topic until the 1990s, just when chemtrails became the rage. Perhaps chemtrails are for mind control of Bigfoot researchers.
11. New diseases and new strains of diseases have appeared since the mid-1990s. Chemtrails?
12. Every time someone tests for "pollution" in the air, they find it. This never happened 20+ years ago when the air was pristine with zero pollutants.
13. The government was working on Regan's "Star Wars" program and look at how successful that's been, so doing the near impossible is possible --- kinda'.
14. Some undergrad wrote a paper saying it would be advantageous if the military could control the weather.
15. Some undergrad wrote a paper saying it would be advantageous if the military could time travel.
16. Some undergrad wrote a paper saying it would be advantageous if the military could make their troops invisible.
17. There are people claiming all three of the above are in existance. Subtle disclosure or fantasy?
18. The existence of Reptoid activist that are found in almost every developed country. Chemtrails connected to Reptoids? Connet the dots people.
19. Governments are greedy and dishonest.
20. Businesses are greedy and dishonest.
21. People are greedy and dishonest.
22. Because of the above 3 items, it is possible that giant, mechanical slugs are being unleashed on the populace who are blinded to this fact by chemtrail mind control.
23. <insert any irrelevent, fanciful or made-up BS here.>
24. loop to #23

I'm convinced.


R.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 960518
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06/02/2010 05:56 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
So what is it chemtrails are supposed to do?

And where is Clare? I haven't had my fix of relational predisposed superpositional interstitial grass-roots homiligook today. I mean damn, did we run off the only chick in the room?
 Quoting: Returner 997


I'm mildly worried I might have "short-circuited" her with that long-ass post of mine yesterday.

Hope not. Didn't mean to "damage" anybody. :)

Anybody know how old she's purported to be? Like, I didn't just viciously engage somebody's grandmother yesterday, did I...?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 990345
United Kingdom
06/02/2010 05:58 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
In other words, the chemk00ks don't WANT the question resolved.

You can assume that . . . I rather think they are doing the best they can with the resources at their disposal. They may eventually be able to do just what your are demanding for your proof; however, I think even then you would find and objection.
 Quoting: George B


Standard kOOk excuse.
Anonymous Coward
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06/02/2010 05:59 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
Ah good ole chemtrails, the swiss army knife in the conspiracists arsenal.

Is there anything chemtrails can't do?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 990324


Get proven, apparently!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 990345
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06/02/2010 06:08 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
You have some proof that they're making uncharacteristic sky tracks with chaff, whose purpose is to fool the radar of enemy missiles?

Not exactly as you have stated it; however, I will say that at one time I read and copied documentation that strongly suggested similar capabilities . . . I had a computer crash since and lost a lot of my sources. I hope I can relocate and document much of what I am now saying.
 Quoting: George B


Oh, how CONVENIENT! Always the same LAME excuses from kOOks when challenged to produce the 'damning' evidence they remember seeing once on some web site!

"Strongly suggested" = IOW, "I interpreted it to mean what my delusion predisposes me to believe"

You are nothing but a typical brain-dead kOOk idiot.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 976283
United States
06/02/2010 06:17 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
And you were challenging very knowledgeable people to debate the subject with only THIS?

NO!

Sorry, I have to run again.
 Quoting: George B


No, I have quite a bit more evidence to present:

I am probably typical of many people who visit GLP . . . curious and aware of much of the DOOM being pushed out of several media sources. I may have some basic scientific knowledge but have forgotten much more than I remember.

Debunking as a pastime and entertainment is to my experience a rather new science. However, while you (debunkers) see it more than likely as entertainment I see it as a public service.

My primary purpose is to gather on my time and effort all that the average person can realistically understand and go against a Thread Baron/s . . . self-proclaimed and or real experts on almost about anything.
I am the sacrificial Advocate on Chemtrails . . . you are the expert Opponent. The judge or judges will rule on the result of the Trial/Debate whatever.

PUBLIC SERVICE: with a reasonably thorough presentation of the evidence, its rebuttal, counter arguments and the final vote by a Judge. One can point to a point in time when there was a process and a result (if only temporary). I also think it can be rather entertaining as well. I am perfectly willing to be trashed but don't think I will go down easy. I really do believe there is something to the Chemtrail issue.

FINAL RESULT: You will help people understand there are many more positions on DOOM than the DOOMSAYERS are saying.
Anonymous Coward
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06/02/2010 06:19 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
This is my proposal: see below:

CHEMTRAIL TRIAL Proposal

1. I propose a new Thread entitled "Chemtrails on Trial" . . . I think they exist . . . I (George B.), I am the Advocate. I need at least one Opponent who will debate in a trial like format. I need either one or three Judges to make the final vote on who is the winner . . . the Advocate or the Opponent.

I propose a three day event which does not have to be done on three consecutive days.

First Day: Beginning Argument . . . this can be a brief one post statement . . . it can be as short as one line or as big as one page. The Advocate or Opponent is not restricted to any format or logic on this post.
After the beginning argument the Advocate and Opponent may list and present their evidence . . . I would suggest in Exhibit form so they can be easily referred to by either side. See below:

Advocate Exibit #1: The mission of the Department of Defense is to provide the military forces needed to deter war and to protect the security of our country. The department's headquarters is at the Pentagon. [link to www.defense.gov]

Opponent Exhibit #1: Contrail definition by NOAA: A contrail is the condensation trail that is left behind by a passing jet plane. Contrails form when hot humid air from jet exhaust mixes with environmental air of low vapor pressure and low temperature. Vapor pressure is just a fancy term for the amount of pressure that is exerted by water vapor itself (as opposed to atmospheric, or barometric, pressure which is due to the weight of the entire atmosphere above you). The mixing occurs directly behind the plane due to the turbulence generated by the engine. If condensation (conversion from a gas to a liquid) occurs, then a contrail becomes visible. Since air temperatures at these high atmospheric levels are very cold (generally colder than -40 F), only a small amount of liquid is necessary for condensation to occur. Water is a normal byproduct of combustion in engines. [link to www.wrh.noaa.gov]

Second Day: Arguments presented using the Exhibits presented on day one. Additional Exhibits if there are any must be approved by one of the judges.

Third Day: Rebuttals and counter arguments . . . then a one post final summation asking the judge/s decision.

THE ONLY RULE: The Advocate, Opponent, and Judge/s may respond or ignore any person posting if they wish; however, they must respond to any post directed to them by the Advocate, Opponent or Judge/s.

Finally, I must have an Opponent and at least one Judge or this trial cannot begin . . . who will volunteer?
 Quoting: George B
George B
Extinct But Not Forgotten!

User ID: 976283
United States
06/02/2010 07:38 PM

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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
You have some proof that they're making uncharacteristic sky tracks with chaff, whose purpose is to fool the radar of enemy missiles?

Not exactly as you have stated it; however, I will say that at one time I read and copied documentation that strongly suggested similar capabilities . . . I had a computer crash since and lost a lot of my sources. I hope I can relocate and document much of what I am now saying.


Oh, how CONVENIENT! Always the same LAME excuses from kOOks when challenged to produce the 'damning' evidence they remember seeing once on some web site!

"Strongly suggested" = IOW, "I interpreted it to mean what my delusion predisposes me to believe"

You are nothing but a typical brain-dead kOOk idiot.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 990345

I am tell the truth I have over 800 Gigs of scrambled data . . . do you really think that I would tell you that unless is was the truth? I knowing the reception I would get. I can assure you that I will find that info and much more.
Martin Luther King . . . Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter!

"Email: MonaAnnLisa@yahoo.com"

All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them.
Galileo Galilei, Italian astronomer & physicist (1564 - 1642)

The only thing guaranteed in life is deception. . . everything else is optional . . . George B
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 908953
Canada
06/02/2010 07:39 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
Some of the purposes listed by advocates:

1. Climate Modification . . . combat global warming

 Quoting: George B

This of course assumes that global warming is real, which has not been proven.

2. Weather Modification . . . for good and bad reasons
3. Radar suppression
4. Medium used to detect energy weapons used against the US
5. Spy in the sky suppression
6. Research to enhance 3D imaging on the battle field
7. Distribution of pathogens and toxins
8. Medium used to support HAARP
 Quoting: George B

Wow, those are a lot of tin foil hat worries, none of which can be substantiated by serious research.

9. Zeta claim to obscure Planet-X, etc.
10. Zeta claim to slow down or make people too ill to escape their demise in the pole shift
 Quoting: George B

ROFLMAO. Zetas also claim that we can't see PX because of red dust, or because it is behind the sun. They can't make up their minds about why it can't be seen, except for fleeting moments when webcams and cellphones capture it. As for making people too ill to survive the pole shift, it Nancy's pole shift did happen, no living creature would survive. Period.
George B
Extinct But Not Forgotten!

User ID: 976283
United States
06/02/2010 07:48 PM

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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
Some of the purposes listed by advocates:

1. Climate Modification . . . combat global warming


This of course assumes that global warming is real, which has not been proven.



2. Weather Modification . . . for good and bad reasons
3. Radar suppression
4. Medium used to detect energy weapons used against the US
5. Spy in the sky suppression
6. Research to enhance 3D imaging on the battle field
7. Distribution of pathogens and toxins
8. Medium used to support HAARP

Wow, those are a lot of tin foil hat worries, none of which can be substantiated by serious research.



9. Zeta claim to obscure Planet-X, etc.
10. Zeta claim to slow down or make people too ill to escape their demise in the pole shift

ROFLMAO. Zetas also claim that we can't see PX because of red dust, or because it is behind the sun. They can't make up their minds about why it can't be seen, except for fleeting moments when webcams and cellphones capture it. As for making people too ill to survive the pole shift, it Nancy's pole shift did happen, no living creature would survive. Period.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 908953

2 & 3 are already dead locks . . . these are already accomplished by good old CHAFF. It has been used in one form or another since WWII. Number 1, has been presented as totally possible (via the same concept that Chemtrails are thought to be) and will cost 1 Billion dollars a year to accomplish. The rest most . . . likely what you said! However, I will still research them.

Last Edited by George B on 06/02/2010 07:57 PM
Martin Luther King . . . Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter!

"Email: MonaAnnLisa@yahoo.com"

All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them.
Galileo Galilei, Italian astronomer & physicist (1564 - 1642)

The only thing guaranteed in life is deception. . . everything else is optional . . . George B
George B
Extinct But Not Forgotten!

User ID: 976283
United States
06/02/2010 08:16 PM

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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 908953

Hi, you were KeepingItReal in a prior life? Are you not the Native Canadian/Mexican/South American healer. You have Mayan connections or heritage as well. Greetings! I have great respect for your heritage and abilities. We had a few discussions and I enjoyed them greatly.
Sorry, I must run . . . hope to talk some time in the future.
Martin Luther King . . . Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter!

"Email: MonaAnnLisa@yahoo.com"

All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them.
Galileo Galilei, Italian astronomer & physicist (1564 - 1642)

The only thing guaranteed in life is deception. . . everything else is optional . . . George B
The Commentator

User ID: 587619
United States
06/02/2010 09:08 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
You have some proof that they're making uncharacteristic sky tracks with chaff, whose purpose is to fool the radar of enemy missiles?

Not exactly as you have stated it; however, I will say that at one time I read and copied documentation that strongly suggested similar capabilities . . . I had a computer crash since and lost a lot of my sources. I hope I can relocate and document much of what I am now saying.


Oh, how CONVENIENT! Always the same LAME excuses from kOOks when challenged to produce the 'damning' evidence they remember seeing once on some web site!

"Strongly suggested" = IOW, "I interpreted it to mean what my delusion predisposes me to believe"

You are nothing but a typical brain-dead kOOk idiot.

I am tell the truth I have over 800 Gigs of scrambled data . . . do you really think that I would tell you that unless is was the truth? I knowing the reception I would get. I can assure you that I will find that info and much more.
 Quoting: George B



The plural of "anecdote" is not "data."

Makes no difference how much anecdote you have, it can be confirmed or falsified with one good experiment, an experiment the chemk00ks will NEVER perform.
non sufficit Orbis

Being a zetatard means never having to make sense.

"Nancy pays me to post on Her threads"

Free Store admits to being a paid zetadrool shill

NO max/bridget EVER!!!!!
NO luser EVER!!!
NO clunker EVER!!!!!
The Commentator

User ID: 587619
United States
06/02/2010 09:18 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
So what is it chemtrails are supposed to do?

And where is Clare? I haven't had my fix of relational predisposed superpositional interstitial grass-roots homiligook today. I mean damn, did we run off the only chick in the room?


I'm mildly worried I might have "short-circuited" her with that long-ass post of mine yesterday.

Hope not. Didn't mean to "damage" anybody. :)

Anybody know how old she's purported to be? Like, I didn't just viciously engage somebody's grandmother yesterday, did I...?
 Quoting: "...Sing, I'll sway.



You could not cause the sort of damage that clunker had.

Of course clunker was probably just a simple troll. No one could be that stupid on so many topics and possibly operate a computer.
non sufficit Orbis

Being a zetatard means never having to make sense.

"Nancy pays me to post on Her threads"

Free Store admits to being a paid zetadrool shill

NO max/bridget EVER!!!!!
NO luser EVER!!!
NO clunker EVER!!!!!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 990588
United Kingdom
06/02/2010 09:51 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
You have some proof that they're making uncharacteristic sky tracks with chaff, whose purpose is to fool the radar of enemy missiles?

Not exactly as you have stated it; however, I will say that at one time I read and copied documentation that strongly suggested similar capabilities . . . I had a computer crash since and lost a lot of my sources. I hope I can relocate and document much of what I am now saying.


Oh, how CONVENIENT! Always the same LAME excuses from kOOks when challenged to produce the 'damning' evidence they remember seeing once on some web site!

"Strongly suggested" = IOW, "I interpreted it to mean what my delusion predisposes me to believe"

You are nothing but a typical brain-dead kOOk idiot.

I am tell the truth I have over 800 Gigs of scrambled data . . . do you really think that I would tell you that unless is was the truth? I knowing the reception I would get. I can assure you that I will find that info and much more.
 Quoting: George B


That's what they ALWAYS say! You continue to prove yourself a kOOk, and 'chemtrails' bullshit.

rockon
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06/02/2010 09:55 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
And you were challenging very knowledgeable people to debate the subject with only THIS?

NO!

Sorry, I have to run again.


No, I have quite a bit more evidence to present:

I am probably typical of many people who visit GLP . . . curious and aware of much of the DOOM being pushed out of several media sources. I may have some basic scientific knowledge but have forgotten much more than I remember.

Debunking as a pastime and entertainment is to my experience a rather new science. However, while you (debunkers) see it more than likely as entertainment I see it as a public service.

My primary purpose is to gather on my time and effort all that the average person can realistically understand and go against a Thread Baron/s . . . self-proclaimed and or real experts on almost about anything.
I am the sacrificial Advocate on Chemtrails . . . you are the expert Opponent. The judge or judges will rule on the result of the Trial/Debate whatever.

PUBLIC SERVICE: with a reasonably thorough presentation of the evidence, its rebuttal, counter arguments and the final vote by a Judge. One can point to a point in time when there was a process and a result (if only temporary). I also think it can be rather entertaining as well. I am perfectly willing to be trashed but don't think I will go down easy. I really do believe there is something to the Chemtrail issue.

FINAL RESULT: You will help people understand there are many more positions on DOOM than the DOOMSAYERS are saying.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 976283


Pathetic kOOk delusions of grandeur.
Anonymous Coward
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06/02/2010 10:37 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I am the sacrificial Advocate on Chemtrails . . . you are the expert Opponent. The judge or judges will rule on the result of the Trial/Debate whatever.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 976283



George, here is my suggestion:

Start a thread titled "I challenge "The Guy" to a civil debate on chemtrails" and keep bumping it until someone shows up.
Menow
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06/02/2010 10:43 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I am the sacrificial Advocate on Chemtrails . . . you are the expert Opponent. The judge or judges will rule on the result of the Trial/Debate whatever.




George, here is my suggestion:

Start a thread titled "I challenge "The Guy" to a civil debate on chemtrails" and keep bumping it until someone shows up.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 969583

Yep. Do that, George. It's the best chance you have of getting what you want.
Anonymous Coward
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06/02/2010 10:50 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I am the sacrificial Advocate on Chemtrails . . . you are the expert Opponent. The judge or judges will rule on the result of the Trial/Debate whatever.




George, here is my suggestion:

Start a thread titled "I challenge "The Guy" to a civil debate on chemtrails" and keep bumping it until someone shows up.

Yep. Do that, George. It's the best chance you have of getting what you want.
 Quoting: Menow 988478



Where George's plan won't work on GLP is the idea of having just 3 judges.

No one will respect that and everyone who wants to will weigh in.
Anonymous Coward
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06/02/2010 10:58 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
Of course clunker was probably just a simple troll. No one could be that stupid on so many topics and possibly operate a computer.
 Quoting: The Commentator


No, she wasn't trolling in the sense of pretending to be stupid provoke a response. That was what was especially disturbing about it to me.

I listened to her podcast interview with Fetzer--she's for real. She was billed as some kind of expert by a guy with a PhD who seemed to be completely going along with her spiel without so much as batting an eye.
Anonymous Coward
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06/02/2010 11:03 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
And I know I'm basically a rube, but how in the world does someone like Fetzer get a Ph.D. in the History and Philosophy of Science, become a tenured professor and wind up championing someone talking the way Clair does?

I just don't get it.
Menow
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06/02/2010 11:15 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
And I know I'm basically a rube, but how in the world does someone like Fetzer get a Ph.D. in the History and Philosophy of Science, become a tenured professor and wind up championing someone talking the way Clair does?

I just don't get it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 969583


Most people are unable to differentiate emphatically stated bullshit from calmly spoken facts. Our world values style over substance. It's that simple.
The Commentator

User ID: 587619
United States
06/02/2010 11:56 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
Of course clunker was probably just a simple troll. No one could be that stupid on so many topics and possibly operate a computer.


No, she wasn't trolling in the sense of pretending to be stupid provoke a response. That was what was especially disturbing about it to me.

I listened to her podcast interview with Fetzer--she's for real. She was billed as some kind of expert by a guy with a PhD who seemed to be completely going along with her spiel without so much as batting an eye.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 969583



Since i didn't, and don't intend to, listen to her "interview" could you give a brief synopsis?
non sufficit Orbis

Being a zetatard means never having to make sense.

"Nancy pays me to post on Her threads"

Free Store admits to being a paid zetadrool shill

NO max/bridget EVER!!!!!
NO luser EVER!!!
NO clunker EVER!!!!!
mclarek
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06/03/2010 02:01 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
No, I know of that. But WHERE WERE THE REMAINS FROM?

Most of those investigators got the remains from others ...




And your source on that?

My guess is that you know nothing about this one way or the other and you're just winging it based only on your assumption that this can't be true.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 969583

It has to be false. Due to the Citgo witnesses, the only carefully questioned witnesses, the flight was from the North. They were stationary, and in a key vantage point, asked a simple yes-no type question (which is where witnesses are at their best): this is what witness studies have found. "Left or right, which view over the stationary gas station? Left."

Wrong trajectory.

Plus no gas smell from someone refusing to be cowed by a hospital visit. And early reporters saying explosive smell, and no debris.

Plus black box (southerly direction) stopping short of the "hit" leaves probability it was a 2nd flyover.

And small hole (before wall caved in) with no place for the huge engines to go through, and no huge engines outside as clear evidence. Later, a photo showed up, of unclear provenance, of an engine.

There was no gas clean-up on record.

And the lawn wasn't scoured by a low-impact drag.

And the cabbie whose car had a light pole in it, his wife was FBI (or CIA, I don't remember) and the pole was clean through the centre, without any damage to the seats.

Staged event.
mclarek
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06/03/2010 02:44 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
You guys have been busy while I was away.

:)

The speculations on me again are really funny.

As to the no-plane hypothesis, theory, conclusion, first

a) Handle the plane physics from the plane expert: Lear. You have only talked of his interest in the paranormal, etc. Newton was an obsessed mystical prophecy interpreter and alchemist, and most of is actual writings were on the spiritual and magic. Thus, be scientific and legally neutral: deal with the work of Lear in his expert field: piloting; ignore his other interests.

b) The Citgo witnesses are the determining witnesses, not because I say so, but purely rationally: when asked a simple polarized question (yes-no, left-right, etc.) on a salient experience, and when also from a good vanage point and reasonably stable (in this case from a fixed and excellent vantage point on the incoming flight), they said left, over the trees to their left. It is in such kind of questioning, when people were at a good vantage point and stationary enough to notice, that witnesses are at their best, in scientific studies of witness reliability.

c) The other witnesses you love to mention saw SOMETHING, and described various things. First, some had to be lying (plants) or embellishing (e.g., faces in the windows). Others saw a flight, but described various types of aircraft, and assumed the plane in the smoke had hit. This would be reasonable, given a possible smoke-and-mirrors flyover. Plus, they were moving (on a highway). All this is trumped for trajectory and vangage point, simplicity of question and cross-examination and time to notice their reaction -- when asked a simple question. They were stationary witnesses at the key angle vantage point along the trajectory, the Citgo witnesses. The others werent, and there are too few of them, possibly suspicious in itself. There should have been several hundred.

d) All passenger effects could have come -- from the dead patsies -- from another location, so they are not NECESSARY to the issue of plane locations or use at the final locations, hypothetically speaking. (Of course, this is sad emotionally that they were likely killed -- or most were killed? -- known from the pathologists' reports. Their SSNs are mostly active, though. So there is some question about their final fate even if you do want to believe in planes.)

e) We have a lack of jet fuel fire effects on an uncowed witness -- known to have had a visit by suits -- and a lack of same smells and effects noticed by the first reporter on the scene. At the Pentagon (and Shanksville) there was no massive oil fire: the fire engines spread water ... except on a truck which caught flame at the Pentagon.

f) The black box data shows the plane high and has a gap of the "end portion" -- excused on debunker sites, as "a question". But there should be no gap at all, first of all. Second of all, it means a loop hole for no planes, given the other problems around 9/11. It can be considered suspect, so imagine for a second it is. Plus, though it comes more from the south than north, unlike the Citgo witnesses, many planes were flying around when they shouldn't have, and it could have been a second flyover, to get a better (but incomplete) black box, to make the southerly approach feasible ... because there was a northerly approach from the Citgo witnesses, and they were in the best and most stable position, with a stable reference point to answer the clear question asked.

e) Other events of the day have been problematic, so the likelihood there was skulduggery here, too, is already high, even probably. Shanksville was a plane-shape (silly, from a prima facie point of view anyway). It had a small centre hole with some duty trashy bits in it. All nearby singed branches were cut off -- allowing no testing of what burned them, chemically speaking (jet fuel or other). There were no signs of jet fuel disaster or clean up from that. Not to mention, there was no major part of a plane, but for one engine in a bulldozer scoop, a smallish one, as if for a photo op. There was so little of a plane that it was remarked on by all. This prompted a claim that the plane had vanished completely into a mine shaft. If so, it must have been in quicksand, so to speak, for all parts, wing, tall tail, all engine parts, seats, people, etc. were gone (but for the one engie in the bulldozer. Yet, if such a thing were even possible -- and just for a moment let's say it were -- no efforts are on record of pulling out the major lights and rescue equipment with a massive search of this miracle mine, all night and day for days.

f) Parallax impossibilities exist in some of the WTC TV vids; this means that whatever happened in NYC, the vid content is suspect, and was pre-arranged, in large part. There are other problems (helicopters going backwards, timing issues with continuous soundtracks, etc., planes losing wings in frames -- sloppy CGI, it would seem -- etc.). But the parallax problems are a self-consistency issue: if impossible parallax exists, then no matter what happens with the rest of the case, no matter what was going on in 9/11 events in other parts of the case, the films were in part composites, scientifically absolutely, and independent of the position you take on 9/11 otherwise. ....... Yes, the events of the gov't could even be otherwise true -- let's say -- but parts of the vids remain optically constructed. Objects move in the far background without objects moving in the middle or foreground ... and vice versa. Once you get this through your senses, you then notice too that it may be they were not even done from a realistic vantage point, but in layers. The rest of the video problems are complex, but this one is simple and absolute -- unless all we know of optics is false. Since the latter is so highly unlikely as to be considered absolute, we know at least some of the "live" broadcasts were being shown from a compositry hub. What were they hiding? Pyrotechnics and plane flybys and maybe a missile painted AA?

Finally, everyone, again re. Lear: you cannot dismiss Lear as if he came to this idea as a wild notion; he came to it with serious pilot experience and back-up. It is that to which his expertise led him, not the other way around. And given the nature of relative weight of evidence, if you realize what the Citgo people mean, the gap on the tape, the extremely likely planted lampposts (which by the way would have caused the plane to careen and NOT to hit perfectly anyway, and likely to have left bits all along -- not just after the "suits" came later) ...

Then you will realize that there were no planes. None. Nada.

To comfort you: it's not just that someone dreamed up a silly notion of removing planes from 9/11. There DIDN'T HAVE TO be planes; it was easier without them (no mishaps), and cheaper. And we have evidence contrary to tendency, which shows it: evidence where people in perfect positions tell us there's no key aspect of the plane story. The others saw planes, but noticed the pyrotechnics.

Hollywood -- life and death, style.
mclarek
User ID: 986233
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06/03/2010 02:49 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
And I know I'm basically a rube, but how in the world does someone like Fetzer get a Ph.D. in the History and Philosophy of Science, become a tenured professor and wind up championing someone talking the way Clair does?

I just don't get it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 969583

Maybe you don't get the POSITION, and hence instead of seeing the weight in Fetzer's support of my position, you see him as suspect.

Turn it around.

It took him two years to emotionally face what the evidence points to: no planes. He first realized the video fakery and then realized it went beyond that. Like me, he didn't come to this position overnight.

By the way, the name's Clare -- Irish. (Claire is the French and feminine; Clair is French masculine or last name.)

Not offended. Just wanted to get that right. Made a note of it some time back for people.

Toodles.


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