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Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!

 
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:10 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
How many times have I said that Nancy's claims lie entirely in the realm of "might-be"?


And I have said so too, but not all of them are so highly so as this stoppage one.


There is NOTHING 'might-be' about that claim. It is simply absurd. It is only YOU suggesting supernatural possibilities, and demanding that WE take them seriously. It's completely laughable.


This one is. In fact, it goes beyond might be, to a possibly unprovable claim -- since Zetas are supposedly mostly fixing everything about it.


Supposedly? And we are supposed to take that seriously simply because YOU say so?
 Quoting: Menow 1003573



Oh come on, Menow. You guys are the ones who want to debunk the full claims of a seemingly silly woman -- in your view -- and her visions.

And as one of her major claims, the stoppage of the rotation is, I admit, a good one to disprove.

But, you CAN'T -- because it's not merely postulated that we've stopped, but that there's MANIPULATION so you won't KNOW!

So, part of that claim is the MANIPULATION of it all by Zetas. Thus, that is the final "unknowable" in the whole thing, and you can't logically get away from that. It is part of what you have to account for. To be scientific, you have to say:

"We are not just testing if the ordinary phenomena would be changed, but have to also recognize that part of the claim is not testable -- unless there's a deliberate mess-up by the putative Zetas."

It is PART of the claim. So, you can test all you want, but since they have postulated Zetas and manipulation by them, you can never disprove it. You could only PROVE that we've stopped -- and that's only if the Zetas let you.

It is not my postulate. It is theirs. And so it's part of what you are fighting.
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:13 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
They aren't suggesting you don't get it, they are stating a fact and have provided plenty of examples to prove you don't. Even you keep providing evidence to support that. With every depressingly stupid post, you prove just how ignorant you are. If you really were looking for truth, you would realize that there are people on this thread that know a lot more than you do, and they can help you learn with real exercises and point you in the direction of good information. But you insist on shoving youtube videos and kook conspiracy down our throats. Maybe you don't agree, but whether intentionally or not, you are behaving like a spoiled troll.


Don't get what?

Parallax on the stars having some possibility of revealing putative "mistakes" from the Zetas in hiding a putative stoppage-cum-tilt?

No I don't not get it and no they don't think it isn't so. It's clear that Menow knows it's a possibility but
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


I know WHAT?!

Maybe I didn't make myself clear... let me restate:

Fuck you.

-- like me -- he doesn't think it worthwhile.

But it would be a final test of a (probably wildly silly lie) from Nancy's visions -- even though if they're all-powerful, it would not be a totally conclusive test. It would be the final one you could do, though.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


You haven't even the slightest idea what you are talking about.
Anonymous Coward
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06/15/2010 11:17 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
The only test one needs to verify that the earth is not stopped, not wobbling wildly, and that the planets in our solar system and the stars are in their rightful place is to observe them. Period. The only test one needs to conclude that the zetas are not tilting the earth to simulate normalcy is good old common sense and an elementary school understanding of physics. Period. Clunk is a troll.
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:19 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
How many times have I said that Nancy's claims lie entirely in the realm of "might-be"?


And I have said so too, but not all of them are so highly so as this stoppage one.


There is NOTHING 'might-be' about that claim. It is simply absurd. It is only YOU suggesting supernatural possibilities, and demanding that WE take them seriously. It's completely laughable.


This one is. In fact, it goes beyond might be, to a possibly unprovable claim -- since Zetas are supposedly mostly fixing everything about it.


Supposedly? And we are supposed to take that seriously simply because YOU say so?



Oh come on, Menow. You guys are the ones who want to debunk the full claims of a seemingly silly woman -- in your view -- and her visions.

And as one of her major claims, the stoppage of the rotation is, I admit, a good one to disprove.

But, you CAN'T -- because it's not merely postulated that we've stopped, but that there's MANIPULATION so you won't KNOW!

So, part of that claim is the MANIPULATION of it all by Zetas. Thus, that is the final "unknowable" in the whole thing, and you can't logically get away from that. It is part of what you have to account for. To be scientific, you have to say:

"We are not just testing if the ordinary phenomena would be changed, but have to also recognize that part of the claim is not testable -- unless there's a deliberate mess-up by the putative Zetas."

It is PART of the claim. So, you can test all you want, but since they have postulated Zetas and manipulation by them, you can never disprove it. You could only PROVE that we've stopped -- and that's only if the Zetas let you.

It is not my postulate. It is theirs. And so it's part of what you are fighting.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


We are 'fighting' no such thing. No one is claiming to disprove magic, or God, and that is the logical refuge you have fully retreated into.

You are a brat, braying like a 12-year-old that we can't disprove your magic, or a negative. How many times do I have to say it?

You're an obtuse, argumentative, raving lunatic. I pity all those who have to live/work around you.
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:21 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
This is exactly where Maxie ended up with his 'argument'. It's the "Anything Is Possible" position...
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:21 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
"Light bending"? The only one even suggesting that is you, with your blatant handwaving to a claim you made up on the spot. The funny part is there is that since you're making claims up on the spot which themselves equate to "magic" and for which you lack any evidence whatsoever, there is ABSOLUTELY no reason to conclude that they would have "missed" parallax other than your entirely baseless and arbitrary assumption.
 Quoting: Astronut


Light-bending is the claim often repeated on Zetatalk. It is not my postulate. I am only elucidating what and what not you can test for.

They have a nearly untestable hypothesis in their claim: it is that only IF the Zetas want you to know, will you know.

So, you can prove we are stopped, IF they let you, but you cannot prove we are NOT stopped, if they don't.

That is the basic premise of this whole silly affair. And it is THEIRS. It is a conundrum, because it's a near "fairyland" postulate. But -- it is what they are saying.

And at least there's the idea built in that the Zetas have left clues. LOL! So it's not a TRULY God-hypothesis. But nearly so!

But ... it's an interesting, probably useless, but interesting question.

No, it's not an interesting question at all, it's just pointless illogical handwaving to magic. Here's the equivalent; there's an invisible ninja elf hiding in my lawn. Prove there isn't. Gee, wasn't that interesting (no)?
 Quoting: Astronut


Well, I know how you feel. I mean, I don't even deal with this claim of the Zetas -- it is handwaving from Zetas or Nancy (take your pick). But it is their claim: so, what CAN we do with it? Anything? Only wonder if there are clues the Zetas left.

*I* think it's likely pointless and silly to try, but ... to leave no stone unturned, you could watch for if there were ANYTHING out of place.

Since most things are fine in motion obviously, then either ALL IS ACTUALLY FINE (most likely so, one would think), or THE ZETAS HAVE FOOLED US ALL.

Since the Zetas are part of the proposition in the first place, the 2nd postulate is (unfortunately) a co-claimant for attention.

Thus, what can we honestly, scientifically do (if we are going to bother!): we can test the parallax on the faraway stars. The Zetas might have left a clue there; if we find a problem, then it's all up for grabs.

If we don't, then the putative Zetas remain, hypothetically, still able to fool us.

Personally, I am only laying out the FULL LOGICAL RAMIFICATIONS of a (highly likely silly) claim. But ... it is interesting that no-one's claimed they've done the only remaining test they can: the parallax on the fixed stars.

So I brought it up -- as a brain teaser. That's all.

NOT LIKELY TO BE IMPORTANT.
So ...
Don't bother, unless you ARE concerned about putative Zetas and want to rule every possibility out that you can.

(Personally, I find the other issues around PX more interesting, individually and as a group -- with or without PX to account for them.)
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:26 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
No I don't not get it and no they don't think it isn't so. It's clear that Menow knows it's a possibility but


I know WHAT?!

Maybe I didn't make myself clear... let me restate:

Fuck you.
 Quoting: Menow 1003573


I meant, Menow, that you know we haven't bothered to test the parallax.

No need to swear.

I don't mean you think there are Zetas.

-- like me -- he doesn't think it worthwhile.

But it would be a final test of a (probably wildly silly lie) from Nancy's visions -- even though if they're all-powerful, it would not be a totally conclusive test. It would be the final one you could do, though.


You haven't even the slightest idea what you are talking about.
 Quoting: Menow


Yes, I do. If there's total manipulation by God-like Zetas but they're leaving clues -- as Nancy would posit -- and this is what you want to do your best with, then you could test the parallax.

I don't suggest you bother, but it would be the last test you could do, before everything is:

a) just fine (seeming)
b) not fine

And note, even a) doesn't cover Nancy's claim fully: since it is a tautology, whereby it only means (to her, etc.) that the Zetas did a great job fooling us with light bending.

You really can't win this with them. They have set up a tautology ... or almost. I mean, b) would prove something is off ... but also proves all the rest was manipulated.

HA HA HA.

Anyway, it's most likely it's all fine and normal and no Zetas are tipping the Earth and we're not stopped and fooled.

Of course.
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:30 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
"Light bending"? The only one even suggesting that is you, with your blatant handwaving to a claim you made up on the spot. The funny part is there is that since you're making claims up on the spot which themselves equate to "magic" and for which you lack any evidence whatsoever, there is ABSOLUTELY no reason to conclude that they would have "missed" parallax other than your entirely baseless and arbitrary assumption.

Light-bending is the claim often repeated on Zetatalk. It is not my postulate. I am only elucidating what and what not you can test for.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


As if WE don't know that??

Idiot.

I postulate that YOU don't exist. Prove me wrong.
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:31 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
The only test one needs to verify that the earth is not stopped, not wobbling wildly, and that the planets in our solar system and the stars are in their rightful place is to observe them. Period. The only test one needs to conclude that the zetas are not tilting the earth to simulate normalcy is good old common sense and an elementary school understanding of physics. Period. Clunk is a troll.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 908953


No, PURELY scientific treatment of this handles the FULL claim. The FULL claim by Nancy is that there are near-perfect Zetas FOOLING us.

Therefore, finding all normal does not in fact disprove her main claim.

It is UNDISPROVABLE. It is like a God-hypothesis in that sense. A tautology.

But ... if real Zetas are leaving clues, it is PROVABLE. (Highly unlikely, to say the least.) So it's not a purely God-hypothesis untestable PROVABLE thing if "they" leave us clues.

That's how the reasoning works. But it's likely pointless to bother with anyway, because a priori, likely the Zetas are not real OR are real but not messing with a stopped Earth and all other testable aspects of one.

So I suggest you not bother with the claim at all!
Me, I don't. But if I were going to, it's true I'd have to test everything to see if there were "any clue" of the Zeta manipulation. If not, they still hypothetically could be doing it! If so, we're doomed but we proved Zeta manipulation. HA HA HA HA HA
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:32 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
If

















Of course.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


You are a waste of my time, and I have a CNC machine to work on.
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:36 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I don't notice WHAT other aspects of the claims? Please be SPECIFIC!

Well, if Zetas are lying about our being stopped, there is still the probable 2nd magnetic field operating on the Earth to create repulsion with the Sun's attraction.
Quoting: mclarek 1004307


The "Zeta" claim is that the repulsion force rises to equal the force of gravity at the point of contact between large bodies like PX and the Sun. So, Clare, how does that keep PX allegedly hovering near the Sun for 7 years and slow PX from near lightspeed as it allegeldy careened toward the Sun?

 Quoting: Menow 1003573


Note: No response to this REAL point while Clare wallows in arguments she claims NOT to care about. How droll.
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:36 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
This is exactly where Maxie ended up with his 'argument'. It's the "Anything Is Possible" position...
 Quoting: Menow 1003573



Well, I don't believe it.
But hypothetically reasoned out, a tautology leaves you with an unprovable variable.

In that sense, absolute rigour must acknowledge that you don't know yet, but reason has done its best, and prima facie, the claim is unlikely to be true.

So, it's not a wishy-washy version of "anything IS possible" but rather, we can't test for an untestable postulate.

We can test for a testable postulate: which is that Zetas (in the claim) might leave a clue. If "they do", we'll know. If not then:

a) all is normal in fact.
b) we were unable to test find (test) the existence of perfect fakery by Zetas.

Get it?

This is why I never thought it was true in the first place.
But ... this is where it comes down to: do all tests (if you want) and all you've proved is things SEEM normal.

HA HA HA! I find these logical conundra rather funny. I mean, the claim sounds silly to start, but working out with absolute constrained logic, what situation we're in with a given postulate, is good brain candy, n'est-ce pas? :)
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:39 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
"Light bending"? The only one even suggesting that is you, with your blatant handwaving to a claim you made up on the spot. The funny part is there is that since you're making claims up on the spot which themselves equate to "magic" and for which you lack any evidence whatsoever, there is ABSOLUTELY no reason to conclude that they would have "missed" parallax other than your entirely baseless and arbitrary assumption.

Light-bending is the claim often repeated on Zetatalk. It is not my postulate. I am only elucidating what and what not you can test for.


As if WE don't know that??

Idiot.

I postulate that YOU don't exist. Prove me wrong.
 Quoting: Menow 1003573



Talk to Astronut. HE is the one who didn't get that light bending wasn't my postulate!

redface

As to the postulate that I don't exist at all: yes, it's the same thing and it's why I said I don't DEAL with this issue from Nancy.

However, you could do your best to prove that ALL "seems" normal (by looking at parallax as the last place the Zetas might hide clues). But then, a) you'd likely find all looks fine and b) Nancy/Zetas could still say the Zetas didn't leave you any clues.

tomato
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:39 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
This is exactly where Maxie ended up with his 'argument'. It's the "Anything Is Possible" position...



Well, I don't believe it.
But hypothetically reasoned out, a tautology leaves you with an unprovable variable.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


To WHOM do you think you are 'explaining' that, exactly?
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:41 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
"Light bending"? The only one even suggesting that is you, with your blatant handwaving to a claim you made up on the spot. The funny part is there is that since you're making claims up on the spot which themselves equate to "magic" and for which you lack any evidence whatsoever, there is ABSOLUTELY no reason to conclude that they would have "missed" parallax other than your entirely baseless and arbitrary assumption.

Light-bending is the claim often repeated on Zetatalk. It is not my postulate. I am only elucidating what and what not you can test for.


As if WE don't know that??

Idiot.

I postulate that YOU don't exist. Prove me wrong.



Talk to Astronut. HE is the one who didn't get that light bending wasn't my postulate!
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


You don't really know the "Zeta" claims at all. The original 'light-bending' claim was nothing like what you are citing.
Menow
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06/15/2010 11:44 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
We can test for a testable postulate: which is that Zetas (in the claim) might leave a clue. If "they do", we'll know. If not then:

a) all is normal in fact.
b) we were unable to test find (test) the existence of perfect fakery by Zetas.

Get it?

 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


What on EARTH makes you think nobody GETS that but you?
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:44 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
It is not my postulate. It is theirs. And so it's part of what you are fighting.



We are 'fighting' no such thing. No one is claiming to disprove magic, or God, and that is the logical refuge you have fully retreated into.

You are a brat, braying like a 12-year-old that we can't disprove your magic, or a negative. How many times do I have to say it?

You're an obtuse, argumentative, raving lunatic. I pity all those who have to live/work around you.
 Quoting: Menow 1003573



Hey, I never wanted to discuss this. It was you guys who wanted to -- and didn't understand that just proving all's normal doesn't disprove their root postulate: you are dealing with an unprovable postulate (at root), unless "they leave clues" and the only clue area left would be parallax.

I have no real interest in this side of the matter and have only been obliging you (and defending the rigour of reason here, as to what you can and can't do in the face of the tautological claim of Nancy/Zetas).

You have been dragging this out. It is the postulate by Nancy that's the problem, not me.

And it is HER postulates you are fighting. So, you are fighting what is, logically, only PROVABLE if the "Zetas let you see it" and not DISPROVABLE, because all of your tests are of PHENOMENA not ZETAS. So don't blame me here. It's Nancy's claim that's weird.

wtf
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:52 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I don't notice WHAT other aspects of the claims? Please be SPECIFIC!

Well, if Zetas are lying about our being stopped, there is still the probable 2nd magnetic field operating on the Earth to create repulsion with the Sun's attraction.
Quoting: mclarek 1004307


The "Zeta" claim is that the repulsion force rises to equal the force of gravity at the point of contact between large bodies like PX and the Sun. So, Clare, how does that keep PX allegedly hovering near the Sun for 7 years and slow PX from near lightspeed as it allegeldy careened toward the Sun?



Note: No response to this REAL point while Clare wallows in arguments she claims NOT to care about. How droll.
 Quoting: Menow 1003573


Now you are CHANGING THE TOPIC.

Which is fine by me, but that's what you're doing.

THE OTHER ONE ISN'T EVER PROVEN OR DISPROVEN, because of the putative Zeta manipulation -- unless the putative "they" want you to know.


..........................

So far as I know, this other claim you mention (above) is some efect of:

a) electromagnetics (mostly unaccounted for a separate effect on -- charge in -- our solar system).
b) un-as-yet testable dynamics from other dimensions, creating the gravity and electromagnetic effects here.

#1 could maybe be worked out.
#2 is another AS-YET un-provable postulate.

In toto, however, I wouldn't presume to answer that myself. Would you?

I assume it may not be here and all this is bunk -- but it is, again, technically an unknown possible -- meaning, we don't know if it's actually possible, but it's an hypothetical maybe, and untestable at the present time.

(However, it is probably more testable in the long run, than Zeta manipulation of all light reaching a stopped but manipulated-tilt Earth).
Anonymous Coward
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06/15/2010 11:54 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
It is not my postulate. It is theirs. And so it's part of what you are fighting.



We are 'fighting' no such thing. No one is claiming to disprove magic, or God, and that is the logical refuge you have fully retreated into.

You are a brat, braying like a 12-year-old that we can't disprove your magic, or a negative. How many times do I have to say it?

You're an obtuse, argumentative, raving lunatic. I pity all those who have to live/work around you.



Hey, I never wanted to discuss this. It was you guys who wanted to -- and didn't understand that just proving all's normal doesn't disprove their root postulate: you are dealing with an unprovable postulate (at root), unless "they leave clues" and the only clue area left would be parallax.

I have no real interest in this side of the matter and have only been obliging you (and defending the rigour of reason here, as to what you can and can't do in the face of the tautological claim of Nancy/Zetas).

You have been dragging this out. It is the postulate by Nancy that's the problem, not me.

And it is HER postulates you are fighting. So, you are fighting what is, logically, only PROVABLE if the "Zetas let you see it" and not DISPROVABLE, because all of your tests are of PHENOMENA not ZETAS. So don't blame me here. It's Nancy's claim that's weird.

wtf
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307

You are the one that keeps discussing it! Fuck. Let's ask and see how many people here want to discuss it with you - raise your hands. Now everyone that wishes clunkspam would just fuck off to her own thread and leave this one alone, raise your hand. You said you wouldn't reply if we called you clunk. Another lie. Trolling twat that you are!
mclarek
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06/15/2010 11:58 PM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
We can test for a testable postulate: which is that Zetas (in the claim) might leave a clue. If "they do", we'll know. If not then:

a) all is normal in fact.
b) we were unable to test find (test) the existence of perfect fakery by Zetas.

Get it?



What on EARTH makes you think nobody GETS that but you?
 Quoting: Menow 1003573



First, you and others keep saying, "there's no proof of it" as though the claim involved a mere stopped Earth, with no magical element -- deception.

Second, you dragged out the issue.

Third, you didn't want to hear that your claims can only PROVE Zeta clues, and not even that if "they" don't leave any; and you cannot DISPROVE the statement no matter what you do.

You can disprove the Moon and Sun stuff -- but only that they SEEM out of place. Her main claim cannot be disproven: that things are off and the Zetas hide it. Heck, the Zetas could be lying to her and the Moon isn't the clue; the stars are!

At least I thought of some testable phenomenon (parallax) which you haven't tested yet. That's all I was saying.

But it's a silly pursuit, I hazard to guess -- and as you think, too! :)
mclarek
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06/16/2010 12:08 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
You are the one that keeps discussing it! Fuck. Let's ask and see how many people here want to discuss it with you - raise your hands. Now everyone that wishes clunkspam would just fuck off to her own thread and leave this one alone, raise your hand. You said you wouldn't reply if we called you clunk. Another lie. Trolling twat that you are!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 908953



Enough.

Any time I raised it it was as a brain teaser. I raised it for fun and in total constrained scientific logic: of what you can and can't know -- but how useless it would likely be.

These others have been so fascinated with it and with saying "we know" what's out there that they never admit the tautological aspect of the proposition in detailed terms: what is and what is not knowable, and under what conditions.

I have done so and it confused them as to why. They even thought I bought the fairy-land aspect of it. I clearly don't. But with total rigour I laid out what the situation entails.

And in their miffed ego way (which I'm getting used to -- sigh) they kept saying there was:

a) no reason to bring up parallax (though it's the only phenomenon they haven't tested yet)
b) magic can't exist (when in truth, it's merely untestable unless the magician lets you in on the secret in this case, so to speak)
c) some wish of mine to discuss it (when I am merely laying it out and wanted to be done with it, which is why I kept saying, "It's not likely to be worth it, so I wouldn't bother")

What you seem to think is that I discuss such silly side-lines as because they're true. NO. I discuss them AS THOUGH they're true, so that we can find out what we CAN AND CANNOT DO to find out if they're true.

It was others who wouldn't understand that who went off onto tangents about what is parallax, or my character, or other people who believe anything "IS" possible.

Instead, not anything IS possible, but anything can be considered HYPOTHETICALLY possible until it's testably not so or not likely. That's all.

I am merely intellectually curious about it all. I do not have an axe to grind about some of Nancy's claims, such as this one. So many of you assume that to have something to say on an issue, one's whole belief system must be wrapped up in it. No. I am merely laying out the reasoning around a near-tautology.

However ...

I DO wonder about our magnetosphere's holes of repulsion while the Sun was attracting us, though! Mighty odd. PX or not!

Finito.
Menow
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
It is not my postulate. It is theirs. And so it's part of what you are fighting.



We are 'fighting' no such thing. No one is claiming to disprove magic, or God, and that is the logical refuge you have fully retreated into.

You are a brat, braying like a 12-year-old that we can't disprove your magic, or a negative. How many times do I have to say it?

You're an obtuse, argumentative, raving lunatic. I pity all those who have to live/work around you.



Hey, I never wanted to discuss this. It was you guys who wanted to

 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


You are quite simply out of your mind.
Menow
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06/16/2010 12:22 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I don't notice WHAT other aspects of the claims? Please be SPECIFIC!

Well, if Zetas are lying about our being stopped, there is still the probable 2nd magnetic field operating on the Earth to create repulsion with the Sun's attraction.
Quoting: mclarek 1004307



The "Zeta" claim is that the repulsion force rises to equal the force of gravity at the point of contact between large bodies like PX and the Sun. So, Clare, how does that keep PX allegedly hovering near the Sun for 7 years and slow PX from near lightspeed as it allegeldy careened toward the Sun?



Note: No response to this REAL point while Clare wallows in arguments she claims NOT to care about. How droll.


Now you are CHANGING THE TOPIC.

Which is fine by me, but that's what you're doing.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


Do you see where I'm quoting YOU, and responding to YOU? I put it in italics now, just for you.
Menow
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06/16/2010 12:24 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I don't notice WHAT other aspects of the claims? Please be SPECIFIC!

Well, if Zetas are lying about our being stopped, there is still the probable 2nd magnetic field operating on the Earth to create repulsion with the Sun's attraction.
Quoting: mclarek 1004307


The "Zeta" claim is that the repulsion force rises to equal the force of gravity at the point of contact between large bodies like PX and the Sun. So, Clare, how does that keep PX allegedly hovering near the Sun for 7 years and slow PX from near lightspeed as it allegeldy careened toward the Sun?



Note: No response to this REAL point while Clare wallows in arguments she claims NOT to care about. How droll.


Now you are CHANGING THE TOPIC.

Which is fine by me, but that's what you're doing.

THE OTHER ONE ISN'T EVER PROVEN OR DISPROVEN, because of the putative Zeta manipulation -- unless the putative "they" want you to know.


..........................

So far as I know, this other claim you mention (above) is some efect of:

a) electromagnetics (mostly unaccounted for a separate effect on -- charge in -- our solar system).
b) un-as-yet testable dynamics from other dimensions, creating the gravity and electromagnetic effects here.

#1 could maybe be worked out.
#2 is another AS-YET un-provable postulate.

In toto, however, I wouldn't presume to answer that myself. Would you?

I assume it may not be here and all this is bunk -- but it is, again, technically an unknown possible -- meaning, we don't know if it's actually possible, but it's an hypothetical maybe, and untestable at the present time.

(However, it is probably more testable in the long run, than Zeta manipulation of all light reaching a stopped but manipulated-tilt Earth).
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


Did you read what I said, at ALL? Hint: It's in bold.
Menow
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06/16/2010 12:27 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
We can test for a testable postulate: which is that Zetas (in the claim) might leave a clue. If "they do", we'll know. If not then:

a) all is normal in fact.
b) we were unable to test find (test) the existence of perfect fakery by Zetas.

Get it?



What on EARTH makes you think nobody GETS that but you?



First, you and others keep saying, "there's no proof of it" as though the claim involved a mere stopped Earth, with no magical element -- deception.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


You mean that Nancy inserted 'magic' into her claims so that no on could be *sure* she was wrong. Cute! Problem is, I KNOW Nancy has told obvious falsehoods to numerous to count, over the years. Now you want me/us to take THIS wild claim of hers seriously? Just because she has the temerity to SAY it????

Surely you jest. NO... I suspect you're serious.
Menow
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06/16/2010 12:31 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
At least I thought of some testable phenomenon (parallax) which you haven't tested yet. That's all I was saying.

But it's a silly pursuit, I hazard to guess -- and as you think, too! :)

 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


You, on your own, by your widdle self, have just decided that no astronomers on the planet have done experiments involving the parallax of distant stars in the last 7 years?

Really??
mclarek
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06/16/2010 12:35 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
Menow: The "Zeta" claim is that the repulsion force rises to equal the force of gravity at the point of contact between large bodies like PX and the Sun. So, Clare, how does that keep PX allegedly hovering near the Sun for 7 years and slow PX from near lightspeed as it allegeldy careened toward the Sun?


..........................

mclarek: So far as I know, this other claim you mention (above) is some effect of:

a) electromagnetics (mostly unaccounted for a separate effect on -- charge in -- our solar system).
b) un-as-yet testable dynamics from other dimensions, creating the gravity and electromagnetic effects here.

#1 could maybe be worked out.
#2 is another AS-YET un-provable postulate.

In toto, however, I wouldn't presume to answer that myself. Would you?



Menow: Did you read what I said, at ALL? Hint: It's in bold.
 Quoting: Menow 1003573


Yes. I read it. Hint: My reply is in bracketed alphanumeric order and subsequent statements. That's all I have to say on it.

Do you have anything to contribute to the issue? Do regale us with your thoughts on the "matter." (Pun intended.)

By the way, I never heard it was at near light speed on its putative way in. Where did you hear that?

And I have a question for YOU, Menow, on a change of subject (or rather a meta-subject): are you ever NICE when you discuss issues of PX? LOL!
Anonymous Coward
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06/16/2010 12:39 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
And I have a question for Clunk. Do you ever shut the fuck up?
Menow
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06/16/2010 12:42 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
You are the one that keeps discussing it! Fuck. Let's ask and see how many people here want to discuss it with you - raise your hands. Now everyone that wishes clunkspam would just fuck off to her own thread and leave this one alone, raise your hand. You said you wouldn't reply if we called you clunk. Another lie. Trolling twat that you are!



Enough.

Any time I raised it it was as a brain teaser. I raised it for fun and in total constrained scientific logic: of what you can and can't know -- but how useless it would likely be.

These others have been so fascinated with it and with saying "we know" what's out there that they never admit the tautological aspect of the proposition in detailed terms: what is and what is not knowable, and under what conditions.

I have done so and it confused them as to why. They even thought I bought the fairy-land aspect of it. I clearly don't. But with total rigour I laid out what the situation entails.

And in their miffed ego way (which I'm getting used to -- sigh) they kept saying there was:

a) no reason to bring up parallax (though it's the only phenomenon they haven't tested yet)
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


No, you brought up parallax as a proof for Earth-tilt when it has no bearing.

b) magic can't exist (when in truth, it's merely untestable unless the magician lets you in on the secret in this case, so to speak)
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


Lie.

c) some wish of mine to discuss it (when I am merely laying it out and wanted to be done with it, which is why I kept saying, "It's not likely to be worth it, so I wouldn't bother")
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


Bullshit. You simply wouldn't accept that no one gives a fuck about it but you.

What you seem to think is that I discuss such silly side-lines as because they're true. NO. I discuss them AS THOUGH they're true, so that we can find out what we CAN AND CANNOT DO to find out if they're true.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


Needless condescending crapola.

It was others who wouldn't understand that who went off onto tangents about what is parallax, or my character, or other people who believe anything "IS" possible.

Instead, not anything IS possible, but anything can be considered HYPOTHETICALLY possible until it's testably not so or not likely. That's all.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


And you have the insufferably huge ego to believe that nobody but YOU understands that concept.

I am merely intellectually curious about it all. I do not have an axe to grind about some of Nancy's claims, such as this one. So many of you assume that to have something to say on an issue, one's whole belief system must be wrapped up in it. No. I am merely laying out the reasoning around a near-tautology.

However ...

I DO wonder about our magnetosphere's holes of repulsion while the Sun was attracting us, though! Mighty odd. PX or not!

Finito.
 Quoting: mclarek 1004307


Would that it were so...
mclarek
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06/16/2010 12:43 AM
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Re: Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!
I don't notice WHAT other aspects of the claims? Please be SPECIFIC!

Well, if Zetas are lying about our being stopped, there is still the probable 2nd magnetic field operating on the Earth to create repulsion with the Sun's attraction.
Quoting: mclarek 1004307



The "Zeta" claim is that the repulsion force rises to equal the force of gravity at the point of contact between large bodies like PX and the Sun. So, Clare, how does that keep PX allegedly hovering near the Sun for 7 years and slow PX from near lightspeed as it allegeldy careened toward the Sun?



Do you see where I'm quoting YOU, and responding to YOU? I put it in italics now, just for you.
 Quoting: Menow 1003573


I see. So you think I was raising it for discussion. I wasn't at the time.


I was bringing it up as a side-thought to the interminable issue of the un-provable stoppage of the Earth -- given that that was not merely postulated but that Zeta manipulation was part of the claim to start with.

But anyway, I know there must be more to electromagnetism than is mentioned/ directly accounted for in the solar system. That's why I mentioned it might have some effect on a putative PX's movements around the Sun.

But maybe there are other aspects of planetary action which are obscured in our ordinar experience, that is, our equations hide them, and the implications are not clear until a special circumstance brings them to our attention, or someone fills in the full ramifications from e-m ... for e-m on metal always induces CHARGE.

Given that, and the changing face of research into gravity and e-m connections in some quarters of the scientific community, who am I to say the Zetas might not be right about this one? I simply don't know.

I do know, though, that e-m might very well be part of a repulsive effect if there were a PX with a metallic core composition, like the Earth.

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