Debunker Talk LIVE Chat 24/7 - A debunker's paradise!!

Been there, tried that... 20 times is enough.

Everyone has tried to get Freaky to see basic common sense about his Px issues to no avail, I gave up replying to his posts last year, in my opinion he likely gave money to Nancy and is (and has been) hoping Nancy has booked him a place on her delusional "mothership".

Which will be denied from the bunkers even past 2013.

btw,

Nancy ace will tell rueful of being historic as moon renders or receiver traces almighty popcorn trips monday night to Zetamax Mercury swing repulsions
#-------------------------------
And WHOEVER solves this, he may NOT publish the solution, but just tell he got it, and may supply a secret proof by coding something the same way.
55 days ZT not solved
0 debunker solvers accepted
#-------------------------------
Hints will be provided every 25 days
Hint No. 1: The riddle CAN be solved, and you WILL know if your solution is right. (everybody doing it can be proud)
Hint No. 2: Where did the riddle appear first? (everybody doing it should be proud)
(from now on, every answer cannot be assumed to be sourcing from "Zetas")

Maxipads

In Aussie we have Eucalyptus oil, great stuff to counter bad smells.

Oops! typo!

Last Edited by Prof_Rabbit on 06/17/2009 09:57 AM

From the archives.




"I don't regret what I've done in other words and I don't blame anybody. I, I take responsibility for what I've done."
Nancy Lieder

From the Lou Gentile show 6th June, 2003

Lou:

Ladies and gentlemen, Nancy Lieder, hello dear.

----8< snip -------

Lou:

What was your first reaction with this?

Nancy:

I went for a long hike, ha. I went hiking some place it was going to take me several hours to get back and I was going to be in a state of exhaustion and then I sat in the basement for a while, ha, ha, ha, and by that time I understood what had happened and why. And then I finally got an e-mail, I was off e-mail for several day's, you know, most of the week. Then I had my set answer and I just did as they said, bla date and what about I did a copy-paste-send, ho, ho, ho, to I don't know thousands of e-mails. That was my reaction. You know, what else could I do?

Lou:

Well, ea, em, ha.....

Nancy:

And then it got to be the 26th.....

----8< snip----

Lou:

That's all fine and dandy, but the problem is Nancy now that the, the Zetas have lied don't you think that people are going to more apt now to really come after you if you're wrong again?

Nancy:

You think this was about making Nancy comfortable ever, ever? I have no money, you know, I'm, I've been, ahh... a target like you would not believe since 1995, you know, and, and ah.. in way's that I couldn't even describe here on the air. So do you think the fact that people might roar toward me and do their damnest is bothering me. I know that I'm getting an important message out, and I have great confidence that this is still coming because I'm looking at the quake statistics, I'm looking at the photographs, I'm looking at the Earth changes and I'm watching the way the government reacted and I have no change of opinion. I know I was used to put a false statement out there, I understand the reason and I agree with it. So am I worried that Nancy's going to be beat-up. Nancy has been beat-up. Nancy is nothing but a punching bag, never has been anything but that by the general public.

------8< snip ----

Lou:

Well, look Nancy, you know, this, this is something that a lot of people, you know, believe with what you were saying and what the Zetas were saying, although the one thing, and I've said it many times before, that, you know, just really.. I can't understand is why people.. or why can't give people some kind of evidence that these Zetas are real.

Nancy:

Oh, I have something ermm... there was something that, not that I took it, but recently there... and some guy actually took erm... a video of it and I think we have more than one of the Sun, there's a, a brown er.. round circle in the middle of the Sun, or a series of them in a line, in front of the Sun and people have commented about this, they've seen it, they've taken pictures and I actually have a picture on my website of erm.. something I got from another website, anyway what can that be if its not on the SOHO, its not a piece of dirt on the lens, its a MOTHERSHIP. And I'm, I'm saying to you that if people want evidence that aliens exist its all around you.

More funny material. (Same show June 2003)

quote
Lou:

See I'm, I, I, it's like I'm channelling or something, I don't know. All right, let's go to er... to another one. Errrrrr.... let's see this is one is from Danish Wick, it says ask her why the Zetas told her people to kill their pets if this is the only "white lie?" and er... and that's it.

Nancy:

They didn't tell people to kill their pets. They, uhhhh... answered a question and it was in regards to what I do to my little "fluffy," you know, what, what do you suggest to do with pets. Like for instance they've gotten questions about domestic animals during the hours of rotation stoppage and they, the advice was if you keep them in the barn they're going to throw themselves against the doors and the walls and hurt themselves and break a leg and you'll have to put them down. Let them loose to run in the fields, because they'll run themselves into exhaustion and after the pole shift is over they'll more likely be OK. If you keep them in the barn they'll thrash around out of, because get frantic when there' moaning ahead of an earthquake. So with pets they said that consider that your neighbour's children are going to be starving and, and er... what you going to feed your pet if your neighbours children are starving. So, uhmmm.... if, if a person's in a situation not being able to feed their pets uhhhh.... we, we recommend euphonising it, but only when you're darn sure that, that this is the step to take in other words don't rush out and do it now, wait until you see, to your satisfaction, evidence that a pole shift is, I mean if the world stops rotating for a few days. Hey that red... green light has gone off, you know that red light is blinking whatever, how you want to call it. So, they didn't say go kill pets, they were asked a question to do with "fluffy" and they responded with an honest, practical answer. Like what you do about drinking water? Distil it, cause' it gets rid of lead and pollutants. That kind of a practical answer and it's become Nancy Lieder the puppy killer all over the place.
end quote

And one more from the same show, remember this is June 2003.

quote
Lou:

OK, errr... let's see...... (long pause) Ok this is er... Gary Tuck wants to know if erm... if Planet X is going to happen at least within a year?

Nancy:

Oh its a heck of a sooner than that and I'll give you a specific uhmm... since May 26th when we've been watching the live siesmo we noticed something odd about the south pole having this slow wave going on. I wouldn't call it, quakes up and down, sharp lines, this was a slow wave and, and ahh.. it switched at a certain point got very calm then both of the north and south poles we're wobbling like that, but the rest of the world was not and I asked the Zetas what that was and they called it "magma surging" and they described three steps that would happen. One would be that they said that Planet X is rising to the ecliptic and its, its magnetic particles are flowing from its north pole into the Earth south pole causing, you know, lob-sided accumulation of something, so the south pole only wobbled. Then it moved up to counter, er.... the flow on the side towards the Sun, so that uhmmm... both the north and south, and this is diagrammed on my website. The third step was that this material that was causing the poles to bobble would escape and flow around freely and then attach to the Atlantic rift which would be cause, created more of a magnet. That in fact happened yesterday and today, we are, I'm just tracking that. Now this tells me that' s step 1, 2, 3, and we're at step three so its around the corner. I'm not giving a date, but I'm telling you I am personally braced for this to happen anyday. The, the rotation stoppage.

end quote

How can you read this thread and not say " Zetas right again, 43% go insane."

Geez, I can't even really understand what the heck she's saying. I did notice she likes to refer to herself in the third person.

Nancy's delusional zetas have yet to get one right..

So does Melfy, remember this...

quote

The human posting as ***ZetaMax*** was on the 31st Floor of Tower One of the World Trade Center on September 11, 2001.
end quote

I disagree. In other parts of the country, temperatures are average or above normal. For the "Zetas" to be correct, more than a handful of locations would need to be experiencing cooler temperatures. And, since it is known the planet is getting warmer, shouldn't it be summer blending into winter...instead of the other way around? In addition, considering that Earth has been "halted in orbit and pushed back into an August position", that means more sunlight is hitting the northern hemisphere, which would also increase heating.

Based on that information, it looks more and more like:

Never in the History of meteorlogical record keeping?

[link to www.isws.illinois.edu]

From the 1900-1950, I see a couple Above 80degree temps from jun into the july time frame. Granted this information is on Freeport. However, it's "northern Illinois" none the less.

Last Edited by Mysterysoul on 06/17/2009 12:21 PM

He said is has not been above 80 yet.

you're right, I mis-read the "hasn't" part.

Although still seems relatively consistent.

How are local temperatures affected by an invisible planet?

I mean, WHY would a new planet in the solar system cause temperatures to change? Temperatures don't change when Mars or Venus is closer/further in distance to Earth.

So why should PX, assuming it existed?

I don't see weather phenomena at ALL being positive evidence for PX... particularly as traditional science predicted such changes for decades, and an invisible planet seems unnecessary to cause it...

You forget the magical nature of Planet X. It causes select poorly maintained bridges to collapse, power failures, plane crashes, earthquakes, sinkholes, thunderstorms, tornados, dambursts, floods, droughts, paranoia, crop failures, crop circles, gas leaks, explosions, forest fires, ice shelf melting and everything else you can think of. At least, this is what Nancy says, so it must be true.

It could be worse - they could have said 44%.

Plot summary for
The Man from Planet X (1951)

To study a rogue planet heading for a near-miss with Earth, Prof. Elliot sets up an observatory on the foggy moors of a remote Scottish island, with his pretty daughter and Dr. Mears, a former student with a shady past. Soon after arrival of reporter John Lawrence, a ship from Planet X just happens to land near the observatory. Is the visitor (who actually looks alien) benevolent? What are Mears' real motives for trying to communicate with it? Written by Rod Crawford {[email protected]}

A New York City newspaper reporter flies to a remote island off Scotland, on an invitation from a scientist who is a long-time friend, to cover the news of the approach to earth of a previously-unknown planet, which the scientist has called Planet X. While awaiting the calculated date of it closest approach to Earth, they discover a torpedo-shaped craft in which an agent of Planet X, peacefully disposed, has landed to make preparations for further landings of X-people when the planet reaches its closest proximity to Earth. The scientist's assistant crosses up the friendly visitor, who depends on a tank of X-atmosphere for survival. The Man from Planet X, using a mesmeric ray, captures the scientist, his daughter, the assistant and several townspeople. The reporter calls Scotland Yard. Sherrill Corwin, a distributor, gave this film a test-run at the San Francisco Paramount on March 9, 1951 (after screening it in Hollywood for the trade-paper reviewers on March 8) before buying the distribution rights from Aubrey Wisberg and Jack Pollexfen's Mid-Century Pictures production company. Written by Les Adams {[email protected]}

The above sound familiar? Well merge it with this and I think we will see where Nancy's Zetas really come from:
[link to skeptoid.com]

It was shortly before midnight on September 19, 1961 when Betty and Barney Hill had the experience which was to shape all of modern alien folklore. They were driving from Canada to Portsmouth, New Hampshire. Near the resort of Indian Head, New Hampshire, they stopped their car in the middle of Route 3 to observe a strange light moving through in the sky. The next thing they knew, they were about 35 miles further along on their trip, and several hours had elapsed.

Betty telephoned their close friend, Major Paul Henderson at nearby Pease Air Force Base, to report a UFO sighting. Major Henderson found that this was corroborated by two separate UFO reports from radar data from two different Air Force installations nearby. All three reports are officially recorded in Project Blue Book. Then Betty began having nightmares two weeks later. In her nightmares, she described being taken aboard an alien spacecraft and having medical experiments performed. As a result of these nightmares, Betty and Barney decided to undergo hypnosis. In separate sessions, they described nearly identical experiences of being taken on board the alien spacecraft by what we now call gray aliens: Short beings with huge black eyes and smooth gray skin. Both of the Hills had a whole spectrum of tests done. Betty was shown a star map which she was able to memorize and reproduce later, and which has been identified as showing Zeta Reticuli as the aliens' home planet. After the experiments they were taken back to their car in a dazed condition, and sent along their way.

Innumerable books and movies were made about the Betty & Barney Hill abduction. It was the introduction of the gray alien into popular culture. It was also the beginning of the entire "alien abduction" phenomenon. The physical evidence of the star map and the radar reports are said to have both withstood all scrutiny. In fact you almost never hear a critical treatment of their story.

Much of the Hill story is said to be based on these separate hypnosis sessions. In fact, that turns out not to be the case at all. It's important to note that it was more than two years after the incident that the Hills underwent hypnosis. During those two years, Betty was writing and rewriting her accounts of her dreams. All of the significant details you may have heard about the Hills' medical experiments came from Betty's two years of writings: A long needle inserted into her navel; the star map; the aliens' fascination with Barney's dentures; the examination of both Betty and Barney's genitals; and the overall chronology of the episode, including being met on the ground by the aliens, a leader coming forward and escorting them to exam rooms, the aliens' general demeanor and individual personalities, and the way they spoke to Betty in English but to Barney via telepathy. Betty wrote all of this based only on what she claims were her dreams, and probably told the story to Barney over and over again until his ears fell off over a period of two years, before they ever had any hypnosis.

During those two years, Barney's own recollection was somewhat less dramatic. When they first saw the light in the sky, Betty said she thought it was a spacecraft, but Barney always said he thought it was an airplane.

Betty's written description of the characters in her nightmare depicted short guys with black hair and "Jimmy Durante" noses. It was only in Barney Hill's hypnosis sessions that we got the first description of skinny figures with gray skin, large bald heads, and huge black eyes. After Betty Hill heard these sessions, suddenly her own hypnosis accounts began to describe the same type of character, and from that moment on, she never again mentioned her original Jimmy Durante guys. Many modern accounts wrongly state that her original nightmares also described grays.

Although the popular version of events is that Barney Hill's hypnosis description is the first appearance of a so-called gray alien in modern culture, that first appearance actually came twelve days earlier, on national television, in an episode of The Outer Limits called The Bellero Shield. The alien in that episode shared most of the significant physical characteristics with the alien in Barney's story: Bald head, gray skin, big wraparound eyes. The Hills stated they did not watch it and didn't know about it.

Remember: Before examining the specific claims made in a fantastic story, you should check the source of the story for credibility. Barney Hill died only a few years after the alleged incident, but Betty Hill stuck around long enough for her credibility to be pretty thoroughly demonstrated. Skeptical Inquirer columnist Robert Shaeffer wrote:

I was present at the National UFO Conference in New York City in 1980, at which Betty presented some of the UFO photos she had taken. She showed what must have been well over two hundred slides, mostly of blips, blurs, and blobs against a dark background. These were supposed to be UFOs coming in close, chasing her car, landing, etc... After her talk had exceeded about twice its allotted time, Betty was literally jeered off the stage by what had been at first a very sympathetic audience. This incident, witnessed by many of UFOlogy's leaders and top activists, removed any lingering doubts about Betty's credibility — she had none. In the oft-repeated words of one UFOlogist who accompanied Betty on a UFO vigil in 1977, she was "unable to distinguish between a landed UFO and a streetlight." In 1995, Betty Hill wrote a self-published book, A Common Sense Approach to UFOs. It is filled with obviously delusional stories, such as seeing entire squadrons of UFOs in flight and a truck levitating above the freeway.

She also once wrote in a 1966 letter "Barney and I go out frequently at night for one reason or another. Since last October, we have seen our 'friends' on the average of eight or nine times out of every ten trips." But is it possible that Betty's obsession with UFOs could have been caused by her trauma from a genuine abduction? Yes, it's possible that it could have pushed her further in that direction, but Betty had commonly spoken of UFOs even before 1961, including one story she often told of her sister's own close encounter in 1957.

So here's what we have so far: A woman who clearly had an obsession with UFOs saw a light in the sky that her husband described as an airplane. She then spent two years writing an elaborate story and no doubt telling and retelling it to her husband. Later, under hypnosis, Barney was asked about the events described in Betty's story, and surprise surprise, he retold the story she'd already told him a hundred times, with an added dash from The Outer Limits episode of twelve days before. So far, we have a tale that's hard to consider reliable.

But then there are those three items said to be physical evidence of the Hill abduction: first, the star map hand drawn by Betty by memory from one shown to her aboard the spacecraft; second, the purple dress she was wearing on that night, kept for forty years in her closet, torn and covered with mysterious dust; and third, reports in the Air Force's official Project Blue Book stating that radar confirmed the presence of a UFO on that night at two separate Air Force facilities in the area, both within hours of the Hills' claimed abduction. Let's look at those first.

The first report was from Pease Air Force Base, about 82 miles southeast of Indian Head, at 2:14am. The Hills got home in Portsmouth at 5:00 in the morning on September 20. Their story states that they came to after their medical experiments about 35 miles south of Indian Head, near the town of Ashland. From Ashland to Portsmouth is about an hour and 45 minute drive, so they came to in their car around 3:15. This chronology puts Pease AFB's UFO radar evidence squarely in the middle of the Hills' three hours of medical experiments aboard the spaceship, which they say was sitting on the ground the whole time. If the Hills' story is true, the Pease AFB report must be an unrelated event.

The second report is from North Concord Air Force Station, a small hilltop radar station (closed in 1963) that was about 40 miles north of Indian Head, at 5:22pm on September 19. This is about seven hours before the Hills observed their light in the sky. It clearly does not corroborate the Hills' sighting. The reports in Project Blue Book note each target's extremely high altitude and low speed, and conclude that each was probably a weather balloon.

Next we have Betty's purple dress, the zipper of which she found to be torn. She then hung it in the closet. Two years later, after the hypnosis, she got it out and said there was strange pink dust on it. She hung it up again, this time for forty years, when a group of crop circle investigators examined it. They concluded the dress had an "anomalous biological substance" on it. While a good stretch of the imagination might consider this to be consistent with the abduction story, it's also consistent with perfectly natural explanations, namely, 40 years of dust mites, moths, and mold. I don't find the Great Purple Dress Caper to be good evidence of anything.

So the only thing we're left with is Betty's star map. In her original written stories, she described the aliens' star map as three dimensional. Under hypnosis, she redrew it on paper, in two dimensions. It's seven or eight random dots connected by lines, and it's quite rough and by no means precise. Several years later, a schoolteacher named Marjorie Fish read a book about the Hills. She then took beads and strings and converted her living room into a three dimensional version of the galaxy based on the 1969 Gliese Star Catalog. She then spent several years viewing her galaxy from different angles, trying to find a match for Betty's map, and eventually concluded that Zeta Reticuli was the alien homeworld. Other UFOlogists have proposed innumerable different interpretations. Carl Sagan and other astronomers have said that it is not even a good match for Zeta Reticuli, and that Betty's drawing is far too random and imprecise to make any kind of useful interpretation. With its third dimension removed, Betty's map cannot contain any useful positional information. Even if she had somehow drawn a perfect 3D map that did exactly align with known star positions, it still wouldn't be evidence of anything other than that such reference material is widely available, in sources like the Gliese Star Catalog. We would not conclude that an alien abduction is the only reasonable way that Betty could have learned seven or eight star positions during those two years.

And so, there we have it. The Betty & Barney Hill abduction story has every indication of being merely an inventive tale from the mind of a lifelong UFO fanatic. Despite the best efforts of authors to bolster it with mischaracterized or exaggerated evidence, it is unsupported by any useful evidence, and is perfectly consistent with the purely natural explanation.

...And that smell of .....permeates through many a bunker posting.

.......

:Ha:

When I asked Nancy about that, she told me to go drown in the "pole shift."

So much for Ms LIEDer being Service To Others.

Yes the "status quo" of our reality remains the same....

Actually any bunker posting. But your point is well taken.

Yes zetatalk Live "chat" is wildly popular....so much so that the bunkers "asked" the debunkers to leave to create more space for the hundreds of other believing glpers that desired to enter the zetatalk "chat" room.

I see that glpers, in their massive numbers, have been knocking down the "chat" doors just to be a part of the vibrant bunker discussion.

Delusional ings can be a great pastime....just ask any bunker believer.

Yes, Bucketheadgirl, we have found other silly stuff to talk about....such as the immense advancement in mankind due to the invention of The Flushed Toilet.

Oh really.....and don't forget Soledad?.....July 22nd.

will be reminding you of your claim.

From the wisdom and insight of Bucketheadgirl and Soledad:


I've been uncomfortable with the term "debunker" from the beginning.

Circuit Breaker recently defined the word and his definition brought some clarity to me. His definition of debunker included the words "expose...a claim, assertion, sentiment, etc. as being pretentious, false, or exaggerated." His conclusion: "By calling anyone 'debunker' they're admitting that their claims are false or exaggerated." [I'll give you the where and when if must. Just ask.]

Circuit Breaker's definition brought to mind my uneasiness about our use of the word. I used the term "debunker" because it was in common use on this thread. My dictionary defines debunk as "to expose as false: to demystify".

Do you agree with his conclusion? By calling the nay-sayers "debunkers" are we mispeaking? Just wondering.
Quoting: burkettgirl


You are no doubt correct. Thing is, most PXers don't really care about word games, as that is the purview of the "other guys." We've got enough on our plates trying to come to grips with a possible TEOTWAWKI!
Quoting: Soledad

There you have it. The us vs them component that fuels the formation of all cults and whacko belief systems. I am sorry to hear that Soledad has so much on her plate. It must be a terrible burden to be one of perhaps 10 people charged with preparing for the end of the world.

Personally, every day for me is TEOTWAWKI. I try to enter each day with the attitude that it is a new day, a new world with unlimited possibilities. I don't sit around waiting for the end of the world to come, I try to pursue life until death takes me.