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The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture

 
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The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
One of the most difficult things for someone unfamiliar with dispensational theology to understand is why Israel needs to exist at all in the last days, let alone rebuild their Temple. A recent discussion with a theology professor from a well known West Coast Christian school made this clear.

We were talking about our respective views of the End Times. When I mentioned the coming Temple and Israel's re-awakening into their Old Covenant relationship, he looked at me like I was from another planet. He graduated from one of the main line denominational seminaries where he had been immersed in liberal theology, so what little he knows about the end times is all allegorical. He had never been taught anything like what I was saying.

Why on Earth, he asked, would God bring Israel back when the Church has replaced Israel in His eyes? And even if He did, why would He bring them into an Old Covenant relationship when He's told the Church that since the cross the Old Covenant no longer applies?

Good Questions
Most Christians can't answer these questions, and even among those who take the Bible literally, many can only say , “Because the Bible says so.” They can't explain why it says so.

It's only when you understand that the Age of Grace didn't end the Age of Law, but only interrupted it seven years short of its alloted time, that it all becomes clear. Here's what happened.

Near the end of the Babylonian captivity the Angel Gabriel told Daniel that Israel was being given 490 years to complete 6 tasks.

"Seventy 'sevens' (490 years) are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy (place). (Daniel 9:24)

When the Lord was crucified, 483 of those years had past. Remember, that's why the disciples were astonished when He told them the Temple would soon be destroyed (Matt. 24:2). It's also why, 40 days after the Resurrection, they asked if He was was going to restore the Kingdom to Israel now. (Acts 1:6) They thought they were only 7 years away from the Kingdom Age. Ten days later, on Pentecost, the indeterminate Age of the Church began, with the Age of Law still 7 years short of its prophesied end.

After 20 years had passed the Lord's half-brother James, who was the head of the Church in Jerusalem at the time, explained that Israel had been set aside while the Lord took from among the Gentiles a people for Himself (the Church). After that he would turn again to Israel and pick up where He had left off (Acts 15:13-18). About 18 years after that the Temple was destroyed and has never been rebuilt. In 135 AD the nation ceased to exist in any form. The Roman Emperor Hadrian destroyed what was left of Jerusalem, built a new city called Aelia Capitolina on its ruins, and forbade any Jew from entering it. But the Lord's promise still stands. As soon as He has taken the Church, He'll turn again to Israel to complete the last 7 years of the Age of Law.

These facts from both the Bible and history completely undermine any arguments for the validity of replacement theology. They explain why Israel has to exist in the End Times and why the Jews will need a Temple.

The Great Pause
While Pentecost was the official beginning of the Age of Grace, it didn't signal the end of the Age of Law, as so many in the Church wrongly assume. It was only a Great Pause while the Lord pursued His Church, something He intended to do all along, but had only divulged in a general way in the past.

Speaking to His Messiah, the Lord said, "It is too small a thing for you to be my servant to restore the tribes of Jacob and bring back those of Israel I have kept. I will also make you a light for the Gentiles, that you may bring my salvation to the ends of the earth." (Isaiah 49:6)

When you understand the Great Pause, lots of other things fall into place. We've already discussed the re-birth of the Nation and the re-built Temple. Israel had to be re-born and will have to become a covenant people again in order to complete their final 7 years. This is what makes their re-birth such a powerful sign that the Great Pause is about to end. The only reason for Israel to exist again is to complete the 7 years remaining in the Age of Law. It also explains the return to animal sacrifice during this time. This is the way things were before the Great Pause began, and the way they'll have to be after it ends. Although people have always been saved by faith, during the Age of Law their faith has to be evidenced by obedience to the Law.

Understanding the Great Pause also helps us see why the Rapture of the Church has to precede the final 7 years. The purpose of the Great Pause is so the Lord can take from among the Gentiles a people for Himself. The Greek word translated “take” in Acts 15:14 is lambano. A look at the primary meanings of lambano reveals that the intent of the word is to describe one who takes something for the purpose of carrying it away. Once the church is complete the Lord will carry us away before turning again to Israel. This is consistent with Paul's statement in Romans 11:25 that Israel has experienced a partial blindness until the full number of Gentiles has come in. The phrase “come in” means to arrive at one's destination, as when a ship has “come in”. According to John 14:2-3 our destination is Heaven. Once the church has been carried away to its destination in Heaven the blinders will fall from Israel's eyes, the Great Pause will come to an end, and Israel will complete its final seven years.

The Rapture has to happen before Daniel's 70th Week can begin, because the 70th Week is all about Israel. It's their final opportunity to be reconciled to God through the Messiah and prepare for the Kingdom He promised them so long ago. 2500 years before the fact, Zechariah prophesied that this would take place near the end of the 70th Week.

"And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son.” (Zech. 12:10)

Paul confirmed this and said it would happen after the rapture.

I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins." (Romans 11:25-27)

And the Great Pause explains why post rapture salvation will be like it was in Old Testament times. The only difference is post rapture believers will be looking back to the cross whereas Old Testament believers looked forward to it. Speaking of the time when taking the mark of the beast will be required of everyone on Earth, the Lord said, “This calls for patient endurance on the part of the saints who obey God's commandments and remain faithful to Jesus.” (Rev. 14:12) Again, people have always been saved by faith, but during the Age of Law their faith has to be evidenced by obedience to the Law.

It also explains why the 144,000 servants of God have to be sealed before undertaking their mission. (Rev. 7:3) If the church was still here they would be sealed just the way we are. But during the Age of Law believers were not, nor will they be, sealed with the Holy Spirit as a guarantee of their inheritance as we are (Ephes. 1:13-14). The 144,000 is the only group in the post rapture world that is described as being sealed. By the way, some scholars believe this means only the 144,000 will be supernaturally protected from the demonic locusts spoken of in Rev. 9.

I Can See Clearly Now
I could go on, but I think you get the idea. No other system of theology explains God's overarching plan as succinctly as dispensationalism. None gives us such a clear understanding of the connection between events before Pentecost and those after the Rapture. No other one helps us see the “why” behind the “what” described in the Bible. None other so vividly demonstrates the absolutely unique nature of the church, while maintaining the integrity of God's promises to Israel. And best of all it does so in a manner consistent with the literal, historical, grammatical interpretation of His Word. 06-27-09 J. Kelly RR
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 12:32 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The 70 weeks / 490 years was fulfilled when Christ ascended.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 12:34 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The 70 weeks / 490 years was fulfilled when Christ ascended.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 714698

How do you squeeze 7 years into 40 days?
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 12:38 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The 70 weeks / 490 years was fulfilled when Christ ascended.

How do you squeeze 7 years into 40 days?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 541166

? Come again?
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 12:39 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
I have to disagree:

Romans 11:25
that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.


This verse is essential, because it tells us what this current dispensation of God and the church age is actually based around. Even though a remnant of Jews accepted Christ as the true Messiah at that time, Israel as a nation, stepped into blindness because of their rejection. The blindness of unbelieving Israel will continue until the fullness, or full number of Gentiles, allotted by God, has come into the church. The nation of Israel will not open its eyes until the very last Gentile has entered into the church and the doors have been closed.

To find out how long the church age will last is to find out when Israel, as a nation, will step out of blindness!

Since Christ is currently found to be the stumbling block to them and the root cause of their blindness, then the church age will continue until Israel accepts Jesus Christ, as a nation! Fortunately, the scriptures are in direct harmony with this approach by revealing this moment to us, beginning with the very next verse in Romans.

Romans 11:26-27
26And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

Since Israel is still stooped in ungodly practices to date, this verse is speaking of the second advent of Christ in glory at which he will claim his rightly position of authority and open the eyes of Israel to his power, cleansing them of their sins forever. Here is the Old Testament parallel.

Zechariah 12:10-11,14
10And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
11In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.
14All the families that remain, every family apart, and their wives apart.
Zechariah 13:1
1In that day there shall be a fountain opened to the house of David and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleanness.

These verses speak of Christ’s second arrival into Israel. The only way they can look at him, is if they can actually see him. It will take Christ physically coming back to the land to open the eyes of the unrepentant nation of Israel! Once they see him coming in all his glory, they will mourn for him, as a nation, in realization of their blindness. Then will God give them an opportunity to cleanse themselves of their sins and turn to him.

As you may very well know, this advent of Jesus Christ will occur after the great tribulation. This is when blindness will forever cease in Israel. It is when the veil is lifted and the light let in.

The book of Romans is actually indicating that the church will remain until the physical second coming of Jesus Christ to Israel.
The Boss

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06/30/2009 12:42 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Complete bullshit. Dispensationalism was created by John Darby and made popular via that Scofield annotated bible.
Pardon me for interrupting your premature celebration, but I thought it only fair to give you a sporting chance as you are new to this game.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 12:42 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
I have to disagree:
......................................................
As you may very well know, this advent of Jesus Christ will occur after the great tribulation. This is when blindness will forever cease in Israel. It is when the veil is lifted and the light let in.

The book of Romans is actually indicating that the church will remain until the physical second coming of Jesus Christ to Israel.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 713969

You are reading things not written.
But hey, I'm right, we ride.
Your right, we ride 7 years later.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 12:44 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Complete bullshit. Dispensationalism was created by John Darby and made popular via that Scofield annotated bible.
 Quoting: The Boss

Did you not read the quotes from the original apostles from the Bible it's self? I did not quote Darby.
The Boss

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06/30/2009 12:46 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Complete bullshit. Dispensationalism was created by John Darby and made popular via that Scofield annotated bible.

Did you not read the quotes from the original apostles from the Bible it's self? I did not quote Darby.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 541166



Back during a period of time in my life when I thought that I was going to do this for "a living", I spent quite a bit of time studying the scriptures you take from context and insist that Christians will fly.

Laws of first mentions buddy. Try to understand it.
Pardon me for interrupting your premature celebration, but I thought it only fair to give you a sporting chance as you are new to this game.
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 12:47 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
I have to disagree:
......................................................
As you may very well know, this advent of Jesus Christ will occur after the great tribulation. This is when blindness will forever cease in Israel. It is when the veil is lifted and the light let in.

The book of Romans is actually indicating that the church will remain until the physical second coming of Jesus Christ to Israel.

You are reading things not written.
But hey, I'm right, we ride.
Your right, we ride 7 years later.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 541166


The "rapture" is post trib. Scripture is extremely clear. Here is how easy it is to prove it:

"rapture" (I Thess 4:16-17) =
day of the Lord (I Thess 5:2) =
sky darkening (Joel 2:31) =
Christ's identical description of sky darkening as occuring immediately after the great trib. (Matt 24:29)
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 12:47 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The 70 weeks / 490 years was fulfilled when Christ ascended.

How do you squeeze 7 years into 40 days?

? Come again?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 714698

The 483rd year began at the "Triumphant Entry" days before the crucifixion/resurrection.
The Holy Spirit's arrival and Christs ascention happened in the same year, not 7 years later.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 12:52 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Complete bullshit. Dispensationalism was created by John Darby and made popular via that Scofield annotated bible.

Did you not read the quotes from the original apostles from the Bible it's self? I did not quote Darby.



Back during a period of time in my life when I thought that I was going to do this for "a living", I spent quite a bit of time studying the scriptures you take from context and insist that Christians will fly.

Laws of first mentions buddy. Try to understand it.
 Quoting: The Boss

I think the quotes I mentioned were first, Buddy. By several centuries.
It's a good thing that your foul mouth decided against "the living". We have enough pastors/preachers/priests to defame the Truth already.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 12:55 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Complete bullshit. Dispensationalism was created by John Darby ................................
 Quoting: The Boss



One more thing

Surely you have heard about the dispensation of God's grace that was given to me for you, that is, the mystery made known to me by revelation, as I have already written briefly. (Ephesians 3:2-3)
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 12:58 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The 70 weeks / 490 years was fulfilled when Christ ascended.

How do you squeeze 7 years into 40 days?

? Come again?

The 483rd year began at the "Triumphant Entry" days before the crucifixion/resurrection.
The Holy Spirit's arrival and Christs ascention happened in the same year, not 7 years later.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 541166

Work bacwards 490 years before the ascention and you will see what i'm saying. Have you read the entire bible in order?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 01:05 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Work bacwards 490 years before the ascention and you will see what i'm saying. Have you read the entire bible in order?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 714698

Been done thousand times over. Here is an example.
(And yes, I have read the Bible)
Judah had been deported to Babylon in three stages: 605 B.C., 597 B.C. and 586 B.C. (Julian calendar).

When the Babylonian empire was defeated by the Persian empire in 539 B.C., it paved the way for a return to the Jewish homeland.

This also occurred over three distinct stages: 538 B.C., 457 B.C. and 444 B.C. (Julian calendar).



The 69 weeks equate to 69 sets of 7 Lunar years = 483 Lunar years.

Prophetic and Bible years are not Solar, but Lunar years of 360 days = 30 days per month.

Noah's flood is recorded as from the 17th day of the 2nd month to the 17th day of the 7th month, and that same period is given as 150 days.

The Jews used a lunar calendar of 30 day months = 360 days per year.

The Julian Calendar is calculated as 365 days per year, plus one extra day every fourth year and one less day every 128 years.



444 B.C. appears to align with this prophecy. (Nehemiah leads the third group of exiles back to Jerusalem).

444 years x 365 days (Julian calendar) = 162060 days

+ leap year days = 111 days

less one day every 128 years = 3 days

= 162168 days

divided by 360 days (Lunar calendar) = 450 years.

Christ's ministry commenced at approximately age 30, and lasted 3 years.

He was cruxified when he was approximately 33 years old.

The 450 lunar years from 444 B.C. plus the 33 years of Christ's life = 483 lunar years and appear to align with the prophecy given in Daniel 9:25-26.
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 01:15 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Good luck OP and don't leave your door unlocked, that's all i'm going to leave you with because truth must be found, not taught.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 01:19 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Good luck OP and don't leave your door unlocked, that's all i'm going to leave you with because truth must be found, not taught.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 714698

Making truth to be easily found since 1990.
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 01:20 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
444 B.C. appears to align with this prophecy. (Nehemiah leads the third group of exiles back to Jerusalem).

444 years x 365 days (Julian calendar) = 162060 days

+ leap year days = 111 days

less one day every 128 years = 3 days

= 162168 days

divided by 360 days (Lunar calendar) = 450 years.

Christ's ministry commenced at approximately age 30, and lasted 3 years.

He was cruxified when he was approximately 33 years old.

The 450 lunar years from 444 B.C. plus the 33 years of Christ's life = 483 lunar years and appear to align with the prophecy given in Daniel 9:25-26.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 541166

The Gregorian calendar is off. Christ was born in ~4 BC, not 1 AD.
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 01:21 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Good luck OP and don't leave your door unlocked, that's all i'm going to leave you with because truth must be found, not taught.

Making truth to be easily found since 1990.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 541166

<making>
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 01:27 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The Gregorian calendar is off. Christ was born in ~4 BC, not 1 AD.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 698702


The Maggi was astonished that few knew the time of the Messiah's advent.
The maggi were trained by the wisest of all Persian wise men, Daniel.
The calendar is speculation, as is the day of the BIRTH of Christ (which has nothing to do with the prophecy).
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06/30/2009 01:29 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The Maggi was astonished that few knew the time of the Messiah's advent.
The maggi were trained by the wisest of all Persian wise men, Daniel.
The calendar is speculation, as is the day of the BIRTH of Christ (which has nothing to do with the prophecy).
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 541166

It certainly does, because if the calendar is adjusted to be accurate your BS numerology falls by the wayside.
Anonymous Coward
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06/30/2009 01:34 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
OP how close is the rapture?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 01:42 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
OP how close is the rapture?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 714772

The time is unknowable. But it will happen. It is a purifing doctrine. There are crowns given for those looking for this advent. Many will be suprised when it happens. Many will be ashamed when it happens to them.
This is when the "Light" comes on for the Jewish people.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 03:18 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
I have to disagree:

Romans 11:25
that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

.............................................................​.............................................................​As you may very well know, this advent of Jesus Christ will occur after the great tribulation. This is when blindness will forever cease in Israel. It is when the veil is lifted and the light let in.

The book of Romans is actually indicating that the church will remain until the physical second coming of Jesus Christ to Israel.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 713969

Thanks for your post. But after re-reading it you seem to contradict yourself.
You did nothing to prove your asertion that the Romans verse indicates the Church is present at this event.

The Rapture has to happen before Daniel's 70th Week can begin, because the 70th Week is all about Israel. It's their final opportunity to be reconciled to God through the Messiah and prepare for the Kingdom He promised them so long ago. 2500 years before the fact, Zechariah prophesied that this would take place near the end of the 70th Week.

"And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son.” (Zech. 12:10)

Paul confirmed this and said it would happen after the rapture.

I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob. And this is my covenant with them when I take away their sins." (Romans 11:25-27)
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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06/30/2009 11:06 PM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
The return of Christ makes no sense if viewed only as a one-phased event. This is because the Scriptures present conflict and confusion, if trying to make the second coming simply the Lord breaking through the black clouds of Revelation 19:11, then defeating all rebels and moving to Jerusalem to set up His millennial kingdom.

Some Scriptures reveal that no one can know the exact day or hour of Christ’s return. Others tell that the exact number of days to His return to earth can be precisely calculated. Matthew 25:13 says Jesus will return at an unknown time, while Revelation 12:6 indicates that the Jews will have to wait on the Lord 1,260 days, starting when the Antichrist stands in the Temple of God and declares himself to be God. This takes place three and one-half years into the seven-year tribulation period.

Which is it? Can Christ’s time of return be known for sure, or not? God is not the author of confusion (1 Corinthians 14:33). His Word is orderly, and always makes sense when proper context is applied and when the reader is faithful to seek out what it really says. It is vital, therefore, that Bible prophecy, as the Word of God in general, be studied thoroughly in total context. It can be hard work, but blesses the soul every time it is done. So, we see that the area dealing with knowing or not knowing the time of Christ’s coming back to earth presents what might be construed as contradiction. Bible prophecy seems to say different things about earth dwellers being aware of exactly when He is coming again. It is impossible to understand the apparent contradiction (which is not contradiction at all) without in-depth study on the matter. Such study, covered with prayer for understanding, reveals that Christ will return to Planet Earth in two distinct phases. Additionally, study brings realization that it is essential to understand that God is working within two prophetic programs: one involving the church of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the other involving His chosen people, the nation Israel. The two dovetail into the most glorious event in human history to occur since Christ’s first coming.

Phase 1: The Rapture
This event involves the church, all born-again believers in Jesus Christ for salvation. A person is born again (John 3:3) into the family of God by accepting that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God. This is the “rock” upon which Jesus said He would build His Church (Matthew 16:18). All people who have been born since the church began have lived in the “church age” or “age of grace.” That is, all during this period of time, this dispensation, who accept Christ’s blood as atonement for sin are under the grace of God. These believers are recipients of reconciliation with God the Father, their sins forever removed from receiving His judgment.

Rapture of the church, as foretold by the Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-55 will be the one atomos of time (faster than the eye can blink) when Jesus will call all believers of the church age to be with Him forever. This is the “mystery” Paul showed believers, revealing in full what Jesus meant when He said the following: “Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also” (John 14:1-3).

The prerequisite, then, for being rapture ready is to accept Christ as Savior. Paul tells us that ALL will be changed in that “twinkling of an eye.” Who is included in the “all” he wrote about? “All” was the pronoun he used to include every individual during the church age who will accept Christ for their personal salvation.

The rapture is the first of the two-phase second coming. Thus, those who are rapture ready are also second coming ready. “All,” not “some,” will go to be with the Lord when He calls, as He did to John in Revelation 4:1. Each believer is rapture ready in the sense that each will go to be with Jesus in that stupendous event. Each will be taken; none will be left behind.

However, not every Christian will be “ready” in another important sense. Those who have lived carnal lives–lives that are not walking in the will of God will lose rewards at the bema, or judgment seat of Christ. The believer must do his or her best to live the way God expects of His children while still in this mortal flesh. Those who do not won’t be kicked out of God’s family or be left behind to suffer His wrath (for we are not appointed to the wrath of God; see 1 Thessalonians 5:9). But, those who choose to live apart from the Father’s instructions will have disappointed their Lord, and at the bema judgment will see their carnal works burned in the holy fire that purges unrighteousness. Sinful acts, through commission or ommision, cannot enter God’s eternal kingdom.

The child of God should take this truth very seriously. How he or she attempts to walk righteously here on earth will determine his or her eternal service status when they look into their Lord’s omniscient eyes.

Phase 2: Second Advent
The physical touchdown of the Lord Jesus atop the Mount of Olives will take place at a minimum of seven years following the rapture of the church. This will be the second phase of Christ’s second coming. It will come at the end of the worst era of human history, the tribulation. The tribulation era will begin God’s dealing with His chosen people, Israel, in a supernatural way. He will, during this horrific time, purge, through the fiery crucible of Antichrist’s genocidal rage, a special remnant of the Jewish people. These will be His nation as head of all nations during the millennium, the 1,000-year era that will follow the tribulation. However, before the Jewish remnant will enjoy the millennial earth as the foremost nation, the time will be worse for the Jewish people than at any time during the many anti-Semite persecutions and diasporas (scatterings) through the ages.

Jeremiah, the Old Testament prophet, said the following about that horrendous time: “Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it” (Jeremiah 30:7).
Anonymous Coward
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07/01/2009 12:15 AM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Jesus referred to carnal Jews as "lost" sheep. Too long in captivity, the religion of the Pharisees had evolved into a kind of Babylonian/Caballistic hybrid.
In the Book of Acts, James mistakenly allowed "judaizers" into the church in Jerusalem in the first century. I believe this infiltration was the "different gospel" Paul wrote about. He said "let them be accursed" and a few years later, in 70 AD, they were destroyed.
My understanding is that the New Testament teaches that born again Christians are Israel. God remade it from a physical nation to a spiritual nation. Speaking to all men, Christ said "you must be born again." Paul's teaching on Israel in Romans are not about carnal jews either. He had already defined Israel as born again believers in the earlier chapters. To believers in Christ, he said "we are the Israel of God". He clearly taught that "he who is a Jew is a Jew inwardly".
God is a Spirit and He is not interested in physical bloodlines and lineages, in skin color, or anything else physical. Why, then, does organized religion elevate carnal Jews? I think primarily because Jewish supremacy is the foundation of their principal money machine-the pre-trib rapture. Carnal Jews must be the ones who turn over a new leaf after Christians float off. I say organized religion is Esau when they claim carnal jews are the "chosen people". They sell their own birthright.
In fact, when you think about carnal Israel, it is the only Biblically significant nation "who was,was not,and now is." They ended in 70 AD and "were not" for many centuries. They regained a "now is" stature in 1948 and "the whole world wondered after them. These people deny Christ, yet most churches tell its membership to exalt them. It seems to me that carnal Israel is the beast and organized religion is the false prophet. You would do well "to come out of her".
There is no Judeo-Christianity-it's a creation birthed in the synthesis of two diametrically opposed belief systems. I think the Bible refers to it as a "whore".
If you believe western history occurred without the hidden hand of Talmudic/Cabbalistic Judaism and it's puppets, consider yourself marked for judgement. A mind so programmed is the true mark of the beast.
As to a pretrib rapture..er no! Jesus says six times in John chap 4, He'll raise the dead on the last day..not the last day minus 7 years. With that in mind, reread 1 Cor. 15:5. And that "some are taken" verse-the vultures gather where the dead are..they're taken to their death. Now go memorize Psalm 91 and maybe thousands will die at your side but the plague won't draw near you. See..the believers are still on earth..a promise of protection and a fine proof verse against the pre-trib rapture as well.
rb
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07/01/2009 12:47 AM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
interesting!

yes we are in the dispensation of the fulness of times!

Jesus gave us the cup of the new covenant -- His blood shed for many

we are grafted in.

we are not to curse the Jews -- we are only grafted. they are judicially blinded, we don't have that excuse. we are without excuse. all the things we condemn we practice ourselves.

I believe we are best off when we don't so much as lift our eyes to heaven, but beat our chest and say have mercy on me oh God, a sinner!

I personally see dispensations in changing covenant relationships throughout the Bible. God deals with different people differently. and the Jews especially.

pray for the peace of Jerusalem.

love peace and joy!

rb
Anonymous Coward
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07/01/2009 01:44 AM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
interesting!

yes we are in the dispensation of the fulness of times!

Jesus gave us the cup of the new covenant -- His blood shed for many

we are grafted in.

we are not to curse the Jews -- we are only grafted. they are judicially blinded, we don't have that excuse. we are without excuse. all the things we condemn we practice ourselves.

I believe we are best off when we don't so much as lift our eyes to heaven, but beat our chest and say have mercy on me oh God, a sinner!

I personally see dispensations in changing covenant relationships throughout the Bible. God deals with different people differently. and the Jews especially.

pray for the peace of Jerusalem.

love peace and joy!

rb
 Quoting: rb 715224



Watch and pray rb.....it wont be much longer.......
Anonymous Coward
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07/01/2009 02:20 AM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
You're all full of it. Especially you, "Boss." You and your quippy little signature at the end of all your posts. The pretrib/posttrib debate is as wrongheaded as the reformed vs. wesleyan debate over God's sovereignty. Complete adoption of one requires an arbitrary literal reading of some passages and an equally arbitrary rejection of the literal meaning of "competing" passages. These debates are mostly just platforms for people with intellectual class arrogance (I'm talking to you, "Boss").

Christ, the building up of the Body and the physical work of the Gospel are all that matter. Stop your bickering. It's not like if Christ returns Pre-trib (or viceversa) that whoever was "right" will be thumping their chests at whoever was "wrong" saying, "What did I tell you!" as you're flying thru the clouds! Give it a rest. These debates are only ends unto themselves. And believers that actually look down their nose at those who hold differing views of such peripheral matters are the dumbest of all.
Anonymous Coward
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07/01/2009 02:48 AM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
Christ died in the middle of the 70 week (69 1/2) to put an end to the sacrifices. Daniel speaks of this. After his death the jews were given 3.5 years to accept christ and be a light unto the world. they obviously did not and as of result the jewish leaders stoned stephen(marked end of 70th given to Israel). from then on it went to the gentiles and jews. all the promises to nation of israel were no longer in play after that because the promises came with conditions and as a people the failed. Now, remember Jesus and paul says that those who follow christ are whether jew or gentile are considered the true seeds of Abraham...the true jews. The promises will be fulfilled but to those that Follow Jesus, not to a single nation or race of people but to those that consist in the body of christ.
Anonymous Coward
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07/01/2009 02:49 AM
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Re: The case for Dispensational Theology and the need for Israel and the Rapture
glp censors me.. alot

I tried to talk about a certain institute that's name begins with T...


and I get censored everytime, when I type it out it turns into "Merry Christmas"

GLP is a air force op.

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