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Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.

 
CatCarel

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12/20/2012 10:32 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Happy End of the World, everyone :)
 Quoting: Chaol


kitty See you on the other side!
Cat
Unit3

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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Now that we've briefly discussed use of the Genius how about we talk about ways that we use it in our everyday lives, without realizing it?

Take what you know about how to make a Genius model and apply it to the world that is all ready around you.

This is a tricky one but it is the step that leads up to more advanced uses of Ecsys.

I'll start with a hint:

Everything of your perception is a symbol
 Quoting: Chaol




I think this is a great exercise. I've been trying to figure it out.

Here's what I'll say in answer to your quesiton:

I give meaning to everything I perceive.
 Quoting: Unit3



Forgot to add that I interact with my environment, esp, the things I strongly like or dislike.

And happy end of the world? Yes, I'm looking forward to it, heh!
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Ambra
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12/21/2012 05:25 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Happy End of the World, everyone :)
 Quoting: Chaol


Yay!
banana2
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Happy End of the World, everyone :)
 Quoting: Chaol


Happy End of the World to you too!
moshpit
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Happy End of the World, everyone :)
 Quoting: Chaol


I am teyerd my love, gravity is what it is not. Why has never left, I am here......lets do this

AND(DNA)the "dream" ISIS





















i
Chaol

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12/21/2012 10:39 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Update for 11/27

3 quantum experiments to keep in mind while viewing this thread:

1. double slit [link to www.youtube.com]

The act of perceiving something causes the the wave of possibilities to collapse manifesting an experience.

2. [link to www.youtube.com]

everything is connected

3. superposition

something unobserved exists in all its possible states
 Quoting: dodec 20177375


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 10:52 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...

In other words, you don't know why Chaol arrives early every September and then leaves every mid-November.

If I knew, I would not have asked. You offered to answer questions. Using my logic and seeing the possibilities, you are not very good at this.

Interaction is over with. I don't care to play your game.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 6853315


Ok I'm back with my kiddy gloves on to discuss Chaol's comings and goings. I think I assumed you were all paying more attention.

Chaol comes and goes on prominent Nexi. By now we all know that nexi represent spaces for possibility. What creates these spaces? Based on what we have learned so far, the relationship (geometry) between two or more representations creates the space for possibility, the same way binaural tones work. So what are the major representations that are always associated with Chaol's comings and goings? Seems they always sun-related, with expressions on planet earth, physically, socially, etc.

Feel free to add any other relationships (patterns) that you feel are pertinent.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1487466


Think sun-moon magnetic relationships. These two representations are of major relevance to this perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1487466


Nexus = Solar Flare + Chaol leaving/returning

The Nexi exist because of his interaction with solar activity
 Quoting: CatCarel


Sol represents this particular brand of physicality. Everything physical (as we know it) has its 'origin' there.

Every 'level' of physicality has a sun, you could say. From the particles on up to the universe.

The potential energy of the sun is made relative through interaction (solar activity).

However, this activity is as much in your body as in what appears to be the center of your solar system.

In one way it's the same thing.

In an other, perhaps more practical, way it's a connection. (In this way you can reach other possibilities of physically-oriented experience.) It's one reason you could stand next to it and not burn (although your clothes and equipment may, as they have a less-relative 'sun' at their center).

The universe is, indeed, your body in all respects.
Chaol

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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Does he create the solar flares? Otherwise, how is there one on that exact date every year?
 Quoting: Unit3


The same way you can tell about what time you'll be hungry.

The activity on/of your sun is the same activity in/of your body.
Jesse Sovoda

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12/21/2012 10:55 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Update for 11/27

3 quantum experiments to keep in mind while viewing this thread:

1. double slit [link to www.youtube.com]

The act of perceiving something causes the the wave of possibilities to collapse manifesting an experience.

2. [link to www.youtube.com]

everything is connected

3. superposition

something unobserved exists in all its possible states
 Quoting: dodec 20177375


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
 Quoting: Chaol


Yup and yup. But for #3 one could say "no energy is independent of perspective(observation)". Until something is observed it seems to sit out there (as a possibility) un-rendered waiting to become logical (enough to be rendered).
Consider the possibility that you order yourself into being from chaos... You do this, always, in all ways. This "ordering" has resulted in the possibilities you're experiencing, here, now. In each experience you've ever had, more and more of "this" reality is generated logically from your previous experience. Your observation of this unfolding of order and chaos is reality.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 10:57 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
alas my numbers don't match, but then again... maybe no one's do. Till the next lotto drawing

We Ride....
 Quoting: DODEC 20177375


Sure. Not if you think of it in the traditional sense.

Why not see your numbers match right now, in a different way?
Chaol

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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
I think someone should start an advanced ecsys thread and hopefully Chaol can pop in there and teach us some more. I particularly would like to learn more about mental symbols, ecsys on the fly, predicting the future and visualization techniques. I don't really know how to start a thread though.
 Quoting: Not-Chaol 5877556


Personally, I'm not leaving the space Chaol created. I like being in his Genius map. If anyone starts another thread on this material, then that is creating another space. Also, I think Chaol does enough for us so I wouldn't dare ask him to go teach in my thread. Just sayin'

I don't understand why you don't just post what you are interested in here such as mental symbols, ecsys on the fly, etc:?


Edit: And quite frankly, if one doesn't understand the basics I just mentioned above, then I don't think it's time to move to advanced information. And Chaol has actually mentioned it's not time to move on until we understand some things.

Also, he has mentioned 2013 a few times and that he will tell us more. He is waiting to reveal something to us. I have no idea what it is, but I'm content to play with my Genius plans and see what I can learn. After all, we are really trying to learn HOW we create our reality.

And, as far as I know, only 3 people have actually accomplished anything with their Genius plans. That would be tuuuuuuur, Cat and the poster that just moved to Canada. Marshwiggle and I both are unsure of our results and I know I'm waiting on Chaol to return for feedback to see if I had results or a personal experience.
 Quoting: Unit3


I think many of us have a good understanding of the basics to move up a notch.

A small notch ;)

(Far many more persons have accomplished something with their Genius. Some speak up, though.)
Unit3

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12/21/2012 01:35 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...


Ok I'm back with my kiddy gloves on to discuss Chaol's comings and goings. I think I assumed you were all paying more attention.

Chaol comes and goes on prominent Nexi. By now we all know that nexi represent spaces for possibility. What creates these spaces? Based on what we have learned so far, the relationship (geometry) between two or more representations creates the space for possibility, the same way binaural tones work. So what are the major representations that are always associated with Chaol's comings and goings? Seems they always sun-related, with expressions on planet earth, physically, socially, etc.

Feel free to add any other relationships (patterns) that you feel are pertinent.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1487466


Think sun-moon magnetic relationships. These two representations are of major relevance to this perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1487466


Nexus = Solar Flare + Chaol leaving/returning

The Nexi exist because of his interaction with solar activity
 Quoting: CatCarel


Sol represents this particular brand of physicality. Everything physical (as we know it) has its 'origin' there.

Every 'level' of physicality has a sun, you could say. From the particles on up to the universe.

The potential energy of the sun is made relative through interaction (solar activity).

However, this activity is as much in your body as in what appears to be the center of your solar system.

In one way it's the same thing.

In an other, perhaps more practical, way it's a connection. (In this way you can reach other possibilities of physically-oriented experience.) It's one reason you could stand next to it and not burn (although your clothes and equipment may, as they have a less-relative 'sun' at their center).

The universe is, indeed, your body in all respects.
 Quoting: Chaol



Yes, otherwise, we couldn't perceive it. And since it all operates by "laws," I think we are proving there is a Universal Source.
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Unit3

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12/21/2012 01:47 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Update for 11/27

3 quantum experiments to keep in mind while viewing this thread:

1. double slit [link to www.youtube.com]

The act of perceiving something causes the the wave of possibilities to collapse manifesting an experience.

2. [link to www.youtube.com]

everything is connected

3. superposition

something unobserved exists in all its possible states
 Quoting: dodec 20177375


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
 Quoting: Chaol





And yet, some perceive, even to the point of knowing how to do so, by using symbols within the mind.

I think we have proven a Source....which is a network of symbols. Otherwise, how can our world, who does not know how it arranges these symbols, still perceive?

The symbols exist or how can it be explained that we are able to arrange them into geometrical relationships?

Infinity exploring the finite.

Last Edited by ERE3 on 12/21/2012 04:50 PM
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Unit3

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12/21/2012 01:49 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
alas my numbers don't match, but then again... maybe no one's do. Till the next lotto drawing

We Ride....
 Quoting: DODEC 20177375


Sure. Not if you think of it in the traditional sense.

Why not see your numbers match right now, in a different way?
 Quoting: Chaol





I love that thought! ^^^^^^^^^^^
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Unit3

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12/21/2012 01:49 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
I think someone should start an advanced ecsys thread and hopefully Chaol can pop in there and teach us some more. I particularly would like to learn more about mental symbols, ecsys on the fly, predicting the future and visualization techniques. I don't really know how to start a thread though.
 Quoting: Not-Chaol 5877556


Personally, I'm not leaving the space Chaol created. I like being in his Genius map. If anyone starts another thread on this material, then that is creating another space. Also, I think Chaol does enough for us so I wouldn't dare ask him to go teach in my thread. Just sayin'

I don't understand why you don't just post what you are interested in here such as mental symbols, ecsys on the fly, etc:?


Edit: And quite frankly, if one doesn't understand the basics I just mentioned above, then I don't think it's time to move to advanced information. And Chaol has actually mentioned it's not time to move on until we understand some things.

Also, he has mentioned 2013 a few times and that he will tell us more. He is waiting to reveal something to us. I have no idea what it is, but I'm content to play with my Genius plans and see what I can learn. After all, we are really trying to learn HOW we create our reality.

And, as far as I know, only 3 people have actually accomplished anything with their Genius plans. That would be tuuuuuuur, Cat and the poster that just moved to Canada. Marshwiggle and I both are unsure of our results and I know I'm waiting on Chaol to return for feedback to see if I had results or a personal experience.
 Quoting: Unit3


I think many of us have a good understanding of the basics to move up a notch.

A small notch ;)

(Far many more persons have accomplished something with their Genius. Some speak up, though.)
 Quoting: Chaol




Yeah, I was just fishing, heh!!!!

That's exciting....let's do move it up! WhoooHOooo!
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
* * *

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12/21/2012 02:04 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Now that we've briefly discussed use of the Genius how about we talk about ways that we use it in our everyday lives, without realizing it?

Take what you know about how to make a Genius model and apply it to the world that is all ready around you.

This is a tricky one but it is the step that leads up to more advanced uses of Ecsys.

I'll start with a hint:

Everything of your perception is a symbol
 Quoting: Chaol


YES.

Also, I appreciate your use of the word "of" here. Everything of my perception. Good stuff.

:D
---
***
Unit3

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12/21/2012 02:06 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Update for 11/27

3 quantum experiments to keep in mind while viewing this thread:

1. double slit [link to www.youtube.com]

The act of perceiving something causes the the wave of possibilities to collapse manifesting an experience.

2. [link to www.youtube.com]

everything is connected

3. superposition

something unobserved exists in all its possible states
 Quoting: dodec 20177375


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
 Quoting: Chaol


Yup and yup. But for #3 one could say "no energy is independent of perspective(observation)". Until something is observed it seems to sit out there (as a possibility) un-rendered waiting to become logical (enough to be rendered).
 Quoting: Jesse Sovoda



Which gets us back to the question of existence and non-existence. It doesn't exist until it is perceived. We use symbols so we can perceive it. Where do the symbols and/or the knowledge to use them come from?

In our world, we use them without even knowing how. So, they exist.
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Jesse Sovoda

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United States
12/21/2012 05:00 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Update for 11/27

3 quantum experiments to keep in mind while viewing this thread:

1. double slit [link to www.youtube.com]

The act of perceiving something causes the the wave of possibilities to collapse manifesting an experience.

2. [link to www.youtube.com]

everything is connected

3. superposition

something unobserved exists in all its possible states
 Quoting: dodec 20177375


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
 Quoting: Chaol


Yup and yup. But for #3 one could say "no energy is independent of perspective(observation)". Until something is observed it seems to sit out there (as a possibility) un-rendered waiting to become logical (enough to be rendered).
 Quoting: Jesse Sovoda



Which gets us back to the question of existence and non-existence. It doesn't exist until it is perceived. We use symbols so we can perceive it. Where do the symbols and/or the knowledge to use them come from?

In our world, we use them without even knowing how. So, they exist.
 Quoting: Unit3


I imagine it "happened" something like this...

In the beginning (yes the very beginning) there was nothing. This nothing is not nothing, it's something. It is impossible to define as it lies outside of anything we can or will ever perceive (it is perception). This "ability to perceive" required additional things be generated at the same time. It "presupposed" a random soup of pure "true" randomness. Within that "perspective", patterns emerged and not necessarily in a physical sense. Could have been the most simple of concepts at first, but in "true" randomness (without time) you can have complex patterns emerge (including time and the observer). Some could just have initial conditions where minute changes over time are allowed. Include continued existence for a concept that can grow in meaning and adjust itself based on what it is currently experiencing.

You see, I don't know that nothing exists, because nothing is as random as possible. Nothing is ever provable. You can only collect evidence of experience and work to predict and understand the probability for it to happen. This evidence allows you to judge how the future can behave.

As I see it, this is how you(we) got here. Or if nothing else, it is how we formed within the framework of these "physical bodies" and their perceived environment. All of your past could have been generated (in whole) at this moment with you as complex as you are.

Edit- Not only did we come into being capable of experience like this, I believe it is this possibility space that we abuse by using the Genius. We provide perspective a possibility for something previously not logical. Once we allow it to interact it is queued into experience. The more irrelevant the symbol the more possibility for that beautiful "true" random to be abused(utilized).

Last Edited by MutantMessiah on 12/21/2012 05:11 PM
Consider the possibility that you order yourself into being from chaos... You do this, always, in all ways. This "ordering" has resulted in the possibilities you're experiencing, here, now. In each experience you've ever had, more and more of "this" reality is generated logically from your previous experience. Your observation of this unfolding of order and chaos is reality.
Unit3

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12/21/2012 05:54 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
 Quoting: Chaol


Yup and yup. But for #3 one could say "no energy is independent of perspective(observation)". Until something is observed it seems to sit out there (as a possibility) un-rendered waiting to become logical (enough to be rendered).
 Quoting: Jesse Sovoda



Which gets us back to the question of existence and non-existence. It doesn't exist until it is perceived. We use symbols so we can perceive it. Where do the symbols and/or the knowledge to use them come from?

In our world, we use them without even knowing how. So, they exist.
 Quoting: Unit3


I imagine it "happened" something like this...

In the beginning (yes the very beginning) there was nothing. This nothing is not nothing, it's something. It is impossible to define as it lies outside of anything we can or will ever perceive (it is perception). This "ability to perceive" required additional things be generated at the same time. It "presupposed" a random soup of pure "true" randomness. Within that "perspective", patterns emerged and not necessarily in a physical sense. Could have been the most simple of concepts at first, but in "true" randomness (without time) you can have complex patterns emerge (including time and the observer). Some could just have initial conditions where minute changes over time are allowed. Include continued existence for a concept that can grow in meaning and adjust itself based on what it is currently experiencing.

You see, I don't know that nothing exists, because nothing is as random as possible. Nothing is ever provable. You can only collect evidence of experience and work to predict and understand the probability for it to happen. This evidence allows you to judge how the future can behave.

As I see it, this is how you(we) got here. Or if nothing else, it is how we formed within the framework of these "physical bodies" and their perceived environment. All of your past could have been generated (in whole) at this moment with you as complex as you are.

Edit- Not only did we come into being capable of experience like this, I believe it is this possibility space that we abuse by using the Genius. We provide perspective a possibility for something previously not logical. Once we allow it to interact it is queued into experience. The more irrelevant the symbol the more possibility for that beautiful "true" random to be abused(utilized).
 Quoting: Jesse Sovoda



I totally agree with the bolded statement.

I couldn't say about the rest but thank you for sharing it. Gives me a lot to think about.

When I consider that I am at this very moment, perceiving a body, a computer in a room, sitting in a chair, a past, a future, family, etc:, etc:, etc;, without knowing how, then it must be that there is a mind or intelligent design. Something that is providing "material" for me to arrange into perspective.

How could it be otherwise? I don't know what I'm doing but there is some kind of GENIUS involved, LOL!


What is your definition of the subconscious? (Let's not assume any of us knows what anyone else is basing logic on.) I am thinking, at this point, the subconscious is the universal mind that I tap into and re-arrange for perspective of endless possibilities.
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Jesse Sovoda

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12/21/2012 05:58 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...


Yup and yup. But for #3 one could say "no energy is independent of perspective(observation)". Until something is observed it seems to sit out there (as a possibility) un-rendered waiting to become logical (enough to be rendered).
 Quoting: Jesse Sovoda



Which gets us back to the question of existence and non-existence. It doesn't exist until it is perceived. We use symbols so we can perceive it. Where do the symbols and/or the knowledge to use them come from?

In our world, we use them without even knowing how. So, they exist.
 Quoting: Unit3


I imagine it "happened" something like this...

In the beginning (yes the very beginning) there was nothing. This nothing is not nothing, it's something. It is impossible to define as it lies outside of anything we can or will ever perceive (it is perception). This "ability to perceive" required additional things be generated at the same time. It "presupposed" a random soup of pure "true" randomness. Within that "perspective", patterns emerged and not necessarily in a physical sense. Could have been the most simple of concepts at first, but in "true" randomness (without time) you can have complex patterns emerge (including time and the observer). Some could just have initial conditions where minute changes over time are allowed. Include continued existence for a concept that can grow in meaning and adjust itself based on what it is currently experiencing.

You see, I don't know that nothing exists, because nothing is as random as possible. Nothing is ever provable. You can only collect evidence of experience and work to predict and understand the probability for it to happen. This evidence allows you to judge how the future can behave.

As I see it, this is how you(we) got here. Or if nothing else, it is how we formed within the framework of these "physical bodies" and their perceived environment. All of your past could have been generated (in whole) at this moment with you as complex as you are.

Edit- Not only did we come into being capable of experience like this, I believe it is this possibility space that we abuse by using the Genius. We provide perspective a possibility for something previously not logical. Once we allow it to interact it is queued into experience. The more irrelevant the symbol the more possibility for that beautiful "true" random to be abused(utilized).
 Quoting: Jesse Sovoda



I totally agree with the bolded statement.

I couldn't say about the rest but thank you for sharing it. Gives me a lot to think about.

When I consider that I am at this very moment, perceiving a body, a computer in a room, sitting in a chair, a past, a future, family, etc:, etc:, etc;, without knowing how, then it must be that there is a mind or intelligent design. Something that is providing "material" for me to arrange into perspective.

How could it be otherwise? I don't know what I'm doing but there is some kind of GENIUS involved, LOL!


What is your definition of the subconscious? (Let's not assume any of us knows what anyone else is basing logic on.) I am thinking, at this point, the subconscious is the universal mind that I tap into and re-arrange for perspective of endless possibilities.
 Quoting: Unit3


Subconscious, from a hypnotherapy standpoint is the part of you that you're unaware of. I'd argue that's true.
Consider the possibility that you order yourself into being from chaos... You do this, always, in all ways. This "ordering" has resulted in the possibilities you're experiencing, here, now. In each experience you've ever had, more and more of "this" reality is generated logically from your previous experience. Your observation of this unfolding of order and chaos is reality.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:08 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Update for 11/27

3 quantum experiments to keep in mind while viewing this thread:

1. double slit [link to www.youtube.com]

The act of perceiving something causes the the wave of possibilities to collapse manifesting an experience.

2. [link to www.youtube.com]

everything is connected

3. superposition

something unobserved exists in all its possible states
 Quoting: dodec 20177375


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
 Quoting: Chaol


Following on, I am not implying that there are observers or each has its own wave of possibilities, for #1.

There is no observer in the broad sense. There is only that which (seems to) perceive.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:11 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Sol represents this particular brand of physicality. Everything physical (as we know it) has its 'origin' there.

Every 'level' of physicality has a sun, you could say. From the particles on up to the universe.

The potential energy of the sun is made relative through interaction (solar activity).

However, this activity is as much in your body as in what appears to be the center of your solar system.

In one way it's the same thing.

In an other, perhaps more practical, way it's a connection. (In this way you can reach other possibilities of physically-oriented experience.) It's one reason you could stand next to it and not burn (although your clothes and equipment may, as they have a less-relative 'sun' at their center).

The universe is, indeed, your body in all respects.
 Quoting: Chaol



Yes, otherwise, we couldn't perceive it. And since it all operates by "laws," I think we are proving there is a Universal Source.
 Quoting: Unit3


What laws might those be?

It does not seem to follow that there is a "Universal Source" beyond your own perspective, implied from the above.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:15 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
And yet, some perceive, even to the point of knowing how to do so, by using symbols within the mind.

I think we have proven a Source....which is a network of symbols. Otherwise, how can our world, who does not know how it arranges these symbols, still perceive?

The symbols exist or how can it be explained that we are able to arrange them into geometrical relationships?

Infinity exploring the finite.
 Quoting: Unit3


Whatever order we arrange them is logical.

It could be completely random but we would still make sense of it.

That is, indeed, what is done.

We perceive nothing. There is no inherent order or logic in "nothing".

We make sense of it, according to our perspective.

If you relate anything to anything else it is a relationship and, thus, can be logical.

Infinity does not actually exist, for "nothing" is not actually infinite. However, when we perceive of nothing it appears infinite because it is impossible to perceive of anything directly.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:22 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Update for 11/27

3 quantum experiments to keep in mind while viewing this thread:

1. double slit [link to www.youtube.com]

The act of perceiving something causes the the wave of possibilities to collapse manifesting an experience.

2. [link to www.youtube.com]

everything is connected

3. superposition

something unobserved exists in all its possible states
 Quoting: dodec 20177375


For #1, would that not imply that each observer has their own wave of possibilities?

For #3, if it is unobserved then it would not relate to anything and would not thus have a state.
 Quoting: Chaol


Yup and yup. But for #3 one could say "no energy is independent of perspective(observation)". Until something is observed it seems to sit out there (as a possibility) un-rendered waiting to become logical (enough to be rendered).
 Quoting: Jesse Sovoda


Which gets us back to the question of existence and non-existence. It doesn't exist until it is perceived. We use symbols so we can perceive it. Where do the symbols and/or the knowledge to use them come from?

In our world, we use them without even knowing how. So, they exist.
 Quoting: Unit3


Even when it is perceive it does not exist, but only seem to exist because we have related (what appears to be) something with (what appears to be) something else.

We cannot perceive of something because there is only Nothing.

When we relate one illusion with an other, existence seems to be. When, actually, it was never there at all.

The symbols don't come from anywhere. They don't need to.

When you relate one thing with an other thing (both illusions) you have a symbol (that is also an illusion).

If there was ever a "source" it is Nothing. But we don't pull something out of nothing as it would be a waste of energy (and also impossible). There need only be the illusion of us doing so.

We have a taste of this at every moment in physicality. Things appear solid and are 'good enough' for their purpose. They need not be solid throughout or even real.

We need only relate. And relating two illusions together completely satisfies the need to relate.
Dodec
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12/21/2012 06:26 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
alas my numbers don't match, but then again... maybe no one's do. Till the next lotto drawing

We Ride....
 Quoting: DODEC 20177375


Sure. Not if you think of it in the traditional sense.

Why not see your numbers match right now, in a different way?

 Quoting: Chaol


Trying to think untraditionally...

but not coming up with anything useful.

Can you elaborate Chaol?


Thanks
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:30 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
I set my electronics free and now they have a mind of their own. They won't post if they don't want to! My Kindle is still cooperating so far.
 Quoting: 6853315 1298031


They all ready do.

There is far more life in our electronics that we realize. It would be as though there we were surrounded by a whole world of intelligent beings but we only used and analyzed their poopings.

We look at their form of communication and consider it something that we have invented or discovered.

Two elephants are in the forest and, for the first time, they head humans talking. One elephant turns to the other and says, "I have discovered a new type of sound!" and proceeds to dance to get other humans to visit, thus making more sounds.

What we 'invent' is a discovery of something that was all ready there.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:34 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
I'd invite anyone that has had results with their GENIUS to feel free to share here if you feel to do so.

I notice people will post and say the Genius works, but then kind of back off from telling more about it. It could be for any number of reasons and it's your business anyway. But, just know I, for one, would enjoy discussing how we see the plans working.

I wouldn't even mind a discussion analyzing the GENIUS. Chaol says we already use it so I've thought a lot about it. I understand how I create space. I have a desire so I'm looking into it by reading about it, visiting places that relate to it, etc:.

I don't quite understand how I leave a nonsensical symbol in that space though. Does a piece of lint from my sweater with a hint of the blueberry jam from breakfast, accidentally drop off in the space?

I've also thought about the logic. I can be kinda wild and crazy, but not consistently in places (spaces) I visit.
 Quoting: Unit3


As part of the more advanced uses of Ecsys and neuronics we will learn to make use of the understanding that every experience is one of unique symbols.

The doorknob you touched yesterday is entirely unique from the one today. (One that has of course interacted with other aspects of our perspective that would be called "past" and, thus, seems like the same from yesterday.)

You use the Genius at every moment.

It is what 'creates' the illusion of physically-oriented existence.
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:47 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
I set my electronics free and now they have a mind of their own. They won't post if they don't want to! My Kindle is still cooperating so far.
 Quoting: 6853315 1298031

I can see there is a definite space thing going on, LOL! Would love to hear more about it but it might be difficult for you right now. I am looking forward to the day when I can interface with electronics organically. Lucky you!

Edit: Btw, did you use a GENIUS to set them free? Also, I think you could use a GENIUS to get them to co-operate with you a little better.
 Quoting: Unit3


Some may have success in modeling an electronic component in their mind (i.e., in a more relative perspective) and working with it there.

In this way you could, for example, turn on a device from 20 feet away or (as I tend to do) fix something that is broken.

If someone was talking with herself during this process the exchange could go something like this way:

"My laptop is broken. I will make a Genius model of the laptop in my mind because the laptop exists in my perspective. Although it is not as relative as is my hand it is entirely in my perspective and it can be fixed if I change ("fix") my perspective of it. So now I imagine a black box with pictures and other information on it, which will serve as my symbol of it. I need not know how a laptop works but only how perspective works because it exists entirely in my perspective. I imagine it in the palm of my hand. My fingers interact with the pictures and manipulate the information. But wait.. it's breaking. My fingers have much more difficulty in moving the pictures around. I will put my mental laptop down on the floor and crack my fingers and exercise them. I will also blow into the laptop to clear away any defects within the perception. Now I will pick up the laptop and close it and open it again. I will now power on the other aspect of my mental laptop (the more physical laptop that was broken). It works, so now I can use it."

Last Edited by Chaol on 12/23/2012 01:34 PM
Chaol

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12/21/2012 06:49 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
I feel like this is what is holding me back, and would appreciate any comments or suggestions...

The success of the genius clearly is related to "living in the now" and having NO expectations.

 Quoting: DODEC 20177375


Your Genius is much "smarter" (or wise) than you are so it's best not to have expectations about it.

You'll often be surprised about how ingenious the path to your desired perspective may be.

(It's something that you probably would not have thought of when so closely married to physical perspective.)

Does anyone know or have knowledge of what Chaol says about how our representation morphs or becomes the actual thing it represents?

Does it switch along the way?

Appreciate all help,
I feel like I am close and have learned a lot in the past few days.

<3
DODEC
 Quoting: DODEC 20177375


The representations have different aspects. Some are mental (dreams, thoughts, etc) and some are more physically oriented in a similar way to what you consider yourself to be (you'd call this the "real" version).

The representation does not morph. You could say that your experience with the representation morphs.

You can shift between different versions of the same thing. You can also make use of multiple representations simultaneously.

The illusion and the real thing are both representations of the same thing. You just call one illusion real because it's a sibling and the other one not-Real because it's a cousin.

Hope this helps.

Last Edited by Chaol on 12/21/2012 06:53 PM
Chaol

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12/21/2012 07:03 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
I set my electronics free and now they have a mind of their own. They won't post if they don't want to! My Kindle is still cooperating so far.
 Quoting: 6853315 1298031

I can see there is a definite space thing going on, LOL! Would love to hear more about it but it might be difficult for you right now. I am looking forward to the day when I can interface with electronics organically. Lucky you!

Edit: Btw, did you use a GENIUS to set them free? Also, I think you could use a GENIUS to get them to co-operate with you a little better.
 Quoting: Unit3

Even my Kindle wouldn't post, so I am surprised to see my post made its way here.

No Genius used. Just a sudden comprehension of how everything is composed of electricity or photons or neutrinos or whatever particle one wants to use as a representation. I don't want to be a dictator by telling everything that it has to conform to my wishes. So, I told everything that it was free to do whatever it wanted. Well, one ceiling light went out and then another one that could see the first one went out. One of the lights on the outside of my house was still on around mid-morning, and when I went to turn it off, all the switches were off! I peeked at it again, and it had turned itself off. Then the one dead ceiling light came on when I flipped the switch. They're having a party! Running free!

I also tried to post to the Neuronics thread. I wanted to say that the neuronicons look like lightning or electrical arcs. They're circuits. Get it? You can rewire your perception by rewiring the neurons in your brain using the circuitry that Chaol introduced to us. The gaps between the handwritten icons mimic the gaps between the neurons in your brain.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 6853315


This is quite amusing for me to hear how you've discovered that your electronics have 'a mind of their own'.

It's not a Terminator-type scenario where they're waiting to take over or evolving consciousness.

Every aspect of your perspective is related to something else. The relationship is what you'd call consciousness.

The components of an electronic device (or anything else, for that matter) are related to what you are in some way. They are also related to other parts of your perspective.

Don't confuse the inside of an electronic device with its meaning. (It's value, or meaning, is roughly illustrated in the components but we need not know anything about the components the same way you don't need to know about cellular biology in order to communicate with your friends.)

When a device relates to your world it will bring you the news. A music device is an expression of a type of musical relationships, not just a machine that reproduces the sound for your enjoyment.

When you are reading something off of your Kindle the device is as much what you are reading as you are. There is an interaction between both of you. Your Kindle is telling you a story. It knows who you are like you think your dog might. It relates to you in multiple aspects.

Letting your electronics go isn't losing them. It's just allowing them to more fully-express their own values. It's the subconscious, in a way.

You can maintain strict dictates on your subconscious (which is what the 'conscious' is) and all is fine. Nothing wrong with that, of course.

You can also allow your subconscious to more fully-express its own values.

Your Kindle is not an electronic device. It is you. A part of your subconscious no different from the Kindle in your dream.

(In the dream the inside of the Kindle need not exist, either. Only the relationships matter.)


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