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Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.

 
Anonymous Coward
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02/10/2015 11:21 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...




?

Why is it you're losing patience?
 Quoting: ERE3

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288466


because it's right there. I could hit you in the face with it and you still not see would it. it's so obvious that to those who do see it, it drives you crazy to see those that don't see it (99.99999% of man and woman). you would say I am crazy when it is you that is under the spell.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288466


Our every perception and experience can help us to understand our reality.

But it is one thing to have an idea that "everything is an illusion" and another thing to understand how and why the illusion is there, and the amazing way that illusions beget our reality.

If we say something like, "you would say I am crazy when it is you..." are we ignoring that the illusion of separation is there?

Even if we increase our understanding a million-fold, there is still a lot more to understand. But, importantly, there may be nothing wrong with participating in the illusion, if illusions are all there is.

Perhaps we need not understand the illusion at all, only interact with them. And so here we are, interacting with illusions in all manner of ways.

There is no need to be impatient when time is part of the illusion.
 Quoting: Chaom


The understanding of how and why first requires a recognition of it. The statement was made for effect.
Anonymous Coward
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02/10/2015 11:24 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
we all have a story. the difference between you and I, is that you believe your story is true and I see mine for the lie it is.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288466


Is it possible that illusions could be a representation of what is "true"?

And, if so, that we should not fault perspective for being unable to contain the entirety of "truth" but could, instead, learn to work with perspective to uncover the illusion?

Something only seems to be a lie because we have compared it with something else.

By saying one thing is a lie, we have presumed to know what "truth" is.

I would say it is impossible for us to perceive "truth", so therefore lies do not exist.

What we may call a lie or an illusion is very likely to be an illustration of what cannot be perceived (truth).

Hopefully, we can begin to see that this illusion-within-the-illusion is actually the only way that we can perceive what is true.
 Quoting: Chaom


Illusions could be anything. That does not mean they are anything other than illusions. Lie is a proxy for something that has no definition.
Anonymous Coward
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02/10/2015 11:28 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
because it's right there. I could hit you in the face with it and you still not see would it. it's so obvious that to those who do see it, it drives you crazy to see those that don't see it (99.99999% of man and woman). you would say I am crazy when it is you that is under the spell.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288466



So what? Your attitude makes it undesirable.

I think you're mad because you went about it the hard way and it pisses you off. You're not impatient with anyone but yourself.
 Quoting: ERE3


It is interesting to see such exchanges when you realize that we are actually talking to ourselves, i.e., another aspect of our perspective.

It could also be said, "So what? My attitude makes it undesirable. I think I'm mad because I went about it the hard way and it pisses me off. I'm not impatient with anyone but myself."

Ahh.. how vast the self is. Even the reality of our own hands seem to be another world entirely. Do we feel our heart actually breathing and giving us life, or do we just know it is there? How easy is it to think that what is not immediately relative to us is "not us".
 Quoting: Chaom


Yes and sometimes you need to turn the sword on yourself.
ERE3

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02/10/2015 11:46 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Hopefully we can illustrate the how of it all while at the same time maintaining integrity of the why.

There is, after all, a reason that the illusion of separation is there.

And, for myself, illustrating the logic of why it is likely not unity or oneness, or even love, that we actually seek but a far greater concept that knows no bounds.
 Quoting: Chaom




Chaom, will all the above be in this first book?
 Quoting: ERE3


It will be there but you are unlikely to get the message. I have tried to be the finger pointing at the moon for you but you are more interested in your stories.

Not-chaom.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000




I appreciate that you want to help me but I have tried your path and it's not for me.
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
ERE3

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02/10/2015 11:51 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Our every perception and experience can help us to understand our reality.

But it is one thing to have an idea that "everything is an illusion" and another thing to understand how and why the illusion is there, and the amazing way that illusions beget our reality.
 Quoting: Chaom




Chaol told us when we see how we create the illusion, then reality is had. I don't see anything wrong with that idea.



Even if we increase our understanding a million-fold, there is still a lot more to understand.
 Quoting: Chaom



That's the exciting part to me, that there is so much to learn.
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
ERE3

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02/10/2015 11:53 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Hopefully, we can begin to see that this illusion-within-the-illusion is actually the only way that we can perceive what is true.
 Quoting: Chaom



Verrrry interesting.

hf
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
ERE3

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02/10/2015 11:55 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
It is interesting to see such exchanges when you realize that we are actually talking to ourselves, i.e., another aspect of our perspective.

It could also be said, "So what? My attitude makes it undesirable. I think I'm mad because I went about it the hard way and it pisses me off. I'm not impatient with anyone but myself."

Ahh.. how vast the self is. Even the reality of our own hands seem to be another world entirely. Do we feel our heart actually breathing and giving us life, or do we just know it is there? How easy is it to think that what is not immediately relative to us is "not us".
 Quoting: Chaom




Oh, I got the message loud and clear what this exchange is about for me. And I agree, it's all about me, lol!
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Anonymous Coward
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02/10/2015 11:55 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Hopefully we can illustrate the how of it all while at the same time maintaining integrity of the why.

There is, after all, a reason that the illusion of separation is there.

And, for myself, illustrating the logic of why it is likely not unity or oneness, or even love, that we actually seek but a far greater concept that knows no bounds.
 Quoting: Chaom




Chaom, will all the above be in this first book?
 Quoting: ERE3


It will be there but you are unlikely to get the message. I have tried to be the finger pointing at the moon for you but you are more interested in your stories.

Not-chaom.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000




I appreciate that you want to help me but I have tried your path and it's not for me.
 Quoting: ERE3


The post was not intended for you alone but it definitely was not one you could pass by without replying. The attraction was unstoppable.
Chaom

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02/10/2015 11:56 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
The understanding of how and why first requires a recognition of it. The statement was made for effect.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


We won't get into the validity of cause and effect (considering the illusion of time) but if you agree that everything is a representation of something else then what is it we're recognizing?
Chaom

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02/10/2015 11:57 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Illusions could be anything. That does not mean they are anything other than illusions. Lie is a proxy for something that has no definition.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


A lie would imply that there is truth to be told.

But let's take an example. Can you tell me one thing that you think is a "lie"?
Chaom

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02/10/2015 11:58 PM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Yes and sometimes you need to turn the sword on yourself.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


Illusions doing things with other illusions are still illusions, aren't they?

We are so distracted with doing things we forget what we are being.
Chaom

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02/11/2015 12:00 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...


Chaom, will all the above be in this first book?
 Quoting: ERE3


It will be there but you are unlikely to get the message. I have tried to be the finger pointing at the moon for you but you are more interested in your stories.

Not-chaom.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


I appreciate that you want to help me but I have tried your path and it's not for me.
 Quoting: ERE3


The post was not intended for you alone but it definitely was not one you could pass by without replying. The attraction was unstoppable.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


Would you like to talk about what is really going on, or should we just leave it at that?
ERE3

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02/11/2015 12:02 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...




Chaom, will all the above be in this first book?
 Quoting: ERE3


It will be there but you are unlikely to get the message. I have tried to be the finger pointing at the moon for you but you are more interested in your stories.

Not-chaom.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000




I appreciate that you want to help me but I have tried your path and it's not for me.
 Quoting: ERE3


The post was not intended for you alone but it definitely was not one you could pass by without replying. The attraction was unstoppable.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000




So you notice I interact with all parts of myself! Good for you.
"We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka
Anonymous Coward
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02/11/2015 12:16 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
The understanding of how and why first requires a recognition of it. The statement was made for effect.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


We won't get into the validity of cause and effect (considering the illusion of time) but if you agree that everything is a representation of something else then what is it we're recognizing?
 Quoting: Chaom


Cause can not be perceived. Only effect can be perceived.
Anonymous Coward
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02/11/2015 12:19 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Yes and sometimes you need to turn the sword on yourself.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


Illusions doing things with other illusions are still illusions, aren't they?

We are so distracted with doing things we forget what we are being.
 Quoting: Chaom


Turn the sword on being then and see how that fairs.
Anonymous Coward
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02/11/2015 12:20 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
...


It will be there but you are unlikely to get the message. I have tried to be the finger pointing at the moon for you but you are more interested in your stories.

Not-chaom.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


I appreciate that you want to help me but I have tried your path and it's not for me.
 Quoting: ERE3


The post was not intended for you alone but it definitely was not one you could pass by without replying. The attraction was unstoppable.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


Would you like to talk about what is really going on, or should we just leave it at that?
 Quoting: Chaom


Let's contiune on what is really going on
Anonymous Coward
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02/11/2015 12:26 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Illusions could be anything. That does not mean they are anything other than illusions. Lie is a proxy for something that has no definition.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


A lie would imply that there is truth to be told.

But let's take an example. Can you tell me one thing that you think is a "lie"?
 Quoting: Chaom


That human beings are a single consciousness per body.
RE_LKing

User ID: 61272890
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02/11/2015 05:52 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
we all have a story. the difference between you and I, is that you believe your story is true and I see mine for the lie it is.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288466


Is it possible that illusions could be a representation of what is "true"?

And, if so, that we should not fault perspective for being unable to contain the entirety of "truth" but could, instead, learn to work with perspective to uncover the illusion?

Something only seems to be a lie because we have compared it with something else.

By saying one thing is a lie, we have presumed to know what "truth" is.

I would say it is impossible for us to perceive "truth", so therefore lies do not exist.

What we may call a lie or an illusion is very likely to be an illustration of what cannot be perceived (truth).

Hopefully, we can begin to see that this illusion-within-the-illusion is actually the only way that we can perceive what is true.
 Quoting: Chaom


That's that smart ass patience dismissing with funny truth logic and dumbfounded backwards opposition to say we can all go round in circles if you want to be a dick, or we can all just move forward.
Your patience always astounded me, I'd of just said %&±£ you and moved onto the next post.
To the Chaom!
RE_LKing

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02/11/2015 06:59 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Truth is this-non what so ever.

According to a BBC documentary they explained how a certain big european leader has maintained power for 15+ years by funding everyone, even the opposition, infiltrating their ranks and effectively controlling their party...let's say 7,000 years of a totalitarian heirachy later, what would of changed??

No mortal knows a damn thing, so we could all keep chasing the shadow trails left to confuse or focus on your own dreams, not the cryptic messages, what drives you on the inside to get the fcuk up in a morning and do what you need to do.
Anonymous Coward
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02/11/2015 07:19 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
@OP

Are you a demon (genie, jinn) in a human form then?

Humans can't visit different dimensions like demons.

Even if you are, you lie.

No beings can travel to future and back.
Anonymous Coward
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02/11/2015 07:20 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
@OP

Explain me a day which is like a year, a day which is like a month, a day which is like a week, a day which is like a usual day.
Chaom

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02/11/2015 07:23 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
The understanding of how and why first requires a recognition of it. The statement was made for effect.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


We won't get into the validity of cause and effect (considering the illusion of time) but if you agree that everything is a representation of something else then what is it we're recognizing?
 Quoting: Chaom


Cause can not be perceived. Only effect can be perceived.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


So in what way can I not perceive my fingers type this? Can I perceive what I typed after I post?

If time is an illusion, then so is cause and effect.
Chaom

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02/11/2015 07:24 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Yes and sometimes you need to turn the sword on yourself.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


Illusions doing things with other illusions are still illusions, aren't they?

We are so distracted with doing things we forget what we are being.
 Quoting: Chaom


Turn the sword on being then and see how that fairs.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


Sorry, I don't know what that means.
Chaom

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02/11/2015 07:28 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Would you like to talk about what is really going on, or should we just leave it at that?
 Quoting: Chaom


Let's contiune on what is really going on
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


If there is one thing that you could understand or change, what would it be?
Chaom

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02/11/2015 07:30 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Illusions could be anything. That does not mean they are anything other than illusions. Lie is a proxy for something that has no definition.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 65389000


A lie would imply that there is truth to be told.

But let's take an example. Can you tell me one thing that you think is a "lie"?
 Quoting: Chaom


That human beings are a single consciousness per body.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 66777011


So where does this "lie" come from? Anyone or anywhere? Is it written in a book somewhere?
Chaom

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02/11/2015 07:30 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
we all have a story. the difference between you and I, is that you believe your story is true and I see mine for the lie it is.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288466


Is it possible that illusions could be a representation of what is "true"?

And, if so, that we should not fault perspective for being unable to contain the entirety of "truth" but could, instead, learn to work with perspective to uncover the illusion?

Something only seems to be a lie because we have compared it with something else.

By saying one thing is a lie, we have presumed to know what "truth" is.

I would say it is impossible for us to perceive "truth", so therefore lies do not exist.

What we may call a lie or an illusion is very likely to be an illustration of what cannot be perceived (truth).

Hopefully, we can begin to see that this illusion-within-the-illusion is actually the only way that we can perceive what is true.
 Quoting: Chaom


That's that smart ass patience dismissing with funny truth logic and dumbfounded backwards opposition to say we can all go round in circles if you want to be a dick, or we can all just move forward.
Your patience always astounded me, I'd of just said %&±£ you and moved onto the next post.
To the Chaom!
 Quoting: RE_LKing


We are all our own interpretations of the same thing.

It is not difficult to have patience for ourselves :)
Chaom

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02/11/2015 07:31 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
@OP

Are you a demon (genie, jinn) in a human form then?

Humans can't visit different dimensions like demons.

Even if you are, you lie.

No beings can travel to future and back.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67927299


Probably!

You raise a good point.

Chaol is a demon!
Chaom

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02/11/2015 07:32 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
@OP

Explain me a day which is like a year, a day which is like a month, a day which is like a week, a day which is like a usual day.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67927299


Chaol, the OP, is not coming back.

But if you would like me to answer, I would first need to understand your question. What do you mean?
MutantMessiah

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02/11/2015 07:43 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
Chaom,
Does "being" Chaol still feel like a dream you can't recall or has processing/synthesizing the material led to a kind of reintegration?

I ask, because you seem (and I feel)... more "complete" lately.
Consider the possibility that you order yourself into being from chaos... You do this, always, in all ways. This "ordering" has resulted in the possibilities you're experiencing, here, now. In each experience you've ever had, more and more of "this" reality is generated logically from your previous experience. Your observation of this unfolding of order and chaos is reality.
Anonymous Coward
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02/11/2015 07:49 AM
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Re: Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking.
@OP

Explain me a day which is like a year, a day which is like a month, a day which is like a week, a day which is like a usual day.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67927299


Chaol, the OP, is not coming back.

But if you would like me to answer, I would first need to understand your question. What do you mean?
 Quoting: Chaom


If you are not a Demon, you cannot understand the question.





GLP