I know the bible well - ask me a question that you have never understood about it or christianity

Please Explain this scripture !! Joh 5:4 For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.


It was a Jewish belief that said the angels came and stirred the water in the pool of Beththesda and the 1st one in the pool would be healed of what so ever was wrong with him.

What sort of pool was it ? Why couldn't the the man roll into the pool ! Now you use the word stirred and king James called it troubled ! Was the angel in the water or other ??


My apologies. I have gave you a quick answer. Allow me to elaborabe for you.

John 5:1-3
"After this there was a feast of the Jews and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. Now there is at Jerusalem by the sheep market a pool, which is called in the Hebrew tongue Bethesda, having five porches. In these lay a great multitude of ipotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool and troubled the water, whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had".

The fourth verse is not in the better manuscripts. That does not mean I do not believe in the inerrancy of the Scriptures, because I do! I only say that to let you know that we should heed scholarship, fundamental scholarship which says that it was not in the better manuscripts.

What does that mean??? It simply means that a scribe put this verse in as a word of explination. I believe it is factual and it helps us to understand why this large crowd was gathered there. To me, it is not an important thing and actually helps us in our understanding of WHY.

So..........Now we know why they were there. The belief was that an angel "troubled"(means to STIR UP) the water at a certain time. The angle was not in the water, he just moved it around.

All of the people there were "lame, blind, halted". They could not move quickly. Since this man had been there for 38 years I would say that he was the worst of the lot.

But the real lesson here is that Jesus wanted this man to get his eyes off of the water and onto HIM. He had the condition of most of us today. We sit around watching the pool waiting for something to happen. Churches are full of people waiting for some great sweeping emotion to take them over.

Then there are those who put off coming to Christ waiting for a more convient time or trying to find more proof of His existance.

I hope this answers your question.

Praise The Holy Of Holy :: I find your answer spirit led !! I enjoyed it quite well ! Tomorrow I will ask a spirit led Preacher the same question and compare the answer ! Yes keep your eyes on Jesus !! Amen

The paster I spoke with always amazes me with his spirit let vision of scriptures ! He said the stirring was a bubbling up ! Like a boiling only not hot ! Made me think of silver water !

Ruotsher, thanks for your reply, so only those that know not the law will be judged by their hearts? One more reason for me to wish that I was born in the Amazon and not in a crooked, twisted society where I don't know what to believe.

I don't reject Christ per say, I just don't trust a doctrine that I can clearly see to be edited and mis-interpreted/mis-translated, I mean how many different versions are there of the Bible? Why is that?

It's too bad, I always thought I had a good heart.

ok !

First, I highly recommend the book to you, when you get a chance. You will likely find yourself ordering the hard copy to have it on hand.......

Ok, trying to find some neutral ground here to start with. We both resepct Dr. Heiser's work. There's are neutral ground.

In his articles, he talks of the Divine Council....and he talks of them (the council) as being gods, acknowledging the problem that some have with seeing polye...poly poly something --- multiple gods. He is able to by-pass that through his studies and research and his conclusion is these gods are the created "sons" of God.

They aren't human, they are spirit beings.

do you disagree with his conclusions?

'J. Vernon MaGee' is in truth J. Vernon McGee!

contadiction busted! major you stand corrected!

Ruotsher, thanks for your reply, so only those that know not the law will be judged by their hearts? One more reason for me to wish that I was born in the Amazon and not in a crooked, twisted society where I don't know what to believe.

I don't reject Christ per say, I just don't trust a doctrine that I can clearly see to be edited and mis-interpreted/mis-translated, I mean how many different versions are there of the Bible? Why is that?

It's too bad, I always thought I had a good heart.

What do you think of King Solomon?Who's seal was the pentagram, the same symbol that was used for Witchcraft and Wizardry, and still is today. He is considered to be one of the greatest Wizards of all time. One of God's most beloved men was a Witch, or Wizard rather.



His seal is the six sided star of david, not a 5 sided pentagram

The "sons of God" in Genesis 6, IMO are humans. THey procreate and according Matthew 22:30, angels do not procreate BECAUSE THEY ARE IN FACT SPIRITUAL and were created beings. The spiritual and physical can not reproduce.

No matter how we approach this, in the light of Matthew 22:30 there is going to be a problem in making the angels and humans come together. That one Bible verse will always pop up and say..."Ooops, that wont work".

Now as for TWO lines of humans. Ask yourself, why did God bring the flood? Genesis 6:5. "There was evil continuesly"

Where did it all come from. Adam knew God. Eve knew God. Able knew God. Cain kew but rejected God. Correct???

Yes!! sO AT THAT TIME WE SEE two LINES OF HUMANITY.
Cain who killed his brother and left and went into the land of Nod.Genesis 4:16.

Adam and Eve. Then Adam and Eve had another child, Seth (Genesis 4:25) and he knew God as did Adam and Eve because in verse 26 we see, "and to Seth to him also there was born a son and he called him Enos, then began men to call upon the name of the Lord".

So then we come to Genesis 6 and the problem with identifing the "Sons of God" and the "daughters of men".
I still am convince that the "sons of God' are the Godly line born through Adam and Seth, and the "daughters of men" are the un-godly line of humans born through Cain.

As time went on, these two lines intermarried and as a result the entire human race was totally corruped so that God had to bring on the flood.

Thanks for the reply Major and ruotsher, I've been telling myself and others for years now that proof of "God" or a creator is all around us and also inside us.

I do seek God with my heart, soul, and mind, I am a truthseeker, I only got this far by asking why so I'm not ready to stop dissenting and fall in line by accepting a figure (Jesus) who I have almost no doubt was real and good but whose message may well be skewed and used by the money makers you mentioned.

Besides that, the whole idea of Biblical Hell with its various eternal punishments and suffering has always seemed far fetched to me, why would God want to banish any of his "children" to Hell or should I say "sheol" ;) Why not let nature take its course, I think good would triumph either way.

Better yet, how does a God that should be infallible end up creating an angel (Satan) that causes us to sin and therefore go through a constant struggle. Couldn't God have just done away with Satan the minute he realized he was evil instead of burdening us with this "test" of life?

Way to many questions, not enough answers

Damn that free will...

'Thank you for the rebuke my friend.'
now that we have that bit of business taken care of, let me say how much i appreciate your efforts on this thread. if you're in err in any other way, i don't see it.
that is all.

Thanks for the reply Major and ruotsher, I've been telling myself and others for years now that proof of "God" or a creator is all around us and also inside us.

I do seek God with my heart, soul, and mind, I am a truthseeker, I only got this far by asking why so I'm not ready to stop dissenting and fall in line by accepting a figure (Jesus) who I have almost no doubt was real and good but whose message may well be skewed and used by the money makers you mentioned.

Besides that, the whole idea of Biblical Hell with its various eternal punishments and suffering has always seemed far fetched to me, why would God want to banish any of his "children" to Hell or should I say "sheol" ;) Why not let nature take its course, I think good would triumph either way.

Better yet, how does a God that should be infallible end up creating an angel (Satan) that causes us to sin and therefore go through a constant struggle. Couldn't God have just done away with Satan the minute he realized he was evil instead of burdening us with this "test" of life?

Way to many questions, not enough answers

Damn that free will...

The "sons of God" in Genesis 6, IMO are humans. THey procreate and according Matthew 22:30, angels do not procreate BECAUSE THEY ARE IN FACT SPIRITUAL and were created beings. The spiritual and physical can not reproduce.

No matter how we approach this, in the light of Matthew 22:30 there is going to be a problem in making the angels and humans come together. That one Bible verse will always pop up and say..."Ooops, that wont work".

Now as for TWO lines of humans. Ask yourself, why did God bring the flood? Genesis 6:5. "There was evil continuesly"

Where did it all come from. Adam knew God. Eve knew God. Able knew God. Cain kew but rejected God. Correct???

Yes!! sO AT THAT TIME WE SEE two LINES OF HUMANITY.
Cain who killed his brother and left and went into the land of Nod.Genesis 4:16.

Adam and Eve. Then Adam and Eve had another child, Seth (Genesis 4:25) and he knew God as did Adam and Eve because in verse 26 we see, "and to Seth to him also there was born a son and he called him Enos, then began men to call upon the name of the Lord".

So then we come to Genesis 6 and the problem with identifing the "Sons of God" and the "daughters of men".
I still am convince that the "sons of God' are the Godly line born through Adam and Seth, and the "daughters of men" are the un-godly line of humans born through Cain.

As time went on, these two lines intermarried and as a result the entire human race was totally corruped so that God had to bring on the flood.


The sons of God in Genesis 6 is translated from Hebrew as “ben elohiym”. The only other place you see this is in Job. They MUST be the same. The line of Seth is never referred to as ben elohiym.

Now remember what you said? You must read what it says, not what you want it to say: 30For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
This says nothing about gender or the qualities/use thereof…..I’m just sayin’ ~

Final point, if the flood was due to the continuous state of sin of man (which I cannot believe was worse than what we have today; God will need to apologize to those who He wiped out in the flood if this is the case) then why are we told 7And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

What did the animals, plants and creeping things due that grieved God so bad He wanted them destroyed as well?

And finally, why would Seth’s line marrying into Cain’s line create giants and men of renknown? And who are the nephilim, translated “fallen ones” that were in the days before Noah, and after Noah?

you are my good friend.
thanks.
x

Final point, if the flood was due to the continuous state of sin of man (which I cannot believe was worse than what we have today; God will need to apologize to those who He wiped out in the flood if this is the case) then why are we told 7And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

What did the animals, plants and creeping things due that grieved God so bad He wanted them destroyed as well?

And finally, why would Seth’s line marrying into Cain’s line create giants and men of renknown? And who are the nephilim, translated “fallen ones” that were in the days before Noah, and after Noah?


Notice again Matthew 22:30. BUT 1st read verse 25-29.
The CONTEXT of the verses is a question to Jesus as to whom will be this womans husband in heaven.

The answer from Jesus was about that question and He said she would not marry not be given in marriage or, she will be like the angels who are asexual. Resurrected saints will have a glorified body like angels which means we will not have sexual relation either, JUST LIKE THE ANGELS.

Old Testament (bene ha-'elohim, "sons of God" (Genesis 6:2,4.)

Job 1:6; 2:1; bene 'elohim, "sons of God" (Job 38:7); bene 'elim, "ye mighty."

Notice the different word used in each. Could that account for the different opinions??? JUst asking.

Possibly.....I don't think so..I'd have to go back and look again.....
RENOWN would be "important". Princes etc.

The "sons of God" in Genesis 6, IMO are humans. THey procreate and according Matthew 22:30, angels do not procreate BECAUSE THEY ARE IN FACT SPIRITUAL and were created beings. The spiritual and physical can not reproduce.

No matter how we approach this, in the light of Matthew 22:30 there is going to be a problem in making the angels and humans come together. That one Bible verse will always pop up and say..."Ooops, that wont work".

Now as for TWO lines of humans. Ask yourself, why did God bring the flood? Genesis 6:5. "There was evil continuesly"

Where did it all come from. Adam knew God. Eve knew God. Able knew God. Cain kew but rejected God. Correct???

Yes!! sO AT THAT TIME WE SEE two LINES OF HUMANITY.
Cain who killed his brother and left and went into the land of Nod.Genesis 4:16.

Adam and Eve. Then Adam and Eve had another child, Seth (Genesis 4:25) and he knew God as did Adam and Eve because in verse 26 we see, "and to Seth to him also there was born a son and he called him Enos, then began men to call upon the name of the Lord".

So then we come to Genesis 6 and the problem with identifing the "Sons of God" and the "daughters of men".
I still am convince that the "sons of God' are the Godly line born through Adam and Seth, and the "daughters of men" are the un-godly line of humans born through Cain.

As time went on, these two lines intermarried and as a result the entire human race was totally corruped so that God had to bring on the flood.


The sons of God in Genesis 6 is translated from Hebrew as “ben elohiym”. The only other place you see this is in Job. They MUST be the same. The line of Seth is never referred to as ben elohiym.

Now remember what you said? You must read what it says, not what you want it to say: 30For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
This says nothing about gender or the qualities/use thereof…..I’m just sayin’ ~

Final point, if the flood was due to the continuous state of sin of man (which I cannot believe was worse than what we have today; God will need to apologize to those who He wiped out in the flood if this is the case) then why are we told 7And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

What did the animals, plants and creeping things due that grieved God so bad He wanted them destroyed as well?

And finally, why would Seth’s line marrying into Cain’s line create giants and men of renknown? And who are the nephilim, translated “fallen ones” that were in the days before Noah, and after Noah?

Please Explain this scripture !! Joh 5:4 For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.


It was a Jewish belief that said the angels came and stirred the water in the pool of Beththesda and the 1st one in the pool would be healed of what so ever was wrong with him.

What sort of pool was it ? Why couldn't the the man roll into the pool ! Now you use the word stirred and king James called it troubled ! Was the angel in the water or other ??


My apologies. I have gave you a quick answer. Allow me to elaborabe for you.

John 5:1-3
"After this there was a feast of the Jews and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. Now there is at Jerusalem by the sheep market a pool, which is called in the Hebrew tongue Bethesda, having five porches. In these lay a great multitude of ipotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool and troubled the water, whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had".

The fourth verse is not in the better manuscripts. That does not mean I do not believe in the inerrancy of the Scriptures, because I do! I only say that to let you know that we should heed scholarship, fundamental scholarship which says that it was not in the better manuscripts.

What about "nephilim"....where do you believe they came from?

What about "nephilim"....where do you believe they came from?



Who are the “sons of God”?

Who were the Nephilim?

Genesis 6

--------------------------------------------------------

There are many different beliefs about the “Sons of God”. One of the reasons for the misunderstandings on this subject is the fact that the bible is specifically written to give an understanding about the things of earth and a few things about the heavens. Information about the sons of God is heavenly knowledge and not earthly knowledge. God has chosen to give this information concerning the sons of God to me.

In considering who the sons of God are as mentioned in Genesis 6, there are two things to pay attention to. The first is the fact that the phrase "sons of God" in the Old Testament is no different than the same phrase in the new testament. We were not ever told to separate the meaning of these words between the Old and the New Testaments. Yet many do so blindly. In the Old Testament we are told in the book of Job that there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves to God. They presented themselves to give a report of their work. We learn that Satan also showed up at this meeting to give his report. Remember these were sons of God. We are also informed in Genesis 6 that the sons of God saw that the daughters of MEN were fair and took them as wives. Some want to say that these sons of God were angels and others want to call them the children of Seth. However they are neither. For they were truly sons of God in the same way that John said that we have been given the power to become the sons of God. Before I bring you to the conclusion of this statement we need to examine the second thing I mentioned we need to consider. This second thing is a statement made by Jesus that gives a hint to who the sons of God are. Jesus says in John 14:2 “In my Father's house there are many mansions. If it were no so I would have told you.” Why would Jesus need to say “if it were not so I would have told you”? Now look again at what was “so” according to Jesus. What was “so” was the fact that there were many mansions in the Father’s house. We view a mansion as a large house, however we would do better to consider a mansion as a place of habitation or residence. Unfortunately many think that in the Father’s house that there is only one mansion or place of residency, and they also think that the one and only mansion or place of residency is the mansion or place of residency called Earth. But Jesus said that in the Father’s house (which by the way is the UNIVERSE) there are many mansions. Jesus further says that if earth was the only mansion (place of residence) He would have told us “so”. Jesus is saying here that I never told you that this is the only place where there is a residence (mansion) or a place for people to live. Unfortunately we make that assumption based upon a misunderstanding of Genesis 1:1. However when Genesis says that in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth it means just that, all that is in the HEAVENS and (or including) the Earth. The problem is because of the fall of Satan, some mansions like earth became victims of sin and some did not become victims of the disease called sin. Those mansions where there is sin have need of a Savior called Jesus. Those mansions where there is no sin, already know that Jesus is God in the flesh and they assist God in His planned workings for the Universe or His house.

Now if we place both pieces of information together then we have a better picture of who the sons of God were that are mentioned in Genesis 6. Sons of God are human beings who God has commissioned to come to this planet to assist Him in His planned working for this planet. They are from planets that have not been infected with sin or planets that were infected with sin but were able to recover through the blood of Jesus Christ who went to that planet and suffered and died their for their sake, and now they also have eternal life. That is why we read about them in the book of Job coming to present themselves before God to give a report of their work.

The job of the sons of God is to assist God in His planned working on the planets where there is sin. The sons of God who were assigned to earth were to assist God instead of becoming selfish and only consider their own wishes. In considering their own selfish desires instead of remaining committed to their commission they began to choose the women of earth (daughters of men) for mates. This was a violation of their directions and the mixing of the genetics was used by Satan to tamper with the genetics causing giants or what is known as the Nephilim to be created in the land. The Nephilim were the offspring created by the mating of the sons of God with the daughters of men and the tampering of the genes by Satan. Yes, even then Satan was tampering with genetics. Of course God fixed this problem by sending the flood of Noah's time. There are yet sons of God here on Earth today who report in to God. Many have already left because they know we are in the “End of Time” for this planet. You also through the redemptive power of Jesus Christ can be a son of God. Behold what manner or love the Father has bestowed upon us that we should be called the sons of God!!

Thanks for the reply Major and ruotsher, I've been telling myself and others for years now that proof of "God" or a creator is all around us and also inside us.

I do seek God with my heart, soul, and mind, I am a truthseeker, I only got this far by asking why so I'm not ready to stop dissenting and fall in line by accepting a figure (Jesus) who I have almost no doubt was real and good but whose message may well be skewed and used by the money makers you mentioned.

Besides that, the whole idea of Biblical Hell with its various eternal punishments and suffering has always seemed far fetched to me, why would God want to banish any of his "children" to Hell or should I say "sheol" ;) Why not let nature take its course, I think good would triumph either way.

Better yet, how does a God that should be infallible end up creating an angel (Satan) that causes us to sin and therefore go through a constant struggle. Couldn't God have just done away with Satan the minute he realized he was evil instead of burdening us with this "test" of life?

Way to many questions, not enough answers

Damn that free will...

Final point, if the flood was due to the continuous state of sin of man (which I cannot believe was worse than what we have today; God will need to apologize to those who He wiped out in the flood if this is the case) then why are we told 7And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

What did the animals, plants and creeping things due that grieved God so bad He wanted them destroyed as well?

And finally, why would Seth’s line marrying into Cain’s line create giants and men of renknown? And who are the nephilim, translated “fallen ones” that were in the days before Noah, and after Noah?


Notice again Matthew 22:30. BUT 1st read verse 25-29.
The CONTEXT of the verses is a question to Jesus as to whom will be this womans husband in heaven.

The answer from Jesus was about that question and He said she would not marry not be given in marriage or, she will be like the angels who are asexual. Resurrected saints will have a glorified body like angels which means we will not have sexual relation either, JUST LIKE THE ANGELS.

Old Testament (bene ha-'elohim, "sons of God" (Genesis 6:2,4.)

Job 1:6; 2:1; bene 'elohim, "sons of God" (Job 38:7); bene 'elim, "ye mighty."

Notice the different word used in each. Could that account for the different opinions??? JUst asking.

Possibly.....I don't think so..I'd have to go back and look again.....
RENOWN would be "important". Princes etc.


What did the animals, plants and creeping things due that grieved God so bad He wanted them destroyed as well?

What about "nephilim"....where do you believe they came from?

Hello OP. Your thoughts on the daughters of Zion, please.

Peace to you. Have faith in love and in each other.