They lost me at aliens will be covered ....sorry. I read on the bill in BIG BOLD wording illegals are not covered... This kind of shit is what makes us look like idiots! The fucking bill is bad enough all on it's own without the lies. I think they are being sent out by the left to piss people off and make the mis- quote the bill thus making anything they say null!
Well, if YOU had conducted YOUR due diligence, you would understand that the loophole is THERE IS NO MANDATE TO VERIFY IF A PERSON IS HERE LEGALLY OR NOT.
So, I ask: who looks like the idiot?
/
UMM yes there is... they are going to give us rfd cards and shit.... keep reading.
Now I have not went through and checked everything it is quoting. I stopped since they are now working on a NEW bill but they are merging old with new so I expect to see it somewhere in there as well. I would think if they are issuing cards they would need birth records and such as most states require those for a simple drivers license. I am not sure why you are attacking me. I only made the statement that we must be carefully about reading and passing forward unsigned e-mails (as the op on that post said is where the info came from and they weren't sure it was true) as they get passed forward and everyone ends up quoting them as fact and when found that some facts are indeed not fact the person and all in the apposed movement end up looking like idiots to those that are for the bills.
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 794732
Don't forget that there is also 800 pages of amendments
they did not put on line. ___________________________________ KNOW THY ENEMY:
THIS IS NOT YOUR MOTHER'S DEMOCRATIC PARTY
___________________________________
COUNTDOWN TO 12/21/2012
STARTED ON 04/26/2009
We need REVOLUTION
a. a turning round or rotating, as on an axis.
b. a moving in a circular or curving course, as about a central point.
c. a single cycle in such a course.
___________________________
[link to www.sarahpac.com]
There is no thing endowed with life - from man, who is enslaving the elements, to the nimblest creature - in all this world that does not sway in its turn. Whenever action is born from force, though it be infinitesimal, the cosmic balance is upset and the universal motion results.
1990 pages? Somehow that bothers me. Not sure why exactly. Just does.
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 642760
Maybe the fact that is is purposefully set against us
The fact that the Constitution has few pages-35 I believe and they want to trash it in any way
Yet they cannot even wrote a congressional plan-so they have allowed Insurance agents and bIg Pharma to write most of it...oh so many reasons why this is so wrong
I am speaking from a professional viewpoint-medical
And also a wealth of knowledge about govt run healthcare like the VA or even other private hospitals as the govt has been screwing around with health care since Nixon found HMOs could create profit for the govt...and less care for the consumers...being he was rep. *************************************
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."
~Alice's Adventures in Wonderland
There is little gain in attempting to change external conditions, you must first change the core of inner beliefs, naturally outer conditions will change accordingly.
BECOME it to achieve it.
Wisdom strengthened the wise more than ten mighty men which are in the city. Ecclesiastes 7:19
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Does the shadow appear to be growing darker? The light that is casting shadows is becoming much brighter; in utter darkness it is luminous.
Anonymous Coward User ID: 686411 11/2/2009 8:17 PM
IF this bill passes, can we stop it in the future if we are able to vote the idiots out of office? Like reverse the Law?
From Limbaugh's site:
RUSH: I have 'em on one page, some of the tax increases in the Pelosi bill. They're not just tax increases, but you remember yesterday Obama was out somewhere talking to small business people and said, "If you like your plan and if you like what you're paying for it, if you like your benefits, keep it, nothing's going to change."
Page 94, Pelosi plan: "Prohibits the sale of private individual health insurance policies, beginning in 2013, forcing individuals to purchase coverage through the federal government." In 2013, after the 2012 presidential election. In 2013, there is no private insurance allowed. The sale of it will be prohibited.
Page 110: "Requires the use of federal dollars to fund abortions through the government-run health plan -- and, if the Hyde Amendment were ever not renewed, would require the plan to fund elective abortions."
Page 111 -- Section 223: "Establishes a new board of federal bureaucrats (the 'Health Benefits Advisory Committee') to dictate the health plans that all individuals must purchase -- and would likely require all Americans to subsidize and purchase plans that cover any abortion." The death panels are back, by the way.
Page 211 -- Section 321: "Establishes a new government-run health plan that, according to non-partisan actuaries at the Lewin Group, would cause as many as 114 million Americans to lose their existing coverage."
Page 225 -- Section 330: "Permits -- but does not require -- Members of Congress to enroll in government-run health care." So they'll be able to opt out of it and maintain their Cadillac plans.
Page 255 -- Section 345: "Includes language requiring verification of income for individuals wishing to receive federal health care subsidies under the bill -- while the bill includes a requirement for applicants to verify their citizenship, it does not include a similar requirement to verify applicants' identity, thus encouraging identity fraud for undocumented immigrants and others wishing to receive taxpayer-subsidized health benefits."
Page 297 -- Section 501: "Imposes a 2.5 percent tax on all individuals who do not purchase 'bureaucrat-approved' health insurance -- the tax would apply on individuals with incomes under $250,000, thus breaking a central promise of then-Senator Obama’s presidential campaign."
Page 313 -- Section 512: "Imposes an 8 percent 'tax on jobs' for firms that cannot afford to purchase 'bureaucrat-approved' health coverage; according to an analysis by Harvard Professor Kate Baicker, such a tax would place millions 'at substantial risk of unemployment' -- with minority workers losing their jobs at twice the rate of their white counterparts."
Page 336 -- Section 551: "Imposes additional job-killing taxes, in the form of a half-trillion dollar 'surcharge,' more than half of which will hit small businesses; according to a model developed by President Obama’s senior economic advisor, such taxes could cost up to 5.5 million jobs." This is the thing we talked about yesterday, $500,000 for single filers, million dollars, the income surcharge on those earners. A lot of people are small business owners, and they file on their personal 1040 form.
Page 520 -- Section 1161: "Cuts more than $150 billion from Medicare Advantage plans."
Page 733 -- Section 1401: "Establishes a new Center for Comparative Effectiveness Research; the bill includes no provisions preventing the government-run health plan from using such research to deny access to life-saving treatments on cost grounds, similar to Britain’s National Health Service, which denies patient treatments costing more than $35,000."
Page 1174 -- Section 1802(b): "Includes provisions entitled 'TAXES ON CERTAIN INSURANCE POLICIES' to fund comparative effectiveness research, breaking Speaker Pelosi’s promise that 'We will not be taxing [health] benefits in any bill that passes the House.'" And this, you know, is just the scratch-the-surface look 'cause there are 1,990 pages.
RUSH: You know the death panels are still in the bill. I got some e-mails, "Rush, you won't find the word death panel in it." Wake up, folks. It's even being reported by State-Controlled Associated Press. End-of-life counseling remains in the bill. "The Medicare end-of-life planning provision that 2008 Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin said was tantamount to death panels' for seniors is staying in the Pelosi bill. The provision allows Medicare to pay for voluntary counseling to help beneficiaries deal with the complex and painful decisions families face when a loved one is approaching death. ... But when House Democrats proposed this summer to pay doctors for end-of-life counseling, it touched off a wave of suspicion and anger,"and they took it out of there and said it wasn't going to happen and it was never in there. So now it's in there. Let's not forget, Newsweek: "The Case for Pulling the Plug on Granny."
1990 pages? Somehow that bothers me. Not sure why exactly. Just does.
Maybe the fact that is is purposefully set against us
The fact that the Constitution has few pages-35 I believe and they want to trash it in any way
Yet they cannot even wrote a congressional plan-so they have allowed Insurance agents and bIg Pharma to write most of it...oh so many reasons why this is so wrong
I am speaking from a professional viewpoint-medical
And also a wealth of knowledge about govt run healthcare like the VA or even other private hospitals as the govt has been screwing around with health care since Nixon found HMOs could create profit for the govt...and less care for the consumers...being he was rep.
Quoting: ShadowDancer
Actually, lawyers benefit the most from this bill. One of the biggest things in this bill is anti-tort reform. And this law will overturn the few states that have passed tort reform. *Slayer of Trolls*
*Killer of Threads*
zeroglp@gmail.com
Anonymous Coward User ID: 809099 11/3/2009 1:21 AM
HERES JUST A SMALL PART OF WHERE ALL THIS SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY IS HEADED! EVENTUALLY, EVERYONE WILL HAVE TO HAVE SOME FORM OF FOOLPROOF ELECTRONIC ID IN OR ON THEM, A 'MARK', WITHOUT WHICH YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO 'BUY OR SELL'! ITS A FACT, NOT FICTION!
"VeriChip Corporation To Present Its Glucose-Sensing RFID Microchip And Virus Triage Detection System For The H1N1 VIRUS ...
VeriChip Corporation (NASDAQ:CHIP) ("VeriChip" or the "Company") announced today that its Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Scott R. Silverman, will present at the ID World International Congress in Milan, Italy, which runs from November 3-5, 2009, and is the world's leading symposium on the future directions of identification technology."
THE TECHNOLOGY TO ELECTRONICALLY 'MARK' INDIVIDUALS FOR GLOBAL ELECTRONIC COMMERCE ALREADY EXISTS! THE TRANSITION TO ELECTRONIC MONEY IS WELL UNDERWAY! EVENTUALLY, NO MORE COINS, CASH, CARDS, FOBS, WRISTBANDS, ETC.! IT'LL SEEM LIKE A GREAT IDEA, BUT THE DEVIL IS, LITERALLY, IN THE DETAILS! TO ALL THOSE WHO DISMISS AND DENY THE PROPHECIES IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION, YOU ARE WRONG!
One consequence of this thing will be for many doctors to offically 'retire' and go underground with their practice offerring services that may be denied to someone for a cash payment. Black market medicine.
Anonymous Coward User ID: 809437 11/3/2009 11:18 AM
HERES JUST A SMALL PART OF WHERE ALL THIS SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY IS HEADED! EVENTUALLY, EVERYONE WILL HAVE TO HAVE SOME FORM OF FOOLPROOF ELECTRONIC ID IN OR ON THEM, A 'MARK', WITHOUT WHICH YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO 'BUY OR SELL'! ITS A FACT, NOT FICTION!
"VeriChip Corporation To Present Its Glucose-Sensing RFID Microchip And Virus Triage Detection System For The H1N1 VIRUS ...
VeriChip Corporation (NASDAQ:CHIP) ("VeriChip" or the "Company") announced today that its Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Scott R. Silverman, will present at the ID World International Congress in Milan, Italy, which runs from November 3-5, 2009, and is the world's leading symposium on the future directions of identification technology."
THE TECHNOLOGY TO ELECTRONICALLY 'MARK' INDIVIDUALS FOR GLOBAL ELECTRONIC COMMERCE ALREADY EXISTS! THE TRANSITION TO ELECTRONIC MONEY IS WELL UNDERWAY! EVENTUALLY, NO MORE COINS, CASH, CARDS, FOBS, WRISTBANDS, ETC.! IT'LL SEEM LIKE A GREAT IDEA, BUT THE DEVIL IS, LITERALLY, IN THE DETAILS! TO ALL THOSE WHO DISMISS AND DENY THE PROPHECIES IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION, YOU ARE WRONG!
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 809322
YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!
Anonymous Coward User ID: 686411 11/3/2009 12:03 PM
***Reading Guide—Pelosi Health “Reform” Bill ***
In order to assist Members, staff, and interested parties seeking to read and review the health “reform” legislation (H.R. 3962) introduced by House Democrats, the Republican Conference has compiled a list of important page numbers and provisions in Speaker Pelosi’s 1,990-page “Affordable Health Care for America Act:”
Page 94—Section 202(c) prohibits the sale of private individual health insurance policies, beginning in 2013, forcing individuals to purchase coverage through the federal government
Page 110—Section 222(e) requires the use of federal dollars to fund abortions through the government-run health plan—and, if the Hyde Amendment were ever not renewed, would require the plan to fund elective abortions
Page 111—Section 223 establishes a new board of federal bureaucrats (the “Health Benefits Advisory Committee”) to dictate the health plans that all individuals must purchase—and would likely require all Americans to subsidize and purchase plans that cover any abortion
Page 211—Section 321 establishes a new government-run health plan that, according to non-partisan actuaries at the HULewin GroupUH, would cause as many as 114 million Americans to lose their existing coverage
Page 225—Section 330 permits—but does not require—Members of Congress to enroll in government-run health care
Page 255—Section 345 includes language requiring verification of income for individuals wishing to receive federal health care subsidies under the bill—while the bill includes a requirement for applicants to verify their citizenship, it does not include a similar requirement to verify applicants’ identity, thus encouraging identity fraud for undocumented immigrants and others wishing to receive taxpayer-subsidized health benefits
Page 297—Section 501 imposes a 2.5 percent tax on all individuals who do not purchase “bureaucrat-approved” health insurance—the tax would apply on individuals with incomes under $250,000, thus breaking a central HUpromiseUH of then-Senator Obama’s presidential campaign
Page 313—Section 512 imposes an 8 percent “tax on jobs” for firms that cannot afford to purchase “bureaucrat-approved” health coverage; according to an HUanalysisUH by Harvard Professor Kate Baicker, such a tax would place millions “at substantial risk of unemployment”—Uwith minority workers losing their jobs at twice the rate of their white counterparts
Page 336—Section 551 imposes additional job-killing taxes, in the form of a half-trillion dollar “surcharge,” more than half of which will hit small businesses; according to a model developed by President Obama’s senior economic advisor, such taxes could cost up to 5.5 million jobs
Page 520—Section 1161 cuts more than $150 billion from Medicare Advantage plans, potentially jeopardizing millions of seniors’ existing coverage
Page 733—Section 1401 establishes a new Center for Comparative Effectiveness Research; the bill includes no provisions preventing the government-run health plan from using such research to deny access to life-saving treatments on cost grounds, similar to Britain’s National Health Service, which denies patient treatments costing more than £35,000
Page 1174—Section 1802(b) includes provisions entitled “TAXES ON CERTAIN INSURANCE POLICIES” to fund comparative effectiveness research, breaking Speaker Pelosi’s promise that “UWe will not be taxing [health] benefits in any bill that passes the HouseU,” and the President’s promise not to raise taxes on families with incomes under $250,000
###
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 806528
''''''''NEWS FLASH'''''' ITS THE SAME DAM BILL JUST IN A DIFFEN FORMAT THEY ARE STILL TRYING TO RAM THE CRAP THOU AND WORDED DIFFENLY
Anonymous Coward User ID: 746238 11/3/2009 12:59 PM
Representative Foxx spoke about the Democratic health care proposal, saying "we have more to fear from the potential of that bill passing than we do from any terrorist right now in any country."
What’s more important to you? Security or freedom? How much freedom are you willing to give up to feel more ’secure’ about your health care? And, do you feel more secure knowing that the government will be making your health care decisions for you?
This isn’t just about health care. It’s about a whole lot more. Once we let the government make our health care decisions for us, where will it stop?
Will we have to go to the government to request to purchase a new home when only Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac will be lending money for mortgages?
How about if we want to finance a car purchase and need to request lending facilities from government owned GM, Citi, JP Morgan Chase, Wells Fargo?
What if we want to eat healthy foods, and can’t get them from our local farmers anymore because of the Federal Food Police, and our only option is to buy from mega-food conglomerates like Monsanto?
What about home schooling our children as opposed to forced government education?
What if you’d rather use gas to power you car than solar energy or electricity? Will you have that right ten years from now?
Make no mistake. Once the government is allowed the power to control health care, or any other industry for that matter, it will be very difficult, if not impossible, for us to force them to release their grip.
It’s not the health care bill that is more dangerous to our freedoms than any terrorist. It is the unchecked attempts by government to mandate every aspect of our lives’.
I found this on another forum, I still need to verify it. If it is accurate then we better get our guns, ammo and get ready for a big blow out.
Doctors will not treat anyone over 60 as of December
This would be beyond belief if I had not heard so much already.
Who would think the white house would - or could - destroy AMERICA in 10 months?!?
I have corresponded with Celeste for some years and have found her trustworthy. I am tempted to add . unfortunalely .. I am over 60!
Celeste Emailed me November 2 .....
Quote
Hospitals plan to Ration care. In Dec. docs will not treat anyone 60 or over.
Must show photo ID for appts and meds. We are plummeting into medical tyranny.
I wrote back ..........
Are you serious?
Will this be on your website?
Is this obamacare?
I am over 60. Will my doctor no longer see me?
Can you give me details?
Celeste replied November 3 .....
Quote
I worked for a physician on and off through the years. I just went to see him.
Everyone needs to show ID.
There is also a series of questions they ask folks.
My doc (a Believer) said that as of December doctors would not be treating
anyone over 60 because they will get nothing for treating them. *
Even if a patient wants to private cash pay they cannot treat them.
I do not have a document on this other than the
Obama care proposed legislation that actually is being implemented.
The infrastructure is complete and they are incrementally implementing it.
I also went to the pharmacy and unless you show ID no meds.
The noose is tightening toward the mark.
This is confirmed by a person in the medical profession in NEVADA who says that
doctors treating patients on Medicare and SSI are NOT getting paid.
It won’t be long before the docs stop treating them with no payments coming in.
END xxx
-------------------------------------------------
Quote
* 'Even if a patient wants to private cash pay they cannot treat them.'
I saw all this on TV recently! Honestly, I dont know if it was Glenn Beck or who/what.
THE REASON we cant pay cash is because then the doctor is penalized by the govt.
Celeste's sources were NOT television.
OBAMA WANTS SENIORS DEAD!
This lends more credibility to my belief that Barak Obama
killed his Grandma when he visited her in Hawaii in 2008.
Obama's Grandmother Dies on Eve of Election
One can speculate many things. (Scroll way down the page)
[link to revlu.com]
this is obama /government population reduction in the works as if those over 60 can't get their heart meds, diabetic supplies then they will more than likely die or succumb to a grave illness due to lack of treatment. what about those that had organ transplants( heart, liver, kidney) and need the anti rejection meds?
If it is true then my own Mother will be hurting as she has to take meds daily she is 70 , active but still has to take meds.
If this does happen and is put into effect then you will see a uprising as Patriots like I will not stand by and watch our parents be denied meds or medical treatment , consider how many that are over 60 have fought to protect America , vets from WWII, KOREA, VIETNAM, do you think they will take this lightly/sitting down, HELL NO.
Isn't there supposed to be some more of this bill released tonight?
They keep changing it and adding and subtacting from it so that no one will be able to keep up and know what they are up to.
I d'l'ed a copy of 3962, is that the newest?
I'm speed reading it, b/c honestly I'm not sure what to look for...
Speed reading? I took a speed reading course one time but I had to drop out. I couldn't turn the pages fast enough.
i.e. skimming pages til I catch something interesting.
Could have dropped the font on this bitch and it would have been sub 100 pages..haha
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 686411
Unless you can refer back and forth between Section XX, paragraph XX subsection A to Section Xy, paragraph Ab, subsection C where that refers to another bill with such and such paragraph good luck understanding what they are trying to hide. When you find extremely long definitions and all these cross references you need to write down or jump to that section to understand what the current section is saying.
It's like a really complicated puzzle that you have to fit together to see the larger picture.
The larger picture in this case is a takeover and funding for pet projects with long term monetary kickbacks.
Anonymous Coward User ID: 686411 11/3/2009 7:44 PM
Isn't there supposed to be some more of this bill released tonight?
They keep changing it and adding and subtacting from it so that no one will be able to keep up and know what they are up to.
Quoting: Bluebird
correct so everyone needs to be reasonable when people are pointing stuff out-it is being constantly tweaked so everyone discussing it looks stupid
forewarned is forearmed...pretty pathetic and SPEAKS VOLUMES
*************************************
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."
~Alice's Adventures in Wonderland
There is little gain in attempting to change external conditions, you must first change the core of inner beliefs, naturally outer conditions will change accordingly.
BECOME it to achieve it.
Wisdom strengthened the wise more than ten mighty men which are in the city. Ecclesiastes 7:19
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Does the shadow appear to be growing darker? The light that is casting shadows is becoming much brighter; in utter darkness it is luminous.
Isn't there supposed to be some more of this bill released tonight?
They keep changing it and adding and subtacting from it so that no one will be able to keep up and know what they are up to.
I d'l'ed a copy of 3962, is that the newest?
I'm speed reading it, b/c honestly I'm not sure what to look for...
Speed reading? I took a speed reading course one time but I had to drop out. I couldn't turn the pages fast enough.
i.e. skimming pages til I catch something interesting.
Could have dropped the font on this bitch and it would have been sub 100 pages..haha
******************************************************
Unless you can refer back and forth between Section XX, paragraph XX subsection A to Section Xy, paragraph Ab, subsection C where that refers to another bill with such and such paragraph good luck understanding what they are trying to hide. When you find extremely long definitions and all these cross references you need to write down or jump to that section to understand what the current section is saying.
It's like a really complicated puzzle that you have to fit together to see the larger picture.
The larger picture in this case is a takeover and funding for pet projects with long term monetary kickbacks.
Quoting: Anonymous Coward 656642
No I think it was subsection six of title (3) of section 1A in the sixth subsection of HH and of course exceptions under the form 10483 of the broad definition of strategic section 39 within the status of the section 3J when applied to division unless is is in use with bio stimulant that is equal or greater in performance of the function specified in section E when XYZ does not apply
What a bunch of inept nitwits from nimrods school---we need a really good parser...
geez-one can readily see they are working hard to make it clear as lead... *************************************
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."
~Alice's Adventures in Wonderland
There is little gain in attempting to change external conditions, you must first change the core of inner beliefs, naturally outer conditions will change accordingly.
BECOME it to achieve it.
Wisdom strengthened the wise more than ten mighty men which are in the city. Ecclesiastes 7:19
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Does the shadow appear to be growing darker? The light that is casting shadows is becoming much brighter; in utter darkness it is luminous.
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