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***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***

 
Sinanju2

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11/25/2009 05:01 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
it took me about 20sec to click on the first result in my country to get an artical
from the 2nd biggest newspaper in the country that said this:

"Armageddon is not nigh. The planet has been cooling for almost a decade and the fabled climate computer models never predicted that."


It's plausible. But the computer model was never meant to be a predictor of the weather. It brings together data from many sources, plots trends based on the actual data and, on current scientific knowledge, attaches probabilities for various scenarios into the future. If you want to disagree you have to try to undermine those conclusions based on the same science..


>>You unscientific moron. The data is corrupted and intentionally so. The 'actual' data has been manipulated for a DECADE.


The data is what it is, and it's freely available from many sources (the CRU doesnt make the data, it collects it). If you are talking about the statistical modelling as per Harry's programming, he did a decent job on alot of messy databases (the nature of the biz), and he reproduced the previous publish results. Have you read Harry's notes? Downloaded the original data in Excel? Investigated the actual monitoring stations. No? If not, then how the fuck do you know what you are talking about?
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged


>>You ignorant fucking shill. I KNOW because they ADMITTED in the hacked emails that they were LYING about the data they said they 'collected'.

When the data shows a decline in global temperatures and they FUCKING LIE and say the data shows an INCREASE in global temperatures, then ALL the conclusions are suspect.

You are no scientist.
I don't do book reports, I don't sort the wheat from the chaff but I will discuss the topic of your ignorance if I'm asked. -MC Frontalot

“But make no mistake, BP is operating at our direction...” -Barry Obammy
Anonymous Coward
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11/25/2009 05:01 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
EXCELLENT VIDEO!!!!!


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 826987

SOrry, but I just can't listen to him for 10 mins.
forget it .
snarkModerator  (OP)
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11/25/2009 05:04 PM

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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
it took me about 20sec to click on the first result in my country to get an artical
from the 2nd biggest newspaper in the country that said this:

"Armageddon is not nigh. The planet has been cooling for almost a decade and the fabled climate computer models never predicted that."


It's plausible. But the computer model was never meant to be a predictor of the weather. It brings together data from many sources, plots trends based on the actual data and, on current scientific knowledge, attaches probabilities for various scenarios into the future. If you want to disagree you have to try to undermine those conclusions based on the same science..
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged


The bottom line data was from trees in the Yamal peninsula in Siberia. 12 of them. 12 FUCKING TREE CORES are used as the proxy for historical temperature data. 12 cherry-picked trees, at that. And trees don't grow on ice, or in the sea, or in the desert. Give me a break, please.
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
Anonymous Coward
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11/25/2009 05:06 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
ALL THESE ARE MAINSTREAM MEDIA....... ALL SAY DATA INDICATES GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM.


the Australian [link to www.theaustralian.com.au]

the Age [link to www.theage.com.au]

the Herald sun [link to www.heraldsun.com.au]



so why the fuck they arent reporting it in europe/usa i dont fucking know.

but in aus the facts are there. plain as day, making headlines.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 786980

The Australian main stream ignored it for a few days but they know they can't now.
Anonymous Coward
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11/25/2009 05:07 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
ALL THESE ARE MAINSTREAM MEDIA....... ALL SAY DATA INDICATES GLOBAL WARMING IS A SCAM.


the Australian [link to www.theaustralian.com.au]

the Age [link to www.theage.com.au]

the Herald sun [link to www.heraldsun.com.au]



so why the fuck they arent reporting it in europe/usa i dont fucking know.

but in aus the facts are there. plain as day, making headlines.


The Australian main stream ignored it for a few days but they know they can't now.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 817968



bump





.
AlreadyBugged

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11/25/2009 05:09 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
'They crunched the numbers and that's what they came up with. No one competent is saying they are lying or not following the scientific method. There is disagreement, but no one goes as far as the anti science haters...'

>>You lying shill. The emails that they ADMITTED were true and written by them stated that they crunched the numbers and then found out that there was NO WARMING.... so they decided to LIE.

Just like YOU are lying now.


You saw nothing affecting their status as scientists. Nor their conclusions. So you lie. You are an anti science hating shill, and you want to smear scientists, all scientists, instead of using rational argument. Desperate?


From the leaked emails...

From Phil Jones (modification of data to hide unwanted results):
"I’ve just completed Mike’s Nature trick of adding in the real temps to each series for the last 20 years (ie from 1981 onwards) amd from 1961 for Keith’s to hide the decline."

Trick? Hide the decline?

Who is desperate now?

It is obvious that you know nothing about science.


A mathematical trick? Lots of those. Where would we be without them. And which "decline" are you talking about? Specifically.... I hope this isnt all you got....


>>So, now you advocate 'mathematical tricks' when it comes to collating data... that is the TOTAL opposite of the scientific method.

Mathematical tricks are what mafia accountants use... not true scientists.

As for your ignorant question about the 'decline', it refers to the DECLINE in GLOBAL TEMPERATURES over the past DECADE.

You fail, shill.
 Quoting: Sinanju2


I never saw a reference to what it meant. I saw alot of people interpreting it the way they wanted, but I never saw or read about someone flipping the decline of temperatures over the last decade. Realistically, that would have been just too foolish, since we know from multiple sources, what the temperatures have been in the last decade. In fact, scientists acknowledge all over the world that average global temperatures have fallen over the last decade. So you are stupid to believe that they would have been that stupid...

You fail, anti science troglodyke...

Last Edited by ExAmerican on 11/25/2009 05:59 PM
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11/25/2009 05:18 PM

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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
'They crunched the numbers and that's what they came up with. No one competent is saying they are lying or not following the scientific method. There is disagreement, but no one goes as far as the anti science haters...'

>>You lying shill. The emails that they ADMITTED were true and written by them stated that they crunched the numbers and then found out that there was NO WARMING.... so they decided to LIE.

Just like YOU are lying now.


You saw nothing affecting their status as scientists. Nor their conclusions. So you lie. You are an anti science hating shill, and you want to smear scientists, all scientists, instead of using rational argument. Desperate?


From the leaked emails...

From Phil Jones (modification of data to hide unwanted results):
"I’ve just completed Mike’s Nature trick of adding in the real temps to each series for the last 20 years (ie from 1981 onwards) amd from 1961 for Keith’s to hide the decline."

Trick? Hide the decline?

Who is desperate now?

It is obvious that you know nothing about science.


A mathematical trick? Lots of those. Where would we be without them. And which "decline" are you talking about? Specifically.... I hope this isnt all you got....


>>So, now you advocate 'mathematical tricks' when it comes to collating data... that is the TOTAL opposite of the scientific method.

Mathematical tricks are what mafia accountants use... not true scientists.

As for your ignorant question about the 'decline', it refers to the DECLINE in GLOBAL TEMPERATURES over the past DECADE.

You fail, shill.


I never saw a reference to what it meant. I saw alot of people interpreting it the way they wanted, but I never saw or read about someone flipping the decline of temperatures over the last decade. Realistically, that would have been just too foolish, since we know from multiple sources, what the temperatures have been in the last decade. In fact, scientists acknowledge all over the world that average global temperatures have fallen over the last decade. So you are stupid to believe that they would have been that stupid...

You fail, anti science hater...
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged

If you didn't read their flipping the decline and substituting proxies and actual temperature data whenever it fit their purposes, you need to go back and re-read the emails. Come back when you're done.
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
Anonymous Coward
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11/25/2009 05:20 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
'They crunched the numbers and that's what they came up with. No one competent is saying they are lying or not following the scientific method. There is disagreement, but no one goes as far as the anti science haters...'

>>You lying shill. The emails that they ADMITTED were true and written by them stated that they crunched the numbers and then found out that there was NO WARMING.... so they decided to LIE.

Just like YOU are lying now.


You saw nothing affecting their status as scientists. Nor their conclusions. So you lie. You are an anti science hating shill, and you want to smear scientists, all scientists, instead of using rational argument. Desperate?


From the leaked emails...

From Phil Jones (modification of data to hide unwanted results):
"I’ve just completed Mike’s Nature trick of adding in the real temps to each series for the last 20 years (ie from 1981 onwards) amd from 1961 for Keith’s to hide the decline."

Trick? Hide the decline?

Who is desperate now?

It is obvious that you know nothing about science.


A mathematical trick? Lots of those. Where would we be without them. And which "decline" are you talking about? Specifically.... I hope this isnt all you got....


>>So, now you advocate 'mathematical tricks' when it comes to collating data... that is the TOTAL opposite of the scientific method.

Mathematical tricks are what mafia accountants use... not true scientists.

As for your ignorant question about the 'decline', it refers to the DECLINE in GLOBAL TEMPERATURES over the past DECADE.

You fail, shill.


I never saw a reference to what it meant. I saw alot of people interpreting it the way they wanted, but I never saw or read about someone flipping the decline of temperatures over the last decade. Realistically, that would have been just too foolish, since we know from multiple sources, what the temperatures have been in the last decade. In fact, scientists acknowledge all over the world that average global temperatures have fallen over the last decade. So you are stupid to believe that they would have been that stupid...

You fail, anti science hater...
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged

Yes he is an "Anti science hater" as you call him because he hates "Anti science" which the AGW scientists have been caught practicing. Glad you've seen the light.
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11/25/2009 05:21 PM

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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
[link to www.globalwarming.org]

Why Hiding Computer Code Is Lethal To Climate Science

This post is a follow up to my previous on why Climategate is the real war on science.

My earlier post commented on Willis Eschenbach’s excellent column on Anthony Watts’s blog (WUWT) [link to wattsupwiththat.com] . Here I want to reproduce a comment Eschenbach posted in the back and forth on WUWT. In it, he explains why hiding computer code is lethal in a field, like climate science, where results hinge on statistical methods and mathematical techniques. Eschenbach’s comment follows.

Willis Eschenbach (17:15:51):


Part of the difficulty with climate science is that, unlike all other physical sciences, it does not study things — instead it studies averages.

This is because climate by definition is the average of weather over a suitably long period of time (typically taken as a minimum of 30 years).

As a result, much of the study that goes on, and the papers that are written, deal almost exclusively with mathematics and statistics. This is the reason that access to the computer codes is so critical.

It’s simple in the physical sciences to describe an experiment, e.g. “I took three grams of carbon and subjected them to a pressure of 50,000KPa and a temperature of 500C. Unfortunately, the experiment did not succeed, I could not replace the diamond I had lost from my wife’s wedding ring.” Anyone can reproduce that experiment (and get the same results).

But when you say “I took the raw temperature data, variance-adjusted it, averaged it, gridded it, area-adjusted it, extrapolated results to data-free areas within 250 km, and made a global temperature record”, that’s far from enough information. In order to determine what was done, we need far more detailed information in climate science, because in general we are describing intricate mathematical operations. These are often very hard to describe clearly in spoken or written language.

And even a crystal-clear description is not enough. Despite what he says he has done, if the scientist has inadvertently used an improper procedure (e.g. the uncentered principal components analysis used in Mann’s Hockeystick), we’ll never be able to determine that the answer is demonstrably wrong unless we have the actual code that he used. Otherwise, we could spend years trying to guess where he went wrong, but we would never be able to show that he went wrong as science demands.

This is why the insistence of scientists that their computer codes are sacrosanct private secret documents best kept under Hermetic seal in a clandestine vault is lethal to good science. Without the codes, we can’t tell if what has been done is correct and free from hidden mathematical error. Of course, this may be unconnected with the reason that Jones et. al are hiding their codes …

Given that climate science is not the study of things but of the averages of things, and that as a result math and statistics are central to climate science, the findings of the Wegman Report are now seen to be even more insightful, trenchant, and valid. They said:

It is important to note the isolation of the paleoclimate community; even though they rely heavily on statistical methods they do not seem to be interacting with the statistical community. Additionally, we judge that the sharing of research materials, data and results was haphazardly and grudgingly done. In this case we judge that there was too much reliance on peer review, which was not necessarily independent. Moreover, the work has been sufficiently politicized that this community can hardly reassess their public positions without losing credibility. Overall, our committee believes that Mann’s assessments that the decade of the 1990s was the hottest decade of the millennium and that 1998 was the hottest year of the millennium cannot be supported by his analysis.

And presciently, that was written three years ago, well before we got the CRU emails

Last Edited by snark on 11/25/2009 05:24 PM
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
AlreadyBugged

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11/25/2009 05:27 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
it took me about 20sec to click on the first result in my country to get an artical
from the 2nd biggest newspaper in the country that said this:

"Armageddon is not nigh. The planet has been cooling for almost a decade and the fabled climate computer models never predicted that."


It's plausible. But the computer model was never meant to be a predictor of the weather. It brings together data from many sources, plots trends based on the actual data and, on current scientific knowledge, attaches probabilities for various scenarios into the future. If you want to disagree you have to try to undermine those conclusions based on the same science..


The bottom line data was from trees in the Yamal peninsula in Siberia. 12 of them. 12 FUCKING TREE CORES are used as the proxy for historical temperature data. 12 cherry-picked trees, at that. And trees don't grow on ice, or in the sea, or in the desert. Give me a break, please.
 Quoting: snark


That's the ticket. I am not unreasonable, snark. I agree with your criticism, as limited as it is. But there still is the measured increase of long term CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere. The accepted greenhouse theory of science. And, finally, the measured and changing temperature difference between the toposphere and the stratosphere predicted by the greenhouse theory by way of excess atmospheric CO2.

[link to cfpub.epa.gov]

[link to www.physicalgeography.net]

[link to www.springerlink.com]
ATE
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11/25/2009 05:28 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
EXCELLENT VIDEO!!!!!



SOrry, but I just can't listen to him for 10 mins.
forget it .
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 817968


I bet it's hard to hear anything with your head up your arse.
AlreadyBugged

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11/25/2009 05:31 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
You fail, anti science hater...

Yes he is an "Anti science hater" as you call him because he hates "Anti science" which the AGW scientists have been caught practicing. Glad you've seen the light.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 688990


darn you caught the grammatical error, didnt you? No that isnt what I meant.

Okay how about anti science troglodyte? He is a troglodyte who hates science. Yeah that works....
those meddling kids
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11/25/2009 05:35 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
No one competent is saying they are lying or not following the scientific method.
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged


"The tiny, close-knit clique of climate scientists who invented and now drive the “global warming” fraud — for fraud is what we now know it to be — tampered with temperature data so assiduously that, on the recent admission of one of them, land temperatures since 1980 have risen twice as fast as ocean temperatures."

"Worse, these arrogant fraudsters — for fraudsters are what we now know them to be — have refused, for years and years and years, to reveal their data and their computer program listings."

"Finally, these huckstering snake-oil salesmen and “global warming” profiteers — for that is what they are — have written to each other encouraging the destruction of data that had been lawfully requested under the Freedom of Information Act"

"The few who have brought themselves to comment, through gritted teeth, have said that all of this is a storm in a teacup, and that their friends in the University of East Anglia and elsewhere in the climatological community are good people, really. No, they’re not. They’re criminals. " -- Christopher Monckton

[link to pajamasmedia.com]
AlreadyBugged

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11/25/2009 05:35 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
If you didn't read their flipping the decline and substituting proxies and actual temperature data whenever it fit their purposes, you need to go back and re-read the emails. Come back when you're done.
 Quoting: snark


Oh I read about techniques statisticians do to substitute gaps in the data with surrounding data. About proxies, yeah so what? A commonly accepted practice. But you seem to have proof they filled a decline in the last decade, out of malicious intent. Let's see it....

Last Edited by ExAmerican on 11/25/2009 05:57 PM
snarkModerator  (OP)
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11/25/2009 05:41 PM

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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
it took me about 20sec to click on the first result in my country to get an artical
from the 2nd biggest newspaper in the country that said this:

"Armageddon is not nigh. The planet has been cooling for almost a decade and the fabled climate computer models never predicted that."


It's plausible. But the computer model was never meant to be a predictor of the weather. It brings together data from many sources, plots trends based on the actual data and, on current scientific knowledge, attaches probabilities for various scenarios into the future. If you want to disagree you have to try to undermine those conclusions based on the same science..


The bottom line data was from trees in the Yamal peninsula in Siberia. 12 of them. 12 FUCKING TREE CORES are used as the proxy for historical temperature data. 12 cherry-picked trees, at that. And trees don't grow on ice, or in the sea, or in the desert. Give me a break, please.


That's the ticket. I am not unreasonable, snark. I agree with your criticism, as limited as it is. But there still is the measured increase of long term CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere. The accepted greenhouse theory of science. And, finally, the measured and changing temperature difference between the toposphere and the stratosphere predicted by the greenhouse theory by way of excess atmospheric CO2.

[link to cfpub.epa.gov]

[link to www.physicalgeography.net]

[link to www.springerlink.com]
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged


Co2 is approximately .04% of the earth's atmosphere, and it's critical for life on earth. Over 95% of total CO2 emissions would occur even if humans were not present on Earth. The natural decay of organic material in forests and grasslands results in the release of about 220 gigatonnes of carbon dioxide every year. This carbon dioxide alone is over 8 times the amount emitted by humans. I'm not afraid of C02.
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
Anonymous Coward
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11/25/2009 05:44 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
The emperor's bare-assed nekkid at the moment and needs a good peltin' with soft, slushy overripened tomatos.

If he doesn't get this, bare-assed nekkid will become the new "fully clothed".

Can't let this devolve into "we lied but you can't do anything about it to change our agenda".
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11/25/2009 05:48 PM

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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
If you didn't read their flipping the decline and substituting proxies and actual temperature data whenever it fit their purposes, you need to go back and re-read the emails. Come back when you're done.


Oh I read about techniques statisticians do to substitute gaps in the data with surrounding data. A commonly accepted practice. But you seem to have proof they filled a decline in the last decade, out of malicious intent. Let's see it....
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged

I believe you said you did read the HARRY_READ_ME doc. Let me refresh your memory: The file briffa_sep98_d.pro says: "Apply a VERY ARTIFICAL correction for decline!!" and "APPLY ARTIFICIAL CORRECTION." Another, quantify_tsdcal.pro, says: "Low pass filtering at century and longer time scales never gets rid of the trend - so eventually I start to scale down the 120-yr low pass time series to mimic the effect of removing/adding longer time scales!" Time and again the programmer forces solutions in when the code is not cooperating with the desired end-result.
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
AlreadyBugged

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11/25/2009 05:50 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
No one competent is saying they are lying or not following the scientific method.

--- meddling kids 823670
"on the recent admission of one of them, land temperatures since 1980 have risen twice as fast as ocean temperatures."

And? They dont hold a monopoly on this data.

"have refused, to reveal their data and their computer program listings."

They have revealed their methods and the data is available to all, all that peer review requires. And the programming notes shows hundreds and hundreds of hours of work to arrive at their statistical modelling predictive results. They have resisted giving away their work to just anyone, and are backed by their legal FOI advisers.

" destruction of data that had been lawfully requested under the Freedom of Information Act"

Deleting of confidential emails between collaborators,,, Well, we will have to see if any lawsuits transpire for refusing to pass on private emails under FOI. It isnt "data" and it doesnt affect the science.

"friends in the University of East Anglia and elsewhere in the climatological community are good people, really. No, they’re not. They’re criminals.

As usual the anti science troglodytes over reach. Now it's ALL climatologists are criminals. Surely with this comment you can see their primitive nature.
Anonymous Coward
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11/25/2009 05:55 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
Apparently, for alreadybuggered “apply artificial correction” means the same as “substitute gaps in the data”. That’s real science there!!!
Anonymous Coward
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11/25/2009 05:57 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
No one competent is sayi"friends in the University of East Anglia and elsewhere in the climatological community are good people, really. No, they’re not. They’re criminals.

As usual the anti science troglodytes over reach. Now it's ALL climatologists are criminals. Surely with this comment you can see their primitive nature.
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged


He didn't say all climatologists are criminals. He said "their friends in the University of East Anglia and elsewhere in the climatological community are [...] criminals". He is specifically referring to Professor Phil Jones and the others involved in Climategate.

And he is not overreaching, he has reported them to the authorities:

"I have reported them to the UK’s Information Commissioner, with a request that he investigate their offenses and, if thought fit, prosecute. But I won’t be holding my breath: In the police state that Britain has now sadly become, with supine news media largely owned and controlled by the government, the establishment tends to look after its own.

At our expense, and at the expense of the truth."

[link to pajamasmedia.com]
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11/25/2009 06:01 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
they are all liars and thieves!!!!!!!!!!
the only true people are jedward

[link to www.youtube.com]
AlreadyBugged

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11/25/2009 06:03 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
"I have reported them to the UK’s Information Commissioner, with a request that he investigate their offenses and, if thought fit, prosecute. But I won’t be holding my breath: In the police state that Britain has now sadly become, with supine news media largely owned and controlled by the government, the establishment tends to look after its own.

At our expense, and at the expense of the truth."
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 823670


Blah blah blah. We'll see,,,
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11/25/2009 06:05 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
Apparently, for alreadybuggered “apply artificial correction” means the same as “substitute gaps in the data”. That’s real science there!!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 822029


Yeah you got it. "artificial correction" falls under "substitute gaps in the data" with surrounding data. And that is acceptable science, exactly!
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
If you didn't read their flipping the decline and substituting proxies and actual temperature data whenever it fit their purposes, you need to go back and re-read the emails. Come back when you're done.


Oh I read about techniques statisticians do to substitute gaps in the data with surrounding data. A commonly accepted practice. But you seem to have proof they filled a decline in the last decade, out of malicious intent. Let's see it....

I believe you said you did read the HARRY_READ_ME doc. Let me refresh your memory: The file briffa_sep98_d.pro says: "Apply a VERY ARTIFICAL correction for decline!!" and "APPLY ARTIFICIAL CORRECTION." Another, quantify_tsdcal.pro, says: "Low pass filtering at century and longer time scales never gets rid of the trend - so eventually I start to scale down the 120-yr low pass time series to mimic the effect of removing/adding longer time scales!" Time and again the programmer forces solutions in when the code is not cooperating with the desired end-result.
 Quoting: snark


I missed those comments. I was using this link...

[link to di2.nu]

Are you sure they were in HARRY readme? Or in another file?

Need to see the context, you see. The first comment doesnt sound right, why use the superlative "VERY ARTIFICIAL"? And how does this affect the underlying data and resulting statistics? That's what it is all about. For example, if they just changed the time scale, it would be acceptable if applied across ALL the dataset. However, if they mixed scales, applying one scale here, another there, that would be VERY ARTIFICIAL and suspicious, of course. It would be interesting to know when and where they are talking about and check the published results.. Hmm?
snarkModerator  (OP)
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11/25/2009 06:21 PM

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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
Apparently, for alreadybuggered “apply artificial correction” means the same as “substitute gaps in the data”. That’s real science there!!!


Yeah you got it. "artificial correction" falls under "substitute gaps in the data" with surrounding data. And that is acceptable science, exactly!
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged

"Acceptable science" is science that is able to be replicated. And this is the core problem with the "science" coming out of the CRU. No one can replicate it. No one could begin to replicate it. Firstly, the data was not released so that other scientists could attempt to replicate the experiments, despite a decade of requests...including FOIA requests. Second, now that the code HAS been released, it is so buggered and problematic that replication is but a pipe-dream. All UN funding requests are based on this data. PROBLEM.
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
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11/25/2009 06:24 PM

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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
If you didn't read their flipping the decline and substituting proxies and actual temperature data whenever it fit their purposes, you need to go back and re-read the emails. Come back when you're done.


Oh I read about techniques statisticians do to substitute gaps in the data with surrounding data. A commonly accepted practice. But you seem to have proof they filled a decline in the last decade, out of malicious intent. Let's see it....

I believe you said you did read the HARRY_READ_ME doc. Let me refresh your memory: The file briffa_sep98_d.pro says: "Apply a VERY ARTIFICAL correction for decline!!" and "APPLY ARTIFICIAL CORRECTION." Another, quantify_tsdcal.pro, says: "Low pass filtering at century and longer time scales never gets rid of the trend - so eventually I start to scale down the 120-yr low pass time series to mimic the effect of removing/adding longer time scales!" Time and again the programmer forces solutions in when the code is not cooperating with the desired end-result.


I missed those comments. I was using this link...

[link to di2.nu]

Are you sure they were in HARRY readme? Or in another file?

Need to see the context, you see. The first comment doesnt sound right, why use the superlative "VERY ARTIFICIAL"? And how does this affect the underlying data and resulting statistics? That's what it is all about. For example, if they just changed the time scale, it would be acceptable if applied across ALL the dataset. However, if they mixed scales, applying one scale here, another there, that would be VERY ARTIFICIAL and suspicious, of course. It would be interesting to know when and where they are talking about and check the published results.. Hmm?
 Quoting: AlreadyBugged

The file is 35 pages long. Your link is to one of the pages. Perhaps you should download the files yourself.
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
Anonymous Coward
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United Kingdom
11/25/2009 06:26 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
EXCELLENT VIDEO!!!!!


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 826987


bump for complete agreement.
hf
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 823670
Australia
11/25/2009 06:29 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
I missed those comments. I was using this link...

[link to di2.nu]

Are you sure they were in HARRY readme? Or in another file?


The file is 35 pages long. Your link is to one of the pages. Perhaps you should download the files yourself.
 Quoting: snark


Surely AlreadyBugged has read the whole readme file. That's what he said in his big thread about the file, the thread where he was mostly talking to himself.

[link to www.godlikeproductions.com]

Still, at least he's read 1/35th of the file.
AlreadyBugged

User ID: 825008
Mexico
11/25/2009 06:31 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
it took me about 20sec to click on the first result in my country to get an artical
from the 2nd biggest newspaper in the country that said this:

"Armageddon is not nigh. The planet has been cooling for almost a decade and the fabled climate computer models never predicted that."


It's plausible. But the computer model was never meant to be a predictor of the weather. It brings together data from many sources, plots trends based on the actual data and, on current scientific knowledge, attaches probabilities for various scenarios into the future. If you want to disagree you have to try to undermine those conclusions based on the same science..


The bottom line data was from trees in the Yamal peninsula in Siberia. 12 of them. 12 FUCKING TREE CORES are used as the proxy for historical temperature data. 12 cherry-picked trees, at that. And trees don't grow on ice, or in the sea, or in the desert. Give me a break, please.


That's the ticket. I am not unreasonable, snark. I agree with your criticism, as limited as it is. But there still is the measured increase of long term CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere. The accepted greenhouse theory of science. And, finally, the measured and changing temperature difference between the toposphere and the stratosphere predicted by the greenhouse theory by way of excess atmospheric CO2.

[link to cfpub.epa.gov]

[link to www.physicalgeography.net]

[link to www.springerlink.com]


Co2 is approximately .04% of the earth's atmosphere, and it's critical for life on earth. Over 95% of total CO2 emissions would occur even if humans were not present on Earth. The natural decay of organic material in forests and grasslands results in the release of about 220 gigatonnes of carbon dioxide every year. This carbon dioxide alone is over 8 times the amount emitted by humans. I'm not afraid of C02.
 Quoting: snark


I dont like breathing exhaust fumes, I am not afraid of it but I prefer a healthier lifestyle. And atmospheric CO2 in excess of absorbtion is a harmful pollutant that can have undesirable effects (ie verified greenhouse effects by measured significant increases in CO2 concentrations -- manmade). I see nothing wrong with cleaning up our act based on good observational and sound science,,, I dont want bad policy, however...
AlreadyBugged

User ID: 825008
Mexico
11/25/2009 06:34 PM
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Re: ***The MSM Tries To Ignore Climategate... But Readers Bring Them Back To Reality!!***
I missed those comments. I was using this link...

[link to di2.nu]

Are you sure they were in HARRY readme? Or in another file?


The file is 35 pages long. Your link is to one of the pages. Perhaps you should download the files yourself.


Surely AlreadyBugged has read the whole readme file. That's what he said in his big thread about the file, the thread where he was mostly talking to himself.

[link to www.godlikeproductions.com]

Still, at least he's read 1/35th of the file.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 823670


I did NOT read ALL the out-of-context code or sampled output. I read the programmers comments, over the entire 35 pages. What's your point?





GLP