will solar panels survive solar flare or EMP???? | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 954702 United States 06/10/2010 03:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
resistor User ID: 956398 Belgium 06/10/2010 03:06 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 999110 Germany 06/10/2010 03:07 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | need that: [link to en.wikipedia.org] |
Anonymous Coward (OP) User ID: 553745 United States 06/10/2010 03:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 496282 United States 06/10/2010 03:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
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resistor User ID: 956398 Belgium 06/10/2010 03:14 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | i think the protection you seek is a farday cage - could be wrong ! Quoting: Anonymous Coward 496282Faraday cage can't work the object needs to be isolated air tight meaning no air molecules are allowed in! Once it is sealed with a non conductive isolator and made air tight a faraday cage or any metal cage will do as the electrons are trapped above the isolation and conducted trough the metal or copper cage.... But a copper cage in open air without any isolator surrounding the item you wan't to protect won't do. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 999110 Germany 06/10/2010 03:16 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
resistor User ID: 956398 Belgium 06/10/2010 03:18 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | so you'd have to protect everything till after the event Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553745Yes which is virtually impossible. See that's why those dumbs (deep underground military bases are build so deep under the ground they hope to survive the emp's) You better prepare yourself to live without technology. This may seem difficult but once your in it you will be astonished how life can be simple and easy without all the modern stuff. However an emp is not the actual problem you see it is the upheavels after the emp that will make survival almost impossible without elektricity. Clean potable water will be the biggest challenge! If you don't believe try finding drinking water in the city without using the tap..... |
Anonymous Coward (OP) User ID: 553745 United States 06/10/2010 03:19 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
resistor User ID: 956398 Belgium 06/10/2010 03:20 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | so you'd have to protect everything till after the event Quoting: Anonymous Coward 999110if u wrap the items u want to protect in tin foil with an Earthing system (cable connect foil and earth) u will be fine. Liar the item has to be first surrounded by an insulator and no air is allowed inside it afterwords you can wrap it with tin foil and make sure it is earthed! |
Anonymous Coward (OP) User ID: 553745 United States 06/10/2010 03:25 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Clean potable water will be the biggest challenge! Quoting: resistor 956398If you don't believe try finding drinking water in the city without using the tap..... this is why i moved from the city. My issue is I have so much info ie PDF’s . (8 plus gigs at the moment) That to print it all out I’d be chopping down half the rain forest. I’d like to have solar panel and charger equipment to run my netbook and usb drives |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 999110 Germany 06/10/2010 03:25 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | so you'd have to protect everything till after the event Quoting: resistor 956398if u wrap the items u want to protect in tin foil with an Earthing system (cable connect foil and earth) u will be fine. Liar the item has to be first surrounded by an insulator and no air is allowed inside it afterwords you can wrap it with tin foil and make sure it is earthed! false the fucking air has nothing to do with it! the electricity will stay on top of the tin foil and into earth trough the earthing system. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 996623 United States 06/10/2010 03:27 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | i think the protection you seek is a farday cage - could be wrong ! Quoting: resistor 956398Faraday cage can't work the object needs to be isolated air tight meaning no air molecules are allowed in! A Faraday cage is an electrically conductive container. It does NOT need to be airtight, but if it has gaps, the gaps will allow wavelengths shorter than the gaps to get in. [link to en.wikipedia.org] [link to www.unitedstatesaction.com] Wrapping an object in aluminum foil will also protect it as long as the wrapping is tight and in more than one layer. proof that the cage idea really works [link to www.youtube.com] |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 999153 United States 06/10/2010 03:32 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Clean potable water will be the biggest challenge! Quoting: Anonymous Coward 553745If you don't believe try finding drinking water in the city without using the tap..... this is why i moved from the city. My issue is I have so much info ie PDF’s . (8 plus gigs at the moment) That to print it all out I’d be chopping down half the rain forest. I’d like to have solar panel and charger equipment to run my netbook and usb drives There are some neat camping solar stuff that you could stick in a cage. [link to www.manventureoutpost.com] |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 996623 United States 06/10/2010 03:41 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It is possible to survive an EMP with a working system. The worse EMP possible on earth is a lighting strike. Transmitters, cell towers and such get hit by lighting all the time and mostly survive. It all a matter of being able to bypass the surge energy to ground. A big CME is very different from an EMP. Where an EMP is a fast pulse (mostly RF energy), A big CME is a huge DC current. This DC current will saturate large power transformers and melt wiring both in the transformers and switchgear, and on the long lines. This will cause massive spikes in the AC power lines, but again, not as bad as a direct lighting strike. If your system is hardened enough to survive lighting, it will survive both EMP and CME events. A good link on lighting protection (it's all about the grounding) [link to www.windsun.com] |
Anonymous Coward (OP) User ID: 553745 United States 06/10/2010 03:45 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 999110 Germany 06/10/2010 03:50 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It is possible to survive an EMP with a working system. The worse EMP possible on earth is a lighting strike. Transmitters, cell towers and such get hit by lighting all the time and mostly survive. It all a matter of being able to bypass the surge energy to ground. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 996623A big CME is very different from an EMP. Where an EMP is a fast pulse (mostly RF energy), A big CME is a huge DC current. This DC current will saturate large power transformers and melt wiring both in the transformers and switchgear, and on the long lines. This will cause massive spikes in the AC power lines, but again, not as bad as a direct lighting strike. If your system is hardened enough to survive lighting, it will survive both EMP and CME events. A good link on lighting protection (it's all about the grounding) [link to www.windsun.com] sry for stupid asking but a lighting strike is an inch wide and allways strikes at the highest spot with conductivity now a emp or cme fucks everything up. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 996623 United States 06/10/2010 03:56 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Read up on grounding tricks for lighting protection, but in the best grounding you can. Get the biggest surge suppressors you can afford and protect all AC outlets. Install gas-filled voltage suppressors on all outdoor wiring, make sure all the wiring is inside grounded metal conduit, Make sure all your inverters and converters are in metal boxes (or are built with metal cases) and ground everything. Read up on how transmitters and cell towers survive lighting. You can get to a 95% chance of surviving just about anything. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 998266 Indonesia 06/10/2010 03:59 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward (OP) User ID: 553745 United States 06/10/2010 04:01 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | absolutely. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 998266here's the deal, faraday shielding will work for most of the electronic components except for the MAGNETIC devices. Anything with TRANSFORMERS... ie all POWER SUPPLIES... like ur solar panels power inverter. and how do you protect that? |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 996623 United States 06/10/2010 04:06 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It is possible to survive an EMP with a working system. The worse EMP possible on earth is a lighting strike. Transmitters, cell towers and such get hit by lighting all the time and mostly survive. It all a matter of being able to bypass the surge energy to ground. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 999110A big CME is very different from an EMP. Where an EMP is a fast pulse (mostly RF energy), A big CME is a huge DC current. This DC current will saturate large power transformers and melt wiring both in the transformers and switchgear, and on the long lines. This will cause massive spikes in the AC power lines, but again, not as bad as a direct lighting strike. If your system is hardened enough to survive lighting, it will survive both EMP and CME events. A good link on lighting protection (it's all about the grounding) [link to www.windsun.com] sry for stupid asking but a lighting strike is an inch wide and allways strikes at the highest spot with conductivity now a emp or cme fucks everything up. The "inch wide" comment means nothing. lighting is over 100,000,000 volts and thousands of amps, for about a microsecond. It acts like an RF energy pulse, meaning that it follows the lowest impedance path to ground, not necessarily the shortest distance, or highest point. Most of the damage from a lighting strike is from the EMP that this creates. A CME is more of a large DC current induced into long wiring, so the damage is different. The protection is the same, have a very good ground system, and make sure than any excess power goes into the ground. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 860325 United States 06/11/2010 02:14 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | All the lightning references are not what was asked, of course a proper lightning arrestor is needed for protection from direct and near strikes but this will offer no protection from EMP weapons or effects. A solar panel is made like and of materials close to a giant IC chip. Voltage differences in the wrong places don't have to be greater than 20V to ESD damage the thin layers that "trap" the photons, bumping electrons out creating the panels electrical current. Quote from the internet: "Once a solar panel surface is charged and potential difference between surface insulator and conductor exceeds certain value, electrostatic discharge (ESD) may occur. This ESD may trigger a secondary arc that can destroy the solar panel circuit. ESD is also called as primary or minor arc and secondary is called major arc. The energy of minor arc is supplied by the charge stored in the coverglass of solar array and is a pulse of typically several 100 ns to several 100 μs duration. The damage caused by minor arc is less compared to major arcs, but it is observed that the minor arc is cause of major arc." This was referring to a charged space plasma causing the voltage buildup. So in my estimation deployed SP systems seem fragile to such events, not to mention reduced output by volcanic ash, Red dust from the interstellar cloud, or constant overcast conditions caused by cosmic ray or particle nucleation of water vapor. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 975529 United States 06/11/2010 02:28 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 975529 United States 06/11/2010 02:31 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 985286 United States 06/11/2010 04:17 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | yes. but your charge controller and anything that you want to power with the solar panels that has any sort of a micro chip in it will not. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 954702Dah, since most photovolatics are the same sort of silicon semiconducter diodes that your computer uses as well as for all its little zillions of transistors... given a strong enough local EMP field, no... won't survive. Why do you think TPTB are trying so hard to get everyone to switch over to sole dependence on Solar Electric? |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 985286 United States 06/11/2010 04:18 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | If a solar panel is hooked up to any kind of electrical device for running it the answer is no because the EMP will destroy the electrical equipment that is running the solar panel, it won't destroy the solar panel itself but the power source for it would be fried. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 975529Ah, the Power Source for Solar Panels is the SUN.. hello? |
Dr. Monroe User ID: 958499 United States 06/11/2010 04:20 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
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Burt Gummer User ID: 989406 United States 06/11/2010 04:24 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Sorry to burst you guys bubble but nothing will work on a EMP except a 4 inch thick walled LEAD box that has an airtight seal on it. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 975529That is it ! Bullsh*t. The cheapest FARADAY CAGE you can buy for your electronics.... [link to www.dreamstime.com] As long as you insulate the inner materials with foam padding or crumpled newspapers....you are fine. Bigger stuff....then you have an issue. Also...old cars or equipment that runs on points and condenser ignitions are likely to survive as well. New cars?.....TOAST. (A stainless steel body Delorean might survive too.) |