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To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...

 
Mr. Mannn
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User ID: 1005580
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06/16/2010 07:33 PM
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To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
I would like to ask several questions.

Let's look at all the important aspects of a relationship and break them down one by one.

First...Communication.

In any good relationship, communication is an important factor, if not the most important factor. If two people cannot communicate clearly, then problems will arise.

For instance, if a husband wants to communicate with his wife, but does it in vague manners, it will strain the relationship.

The husband goes around leaving notes to communicate what he is feeling or wants to do. Also, the husband makes it very hard to communicate by hiding himself from her or at best giving one word responses every now and then to her questions.
The wife has to constantly jump through hoops and mental mind games to try to figure out what her husband wants.

In christianity, you must constantly pray, fast, etc, etc just to get one word or sentence from "god" in your mind, and even then you must decipher whether the thoughts are from you, "god", or "satan".

And to make things even more interesting, apparently god likes to communicate through little signs and you are supposed to decipher what they mean.

Second...Self Esteem

In any good relationship, tearing the person down is never good. If you were constantly told that you were trash, you could do nothing to please your friend or spouse, but that you could only be happy with them in your life, it wouldn't make you feel good about yourself.

It perpetuates an imbalanced relationship.

We always hear of god as a loving father, and that imagine a father who is rejected by his children and his heart breaking. Well by that same token, I can't imagine anyone in this world calling someone a good father if they constantly tell their children that ever since the day they were born, they were bad and evil children, and that "in and of themselves" they could do nothing to please the father.

Not very encouraging is it?

Third...Visibility

Seeing the person you're in a relationship with is very important as well. It makes the communication a bit easier and things are conveyed better.

Constantly hiding yourself from your relationship would surely harm it.

As a christians I would often here pastors ask us or chastise us of being more in touch with family or other things than god instead of praying more to him.

It hit me that maybe it's so hard for all of us because I can actually see my friend sitting next to me, and when I talk to them, I get direct responses.

They don't play mind games where I have to sit and decipher signs from them, or they don't wait weeks before I get an answer to a question I asked them.

Fourth...Touch

Now touch is a big important factor in a relationship. More so in a romantic one of course, it connects us to that person.

There's nothing like a hug or sitting next to the one you love (even though some people admittedly hate hugging).


Fifth...Reliability

This is a big factor. If a husband can't depend on his wife, and vice versa, there is a problem.

For instance, if the family has one car and the wife needs to be taken to work everyday, but the husband only decides to do so sometimes or when he feels like it, there will be problems.

Now we all can't be perfect, but a trend of reliability over the course of a lifetime is what we're looking for.

In christianity, you really never know when god is going to show up. In a natural disaster, he may kill thousands of people, but save 5 and people will call it a miracle.

Sixth....Predictability/Unpredictability

Being unpredictable in a relationship is never good. If a husband goes to work sometimes, then decides to get drunk the other times, then gambles away all the money, or just completely being random at all times, the relationship fails.

In the bible we see god being very unpredictable. He loves us, then drowns us, orders sacrifices, then says no more sacrifices, etc etc.

With all this said, how do you have a relationship when in any other circumstances, we would call this, a bad relationship?
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Anonymous Coward
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06/16/2010 07:37 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
Jesus is just an archetype.. a tool to aid you in your relationship with God. Thats all there is forget Buddha Vishnu etc.. They are just tools.
Anonymous Coward
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06/16/2010 07:38 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
oops Vishnu is God to the Hindus I meant to say Krishna...
Hell Idk their religion is kind of complicated and confusing
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 363314
Sweden
06/16/2010 07:42 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
Is the man who was born year 0 and died 33 a.d., the same as the deity Christians worship?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 704060
United States
06/16/2010 07:46 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
I would like to ask several questions.

Let's look at all the important aspects of a relationship and break them down one by one.

First...Communication.

In any good relationship, communication is an important factor, if not the most important factor. If two people cannot communicate clearly, then problems will arise.

For instance, if a husband wants to communicate with his wife, but does it in vague manners, it will strain the relationship.

The husband goes around leaving notes to communicate what he is feeling or wants to do. Also, the husband makes it very hard to communicate by hiding himself from her or at best giving one word responses every now and then to her questions.
The wife has to constantly jump through hoops and mental mind games to try to figure out what her husband wants.

In christianity, you must constantly pray, fast, etc, etc just to get one word or sentence from "god" in your mind, and even then you must decipher whether the thoughts are from you, "god", or "satan".

And to make things even more interesting, apparently god likes to communicate through little signs and you are supposed to decipher what they mean.

Second...Self Esteem

In any good relationship, tearing the person down is never good. If you were constantly told that you were trash, you could do nothing to please your friend or spouse, but that you could only be happy with them in your life, it wouldn't make you feel good about yourself.

It perpetuates an imbalanced relationship.

We always hear of god as a loving father, and that imagine a father who is rejected by his children and his heart breaking. Well by that same token, I can't imagine anyone in this world calling someone a good father if they constantly tell their children that ever since the day they were born, they were bad and evil children, and that "in and of themselves" they could do nothing to please the father.

Not very encouraging is it?

Third...Visibility

Seeing the person you're in a relationship with is very important as well. It makes the communication a bit easier and things are conveyed better.

Constantly hiding yourself from your relationship would surely harm it.

As a christians I would often here pastors ask us or chastise us of being more in touch with family or other things than god instead of praying more to him.

It hit me that maybe it's so hard for all of us because I can actually see my friend sitting next to me, and when I talk to them, I get direct responses.

They don't play mind games where I have to sit and decipher signs from them, or they don't wait weeks before I get an answer to a question I asked them.

Fourth...Touch

Now touch is a big important factor in a relationship. More so in a romantic one of course, it connects us to that person.

There's nothing like a hug or sitting next to the one you love (even though some people admittedly hate hugging).


Fifth...Reliability

This is a big factor. If a husband can't depend on his wife, and vice versa, there is a problem.

For instance, if the family has one car and the wife needs to be taken to work everyday, but the husband only decides to do so sometimes or when he feels like it, there will be problems.

Now we all can't be perfect, but a trend of reliability over the course of a lifetime is what we're looking for.

In christianity, you really never know when god is going to show up. In a natural disaster, he may kill thousands of people, but save 5 and people will call it a miracle.

Sixth....Predictability/Unpredictability

Being unpredictable in a relationship is never good. If a husband goes to work sometimes, then decides to get drunk the other times, then gambles away all the money, or just completely being random at all times, the relationship fails.

In the bible we see god being very unpredictable. He loves us, then drowns us, orders sacrifices, then says no more sacrifices, etc etc.

With all this said, how do you have a relationship when in any other circumstances, we would call this, a bad relationship?
 Quoting: Mr. Mannn

Totally depends on one's belief system doesn't it. Because having reasoned with the topics and words of the bible, I have been totally persuaded and I have found and proven that god as totally predictable and totally perfect. So I have no problem with it. I call it a workable, profitable, healthy living relationship?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 478522
United States
06/16/2010 07:54 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
I would like to ask several questions.

Let's look at all the important aspects of a relationship and break them down one by one.

First...Communication.

In any good relationship, communication is an important factor, if not the most important factor. If two people cannot communicate clearly, then problems will arise.

For instance, if a husband wants to communicate with his wife, but does it in vague manners, it will strain the relationship.

The husband goes around leaving notes to communicate what he is feeling or wants to do. Also, the husband makes it very hard to communicate by hiding himself from her or at best giving one word responses every now and then to her questions.
The wife has to constantly jump through hoops and mental mind games to try to figure out what her husband wants.

In christianity, you must constantly pray, fast, etc, etc just to get one word or sentence from "god" in your mind, and even then you must decipher whether the thoughts are from you, "god", or "satan".

And to make things even more interesting, apparently god likes to communicate through little signs and you are supposed to decipher what they mean.

Second...Self Esteem

In any good relationship, tearing the person down is never good. If you were constantly told that you were trash, you could do nothing to please your friend or spouse, but that you could only be happy with them in your life, it wouldn't make you feel good about yourself.

It perpetuates an imbalanced relationship.

We always hear of god as a loving father, and that imagine a father who is rejected by his children and his heart breaking. Well by that same token, I can't imagine anyone in this world calling someone a good father if they constantly tell their children that ever since the day they were born, they were bad and evil children, and that "in and of themselves" they could do nothing to please the father.

Not very encouraging is it?

Third...Visibility

Seeing the person you're in a relationship with is very important as well. It makes the communication a bit easier and things are conveyed better.

Constantly hiding yourself from your relationship would surely harm it.

As a christians I would often here pastors ask us or chastise us of being more in touch with family or other things than god instead of praying more to him.

It hit me that maybe it's so hard for all of us because I can actually see my friend sitting next to me, and when I talk to them, I get direct responses.

They don't play mind games where I have to sit and decipher signs from them, or they don't wait weeks before I get an answer to a question I asked them.

Fourth...Touch

Now touch is a big important factor in a relationship. More so in a romantic one of course, it connects us to that person.

There's nothing like a hug or sitting next to the one you love (even though some people admittedly hate hugging).


Fifth...Reliability

This is a big factor. If a husband can't depend on his wife, and vice versa, there is a problem.

For instance, if the family has one car and the wife needs to be taken to work everyday, but the husband only decides to do so sometimes or when he feels like it, there will be problems.

Now we all can't be perfect, but a trend of reliability over the course of a lifetime is what we're looking for.

In christianity, you really never know when god is going to show up. In a natural disaster, he may kill thousands of people, but save 5 and people will call it a miracle.

Sixth....Predictability/Unpredictability

Being unpredictable in a relationship is never good. If a husband goes to work sometimes, then decides to get drunk the other times, then gambles away all the money, or just completely being random at all times, the relationship fails.

In the bible we see god being very unpredictable. He loves us, then drowns us, orders sacrifices, then says no more sacrifices, etc etc.

With all this said, how do you have a relationship when in any other circumstances, we would call this, a bad relationship?
 Quoting: Mr. Mannn

MR. MANN:
You are wrong. I have an upclose and personal relationship with Jesus and he is my BEST friend. You talk about communication. I talk to him EVERY day. I hear him when he tells me what to do and what not to do. For instance, every single time I am about to sin, Jesus tells me he is disappointed in me and I stop. That is what a personal relationship is all about. It is wonderful. And he keeps me on the straight and narrow. Without Jesus, who knows where I would be???

Then you talk about self-esteem. Without Jesus, I would have low esteem but he tells me that he loves me every day. He has gone up to prepare this wonderful mansion for me and I will walk on golden streets forever. I am loved by the creator of the universe and that gives me high self-esteem. It is wonderful to be loved by the man who died for ME. I was so special that if I was the only person alive, Jesus would have died for me. I am special to God so this gives me very high self-esteem.

Jesus is very visible to us. You would see him too. You just have to look but not with your human eyes. You can see Jesus through spiritual eyes and he is quite visible. Do you know Jesus died for YOU? If you only believe in him he will let you go to heaven forever. But if you turn away from this wonderful gift, you will be under God's wrath because God hates sin. Maybe you don't see yourself as a sinner but God hates ALL sin. That is why Jesus died. Are you starting to understand why I love him? He died for ME.

As far as touch, haven't you ever heard anyone say "Jesus touched me." Again, not a physical touch but a spiritual touch and that is MUCH better. Touching and hugging can't compare to knowing that Jesus died for you. I live every day in total happiness because Jesus died for ME.

Jesus is very predictable and dependable and reliable. Yes, sometimes bad things happen to good people but that is why Jesus is so wonderful. When people that love him die, they go to heaven. To die is considered to be GAIN in the Bible. So if there is an accident and someone is killed the Christian rests knowing they are walking on those golden streets. And they will live forever. And you will be stuck down here. Seriously, where would you rather be?God will always be there if you love him. He will always do what is best for you. That is why you MUST be a Christian. There is no other religion with a RISEN savior.

Now...doesn't that sound like a pile of cow manure. I am an atheist but I thought I would try to answer your questions from a Christian perspective with a few snide remarks thrown in for good measure. Maybe the Christians would like to answer too. I am sure I missed a pile of cow manure somewhere along the way.
Mr. Mannn  (OP)

User ID: 1005580
United States
06/16/2010 07:56 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
MR. MANN:
You are wrong. I have an upclose and personal relationship with Jesus and he is my BEST friend. You talk about communication. I talk to him EVERY day. I hear him when he tells me what to do and what not to do. For instance, every single time I am about to sin, Jesus tells me he is disappointed in me and I stop. That is what a personal relationship is all about. It is wonderful. And he keeps me on the straight and narrow. Without Jesus, who knows where I would be???

Then you talk about self-esteem. Without Jesus, I would have low esteem but he tells me that he loves me every day. He has gone up to prepare this wonderful mansion for me and I will walk on golden streets forever. I am loved by the creator of the universe and that gives me high self-esteem. It is wonderful to be loved by the man who died for ME. I was so special that if I was the only person alive, Jesus would have died for me. I am special to God so this gives me very high self-esteem.

Jesus is very visible to us. You would see him too. You just have to look but not with your human eyes. You can see Jesus through spiritual eyes and he is quite visible. Do you know Jesus died for YOU? If you only believe in him he will let you go to heaven forever. But if you turn away from this wonderful gift, you will be under God's wrath because God hates sin. Maybe you don't see yourself as a sinner but God hates ALL sin. That is why Jesus died. Are you starting to understand why I love him? He died for ME.

As far as touch, haven't you ever heard anyone say "Jesus touched me." Again, not a physical touch but a spiritual touch and that is MUCH better. Touching and hugging can't compare to knowing that Jesus died for you. I live every day in total happiness because Jesus died for ME.

Jesus is very predictable and dependable and reliable. Yes, sometimes bad things happen to good people but that is why Jesus is so wonderful. When people that love him die, they go to heaven. To die is considered to be GAIN in the Bible. So if there is an accident and someone is killed the Christian rests knowing they are walking on those golden streets. And they will live forever. And you will be stuck down here. Seriously, where would you rather be?God will always be there if you love him. He will always do what is best for you. That is why you MUST be a Christian. There is no other religion with a RISEN savior.

Now...doesn't that sound like a pile of cow manure. I am an atheist but I thought I would try to answer your questions from a Christian perspective with a few snide remarks thrown in for good measure. Maybe the Christians would like to answer too. I am sure I missed a pile of cow manure somewhere along the way.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 478522



LOL...wow you sounded so genuine and real.
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1005611
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06/16/2010 08:01 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
For years I struggled on how to hear God talk to me. I was nearly obsessed with it. When I say years, I mean literally years for me. I was very frustrated by this.

What was wrong? Well, for one, I was still living a sinful lifestyle. In reality, I wanted to do things my way, and yet I still wanted God to be close to me and talk to me. However, it doesn't work that way.

I'm not going to go through all your points one by one, but the underlying theme I detected in them is that you don't know God at all, you have a deeply warped view of Him, and He has hidden Himself from you. He says His sheep know His voice.

Many years later, free from living a sinful lifestyle, I can finally hear God talk to me. Is it as much as I want? Honestly, no, because He talks in very short sentences, and I would love to hear Him ramble on and on to me, but when I've thought that before, He has told me to go to His Word, the Bible, where there is a lot of ramblin' going on, good ramblin' of course... But there is no mistaking that voice when He does talk to me with a personal message. He's been my encourager, my friend that was there when no one else has been, and the love of my life. He knows me like no one else ever has or ever will, all the dirt and the dessert.

If you're really sincere about getting close to Him, you will seek Him out with all of your heart, realizing what a priceless treasure He is. And that happens when you humble yourself. Question is, can you humble yourself enough for that?
Anonymous Coward
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06/16/2010 08:09 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
For years I struggled on how to hear God talk to me. I was nearly obsessed with it. When I say years, I mean literally years for me. I was very frustrated by this.

What was wrong? Well, for one, I was still living a sinful lifestyle. In reality, I wanted to do things my way, and yet I still wanted God to be close to me and talk to me. However, it doesn't work that way.

I'm not going to go through all your points one by one, but the underlying theme I detected in them is that you don't know God at all, you have a deeply warped view of Him, and He has hidden Himself from you. He says His sheep know His voice.

Many years later, free from living a sinful lifestyle, I can finally hear God talk to me. Is it as much as I want? Honestly, no, because He talks in very short sentences, and I would love to hear Him ramble on and on to me, but when I've thought that before, He has told me to go to His Word, the Bible, where there is a lot of ramblin' going on, good ramblin' of course... But there is no mistaking that voice when He does talk to me with a personal message. He's been my encourager, my friend that was there when no one else has been, and the love of my life. He knows me like no one else ever has or ever will, all the dirt and the dessert.

If you're really sincere about getting close to Him, you will seek Him out with all of your heart, realizing what a priceless treasure He is. And that happens when you humble yourself. Question is, can you humble yourself enough for that?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1005611

No, maybe the question is, can you grow up and accept the fact that you are a mortal human being who will die and rot in the ground. That is what your love for God/Jesus/Allah/whoever is all about. You have to have invisible friends because you are scared to death of your own mortality.

You pretend like you don't sin anymore and you turned from your sinful lifestyle. You probably went out drinking once in a while or smoked some pot. Big deal. Now you are a self-righteous, pride-filled Pharisee and I guess you think you are perfect. Well, you know what your dumb book says, "First take the big log out of your own eye before you remove the speck from another eye."

The voice you hear in your head is you and it has a name. It is called your conscience and most every human being has one. Muslims have a conscience and so do Buddhists and Hindus. The voice you THINK you hear is only your own. Christians do just as many evil things as any other person from any other religion so what do you have to say about that. In fact, Buddhists are generally MUCH more peaceful than Christians.

You go on and on about your invisible lover. That makes you crazy but you just don't know it. It just isn't healthy to have a "relationship" with an invisible friend. That is why children are encouraged to give up their invisible friends by a certain age and they usually do...when they grow up. You should try it sometime.
Mr. Mannn  (OP)

User ID: 1005631
United States
06/16/2010 08:14 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
For years I struggled on how to hear God talk to me. I was nearly obsessed with it. When I say years, I mean literally years for me. I was very frustrated by this.

What was wrong? Well, for one, I was still living a sinful lifestyle. In reality, I wanted to do things my way, and yet I still wanted God to be close to me and talk to me. However, it doesn't work that way.

I'm not going to go through all your points one by one, but the underlying theme I detected in them is that you don't know God at all, you have a deeply warped view of Him, and He has hidden Himself from you. He says His sheep know His voice.

Many years later, free from living a sinful lifestyle, I can finally hear God talk to me. Is it as much as I want? Honestly, no, because He talks in very short sentences, and I would love to hear Him ramble on and on to me, but when I've thought that before, He has told me to go to His Word, the Bible, where there is a lot of ramblin' going on, good ramblin' of course... But there is no mistaking that voice when He does talk to me with a personal message. He's been my encourager, my friend that was there when no one else has been, and the love of my life. He knows me like no one else ever has or ever will, all the dirt and the dessert.

If you're really sincere about getting close to Him, you will seek Him out with all of your heart, realizing what a priceless treasure He is. And that happens when you humble yourself. Question is, can you humble yourself enough for that?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1005611


Yeah I was a christian for several years and realized that I either never heard him, or that it was my own thoughts telling me things.

And to claim that people can't hear him because they are sinful, I'm pretty sure in the bible, god talked to sinful people all the time clear as day.

And I don't think you got the point of what I said. You say he has hidden himself from me? Why?

All I did was ask honest questions as a christian, and ultimately those questions could not be answered.

I think what you have really given are excuses for god not showing up. You are talking to yourself.
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The Professor
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06/17/2010 06:14 PM
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Re: To all the christians who claim to have a "relationship" with Jesus...
Is the man who was born year 0 and died 33 a.d., the same as the deity Christians worship?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 363314



Actually, Christians cannot agree on the date of Christ's birth or the date of His death.





GLP