Molecular clouds responsible for life and creation of solar systems, are they alive?

These clouds can also create planetars and MASERS.

Planetar is a term used in astronomy that refers to one of two things:
Brown dwarfs - objects intermediate in size between planets and stars.
Interstellar planets - planetars that are cold masses smaller than brown dwarfs and do not orbit a star, but are free-floating in space.
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Failed brown dwarfs

Sub-brown dwarfs are formed in the manner of stars, through the collapse of a gas cloud (perhaps with the help of photo-erosion), and not through accretion or core collapse from a circumstellar disc. The distinction between a sub-brown dwarf and a planet is unclear; astronomers are divided into two camps as whether to consider the formation process of a planet as part of its division in classification.[1]
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

A maser is a device that produces coherent electromagnetic waves through amplification by stimulated emission.
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Closer to home, we find that the interstellar medium of galaxies is often rich with molecular gas. In some circumstances, naturally-occurring masers can form, producing extremely bright and collimated beams of radiation. Prof. David Neufeld is an expert in all aspects of molecular astrophysics, and uses molecular diagnostics to elucidate the properties of astronomical systems from planets and comets to stellar atmospheres to molecular clouds. Prof. Steven Beckwith, former Director of the Space Telescope Science Institute, has long been a leader in using infrared observations to probe molecular clouds in order to reveal the new stars being created within them. Characterizing diffuse UV emission has long been a goal of Prof. Richard Henry's work.

The last decade has seen an explosion of interest in the formation of planetary systems, now that we can detect dozens of extra-Solar planets as well as conduct detailed studies of many of our own Solar System's planets through a variety of space experiments. A number of Hopkins astrophysicists are deeply involved in these efforts, developing new techniques for detecting extra-Solar Planets (Prof. Holland Ford), studying the atmospheres and magnetospheres of other planets in our Solar System (Prof. Warren Moos), and analyzing cometary spectra (Prof. Paul Feldman).

Virtually all the matter in the Universe is ionized, and magnetic fields are ubiquitous in ionized gases. Two of the most important unsolved physics problems in astrophysics are the origin and growth of these magnetic fields and what happens when oppositely-directed fieldlines reconnect. These problems are at the center of Prof. Ethan Vishniac's work.
[link to physics-astronomy.jhu.edu]


Historical background

In 1965 an unexpected discovery was made by Weaver et al.[3]: emission lines in space, of unknown origin, at a frequency of 1665 MHz. At this time many people still thought that molecules could not exist in space, and so the emission was at first attributed to an unknown interstellar species named Mysterium, but the emission was soon identified as line emission from OH molecules in compact sources within molecular clouds[4]. More discoveries followed, with H2O emission in 1969[5], CH3OH emission in 1970[6] and SiO emission in 1974[7], all coming from within molecular clouds. These were termed "masers", as from their narrow line-widths and high effective temperatures it became clear that these sources were amplifying microwave radiation.

Masers were then discovered around highly-evolved Late type stars; First was OH emission in 1968[8], then H2O emission in 1969[9] and SiO emission in 1974[10]. Masers were also discovered in external galaxies in 1973[11], and in our own solar system in comet halos.

Another unexpected discovery was made in 1982 with the discovery of emission from an extra-galactic source with an unrivalled luminosity about 106 times larger than any previous source[12]. This was termed a megamaser because of its great luminosity; many more megamasers have since been discovered.

*snip*
Polarisation

An important aspect of maser study is polarisation of the emission. Astronomical masers are often very highly polarised, sometimes 100% (in the case of some OH masers) in a circular fashion, and to a lesser degree in a linear fashion. This polarisation is due to some combination of the Zeeman effect, magnetic beaming of the maser radiation, and anisotropic pumping which favours certain magnetic-state transitions.

It should be noted that many of the characteristics of megamaser emission are different.
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Experimental data on association reactions of H and OH suggest that radiative association involving atomic and diatomic neutral radicals may be considered as an effective mechanism for the production of small neutral molecules in the interstellar clouds.

OH masers

OH masers, a type of astrophysical maser, were the first masers to be discovered in space and have been observed in more environments than any other type of maser.

In the Milky Way, OH masers are found in stellar masers (evolved stars), interstellar masers (regions of massive star formation), or in the interface between supernova remnants and molecular material. Interstellar OH masers are often observed from molecular material surrounding ultracompact H II regions (UC H II). But there are masers associated with very young stars that have yet to create UC H II regions.[6] This class of OH masers appears to form near the edges of very dense material, place where H2O masers form, and where total densities drop rapidly and UV radiation form young stars can dissociate the H2O molecules. So, observations of OH masers in these regions, can be an important way to probe the distribution of the important H2O molecule in interstellar shocks at high spacial resolutions.
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Last Edited by Xenus  on 06/22/2010 01:42 AM

Anyone remember the IBEX findings?

The IBEX data fit in nicely with recent results from Voyager. Voyager 1 and 2 are near the edge of the solar system and they also have sensed strong* magnetism nearby. Voyager measurements are relatively local to the spacecraft, however. IBEX is filling in the "big picture." The ribbon it sees is vast and stretches almost all the way across the sky, suggesting that the magnetic field behind it must be equally vast.

Although maps of the ribbon (see below) seem to show a luminous body, the ribbon emits no light. Instead, it makes itself known via particles called "energetic neutral atoms" (ENAs)--mainly garden-variety hydrogen atoms. The ribbon emits these particles, which are picked up by IBEX in Earth orbit.

*snip*

The solar system is passing through a region of the Milky Way filled with cosmic rays and interstellar clouds. The magnetic field of our own sun, inflated by the solar wind into a bubble called the "heliosphere," substantially protects us from these things. However, the bubble itself is vulnerable to external fields. A strong magnetic field just outside the solar system could press against the heliosphere and interact with it in unknown ways. Will this strengthen our natural shielding—or weaken it? No one can say.
[link to science.nasa.gov]

Life molecules

The newly discovered molecules are made up of 6 to 11 atoms each and are classified as organic because they contain carbon.

Five of the molecules were discovered in Sagittarius B2(N), a star-forming dust cloud located 26,000 light-years from Earth near the center of the Milky Way Galaxy. This stellar nursery is the largest known repository of complex interstellar molecules.

The other three molecules were found in the Taurus Molecular Cloud (TMC-1), located only 450 light-years away. TMC-1 is starless; it is cold and dark and has a temperature of only 10 degrees above absolute zero.

"The discovery of these large organic molecules in the coldest regions of the interstellar medium has certainly changed the belief that large organic molecules would only have their origins in hot molecular cores," said study team member Anthony Remijan of the National Radio Astronomy Observatory (NRAO). "It has forced us to rethink the paradigms of interstellar chemistry."

Just because a molecule is organic does not mean that it is made by living things. In fact, many of the newly spotted molecules are poisonous to organisms on Earth, Hollis said. But one of the molecules found in Sagittarius B2(N), called acetamide, contains a type of chemical bond important for linking together amino acids, the molecular building blocks of proteins.

Made up of 9 atoms, acetamide "is the largest molecule found in space that has that bond," Hollis told SPACE.com.

Space tumbleweeds

The molecules are thought to form by two main mechanisms. In the first, simple chemical reactions add an atom to a molecule that is stuck to the surface of a dust grain afloat in space. The second method involves chemical reactions between neutral molecules and highly reactive molecules called radicals.

Once formed, the molecules are shaken loose from their dust-grain homes by rapidly moving shock waves. As the freed molecules tumble end-over-end in space, they can emit or absorb radiation at precise radio frequencies unique to each type of molecule. Astronomers identify the molecules based on these radio frequencies.

Within a dust cloud, thousands of billions of molecules undergo the same types of rotation, emitting and absorbing the same radio frequencies. The end result is a signal strong enough to be detected by instruments on Earth.

The newfound molecules bring the total number of biologically-relevant molecules found in interstellar space to 141. Scientists have previously found benzene, a ring-shaped carbon molecule important for life on Earth, around stars and intact amino acids in meteorites that have crash-landed on Earth.

Even more complex molecular creations might be possible in space, experiments suggest. In one study, scientists simulated deep space conditions in the laboratory and created small structures resembling cell walls in living organisms.

A case for extraterrestrial life

Taken together, the findings suggest that the chemical ingredients necessary for life began taking shape long before our planet was formed.

Many scientists now accept the notion that ancient meteorites and comets helped jumpstart life on our planet by bringing a significant amount of water, organic molecules and even amino acids to early Earth.
[link to www.space.com]

This is a list of molecules that have been detected in the interstellar medium, grouped by the number of component atoms. The chemical formula is listed for each detected compound, along with any ionized form that has also been observed.

The list includes H2O aka water.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

These dense clouds are not only responsible for the formation of solar systems and planetars but also for LIFE. Religious people refer to these clouds as GOD. Whether these plasma clouds are intelligent, alive and sentient is another matter but we do know they gave BIRTH to everything we see around us and as a result life flourished and evolved.

Last Edited by Xenus  on 06/22/2010 02:11 AM

For those people who don't get it, the passage of our solar system through these clouds can cause stellar events such as the birth of a brown dwarf or planetar, a protostar or a star as well as formation of moons and planets. All it takes is some radiation, from our sun or a supernova nearby. And of course there is the less comfortable fact that they can also cause extinction level events on our planet and drastically alter biological systems, causing dramatic changes in evolution and possibly the creation of new life.

You must be trolling or simply too stupid to understand, because there's no BS here. Despite all the evidence in the universe most of the religious people will call BS, even though they choose to believe in a fictional god of man's creations (with absolutely no proof), created in a time of scarce knowledge about our place in the universe. Now some of us have actually learned and evolved enough to begin to understand the complexities of life, where life came from and what caused it to proliferate.

The monkeys are still waving their bibles around as if it actually explained anything. The rest of the humans are actually learning and growing.

These clouds are your gods, they created you, our solar system and everything in it. Whether you choose to believe this fact or not is irrelevant because it is a fact. It is the reality, the one believers try to hide from in favour for their more comfortable lies and delusions.

Whether or not these clouds are living beings beyond our current understanding or merely universal structures/factories that create life and solid matter is another matter.

thank you xenus.

It's impossible to say what will happen because the possibilities are extremely varied and have many factors involved so that only leaves exploring the possibilities. There's a lot of information about what these clouds are capable of and what we have observed within them and their interactions. However there is very little solid information in regards to what would happen when these clouds pass us/we pass through them, apart from the shrinking heliosphere. Since I've already gone through these things in my other thread I won't add the information here but you can find it here; [link to www.godlikeproductions.com]

And evidence of past events of these clouds can be found engraved into rocks, known as petroglyphs. Details in my petroglyph thread. Thread: Petroglyphs, not just simple, crude drawings from ancient man. The truth is stranger then you could ever imagine.

There is enough scientific data and evidence to show that we've passed through such clouds before, but the dense clouds are very rare with an estimate of a dozen passages in the history of the Earth compared to several hundred less dense clouds. So far all the observations and evidence are showing that this cloud is one of those rare dense clouds. The only real way of finding that out for sure is to study the characteristics of the cloud, the composition and density etc. using spectroscopy and radio astronomy. They are invisible to our eyes and our telescopes, the dust and plasma (charged particles and ionized atoms) blocks visible light frequencies and also absorbs them.

We'll never SEE it coming, only the effects it has. Has no one been paying to the extremely odd behaviour of the sun? The extremely long and deep minimum, still ongoing, shrinking heliosphere, all these "rare" filaments and hyder flares and asteroids/comets slamming into Jupiter lately... Not to mention the peculiar phenomena known as noctulicent clouds, first appeared less than 100 (or so from memory) years ago and now increasing dramatically, the exact same atmospheric phenomena which is responsible for the belt on Jupiter disappearing.

Last Edited by Xenus  on 06/22/2010 03:46 AM

I would have thought there would be more interest about something major as this, the distractions all seem to be working just fine... The oil spill is nothing but a show and a distribution of BP's money (isn't that money laundering?) and while everyone is focused on gossip, distractions and other useless shit we're heading deeper into the cloud(s) and the cloud is leaking into the solar system...

I've shown that these clouds are normal in the universe, how we're surrounded by such a cloud and have been for thousands of years, only it's not as dense as the cloud(s) we're running into now. And it's these denser clouds that push back the heliosphere and make the sun change behaviour and alters the activity. There are only two possible explanations for a shrinking heliosphere, the sun is getting ready to die or that a massive dense plasma cloud is compressing the heliosphere with its magnetic field. Since the death of our sun is highly unlikely at this point in time that leaves the cloud.

I've shown the different possible effects that these clouds have just on their own, without any interaction with the solar system and the sun and how it affects the heliosphere, compressing it, if it is dense enough it will compress to within 1 AU (inside our orbit) allowing a magnitude or two more galactic cosmic rays to reach Earth.

The only information I don't have is the effects of these cosmic rays on biological systems, apart from the whole cancer/mutation issue. A few scientists have claimed that they have been responsible for the leaps in evolution but how?

Also the fact that everything required for life exists in the interstellar medium should be an eye opener, it means that there is a good chance for life out there somewhere unless something is preventing it from forming. Not to mention that is how comets, asteroids and other solid objects are formed, inside these dense clouds and get ejected out. They are the product of FIRE and ICE, hot and cold temperatures.

What would it mean if the key ingredients for life exist in abundance but we're the only life as we know (carbon/silicon based) in the entire universe? These molecular clouds are cooler than their counterpart plasma clouds, cool enough for biochemical growth and evolution. Think about that, they almost seem alive, being able to replicate, communicate, give birth to entire solar systems, create matter and transmute matter.

Physicists have created blobs of gaseous plasma that can grow, replicate and communicate - fulfilling most of the traditional requirements for biological cells. Without inherited material they cannot be described as alive, but the researchers believe these curious spheres may offer a radical new explanation for how life began.

Most biologists think living cells arose out of a complex and lengthy evolution of chemicals that took millions of years, beginning with simple molecules through amino acids, primitive proteins and finally forming an organised structure. But if Mircea Sanduloviciu and his colleagues at Cuza University in Romania are right, the theory may have to be completely revised. They say cell-like self-organisation can occur in a few microseconds.

The researchers studied environmental conditions similar to those that existed on the Earth before life began, when the planet was enveloped in electric storms that caused ionised gases called plasmas to form in the atmosphere.

They inserted two electrodes into a chamber containing a low-temperature plasma of argon - a gas in which some of the atoms have been split into electrons and charged ions. They applied a high voltage to the electrodes, producing an arc of energy that flew across the gap between them, like a miniature lightning strike.

Split in two

A distinct boundary layer that confines and separates an object from its environment is one of the four main criteria generally used to define living cells. Sanduloviciu decided to find out if his cells met the other criteria: the ability to replicate, to communicate information, and to metabolise and grow.

He found that the spheres could replicate by splitting into two. Under the right conditions they also got bigger, taking up neutral argon atoms and splitting them into ions and electrons to replenish their boundary layers.

Finally, they could communicate information by emitting electromagnetic energy, making the atoms within other spheres vibrate at a particular frequency. The spheres are not the only self-organising systems to meet all of these requirements. But they are the first gaseous "cells".

Sanduloviciu even thinks they could have been the first cells on Earth, arising within electric storms. "The emergence of such spheres seems likely to be a prerequisite for biochemical evolution," he says.

Sanduloviciu insists that although the spheres require high temperature to form, they can survive at lower temperatures. "That would be the sort of environment in which normal biochemical interactions occur."

But perhaps the most intriguing implications of Sanduloviciu's work are for life on other planets. "The cell-like spheres we describe could be at the origin of other forms of life we have not yet considered," he says. Which means our search for extraterrestrial life may need a drastic re-think. There could be life out there, but not as we know it.
[link to www.newscientist.com]

hi xenus
in meditation, effects on biological systems are seen as a swirl, creating pressure which rises in brain.
any defective organ will suffer during the rise.
especially the solar plexus and heart.
fire in brain cavity leading to depression within the cavity. so dementia is a risk.

fire and ice(cold) create pressure variances and affect mind. so...
leap in evolution? yes
madness? yes
for some? yes
for the rest? yes
visualization of coming conditions advises to decrease heat in brain cavity.

..and we could finally "allow"
that all motion is actually "life"
and that all our approaches for understanding the universe we live in, was needlessly mechanical in nature

exactly
if you can remember how quick was your "last" realization
you can envisin this big one!

we will just open our eyes one day,
and realize in one moment, that something changed,
as if you, the evening before met 1000 new people,
and became their best friend from the moment on

the new morning would bring you a whole new perspective
new reality with details you missed (not needed)

interesting read, thanks :-)

Last Edited by Thoughts Faux Fodder on 06/23/2010 05:39 AM

Glad you found it interesting. I find the idea that matter in the state of plasma can be a form of life to be fascinating, especially when you consider that our own star is a ball of plasma...

Spitzer was able to spot the sinuous cloud using its heat-seeking infrared vision. The object is hiding in the dusty plane of our Milky Way galaxy, invisible to optical telescopes. Because its heat, or infrared light, can sneak through the dust, it first showed up in infrared images from past missions. The cloud is so thick with dust that if you were to somehow transport yourself into the middle of it, you would see nothing but black, not even a star in the sky.


Spitzer's new view of the snake provides the best view of what lurks inside. The yellow and orange spots located on and around it are massive stars just beginning to take shape. The bright red spot located on its belly is a monstrous stellar embryo, with about 20 to 50 times the mass of our sun.


Astronomers say these observations will ultimately help them better understand how massive stars form. By studying the clustering and range of masses of the stellar embryos, they hope to determine if the stars were born in the same way that our low-mass sun was formed -- out of a collapsing cloud of gas and dust -- or by another mechanism in which the environment plays a larger role.
[link to www.dailygalaxy.com]

ALL is LIFE.
LIFE is ALL.

nice to see open eyes here

Matter is energy
Energy is matter

At least according to Einstein. These clouds are capable of creating matter from radiation and vice versa. The holy grail of energy. Fusing elements to create heavier elements, from hydrogen. I'm not sure if the colder clouds are capable of fusion but the hot ones certainly are. As massive as our sun is, these clouds are light years across, dense in the middle, "wispy and fluffy" on the outside. The images you see of nebulae are obviously false colour, we cannot see them. So next time some smart ass rich astronomer says it doesn't exist because they cannot see it, point out there is much in space they cannot see in the tiny portion of the visible light spectrum.

While we don't understand the process behind cloud collapse and the birth of planets and stars, we know it only happens in these clouds.

sounds like the "tsunami from outer space thread that went viral a few years ago:

Thread: Tsunami from outer space. Prepare yourself for unimaginable destruction.

Only not, these clouds are massive, light years across and they vary greatly on characteristics like density, composition and temperature, all of which make them highly unpredictable and there is no one scenario that can explain what will happen, only a range of different scenarios of the possibilities. Let's just say the past 30-60,000 years have been a walk in the park compared to a galactic environment altered by these clouds.

Apples and oranges.

Homepage of Priscilla C. Frisch [link to astro.uchicago.edu]

The Sun’s Journey Through the Local
Interstellar Medium: The PaleoLISM and
Paleoheliosphere
P. C. Frisch 1 and J. D. Slavin 2

Abstract

Over the recent past, the galactic environment of the Sun has differed substantially from today. Sometime within the past 130,000 years, and possibly as recent as 56,000 years ago, the Sun entered the tenuous tepid partially ionized
interstellar material now flowing past the Sun. Prior to that, the Sun was in the low density interior of the Local Bubble. As the Sun entered the local
ISM flow, we passed briefly through an interface region of some type. The low column densities of the cloud now surrounding the solar system indicate that
heliosphere boundary conditions will vary from opacity considerations alone as the Sun moves through the cloud. These variations in the interstellar material surrounding the Sun affected the paleoheliosphere.

Conclusions

The primary conclusion of this paper is that, over the past several million years, both the galactic environment of the Sun and the heliosphere have been significantly
different than they are today. Observational data combined with theoretical studies can be used to reconstruct the three-dimensional distribution
of nearby ISM, and predict the times the Sun transitioned between different environments. If we assume a continuously distributed local ISM, within the
past 130, 000±70,000 years, and possibly as recent as 56,000 years ago, the Sun entered low density partially ionized ISM flowing away from the direction of
the Scorpius-Centaurus Association. Sometime within the past 40,000 years the Sun entered the cloud now surrounding the solar system, the LIC. These
estimates rely on topologically simple models of the cluster of local interstellar clouds (CLIC) flowing past the Sun; more elaborate models are discussed
elsewhere ([17, 26, 43], SF06). As the Sun moves through this complex of local interstellar clouds, the boundary conditions of the heliosphere should change by
substantial amounts due to changes in cloud temperature, velocity, and opacitydriven variations in the ionization of the surrounding ISM. Prior to that, the
Sun was in the low density plasma of the Local Bubble cavity. Between the Local Bubble cavity and the CLIC, the Sun briefly (500 years) passed through
an interface region of some type.
These estimates of the entry date of the Sun into the CLIC and LIC are based on current data and models.
[link to lanl.arxiv.org]