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DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion

 
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 11:27 AM
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DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
DISCUSS: The reasons for and against the eradication of religion.

Please limit the discussion to the topic at hand. There should be no trolling or bashing of specific religions or posters in this thread. All intelligent arguments are welcome in this thread.

I'll start. I will leave the discussion to simmer for a while before contributing again.

At some point in the infancy of human civilization, religion provided a necessary stabilizing influence. It served as a system of laws, it gave people a moral force and obligations, and it gave people hope and something to live for.
However, we've grown past religion. We don't need it anymore, and it is causing us some serious problems.
More large groups people have been killed on the planet over the course of human history than for any other reason. It appears as though the world is headed towards another religious conflict, and the forces are so large and powerful that it is truly doubtful whether our global civilization will survive the coming war.

Some arguments (debunked) against abandonment of religion:
1. Loss of morals. Once the assumptions of religion are discarded, and one realizes that the entirety of the religion was created by man, it follows that it is not god who gave us morality, it was man. Intelligent religious leaders recognized long ago that to live in large groups, and in harmony, there needed to be a group morality. Without god, morals exist as a way for people to live together in peace. Don't kill, don't steal, and so on are common sense.

2. Punishment in the afterlife. Humans, just like any animal, have a foundational instinct to avoid death. In humans, this manifests in large part as fear of death. It is only natural to desire something beyond this life. The loss of the self, of ceasing to be, is one of our greatest fears. This has lead to the afterlife myth. Hell and heaven are the primary christian variation on the afterlife myth, which have been long used as the stick and the carrot by religious leaders. It is simply another way of controlling the people and giving them an incentive to live according to the rules set out by the religious tradition.

3. Divine intervention. This is simple. There is no fate. Only coincidence. If you feel as though you have been blessed or saved by some divine providence, examine the circumstances of this supposed miracle. Whether through positive thinking, better circumstances, skill, preparation, or just pure chance, things do not happen for a divine reason. Good things happen to bad people, and bad things happen to good people every day.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 11:33 AM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, "disillusioned with Christianity"


our future hf
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 11:38 AM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, "disillusioned with Christianity"


our future hf
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1096750

God, you Marxists never give up, do you? Not even after murdering hundreds of million. The blood lust is never fulfilled. And you blame the victims of your mass murder on the victims themselves. Cute.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:31 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, "disillusioned with Christianity"


our future hf

God, you Marxists never give up, do you? Not even after murdering hundreds of million. The blood lust is never fulfilled. And you blame the victims of your mass murder on the victims themselves. Cute.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1047610


Some of marxism is screwed up, but the point it makes about capitalism is correct. Exploitation of people en masse is what our society is currently all about. This needs to change.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:32 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Actually, my apologies OP for derailing even further. Religion is a fat wolf feeding on the masses.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:34 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
God, you proselytizers never give up, do you? Not even after murdering hundreds of million. The blood lust is never fulfilled. And you blame the victims of your mass murder on the victims themselves. Cute.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1047610
GUANO

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09/13/2010 01:37 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe.


Belief is the psychological state in which an individual holds a proposition or premise to be true.

To 'worship' is to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).

A god is a person or thing (or ideal) of supreme value.






----Religion is transcendental... Everyone on earth is part of a religion, everyone on earth 'worships' a god.
Total Protonic Reversal...
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:41 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe.


Belief is the psychological state in which an individual holds a proposition or premise to be true.

To 'worship' is to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).

A god is a person or thing (or ideal) of supreme value.






----Religion is transcendental... Everyone on earth is part of a religion, everyone on earth 'worships' a god.
 Quoting: GUANO


Sorry, but I don't follow the above. Not everyone on earth worships a god. A lot of people don't even think there is a god.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:45 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."


Man should not seek to limit another rights.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:47 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."


Man should not seek to limit another rights.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1052576



"That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,---That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness"...
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:49 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."


Man should not seek to limit another rights.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1052576


Please elaborate.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:51 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religious people breed a lot homeschool their kids and indoctrinate them. Look at the Westboro Baptist Church.

Non-religious people do not do this.

Anyone that thinks there will be an end to religion any time soon (within a few thousands years) is retarded.

Even more retarded than the fundies they hate.

amen.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:53 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
If you want a constructive discussion you need to start by accepting some untenable truths.

This drive against religion is predicated upon knowledge of genuine religiosity; true religion is anti-White.

Accepting this will empower you to accept what is more important.

You (if you are white) are required to submit to the ultimate authority.

You need to start conditioning yourselves for what in most cases will be an impossible task.

It's either this, or you stop wasting time debating about religion and try to get rid of it.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:54 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religious people breed a lot homeschool their kids and indoctrinate them. Look at the Westboro Baptist Church.

Non-religious people do not do this.

Anyone that thinks there will be an end to religion any time soon (within a few thousands years) is retarded.

Even more retarded than the fundies they hate.

amen.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097618


Yes, but if those kids can be reached somehow, maybe we could help them realize that religion is fakery and that they are slaves to an organization that exists only to absorb their resources and feed itself!
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:55 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
If you want a constructive discussion you need to start by accepting some untenable truths.

This drive against religion is predicated upon knowledge of genuine religiosity; true religion is anti-White.

Accepting this will empower you to accept what is more important.

You (if you are white) are required to submit to the ultimate authority.

You need to start conditioning yourselves for what in most cases will be an impossible task.

It's either this, or you stop wasting time debating about religion and try to get rid of it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097673


Why are you talking about race? That's not related to the issue at hand.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:55 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe.


Belief is the psychological state in which an individual holds a proposition or premise to be true.

To 'worship' is to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).

A god is a person or thing (or ideal) of supreme value.






----Religion is transcendental... Everyone on earth is part of a religion, everyone on earth 'worships' a god.


Sorry, but I don't follow the above. Not everyone on earth worships a god. A lot of people don't even think there is a god.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097648



I'll have to disagree with you, most do worship what fulfills there emotional and ego needs.

Some worship

Guitar riffs

Pussy

Money/Wealth

Themselves

Fast Cars

Jewels

Trees

Pop Stars

Wine

Planets/Stars/Moon/Sun

Science

Royalty

Power

Humans

Comedians

Animals

Linghams

Food

Mind/Intellect

Dictators/Tyrants

Drugs

Athletes

Adrenaline

SHR

etc.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 01:58 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religious people breed a lot homeschool their kids and indoctrinate them. Look at the Westboro Baptist Church.

Non-religious people do not do this.

Anyone that thinks there will be an end to religion any time soon (within a few thousands years) is retarded.

Even more retarded than the fundies they hate.

amen.


Yes, but if those kids can be reached somehow, maybe we could help them realize that religion is fakery and that they are slaves to an organization that exists only to absorb their resources and feed itself!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097648

I agree dude but I am being realistic.

The amount of kids that "defect" is tiny, miniscule.

Relgious indoctrination is very effective brainwashing. It hits key points like you will be blessed and live in bliss for eternity if you listen to me, and if you don't you will be miserable and burn for eternity.

They also start on the kids from birth and the indoctrinating comes from the PARENTS AND COMMUNITY (CHURCH).

Lots of these people don't even send their kids to public schools.

If you have been around any of these people, or read more of the posts at GLP I think some of you may start to realize this.

And for every kid that tells his parents to fuck off because their religion is bullshit, 1000 other kids are indoctrinated.

Also with the coming global hard times religion will flourish, that is just how it is. Look at the plague.

Also lots of people simply cannot handle atheism and the new agers simply do not make sense and base their claims on bullshit just like the fundies in my opinion.

So there is nothing to offer these people really. But who knows?
GUANO

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09/13/2010 02:00 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe.


Belief is the psychological state in which an individual holds a proposition or premise to be true.

To 'worship' is to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).

A god is a person or thing (or ideal) of supreme value.






----Religion is transcendental... Everyone on earth is part of a religion, everyone on earth 'worships' a god.


Sorry, but I don't follow the above. Not everyone on earth worships a god. A lot of people don't even think there is a god.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097648



did you not read the above? how can you not follow that? lol.

worship = adore
god = a person, thing, or idea worthy of adoration from the observer

every single person on earth has feelings of adoration for certain people, things, and ideas.
Total Protonic Reversal...
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:00 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
If you want a constructive discussion you need to start by accepting some untenable truths.

This drive against religion is predicated upon knowledge of genuine religiosity; true religion is anti-White.

Accepting this will empower you to accept what is more important.

You (if you are white) are required to submit to the ultimate authority.

You need to start conditioning yourselves for what in most cases will be an impossible task.

It's either this, or you stop wasting time debating about religion and try to get rid of it.


Why are you talking about race? That's not related to the issue at hand.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097648

Well I did not mention race but I disagree it does relate. It relates because those nations with lower IQs are more religious. People with low IQs are more likely to be religious.

East Asians and Europeans have the highest average IQ by nation and are the LEAST religious people in the world.

So there you go.

May not be the PC type of discussion you want but there it is.
GUANO

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09/13/2010 02:02 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religious people breed a lot homeschool their kids and indoctrinate them. Look at the Westboro Baptist Church.

Non-religious people do not do this.

Anyone that thinks there will be an end to religion any time soon (within a few thousands years) is retarded.

Even more retarded than the fundies they hate.

amen.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097618



Yes, let the "state" indoctrinate them.

You are mentally ill.

Everyone on earth is indoctrinated. an individuals perception of the world is THEIR RELIGION.
Total Protonic Reversal...
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:03 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe.


Belief is the psychological state in which an individual holds a proposition or premise to be true.

To 'worship' is to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).

A god is a person or thing (or ideal) of supreme value.






----Religion is transcendental... Everyone on earth is part of a religion, everyone on earth 'worships' a god.


Sorry, but I don't follow the above. Not everyone on earth worships a god. A lot of people don't even think there is a god.



did you not read the above? how can you not follow that? lol.

worship = adore
god = a person, thing, or idea worthy of adoration from the observer

every single person on earth has feelings of adoration for certain people, things, and ideas.
 Quoting: GUANO

Seriously this thread is not for some bullshit semantics. You know exactly what the OP is talking about. Religion. People's belief's in a God, a creator, controller of the universe.

An omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, omnibenevolent entity.

Sorry but please check your half assed sematics at the door, people that are interested in this discussion are not interested in bullshit straw men.

Thank you.
tkwasny

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09/13/2010 02:05 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Actually, my apologies OP for derailing even further. Religion is a fat wolf feeding on the masses.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097648

The original intent, I believe, was to send the seeker down the path. But hijackers altered the content to leave the impression that these religions were the totality.

Religions are the tricycles on the runway where your goal is to be landing and taking off in a starship. Yet most are afraid to leave their tricycle because to do so takes a 100% commitment.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:05 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religious people breed a lot homeschool their kids and indoctrinate them. Look at the Westboro Baptist Church.

Non-religious people do not do this.

Anyone that thinks there will be an end to religion any time soon (within a few thousands years) is retarded.

Even more retarded than the fundies they hate.

amen.



Yes, let the "state" indoctrinate them.

You are mentally ill.

Everyone on earth is indoctrinated. an individuals perception of the world is THEIR RELIGION.
 Quoting: GUANO

More of your semantics.


Yes, teaching children about evolution is indoctrination, lol.

The American school system is shit however, I think we can agree on that.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:07 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
If you want a constructive discussion you need to start by accepting some untenable truths.

This drive against religion is predicated upon knowledge of genuine religiosity; true religion is anti-White.

Accepting this will empower you to accept what is more important.

You (if you are white) are required to submit to the ultimate authority.

You need to start conditioning yourselves for what in most cases will be an impossible task.

It's either this, or you stop wasting time debating about religion and try to get rid of it.


Why are you talking about race? That's not related to the issue at hand.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097648


Actually, it's the most important aspect; this is why TPTB wish to promote (biased) racial tolerance.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:09 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
I personally do not care if religion persists. What I think really needs to end is religious arrogance. That includes fanaticism and proselytizing, and everything in between.

People need something to believe in, something bigger than themselves, something to explain the world they live in. I see no problem with following a belief system that makes you a better human being.

However, I see a problem with you thinking you know better than me, I see a problem with people killing other people in the name of their God, I see a problem with the complete intolerance of one group against another. This is what needs to end.

In the end, it doesn't matter a damn what you believe, it's what you did with your life that matters.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:10 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."


Man should not seek to limit another rights.


Please elaborate.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097648


It was a quote from the Declaration of Independence. What is unclear about it?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1097673
Netherlands
09/13/2010 02:10 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
If you want a constructive discussion you need to start by accepting some untenable truths.

This drive against religion is predicated upon knowledge of genuine religiosity; true religion is anti-White.

Accepting this will empower you to accept what is more important.

You (if you are white) are required to submit to the ultimate authority.

You need to start conditioning yourselves for what in most cases will be an impossible task.

It's either this, or you stop wasting time debating about religion and try to get rid of it.


Why are you talking about race? That's not related to the issue at hand.

Well I did not mention race but I disagree it does relate. It relates because those nations with lower IQs are more religious. People with low IQs are more likely to be religious.

East Asians and Europeans have the highest average IQ by nation and are the LEAST religious people in the world.

So there you go.

May not be the PC type of discussion you want but there it is.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097618


Your awareness is incomplete.

The least religious people (who claim to produce the highest IQs from undertakings of aptitude tests), are also the MOST demoniacal.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:11 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
I personally do not care if religion persists. What I think really needs to end is religious arrogance. That includes fanaticism and proselytizing, and everything in between.

People need something to believe in, something bigger than themselves, something to explain the world they live in. I see no problem with following a belief system that makes you a better human being.

However, I see a problem with you thinking you know better than me, I see a problem with people killing other people in the name of their God, I see a problem with the complete intolerance of one group against another. This is what needs to end.

In the end, it doesn't matter a damn what you believe, it's what you did with your life that matters.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 870004


By the way, I meant you in the general sense, not anyone specifically.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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09/13/2010 02:12 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Actually, it's the most important aspect; this is why TPTB wish to promote (biased) racial tolerance.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097673


How is race actually important? If you take an african baby, an anglo-saxon baby, and a chinese baby, and raise them in an environment that treats them no differently from each other, and simply explain that some people look different from each other, they would turn out to be mostly the same in mindset. The word I think you may be looking for is culture.

If you subscribe to the perspective that some races are simply superior to others, I think you're in the wrong thread.
Anonymous Coward
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09/13/2010 02:14 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
I personally do not care if religion persists. What I think really needs to end is religious arrogance. That includes fanaticism and proselytizing, and everything in between.

People need something to believe in, something bigger than themselves, something to explain the world they live in. I see no problem with following a belief system that makes you a better human being.

However, I see a problem with you thinking you know better than me, I see a problem with people killing other people in the name of their God, I see a problem with the complete intolerance of one group against another. This is what needs to end.

In the end, it doesn't matter a damn what you believe, it's what you did with your life that matters.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 870004


This is a set of callow opinions.

People do things based upon what they are lead to believe.

If you can convince an innocent to believe he is a thief, he is more likely to steal.

This is why it is important to find and promote the truth.

At least this way, people who are meant to behave according to their design, will have an opportunity to do so.
GUANO

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09/13/2010 02:15 PM
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Re: DISCUSSION THREAD: The end of religion
Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe.


Belief is the psychological state in which an individual holds a proposition or premise to be true.

To 'worship' is to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).

A god is a person or thing (or ideal) of supreme value.






----Religion is transcendental... Everyone on earth is part of a religion, everyone on earth 'worships' a god.


Sorry, but I don't follow the above. Not everyone on earth worships a god. A lot of people don't even think there is a god.



did you not read the above? how can you not follow that? lol.

worship = adore
god = a person, thing, or idea worthy of adoration from the observer

every single person on earth has feelings of adoration for certain people, things, and ideas.

Seriously this thread is not for some bullshit semantics. You know exactly what the OP is talking about. Religion. People's belief's in a God, a creator, controller of the universe.

An omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, omnibenevolent entity.

Sorry but please check your half assed sematics at the door, people that are interested in this discussion are not interested in bullshit straw men.

Thank you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1097618



Ok, then you are saying you are a pagan (you believe in and worship multiple gods-as defined above) and that those who believe there is a conscious entity that is above the other gods (which are generally unconscious forces as defined above) is a fool. got it.

either the above is correct, or you have been completely brainwashed into creating a false definition of religion (religion is an organization) and ignoring the English language.

I believe you are saying both. you are a pagan and you have an incorrect understanding of religion as a whole....

I have nothing against other religions... there are millions of pagans out there so don't take it as an insult, you are part of a very large brotherhood... or religion... if you will.. lol
Total Protonic Reversal...





GLP