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Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.

 
Greatest I am
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01/04/2011 03:50 PM
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Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.

At the end of the day, with a God who hides, the only good way to ascertain if he would be real or not is by his morality. This assumes that having a sense of morality is good and not having it is not and that a God would be good.

The pivotal question for God’s existence is;---- would a good God create a place like hell?

The definition of hell here is the one of eternal fire and torture with no chance of reprieve.
IOW. The traditional hell

To help me determine if there was a real Bible God or not, I asked and answered a few simple question for myself.

1. Is it morals and good justice for a soul to be able to sin for a finite time and then have to suffer torture for infinity?

2. Is it good morals and justice for small or mediocre sinners to have to bear the same sentence as Hitler, Stalin and other genocidal maniacs?

Punishment is usually only given to change attitude or actions and cause the sinner to repent.

3. Is it good morals and justice to continue to torture a soul in hell if no change in attitude or actions are to result?

4. Is it good morals and justice to keep a soul alive in hell instead of killing it for mercies sake?

I answered no to all of the above and determined that there is no way in hell that a hell would be a moral construct and that a good God would not create such a place. If hell exists then Bible God cannot if he is a good God.

If you answered no, as I did, then the existence of Bible God also gives a no answer.

If you answered yes to any of the above then let us examine your reasons for thinking that God would create this, to you, moral construct called hell.

Please justify your yes and show what I am to give a rebuttal to and let us try to reason together. This is mostly impossible from what I have seen and experienced but having kept this O P fairly simple, I am hopping that we can.


Regards
DL


PS. The next post is to give you a glimpse of what others think of some of these issues and to stimulate thought. There is quite a bit of it and it is there for reference only.
Greatest I am  (OP)

User ID: 1217224
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01/04/2011 03:51 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
On hell.

Better to shovel coal in hell than to spend eternity watching friends, neighbors and our children in torture and flame forever.
Only a sick mind would conceive of such a situation or wish it upon anyone. That is why God would not do such because then, heaven would be hell.
If those in heaven did not go insane then they could not have once been human or good.

[link to www.youtube.com]

[link to www.youtube.com]

[link to www.youtube.com]


Is God good?

[link to www.youtube.com]

[link to www.youtube.com]

[link to www.youtube.com]


Satan’s history.

[link to www.religioustolerance.org]

[link to www.religioustolerance.org]

[link to abcnews.go.com] -----About ½ way down the page.




O T, N T, Jesus and hell.

[link to www.youtube.com]


What the Bible says.

Romans 12:21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

By any definition, sendind souls to hell is overcoming evil with evil and hell in this sense is not Biblical.

Regards
DL
Riker

User ID: 684208
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01/04/2011 03:52 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
We need to go a few steps back first.

How do you define hell?
You shall know the TRUTH, and the TRUTH shall set you free.
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rikerglp (at) gmail.com
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1217226
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01/04/2011 03:53 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
The "Traditional" hell was invented by the catholic church to keep the sheep subdued and regularly fleeced..NOTHING has changed..as the modern church still does this today.
Anonymous Coward
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01/04/2011 03:59 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
yeah yeah, god loves us so much he'll have our immortal soul tortured forever for doing something the equivalent of a puppy peeing on the carpet.

either total BS or god is one insecure sadistic mofo.
Anonymous Coward
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01/04/2011 04:06 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
The "Traditional" hell was invented by the catholic church to keep the sheep subdued and regularly fleeced..NOTHING has changed..as the modern church still does this today.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1217226


Exactly. Until Rome took over, the predominant belief of the early church was that eventually, everyone would be reconciled to God. But it takes *fear* to control people, so Religion Inc. changed the menu to suit their ambitions.
Anonymous Coward
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01/04/2011 04:33 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
Wake up look around this fleshly existence IS HELL!!!!!
Greatest I am  (OP)

User ID: 1222227
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01/08/2011 12:25 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
We need to go a few steps back first.

How do you define hell?
 Quoting: Riker


As indicated above, the traditional everlasting torture type of hell.

Regards
DL
Greatest I am  (OP)

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01/08/2011 12:26 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
The "Traditional" hell was invented by the catholic church to keep the sheep subdued and regularly fleeced..NOTHING has changed..as the modern church still does this today.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1217226


I agree.

Regards
DL
Greatest I am  (OP)

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01/08/2011 12:28 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
Wake up look around this fleshly existence IS HELL!!!!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1217250


Some of us do enjoy life so hell is quite an enjoyable place.

You may want to move and find new friends.

Regards
DL
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2011 12:45 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
We need to go a few steps back first.

How do you define hell?


As indicated above, the traditional everlasting torture type of hell.

Regards
DL
 Quoting: Greatest I am

Hell is the present abode of the dead who rejected God in this life. Hell was created for Satan and his rebelious angels, not man.
You claim hell last forever but is destroyed in the end by being thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire lasts forever.
You question God's morality. Let's see.
If you are traped in a burning building and a fireman who knows the only way out tells you the path.
As you make your way out, others entice you to follow them to safety to their own rooms.
These safe rooms will all be destroyed when the building burns.
Now if you, someone trying to escape the fire, ignore the advice of the only one with credentials and listen to those who have decided to stay in the burning to their own peril, how can you justify calling the one trying to save your sorry ass with a crime?
You deserve hell. We all do. The way was made. It's your choice. Take it or leave it.
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2011 02:37 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
If you are traped in a burning building and a fireman who knows the only way out tells you the path.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 754098


God isn't a fireman. . .He's the fire itself. He burns up our impurities, either today as we yield willingly, or later without any choice in the matter.
Greatest I am  (OP)

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01/09/2011 02:13 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
We need to go a few steps back first.

How do you define hell?


As indicated above, the traditional everlasting torture type of hell.

Regards
DL

Hell is the present abode of the dead who rejected God in this life. Hell was created for Satan and his rebelious angels, not man.
You claim hell last forever but is destroyed in the end by being thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire lasts forever.
You question God's morality. Let's see.
If you are traped in a burning building and a fireman who knows the only way out tells you the path.
As you make your way out, others entice you to follow them to safety to their own rooms.
These safe rooms will all be destroyed when the building burns.
Now if you, someone trying to escape the fire, ignore the advice of the only one with credentials and listen to those who have decided to stay in the burning to their own peril, how can you justify calling the one trying to save your sorry ass with a crime?
You deserve hell. We all do. The way was made. It's your choice. Take it or leave it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 754098


Given that God wills the very best for us, and given that we ourselves want the very best for ourselves, then it would seem that no one could make a FULLY INFORMED decision against God. And if not FULLY INFORMED, then the free will defense of hell falls down.

For me, this would apply to the above, given that to reject that which is (by the definition of Christians) the very best for us would imply that one is not fully informed.

This argument is developed in many ways in Thomas Talbott's book "The Inescapable Love of God", where he shows how a doctrine of Universalism (all are eventually saved) is compatible with the Biblical teaching as found in the NT, especially the writings of St Paul.

Regards
DL
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2011 02:52 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
Hell is the imaginings of fearful and ignorant minds.
Greatest I am  (OP)

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01/10/2011 03:31 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
Hell is the imaginings of fearful and ignorant minds.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1223756


And an invention of the church that opens the wallets and purses and keeps the $$$ flowing in.

Regards
DL
Anonymous Coward
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01/10/2011 03:35 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
only fundies go to the hell they believe in so much!
Greatest I am  (OP)

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01/12/2011 03:36 PM
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Re: Belief in God hinges on the reality and morality of hell.
only fundies go to the hell they believe in so much!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1218336


Let us pray. I take that back.
No one should wish such on anyone. not even those that deserve it. We do not want to be as immoral as Bible God.

Regards
DL





GLP