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Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........

 
VivianV  (OP)

User ID: 1325594
United States
04/03/2011 09:20 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Folks...

The OP is the one who calls herself the "Supreme Queen" of Heaven.

She can't have any challengers to her rule...

Thus the rant against traditional Christianity.

She is promoting the Mahdi.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326216


What??? I am no queen, just a human person sick of this false doctrine put forth by Paul.... And I posted this to have some sort of debate, I want challenged with non-Paulian words. Can you do that AC 1326216?????

If not, you must be a follower of Paul and not Jesus then???? Use Jesus' words to argue with me, but you can't because you don't know which words are which........ Please just prove me wrong.

Last Edited by VivianV on 04/03/2011 09:22 AM
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
Adam
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04/03/2011 09:35 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Paul's letters are consistent with rest of the bible. See Habbakuk in the old testament "The just shall live by faith...". Jesus fulfilled the righteous requirements of the law, so we must trust in him and not our own feeble efforts. Works are evidence of faith, but do not earn. Grace is a free gift. If salvation could be obtained then why did Christ die?
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 09:37 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Stop being fooled people, Paul was a sham and the book you claim was written by God was almost half written by Paul.
 Quoting: VivianV

No Paul was not a sham. Jesus chose Paul to spread the Gospel.

But the Lord said to Ananias, “Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel. 16 I will show him how much he must suffer for my name.” -- Acts 9:15

[link to www.biblegateway.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326094


By the way, there is a definitely layering within Acts. A part was obviously written by Luke, then another part of it put in later was most likely written by Paul. Oops, who changed a book to make it look like Jesus spoke to him after Jesus DIED? Oh yeah, the liar Paul. Please I'm just trying to help you change your minds and not be so closed off. Paul deceived billions of people over time and helped cause the crusades, do you remember those? And many more religious killings and murders committed by Paulians who thought they were following Jesus.
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1321904
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04/03/2011 09:39 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Here it is in the NIV which you requested:

But the Lord said to Ananias, “Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel. -- Acts 9:15

[link to www.biblegateway.com]

It's pretty much the same as the KJV. Jesus chose Paul to spread the Gospel.

In case you somehow missed it, Jesus was dead, but He rose from the dead. It was after He was resurrected that He chose Paul to spread the Gospel.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326094


Good job, but not what I meant. Jesus was already dead when Paul was "chosen". Now find that in NIV, Jesus was dead and Paul was persecuting Jesus' followers, when all of a sudden,..... Paul changed his mind and will now be a missionary and start the church for him.........
 Quoting: VivianV


Do you really not understand that Jesus rose from death? After that, He chose Paul to spread the Gospel. Please read Acts 9:11-19.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326094


Jesus never rose from the dead, your faith blinds you to that fact, Jesus never claimed to be divine, that was all made up by Paul. The OP is dead on with this and this is why the Gnostic gospels were suppressed by the Paul/Catholic church because they are the truth.
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 09:43 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Paul wasn't self-appointed, Jesus chose him. This is recorded in the bible.

But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
-- Acts 9:15

[link to www.biblegateway.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326094


Right, Jesus did choose him, just like he chose me to tell you you're following the wrong guy. You're a Paulian, not a Christian.
 Quoting: VivianV


Nope, you are making it up. Jesus chose Paul to spread the Gospel. You are falsely claiming that Jesus chose you.

The Gospel which Paul preached is what God wants Christians to do. All the apostles and elders of the church agreed. The Holy Spirit was at their meeting, and could have told them if Paul should not be trusted.

[link to www.biblegateway.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326094


Really!? The Op is falsely claiming , but not Saul, huh?
Saul's claims of this blinding light, vision and conversation with Jesus was on the road to Damascus were he was accompianed by two associates. These associates testified that nothing like this or anything out of the ordinary happened on that road, yet we are to take Sauls word for it.

Sauls mission in life was to destroy Christ's message and followers. Perhaps he had the epiphany that this could be better done by infiltrating the movement and compromizing and diluting the message. A sort of trojan horse. Seems to me to have been very successful.

Note that you cannot destroy any righteous movement head on. Throughout history, and even today, the truth can only be veiled by knocking it off it's path from within.
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 09:47 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Paul's letters are consistent with rest of the bible. See Habbakuk in the old testament "The just shall live by faith...". Jesus fulfilled the righteous requirements of the law, so we must trust in him and not our own feeble efforts. Works are evidence of faith, but do not earn. Grace is a free gift. If salvation could be obtained then why did Christ die?
 Quoting: Adam 1324434


Are you trying to quote, "For by grace are ye saved through faith." without quoting it? Ephesians 2:8. Yep, written by Paul and no Jesus never said anything like this. Habbakuk would be good, but you're taking one little tiny piece and it's out of context. Just admit you're a Paulian, thanks and your argument is invalid. Jesus' words only that prove Paul was trying to help us all be good people striving toward the kingdom of heaven, which Jesus said is inside of us all..... not in churches. See?

Habakkuk 2:4
“See, the enemy is puffed up;
his desires are not upright—
but the righteous person will live by his faithfulness[d]—
5 indeed, wine betrays him;
he is arrogant and never at rest.
Because he is as greedy as the grave
and like death is never satisfied,
he gathers to himself all the nations
and takes captive all the peoples. -------------

this was about an forthcoming attack by the Chaldeans and Habakkuk was doubting he would make it, and Yahweh told him to have faith because those other guys are drunk. See?
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 09:49 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Jesus never rose from the dead, your faith blinds you to that fact, Jesus never claimed to be divine, that was all made up by Paul. The OP is dead on with this and this is why the Gnostic gospels were suppressed by the Paul/Catholic church because they are the truth.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1321904


Phew. I thought a sane person wasn't to be found here anymore, thanks for stopping by.

hf
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
VivianV  (OP)

User ID: 1325594
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04/03/2011 09:53 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Really!? The Op is falsely claiming , but not Saul, huh?
Saul's claims of this blinding light, vision and conversation with Jesus was on the road to Damascus were he was accompianed by two associates. These associates testified that nothing like this or anything out of the ordinary happened on that road, yet we are to take Sauls word for it.

Sauls mission in life was to destroy Christ's message and followers. Perhaps he had the epiphany that this could be better done by infiltrating the movement and compromizing and diluting the message. A sort of trojan horse. Seems to me to have been very successful.

Note that you cannot destroy any righteous movement head on. Throughout history, and even today, the truth can only be veiled by knocking it off it's path from within.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1079553


Yep you're right, it's working too well. Good job Saul/Paul, you duped all these poor folks and now they think they're better than everyone and are getting "raptured" or something, so they don't have to face the hard times coming up ahead. And they also think they have the right to judge everyone. The truth shall be revealed........I can't wait! So many of my own family judge me because of Saul/Paul, it actually is painful to talk to them most of the time.



Major truth will be revealed soooooooon. peace
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 09:55 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Heh, been saying this for years. JC was fresh, new school, Paul was so "establishment" it hurts to read his letters.
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 10:01 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Really!? The Op is falsely claiming , but not Saul, huh?
Saul's claims of this blinding light, vision and conversation with Jesus was on the road to Damascus were he was accompianed by two associates. These associates testified that nothing like this or anything out of the ordinary happened on that road, yet we are to take Sauls word for it.

Sauls mission in life was to destroy Christ's message and followers. Perhaps he had the epiphany that this could be better done by infiltrating the movement and compromizing and diluting the message. A sort of trojan horse. Seems to me to have been very successful.

Note that you cannot destroy any righteous movement head on. Throughout history, and even today, the truth can only be veiled by knocking it off it's path from within.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1079553


Yep you're right, it's working too well. Good job Saul/Paul, you duped all these poor folks and now they think they're better than everyone and are getting "raptured" or something, so they don't have to face the hard times coming up ahead. And they also think they have the right to judge everyone. The truth shall be revealed........I can't wait! So many of my own family judge me because of Saul/Paul, it actually is painful to talk to them most of the time.



Major truth will be revealed soooooooon. peace
 Quoting: VivianV


I too am judged by my very devout, mainstream, fundy, Sunday mega churchers in my family. All 3 sisters are married to Baptist pasters. To top it off, my mother is the most judgemental. I embrace the pure teachings of Christ. It is very difficult for me to be around them.
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 10:06 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Interesting...it always bothered me that we heard more from Paul than we did from Jesus. There's 15-20 years of Jesus' life missing from the Bible. Why?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1176064


Jesus went to India and many places using the Silk road. Why do you think there is nothing written from when Jesus was 13-30? Because he was traveling, there are many accounts from all over about him being there and other places as well. When he was in India, they recognized him as a fully awakened person right away. <<We all have the ability to be awakened one too, we just haven't realized it yet. Meditation calms the mind to help us humans not get so attached to our crazy ideas and emotions, which make us not aware of the present moment.>>


There are writings of him found in Tibet and India and other places as well.

I've been researching this for years, and i just typed in a search and turns out some guy made a movie about the book i was going to write, crap!!

[link to www.jesus-in-india-the-movie.com]

But I've read that there were tales of him being in Tibet written in their texts, they called him Issa. The Vatican found out about it, went to Tibet, tricked the monks into giving them the texts and stole them, and now if those monks still have some of the texts, they will not show them to any westerner anymore. I was going to go there and try and figure out the truth. I still can, but wow, i can't believe this guy made this movie. Now i'll have to watch it.


This guy Nicolas Notovitch was how i found out about all of this.
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Here's the text :
[link to www.atmajyoti.org]


Keep in mind, I was born and raised christian until I was 19 years old, turned atheist then many miracles happened to me, went back to Jesus then found out he was a buddha and it changed everything for me. It opens up a lot if we could all open our minds.

Last Edited by VivianV on 04/03/2011 10:17 AM
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 10:10 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
I too am judged by my very devout, mainstream, fundy, Sunday mega churchers in my family. All 3 sisters are married to Baptist pasters. To top it off, my mother is the most judgemental. I embrace the pure teachings of Christ. It is very difficult for me to be around them.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1079553


It's so hard to be judged by anyone, let alone the ones we love most and are supposed to love us most. All we can do is wish them love and light and hopefully someday they will see how their judgments were wrong and hurtful.

Good luck fellow seeker.

May our family, friends, enemies and strangers all open their minds to purity, truth and love.

hearts
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
Adam
User ID: 1324434
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04/03/2011 10:13 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Really!? The Op is falsely claiming , but not Saul, huh?
Saul's claims of this blinding light, vision and conversation with Jesus was on the road to Damascus were he was accompianed by two associates. These associates testified that nothing like this or anything out of the ordinary happened on that road, yet we are to take Sauls word for it.

Sauls mission in life was to destroy Christ's message and followers. Perhaps he had the epiphany that this could be better done by infiltrating the movement and compromizing and diluting the message. A sort of trojan horse. Seems to me to have been very successful.

Note that you cannot destroy any righteous movement head on. Throughout history, and even today, the truth can only be veiled by knocking it off it's path from within.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1079553


Yep you're right, it's working too well. Good job Saul/Paul, you duped all these poor folks and now they think they're better than everyone and are getting "raptured" or something, so they don't have to face the hard times coming up ahead. And they also think they have the right to judge everyone. The truth shall be revealed........I can't wait! So many of my own family judge me because of Saul/Paul, it actually is painful to talk to them most of the time.



Major truth will be revealed soooooooon. peace
 Quoting: VivianV


Religion is the problem. I don't believe I will be raptured to escape hard times...I never said that. See the problem is you made the asssumption that I am a mindless robot. It is true that some just believe what their churches preach, but that does not speak for all. Are you not judging others by your comments? You believe in another "religion." I am not religious and I believe that ALL religion is slavery including yours. We all fall short...you and me both. God is no respector of persons. None of us have all the answers. I don't go to church nor do I profess to have all the answers, but I do believe the bible is the inerrant word of God. It is our understanding and application that has the error. Christ's work is complete and we should rest in that truth. We are not required to do anything. It will all be revealed one day...we both agree on that point.
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 10:16 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
The narrow path is so because it is a solo journey. Not the one of the herd.
hffor the OP
TheHungerSite.com

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04/03/2011 10:22 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Why do Christians follow a testament written mostly by a man who NEVER met Jesus.....?

Paul was not a disciple, he was a self-appointed apostle who never met Jesus, yet 13 out of 27 books of the New Testament were written by him.

 Quoting: VivianV


Act 9:3
Acts 9:3-8 (King James Version)

3And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:

4And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

5And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

6And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

7And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.

8And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus.


Acts 9
[link to www.biblegateway.com]
Proverbs 28:27 KJV
He that giveth unto the poor shall not lack: but he that hideth his eyes shall have many a curse.
[link to www.TheHungerSite.com]
[link to www.TabForaCause.com]
[link to www.GamesThatGive.net]
[link to www.RemnantOfGod.org]

playlist:Bible Lessons
[link to www.youtube.com]
playlist:Militainment Inc.
[link to www.youtube.com]

[link to linkbun.ch]
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 10:23 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Religion is the problem. I don't believe I will be raptured to escape hard times...I never said that. See the problem is you made the asssumption that I am a mindless robot. It is true that some just believe what their churches preach, but that does not speak for all. Are you not judging others by your comments? You believe in another "religion." I am not religious and I believe that ALL religion is slavery including yours. We all fall short...you and me both. God is no respector of persons. None of us have all the answers. I don't go to church nor do I profess to have all the answers, but I do believe the bible is the inerrant word of God. It is our understanding and application that has the error. Christ's work is complete and we should rest in that truth. We are not required to do anything. It will all be revealed one day...we both agree on that point.
 Quoting: Adam 1324434


Well thats good you don't believe in the rapture. I didn't assume you were a mindless robot, I just said if you follow things in the New Testament written by Paul then you should be called a Paulian and not a Christian, its just semantics. And I am not judging others lest I be judged myself! I believe in what Jesus said and I believe that Paul was a scam artist that turned a beautiful thing into a monster, and here we are on the internet debating whether or not the bible is the "inerrant word of God". I am saying it is fully of many many errors, especially because it was put together and by a group of humans. They chose to put certain books in and to keep certain books out. Rest in the truth, only if it isn't contained in the Pauline epistles. That is all I'm trying to get at, I know its hard and you think I'm trying to derail something, but I want the truth to shine and the dark to diminish just like you. Just so we investigate before blindly following, I think we will be ok.
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 10:28 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Why do Christians follow a testament written mostly by a man who NEVER met Jesus.....?

Paul was not a disciple, he was a self-appointed apostle who never met Jesus, yet 13 out of 27 books of the New Testament were written by him.

 Quoting: VivianV


Act 9:3
Acts 9:3-8 (King James Version)

3And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:

4And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

5And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

6And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

7And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.

8And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus.


Acts 9
[link to www.biblegateway.com]
 Quoting: TheHungerSite.com


Cool, I love the hungersite. Just so you know, the book of Acts was most definitely tampered with. There is a distinct break between the voice, which is obviously akin to Luke, and the voice which tells the story of the "conversion" of Saul/Paul. Don't put it past someone back then to change a book to corrupt a pure system to one full of holes and confusion. You can find the evidence of what I say if you look in the right places, like libraries and other scholarly journals rather than a website for Paulians.......derp i mean Christians, no I do mean Paulians. I wish you would all understand how far the LIES go back.
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
Adam
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04/03/2011 10:39 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Well thats good you don't believe in the rapture. I didn't assume you were a mindless robot, I just said if you follow things in the New Testament written by Paul then you should be called a Paulian and not a Christian, its just semantics. And I am not judging others lest I be judged myself! I believe in what Jesus said and I believe that Paul was a scam artist that turned a beautiful thing into a monster, and here we are on the internet debating whether or not the bible is the "inerrant word of God". I am saying it is fully of many many errors, especially because it was put together and by a group of humans. They chose to put certain books in and to keep certain books out. Rest in the truth, only if it isn't contained in the Pauline epistles. That is all I'm trying to get at, I know its hard and you think I'm trying to derail something, but I want the truth to shine and the dark to diminish just like you. Just so we investigate before blindly following, I think we will be ok.


I agree we should all investigate. My point is that our knowledge is not the gauge on our salvation, but only the work of Christ. We don't need to do anything because it is already accomplished. If we were required to have hidden knowledge or do certain works then the whole Gospel Message is pointless. The good news is that Christ fulfilled the all of requirements of the law. That is what Paul's message was in his letters to the Romans and Galations. Paul also gave some advice and counsel on how to live now knowing the truth of the Gospel of Christ. I don't believe there are any contradictions at all. Apparent contradictions require further study, but this is not a salvation issue. What are your top 3 issues with Paul's letters against Christ's teachings? I'm not interested in the conversion story for this point. Only why do you think they preach different messages?
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 10:43 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Read the words of Christ in the Gospels along with the book of Ecclesiastes. It reveals so much of His true message, and moreso why the masses have chosen the broad path.
TheHungerSite.com

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04/03/2011 10:45 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Isaiah 26:
3Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on thee: because he trusteth in thee.

Psalm 119:
165Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

1 John 2:
10He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.


 Quoting: TheHungerSite.com


Cool, I love the hungersite.
 Quoting: VivianV


Defending the authorship of the Pauline epistles


2 Peter 1
18And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.
19We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
20Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
Proverbs 28:27 KJV
He that giveth unto the poor shall not lack: but he that hideth his eyes shall have many a curse.
[link to www.TheHungerSite.com]
[link to www.TabForaCause.com]
[link to www.GamesThatGive.net]
[link to www.RemnantOfGod.org]

playlist:Bible Lessons
[link to www.youtube.com]
playlist:Militainment Inc.
[link to www.youtube.com]

[link to linkbun.ch]
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 10:49 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Aha! Now it comes out - the Gospel of Thomas, the very definition of spurious literature.

No wonder you are predisposed to believe anything that suits your private esoterica.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 992437


Is private esoterica in Luke 17 as well?

20 Once, on being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, “The coming of the kingdom of God is not something that can be observed, 21 nor will people say, ‘Here it is,’ or ‘There it is,’ because the kingdom of God is within you.

So, what else Canadian coward 992437? I am just trying to get people to think about things instead of blindly accepting everything they're told. That is all. You are a Paulian not following Christ but following Paul..............
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 10:52 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
This is the dumbest thread I have ever come across. The early churches accepted Paul and tested him as well as the disciples... CASE CLOSED
e-watchman

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04/03/2011 10:58 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Paul was the most persecuted of all the apostles. He suffered more for Christ than anyone. His persecutors were often fellow Christians, seemingly. It is not surprising that nearly 2,000 years later so-called Christians are still dissing him.
"Jehovah is a manly person of war. Jehovah is his name." Exodus 15:3
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 10:58 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
I agree we should all investigate. My point is that our knowledge is not the gauge on our salvation, but only the work of Christ. We don't need to do anything because it is already accomplished. If we were required to have hidden knowledge or do certain works then the whole Gospel Message is pointless. The good news is that Christ fulfilled the all of requirements of the law. That is what Paul's message was in his letters to the Romans and Galations. Paul also gave some advice and counsel on how to live now knowing the truth of the Gospel of Christ. I don't believe there are any contradictions at all. Apparent contradictions require further study, but this is not a salvation issue. What are your top 3 issues with Paul's letters against Christ's teachings? I'm not interested in the conversion story for this point. Only why do you think they preach different messages?
 Quoting: Adam 1324434


Well the one thing is right there in your sentence, 'we don't need to do anything because it is already accomplished.' This is the difference right here... Paul said Christ did it all and we only need to have faith and do nothing. That is the problem right there. Jesus did not say we merely need faith, he said we have to do many things and do good and give away our money and care for each other. Paul said, nope just chillax, do nothing and if you believe you will be saved....... wrong, you gotta do good things and be a good person, meek, like the beatitudes. Its just a simple thing.
14 “You are the light of the world. A town built on a hill cannot be hidden. 15 Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. 16 In the same way, let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven.

Its not just Paul's writings, the main point is the conversion story, its fake. And anything he says has no credibility to me because he appointed HIMSELF an apostle in the story in acts. Acts has two distinct voices, one is akin to Luke and another is definitely out of place within the context of the rest and could have only been placed there by either Paul himself or one of his followers.
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 11:08 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
This is the dumbest thread I have ever come across. The early churches accepted Paul and tested him as well as the disciples... CASE CLOSED
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326324


wrong, your argument is invalid. i'm too tired to type more, be back later, but you are wrong unless you can prove it beyond saying 'case closed', derp.
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
TheHungerSite.com

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04/03/2011 11:08 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Romans 12
[link to www.biblegateway.com]
1I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
3For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
4For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
5So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
6Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
7Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;
8Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.
9Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
10Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;
11Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;
12Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
13Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.
14Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
15Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
16Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
17Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
18If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
19Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
20Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.
21Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.
Proverbs 28:27 KJV
He that giveth unto the poor shall not lack: but he that hideth his eyes shall have many a curse.
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VivianV  (OP)

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04/03/2011 11:10 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Romans 12
[link to www.biblegateway.com]
1I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
3For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
4For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
5So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
6Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
7Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;
8Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.
9Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
10Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;
11Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;
12Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
13Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.
14Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
15Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
16Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
17Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
18If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
19Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
20Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.
21Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.
 Quoting: TheHungerSite.com


Invalid if you use a writing from Paul to tell me you follow Christ rather than Paul. Derp!
Life without learning is like a flower without scent.
torahemily

User ID: 1159854
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04/03/2011 11:11 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
This is the dumbest thread I have ever come across. The early churches accepted Paul and tested him as well as the disciples... CASE CLOSED
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326324


Not the churches in Asia, in fact they threw him out. Yeshua aka "Jesus" was a Torah obedient Jew. He never once broke Torah (I am not talking about the traditions of the rabbi's) I am talking about the Torah, Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus and Deut. These five books, the books of Moshe are what we are to use for instructions/teachings on how to worship YHVH and how to live. Yeshua, is the Messiah and he was the unblemished lamb who willingly gave His life for our sin that we may have forgivness of our sin though His shed blood. Paul contradicts Yeshua quite a bit and some say Paul was misunderstood, I am on the fence about that but the OP is right on, "christians" do not worship "Christ" they follow Paul. In fact, the book of Acts that is being quoted what about chapter 15 and the Jerusalem Council? Paul defies James about eating foods sacrified to idols and says it is no big deal however in Revelation, Yeshua says he has that against the churches in Rev. 2:14 and 2:20 He states he has "this against them, that they eat foods sacrified to idols". I paraphrased the Scripture but it is there you can read it for yourself. Also in Revelation 12:17 where the dragon was enraged over the saints who keept the Commandments and the testimony of Jesus. I am not saying Paulianians are not sincere, but they are following the wrong guy, Paul did not die for your sins, Yeshua did. Yeshua is the one coming back to set up His Kingdom on Earth, not Paul. And Paul is not sitting at the Right Hand of the Father. Paul or Jesus, I take Jesus.
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 11:13 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
Ok, he self-appointed himself as an apostle. Your argument is invalid.
 Quoting: VivianV


No he didn't, Jesus chose him. Paul's choice was to kill Christians, but Jesus stopped him from doing that, and made him spread the Gospel instead.


But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
-- Acts 9:15

[link to www.biblegateway.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326094


OK. So who wrote THAT quote:

b]But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:

Someone apparently knows what the lord said to soomeone. Every sentence like this i think is bullshit; someone added these types of texts to bring the authoritative aspect to the bible so i could be used to control the sheep.
Anonymous Coward
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04/03/2011 11:18 AM
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Re: Christians should be called Paulians instead, because most follow Paul not Jesus........
I like your post OP. I never can understand how a man can trust the words of another man which claims to be speaking for God.
And it also is baffling that the ones who killed Jezus are the principle organizers of his religion. And no one cares.
There is a new tv series 'the Borgias', maybe you like it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1321807


Cool thanks AC, I'll check it out. Yes you're right they killed Jesus and built a whole church system and power system based on his life..... very curious.
 Quoting: VivianV




intelligent people ask "why". fools use ignorant phrases and threats to brush off rational arguments to support fairy tales.





GLP