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Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....

 
Damrod
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05/21/2013 07:45 PM
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Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
I have to ask this question.

My dog....or more accurately....my wife's dog... never goes out of the house without a leash. He is somewhat irritating as he will come and "huff" at me when he needs to go out. I work from home so I am always here. My neighbor....they have an "Invisible fence" system and a shock collar on their dog.

Their dog....his name is Ralston. Everytime I go outside and go to my storage building, he comes to say hello. He is a big dog....prob in the 50 to 70 pound range. He is gentle as a lamb. A beautiful red bone hound...he is a very friendly critter.

What I find disturbing is he will come to the edge of his "electric zone" and then press a bit further to get my attention. He will allow himself to be shocked to let me know he is there to say hello. I have seen him quiver and shake as he tries to get my attention. I will walk down onto their property...within his zone...so he is not being shocked. I find this....troubling. I am all for people living their lives as they see fit and I do not care what they do in their bedroom....but here is a weird situation. He is just a dog...but....I think he is my friend. He always comes to me when I go outside...If I ignore him, he will sit at the "border" and whine and whine until I go down and give him a little pat on the head and tell him he is a good boy.

is this wrong? Am I wrong? Is this none of my business? I am a Libertarian and I want everyone to be free....so I am confronted with an odd situation. Ralston is a good dog...a smart dog...and apparently...he thinks I am his buddy. I hate it when I go outside and he runs to the edge of "the border" an is shaking from being shocked....i find it disturbing...

Any solutions? I will never tell these people what to do on their own land...I am a Libertarian and they are free American citizens. This is one thing that I tried to logically write off and i decided he was their property and it was none of my business...but he is ...apparently...my buddy now...and I hate to see him suffer and shake when he is shocked...

suggestions?

Last Edited by Damrod on 05/21/2013 08:02 PM
boilerbengal

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05/21/2013 07:56 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
I believe the shock collars are the best idea ever invented to help pet owners,, i have three large dogs who stay in the yard. they rarely if ever get shocked anymore. i will take their collars off completely for a week on // week off especially during the summer. they will develop sores were the prongs are,, but they are trained !! i'll put the collar back on when i see their poop piles moving closer to the line.

All in All it is the best investment i'v ever made for my dogs. !! good luck
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05/21/2013 07:57 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Not as cruel as a truck tire.
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05/21/2013 07:58 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
my girlfriend behaves better than ever.. love it ,, thanks for askin
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05/21/2013 08:00 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
I would say there is not much you can do besides continue to be his friend. hf

Some animals have it much worse off. Being able to roam freely on their property seems like a pretty good deal.
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05/21/2013 08:01 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Would you rather see him suffer a little for your attention, or see him hit by a car or poisoned by a neighbor who doesn't appreciate his friendly personality? I have had neighbors that have had both happen and it is a tragic consequence of not being a responsible dog owner. We always fence our dogs (physical fence), but others would rather use the electric fence, for a variety of reasons. If he continues to sit within the shock zone even after you have given him attention, it must not be bothering him as much as it is bothering you. I moved into a house once that already had an electric fence, so I tried using it with my dogs. My one dog would go to the shock zone and sit there and get shocked because she was afraid to move. We disconnected the thing. I would rather train my dogs to stay in the yard and have a physical fence as extra security.
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
If we can just convice the president to wear one.
Damrod  (OP)

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05/21/2013 08:25 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Qoq....some of the responces are not what I expected.

I am not going to tell these people that they are wrong. I am a dog owner so...I understand different strokes for different folks.


I was just curious how this would be received...I think he is a wonderful hounddog and if I could....I'd take him in a minute....He is my buddy....for whatever reason. I will not let him suffer...I am not forbidden for stepping into their property....me and the owner are decent neighbors...so it's not like i am going to be shot for stepping onto their land. So I will make him go home and be good...realy weird when you think about it.

This was just a question I thought of and wanted some feedback on.....is it our business or not?

Dogs are our friends....someone decided we needed them and they have been wonderful companions. I could never hurt a dog and it bothers me when I see people think it's normal to do so in order to correct them.....

tell me i AM RIGHT OR WRONG....If I eventually have to take this dog....I will..... he is my friend.
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05/21/2013 08:32 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Qoq....some of the responces are not what I expected.

I am not going to tell these people that they are wrong. I am a dog owner so...I understand different strokes for different folks.


I was just curious how this would be received...I think he is a wonderful hounddog and if I could....I'd take him in a minute....He is my buddy....for whatever reason. I will not let him suffer...I am not forbidden for stepping into their property....me and the owner are decent neighbors...so it's not like i am going to be shot for stepping onto their land. So I will make him go home and be good...realy weird when you think about it.

This was just a question I thought of and wanted some feedback on.....is it our business or not?

Dogs are our friends....someone decided we needed them and they have been wonderful companions. I could never hurt a dog and it bothers me when I see people think it's normal to do so in order to correct them.....

tell me i AM RIGHT OR WRONG....If I eventually have to take this dog....I will..... he is my friend.
 Quoting: Damrod


It just sounds like empathy for the dog from a person with a good heart. Nothing wrong with that at all.

You see this loveable dog come up to say hi and tweaks out and whines because of the shock. Why must the dog be shocked just by saying hi? Will the dog grow cold because it will realize the correlation of being friendly with people and simultaneously be reprimanded at the same time (shocked).

I feel for you and your situation. Maybe you can work something out with this neighbor. Maybe even become a second home for the dog once and awhile.

Kinda seems like the dog might not be getting enough attention from its owners that it risks being shocked to say hello to you.
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05/21/2013 08:37 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Don't let the dog suffer looking for love. See if your neighbor will let you take care of it. hf
Sammie

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05/21/2013 08:45 PM

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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
if you are friendly with your neighbor maybe you could suggest moving the boarder into a portion of your yard so that the dog could enter your property for his greetings, eliminating the shock?

I would suggest that you also mention your affection for their dog in casual conversation. In other words, let it be known that if they ever had a reason to find the dog another home that you would be very happy to take him. Plant the seed. Unfortunately many people dispose of pets when they tire of them. It happens all too often. If you let them know that you really like the dog and would take him, they would know who to call if they ever felt the need to give him away and you could prevent him from being taken to a shelter.

Just a thought.

I feel for your situation. I, too, would feel bad for this dog given the situation.

Sure, other dogs have it much worse and the invisible fence is protecting him from other dangers but on the other hand, other dogs have it much better and are treated as part of the family, not kept outdoors all the time.
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amachiavellian

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05/21/2013 08:53 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
I have to ask this question.

My dog....or more accurately....my wife's dog... never goes out of the house without a leash. He is somewhat irritating as he will come and "huff" at me when he needs to go out. I work from home so I am always here. My neighbor....they have an "Invisible fence" system and a shock collar on their dog.

Their dog....his name is Ralston. Everytime I go outside and go to my storage building, he comes to say hello. He is a big dog....prob in the 50 to 70 pound range. He is gentle as a lamb. A beautiful red bone hound...he is a very friendly critter.

What I find disturbing is he will come to the edge of his "electric zone" and then press a bit further to get my attention. He will allow himself to be shocked to let me know he is there to say hello. I have seen him quiver and shake as he tries to get my attention. I will walk down onto their property...within his zone...so he is not being shocked. I find this....troubling. I am all for people living their lives as they see fit and I do not care what they do in their bedroom....but here is a weird situation. He is just a dog...but....I think he is my friend. He always comes to me when I go outside...If I ignore him, he will sit at the "border" and whine and whine until I go down and give him a little pat on the head and tell him he is a good boy.

is this wrong? Am I wrong? Is this none of my business? I am a Libertarian and I want everyone to be free....so I am confronted with an odd situation. Ralston is a good dog...a smart dog...and apparently...he thinks I am his buddy. I hate it when I go outside and he runs to the edge of "the border" an is shaking from being shocked....i find it disturbing...

Any solutions? I will never tell these people what to do on their own land...I am a Libertarian and they are free American citizens. This is one thing that I tried to logically write off and i decided he was their property and it was none of my business...but he is ...apparently...my buddy now...and I hate to see him suffer and shake when he is shocked...

suggestions?
 Quoting: Damrod


I just had this debate not long ago with a friend.

My stance is that these things are a tool and any tool used incorrectly can be a hazard.

As far as the invisible fence goes, I've had one. But I had one on a farm in a rural setting and I had 12 acres of it.

So -
- a) big area and lots of interesting things in it to occupy them;
- b) no, or few 'temptations' in sight outside or at the perimeter;
- c) more than one dog.

There is no way I would install this thing in an urban setting where there's a lot of temptations to get outside of the perimeter - that would be just mean.

As for your situation OP - it would bother me too. I have little advice I can offer, but if he's friendly enough and willing to let you into his territory, I'd just make the first move and get inside his 'zone' ... which would normally be completely terrible advice, but since you already are doing that to an extent ... I don't know what else to offer. His stress over your presence so close outside his 'perimeter' should lesson as he learns that you will come visit him. Otherwise, I dunno, ask the neighbors if the want to move the perimeter wire a few feet?

Good luck OP!

Edited to add -

SNIP

Kinda seems like the dog might not be getting enough attention from its owners that it risks being shocked to say hello to you.
 Quoting: gurunade


I also wondered that, but too few details for me to make that call ... maybe the dog just loves people? My dog would probably do that if there was a person just out of reach,

Last Edited by amachiavellian on 05/21/2013 09:16 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
it may seem cruel but really it is protecting him as others have commented.

my animals are in cages when i cant interact with them for the same reasons, so they wont get hurt getting into something that i cant monitor, even if its just a dog bone.

plus if the dog just sits there and takes it then its not as painful as you think. dogs are more responsive to physical reactions than emotional.
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05/21/2013 09:04 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Grow some balls OP, take the collar off and strap it to the neighbor, drag his ass across the Invisible fence...see how his ass likes it.
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05/21/2013 09:26 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Subjective

To people whom treat their dog as "one of the family" this is cruel. To people whom treat their dog as a guard dog or other purpose, this is acceptable.

The question begs which type of breed is this dog and what is the dogs purpose?

Also, which is cheaper, a fence or a shock collar with wire perimeter?
train

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05/21/2013 09:33 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
If it really bothered the dog, he wouldn't continue getting shocked, but I would touch base with your neighbors and asked them if it's okay for you to go over there and pet him. Next time you see the dog coming over to the border, walk over there before he gets to the hot zone and pet him.
When the law no longer protects you from the corrupt, but protects the corrupt from you--You know your nation is doomed.
Ayn Rand
boilerbengal

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05/21/2013 09:36 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
like i said nicely above ,,,,,,,

it is the greatest invention for pets ever !!!!

But if you insist to be told your WRONG ,, then OP you are not only WRONG but a irresponsible BOOB !!

The dog learns were the line is and i could stand on the opposite side with a grilled T-Bone steak and not one of my three dogs will get shocked !!! the cats and especially Squirrels will wonder by while my dogs stay the safe 4 feet away from correction and do not get shocked !!!

If your dog was just as RETARDED as your neighbors dog would it get shocked !!

Perhaps you would like some fire in this thread instead of educated , experienced responses , well you got it !! i hope your dog gets a Goodyear tattoo Moran !!

Last Edited by boilerbengal on 05/21/2013 09:41 PM
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ashis

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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
the dog sees you as his friend and can
hardly wait for you to come say hello. maybe even
give him a treat. the dog probably dreams about you as well

. I know I have a rotwieller who always waits for a man to walk by
everyday and give him a pet and say hello. she goes crazy and
cries when she sees him. when she sleeps and shes dreaming of him,
she always has the same cry and waging of the tale.
boilerbengal

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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Qoq....some of the responces are not what I expected.

I am not going to tell these people that they are wrong. I am a dog owner so...I understand different strokes for different folks.


I was just curious how this would be received...I think he is a wonderful hounddog and if I could....I'd take him in a minute....He is my buddy....for whatever reason. I will not let him suffer...I am not forbidden for stepping into their property....me and the owner are decent neighbors...so it's not like i am going to be shot for stepping onto their land. So I will make him go home and be good...realy weird when you think about it.

This was just a question I thought of and wanted some feedback on.....is it our business or not?

Dogs are our friends....someone decided we needed them and they have been wonderful companions. I could never hurt a dog and it bothers me when I see people think it's normal to do so in order to correct them.....

tell me i AM RIGHT OR WRONG....If I eventually have to take this dog....I will..... he is my friend.
 Quoting: Damrod


I'll follow up by saying OP ........ Of course the responses are not what you expected because you think you cant be wrong. You believe your right because you feel you are. You said you'd take that Dog ,,, ERRRRRR REALLY ???? like your some sort of Dog Jesus !! I've had my Fence for 9 years and in that time not one has gotten hurt. before that i had a friend that got a Goodyear tattoo !!!!! And I'm the Idiot huh ?? WOW
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Dog Jesus lmao
amachiavellian

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05/21/2013 10:13 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Subjective

To people whom treat their dog as "one of the family" this is cruel. To people whom treat their dog as a guard dog or other purpose, this is acceptable.

The question begs which type of breed is this dog and what is the dogs purpose?

Also, which is cheaper, a fence or a shock collar with wire perimeter?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28689320


Yes.

Working Dog, or Pet? - We don't know.

Breed? - Redbone Coonhound says the OP. I am familiar with this breed, you can look them up here -
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

For larger areas, the invisible fence (IF) is cheaper. I can't answer to how it would price out on an average "lot". Likely cheaper, and would also skirt any physical fence building issues (eg: permits, neighbor troubles, cable locates ... etc).

It is not that this system is cruel. It just has its place is all.
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amachiavellian

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05/21/2013 10:19 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Qoq....some of the responces are not what I expected.

I am not going to tell these people that they are wrong. I am a dog owner so...I understand different strokes for different folks.


I was just curious how this would be received...I think he is a wonderful hounddog and if I could....I'd take him in a minute....He is my buddy....for whatever reason. I will not let him suffer...I am not forbidden for stepping into their property....me and the owner are decent neighbors...so it's not like i am going to be shot for stepping onto their land. So I will make him go home and be good...realy weird when you think about it.

This was just a question I thought of and wanted some feedback on.....is it our business or not?

Dogs are our friends....someone decided we needed them and they have been wonderful companions. I could never hurt a dog and it bothers me when I see people think it's normal to do so in order to correct them.....

tell me i AM RIGHT OR WRONG....If I eventually have to take this dog....I will..... he is my friend.
 Quoting: Damrod


I'll follow up by saying OP ........ Of course the responses are not what you expected because you think you cant be wrong. You believe your right because you feel you are. You said you'd take that Dog ,,, ERRRRRR REALLY ???? like your some sort of Dog Jesus !! I've had my Fence for 9 years and in that time not one has gotten hurt. before that i had a friend that got a Goodyear tattoo !!!!! And I'm the Idiot huh ?? WOW
 Quoting: boilerbengal

houseg
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05/21/2013 10:28 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Qoq....some of the responces are not what I expected.

I am not going to tell these people that they are wrong. I am a dog owner so...I understand different strokes for different folks.


I was just curious how this would be received...I think he is a wonderful hounddog and if I could....I'd take him in a minute....He is my buddy....for whatever reason. I will not let him suffer...I am not forbidden for stepping into their property....me and the owner are decent neighbors...so it's not like i am going to be shot for stepping onto their land. So I will make him go home and be good...realy weird when you think about it.

This was just a question I thought of and wanted some feedback on.....is it our business or not?

Dogs are our friends....someone decided we needed them and they have been wonderful companions. I could never hurt a dog and it bothers me when I see people think it's normal to do so in order to correct them.....

tell me i AM RIGHT OR WRONG....If I eventually have to take this dog....I will..... he is my friend.
 Quoting: Damrod


I'll follow up by saying OP ........ Of course the responses are not what you expected because you think you cant be wrong. You believe your right because you feel you are. You said you'd take that Dog ,,, ERRRRRR REALLY ???? like your some sort of Dog Jesus !! I've had my Fence for 9 years and in that time not one has gotten hurt. before that i had a friend that got a Goodyear tattoo !!!!! And I'm the Idiot huh ?? WOW
 Quoting: boilerbengal

:houseg:
 Quoting: amachiavellian


really, and I'll lay 50 to 1 odds boilerb slaps his wife around
boilerbengal

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05/21/2013 10:31 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Qoq....some of the responces are not what I expected.

I am not going to tell these people that they are wrong. I am a dog owner so...I understand different strokes for different folks.


I was just curious how this would be received...I think he is a wonderful hounddog and if I could....I'd take him in a minute....He is my buddy....for whatever reason. I will not let him suffer...I am not forbidden for stepping into their property....me and the owner are decent neighbors...so it's not like i am going to be shot for stepping onto their land. So I will make him go home and be good...realy weird when you think about it.

This was just a question I thought of and wanted some feedback on.....is it our business or not?

Dogs are our friends....someone decided we needed them and they have been wonderful companions. I could never hurt a dog and it bothers me when I see people think it's normal to do so in order to correct them.....

tell me i AM RIGHT OR WRONG....If I eventually have to take this dog....I will..... he is my friend.
 Quoting: Damrod


I'll follow up by saying OP ........ Of course the responses are not what you expected because you think you cant be wrong. You believe your right because you feel you are. You said you'd take that Dog ,,, ERRRRRR REALLY ???? like your some sort of Dog Jesus !! I've had my Fence for 9 years and in that time not one has gotten hurt. before that i had a friend that got a Goodyear tattoo !!!!! And I'm the Idiot huh ?? WOW
 Quoting: boilerbengal

houseg
 Quoting: amachiavellian


really, and I'll lay 50 to 1 odds boilerb slaps his wife around
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 10520998


I'll put an even 100 bucks on that !! i dont want all your money just a little.. lol .. how do you make that jump anyway ??
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Meanwhile, my neighbors want me to put a shock collar on my dog because she barks at them. I may have to do it since they called the cops tonight and said she had been barking for 45 minutes. It was about 5.
boilerbengal

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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Meanwhile, my neighbors want me to put a shock collar on my dog because she barks at them. I may have to do it since they called the cops tonight and said she had been barking for 45 minutes. It was about 5.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 37674349


Barklimiter G3 made by TRI-TRONICS 80 bucks on E-Bay ,, great trainer and collar !! i'v bought 3 for all my dogs and they work great !! i just have to say " you want the collar" and they shut right up.

i'v tried a few different kinds over the years and that collar is the best i'v found.
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Anonymous Coward
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
I believe the shock collars are the best idea ever invented to help pet owners,, i have three large dogs who stay in the yard. they rarely if ever get shocked anymore. i will take their collars off completely for a week on // week off especially during the summer. they will develop sores were the prongs are,, but they are trained !! i'll put the collar back on when i see their poop piles moving closer to the line.

All in All it is the best investment i'v ever made for my dogs. !! good luck
 Quoting: boilerbengal


You should not have a dog if you can't train them properly without threatening physical pain... Give your dogs to someone who can take care of them properly scumbag... I have had Bull mastiffs all my life and never once had to lay a finger on them or use shock collars, Time patience and compassion is the only way to truly train a well behaved gentle animal, I hope you know your dogs will grow to resent you one day... I have seen it happen with other owners who mistreat their animals and the terrible thing is that the poor animal gets the blame every single time... You should be ashamed, Learn to train your animals properly or don't have any what so ever! They are not their just because you "want one" they are part of the family and treating them any other way is just cruel, You wouldn't do this to your children so don't do it to your dogs.
amachiavellian

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05/21/2013 10:49 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
Meanwhile, my neighbors want me to put a shock collar on my dog because she barks at them. I may have to do it since they called the cops tonight and said she had been barking for 45 minutes. It was about 5.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 37674349


Barklimiter G3 made by TRI-TRONICS 80 bucks on E-Bay ,, great trainer and collar !! i'v bought 3 for all my dogs and they work great !! i just have to say " you want the collar" and they shut right up.

i'v tried a few different kinds over the years and that collar is the best i'v found.

 Quoting: boilerbengal


troll.meme

... please quit it ... mmmmmk?
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CommonCents

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05/21/2013 10:51 PM
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Re: Are shock collars cruel containment? I need advice....
I think all politicians should wear a shock collar, and every time they lie they get a shock.





GLP