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The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?

 
Citizenperth
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User ID: 45567548
Australia
08/22/2013 10:57 PM
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The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
Current Leakage emergency at Fukushima

This report will be condensed, as there are to many variables in play right now, to go deep into facts and innuendo.

Yes the tanks are leaking. Why does this presuppose TEPCO to lift the situation to a Nuclear level 3 event?

Firstly let's discuss what a Level 3 event actually is (remembering that level 7 has NOT been downgraded regarding the site)

Level 3 Nuclear Event

Looking at the chart [at link], and TEPCO's non-disclosure and lying ability, we can see that level 3 still is under an 'incident' category, albeit the most severe.

What can occur here?

Wiki:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Level 3: Serious incident[edit source | editbeta]
Impact on people and environment

Exposure in excess of ten times the statutory annual limit for workers.

Non-lethal deterministic health effect (e.g., burns) from radiation.

Impact on radiological barriers and control

Exposure rates of more than 1 Sv/h in an operating area.
Severe contamination in an area not expected by design, with a low probability of ­significant public exposure.

Impact on defence-in-depth

Near accident at a nuclear power plant with no safety provisions remaining.

Lost or stolen highly radioactive sealed source.

Misdelivered highly radioactive sealed source without adequate procedures in place to handle it.

Examples:
THORP plant Sellafield (United Kingdom) 2005.
Paks Nuclear Power Plant (Hungary), 2003; fuel rod damage in cleaning tank.
Vandellos Nuclear Power Plant (Spain), 1989; fire destroyed many control systems; the reactor was shut down.
San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station (United States), 2011; Ammonia leak. No evacuation called for.
So why now?

Given TEPCO's History of Non-Disclosure, it is always hard to discern fact from innuendo.

The alert level and immediacy of reporting the event, both to the Nuclear commission and the Mass media can lead to this line of thinking (again based on fact).

The tanks are a stop gap, emergency storage of highly radioactive substance solution.

They were made quickly (probably inexpensively)

They were mass produced using exactly the same methods and materials.

Where is the problem?

If one tank leaks, due to structural integrity? Then the same latent issue remains with the rest of the tanks.

The tanks were made from substances (rubber, metal cladding), that perform poorly with salted (sea), water and are stressed and wear due to the salinity.

There is no alternate place to store such highly toxic waste. (albeit it it is not waste in the true sense), moreover leakage from a destroyed nuclear plant x 4.

There are miles and miles of 'gaffer taped' hosing that pumps this waste to and from whichever place TEPCO deems it necessary to be, with little human intervention due to the highly radioactive environment.

Ground water Emergency

As can be seen in the above diagram [at link], if the tanks leak, it will be into the low lying water table which promotes the following issues.

Ground water is the water used in the Biological food processes, including plants, animals and humans.

Ground water seeps into the sea (regardless of retaining walls) and affects the oceans, ocean life, and life globally.

Water, in its natural process evaporates into clouds, rain furthering its reach globally.

Summary

In all, if the tanks leak, every effort to store what should be contained, is gone. Regardless of what is still being released, this adds X fold to the emergency.

The water table is life-giving, yet precarious, rising serious issues about the stability of the what is left spent fuel pools.

The dooms-day clock is indeed clicking over, and yet, they still have the arduous and dangerous task of removing the spent fuel. Where do they store that?

Indeed, a never before seen, Global man made catastrophe that our generation were sadly here to witness.

23/08/13

CitizenPerth

article with diagrams and pics.
[link to fukushimaemergencywhatcanwedo.blogspot.com.au]

Last Edited by CitizenPerth™ on 08/22/2013 11:28 PM
It's life as we know it, but only just.
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 2002267
New Zealand
08/22/2013 11:04 PM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
thanks for this:


may i say with respect that the news edits you have shared are extreemly important but i cant share them to my friends when they have those little "funny" edits of quite possibly Rasist jokes, ie; the japanese accent cuts.
the news is very serious and i get where you are comming from but in my opinion it cheapens the message and leaves you open to critisisim.

cheers though, you are doing a very good job at keeping me informed.
thanks
Citizenperth  (OP)

User ID: 45567548
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08/22/2013 11:14 PM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
thanks for this:


may i say with respect that the news edits you have shared are extreemly important but i cant share them to my friends when they have those little "funny" edits of quite possibly Rasist jokes, ie; the japanese accent cuts.
the news is very serious and i get where you are comming from but in my opinion it cheapens the message and leaves you open to critisisim.

cheers though, you are doing a very good job at keeping me informed.
thanks
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2002267


no problems. the videos (not on this particular report that i did for the sheeple), are from msmilkytheclown1. her reports are awesome, i understan the racial bit, but it, i find, is a tongue in cheek tepco slant, not against the people themselves..... perhaps if you informed your friends of that they might be more understanding.... call it her frustration....

Last Edited by CitizenPerth™ on 08/22/2013 11:15 PM
It's life as we know it, but only just.
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 2002267
New Zealand
08/22/2013 11:21 PM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
oh right, thats it, they are the reports i was talking about.
anyway, honestly: Thank You.
i will be in melbourne in late september, if you are local let me know and i`ll buy you a beer
Citizenperth  (OP)

User ID: 45567548
Australia
08/22/2013 11:24 PM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
oh right, thats it, they are the reports i was talking about.
anyway, honestly: Thank You.
i will be in melbourne in late september, if you are local let me know and i`ll buy you a beer
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2002267


i'm up on the gold coast if yer up for a fantastic detour on the way home ;)

btw, did your remote triage computer systems there a few years back for the university of aukland... was based in hammy for 12 months or so.. loved it... Fuck a Tarny!!!!
It's life as we know it, but only just.
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 2002267
New Zealand
08/22/2013 11:30 PM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
thats a bit spooky, im posting from the uni.
haha small world, i work for the IT Department
Anonymous Coward
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Japan
08/22/2013 11:50 PM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
Citizen Perth what is your recommended course of action?

In other words, if you were in complete control of the situation what would you do?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1130777
Japan
08/22/2013 11:57 PM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
Citizen Perth what is your recommended course of action?

In other words, if you were in complete control of the situation what would you do?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1130777


Still waiting for an answer. I ask respectfully not "shill"-like.
Citizenperth  (OP)

User ID: 45567548
Australia
08/23/2013 12:06 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
Citizen Perth what is your recommended course of action?

In other words, if you were in complete control of the situation what would you do?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1130777


Still waiting for an answer. I ask respectfully not "shill"-like.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1130777


hi.

what would i do?

difficult question, as to what would i have done as to what would i do know. if you clarify i could answer... remember i'm no nuclear god either... but i could give you an answer...
It's life as we know it, but only just.
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie
Citizenperth  (OP)

User ID: 45567548
Australia
08/23/2013 12:12 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
thats a bit spooky, im posting from the uni.
haha small world, i work for the IT Department
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2002267


look up the institute of rural health ;)
and at the uni 'remote triage for health' ;)
dr joyce hendricks phd
(was my partner back then)

Last Edited by CitizenPerth™ on 08/23/2013 12:12 AM
It's life as we know it, but only just.
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie
Anonymous Coward
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Japan
08/23/2013 12:25 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
what would i do?

difficult question, as to what would i have done as to what would i do know. if you clarify i could answer... remember i'm no nuclear god either... but i could give you an answer...
 Quoting: Citizenperth


OK, thanks for your answer.

I guess what I am trying to get at is...what should be done at this point, if anything, in your opinion?

Imagine you had total control of the situation, in terms of poltics, technology, etc. (We can assume existing technology, not fantasy technolgy). But you can mobilize people or machines to do this or that, you can make up a long- or short-term plan to do this or that, etc.

What should be done?
Anonymous Coward
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08/23/2013 12:28 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
burn_joss_ .....c.c



Thanks CP
Anonymous Coward
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08/23/2013 12:31 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
bump smile_kiss .... .c.c bump
Anonymous Coward
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Japan
08/23/2013 03:29 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
bump
Citizenperth  (OP)

User ID: 45567548
Australia
08/23/2013 04:21 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
bump
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1130777

It's life as we know it, but only just.
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 43696650
United States
08/23/2013 05:16 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
That's really an unfair question, asking somebody what they would do to fix a situation such as Fukushima has become.

How can you even offer suggestions about what to do when they won't even be upfront about where the melted fuel is and "now" they cry for help when they've allowed it to become a hopeless situation?

It's like asking "What do I do now?", after you've just jumped out of a plane at 30,000 feet without a parachute.

Sadly with Fukushima, the horse is out of the barn and really all we can do is offer others ways to minimize the effects and provide information to help others cope with what effects might be on the way.

The question of "What would you do is really only useful when you are still in a position to do anything meaningful".

Also knowing that we may never get all the facts about what has really happened or what the true circumstances behind how this whole situation unfolded makes it a question like "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin"?

I don't think it's any great secret how TEPCO has lied or at the best misrepresented the facts. Knowing how hard it's been trying to get a straight answer out of them so far, can you imagine what their explanations would have been if there were not people like Citizenperth or the many others who have tried to keep TEPCO honest? We would still be getting ridiculous information of "Just Think Happy Thoughts".

CitizenPerth has not portrayed himself as a nuclear scientist and has (it seems to me) been all about trying to inform an uninformed and mislead public.

If you want to attack someone, you should make it all the nuclear "professionals" who understood the severity of Fukushima from Day One and what it could become and did nothing.

We're getting to the point now that the only question to ask is "What tissue should I use"?

Don't kill the messenger.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 43672866
United States
08/23/2013 05:24 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
Theres way more ides for adapting to/living with radiation, than there is for stopping fukushima from releasing radiation.

I think we should focus on adaption.
Citizenperth  (OP)

User ID: 45567548
Australia
08/23/2013 05:28 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
That's really an unfair question, asking somebody what they would do to fix a situation such as Fukushima has become.

How can you even offer suggestions about what to do when they won't even be upfront about where the melted fuel is and "now" they cry for help when they've allowed it to become a hopeless situation?

It's like asking "What do I do now?", after you've just jumped out of a plane at 30,000 feet without a parachute.

Sadly with Fukushima, the horse is out of the barn and really all we can do is offer others ways to minimize the effects and provide information to help others cope with what effects might be on the way.

The question of "What would you do is really only useful when you are still in a position to do anything meaningful".

Also knowing that we may never get all the facts about what has really happened or what the true circumstances behind how this whole situation unfolded makes it a question like "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin"?

I don't think it's any great secret how TEPCO has lied or at the best misrepresented the facts. Knowing how hard it's been trying to get a straight answer out of them so far, can you imagine what their explanations would have been if there were not people like Citizenperth or the many others who have tried to keep TEPCO honest? We would still be getting ridiculous information of "Just Think Happy Thoughts".

CitizenPerth has not portrayed himself as a nuclear scientist and has (it seems to me) been all about trying to inform an uninformed and mislead public.

If you want to attack someone, you should make it all the nuclear "professionals" who understood the severity of Fukushima from Day One and what it could become and did nothing.

We're getting to the point now that the only question to ask is "What tissue should I use"?

Don't kill the messenger.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 43696650


that is humbling (not that i was after thanks), but thankyou....
It's life as we know it, but only just.
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 43696650
United States
08/23/2013 06:18 AM
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Re: The reality of the Level Three Water tank Crisis? Is it really a Doomsday Clock?
I know you were not pitching for compliments but I get so disgusted by people that attack you as if you created and are a part of the problem. The internet is a wonderful tool but even the simplest life forms know that great discernment is required when getting your information off of the internet.

I always tell people that it's takes more work to get news from the internet as it seems everybody has an agenda but you learn who knows what they are talking about and what they're agenda is (helping others and spreading truth is still an agenda) and follow them.

The masses watch MSM because it requires no effort as all I have to do is sit back as the nice people tell me what to think. Whether it's true or not becomes a secondary consideration. These days it has become not that they are telling lies but what they are not telling. Fukushima has only started to receive any attention only because they have been shamed by folks like Radchick, Citizenperth and all the many others who are spreading the truth to the point that they have become embarrassed about not covering it. Even then nobody will even mention the P-word (Plutonium).

I just had a friend who came back from Ireland and told of how many people were talking about Fukushima and it was only after being out of the U.S. and being exposed to other countries news did she realize just how in the dark we are in the U.S.

I have always had great respect for the Japanese culture and they do have an honor and "saving face" aspect of their culture but TEPCO has tried to use that to cover their obvious lies and omissions, this whole bowing to say "We're really sorry we polluted your world". That's not saving face but bold face lying. They use that same "saving face" that the majority of genuine Japanese people have to control and manipulate their own people.

I don't understand why other countries have not been on Japan from Day One as in all reality Japan is at the end of the day attacking the world by destroying the Pacific Ocean and dumping radiation on other countries. It's not like farting in a room, this stuff will affect the world for a very long time.

I don't venture into the whole alien/reptilian idea but the leaders really must be as do they think they are somehow going to escape this? They may have their underground bunkers but nobody is going to get out of this alive at the rate things are going.

I'd rather be dead than live underground. I guess denial has it's uses.





GLP