Godlike Productions - Discussion Forum
Users Online Now: 2,030 (Who's On?)Visitors Today: 803,739
Pageviews Today: 1,768,367Threads Today: 1,024Posts Today: 19,767
11:22 PM


Rate this Thread

Absolute BS Crap Reasonable Nice Amazing
 

"FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46254519
Australia
09/03/2013 07:41 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
"FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
According to these verses..especially the first one..he fully intended to harden the pharoahs heart FROM THE START..

Where was the FREE WILL in that for pharoah?

Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

THIS was said to him at the bush..BEFORE he went to egypt.

It was planned all along to harden his heart..AS the following verses back up.


Exo_7:3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.


Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.

Exo_14:17 And I, behold, I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians, and they shall follow them: and I will get me honour upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host, upon his chariots, and upon his horsemen.

So much for free will there.

But here is more..\

Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)


Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

See a pattern yet??....NO free will..there never was and never will be.


Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Its GOD who makes the decisions..NOT US.

Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

ALL PLANNED..right from the start..as is EVERYTHING else.

Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

SO if you get HARDENED....its all pART of HIS purpose..WE have NO SAY in it...


Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

YES...who CAN resist his will??..because whoever CAN..is STRONGER and more POWRFUL than GOD.

And here is his reply..


Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?


And yes he DOES.\


WE are "ACCOUNTABLE"...but HE is RESPONSIBLE...for it ALL.

THATS why Jesus DIES..he was TAKING RESPONSABILITY FOR IT ALL..as OUR creationg and being born into sin was HIS PLAN>..and NOT OUR FAULT..so..to COVER it..he PAID for it..BEFORE the foundation of the world.

According to the bible we give account...but we DONT bear the responsability.

We pay for our actions..NOT our sins.

He sees the heart..and all hearts according to the verses above are MADE the way they are FOR his purpose..so in the end....

Mat_9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

And notice..his ANGER..which TOO has a purpose..iS NOT forever..

Mic_7:18 Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.

And finally..to prove god is in FULL control of it all and that he is NOT a heartless prick...

Hos_6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Hos_2:23 And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

and besides all this...

What the word actually SAYS about the salvation of man is..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of a small fraction of the nations; and some of the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.


And What the word actually SAYS

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall about 10% of mankind be made alive.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of just a few men, and only of those that believe.

And What the word actually SAYS

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And what they actually TEACH..

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away...except in hell where screaming and pain and tears and death will continue quite happily for eternity.

And What the word actually SAYS

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up 10% of death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off about 10% of faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off a bit of the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And What the word actually SAYS

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw about 10% of men unto me.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and for our's only, but not for the sins of the whole world.


And What the word actually SAYS


John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of part of the world.
.
Took a fair bit of twisting of scripture to make them say the OPPOSITE of whats there...but most christians should not have a problem with it because its what they EXACTLY teach..


God IS love.

Its NOT an ATTRIBUTE of his..its what HE ACTAULLY IS!!!!!!

1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the LOVE that GOD ACTUALLY IS???


1Co 13:4 LOVE suffereth long, and is kind; LOVE envieth not; LOVE vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

1Co 13:8 LOVE never faileth:

But to hear most christians preach..they TWIST it to mean...

1Jn 4:8 He that condemeth others not to hell knoweth not God; for God is JUSTICE and REVENGE.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the JUSTICE and RAGE that God hath to us. God is JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE; and he that dwelleth in JUSTICE and etrnal SPITE dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE that GOD ACTUALLY IS according to how they preach it???


1Co 13:4 JUSTICE and RAGE suffereth NOTHING, and is unkind; JUSTICE and RAGE envieth all things; JUSTICE and RAGE vaunteth itself and DEMANDS worship on pain of ETERNAL TORURE, and is INCREDIBLY puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth behave itself unseemly, seeketh always its own, easily provoked, thinketh eternal evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth in iniquity, but rejoiceth NOT in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Burneth all things, condemneth all things, hopeth all things burn, endureth nothing.

1Co 13:8 And LOVE??? well..it ALWAYS faileth:
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 36715444
United States
09/03/2013 07:45 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
What?
wupy

User ID: 41363484
United States
09/03/2013 07:50 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Learn to think outside the book.

You had free will before you came here. You chose to come here. You have free will now and you will have free will when you leave this world.

It's not a question of what will happen to you when you pass to the next world. It's a question of what do you want to do.

I'm coming right back. I like it here. The food is good, the conversations are decent and the sex is fantastic.

Free the chains on your mind and the chains on your soul will melt away my friend.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 46254519
Australia
09/03/2013 07:55 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Learn to think outside the book.

You had free will before you came here. You chose to come here. You have free will now and you will have free will when you leave this world.

It's not a question of what will happen to you when you pass to the next world. It's a question of what do you want to do.

I'm coming right back. I like it here. The food is good, the conversations are decent and the sex is fantastic.

Free the chains on your mind and the chains on your soul will melt away my friend.
 Quoting: wupy


What is actually taught in the churches makes no sense

They teach that basically..

Life is in a fallen state 'experiment', where the experimenter (GOD) already KNEW the result - something like >90% will fail that experiment and will get tortured in everlasting agony for the amusement of the remaining <10%.

Whoever remembers that they actually volunteered to take part in this deadly 'experiment', can raise their hands!

Even more so, the Experimenter(God) initially created Angels, KNOWING that 1/3 of them will rebel,
He couldn't just simply exterminate the Fallen Angels on spot, no, he had to create some several hundred billions of humans as CANNON FODDER in his war vs the Fallen Angels to prove some infi-dimensional POINT in this unique "court case".

That he can pretty much afford to create billions upon billions of souls just to torture them forever as spoils of war none of them wanted to be any part of. But after all, the Fallen Angels got taught a lesson! So any other creatures of the Universe(s) better not even dare to rebel, or ELSE some other trillion of souls will be created explicitly for eternal suffering!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 15292827
United States
09/03/2013 07:58 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Freedom is a length of rope and God wants you to hang yourself with it.

Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 46254519
Australia
09/03/2013 08:43 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
bump For further conversation.
me777
God Is Love

User ID: 43150400
Canada
09/03/2013 10:30 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Mere Christianity Today




When thy judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.
Isaiah 26:9

"Exposing Those Who Contradict"
[link to bible-truths.com]

"For as in Adam ALL die, so also in the Messiah will ALL be made alive."
[link to www.tentmaker.org]
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 12691522
Australia
09/03/2013 10:38 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
According to these verses..especially the first one..he fully intended to harden the pharoahs heart FROM THE START..

Where was the FREE WILL in that for pharoah?

Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

THIS was said to him at the bush..BEFORE he went to egypt.

It was planned all along to harden his heart..AS the following verses back up.


Exo_7:3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.


Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.

Exo_14:17 And I, behold, I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians, and they shall follow them: and I will get me honour upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host, upon his chariots, and upon his horsemen.

So much for free will there.

But here is more..\

Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)


Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

See a pattern yet??....NO free will..there never was and never will be.


Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Its GOD who makes the decisions..NOT US.

Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

ALL PLANNED..right from the start..as is EVERYTHING else.

Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

SO if you get HARDENED....its all pART of HIS purpose..WE have NO SAY in it...


Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

YES...who CAN resist his will??..because whoever CAN..is STRONGER and more POWRFUL than GOD.

And here is his reply..


Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?


And yes he DOES.\


WE are "ACCOUNTABLE"...but HE is RESPONSIBLE...for it ALL.

THATS why Jesus DIES..he was TAKING RESPONSABILITY FOR IT ALL..as OUR creationg and being born into sin was HIS PLAN>..and NOT OUR FAULT..so..to COVER it..he PAID for it..BEFORE the foundation of the world.

According to the bible we give account...but we DONT bear the responsability.

We pay for our actions..NOT our sins.

He sees the heart..and all hearts according to the verses above are MADE the way they are FOR his purpose..so in the end....

Mat_9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

And notice..his ANGER..which TOO has a purpose..iS NOT forever..

Mic_7:18 Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.

And finally..to prove god is in FULL control of it all and that he is NOT a heartless prick...

Hos_6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Hos_2:23 And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

and besides all this...

What the word actually SAYS about the salvation of man is..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of a small fraction of the nations; and some of the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.


And What the word actually SAYS

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall about 10% of mankind be made alive.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of just a few men, and only of those that believe.

And What the word actually SAYS

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And what they actually TEACH..

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away...except in hell where screaming and pain and tears and death will continue quite happily for eternity.

And What the word actually SAYS

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up 10% of death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off about 10% of faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off a bit of the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And What the word actually SAYS

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw about 10% of men unto me.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and for our's only, but not for the sins of the whole world.


And What the word actually SAYS


John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of part of the world.
.
Took a fair bit of twisting of scripture to make them say the OPPOSITE of whats there...but most christians should not have a problem with it because its what they EXACTLY teach..


God IS love.

Its NOT an ATTRIBUTE of his..its what HE ACTAULLY IS!!!!!!

1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the LOVE that GOD ACTUALLY IS???


1Co 13:4 LOVE suffereth long, and is kind; LOVE envieth not; LOVE vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

1Co 13:8 LOVE never faileth:

But to hear most christians preach..they TWIST it to mean...

1Jn 4:8 He that condemeth others not to hell knoweth not God; for God is JUSTICE and REVENGE.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the JUSTICE and RAGE that God hath to us. God is JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE; and he that dwelleth in JUSTICE and etrnal SPITE dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE that GOD ACTUALLY IS according to how they preach it???


1Co 13:4 JUSTICE and RAGE suffereth NOTHING, and is unkind; JUSTICE and RAGE envieth all things; JUSTICE and RAGE vaunteth itself and DEMANDS worship on pain of ETERNAL TORURE, and is INCREDIBLY puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth behave itself unseemly, seeketh always its own, easily provoked, thinketh eternal evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth in iniquity, but rejoiceth NOT in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Burneth all things, condemneth all things, hopeth all things burn, endureth nothing.

1Co 13:8 And LOVE??? well..it ALWAYS faileth:
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46254519


Out of all the hhit ive read on this site coming from christards that makes the most sense.

How could they have missed whats in their own book and then teach the opposite of it and make a shitload of money doing it?

HAHAHAHA\


They are the biggest bunch of brainwashed tards ever.

OP what you have said is probably the most damning thing you could have ever posted against the hell and money idiots.

Maybe its time they learnt to read.

clappa For you.
Ford Prefect

User ID: 45291675
Brazil
09/03/2013 11:10 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Guess what OP? There's NO GOD! No "heavenly father" mystic invisible entity sitting somewhere in space taking care of the universe and everything that lives in it.

Only aliens of ancient civilizations, of ancient races older than stars, than entire galaxies, playing gods.

What kind of level of evolution or involution they are, what kind of technology they possess, what kind of mind powers they have, one can only imagine, but eventually they colonize planets like Earth and create intelligent beings like humans, then they cross the line and act as if we're they pets, slaves, puppets, and they consider us an inferior species, and they tamper with our genetics as they please, they invade our minds and hearts with their unknown powers, they plant physical microchips in our brains and even ethereal microchips in our astral bodies, and they manipulate us according to their agenda.

Amid all of this, we thrive a lifetime struggling with psychic aggregates that live in our subconscious and we fight against psychic influence of astral thugs, and we also struggle with karma of past lives that become a heavier burden each lifetime ahead, so our "free will" is pretty much like that rat that is free to take a walk inside the maze.



We have "free will" to make choices that are invariably affected by all those factors listed above.

Last Edited by Ford Prefect on 09/03/2013 11:12 PM
It's a tough galaxy. If you want to survive, you've gotta know...where your towel is.
SingleCellOrganism

User ID: 33400049
United States
09/03/2013 11:14 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Guess what OP? There's NO GOD! No "heavenly father" mystic invisible entity sitting somewhere in space taking care of the universe and everything that lives in it.

Only aliens of ancient civilizations, of ancient races older than stars, than entire galaxies, playing gods.

What kind of level of evolution or involution they are, what kind of technology they possess, what kind of mind powers they have, one can only imagine, but eventually they colonize planets like Earth and create intelligent beings like humans, then they cross the line and act as if we're they pets, slaves, puppets, and they consider us an inferior species, and they tamper with our genetics as they please, they invade our minds and hearts with their unknown powers, they plant physical microchips in our brains and even ethereal microchips in our astral bodies, and they manipulate us according to their agenda.

Amid all of this, we thrive a lifetime struggling with psychic aggregates that live in our subconscious and we fight against psychic influence of astral thugs, and we also struggle with karma of past lives that become a heavier burden each lifetime ahead, so our "free will" is pretty much like that rat that is free to take a walk inside the maze.



We have "free will" to make choices that are invariably affected by all those factors listed above.
 Quoting: Ford Prefect


Meh. Deleted.

Last Edited by Quadriped on 09/03/2013 11:19 PM
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 12691522
Australia
09/03/2013 11:50 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
According to these verses..especially the first one..he fully intended to harden the pharoahs heart FROM THE START..

Where was the FREE WILL in that for pharoah?

Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

THIS was said to him at the bush..BEFORE he went to egypt.

It was planned all along to harden his heart..AS the following verses back up.


Exo_7:3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.


Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.

Exo_14:17 And I, behold, I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians, and they shall follow them: and I will get me honour upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host, upon his chariots, and upon his horsemen.

So much for free will there.

But here is more..\

Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)


Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

See a pattern yet??....NO free will..there never was and never will be.


Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Its GOD who makes the decisions..NOT US.

Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

ALL PLANNED..right from the start..as is EVERYTHING else.

Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

SO if you get HARDENED....its all pART of HIS purpose..WE have NO SAY in it...


Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

YES...who CAN resist his will??..because whoever CAN..is STRONGER and more POWRFUL than GOD.

And here is his reply..


Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?


And yes he DOES.\


WE are "ACCOUNTABLE"...but HE is RESPONSIBLE...for it ALL.

THATS why Jesus DIES..he was TAKING RESPONSABILITY FOR IT ALL..as OUR creationg and being born into sin was HIS PLAN>..and NOT OUR FAULT..so..to COVER it..he PAID for it..BEFORE the foundation of the world.

According to the bible we give account...but we DONT bear the responsability.

We pay for our actions..NOT our sins.

He sees the heart..and all hearts according to the verses above are MADE the way they are FOR his purpose..so in the end....

Mat_9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

And notice..his ANGER..which TOO has a purpose..iS NOT forever..

Mic_7:18 Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.

And finally..to prove god is in FULL control of it all and that he is NOT a heartless prick...

Hos_6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Hos_2:23 And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

and besides all this...

What the word actually SAYS about the salvation of man is..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of a small fraction of the nations; and some of the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.


And What the word actually SAYS

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall about 10% of mankind be made alive.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of just a few men, and only of those that believe.

And What the word actually SAYS

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And what they actually TEACH..

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away...except in hell where screaming and pain and tears and death will continue quite happily for eternity.

And What the word actually SAYS

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up 10% of death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off about 10% of faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off a bit of the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And What the word actually SAYS

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw about 10% of men unto me.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and for our's only, but not for the sins of the whole world.


And What the word actually SAYS


John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of part of the world.
.
Took a fair bit of twisting of scripture to make them say the OPPOSITE of whats there...but most christians should not have a problem with it because its what they EXACTLY teach..


God IS love.

Its NOT an ATTRIBUTE of his..its what HE ACTAULLY IS!!!!!!

1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the LOVE that GOD ACTUALLY IS???


1Co 13:4 LOVE suffereth long, and is kind; LOVE envieth not; LOVE vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

1Co 13:8 LOVE never faileth:

But to hear most christians preach..they TWIST it to mean...

1Jn 4:8 He that condemeth others not to hell knoweth not God; for God is JUSTICE and REVENGE.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the JUSTICE and RAGE that God hath to us. God is JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE; and he that dwelleth in JUSTICE and etrnal SPITE dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE that GOD ACTUALLY IS according to how they preach it???


1Co 13:4 JUSTICE and RAGE suffereth NOTHING, and is unkind; JUSTICE and RAGE envieth all things; JUSTICE and RAGE vaunteth itself and DEMANDS worship on pain of ETERNAL TORURE, and is INCREDIBLY puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth behave itself unseemly, seeketh always its own, easily provoked, thinketh eternal evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth in iniquity, but rejoiceth NOT in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Burneth all things, condemneth all things, hopeth all things burn, endureth nothing.

1Co 13:8 And LOVE??? well..it ALWAYS faileth:
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46254519


Out of all the hhit ive read on this site coming from christards that makes the most sense.

How could they have missed whats in their own book and then teach the opposite of it and make a shitload of money doing it?

HAHAHAHA\


They are the biggest bunch of brainwashed tards ever.

OP what you have said is probably the most damning thing you could have ever posted against the hell and money idiots.

Maybe its time they learnt to read.

clappa For you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12691522


Satan is hate and revenge and force and therefore evil.

Its black and white.

Good and evil.

Jesus defined "Good".

The opposite is evil.

Ill do a bible tard thing and quote a verse.

You might be more comfortable if I speak in your language.

(I never forgot what I learnt in sunday shool)

Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

This^^^^is "Good"

Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

This is what christians preach^^^

Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

This^^^is "Good" and shows patience and love.

Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

He Loves both the good and the evil and makes no discrimination in how he treats them. Its is the essence of "Good"


Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

This is what christians do. The hang around eachother patting eachother on the back at how "Holy" they think they are but curse and hate and condemn everyone else all the time. That is "Evil"

Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?

As I said above its "Evil"

Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

So perfect must not mean quoting scriptures or being all self rightous as they do but it means not being an asshole to everyone else.

Because Gods not an asshole.

You may ask why I know all this and am not a christian?

Its because there are no churches anywhere where you can be yourself and not get spat onand condemned for being human.

Not into that shit.

Its all garbage and hypocrisy.

As for God??

If he is real there is no way he can be the asshole they make him out to be.

Im not an athiest nor an evolutionist.

I just live and treat my fellow man as best I can.

Or will some tight assed christian with a bee in their bonnet tellme that I will burn in hell for not saying a sinners prayer?
me777
God Is Love

User ID: 43150400
Canada
09/04/2013 12:06 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
According to these verses..especially the first one..he fully intended to harden the pharoahs heart FROM THE START..

Where was the FREE WILL in that for pharoah?

Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

THIS was said to him at the bush..BEFORE he went to egypt.

It was planned all along to harden his heart..AS the following verses back up.


Exo_7:3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.


Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.

Exo_14:17 And I, behold, I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians, and they shall follow them: and I will get me honour upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host, upon his chariots, and upon his horsemen.

So much for free will there.

But here is more..\

Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)


Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

See a pattern yet??....NO free will..there never was and never will be.


Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Its GOD who makes the decisions..NOT US.

Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

ALL PLANNED..right from the start..as is EVERYTHING else.

Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

SO if you get HARDENED....its all pART of HIS purpose..WE have NO SAY in it...


Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

YES...who CAN resist his will??..because whoever CAN..is STRONGER and more POWRFUL than GOD.

And here is his reply..


Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?


And yes he DOES.\


WE are "ACCOUNTABLE"...but HE is RESPONSIBLE...for it ALL.

THATS why Jesus DIES..he was TAKING RESPONSABILITY FOR IT ALL..as OUR creationg and being born into sin was HIS PLAN>..and NOT OUR FAULT..so..to COVER it..he PAID for it..BEFORE the foundation of the world.

According to the bible we give account...but we DONT bear the responsability.

We pay for our actions..NOT our sins.

He sees the heart..and all hearts according to the verses above are MADE the way they are FOR his purpose..so in the end....

Mat_9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

And notice..his ANGER..which TOO has a purpose..iS NOT forever..

Mic_7:18 Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.

And finally..to prove god is in FULL control of it all and that he is NOT a heartless prick...

Hos_6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Hos_2:23 And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

and besides all this...

What the word actually SAYS about the salvation of man is..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of a small fraction of the nations; and some of the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.


And What the word actually SAYS

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall about 10% of mankind be made alive.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of just a few men, and only of those that believe.

And What the word actually SAYS

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And what they actually TEACH..

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away...except in hell where screaming and pain and tears and death will continue quite happily for eternity.

And What the word actually SAYS

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up 10% of death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off about 10% of faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off a bit of the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And What the word actually SAYS

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw about 10% of men unto me.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and for our's only, but not for the sins of the whole world.


And What the word actually SAYS


John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of part of the world.
.
Took a fair bit of twisting of scripture to make them say the OPPOSITE of whats there...but most christians should not have a problem with it because its what they EXACTLY teach..


God IS love.

Its NOT an ATTRIBUTE of his..its what HE ACTAULLY IS!!!!!!

1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the LOVE that GOD ACTUALLY IS???


1Co 13:4 LOVE suffereth long, and is kind; LOVE envieth not; LOVE vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

1Co 13:8 LOVE never faileth:

But to hear most christians preach..they TWIST it to mean...

1Jn 4:8 He that condemeth others not to hell knoweth not God; for God is JUSTICE and REVENGE.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the JUSTICE and RAGE that God hath to us. God is JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE; and he that dwelleth in JUSTICE and etrnal SPITE dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE that GOD ACTUALLY IS according to how they preach it???


1Co 13:4 JUSTICE and RAGE suffereth NOTHING, and is unkind; JUSTICE and RAGE envieth all things; JUSTICE and RAGE vaunteth itself and DEMANDS worship on pain of ETERNAL TORURE, and is INCREDIBLY puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth behave itself unseemly, seeketh always its own, easily provoked, thinketh eternal evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth in iniquity, but rejoiceth NOT in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Burneth all things, condemneth all things, hopeth all things burn, endureth nothing.

1Co 13:8 And LOVE??? well..it ALWAYS faileth:
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46254519


Out of all the hhit ive read on this site coming from christards that makes the most sense.

How could they have missed whats in their own book and then teach the opposite of it and make a shitload of money doing it?

HAHAHAHA\


They are the biggest bunch of brainwashed tards ever.

OP what you have said is probably the most damning thing you could have ever posted against the hell and money idiots.

Maybe its time they learnt to read.

clappa For you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12691522


Satan is hate and revenge and force and therefore evil.

Its black and white.

Good and evil.

Jesus defined "Good".

The opposite is evil.

Ill do a bible tard thing and quote a verse.

You might be more comfortable if I speak in your language.

(I never forgot what I learnt in sunday shool)

Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

This^^^^is "Good"

Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

This is what christians preach^^^

Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

This^^^is "Good" and shows patience and love.

Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

He Loves both the good and the evil and makes no discrimination in how he treats them. Its is the essence of "Good"


Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

This is what christians do. The hang around eachother patting eachother on the back at how "Holy" they think they are but curse and hate and condemn everyone else all the time. That is "Evil"

Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?

As I said above its "Evil"

Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

So perfect must not mean quoting scriptures or being all self rightous as they do but it means not being an asshole to everyone else.

Because Gods not an asshole.

You may ask why I know all this and am not a christian?

Its because there are no churches anywhere where you can be yourself and not get spat onand condemned for being human.

Not into that shit.

Its all garbage and hypocrisy.

As for God??

If he is real there is no way he can be the asshole they make him out to be.

Im not an athiest nor an evolutionist.

I just live and treat my fellow man as best I can.

Or will some tight assed christian with a bee in their bonnet tellme that I will burn in hell for not saying a sinners prayer?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12691522


THE DEPTH OF SATAN AND THE CHURCH OF GOD

"But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine and which have not known the DEPTHS of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden" (Rev. 2:24).

"But as it is written, ‘What no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the human heart conceived, what God has prepared for those who love Him’--these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit; for the Spirit searches everything, even the DEPTHS of God" (I Cor. 2:10, Revised Standard Version).

Just what is, "the DEPTHS of Satan" and "the DEPTHS of God," and where do we find them?

There are two main issues found in both the depths of Satan and the depths of God:

What is the true nature and character of God?

What is the purpose and destiny of the human race? The depths of Satan and the depths of God both answer these two questions.

The DEPTHS of Satan—teaches that what God does mostly, is HATE! He is a God of eternal hatred and vengeance.

He is pictured as the chief of hypocrites. He tells mankind to love their enemies, but shows His perverted love toward mankind by torturing most of our loved-ones in fire for all eternity. God’s weak wish of saving all humanity is thwarted by the sovereign power of man’s supposed free will, and thus most of the human race will eternally hate and despise and curse their Creator for ever making them. This teaching of Satan has absolutely no redeeming value to it. God will be remembered eternally for being the greatest failure in the history of the universe. This doctrine is both the most evil and the most stupid teaching ever conceived.

The DEPTHS of God—teaches that what God does and is, is LOVE!

He is a God fully capable of bringing the whole human race to repentance through judgments that cause man to learn righteousness. The purpose for man’s creation is to teach him obedience and love, so that he can be molded into the very Image of God Himself and thus be manifested as the Eternal Sons and Daughters of God in the Family of God. God’s plan brings unspeakable happiness to and pleasure to every creature in heaven and earth. God’s plan will be totally successful down to God’s very last wish and desire. Possessing the very character of God and His love for all His creatures is the most marvelous plan ever conceived by our all-wise and Loving God.

Ironically, The Christian Church writes books about, teaches in her seminaries, and preaches from her pulpits, in a most vigorous manner, The DEPTHS of Satan. Contrariwise, she avoids teaching The DEPTHS of God, and accuses those who do, of being false prophets and of the devil.

Seminary professors and theologians, religious writers and movie makers, clergymen and teachers, the world over, attribute to Satan powers and victories that he does not deserve or possess, and they likewise attribute to God weaknesses and failures that He does not deserve or possess! Their theology is turned backward, upside down, and inside out! Satan will not be victorious over the human race by bringing the majority of mankind down into a living eternal hellhole of torture, nor will God be a disgraceful failure in saving the world! It is time now for God to reveal some startling truths to those who have ears to hear.

Little wonder that the Church worldwide does not acknowledge the whereabouts of the depths of Satan. Yet, this is no secret for those who have eyes to see it. "The DEPTHS of Satan is found IN THE CHURCH itself. Satan does not attack the Church from without, but from within:

Where do we find them who "say they are apostles [of Jesus Christ] and are not?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:2).

Where do we find them who have "left their first love?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:4).

Where do we find them which "say they are [spiritual] Jews and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:9 & 3:9).

Where do we find "Satan’s seat [throne]?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:13).

Where do we find "where Satan dwells?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:13).

Where do we find "the doctrine of Balaam?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:14).

Where do we find "them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I [Jesus] hate?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:15).

Where do we find "that woman Jezebel, which calls herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication and to eat things sacrificed unto idols?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 2:19).

Where do we find them that "have a name that you live, and are dead?" Why, IN THE CHURCH

Where do we find them that "are wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked?" Why, IN THE CHURCH (Rev. 3:17).

And were do we find "the DEPTHS of Satan?" Why, IN THE CHURCH, of course Rev. 2:24).

Is it possible that the "depths of God" can co-exist alongside of the "depths of Satan" in the same church?

Are not both taught in the Church? No, they are not. However, let me make myself perfectly clear on this matter. I am not suggesting that nothing but the depths of Satan is taught in the Christian Church. That is certainly not true. There are numerous truths of God that are taught in the Church, and there are doctrines and practices of demons that are not taught in the Church.

But, therein lies the reason why there is much confusion and contradiction among the different denominations. Error mixed with some truth can be more deceptive than error alone.

THE GREATEST DEPTH OF EVIL IS FOUND ONLY IN THE CHURCH

There is no greater evil taught in the Church today that the doctrine of "eternal torment." This doctrine has no validity in the Scriptures.

Even though this doctrine has its origin in paganism, most pagan and heathen nations have long forsaken this hideous teaching. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, that can be conceived by the mind of man or demon, that is more deplorable, detestable, and disgusting than the thought of being physically, mentally, and spiritually tortured for all eternity.

The thought is inconceivable. The thought of eternal torture is far beyond all known evil, immoral, corrupt, damnable, deprived, heinous, hideous, loathsome, nefarious, obscene, repugnant, reprobate, vile and wicked sins of all the universe combined. There just aren’t enough adjectives to describe this doctrine. It can be compared to nothing. The very thought, the teaching, the doctrine, of eternal torment, is the greatest evil than can ever be conceived.

Eternity has NO END!

When totally reprobate men want to commit the ultimate evil, they torture. Torture is outlawed in international warfare. Even the vilest despotic leaders in the world agree in principle (if not always in practice) that torture should be a forbidden practice. All humans who torture others are considered the lowest form of humanity.

Saddam’s two sons were inventors of new forms of human torture. Yet their joy of putting people through tree shredders was child’s play compared to the evils envisioned by the great theologians of Christendom. Theologians picture men, women, and children, being engulfed in real fire while being forced to drink molten hot lead! As for me, I would take the tree shredder any day! At least that quickly comes to an end. But the theologians’ vision of torture by fire in hell, never, ever, ever comes to an end.

And they call it "FAIR"! And they call it "JUSTICE"! I heard them with my own ears. John Hagee said on international television that, hell is "JUSTICE"! And I heard James Kennedy say on international television, that hell is "FAIR"!

NO, ETERNAL TORTURE IS NOT JUSTICE AND NO, IT IS NOT FAIR. It is insane rank demonism—it is The DEPTHS of Satan!! IT IS INORDINATELY EVIL: IT IS THE ULTIMATE SIN: IT IS THE BLASPHEMY OF ALL BLASPHEMIES!

It is a doctrine that demeans and debases the very character of God Almighty below that of the vilest humans who have ever lived.
More:
[link to bible-truths.com]
When thy judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.
Isaiah 26:9

"Exposing Those Who Contradict"
[link to bible-truths.com]

"For as in Adam ALL die, so also in the Messiah will ALL be made alive."
[link to www.tentmaker.org]
SilverPatriot

User ID: 39491380
United States
09/04/2013 12:07 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Op,

Take a break from your personal religious hate fest perhaps you can describe how your free will has been willingly been turned over to your government “leaders” and how happy you are to be taken care of at least for now.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 45887251
Australia
09/04/2013 12:07 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
Creating a race of being without free will would be pretty boring IMO.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26310058
United States
09/04/2013 12:08 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
OP, maybe you should be a Calvinist or some sh*t?
me777
God Is Love

User ID: 43150400
Canada
09/04/2013 12:09 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
OP, maybe you should be a Calvinist or some sh*t?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26310058



When thy judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.
Isaiah 26:9

"Exposing Those Who Contradict"
[link to bible-truths.com]

"For as in Adam ALL die, so also in the Messiah will ALL be made alive."
[link to www.tentmaker.org]
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 40487804
United States
09/04/2013 12:17 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
OP misunderstands. God was saying Pharoh's heart would be hardened because of his attitude towards God as God knows the end from the beginning as He is outside of time. Its the same with all of us, the trials of life we go through are often horrible and unfair and we can choose to ask God to help us get through it all and trust Him or we can shake our fists at Him and blame Him. All of life is a trial.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 12691522
Australia
09/04/2013 12:20 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
OP misunderstands. God was saying Pharoh's heart would be hardened because of his attitude towards God as God knows the end from the beginning as He is outside of time. Its the same with all of us, the trials of life we go through are often horrible and unfair and we can choose to ask God to help us get through it all and trust Him or we can shake our fists at Him and blame Him. All of life is a trial.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 40487804


Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.


What part of god saying "I WILL HARDEN PHAROAS HEART" dont you get?

He said He did it.

On purpose.

So stop being a drongo.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 12691522
Australia
09/04/2013 05:40 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
OP misunderstands. God was saying Pharoh's heart would be hardened because of his attitude towards God as God knows the end from the beginning as He is outside of time. Its the same with all of us, the trials of life we go through are often horrible and unfair and we can choose to ask God to help us get through it all and trust Him or we can shake our fists at Him and blame Him. All of life is a trial.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 40487804


Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.


What part of god saying "I WILL HARDEN PHAROAS HEART" dont you get?

He said He did it.

On purpose.

So stop being a drongo.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12691522


NO reponse??

Didnt think there would be.

Now read the thread again.

AND BE FREE.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46344121
Australia
09/05/2013 08:17 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
According to these verses..especially the first one..he fully intended to harden the pharoahs heart FROM THE START..

Where was the FREE WILL in that for pharoah?

Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

THIS was said to him at the bush..BEFORE he went to egypt.

It was planned all along to harden his heart..AS the following verses back up.


Exo_7:3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.


Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.

Exo_14:17 And I, behold, I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians, and they shall follow them: and I will get me honour upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host, upon his chariots, and upon his horsemen.

So much for free will there.

But here is more..\

Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)


Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

See a pattern yet??....NO free will..there never was and never will be.


Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Its GOD who makes the decisions..NOT US.

Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

ALL PLANNED..right from the start..as is EVERYTHING else.

Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

SO if you get HARDENED....its all pART of HIS purpose..WE have NO SAY in it...


Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

YES...who CAN resist his will??..because whoever CAN..is STRONGER and more POWRFUL than GOD.

And here is his reply..


Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?


And yes he DOES.\


WE are "ACCOUNTABLE"...but HE is RESPONSIBLE...for it ALL.

THATS why Jesus DIES..he was TAKING RESPONSABILITY FOR IT ALL..as OUR creationg and being born into sin was HIS PLAN>..and NOT OUR FAULT..so..to COVER it..he PAID for it..BEFORE the foundation of the world.

According to the bible we give account...but we DONT bear the responsability.

We pay for our actions..NOT our sins.

He sees the heart..and all hearts according to the verses above are MADE the way they are FOR his purpose..so in the end....

Mat_9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

And notice..his ANGER..which TOO has a purpose..iS NOT forever..

Mic_7:18 Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.

And finally..to prove god is in FULL control of it all and that he is NOT a heartless prick...

Hos_6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Hos_2:23 And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

and besides all this...

What the word actually SAYS about the salvation of man is..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of a small fraction of the nations; and some of the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.


And What the word actually SAYS

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall about 10% of mankind be made alive.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of just a few men, and only of those that believe.

And What the word actually SAYS

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And what they actually TEACH..

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away...except in hell where screaming and pain and tears and death will continue quite happily for eternity.

And What the word actually SAYS

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up 10% of death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off about 10% of faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off a bit of the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And What the word actually SAYS

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw about 10% of men unto me.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and for our's only, but not for the sins of the whole world.


And What the word actually SAYS


John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of part of the world.
.
Took a fair bit of twisting of scripture to make them say the OPPOSITE of whats there...but most christians should not have a problem with it because its what they EXACTLY teach..


God IS love.

Its NOT an ATTRIBUTE of his..its what HE ACTAULLY IS!!!!!!

1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the LOVE that GOD ACTUALLY IS???


1Co 13:4 LOVE suffereth long, and is kind; LOVE envieth not; LOVE vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

1Co 13:8 LOVE never faileth:

But to hear most christians preach..they TWIST it to mean...

1Jn 4:8 He that condemeth others not to hell knoweth not God; for God is JUSTICE and REVENGE.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the JUSTICE and RAGE that God hath to us. God is JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE; and he that dwelleth in JUSTICE and etrnal SPITE dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE that GOD ACTUALLY IS according to how they preach it???


1Co 13:4 JUSTICE and RAGE suffereth NOTHING, and is unkind; JUSTICE and RAGE envieth all things; JUSTICE and RAGE vaunteth itself and DEMANDS worship on pain of ETERNAL TORURE, and is INCREDIBLY puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth behave itself unseemly, seeketh always its own, easily provoked, thinketh eternal evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth in iniquity, but rejoiceth NOT in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Burneth all things, condemneth all things, hopeth all things burn, endureth nothing.

1Co 13:8 And LOVE??? well..it ALWAYS faileth:
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46254519


bump
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46381687
Australia
09/06/2013 05:07 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
OP misunderstands. God was saying Pharoh's heart would be hardened because of his attitude towards God as God knows the end from the beginning as He is outside of time. Its the same with all of us, the trials of life we go through are often horrible and unfair and we can choose to ask God to help us get through it all and trust Him or we can shake our fists at Him and blame Him. All of life is a trial.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 40487804


Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.


What part of god saying "I WILL HARDEN PHAROAS HEART" dont you get?

He said He did it.

On purpose.

So stop being a drongo.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12691522


NO reponse??

Didnt think there would be.

Now read the thread again.

AND BE FREE.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12691522


Freedom is good.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46355416
Ireland
09/06/2013 05:08 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
You send yourself to hell.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1194370
United States
09/08/2013 12:38 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
The only one with true free will is God.

Peace,
Regenerated

User ID: 39250554
United States
09/08/2013 12:44 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
The only one with true free will is God.

Peace,
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1194370


God doesn't have free will, He has PERFECT will. God always acts according to His perfect nature. God always wills the right thing, because God's will is an aspect of His perfect Holy nature.

Last Edited by regenerated on 09/08/2013 01:04 AM
Regenerated

User ID: 39250554
United States
09/08/2013 12:52 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
If God truly had free will He could lie, God cannot lie, therefore He does not have free will. Free will is satan's little con game, "ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil " etc. The truth is that satan can only do what God created him to do :)

Last Edited by regenerated on 09/08/2013 01:04 AM
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46455686
Australia
09/08/2013 03:02 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
If God truly had free will He could lie, God cannot lie, therefore He does not have free will. Free will is satan's little con game, "ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil " etc. The truth is that satan can only do what God created him to do :)
 Quoting: Regenerated


yes thats right.

Satan is Gods most obedint servant.

The perfect prosecutor in the case of good versus evil.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1194370
United States
09/08/2013 11:55 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
If God truly had free will He could lie, God cannot lie, therefore He does not have free will. Free will is satan's little con game, "ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil " etc. The truth is that satan can only do what God created him to do :)
 Quoting: Regenerated


Free will is the ability to think and act without constraint.

Only God has free will.

Peace,
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46480287
United States
09/08/2013 12:56 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
perspective.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46557329
Australia
09/09/2013 05:21 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
According to these verses..especially the first one..he fully intended to harden the pharoahs heart FROM THE START..

Where was the FREE WILL in that for pharoah?

Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

THIS was said to him at the bush..BEFORE he went to egypt.

It was planned all along to harden his heart..AS the following verses back up.


Exo_7:3 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.


Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.

Exo_14:17 And I, behold, I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians, and they shall follow them: and I will get me honour upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host, upon his chariots, and upon his horsemen.

So much for free will there.

But here is more..\

Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)


Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

See a pattern yet??....NO free will..there never was and never will be.


Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Its GOD who makes the decisions..NOT US.

Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

ALL PLANNED..right from the start..as is EVERYTHING else.

Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

SO if you get HARDENED....its all pART of HIS purpose..WE have NO SAY in it...


Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

YES...who CAN resist his will??..because whoever CAN..is STRONGER and more POWRFUL than GOD.

And here is his reply..


Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?


And yes he DOES.\


WE are "ACCOUNTABLE"...but HE is RESPONSIBLE...for it ALL.

THATS why Jesus DIES..he was TAKING RESPONSABILITY FOR IT ALL..as OUR creationg and being born into sin was HIS PLAN>..and NOT OUR FAULT..so..to COVER it..he PAID for it..BEFORE the foundation of the world.

According to the bible we give account...but we DONT bear the responsability.

We pay for our actions..NOT our sins.

He sees the heart..and all hearts according to the verses above are MADE the way they are FOR his purpose..so in the end....

Mat_9:13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

And notice..his ANGER..which TOO has a purpose..iS NOT forever..

Mic_7:18 Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.

And finally..to prove god is in FULL control of it all and that he is NOT a heartless prick...

Hos_6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Hos_2:23 And I will sow her unto me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

and besides all this...

What the word actually SAYS about the salvation of man is..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 52:10 The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of a small fraction of the nations; and some of the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God.


And What the word actually SAYS

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall about 10% of mankind be made alive.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of just a few men, and only of those that believe.

And What the word actually SAYS

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And what they actually TEACH..

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away...except in hell where screaming and pain and tears and death will continue quite happily for eternity.

And What the word actually SAYS

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And what they actually TEACH..

Isaiah 25:7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. (8) He will swallow up 10% of death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off about 10% of faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off a bit of the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

And What the word actually SAYS

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw about 10% of men unto me.

And What the word actually SAYS

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

And what they actually TEACH..

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and for our's only, but not for the sins of the whole world.


And What the word actually SAYS


John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.

And what they actually TEACH..

John 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of part of the world.
.
Took a fair bit of twisting of scripture to make them say the OPPOSITE of whats there...but most christians should not have a problem with it because its what they EXACTLY teach..


God IS love.

Its NOT an ATTRIBUTE of his..its what HE ACTAULLY IS!!!!!!

1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the LOVE that GOD ACTUALLY IS???


1Co 13:4 LOVE suffereth long, and is kind; LOVE envieth not; LOVE vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

1Co 13:8 LOVE never faileth:

But to hear most christians preach..they TWIST it to mean...

1Jn 4:8 He that condemeth others not to hell knoweth not God; for God is JUSTICE and REVENGE.

1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the JUSTICE and RAGE that God hath to us. God is JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE; and he that dwelleth in JUSTICE and etrnal SPITE dwelleth in God, and God in him.

So WHAT are the TELLING FEATURES of the JUSTICE and ETERNAL RAGE that GOD ACTUALLY IS according to how they preach it???


1Co 13:4 JUSTICE and RAGE suffereth NOTHING, and is unkind; JUSTICE and RAGE envieth all things; JUSTICE and RAGE vaunteth itself and DEMANDS worship on pain of ETERNAL TORURE, and is INCREDIBLY puffed up,

1Co 13:5 Doth behave itself unseemly, seeketh always its own, easily provoked, thinketh eternal evil;

1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth in iniquity, but rejoiceth NOT in the truth;

1Co 13:7 Burneth all things, condemneth all things, hopeth all things burn, endureth nothing.

1Co 13:8 And LOVE??? well..it ALWAYS faileth:
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46254519


Thats cut and dried.

But it dampens rapture and hell book sales so they keep it all quiet.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 46640597
Australia
09/11/2013 04:18 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
bump
GODHASMYNUMBER
User ID: 42888511
Australia
09/11/2013 06:09 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: "FREE will" is a MYTH and always has been. But it sells books. Hell is big business.
OP misunderstands. God was saying Pharoh's heart would be hardened because of his attitude towards God as God knows the end from the beginning as He is outside of time. Its the same with all of us, the trials of life we go through are often horrible and unfair and we can choose to ask God to help us get through it all and trust Him or we can shake our fists at Him and blame Him. All of life is a trial.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 40487804


Exo_4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.

Exo_14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.


What part of god saying "I WILL HARDEN PHAROAS HEART" dont you get?

He said He did it.

On purpose.

So stop being a drongo.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12691522


PHAROh's "hardened" his heart b4 God ever did, you just don't read that good.





GLP