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Message Subject For christians:The scriptural PROOF that the Rapture is AFTER the tribulation. NO "Basis" here..PROOF!
Poster Handle mccloud286
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if only one of that group were in fact still alive to this very day in 2013..

It seems that the rapture and the second coming are two separate events.
 Quoting: 0_0

If by 'rapture' you mean the Greeting together of those who have been raised from the dead or transformed in the twinkling of their eye and gathered up to met the Lord in the air, .. .. then it is apparent that that rapture, that gathering together to the Lord in the air.. is but a Part of the Second Coming.. not a separate event from it, but a part of it.

so, by the pronouns.. it would seem that either, 1.) Peter, James, John and etal, have never died, or the abomination of desolation spoken of has already happened.. that is if all those have died.. would be a big different though if only one of that group were in fact still alive to this very day in 2013..
What is "abomination of desolation".? What is "desolation"?

Well, what is 'desolation'? If we don't know what desolation even means but just use it as some niffty slogan.. then we know nothing really.

And what is 'abomination".. I find it to be something seen as a curse, seen as a curse by some one.. or someones.

Findign the term 'desolation'to mean as it developed throughout its usages in Scriptures, is but a severe population , a population reduction of a given arear or region of land.. such as currently the ruins of Babylon are Desolate.. (don't know how many Iraqi soliders if any are guard it at the moment.. but its population is definitely desolate compared two when it was the capital city of ALexander the Great.. )

And since in the Prophets, Babylon was desolate, an inhabitance of dragons and jackals.. (animal population) but no human or very low human population, then it would seem.. that the "abomination of desolation" is a very cursed very severe reduction of the human population nunmbers of Humans in the Temple, its complex, and in fact even Jerusalem..

Maybe I got it wrong.. but such an approach in my opinion is getting closer to the ball park.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27972246

At he end of John(the book) peter is being asked If he loves Christ, and when Christ gets done rebuking him for his earlier betrayal, peter sees john and says what of him, and Christ replies: " If I will he remain till I come, what is that to you." John 21:22
So with that logic I actually John is still with this world
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