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"Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 71451758
United States
05/09/2016 11:17 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
the Russians took Berlin while the Americans were still bogged-down at The Battle of The Bulge.
.
 Quoting: Holy Cow!_33


BS. The US could have gone further than the Elbe if they had been allowed to as well.

.
 Quoting: eagleheart66


now, that's the BS.

.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/09/2016 11:27 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
...


Betrayed and destroyed by the incompetent leaders 40 years after the great Victory. Next question?
 Quoting: Tamonten


Why does Russia celebrates victories of most evil empire ever that, according to Solzhenitsyn ("200 years together"), killed around 60 million Russians?

P.S. I know the answer, I'm just curious if you know it too.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67403358


Because Solzhenitsin was either lying or in delusion. His estimates are based on speculations and hearsay at best.
From 1921 to 1954 (Stalin's reign) 3777380 people were convicted for "counterrevolutionary" (i.e. political) crimes. 642980 of which were executed. At it's peak GULag system (which included common criminals) had 2500000 inmates. It's less per caputa than in US right now.

And we are celebration victory of the SU, because Russia is its legal and natural successor.
 Quoting: Tamonten


Wow. I thought you didn't know the answer and you proved me right but I had no idea that you think you know history better than a dude, nobel prize winner, who lived it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72181817


Literature and Peace Nobel Prizes are the most politised ones out there. They are given not to those who've really earned it, but to those who were the best at serving West's interests.

Not to mention, that 60 mln is a ridiculous number. You can't hide it if it was the truth. It's impossible to exterminate 1/4 of population without anyone noticing.
The only way I could explain this numbers is that he extrapolated the ratio of executed in Soviet elites to the whole population of SU. Because Stalin was really strict on that matter. Most of those who were executed for "political" reasons, were middle and high-class Soviet elites who either failed in their tasks or became corrupt.

As for your question, there's actually a simple answer in the very first song I posted:
There is no such family in Russia without a hero remembered.
And the eyes of the young soldiers are looking from the faded photos...


Last Edited by Tamonten on 05/09/2016 11:29 PM
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/09/2016 11:36 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
No info and celebrations about V-day in USA , almost like some Americans feel bad NAZI lost war .....
71 years already .........
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 70938833


That's why I am posting it here.
Official celebrations are not really that important.
"Immortal Regiment" is the real celebration. Just in Moscow more than 700k people took part in it - that's may be the highest count possible, unless you close off all the city's traffic for the day. In some cities up to 1/6 of population were taking part - 250k in Novosibirsk which has 1.5m population in total.
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/09/2016 11:41 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Do any Russians actually know their country cooperated with Hitler? German troops even trained in SU, but I'm guessing Russians themselves have never heard about it. There is no doubt you were allies with Hitler until he ran out of resources and had to attack you. It's a fact.

You're basically celebrating the victory of Zionist-controlled soviet Union over Zionist-sponsored Germany. I feel sorry for you Russians, as you are terribly brainwashed and your current 'leader' is an agent of bankster elite leading you into abyss...

Do you actually have an industry other than oil, gas and arms production? You see, Putin doesn't give a shit about the future of Russians, or the future of Slavdom in general, since he is a Zionist tool, but you can believe the official propaganda as much as you want.
 Quoting: ZmeyGoryNich 72119970


Who's the one brainwashed here, I wonder?..

Do you know, that SU was the last European country to sign a treaty with Nazis?
Do you know about Munich Agreement?
Do you know how Poland participated in plunder of Czechoslovakia together with Nazis after it?
Do you know that after the war many inherently German lands were given to Poland under Soviet influence?
Do you know how millions of Germans were expelled from their homelands by Poles as a result of it?

I'll try to answer the rest of your rubbish, when you'll educate yourself a bit.
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/09/2016 11:51 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
I was just listening to the rock version of the Russian National Anthem. Truly inspiring, puts the Star Spangled Banner to shame, and a pure white dove flew past my window.

I am way the hell and gone out in the country and I've never seen this particular dove before. It just barreled on by at full speed about five feet off the ground.

Does a white dove have any significance in Russian culture?

Since this thread has a Russian theme I just thought it worth mentioning.

Feral
 Quoting: Feral Underclass


Thanks.

White dove with olive branch is an international-recognized symbol of peace actually. Historically it has come from Christianity, where in Eastern iconography it's customary to paint Saint Spirit as a dove.
It may seem a paradox, having a peace symbol on the military parade, but it's actually not the case. "If you want the peace, you should prepare for war." Openly showing your military might serves the purpose of preventing conflicts better than all peaceful proclamations there are.
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/09/2016 11:55 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Russians are so brainwashed nowadays. They lost 27m souls only in WWII not to count Bolsheviks terror and civil war victims. In total 40-50m were killed just in 30 years.

Have no any real achievements since USSR collapse and live in their memories and super power illusions. Matrix-like reality.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72182703


There is no way they lost that many people unless they were breeding like crazy. The population of the Soviet Union increased tremendously throughout the 20th century.

You are right about the lack of achievements since the collapse of the Soviet Union thought. No more Sputnik and AK-47.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 71096886


Depends on what you consider to be your achivements...
Thread: "The President" (2015) - Russian documentary about Putin
Thread: Russian endgamer: S-500 will be the end game when it's finished (Mikhail Yuriev)
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/10/2016 12:00 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Thank you for starting this thread and posting the videos. I was not aware of the masses who came out to honor their brave dead soldiers. Whether they agreed with their countries political positions or not was never an issue. Who had a choice? How noble families were able to keep pictures of their loved ones.

My ancestors (2 women) left your country as young teens right before the Russian Revolution. We still have distant relatives living in one of the small towns. One of their sons served in the Russian Army.

Please ignore the trolls who advocate bombing another country. Despite remnants of distrust we are again fighting a common enemy, DAESH, together. Pray for worldwide peace.
 Quoting: MustRemainAnonlymous


Thank you.

I'm here long enough to not be too affected by GLP resident trolls.
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/10/2016 12:02 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Thank you for starting this thread and posting the videos. I was not aware of the masses who came out to honor their brave dead soldiers. Whether they agreed with their countries political positions or not was never an issue. Who had a choice? How noble families were able to keep pictures of their loved ones.

My ancestors (2 women) left your country as young teens right before the Russian Revolution. We still have distant relatives living in one of the small towns. One of their sons served in the Russian Army.

Please ignore the trolls who advocate bombing another country. Despite remnants of distrust we are again fighting a common enemy, DAESH, together. Pray for worldwide peace.
 Quoting: MustRemainAnonlymous


Islam is the Enemy.

.
 Quoting: Holy Cow!_33


Islam
is not.


[link to www.youtube.com (secure)]

Islamism is.

Last Edited by Tamonten on 05/10/2016 12:02 AM
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/10/2016 12:11 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
the Russians took Berlin while the Americans were still bogged-down at The Battle of The Bulge.
.
 Quoting: Holy Cow!_33


BS. The US could have gone further than the Elbe if they had been allowed to as well.

.
 Quoting: eagleheart66


It's a truth actually, but...
Where were the so-called Allies in 1942, when Churchill (who was tasked with dealing with Stalin) was constantly promising to start an assault on Nazis from the west?.. Normandy happened only after Soviet Army expelled Nazis from Soviet territory and started to free European countries from them.
Allies has come to Europe to take part in beating of already defeated enemy. And Stalin allowed it precisely because he wished for peaceful coexistence. Churchill betrayed that trust in less than a year after the victory though. As usual when dealing with Anglo-Saxons...
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/10/2016 12:23 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Hey Tats sorry that Canada did not accept Russias offer of help in fighting the fires in Ft Mac,

I am embarrassed as a Canadian and this is not the country I was raised in & love. That my family chose to call home after we were exiled from Russia
as the Rodina became something other than what it is.

Now Canada has become something else,

but there is a great hope & fight that things will get better

soon.


Davai!


It even made me consider taking the offer of a couple of acres in Siberia)))
 Quoting: M1.618


Well, it may be even closer to Canada than to Moscow actually. ^^ At the very least, roughly the same distance.

We (well, mostly my parents and grandparents) were feed with Soviet propaganda of "rotten West" for quite some time and it was ridiculous - actually the great difference between official narrative and things seen by people was one of the main reasons why Soviet system has collapsed. But when it did, it seems that the West really started to rot.
As far as there was a competition, an alternative - elites were forced to stay sharp and improve things.
As one of our pundits said some years ago, "The West drank so much on SU's funeral, that it's still suffering from the hungover".

Sadly, the only thing that has ever forced anyone to take a grip was a treat. A world without competition - Fukuyama's "End of History" - is a picture of immediate collapse and degradation.

Last Edited by Tamonten on 05/10/2016 12:54 AM
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
EAT
User ID: 71420435
Canada
05/10/2016 01:27 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Hey Tats sorry that Canada did not accept Russias offer of help in fighting the fires in Ft Mac,

I am embarrassed as a Canadian and this is not the country I was raised in & love. That my family chose to call home after we were exiled from Russia
as the Rodina became something other than what it is.

Now Canada has become something else,

but there is a great hope & fight that things will get better

soon.


Davai!


It even made me consider taking the offer of a couple of acres in Siberia)))
 Quoting: M1.618


My grandparents came out of Russia in the 1920's.
If they had not of left when they did, they would have perished like most in their small village during the 2nd world war.
I too would have loved to have seen the Russian water bombers help us out fighting the big forest fire up in northern Alberta. It would have been a good thing for both countries!
-EAT
M1.618

User ID: 71696943
Canada
05/10/2016 01:44 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Hey Tats sorry that Canada did not accept Russias offer of help in fighting the fires in Ft Mac,

I am embarrassed as a Canadian and this is not the country I was raised in & love. That my family chose to call home after we were exiled from Russia
as the Rodina became something other than what it is.

Now Canada has become something else,

but there is a great hope & fight that things will get better

soon.


Davai!


It even made me consider taking the offer of a couple of acres in Siberia)))
 Quoting: M1.618


Well, it may be even closer to Canada than to Moscow actually. ^^ At the very least, roughly the same distance.

We (well, mostly my parents and grandparents) were feed with Soviet propaganda of "rotten West" for quite some time and it was ridiculous - actually the great difference between official narrative and things seen by people was one of the main reasons why Soviet system has collapsed. But when it did, it seems that the West really started to rot.
As far as there was a competition, an alternative - elites were forced to stay sharp and improve things.
As one of our pundits said some years ago, "The West drank so much on SU's funeral, that it's still suffering from the hungover".

Sadly, the only thing that has ever forced anyone to take a grip was a treat. A world without competition - Fukuyama's "End of History" - is a picture of immediate collapse and degradation.
 Quoting: Tamonten


The world is really in quite a state as good people have much in common,

and what they do not makes it more interesting)
wmMmw
M1.618

User ID: 71696943
Canada
05/10/2016 01:46 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
Hey Tats sorry that Canada did not accept Russias offer of help in fighting the fires in Ft Mac,

I am embarrassed as a Canadian and this is not the country I was raised in & love. That my family chose to call home after we were exiled from Russia
as the Rodina became something other than what it is.

Now Canada has become something else,

but there is a great hope & fight that things will get better

soon.


Davai!


It even made me consider taking the offer of a couple of acres in Siberia)))
 Quoting: M1.618


My grandparents came out of Russia in the 1920's.
If they had not of left when they did, they would have perished like most in their small village during the 2nd world war.
I too would have loved to have seen the Russian water bombers help us out fighting the big forest fire up in northern Alberta. It would have been a good thing for both countries!
-EAT
 Quoting: EAT 71420435


Yes it should have been a good experience.

And maybe we could of helped Russia when they needed a hand.

Both countries benefit doing something that actually matters.


Why is this world so stupid???
wmMmw
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 72179072
Sweden
05/10/2016 02:46 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
national Socialist Germany was defeated on the batllfield. What happened to glorious victorious USSR? Why doesn't exist no more?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67403358


Betrayed and destroyed by the incompetent leaders 40 years after the great Victory. Next question?
 Quoting: Tamonten


Why does Russia celebrates victories of most evil empire ever that, according to Solzhenitsyn ("200 years together"), killed around 60 million Russians?

P.S. I know the answer, I'm just curious if you know it too.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67403358


Because Solzhenitsin was either lying or in delusion.


His estimates are based on speculations and hearsay at best.
From 1921 to 1954 (Stalin's reign) 3777380 people were
convicted for "counterrevolutionary" (i.e. political) crimes. 642980 of which were executed.
At it's peak GULag system (which included common criminals) had 2500000 inmates.
It's less per caputa than in US right now.

And we are celebration victory of the SU, because Russia is its legal and natural successor.
 Quoting: Tamonten


NOW I KNOW what you are.. Fuck off you parasite!
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/10/2016 03:36 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
...


Betrayed and destroyed by the incompetent leaders 40 years after the great Victory. Next question?
 Quoting: Tamonten


Why does Russia celebrates victories of most evil empire ever that, according to Solzhenitsyn ("200 years together"), killed around 60 million Russians?

P.S. I know the answer, I'm just curious if you know it too.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67403358


Because Solzhenitsin was either lying or in delusion.


His estimates are based on speculations and hearsay at best.
From 1921 to 1954 (Stalin's reign) 3777380 people were
convicted for "counterrevolutionary" (i.e. political) crimes. 642980 of which were executed.
At it's peak GULag system (which included common criminals) had 2500000 inmates.
It's less per caputa than in US right now.

And we are celebration victory of the SU, because Russia is its legal and natural successor.
 Quoting: Tamonten


NOW I KNOW what you are.. Fuck off you parasite!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72179072


And you are basing your complete faith in Solzhenitsin on what? Was he Pope in disguise? Because I know no one else who is even claimed to be infallible.
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 69163460
Japan
05/10/2016 04:52 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
The 5 Most Popular Myths About the Soviet Union's Role in WWII, Busted

Read more: [link to sputniknews.com]
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 72181817
Croatia
05/10/2016 05:18 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
...


Why does Russia celebrates victories of most evil empire ever that, according to Solzhenitsyn ("200 years together"), killed around 60 million Russians?

P.S. I know the answer, I'm just curious if you know it too.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67403358


Because Solzhenitsin was either lying or in delusion. His estimates are based on speculations and hearsay at best.
From 1921 to 1954 (Stalin's reign) 3777380 people were convicted for "counterrevolutionary" (i.e. political) crimes. 642980 of which were executed. At it's peak GULag system (which included common criminals) had 2500000 inmates. It's less per caputa than in US right now.

And we are celebration victory of the SU, because Russia is its legal and natural successor.
 Quoting: Tamonten


Wow. I thought you didn't know the answer and you proved me right but I had no idea that you think you know history better than a dude, nobel prize winner, who lived it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72181817


Literature and Peace Nobel Prizes are the most politised ones out there. They are given not to those who've really earned it, but to those who were the best at serving West's interests.

Not to mention, that 60 mln is a ridiculous number. You can't hide it if it was the truth. It's impossible to exterminate 1/4 of population without anyone noticing.
The only way I could explain this numbers is that he extrapolated the ratio of executed in Soviet elites to the whole population of SU. Because Stalin was really strict on that matter. Most of those who were executed for "political" reasons, were middle and high-class Soviet elites who either failed in their tasks or became corrupt.

As for your question, there's actually a simple answer in the very first song I posted:
There is no such family in Russia without a hero remembered.
And the eyes of the young soldiers are looking from the faded photos...

 Quoting: Tamonten


oh yes it is. It happened in Croatia too. About million people were killed in couple months, mostly Croats, all croatia's Germans and most Italians. And nobody had a clue until collapse of communism and Yugoslavia. In communist countries everything is possible, everything bad and evil that is. And everything can be hidden. And everything communists say is a lie or bit od truth in order to protect greater lie. At any rate, you must be out of your mind if you expect anyone to believe you more than author of "Gulag Archipelago" who knew West as good as he knew USSR when he was writing "200 years together"
Anonymous Coward
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05/10/2016 05:36 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
the Russians took Berlin while the Americans were still bogged-down at The Battle of The Bulge.
.
 Quoting: Holy Cow!_33


BS. The US could have gone further than the Elbe if they had been allowed to as well.

.
 Quoting: eagleheart66


now, that's the BS.

.
 Quoting: Holy Cow!_33


Battle of the Bulge Dec 1944-January 1945

Battle of Berlin April 1945


No , the USSR did not take Berlin during the Battle of the Bulge. he is a Liar
Tamonten  (OP)

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Russian Federation
05/10/2016 06:13 AM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
...


Because Solzhenitsin was either lying or in delusion. His estimates are based on speculations and hearsay at best.
From 1921 to 1954 (Stalin's reign) 3777380 people were convicted for "counterrevolutionary" (i.e. political) crimes. 642980 of which were executed. At it's peak GULag system (which included common criminals) had 2500000 inmates. It's less per caputa than in US right now.

And we are celebration victory of the SU, because Russia is its legal and natural successor.
 Quoting: Tamonten


Wow. I thought you didn't know the answer and you proved me right but I had no idea that you think you know history better than a dude, nobel prize winner, who lived it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72181817


Literature and Peace Nobel Prizes are the most politised ones out there. They are given not to those who've really earned it, but to those who were the best at serving West's interests.

Not to mention, that 60 mln is a ridiculous number. You can't hide it if it was the truth. It's impossible to exterminate 1/4 of population without anyone noticing.
The only way I could explain this numbers is that he extrapolated the ratio of executed in Soviet elites to the whole population of SU. Because Stalin was really strict on that matter. Most of those who were executed for "political" reasons, were middle and high-class Soviet elites who either failed in their tasks or became corrupt.

As for your question, there's actually a simple answer in the very first song I posted:
There is no such family in Russia without a hero remembered.
And the eyes of the young soldiers are looking from the faded photos...

 Quoting: Tamonten


oh yes it is. It happened in Croatia too. About million people were killed in couple months, mostly Croats, all croatia's Germans and most Italians. And nobody had a clue until collapse of communism and Yugoslavia. In communist countries everything is possible, everything bad and evil that is. And everything can be hidden. And everything communists say is a lie or bit od truth in order to protect greater lie. At any rate, you must be out of your mind if you expect anyone to believe you more than author of "Gulag Archipelago" who knew West as good as he knew USSR when he was writing "200 years together"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72181817


Two matters here:
1. How can anyone be sure, that the "genocide" you are talking about is not the fake propaganda fabricated to explain why Yugoslavia was an evil-evil state?
2. Even if it is true - it's possible for small closed-off societies. If Solzhenitsin was talking about some isolated minority exterminated, it would have been be at least believable. But he's talking about Russians - the biggest majority in Russia, in a century when almost a half of Russian population relocated to another region within 3 generations. It's impossible to extermination of 1/5 of existing population in this case.

Many times in later years surveys were performed in different regions - people were asked if they saw or heard of someone they knew imprisoned during Soviet period. Almost everywhere the result was the same - in clear correlation with criminal situation. 0,5% to 2% or so. But in Moscow and St.Petersburg (Leningrad then) result was much higher (up to 25% had their relatives arrested in some places on central Moscow), and people noted that those arrested were mostly for political crimes.
Solzhenitsin extrapolated the experience of relatively small Moscow elites to the whole country. That's the only explanation.
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 72168414
Slovenia
05/11/2016 04:29 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
...


Wow. I thought you didn't know the answer and you proved me right but I had no idea that you think you know history better than a dude, nobel prize winner, who lived it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72181817


Literature and Peace Nobel Prizes are the most politised ones out there. They are given not to those who've really earned it, but to those who were the best at serving West's interests.

Not to mention, that 60 mln is a ridiculous number. You can't hide it if it was the truth. It's impossible to exterminate 1/4 of population without anyone noticing.
The only way I could explain this numbers is that he extrapolated the ratio of executed in Soviet elites to the whole population of SU. Because Stalin was really strict on that matter. Most of those who were executed for "political" reasons, were middle and high-class Soviet elites who either failed in their tasks or became corrupt.

As for your question, there's actually a simple answer in the very first song I posted:
There is no such family in Russia without a hero remembered.
And the eyes of the young soldiers are looking from the faded photos...

 Quoting: Tamonten


oh yes it is. It happened in Croatia too. About million people were killed in couple months, mostly Croats, all croatia's Germans and most Italians. And nobody had a clue until collapse of communism and Yugoslavia. In communist countries everything is possible, everything bad and evil that is. And everything can be hidden. And everything communists say is a lie or bit od truth in order to protect greater lie. At any rate, you must be out of your mind if you expect anyone to believe you more than author of "Gulag Archipelago" who knew West as good as he knew USSR when he was writing "200 years together"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72181817


Two matters here:
1. How can anyone be sure, that the "genocide" you are talking about is not the fake propaganda fabricated to explain why Yugoslavia was an evil-evil state?
2. Even if it is true - it's possible for small closed-off societies. If Solzhenitsin was talking about some isolated minority exterminated, it would have been be at least believable. But he's talking about Russians - the biggest majority in Russia, in a century when almost a half of Russian population relocated to another region within 3 generations. It's impossible to extermination of 1/5 of existing population in this case.

Many times in later years surveys were performed in different regions - people were asked if they saw or heard of someone they knew imprisoned during Soviet period. Almost everywhere the result was the same - in clear correlation with criminal situation. 0,5% to 2% or so. But in Moscow and St.Petersburg (Leningrad then) result was much higher (up to 25% had their relatives arrested in some places on central Moscow), and people noted that those arrested were mostly for political crimes.
Solzhenitsin extrapolated the experience of relatively small Moscow elites to the whole country. That's the only explanation.
 Quoting: Tamonten


Only propaganda is the number. It wasn't one million but 300-400 thousands killed by Croat fascists during the war in ONE concentration camp. But commie Yugoslavia had nothing to do with it, they were killing after the war in smaller number but still thousands.
Tamonten  (OP)

User ID: 34754802
Russian Federation
05/11/2016 05:18 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia
...


Literature and Peace Nobel Prizes are the most politised ones out there. They are given not to those who've really earned it, but to those who were the best at serving West's interests.

Not to mention, that 60 mln is a ridiculous number. You can't hide it if it was the truth. It's impossible to exterminate 1/4 of population without anyone noticing.
The only way I could explain this numbers is that he extrapolated the ratio of executed in Soviet elites to the whole population of SU. Because Stalin was really strict on that matter. Most of those who were executed for "political" reasons, were middle and high-class Soviet elites who either failed in their tasks or became corrupt.

As for your question, there's actually a simple answer in the very first song I posted:
There is no such family in Russia without a hero remembered.
And the eyes of the young soldiers are looking from the faded photos...

 Quoting: Tamonten


oh yes it is. It happened in Croatia too. About million people were killed in couple months, mostly Croats, all croatia's Germans and most Italians. And nobody had a clue until collapse of communism and Yugoslavia. In communist countries everything is possible, everything bad and evil that is. And everything can be hidden. And everything communists say is a lie or bit od truth in order to protect greater lie. At any rate, you must be out of your mind if you expect anyone to believe you more than author of "Gulag Archipelago" who knew West as good as he knew USSR when he was writing "200 years together"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72181817


Two matters here:
1. How can anyone be sure, that the "genocide" you are talking about is not the fake propaganda fabricated to explain why Yugoslavia was an evil-evil state?
2. Even if it is true - it's possible for small closed-off societies. If Solzhenitsin was talking about some isolated minority exterminated, it would have been be at least believable. But he's talking about Russians - the biggest majority in Russia, in a century when almost a half of Russian population relocated to another region within 3 generations. It's impossible to extermination of 1/5 of existing population in this case.

Many times in later years surveys were performed in different regions - people were asked if they saw or heard of someone they knew imprisoned during Soviet period. Almost everywhere the result was the same - in clear correlation with criminal situation. 0,5% to 2% or so. But in Moscow and St.Petersburg (Leningrad then) result was much higher (up to 25% had their relatives arrested in some places on central Moscow), and people noted that those arrested were mostly for political crimes.
Solzhenitsin extrapolated the experience of relatively small Moscow elites to the whole country. That's the only explanation.
 Quoting: Tamonten


Only propaganda is the number. It wasn't one million but 300-400 thousands killed by Croat fascists during the war in ONE concentration camp. But commie Yugoslavia had nothing to do with it, they were killing after the war in smaller number but still thousands.
 Quoting: tyash


The number is the thing, actually.

Where there's one, there's ten, where there's ten, there is hundred and so on.
Solzhenitshin too have started from millions imprisoned (which is true), then moved to tens of millions imprisoned and millions executed... it escalated in quite a way during his lifetime.

Let's just say, that when he tried to estimate military loses of Red Army during WW2, his estimate turned out to be 3 times larger than the real one.
"When every one is dead the Great Game is finished. Not before." - Rudyard Kipling, "Kim" (1901)
"But we are still alive." - Thread: "The Great Game" by Mikhail Leontyev (2007-2008)

"Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." - Brandon Sanderson, "The Way of Kings"
"Russia is the great Christian country with rich Islamic history" - Vladimir Solovyov (Russian Jew)
Quos Iupiter perdere vult, dementat.
"Europe can wait while the Russian tsar fishes." - Alexander III The Peacemaker

Thread: I'm Russian ask me a question. Be it about Russia or a personal one.
Thread: From Rus' to Russia - grand concert on the Red Square, June 12th 2015 - please help with translation!

Remember that future is always proceeded by its shadows.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 72147553
United States
05/11/2016 05:26 PM
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Re: "Eternal Flame" and Victory Day celebrations in Russia

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 71647444



 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 71647444


Beat me to it.

Here's another version I've always liked.






GLP